The Syndicate

dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:56 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:49 pm Has anyone noticed that Tim's reads are garbage surface level nothingburger and he's done nothing to promote them?
wasn't it tim yelling at ted earlier and promoting that read or am i misremembering?

I'm definitely game to run up Ted, but I haven't been pushing anything.

I have a history of bitching about people making and demanding useless day one reads, and I thought I'd try something different so went on this reading ISOs campaign. Truth is I was right all along, day one is full of nonsense that can't really be made meaningful in the context of zero facts. All the reading ISOs has really done is made me sleep a lot.

The lazy line here is "Nutella's getting chopped,, probably wolf but could be town I guess, <shrug>" and that, in broad strokes, is the line everyone is taking.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:08 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:05 pm The lazy line here is "Nutella's getting chopped,, probably wolf but could be town I guess, <shrug>" and that, in broad strokes, is the line everyone is taking.
That's cool but I've not seen anyone offer up any strong arguments for other wagons. Not even Nutella herself has pushed her cases very hard.

At the end of the day it's a day 1 chop. It's not going to dictate the result of the game all that much either way. This is a game with a lot of roles so the night movements are going to be a massive factor.

I agree. Just pointing out that the various "lazy line" accusations are kinda silly in the gamestate. It's a runaway wagon day. Looking back on it there are going to be people who were on board just because getting off wouldn't matter, and people who were off wagon just because getting on wouldn't matter.

If Nutella flips wolf there are gonna be people who want town cred just for piling on a runaway wagon. If Nutella doesn't flip wolf there will be people who want town cred for just throwing their vote away on a vanity wagon. Watch for them.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:09 pm Incorrect tim, D1 is for killing mafia

Possibly not this D1 but in general

Where did I say that it wasn't?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:19 pm Tim being Sus and talking about nutella chop as lazy males me feel better about it.

Why is that?

dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:47 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:42 pm sprityo do you genuinely believe you have the clout to convince people to exe tutuu despite half the game townshielding her or is this case entirely performative? Like you can see that there's 90 minutes to EoD and there's 10 votes on nutella right?
so is there any point to doing anything? i don't think anyone on her wagon is interested in moving

I think the question is...

If there isn't any point, why is Sprit making this effort?

Like, if Ted turned up and really started banging the drum to make me a counterwagon I could make some sense of that. Maybe Ted really believes he has the clout, and maybe he really believes there is enough undercurrents of distrust about me that something could happen.

But Sprit banging on about Tutuu is really just banging on to bang on. If Sloonei host posted right now "players are not allowed to vote Nutella, do something else" Sprit still wouldn't have a shot in heck of getting Tutuu chopped, and I think that's so obvious that he has to know it.

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:08 pm
dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:06 pm i do think nutella is being bussed if she flips wolf
by who?

I'm gonna guess by wolves with Hellbusser clauses in their roles, which is imo a serious concern.

dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:12 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:11 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:08 pm
dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:06 pm i do think nutella is being bussed if she flips wolf
by who?
I'm gonna guess by wolves with Hellbusser clauses in their roles, which is imo a serious concern.
Hellbusser clauses???

I've played two games here. In both cases there were wolf roles that unlocked additional powers by participating in killing a fellow wolf. Basically they incentivized an organized planned buss strat; willing wolf who plays to be bussed making connections with townies, wolves who know that they will lose that partner early so come out the gate distancing, the whole bussing trickbag.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:20 pm like the two games you reference were waaaayyyy more unconventional/bordering on bastard than most syndicate games, and sloonei's clause about that makes me think there's nothing that...extreme here

In the main I believe it would be out of character for Sloonei, yes,

Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:19 pm I thought about it for a bit and I sort of think if nutella is a wolf here her teammates are just going to do whatever the hell they want. Nobody's getting cred for bussing her because literally half the game is voting her (11/22 players), and nobody's really catching flak for being off the nutella wagon since they can always shrug and say "hey, nutella was obviously fated to die, I just wanted to push my pet scumread".

So nutella's teammates are probably just going to take the stance on nutella that's the most natural/logical progression for them to have given their "reads" so far and just go with the flow. I don't think they can do anything to change the outcome either since nutella didn't really defend herself and I suspect there's a massive weight of townies on the nutella wagon both from reads and from the sheer number of people piling onto her.

This is basically what I was saying earlier, and is the basic reality of a runaway wagon situation...whether Nutella is a wolf or not, really.

Poison Chan wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:31 pm Just gonna sleep actually I don't see any proper arguments are coming or a possible change of direction or new discovery or changes of minds.

Rest up Poison. Another day is coming here.

Hally wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:42 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:00 pm
Spoiler: show
tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:42 am my ideal wagons are spf vs nutella vs juliets but its fine if u guys dont wanna wagon spf d1 i dont wanna insist

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:46 am cant we like just vig JPIC or something (i still think he's town) instead of wasting a day of wagoning him idk

surely town has KP in a 22 player game so

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:57 am u guys should know that spf is amazing as wolf. she is amazing as town too as proven by her champs games but on em she has like a 54% winrate as mafia last time i checked (which at least imo is huge, i have like 25% winrate as mafia, its rly hard to wolf in those setups) and i remember skimming a few of her games once and like, her tone, her emotions, everything, its all there. like if she is a wolf she wouldnt just roll over and die, just saying!

