GAME OF CHAMPIONS 2021 Endgame (town and 3p win)

[Phil and Gloria]

to those who say I am mafia I say

nay thine

[nutella]

to those who say I am mafia I say

nay thine

nauuurrrrr

[Alison]

so it seems like everyone would draft me...

except I didn't get drafted

which means sloonei is the wolf captain

Or the captain drafted roles.

[Alison]

Do you have TMI that the captain drafted players Mac?

[Alison]

in my experience fully stacked mafia teams get stomped so I would be disinclined to do that

I can tell this is sprit because Mac would never say this after the GoC from two years ago.

I think it's Mac, he lost a couple of games on stacked wolf teams recently.

[Alison]

I would absolutely pick wilgy hes a sleeper god wolf

That's how I feel about Belzy.

[Phil and Gloria]

Do you have TMI that the captain drafted players Mac?

no I didn't think drafting roles was a thing until someone pointed it out

[Phil and Gloria]

in my experience fully stacked mafia teams get stomped so I would be disinclined to do that

I can tell this is sprit because Mac would never say this after the GoC from two years ago.

I think it's Mac, he lost a couple of games on stacked wolf teams recently.

you needn't speculate... I already said it was me

[LinearPoint]

Do you have TMI that the captain drafted players Mac?

no I didn't think drafting roles was a thing until someone pointed it out

Pretty sure that was pointed out. A lot.

[Alison]

idk why people are drafting teams but mine would be

ilario
dyslexicon
Alison
c4
Guillo
Radishes

found wolf captain

I don't think Alexa is the wolf captain. I think if Alexa was the wolf captain she'd almost certainly draft players because that's the kind of person that she is. And if she drafts players, she almost certainly drafts Ilario. Therefore if Alexa is the wolf captain, then Alexa/Ilario are W/W. And I don't think Alexa/Ilario are W/W.

[EnderWiggin]

ender randed jester

Jingle Bells,
Jingle Bells,
Jinggle bell rock,
Take in the votes and,
Leave out the thoughts.

Find em the wolfies,
And leave them the town,
That's the jingle bell,
That's the jingle bell,
That's the jingle bell rooooock

[Sloonei]

Maybe we're all gambit demons.

[Alison]

Oh right, Happy might've been a good choice to pick as wolf too

id easily endgame in a lobby this chaotic

Same and idk if this is cocky to say but i think a lot of people would've drafted me and i'm not a wolf so i feel like they picked the role-option

Same.

[EnderWiggin]

Maybe we're all gambit demons.

The real gambit demon was the friends we made along the way.

[Alison]

Oh right, Happy might've been a good choice to pick as wolf too

id easily endgame in a lobby this chaotic

Same and idk if this is cocky to say but i think a lot of people would've drafted me and i'm not a wolf so i feel like they picked the role-option

Nah. This community of players would not let an opportunity to pick their teammates pass them up.

How many wolves? 8-9?

I would draft players if I was the captain, yeah.

[Phil and Gloria]

Do you have TMI that the captain drafted players Mac?

no I didn't think drafting roles was a thing until someone pointed it out

Pretty sure that was pointed out. A lot.

that sure would have helped those people who read those posts ay

[Alison]

if paopan is an alt im sorry

but i dont think they are and them saying "drafting people like me/scotty" just feels like TMI from a wolf chat discussing this type of thing. and im of the opinion mafia picked roles instead of drafts and therefore may discuss what happened if they drafted

Paopan isn't an alt, they're some random person that Gavial recruited from his homesite or whatever to play Akemi Homura Mafia.

I don't know if he's just heard of your rep though.

[Alison]

Guess I'll votepark on Paopan for a while but for postgame cred I think they're just town

This is an anti-town post.

[Seanzie]

ender randed jester

Jingle Bells,
Jingle Bells,
Jinggle bell rock,
Take in the votes and,
Leave out the thoughts.

