Mafia: A World Asunder - GAME THREAD [Day 13]

[Enrique]

Doc: Fucked off all D1 until he was in danger, then he showed up and now he's fucked off again. He's demonstrated that he's able to play, and that he jumped into the thread at EOD when he was in danger of being lynched demonstrates to me that he's either paying attention himself or has people paying attention for him.

Doesn't he always do exactly this, though?

[Sloonei]

ok. i'll be serious.

timmer is bad because i made a case on him day 1 and even if i don't believe in it anymore that still tilts the read.
g-man is bad because i agree with some early assessments of g-man making big posts that say nothing.

why does your vanished Day 1 read still influence you if you don't believe in it or know what it was?

[Quin]

GTH reads on timmer and G-man, go!

dey bad

Both of them? Why?

You said it was a GTH. This is against the rules.

It was. Now I'm pulling the gun away and asking why you said those words.

Well I am running away with my fingers in my ears going nanananananananana

Then imma leave my vote right here.

That would be somewhat inconvenient.

[sprityo]

I agree with you Mac, SVS is starting to rub me the wrong way


Also who cares about info drops??? What good does it do me to withhold that information? Talking about it later like “oh yeah I saw colonel mustard in the dining hall with the candlestick” isn’t gonna help us 3 days from now

As has been said, it's a difference in culture. Some of us come from a culture where info dumping is either explicitly not allowed in games, or is generally considered bad form. So, even when we aceept that it is part of this culture, we still don't necessarily like it.

I see a lot of complaining that I got lucky to get information, sorry to dissapoint everyone with being different and letting you know something helpful I guess

As I asked above, do you know anything about the source of this information? Is the woman a force for good? Does her information come from hosts or from another player? Does she always tell the truth?

And why are you interpreting as necessarily being that sabie is bad, as opposed to sabie is physically adjacent to someone bad?

This woman is described as “mad” and this is what you would call an NPC, so it’s not from any other player

[Sloonei]

dey bad

Both of them? Why?

You said it was a GTH. This is against the rules.

It was. Now I'm pulling the gun away and asking why you said those words.

Well I am running away with my fingers in my ears going nanananananananana

Then imma leave my vote right here.

That would be somewhat inconvenient.

Go do some town things without me meddling and I'll see how I feel.

[sprityo]

I like this line of thinking from Enrique:

Trickster - Has an aura of three squares, within which any info that is given or received will be corrupted in the Trickster’s favour. When the Trickster kills, that kill can be forged. When the Trickster enters BTSC, it may be under any name.

There's also this.

You support my first theory then of trickster faking their own death?

I mean I don't think it's impossible but I'm not endorsing it here. Was the Trickster dead by the time you met that lady?

I'll be more explicit: How do you know you were talking to an old woman and not to the Trickster, appearing in a chat room as an old woman?

It wasn’t BTSC, no chat room

[Jackofhearts2005]

I have reason to believe that nutella was killed by one of the five players I ISO’d.

For those like me who keep going back and forth to remember who were the five:

Luna
Kyle
DDL
Quin
G-man

I'm okay with striking off G-Man from this specific thing.

why?

I am not swayed by luna’s vouching for him.

Why not?

gut

#trustcops

To be clear, that wasn't a claim or a hint of any kind. I genuinely just don't rule out G-man based on intuition.

I’m not talking about you. I’m talking about Luna.

[Quin]

ok. i'll be serious.

timmer is bad because i made a case on him day 1 and even if i don't believe in it anymore that still tilts the read.
g-man is bad because i agree with some early assessments of g-man making big posts that say nothing.

why does your vanished Day 1 read still influence you if you don't believe in it or know what it was?

i know what it was i acknowledge one bad thing compared to zero good things about timmer. thus, he bad.


maybe i'm just not that funny?

[Sloonei]

This woman is described as “mad” and this is what you would call an NPC, so it’s not from any other player

That changes things.

[Quin]

Both of them? Why?

You said it was a GTH. This is against the rules.

It was. Now I'm pulling the gun away and asking why you said those words.

Well I am running away with my fingers in my ears going nanananananananana

Then imma leave my vote right here.

That would be somewhat inconvenient.

Go do some town things without me meddling and I'll see how I feel.

If I feel like it.

[Enrique]

I like this line of thinking from Enrique:

Trickster - Has an aura of three squares, within which any info that is given or received will be corrupted in the Trickster’s favour. When the Trickster kills, that kill can be forged. When the Trickster enters BTSC, it may be under any name.

There's also this.

You support my first theory then of trickster faking their own death?

I mean I don't think it's impossible but I'm not endorsing it here. Was the Trickster dead by the time you met that lady?

