Anniversary Game 1 - Classic Syndicate [Day 9]

[sig]

Addendum to the post about why G Mans bad team wouldn’t try to lynch someone else.

This is driving me nuts. I’m trying to figure out why a bad team wouldn’t try to start a third wagon if both Sloon and G were bad, or try harder to pile on Sloonei if only G was bad.

Maybe he was alone, or only had one teammate there? Like others were low posters or had time zone issues?

Because I’ve been playing Mafia a long time and have never seen a baddie with an alternative train do … nothing. I’m spitballing about maybe low posters etc because I just don’t understand Gs behavior there.

Yes, this makes sense. Thinking back on g-man's play, it seems like he was doing just enough to try to get by trying to look civ without rocking the boat too much to gain suspicion. As if he were going it pretty much alone and trying to hold it all together. This doesn't help alleviate my gut suspicion of DH, now SVS. And neither does SVS' lack of voting Gman. I don't know why I can't shake it. Does ANYone else feel the same way?

I don't. She's got her kid gloves on in a sense, when it comes to Bea, but bea is looking more and more bad to me and svs noticed that right away. If she were bad, I believe she'd shy away from accusing bea at all. Also, she can read me like a newspaper, and I've never seen a bad svs defend a civ me as well as she has here.

This is exactly my thought.

In a world where Sloonei is civ, bea voting not only to tie the game with a self-professed poor read on the game at large, but to potentially save GMan is a double red flag.

I can see early game reasons why one might feel that way and have before. I think DH was there in frustration before he subbed out. But I tend to agree wirh you on that point viv.

This is responding to Viv’s comment that a civ should never be fine getting miselimmed, which is what GMan was doing.
Then, 20 minutes later:

I am a confused and no lies feel like any vote I make is rushed and illinformed.

Also i missed why svs voted sloon? It looked in the thread like she sused gman.

Dgoing with the tie. I hope rev knows better than i do.

Nothing in that progression makes sense. Does a civ bea have to make sense? No, but I’d expect a better explanation for doing 2 nakedly hedgey and scummy things.

bea is mafia for these actions alone.

This is pretty damning my only issue with Bea is her lack of voting and curse the following day. I’d think the mafia would be more on top of that? Of course that could also serve as a good strategy for a one day pass BUT she wasn’t being suspected then anyway.

I don’t really recall Bea’s neta so I’m a bit worried this may be another Lorab style vote so if any older players could chime in I’d appreciate it

@Kate @Golden @S~V~S

[sig]

Also, based off the direction of the game I’m leaning towards todays vote stealer to be more pro mafia. As the game is in towns favor right now

[Scotty]

Addendum to the post about why G Mans bad team wouldn’t try to lynch someone else.

This is driving me nuts. I’m trying to figure out why a bad team wouldn’t try to start a third wagon if both Sloon and G were bad, or try harder to pile on Sloonei if only G was bad.

Maybe he was alone, or only had one teammate there? Like others were low posters or had time zone issues?

Because I’ve been playing Mafia a long time and have never seen a baddie with an alternative train do … nothing. I’m spitballing about maybe low posters etc because I just don’t understand Gs behavior there.

Yes, this makes sense. Thinking back on g-man's play, it seems like he was doing just enough to try to get by trying to look civ without rocking the boat too much to gain suspicion. As if he were going it pretty much alone and trying to hold it all together. This doesn't help alleviate my gut suspicion of DH, now SVS. And neither does SVS' lack of voting Gman. I don't know why I can't shake it. Does ANYone else feel the same way?

Not only did SVS not vote G-man, but G-man also performed a lovely mental gymnastics routine to avoid voting for DH the day before.

I actually was the first to vote G Man, and I switched to Sloonei to get a wagon going on a second person I suspected instead of letting it form on someone I didn’t.

I’m definitely not G Mans teammate, and neither was DH. I have no clue why G didn’t vote for DH.

In any case in my first big post I said I thought G was shady. So you can believe it, or not, but I’m civ.

I was the first to vote for G-man, actually. I voted the instant the poll opened.

this is true. I remember it as if it were yesterday

[S~V~S]

Oh really I’m sorry I thought it was me. Maybe I was second then?

[sig]

I’m gonna go ahead and vote for Quin. I think Llama + being off major wagon + the peanut gallery votes + Sloonie GMan analysis is a pretty good reason to start there.

The more I read the more I think Bea could be mafia but I’m approaching that cautiously.

I could still see Golden being mafia but that’s more tinfoil right now I do want to ISO him though

And then last is up in the air again. I do think we’ve got a high poster so that means either DH/SVS, Golden, or Scotty since I doubt a mafia team of Sloonie and Gman wouldn’t be able to create a third wagon.

I’ll say for SVS is that she plays an amazing game as mafia and I can’t read her worth a damn BUT DH game was very Civvie near the end. The only caveat would be if DH/SVS entire team is filled with less active players then I could see the in thread anger

[sig]

Adding onto this I’m really vibing with Scotty’s thoughts and while his/Golden D1 defense of me was odd (bit pocketish) it isn’t enough to raise the eyebrows.