Find em the wolfies,
And leave them the town,
That's the jingle bell,
That's the jingle bell,
That's the jingle bell rooooock

Shoot this.

[Seanzie]

ender randed jester

Jingle Bells,
Jingle Bells,
Jinggle bell rock,
Take in the votes and,
Leave out the thoughts.

Find em the wolfies,
And leave them the town,
That's the jingle bell,
That's the jingle bell,
That's the jingle bell rooooock

Shoot this.

[Seanzie]

Maybe we're all gambit demons.

Gimme powers please.

[Alison]

Guess I'll votepark on Paopan for a while but for postgame cred I think they're just town

The more you talk the more confident Neeko is in thinking you're just a Jester.

1) I could be misremembering but I think Nanook is ideologically against jesters. Don't quote me on this, though.
2) If Creature is a jester he immediately afks the moment I drop my case on him and collects a free win.

[Alison]

I'm the most powerful town role~ hihi

This is a certified Ilya moment.

[EnderWiggin]

Seanzie is so insistent on shooting me he wants to shoot me twice.

[LinearPoint]

Was there a game with a Jester this year? That should answer if Jester is even possible.

[Guillotine]

OK Neeko has reached the conclusion Ender is unreadable.

Nah… gimme time and i'll solve him for Neeko

[NotAnAxehole]

if paopan is an alt im sorry

but i dont think they are and them saying "drafting people like me/scotty" just feels like TMI from a wolf chat discussing this type of thing. and im of the opinion mafia picked roles instead of drafts and therefore may discuss what happened if they drafted

Paopan isn't an alt, they're some random person that Gavial recruited from his homesite or whatever to play Akemi Homura Mafia.

I don't know if he's just heard of your rep though.

Paopan was in a game with Alexa & Scotty where Alexa was 3rd party, and Scotty was a wolf who got railroaded by 2 fake claims on the same day. I think he just went through the player list for people he recognized (and who he saw win) and put a bunch of nonsense around it.

[Seanzie]

Seanzie is so insistent on shooting me he wants to shoot me twice.

Doubletap this.

[Alison]

paopan was very towny then alexa made up some bs and half the game spewed paopan town in response

This is like that game where we lost as mafia together, and Alexa is Seanzie and Paopan is Fext.

[EnderWiggin]

OK Neeko has reached the conclusion Ender is unreadable.

Nah… gimme time and i'll solve him for Neeko

It's okay Guillo. You can tell them I'm wolf now.

I've come to peace with you bussing me.

[Alison]

In other words I think Alexa is town. I've liked Paopan's responses, and the Ilya style claim is townie.

[Seanzie]

I think Alison is right that Nook doesn't like jesters. I can't think of a game that a jester was in this year, so they probably wouldn't be included either way. Finally, unless you have clear evidence of the existence of a jester, jester speculation only serves wolves so should be avoided.

We should all assume that there is no jester. If people are acting scummy, they are probably just wolf.

[Alison]

I don’t see what people see in sloonei

I think he’s being intentionally dense or aloof for his own amusement I’d say it’s at worst nai and on average >rand town

I think it's NAI.

[Alison]

EnderWiggin has low impact.

@EnderWiggin why do you have low impact?

[Seanzie]

paopan was very towny then alexa made up some bs and half the game spewed paopan town in response

This is like that game where we lost as mafia together, and Alexa is Seanzie and Paopan is Fext.

And you are... you? and Mac is... Mac?

[LinearPoint]

Neeko liking Seanzie more in recent times. Probably helped by the fact they are saying what Neeko is thinking.

[Alison]

I don’t see what people see in sloonei

I think he’s being intentionally dense or aloof for his own amusement I’d say it’s at worst nai and on average >rand town

Just that the last several times he Did Nothing he was mafia

It's not impossible for him to Do Nothing as town bc he's become lazy in his retirement but it's not a good start

Other than the game we played together where he 0 posted almost d1, is there any other game where he was like that as scum recently?