I'll be more explicit: How do you know you were talking to an old woman and not to the Trickster, appearing in a chat room as an old woman?

It wasn’t BTSC, no chat room

I was thinking more the first part of the role (corrupted info) if anything btw. It's probably legit (mad old forest ladies are good).

[LoRab]

I agree with you Mac, SVS is starting to rub me the wrong way


Also who cares about info drops??? What good does it do me to withhold that information? Talking about it later like “oh yeah I saw colonel mustard in the dining hall with the candlestick” isn’t gonna help us 3 days from now

As has been said, it's a difference in culture. Some of us come from a culture where info dumping is either explicitly not allowed in games, or is generally considered bad form. So, even when we aceept that it is part of this culture, we still don't necessarily like it.

I see a lot of complaining that I got lucky to get information, sorry to dissapoint everyone with being different and letting you know something helpful I guess

As I asked above, do you know anything about the source of this information? Is the woman a force for good? Does her information come from hosts or from another player? Does she always tell the truth?

And why are you interpreting as necessarily being that sabie is bad, as opposed to sabie is physically adjacent to someone bad?

This woman is described as “mad” and this is what you would call an NPC, so it’s not from any other player

I don't know what NPC means.

And she's "mad"? And you just trust what she says?! That does not sound like a necessarily safe idea.

[DharmaHelper]

I agree with you Mac, SVS is starting to rub me the wrong way


Also who cares about info drops??? What good does it do me to withhold that information? Talking about it later like “oh yeah I saw colonel mustard in the dining hall with the candlestick” isn’t gonna help us 3 days from now

As has been said, it's a difference in culture. Some of us come from a culture where info dumping is either explicitly not allowed in games, or is generally considered bad form. So, even when we aceept that it is part of this culture, we still don't necessarily like it.

I see a lot of complaining that I got lucky to get information, sorry to dissapoint everyone with being different and letting you know something helpful I guess

As I asked above, do you know anything about the source of this information? Is the woman a force for good? Does her information come from hosts or from another player? Does she always tell the truth?

And why are you interpreting as necessarily being that sabie is bad, as opposed to sabie is physically adjacent to someone bad?

This woman is described as “mad” and this is what you would call an NPC, so it’s not from any other player

I don't know what NPC means.

And she's "mad"? And you just trust what she says?! That does not sound like a necessarily safe idea.

Non-Player-Character.

[sprityo]

Did I not say crazy lady in the woods?

[Sloonei]

I don't know what NPC means.

And she's "mad"? And you just trust what she says?! That does not sound like a necessarily safe idea.

Non-Playable Character. Video game speak for the computer-generated characters that populate the world of the game.

[Sloonei]

Did I not say crazy lady in the woods?

I guess you did, but knowing that she was specifically identified as "mad" puts another layer of doubt and ambiguity onto the information.

[Enrique]

Also slightly ot, but I hate this player salad nonsense.i don't see a problem with giving lots of reads at once if it makes sense or is asked.

People misuse the term. It’s when the reads are unsubstantiated and based on nothing apparent in context, like if I said, “My scumreads are sprit, Epignosis, Sloonei and maybe speedchuck” and offered little-to-no-reasoning (because I can’t actually supply any).

Colin is mafia.

[LoRab]

Thank you all for clarifying.

But how do we know that what she says isn't generated from a player? I mean, what if one of the secret roles is mad woods lady?

And, again, even if host based, why are we trusting that what she says is true?

[DharmaHelper]

Thank you all for clarifying.

But how do we know that what she says isn't generated from a player? I mean, what if one of the secret roles is mad woods lady?

And, again, even if host based, why are we trusting that what she says is true?

I for one, have not *~(^_^*~)

[sprityo]

I am, it’s the best lead I’ve gotten at such an early point in the game

with minimum effort

[DharmaHelper]

If anyone is thinking of pulling the trigger on sabie's lynch all I have to say is Do It Bitch

[Jackofhearts2005]

You guys are no help at all.

[VOTE: Quin] aubergine

[Sloonei]

Based on the "mad" descriptor I would guess that this lady either speaks cryptically, or provides at least partially false information. This is colored a little by my read of sabie. I think she seems earnest and have a moderate town read on her at the moment.

[Sloonei]

Quin, wilgy, and G-man are the three names I'm most seriously considering.

[Enrique]

Why Wilgert?

[VOTE: Lunalee] aubergine

[Sloonei]

Why Wilgert?

[VOTE: Lunalee] aubergine

If the mady woman's information is cryptic/indirect, sabie seems to be implicating wilgy. Plus, DH's points on wilgy are not insubstantial.