[S~V~S]

@sig i can definitely see bad Bea, her vote last night was a big fat WTF imo.

I posted some over the weekend about her, I’ll try to elaborate on that for you later if time allows.

[Scotty]

Why was I a better option than G-man?

I think this was directed at SVs, but I’ll answer for myself:
-there’s a lot of mystery as to your involvement in the D1 elimination
-your flip would help substantiate my feeling that you just seem off from my perception of your civ game (this reasoning is not defensible)
-your flip would substantiate GMan (and even my own tinfoil) claiming the thread was being led astray by the high posters. You are at the top of that list.


I must say that after coming down from reveal that GMan is bad, I’m still left in a lurch about you. Because
-GMan started peddling the thought that high posters might be leading the thread AFTER he already had a high amount of suspicion.
-GMan would most likely be in spew mode (throwing shit against the wall and perhaps making his teammates look better in the interim)
-You voting for GMan immediately is a risk that could go either way- you (probably) didn’t know if votes were changeable at the time, and then you’d be stuck there voting for a partner if bad. It can go either way.

[sig]

I’m gonna go ahead and vote for Quin.

Silly sig never mind

[Scotty]

Why was I a better option than G-man?

I think this was directed at SVs, but I’ll answer for myself:
-there’s a lot of mystery as to your involvement in the D1 elimination
-your flip would help substantiate my feeling that you just seem off from my perception of your civ game (this reasoning is not defensible)
-your flip would substantiate GMan (and even my own tinfoil) claiming the thread was being led astray by the high posters. You are at the top of that list.


I must say that after coming down from reveal that GMan is bad, I’m still left in a lurch about you. Because
-GMan started peddling the thought that high posters might be leading the thread AFTER he already had a high amount of suspicion.
-GMan would most likely be in spew mode (throwing shit against the wall and perhaps making his teammates look better in the interim)
-You voting for GMan immediately is a risk that could go either way- you (probably) didn’t know if votes were changeable at the time, and then you’d be stuck there voting for a partner if bad. It can go either way.

-oh DUH and the last, big one, is I just need to know what role you are for the solve. If you are one of several town roles, this helps my solve of making other people look better or worse.

[sig]

@sig i can definitely see bad Bea, her vote last night was a big fat WTF imo.

I posted some over the weekend about her, I’ll try to elaborate on that for you later if time allows.

Okay nice, yea the tie/vote was definitely a bad look. Do you think it fits into her meta more to try and save a teammate or throw them under the bus?

[Scotty]

If Sloonei is bad, the double wolf wagons just now are hilarious- bea is still probably bad and so of course she would be confused as to who to vote, because they’re both her partners.

And then Quin is the last one and we’ve got ourselves a case closed.

Go go gadget CONFIRMATION BIAS

[Scotty]

Why was I a better option than G-man?

I am feeling DH the more I play this game.

Just this morning I said that I did not feel any of the other possible wagons forming, and when someone else voted for you, I moved my vote so if there were two wagons, they would both be people I suspected.

That’s why you. I suspected you. I felt if I helped form a second wagon on someone I suspected, then someone I suspected was bound to be lynched.

Why was it important to have two options when you were okay with the first option?

Like…what? What kind of question is this, Mr. ‘I’m going to vote for other people throughout the day even though I have a main suspicion’?

[sig]

@Quin I probably missed it but can you walk me through the following

1. You’re Kate vote
2. Why Sig is the most amazing player ever (500 word minimum with 3 sources formatted in APA)
3. Who post Gman flip you think the mafia team is


@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

@DFaraday if you could just give some quick general thoughts that would be great

@Scotty pay attention to me and my jokey posts + what do you think about Golden right now?

[Sloonei]

I have a hypothetical that I’d like to pose to the thread right now. I think it would be interesting to pursue new worlds where the following is true:

Sloonei is town.

[sig]

I have a hypothetical that I’d like to pose to the thread right now. I think it would be interesting to pursue new worlds where the following is true:

Sloonei is town.

Maybe you and Scotty are both mafia playing deep wolf games.

[Sloonei]

Why was I a better option than G-man?

I am feeling DH the more I play this game.

Just this morning I said that I did not feel any of the other possible wagons forming, and when someone else voted for you, I moved my vote so if there were two wagons, they would both be people I suspected.

That’s why you. I suspected you. I felt if I helped form a second wagon on someone I suspected, then someone I suspected was bound to be lynched.

Why was it important to have two options when you were okay with the first option?

Like…what? What kind of question is this, Mr. ‘I’m going to vote for other people throughout the day even though I have a main suspicion’?

I wanted SVS to answer. Hypocrisy is a stable of the town playbook and all that.

[S~V~S]

@sig i can definitely see bad Bea, her vote last night was a big fat WTF imo.