I guess my other examples are quite a while longer ago tbh and he may have more slanky town games that I haven't followed

But I did dunk on him as a lower-content wolf in last year's GOC and in grasslands off the top of my head

I didn't play a ton of games here in 2021 ngl

He was not low content in Grasslands.

Also you tried to CFD me over Sloonei at the last moment and only barely failed. The north remembers.

[Guillotine]

OK Neeko has reached the conclusion Ender is unreadable.

Nah… gimme time and i'll solve him for Neeko

It's okay Guillo. You can tell them I'm wolf now.

I've come to peace with you bussing me.

I would shoot you for this you know? Just to see what happens.

[EnderWiggin]

EnderWiggin has low impact.

@EnderWiggin why do you have low impact?

Because I'm not Genshin.

[Seanzie]

Neeko liking Seanzie more in recent times. Probably helped by the fact they are saying what Neeko is thinking.

What am I saying that you're thinking? The jester thing I just said is high NAI and something I would easily say as a wolf to look helpful without being helpful.

[EnderWiggin]

OK Neeko has reached the conclusion Ender is unreadable.

Nah… gimme time and i'll solve him for Neeko

It's okay Guillo. You can tell them I'm wolf now.

I've come to peace with you bussing me.

I would shoot you for this you know? Just to see what happens.

Oh no.

Anyway.

[Seanzie]

@Alison do you have a read on me?

[LinearPoint]

But Neeko doesn't think Creature and Ender are both scum.
Ender was pretty quick to jump on Creature wagon which Neeko is pretty sure scum would at least give a post explaining their bussing attempt.
They just kind of voted creature even after the initial push from Alison died off. Doesn't seem very SvS.

[Alison]

this is like some satirical meta comedy version of mafia right now

Okay Mr. Alison doesn't like it when I meme.

[Alison]

i'd probably call mac towny in worlds pre-my last hydra game with him but that + aalison's read on him. he gets to be null. maybe ill try to make an actual read on him in the morning when im less tired.

This kinda feels like a post you make while wearing a coat of not quite 101 dalmations.

this is the craziest mind meld I've ever seen. I was trying to make a post calling Alexa Cruela and Paopan a puppy earlier but I had no reception lol

Actually shit you're right, Pao can't be wolf if Alexa is.

God damn faking building worldviews is so hard.

Someone please shoot this.

Yeah I agree.

[VOTE: EnderWiggin] aubergine

[LinearPoint]

Neeko liking Seanzie more in recent times. Probably helped by the fact they are saying what Neeko is thinking.

What am I saying that you're thinking? The jester thing I just said is high NAI and something I would easily say as a wolf to look helpful without being helpful.

Neeko is pretty sure Mafia just want Town to wildly spekulate more than stopping them.
No one has stepped up to stop the speculating on if Mafia chose players or roles for example meaning Mafia are probably wanting us to do so.

[Alison]

alexa
c4
Creature
ender
falcon
hk
ilario
paopan
sabie
seanzie
urist

there are 0 wolves here

sloonei, nutella, Alison contains min 1 probably 2 wolves

linearpoint is outed mafia

Mac is mafia.

what about sprit?

They share the same alignment.

[EnderWiggin]

I'm gonna claim here guys.

I'm not Jester.

I know it's disappointing for you all.

[Alison]

Mac's entrance is unimpressive. He remains firmly in my suspect pool.

@LinearPoint What is your opinion on my Creature case? You've been very absorbed with the alexa/nutella stuff. I'd like your view on other parts of the game.

OK, lets start from the top and break this down then.

Spoiler: show

Here is my case on Creature.

All of Creature's posts so far can be divided into one of three categories: useless fluff, attempting to derpclear himself for silly reasons, and "flame fanning".

Category 1: Useless Fluff

Spoiler: show

Why does the game always start when I'm the most low energy?

Wow this got intense so quick

Is this game by any chance bastard? I didn't check before joining

Who is Neeko?