Luna's hasty support of sprit's info has knocked her down a peg in my eye. I still town read her, but I'm a little concerned by that.

[DharmaHelper]

You guys are no help at all.

[VOTE: Quin] aubergine

[Jackofhearts2005]

You guys are no help at all.

[VOTE: Quin] aubergine

I could also see myself voting DH.

[DharmaHelper]

But y

[Enrique]

Why Wilgert?

[VOTE: Lunalee] aubergine

If the mady woman's information is cryptic/indirect, sabie seems to be implicating wilgy. Plus, DH's points on wilgy are not insubstantial.

Luna's hasty support of sprit's info has knocked her down a peg in my eye. I still town read her, but I'm a little concerned by that.

I looked at the sabie/Wilgy thing. Basically on Day 1 she went really quick from "I can't tell why people suspect Wilgy, he just voted and left" to "I suspect Wilgy, he just voted and left". I don't think it reflects great on her or that it has anything to do with sprit's stuff tbh (and she can maybe correct me a little bit or dig more into her case? I don't think it's a lot more than that).

[sabie12]

Why Wilgert?

[VOTE: Lunalee] aubergine

If the mady woman's information is cryptic/indirect, sabie seems to be implicating wilgy. Plus, DH's points on wilgy are not insubstantial.

Luna's hasty support of sprit's info has knocked her down a peg in my eye. I still town read her, but I'm a little concerned by that.

I looked at the sabie/Wilgy thing. Basically on Day 1 she went really quick from "I can't tell why people suspect Wilgy, he just voted and left" to "I suspect Wilgy, he just voted and left". I don't think it reflects great on her or that it has anything to do with sprit's stuff tbh (and she can maybe correct me a little bit or dig more into her case? I don't think it's a lot more than that).

I never said I can't tell why people suspect wilgy. I said I can't see a reason not to.

[Kylemii]

ok a couple thoughts

i believe sprityo is being honest about what he experienced, in the woods, with the woods woman, mainly cus it would be a ludicrous thing to lie about. i don't necessarily think that i trust information coming from a character that's described as a crazy old lady that lives in a forest to be completely 100% accurate since BR and LC put a lot of thought into balance, but i think it's worth keeping in mind as a data point nonetheless.

w
as far as sabie herself goes, her response to sprit''s accusation was very calm, she didn't seem particularly panicked and she didn't accuse sprityo of lying or anything like that. this could go either way for me cus if she was bad and knew the accusation was true, then she might realize that going after sprityo instead would backfire so going after the info source as unreliable might be more effective. alternatively she might just generally be a cool cucumber.

i would be interested in seeing anecdotes of her responding to similar situations in the past, if anyone knows of any.

[Epignosis]

I finally made it through Night 1. I see Wilgy has votes. Is this because there's reason to believe he's bad or is he just the default early lynch like he always is?

[Sloonei]

I finally made it through Night 1. I see Wilgy has votes. Is this because there's reason to believe he's bad or is he just the default early lynch like he always is?

There's more to it today. DH has done some work that points toward wilgy as a possible partner of TH's, and sprityo's recent claim may possibly implicate wilgy in some convoluted way.

[Enrique]

Yeah Bob does seem a little all over the place I'll have to look more into that. Not sure if that's where drwilgys suspicion comes from? from what I can tell all drwilgy did was vote with no explanation and then go away with no explanation. I'm always wary of the random no explanation votes even if just a minimal one.

Leaning drwilgy at this time due to random voting no explanation not even mentioning it and then completely disappearing. Off to a Christmas party. I will check back in after though in case anything else comes up.

This is the jump I was talking about. My bad, my eyes just kinda glossed over the last line of the first quote.

[Jackofhearts2005]

But y

You know why.

[sabie12]

ok a couple thoughts

i believe sprityo is being honest about what he experienced, in the woods, with the woods woman, mainly cus it would be a ludicrous thing to lie about. i don't necessarily think that i trust information coming from a character that's described as a crazy old lady that lives in a forest to be completely 100% accurate since BR and LC put a lot of thought into balance, but i think it's worth keeping in mind as a data point nonetheless.

w
as far as sabie herself goes, her response to sprit''s accusation was very calm, she didn't seem particularly panicked and she didn't accuse sprityo of lying or anything like that. this could go either way for me cus if she was bad and knew the accusation was true, then she might realize that going after sprityo instead would backfire so going after the info source as unreliable might be more effective. alternatively she might just generally be a cool cucumber.

i would be interested in seeing anecdotes of her responding to similar situations in the past, if anyone knows of any.