I posted some over the weekend about her, I’ll try to elaborate on that for you later if time allows.

Okay nice, yea the tie/vote was definitely a bad look. Do you think it fits into her meta more to try and save a teammate or throw them under the bus?

Bea is an awesome bad teammate to have. She is loyal to a fault. This is bad or good; good Bea is one of the few people I know who really thinks of the civs as a team, just like the baddies.

Bea would take a chance to save a teammate, yeah.

[Scotty]

I also suspect Michelle, fwiw. But it is hard because I've never played with her before. And she does fit the low poster theory.

I’m actually feeling better about her after a perusal through her ISO. In terms of logical progressions, she is at least following through and I don’t see any holes.

Obviously mafia would want to have logical progression in their posts, but there’s been a cadence in her posts, especially in D1, that don’t scream baddie. I can’t put my finger on it, but I’m content to just let her find her place again. I’m thinking lost town, especially with how busy she’s been recently.

[Scotty]

I’m gonna go ahead and vote for Quin. I think Llama + being off major wagon + the peanut gallery votes + Sloonie GMan analysis is a pretty good reason to start there.

The more I read the more I think Bea could be mafia but I’m approaching that cautiously.

I could still see Golden being mafia but that’s more tinfoil right now I do want to ISO him though

And then last is up in the air again. I do think we’ve got a high poster so that means either DH/SVS, Golden, or Scotty since I doubt a mafia team of Sloonie and Gman wouldn’t be able to create a third wagon.

I’ll say for SVS is that she plays an amazing game as mafia and I can’t read her worth a damn BUT DH game was very Civvie near the end. The only caveat would be if DH/SVS entire team is filled with less active players then I could see the in thread anger

To this point, I think it should be noted that the most prevalent wagons for most of the day were as follows

Current vote total as of ~7 hours left in Day 3:

GMan (4): SVS, Richochet, Scotty, DrWilgy
sig (3): Vivax, Kate, Golden
SVS (2): DFaraday, sig
Kate (1): Quin
Quin (1): GMan
Vivax (1): Sloonei

Not Voting (3): bea, Elo, Michelle

Currently insanified: Michelle, sig

GMan was almost always the leading wagon. His days were numbered from the onset.

Notes:
-bea hadn’t really been around D3, busy with work. If bea is bad, she’s not doing anything to help start a counter wagon.
-if DF is bad, he at least could be seen *trying* to start a counterwagon on SVS, but his playstyle isn’t conducive to being the conductor on another wagon.

This leaves a myriad of other possibilities for partners.
Quin is entirely possible, posting a shallow indictment of Kate and leaving it at that.
Sloon actually jumped off GMan onto Vivax after I posted a vote count 17 hours left into the day, where he sat around and picked at lint in his belly button for a while.

I think the writing was on the wall for GMan, and, especially if low posters are on the team, it makes it VERY hard to coordinate a counter wagon on anyone. Sloon, if civ, is actually a hard one to take down as a miselim I would expect. Sig could have been a scapegoat for sure, with his 2 votes, but that one didn’t take off. If he is bad, this also explains it, because he was cursed and would have a hard time leading a counter wagon as a counter wagon himself and his mush mouth

[Scotty]

I look at the wagon structure and and am full speed ahead on bea being bad. Her partners are tbd, but she seems the most likely hit

[Scotty]

Adding onto this I’m really vibing with Scotty’s thoughts and while his/Golden D1 defense of me was odd (bit pocketish) it isn’t enough to raise the eyebrows.

I’ve mentioned this before, but your thoughts on players throughout this game has basically mirrored mine, and if they didn’t start producing results, I’d be entirely suspicious. As it is, I’m less suspicious only because GMan is down and was in the POE.

You are in my POE based on the wagons yesterday, but currently at the tail end. I have an extremely light Townlean on you.

[Scotty]

@Quin I probably missed it but can you walk me through the following

1. You’re Kate vote
2. Why Sig is the most amazing player ever (500 word minimum with 3 sources formatted in APA)
3. Who post Gman flip you think the mafia team is


@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

@DFaraday if you could just give some quick general thoughts that would be great

@Scotty pay attention to me and my jokey posts + what do you think about Golden right now?

>looks for coded message in sig’s jokey post
>determine that the past letter of every sentence spells out a web address
>put into google
>oh no I’m in the darkweb
>sig what have you gotten me into
>there is a pounding on my door
>it’s the police
>oh no, not again

[Scotty]

@sig I’ve removed my tinfoil hat of Golden of late. That thing was itchy.

He’s messy and doing contributory solving while still hedgy. I think it frustrating at times, but this isn’t anti-civ behavior.

Could he still be? Yes, but my hair looks nice right now and I don’t feel like putting on that tinfoil hat again right now.

[Scotty]

@sig i can definitely see bad Bea, her vote last night was a big fat WTF imo.

I posted some over the weekend about her, I’ll try to elaborate on that for you later if time allows.