Would much rather just be mafia in bastard games

I think you are.

I'm not mafia and this makes your push on me even more annoying

These posts go beyond the usual RVS horsing around (although we are well out of RVS now). These are posts that show a clear lack of interest in the progression of the game. His questions are flat, shallow, and in many cases could have been easily answered by glancing at the OP. He is more interested in looking like he is around and engaging with the game than actually being around and engaging with the game. He had a ripe opportunity to engage with me about my push on him, and he responded by going "I'm not mafia, I'm annoyed now, go away". I don't get the sense that he cares whether or not I am town misreading him or scum trying to get him killed, and this is especially concerning because in my last scum game I tried to get him killed early on.

First thought is that fluff posts in RVS are pretty much always NAI. There is a pretty common thread in the posts that suggests a person who just doesn't want to play meaning they got a role they disliked. This I don't really see as Mafia and is more likely a 3rd Party who doesn't need to worry about screwing over their team or a player who is Town and just got a bad role. You have a point about the backoff "i'm not Mafia" line, but that alone I wouldn't consider enough to warrant saying Creature is Mafia especially when I think the lack of interest in the game would be unlikely to come from Mafia.

Category 2: Attempting to derpclear himself for silly reasons

Spoiler: show

I want the guilty on nutella to be legit

Is soup kill a thing?

Would much rather just be mafia in bastard games

Wait I think the existence of a mafia captain should almost clear me from ever being picked as mafia this game

Unless you want to argue that I'm 3p here? But would be better to seek for the seven mafia first.

If I was mafia captain I would choose players tbh even if it is not mechanically optimal. I would much rather have an enjoyable team to play with.

I know I'd never be picked by the mafia captain if they chose players over roles

Creature makes an excessive number of posts attempting to insinuate that he is town, or in some way get people to "angleshoot" him as being town due to his lack of knowledge about the game mechanics or the inner workings of the mafia ("is there a soup kill?"). But a town Creature who genuinely wanted to know would just check the OP; asking in thread serves no purpose except to try to get people to falsely read him as town. He is aware that he struggles to gain the trust of the town when he is mafia, and he is cheaply attempting to earn this towncred through derptells and "townslips".

Take note that he is trying to convince the game repeatedly that the mafia captain chose players rather than roles. If he is town, he has no reason to believe that the mafia captain chose players over roles. I, personally, have reason to believe that the mafia captain chose roles. I think nutella is much townier than her scum self would be, and as I have argued, a town nutella implies a town Alexa. I know I am town, and I do not think a mafia captain who picked players would pass over both me and Alexa. So this attempt to convince the town - with no evidence whatsoever - that the mafia captain picked players reeks of agenda-pushing to me.

Finally, I want to highlight this line: "Unless you want to argue that I'm 3p here? But would be better to seek for the seven mafia first." Nobody has accused him of being 3P. It comes completely out of the blue, and reads almost as though he is self-aware of his own scumminess and is trying to hang a lampshade of it. I don't think it's a line that would flow naturally from a townie's mouth.

This makes sense. But a lot of people right now are pushing their own opinions on what the Captain chose. Neeko does believe some Mafia will be trying to push the opposite of their choice, but right now everyone is guilty of doing so. It's also hard to tell real derptells from fake derptells. To Neeko this reads more of a 3rd Party than Mafia overall. Neeko did point out when Creature made the post about being a 3rd Party that they seem like a 3rd Party with that post, but right now 3rd Party is just not a big concern imo. Creature also doesn't seem to be distancing from anyone or buddying with anyone so Mafia seems a bit unlikely.