How would you want me to react? Get all angry and annoyed? It doesnt say I'm bad but that a person that was with me was bad. I dont think hes making anything up to accuse me I think he truly believed his incorrect interpretation of the information. He's just wrong.

[Enrique]

I finally made it through Night 1. I see Wilgy has votes. Is this because there's reason to believe he's bad or is he just the default early lynch like he always is?

There's more to it today. DH has done some work that points toward wilgy as a possible partner of TH's, and sprityo's recent claim may possibly implicate wilgy in some convoluted way.

TH's posts on Wilgy basically amount to the same thing Epi and I are talking about now. DH has made good posts but I really don't think this is it.

[Epignosis]

DH has done some work

Nah, I don't buy it.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Do any roles benefit from being close together? Like scum gathering in one place?

There seem to be a number of proximity triggers, and I would ‘t be surprised if there are more in the *secrets*, and sharing a square grants people BTSC. Why do you ask?

DDL seems to be assuming that there is only one mafia in your 5. There could be two, technically.

That made me start wondering if mafia are more likely to be close together or far away. Made me wonder if we could use that.

On further reflection, there's probably a pro/con regardless of abilities. Mafia far away from each other cover more kill targets, but close together avoid more town role effects.

Actually I said at least 1 mafia, not necessarily just one.

[DharmaHelper]

Lotsa people watching the thread right now.

[Kylemii]

ok a couple thoughts

i believe sprityo is being honest about what he experienced, in the woods, with the woods woman, mainly cus it would be a ludicrous thing to lie about. i don't necessarily think that i trust information coming from a character that's described as a crazy old lady that lives in a forest to be completely 100% accurate since BR and LC put a lot of thought into balance, but i think it's worth keeping in mind as a data point nonetheless.

w
as far as sabie herself goes, her response to sprit''s accusation was very calm, she didn't seem particularly panicked and she didn't accuse sprityo of lying or anything like that. this could go either way for me cus if she was bad and knew the accusation was true, then she might realize that going after sprityo instead would backfire so going after the info source as unreliable might be more effective. alternatively she might just generally be a cool cucumber.

i would be interested in seeing anecdotes of her responding to similar situations in the past, if anyone knows of any.

How would you want me to react? Get all angry and annoyed? It doesnt say I'm bad but that a person that was with me was bad. I dont think hes making anything up to accuse me I think he truly believed his incorrect interpretation of the information. He's just wrong.

i'm not saying you reacted wrong or anything, i'm just making note of how you reacted and what it might mean in terms of whether or not it was true. you being civ and reacting to the accusation calmly was a covered possibility. i'm sorry if i wasn't clear

[LoRab]

I finally made it through Night 1. I see Wilgy has votes. Is this because there's reason to believe he's bad or is he just the default early lynch like he always is?

He showed up a minute or so after the lynch ended, and defended himself for his vote. He later claimed that he didn't even know he was up for the lynch. Which is odd, because why would he post any sort of defense if he didn't know that people were finding him suspish. The whole thing didn't sit right.

And, since, based on an interpretation of information, sabie has implicated him.

[Sloonei]

I asked this earlier and zero people responded, and now we're at a sort of lull with not much time to go so lemme ask again:
What's the most civilian thing that each of the candidates has done this game? Answer that question for whichever players you consider to be "candidates".

[Kylemii]

if you'd been like "hey frig off, you big liar" it would have looked much worse actually, but my point was that if you were responding to his supicion from a mafia mindset, you were doing it from a point of experience, but if you were doing it from a civ mindset you were probably just a calm and rational person

[MacDougall]

SVS is suspicious

No she is not, S~V~S is 100% town, my fren.

I am as civvie as the day is long. How about you?

Also, I am going to reread some of the posts of the 5 people, I don't like info drops any more than Tranq does, but Sloonei made cases first, so I will deal. I am not going to entertain info drops with no cases, though.

At this stage, I am null about both Quin and G Man, I reread him today and feel better about Kyle than I did, Luna as well, but not 100% there. DDL is someone I want to reread, his one post pinged me, but nothing since, really. If I had to vote this second (GTH) it would be G Man, I think. While not a truth meta guy like Glor, he does not love lying much and has not said some stuff I kind of expected him to say. But not sure yet.

I'm just teasing you. I find your reactions to suspicion funny.

[MacDougall]

Lol how did we get on a Wilgy train again?

[Sloonei]

[mention]Quin[/mention] you feel like doing anything yet?