Okay nice, yea the tie/vote was definitely a bad look. Do you think it fits into her meta more to try and save a teammate or throw them under the bus?

Bea is an awesome bad teammate to have. She is loyal to a fault. This is bad or good; good Bea is one of the few people I know who really thinks of the civs as a team, just like the baddies.

Bea would take a chance to save a teammate, yeah.

welp. This is one huge point against bea.
And one slightly smaller point for Sloonei.

[Sloonei]

Current vote total as of ~7 hours left in Day 3:

GMan (4): SVS, Richochet, Scotty, DrWilgy
sig (3): Vivax, Kate, Golden
SVS (2): DFaraday, sig
Kate (1): Quin
Quin (1): GMan
Vivax (1): Sloonei

Not Voting (3): bea, Elo, Michelle

Currently insanified: Michelle, sig

Can somebody who is not me reflect on the fact that Sloonei was not a wagon at this point, and only became one in the latter half of the day as a direct counter to the G-man wagon?

[Scotty]

Current vote total as of ~7 hours left in Day 3:

GMan (4): SVS, Richochet, Scotty, DrWilgy
sig (3): Vivax, Kate, Golden
SVS (2): DFaraday, sig
Kate (1): Quin
Quin (1): GMan
Vivax (1): Sloonei

Not Voting (3): bea, Elo, Michelle

Currently insanified: Michelle, sig

Can somebody who is not me reflect on the fact that Sloonei was not a wagon at this point, and only became one in the latter half of the day as a direct counter to the G-man wagon?

Yes! I can speak to that

I was the first one to vote you after this vote count was posted. I don’t know if anyone posted any lists after, because i was gone. So everyone else on the wagon as it stands came on after me

[Elohcin]

@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

First of all, sheeping is a new term to me. When I was told what it meant, it sounded to me like lazy play. "Oh, I trust so-and-so, so I'm going to go and vote who they vote." So early in the game, that is ridiculous. Unless you have civvie BTSC with that person you trust, you cannot know for sure if the person you are trusting is civ. A few days into the game, and it is still risky. Late in the game, even if you have info on a person, it still LOOKS like bad behavior, like you are just being lazy and jumping on a train, even if the train just has an engine and a caboose and you are the caboose. Like I said in my first posts about this, I think all players should read the thread and make up their own minds. It's okay to agree with someone and vote like they do, we all do that all the time. You agree with them because you read and accessed the situation yourself. But to blindly follow someone's vote just because you think you can trust them is silly and lazy. No one would have gotten away with that back in the day and they shouldn't now.

[Kate]

@Quin I probably missed it but can you walk me through the following

1. You’re Kate vote
2. Why Sig is the most amazing player ever (500 word minimum with 3 sources formatted in APA)
3. Who post Gman flip you think the mafia team is


@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

@DFaraday if you could just give some quick general thoughts that would be great

@Scotty pay attention to me and my jokey posts + what do you think about Golden right now?

Me too, particularly, 1 and 3... If I'm remembering correctly, I don't think you even put it in the thread that you were voting for me. So what's up? I was to busy yesterday Halloweening to come ask.

PS you guys are FUNNY. Im loling all day today.

[Scotty]

Current vote total as of ~7 hours left in Day 3:

GMan (4): SVS, Richochet, Scotty, DrWilgy
sig (3): Vivax, Kate, Golden
SVS (2): DFaraday, sig
Kate (1): Quin
Quin (1): GMan
Vivax (1): Sloonei

Not Voting (3): bea, Elo, Michelle

Currently insanified: Michelle, sig

Can somebody who is not me reflect on the fact that Sloonei was not a wagon at this point, and only became one in the latter half of the day as a direct counter to the G-man wagon?

Yes! I can speak to that

I was the first one to vote you after this vote count was posted. I don’t know if anyone posted any lists after, because i was gone. So everyone else on the wagon as it stands came on after me

Followed by SVS for Sloonei
Michelle for GMan
Vivax for Sloonei
Golden for GMan
bea to tie it for Sloonei
At some point I think Ricochet switched to GMan
Then Wilgy put the finishing blow on GMan

This does look like a potential sticking point for malleable counterwagon as the day got closer to ending.

[Scotty]

@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

First of all, sheeping is a new term to me. When I was told what it meant, it sounded to me like lazy play. "Oh, I trust so-and-so, so I'm going to go and vote who they vote." So early in the game, that is ridiculous. Unless you have civvie BTSC with that person you trust, you cannot know for sure if the person you are trusting is civ. A few days into the game, and it is still risky. Late in the game, even if you have info on a person, it still LOOKS like bad behavior, like you are just being lazy and jumping on a train, even if the train just has an engine and a caboose and you are the caboose. Like I said in my first posts about this, I think all players should read the thread and make up their own minds. It's okay to agree with someone and vote like they do, we all do that all the time. You agree with them because you read and accessed the situation yourself. But to blindly follow someone's vote just because you think you can trust them is silly and lazy. No one would have gotten away with that back in the day and they shouldn't now.