Category 3: Flame Fanning

Spoiler: show

lol if nutella is salty alexa caught her n0

lol if the alexa/nutella w/w theory is right

early take is that Seanzie is probably wolfing imo

Thought I was the only one seeing it

LinearPoint has been accused of fanning the flames. I think Creature is even more guilty of this sin. In his ISO of 19 posts (at the time I wrote this case), Creature utters provocative lines, egging on the suspicions of townies towards each other, three separate times. They are quoted in the spoilers above. Note that he first eggs on the "Alexa has a red check on nutella" narrative, then switches to "Alexa and nutella are wolves together". These narratives are contradictory. Creature does not have an opinion of his own; he just encourages whatever happens to be the prevailing opinion or thread sentiment at the time. This is strongly opportunistic, and this opportunism is exemplified even further by his agreement with 112 that Seanzie is wolfing. How is Seanzie being wolfy? Why has he not brought up this scumread on Seanzie before, if he thought he was the only one seeing it? In fact, if he thinks Seanzie is a wolf and fooling everyone except him, why would he keep quiet about it until someone else brings it up, at which point he eagerly jumps on the bandwagon? Answer: because he is nakedly taking advantage of 112's suspicion to push Seanzie.

At no point does he contribute to the conversation. He does not add evidence to support any narrative. He does not refute the evidence or points that others have brought up. He does not, in fact, engage with the theories and accusations that have been thrown around the thread. He merely fuels the fire with provocative one-liners and moves on without explaining them.

OK, admittedly was a bit jaded being falsely accused fanning the flames for jumping to conclusions with Alexa v Nutella to just write off this part, so Neeko will give it a serious read.
A lot of this makes sense for Creature being scum, so Neeko can see where you are coming from. It's not really giving reads and more a lot of just agreeing with hot takes which are shots in the dark from townies trying to scum hunt.

Neeko'll also provide another look into Creature since she had to review his posts for this and might as well.

overall they continued a lot of what you (Alison) pointed out.

Spoiler: show

Is Scotty a good wolf?

This one is another just questioning someone's credibility by probbing others to look into their meta.

i forgot i had Sloonei in my gut pool of maf

Mafia:
Sloonei
LinearPoint
Paopon
Guillotine

that is probably 0/4 or 1/4 based on my early game accuracy but #yolo

I think only Sloonei and Paopan can be wolves here aorn

why?

ftr i am least confident on guillo here but i think linear is probably a wolf

LinearPoint is at that limbo where I think their actions are more likely to come from town but lots of players are saying they're wolf and I'm afraid of being the wrong one here

This personally doesn't feel right. A lot of people have given varying reasons for scum reading Neeko, while Neeko disagrees that any of them are remotely grounded in reality, having no opinion seems a bit odd. Neeko doesn't really like in gneeral when people don't read her as it reads like someone trying to balance between if they want to go for the easy wagon or avoid it with the knowledge it'll not be a red flip.

Is there a red on nutella too? I really did miss a lot.

alexa seems to have info on nutella's role that seems wolf-indicative for the latter but not conclusive.

This is basically just echoing Neeko's read on the Alexa V Nutella, but also not commiting to either side, probably after seeing the backlash Neeko got for the opinion that Alexa V Nutella was Mafia.

Also I maintain being provocative is something I do as town to the feel over players' alignment based on their responses. Looks like unnecessary attention for me to do as wolf.

Mmm defense of “I do this as town” no bueno

It's just that the "fanning the flames" thing can just be town being provocative just like this case. I honestly felt the same about DrWilgy last game when they started asking me useless questions and bugging me into responding them which I thought was wolfy but in reality they were being provocative.

Lastly, this is just blatantly saying they were trying to fan the flames and get people to scum read others without doing so themselves.

Neeko will say she doesn't like Creature. You can read the spoiler for quotes and thoughts on quotes.
Create is probably either a 3rd party who doesn't have partners to spew, or is mafia actively avoiding forming reads on any player to avoid spewing.

I feel pocketed by this post.

You can't pocket someone whose scum reading you silly.
Besides at no point did Neeko say you were Town, though there is a townlean for the record.

"I feel pocketed by this post" just means "I townread this post, even though I scumread you earlier".

[Alison]

Is Ender really just lolwoofing here

I think so.