[juliets]

I am unsure about Luna now after her response to the sprityo info. I do not question that sprityo is giving us information that he got. What I do question is what the info means. sabie? someone she was next to? something I haven't though of? I just don't see how a smart woman as Luna jumps to the conclusion it's sable so quickly. So I'm torn at the moment as to whether that's enough to knock my opinion down to orange or red or just yellow. I'm watching TV at the moment but I'll be around. I WILL NOT be here at EOD though, I will be asleep.

lots of linki

[Enrique]

So I didn’t read into TH being bad or really read at all, but could someone clear out the possibility for me that TH wasn’t forged into being the trickster upon death?

I never trust flavor posts out of habit (speedchuck and I probably share this) this is a role that can make anyone else they kill reveal as something else. It’s not like I can ask long con “did the trickster for real for real die?”

Linki: very well, I’ll keep that in mind sloon

The answer to your question is that it seems like it would be theoretically possible. If the trickster is bad and killed th and forged it to say th was the trickster and was bad, sure. But... why would they do that? It's interesting that you bring up such a specific question when you have barely participated.

The simplest answer is that a mafia person died. If we make that assumption, we can move forward with analyzing TH and sussing out someone to lynch today. If we get all suspicious that TH only flipped bad, and wasn't really bad, then we don't have a clear path forward for today's lynch. I'd rather assume the simplest scenario that TH was bad, and use that information to move forward.

This one post was good.

Spoiler: show

The people want Luna ISO 2.0, so I'm gonna give it to them! late Day 1 and on edition:

Ahhh
Should I break the tie on wilgy or sloonei, or just stay on colin and ignore it?

linki: the tie is gone

WHAT IS THIS POST, LUNA? Why ignore it? What was going through your head as you entered the thread near the deadline? (I'll provide my own answer to that question, you tell me if i'm right or wrong)

Well I guess getting lynched Day 1 means I can study more rip

but you're not getting lynched? Wilgy has 5 votes and you have 3

Are you sitting down?

Things were volatile, votes were changing every second. I don't get this post.

I don't know what's going on and I don't have much time to catch up before EOD. Halp.

Verbal flailing.

I always self destruct under pressure look back at the Peloponnesian war mafia game where I was town

Imma bet wolbre's town.

Good call right there.

Wilgy on the other hand, has said nothing that looks lock-town.

I mean, given the options I can't say this vote is terrible. I'm not sure what to make of the note of confidence though. The vote feels a bit overstated, maybe.

Voting Dr. Wilgy. Incase he's bad. Cause I don't thin Wolbre is.

I can't tell if this vote is more a defense of wolbre or an act against wilgy. It's both for sure, but I'm unclear on what luna's primary motive was, if that sort of thing matters at all.

im not dying over an afk player
[VOTE: DrWilgy] aubergine

dude, please be civ, cause I just saved you for no reason and if you're bad I'm gonna die.

Conclusion on EOD Luna: She showed up late in the day with a vote parked on Colin. She needed to make a decision on Wilgy or wolbre and got involved. I like that on the surface. She made a decision and stuck to it. There was not a lot of time to think things through, so everything came out a bit jumbled, but I'd be interested in hearing what exactly was going through Luna's mind when she was deciding who to vote for, just to help contextualize these posts a bit better. I lean town on her behavior here, but that's not a strong read at the moment.

Summary of my suspects: timmer, Sloonei, Tranq, INH, Luna.

PLAYA SALAD!

(joking, sort of.)

How seriously is this meant to be taken?

Bad wagon is bad. This is bad. One of the other two is Mafia and getting saved. Wilgy is always the mislynch.

...what if Mac and Wilgy are scummates.

I don't know. Do you think they are?

People: "wilgy is a bad vote for people scared to be held responsible"

Also people: "nah let's not vote for anybody on his wagon"

[VOTE: tranq] aubergine

still want juliets

This post is weird and I may be misunderstanding it. But is colonialbob saying people scared to be held responsible will vote off wagon? Then Sloonei quotes it, not only saying he's voting off wagon, but that he's not even voting for who he wants to vote for. If you're going to vote off wagon anyways, why not go for juliets?

cbob was suggesting that we should vote for a player who was voting for wilgy at the time because a number of people were complaining that his wagon was shady and weak. Tranq was on the wagon and was a person who'd garnered a fair amount of suspicion.

Why'd you kill nutella?

I would like to look at Wolbre's wagon. That's a good place to start.

Nutella died? I haven't seen the end of night post.

Agreed RE: wolbre wagon. Let us know what you think when you get a chance.

I wanted to doublecheck my town read on Luna from earlier and it hasn't gone away. It's still not super strong, but there's nothing here that really stands out to me as bad, and a few points that look genuine and proactive. I'd be open to alternative theories though.

Imma bet luna's scum.