I hear you- I find it very difficult to ever have a mindset of sheeping, but as devils advocate, I can say sheeping can be both lazy and productive. If you are feeling not confident in your reads, and do have trust in a civ player that is taking charge, perhaps it’s not a terrible idea to just vote there. Lazy? Yes. But an uninformed faith vote is more productive than a vanity vote for a 3rd wagon that means nothing in a game where town’s only real weapon is the vote.

[S~V~S]

Current vote total as of ~7 hours left in Day 3:

GMan (4): SVS, Richochet, Scotty, DrWilgy
sig (3): Vivax, Kate, Golden
SVS (2): DFaraday, sig
Kate (1): Quin
Quin (1): GMan
Vivax (1): Sloonei

Not Voting (3): bea, Elo, Michelle

Currently insanified: Michelle, sig

Can somebody who is not me reflect on the fact that Sloonei was not a wagon at this point, and only became one in the latter half of the day as a direct counter to the G-man wagon?

Sure. I suspected G Man, I also suspected you more than sig or definitely my civ self. Myself, Scotty and Vivax all started posting some suspicion of you. One of them (I think Scotty but I am not sure) voted for you. I moved to you deciding that if a G Man lynch failed, I would prefer a Sloonei lynch. So I moved my vote. You may not agree with this reasoning, but you’re acting like a man in shock, repeating the same question in various forms over and over.

I can’t answer for anyone who voted for you after me, but apparently several people think you’re shady AF.

[sig]

@Quin I probably missed it but can you walk me through the following

1. You’re Kate vote
2. Why Sig is the most amazing player ever (500 word minimum with 3 sources formatted in APA)
3. Who post Gman flip you think the mafia team is


@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

@DFaraday if you could just give some quick general thoughts that would be great

@Scotty pay attention to me and my jokey posts + what do you think about Golden right now?

>looks for coded message in sig’s jokey post
>determine that the past letter of every sentence spells out a web address
>put into google
>oh no I’m in the darkweb
>sig what have you gotten me into
>there is a pounding on my door
>it’s the police
>oh no, not again

Okay team one civ down let’s see who else we can get arrested

[Scotty]

@Quin I probably missed it but can you walk me through the following

1. You’re Kate vote
2. Why Sig is the most amazing player ever (500 word minimum with 3 sources formatted in APA)
3. Who post Gman flip you think the mafia team is


@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

@DFaraday if you could just give some quick general thoughts that would be great

@Scotty pay attention to me and my jokey posts + what do you think about Golden right now?

>looks for coded message in sig’s jokey post
>determine that the past letter of every sentence spells out a web address
>put into google
>oh no I’m in the darkweb
>sig what have you gotten me into
>there is a pounding on my door
>it’s the police
>oh no, not again

Okay team one civ down let’s see who else we can get arrested

I don’t think you’re civ or mafia

what are you

[Scotty]

I think DrWilgy looks even better if we remember that one player didn’t have a vote. I still don’t know if that player doesn’t know they don’t have a vote, but Wilgy decisively putting over GMan with +2 is a pretty good sign just in case one of the other 4 voters (not counting Rico) didn’t have a working vote.

[sig]

@sig I’ve removed my tinfoil hat of Golden of late. That thing was itchy.

He’s messy and doing contributory solving while still hedgy. I think it frustrating at times, but this isn’t anti-civ behavior.

Could he still be? Yes, but my hair looks nice right now and I don’t feel like putting on that tinfoil hat again right now.

Sounds good. Personally imma keep the hat on and at some point do an ISO just to be sure.

After the quick read I did I’ll say his vote for me seems less bad than expected. I do think it was a pressure vote buuuuut I’m so used to having a few votes those don’t really work on me anymore

The fact he moved off when he saw it wasn’t working is a good civ point since he could’ve just parked there

Spoiler: show

@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

First of all, sheeping is a new term to me. When I was told what it meant, it sounded to me like lazy play. "Oh, I trust so-and-so, so I'm going to go and vote who they vote." So early in the game, that is ridiculous. Unless you have civvie BTSC with that person you trust, you cannot know for sure if the person you are trusting is civ. A few days into the game, and it is still risky. Late in the game, even if you have info on a person, it still LOOKS like bad behavior, like you are just being lazy and jumping on a train, even if the train just has an engine and a caboose and you are the caboose. Like I said in my first posts about this, I think all players should read the thread and make up their own minds. It's okay to agree with someone and vote like they do, we all do that all the time. You agree with them because you read and accessed the situation yourself. But to blindly follow someone's vote just because you think you can trust them is silly and lazy. No one would have gotten away with that back in the day and they shouldn't now.

Sounds good. While normally I’d say this is NAI and more theory based I’d say in this case it makes Eloh come across as more civvie so I’m sticking to that read.

@Quin I probably missed it but can you walk me through the following

1. You’re Kate vote
2. Why Sig is the most amazing player ever (500 word minimum with 3 sources formatted in APA)
3. Who post Gman flip you think the mafia team is


@Elohcin Walk me through why you think Sheepers are more likely to be mafia and what your current thoughts are on the more sheepy players please.

@DFaraday if you could just give some quick general thoughts that would be great

@Scotty pay attention to me and my jokey posts + what do you think about Golden right now?

Me too, particularly, 1 and 3... If I'm remembering correctly, I don't think you even put it in the thread that you were voting for me. So what's up? I was to busy yesterday Halloweening to come ask.

PS you guys are FUNNY. Im loling all day today.

Yea I couldn’t find a reason for the vote but I’ve also not done an ISO yet. I expect we’ll get an answer tomorrow given the time difference though.

I try my best I used to be a lot more serious and just ended up being annoyed/toxic in the thread. It’s much more fun to throw in humor than be too into it.

[Golden]

Random initial thoughts

Major pings for the people who voted/advocates for my lynch when I was cursed and extra eyes for golden trying to nitpick verbiage on me saying cursed.

I’m never going to be super active if I’m cursed since frankly it seems like a waste of time and the majority of people don’t bother to read those posts. It’s just clutter.

So I wrote a giant thing here about how the hosts wouldn’t do that blah blah blah then read this

I'm a dummy.

Srs business:

"Any player who breaks a rule will be insanified the following day"

Bea and DF broke the srs business rule somehow.

SO this makes it even more boggling that Golden would attempt to vote for me and cast shade my way? Like it was pretty clear I wasn’t active jumped in day 3 and was posting. Nobody bothered to call this out for me (especially the people who caught it or were suspecting me should’ve) if anything this actually makes me feel worse about Golden then when I was just reading as I went and thought he was speculating.

And piggybacking on that I’d almost 100% clear Bea and DF for the time being based ONLY off the fact they didn’t vote. I think someone on the mafia team would’ve read that and ensured everyone voted to avoid that.


It seems like he was just trying to find an easy vote/start a counter wagon and that didn’t work so he hopped back into another wagon.

SVS is rewriting my faith in DH slot the main issue I had was the self vote which is why I parked myself their initially.

Not trying to do a DH here, but basically everything you claim I was doing is contradicted by what actually happened.

I never pressed for a vote for you. I pressure voted you to get your head out if your arse and get you to post cursed. It was evident it failed. Waking up to Douche votes on Yu was an unexpected shock. Your ‘noone reads cursed posts’ is weak, and an easy place for mafia to hide, and you don’t get to avoid that scrutiny. Bea managed to contribute, so can you.

But when I actually had time to read some things and read your iso, it looked decent.

There was no grand plan to lead some wagon on you. I even said today based on my availability I was more likely to sheep.

And I didn’t make semantic arguments. I didn’t know whether you’d know why you were cursed. I just asked people whether they thought your knowledge of it was alignment indicative.

Now, a question for you - very basic one. Did you know why you were cursed?

Nope. I assumed the Vomp role cursed me as was the running theory last time I checked in.

And it kinda is a semantic argument if you’re saying I wasn’t “cursed” but punished like it’s still a curse.

Also I’ll go to my grave saying this you can’t be a productive player in thread if your cursed with anything. And trying to be so shouldn’t give you civ points if anything it’s more scummy then just dipping

I did not, even once, say you weren’t cursed. I just said that accusing me of being the curser when it was clearly self-inflicted (ie, a punishment… still a curse), stood out to me.

I thought I’d learn something by you responding to my question but ultimately I realise it’s all wifom… I’m still interested in Beas answer to my question on the subject.

[Sloonei]

Current vote total as of ~7 hours left in Day 3:

GMan (4): SVS, Richochet, Scotty, DrWilgy
sig (3): Vivax, Kate, Golden
SVS (2): DFaraday, sig
Kate (1): Quin
Quin (1): GMan
Vivax (1): Sloonei

Not Voting (3): bea, Elo, Michelle

Currently insanified: Michelle, sig

Can somebody who is not me reflect on the fact that Sloonei was not a wagon at this point, and only became one in the latter half of the day as a direct counter to the G-man wagon?

Sure. I suspected G Man, I also suspected you more than sig or definitely my civ self. Myself, Scotty and Vivax all started posting some suspicion of you. One of them (I think Scotty but I am not sure) voted for you. I moved to you deciding that if a G Man lynch failed, I would prefer a Sloonei lynch. So I moved my vote. You may not agree with this reasoning, but you’re acting like a man in shock, repeating the same question in various forms over and over.

I can’t answer for anyone who voted for you after me, but apparently several people think you’re shady AF.

I’m referring simply to the “wagonomics” of it, not looking for individual vote analysis. For me to be bad, the mafia team had to have either been sitting on their hands all day yesterday, or their strategy was to put two of their own against each other as the elimination options. Look at it like this:

Sloonei did not become a candidate until halfway through the day, after G-man had already been on the brink all day. I think this should indicate that Sloonei was pushed as the counterwagon in an effort to save G-man.

The initial wagon (G-man) was a hit. After it had been stewing for a while, a second wagon emerged as a counter to it. What is more likely: that the mafia team’s thread presence was so weak that it enabled one of its own to become a counterwagon to their dying partner, or that the mafia team seized the momentum against a town player who was already pushing one of their own?

[Golden]

Addendum to the post about why G Mans bad team wouldn’t try to lynch someone else.

This is driving me nuts. I’m trying to figure out why a bad team wouldn’t try to start a third wagon if both Sloon and G were bad, or try harder to pile on Sloonei if only G was bad.

Maybe he was alone, or only had one teammate there? Like others were low posters or had time zone issues?

Because I’ve been playing Mafia a long time and have never seen a baddie with an alternative train do … nothing. I’m spitballing about maybe low posters etc because I just don’t understand Gs behavior there.

Yes, this makes sense. Thinking back on g-man's play, it seems like he was doing just enough to try to get by trying to look civ without rocking the boat too much to gain suspicion. As if he were going it pretty much alone and trying to hold it all together. This doesn't help alleviate my gut suspicion of DH, now SVS. And neither does SVS' lack of voting Gman. I don't know why I can't shake it. Does ANYone else feel the same way?

I don't. She's got her kid gloves on in a sense, when it comes to Bea, but bea is looking more and more bad to me and svs noticed that right away. If she were bad, I believe she'd shy away from accusing bea at all. Also, she can read me like a newspaper, and I've never seen a bad svs defend a civ me as well as she has here.

This is exactly my thought.

In a world where Sloonei is civ, bea voting not only to tie the game with a self-professed poor read on the game at large, but to potentially save GMan is a double red flag.

I can see early game reasons why one might feel that way and have before. I think DH was there in frustration before he subbed out. But I tend to agree wirh you on that point viv.

This is responding to Viv’s comment that a civ should never be fine getting miselimmed, which is what GMan was doing.
Then, 20 minutes later:

I am a confused and no lies feel like any vote I make is rushed and illinformed.

Also i missed why svs voted sloon? It looked in the thread like she sused gman.

Dgoing with the tie. I hope rev knows better than i do.

Nothing in that progression makes sense. Does a civ bea have to make sense? No, but I’d expect a better explanation for doing 2 nakedly hedgey and scummy things.

bea is mafia for these actions alone.

This is pretty damning my only issue with Bea is her lack of voting and curse the following day. I’d think the mafia would be more on top of that? Of course that could also serve as a good strategy for a one day pass BUT she wasn’t being suspected then anyway.

I don’t really recall Bea’s neta so I’m a bit worried this may be another Lorab style vote so if any older players could chime in I’d appreciate it

@Kate @Golden @S~V~S

Oh I really do have to sheep Kate and svs on Beas meta, as previously discussed I think I’m inclined towards always seeing town bea.

[Golden]

I think DrWilgy looks even better if we remember that one player didn’t have a vote. I still don’t know if that player doesn’t know they don’t have a vote, but Wilgy decisively putting over GMan with +2 is a pretty good sign just in case one of the other 4 voters (not counting Rico) didn’t have a working vote.

Please. Wilgy does not look better.

He tastes better.

[Golden]

Honestly I s been vibing with wilgys antics this game more than any other. Maybe I’m reading it wrong but his licking feels like a representation of having read something that has lead to a read and then when he describes their taste in putting that on a taste rainbow chart.

I just generally have felt good about wilgy

[Sloonei]

Why was I a better option than G-man?

I am feeling DH the more I play this game.

Just this morning I said that I did not feel any of the other possible wagons forming, and when someone else voted for you, I moved my vote so if there were two wagons, they would both be people I suspected.

That’s why you. I suspected you. I felt if I helped form a second wagon on someone I suspected, then someone I suspected was bound to be lynched.

Why was it important to have two options when you were okay with the first option?

I have to explain this? I wanted to lynch a baddie. If I think two people are bad and they both have strong wagons, a civ can’t accidentally be lynched. I wanted to head off a civ wagon.

Also I hope I did not offend you, it wasn’t my intention. I was just stating my belief. I’ll pull back off of that.

Linki @ sig

I was a bit frustrated, but I also really did need to leave. I had a job interview. I think it went well.

But the accusation that I have been suspecting everyone is not only false. But it is contrary to some of the other accusations ai have faced in this game. I have been under scrutiny for vocalizing a strong town read on Quin. Vivax expressed suspicion of me for having a town read on Bea. On Day 1, people were critical of me for not having a strong suspect (my top suspect that day ended up flipping indie, fwiw).

And beyond that, I just did a ton of work last night to read G-man and produced a handful of town reads from the exercise. I did not feel it was fair to accuse me of casting blanket suspicion against everyone.

[Sloonei]

Wilgy tastes exceedingly town.

[Golden]

G-Man didn’t vote in self-defense. There’s two explanations for that in my mind. I read Sloonei as town, personally, so I lean more towards the town one. (There’s a third possibility too - “G was just too busy”)

1) G-Man and Sloonei are w/w. I could definitely see G being the type to take the hit over Sloonei because he felt Sloonei had more ‘win equity’. If sloon is mafia right now, not being nked isn’t even suspicious.

2) Sloonei is town, and G-Man wanted the wifom of people wanting to think the reason why he didn’t self-vote is (1). That’s why he made the post about Sloonei being a better town asset than him.

[S~V~S]

Why was I a better option than G-man?

I am feeling DH the more I play this game.

Just this morning I said that I did not feel any of the other possible wagons forming, and when someone else voted for you, I moved my vote so if there were two wagons, they would both be people I suspected.

That’s why you. I suspected you. I felt if I helped form a second wagon on someone I suspected, then someone I suspected was bound to be lynched.

Why was it important to have two options when you were okay with the first option?

I have to explain this? I wanted to lynch a baddie. If I think two people are bad and they both have strong wagons, a civ can’t accidentally be lynched. I wanted to head off a civ wagon.

Also I hope I did not offend you, it wasn’t my intention. I was just stating my belief. I’ll pull back off of that.

Linki @ sig

I was a bit frustrated, but I also really did need to leave. I had a job interview. I think it went well.

But the accusation that I have been suspecting everyone is not only false. But it is contrary to some of the other accusations ai have faced in this game. I have been under scrutiny for vocalizing a strong town read on Quin. Vivax expressed suspicion of me for having a town read on Bea. On Day 1, people were critical of me for not having a strong suspect (my top suspect that day ended up flipping indie, fwiw).

And beyond that, I just did a ton of work last night to read G-man and produced a handful of town reads from the exercise. I did not feel it was fair to accuse me of casting blanket suspicion against everyone.

That is not exactly what I meant, blanket suspicions. I meant more like several small meh votes and suspicions, not really baddie hunting. Poor wording on my part. Not committing to a suspicion. This is the first time I recall you taking a strong stand about someone.

Unfortunately it’s me :ha ha:

But I’m glad to see it.

Linki @Golden i would tend to agree re G man painting a target on Sloonei.

[Scotty]

I think DrWilgy looks even better if we remember that one player didn’t have a vote. I still don’t know if that player doesn’t know they don’t have a vote, but Wilgy decisively putting over GMan with +2 is a pretty good sign just in case one of the other 4 voters (not counting Rico) didn’t have a working vote.

Please. Wilgy does not look better.

He tastes better.

Y’all need to start holstering your tongues

This is how the pandemic starts back up again

[Scotty]

G-Man didn’t vote in self-defense. There’s two explanations for that in my mind. I read Sloonei as town, personally, so I lean more towards the town one. (There’s a third possibility too - “G was just too busy”)

1) G-Man and Sloonei are w/w. I could definitely see G being the type to take the hit over Sloonei because he felt Sloonei had more ‘win equity’. If sloon is mafia right now, not being nked isn’t even suspicious.

2) Sloonei is town, and G-Man wanted the wifom of people wanting to think the reason why he didn’t self-vote is (1). That’s why he made the post about Sloonei being a better town asset than him.

Also, GMan is expendable in the broader sense on his team as the insanifier is far less useful to the team as a whole. Mafia obviously don’t want to lose their Dead Red, and if they haven’t used their Pink ability yet, that one. Though you have to think that was used asap. In which case, that would be a mafia member that wouldn’t be a surprise to be a good candidate for bussing for cred sooner rather than later.

[Sloonei]

That is not exactly what I meant, blanket suspicions. I meant more like several small meh votes and suspicions, not really baddie hunting. Poor wording on my part. Not committing to a suspicion. This is the first time I recall you taking a strong stand about someone.

Unfortunately it’s me :ha ha:

But I’m glad to see it.

Linki @Golden i would tend to agree re G man painting a target on Sloonei.

Perhaps I have also been unclear about something. I hardly consider you my top suspect right now. If Day started this instant, my vote would be on Bea. I also have not finished digging into G-man’s ISO just yet.

But also, I thought I was very vocal about having a strong suspicion against G-man for most of yesterday. Perhaps some of that got lost because my case against him came out incidentally in a large ISO post, and I was also casting a wide net yesterday. But I assure you I felt strongly about my read on G yesterday.

[Vivax]

Nice outcome ! No more off-topic green is a game changer.
I'm a bit groggy today from halloween stuff. Probably won't do much during night phase.

It's interesting that the non-player vote ended up on mafia (considering it's derived from a Feb ability)

[DrWilgy]

Nice outcome ! No more off-topic green is a game changer.
I'm a bit groggy today from halloween stuff. Probably won't do much during night phase.

It's interesting that the non-player vote ended up on mafia (considering it's derived from a Feb ability)

Consume Vivax as well.