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:04 am i think not wagoning JPC for 1 day to see if he gets vigged or poisoned or dayvigged has merits but dont wanna insist any more

at least nutella and spf and whoever else are gonna defend themselves and hvae reactions and talk and stuff

while JPIC wont talk, so using our yeet on him is like as if ... like u know ... waste opportuntity to make reads / day play, and ujst convert the yeet into a mechnical vig

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:11 am
Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:10 am
tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:08 am
Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:05 am People say I have done scummy stuff when this is literally what I do as town
can you do something more?

can u empathize with other ppl who find it frustrating how much effort they're putting, while u dont put as much effort and u expect for ppl to correctly townread u?
I am very empathetic to the town cause. I’ve just been trying to have fun
and you made me laugh a lot and i appreciate it

but like multiple ppl have expressed that its not fun anymore, its like u repeat a joke for the 100th time and its not as funny as when u said it on the first time u know?

can u please try making a few reads?

what do u think about nutella and spf?
tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:18 am
Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:16 am
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:15 am Your opener wasn't NAI by my standards. It felt performative.
I was going to make that post regardless of alignment
what are your reads on nutella and spf

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:25 am

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:33 am jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town jpic is town

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:33 am spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:45 am
Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:37 am
tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:33 am spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum spf is scum
I have seen nothing from SPF recently that leaves me concerned. Why are you reading SPF as scum?
if i had a dayvig and i shot jpic rn and he flipped town would u still not scumread spf

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:52 am well that was a while ago i decided to call u scum now cuz idk. i think jpic is town and u want my silly friend jpic dead and he town so maybe u mafia or somehging

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:30 am [VOTE: timsup2nothing] aubergine

like. we should have more than 1 wagon

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:38 am [VOTE: nutella] aubergine someone else push for a cw if u want

tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 2:03 pm Nut-chan can u leave a legacy readslist on all players no need for explanations just rank their nanes
So this whole interaction Tutuu has with JPIC, Nutella, and SPF really rubs me the wrong way.

Why is JPIC suddenly not mafia and suddenly town? He wasn't ever in trouble of getting lynched either as far as i can tell. then we have the transition of them trying to make Tim a counter wagon????
1. I dont think that wouldve ever happened.
2. Why suddenly do we need a counter wagon?

There has to be something alignment indicative within these posts. The way I see it is:

-JPIC is Town and trying to be pocketed by Tutuu for whatever reason
-SPF is Town or Mafia and just happens to be the target for that switch
-Nutella is Mafia with Tutuu and she does a halfhearted Counterwagon but doesnt want to try and get all of the people off of the huge wagon now formed. If it failed it would of course look bad. So she resign to "you should totally legacy read, sucks to be you"
-Nutella is Town and Tutuu is Mafia. Tutuu of course knows this and is trying to buy credit with the counter wagon attempt. "Aw man, I knew she was town" type of situation.

I dont think the last one is likely but I won't discount it.
really i cannot see scum casing tutuu rn and trying to find her teammates. like.... scum can read the room. tutuu is not getting eliminated this game

Conversely, why would town do it? I admit that there is a general sense that townies are more likely to just do pointless things, but there are wolves that know that. Generating content by a push that certainly won't be proven wrong has value from a wolf perspective.

Hally wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:40 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:49 pm Has anyone noticed that Tim's reads are garbage surface level nothingburger and he's done nothing to promote them?
yes

he is no longer a tr of mine

Bummer.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:48 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:50 pm
dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:47 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:42 pm sprityo do you genuinely believe you have the clout to convince people to exe tutuu despite half the game townshielding her or is this case entirely performative? Like you can see that there's 90 minutes to EoD and there's 10 votes on nutella right?
so is there any point to doing anything? i don't think anyone on her wagon is interested in moving
I guess my general point is that this entire push seems excessively performative and when you get down to it, it's just hiding on a vanity wagon tbh
I think his case on tutuu was towny. I like the idea of trying to get a second wagon going.

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:30 pm what is everyones favorite radiohead album?
The Bends

I've openly advocated for the idea of a counter-wagon. I think Sprit casing and pushing at an immovable object contributes to why we don't have one. "We need a counterwagon, case the most widely townread person and wonder why the towncore says no" isn't how to produce one.

Hally wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:51 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:48 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:40 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:49 pm Has anyone noticed that Tim's reads are garbage surface level nothingburger and he's done nothing to promote them?
yes

he is no longer a tr of mine
Bummer.
sorry. just keep doing your thing

No apology necessary...and seriously, don't I always? lol

Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:53 pm The conspiracy theory is that the tutuu counterwagon is a false flag to make counterwagon attempts look silly in general but I don't think I can get there on sprityo being that manipulative as scum lol

A thing I always try to keep in mind about wolves is that Sprit, if wolf, does not have to have come up with the idea by themselves. If there is a high end manipulator in the wolf chat it could be an assignment. In my first wolf game my active partner did all kinds of devious and manipulative things that he had never done before.

dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:57 pm it's interesting that very few people are willing to commit to a read on nanook

I am being dissed for my reads, but I did say what I meant and meant what I said about Nanook.

dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:04 pmremind me tim

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:00 pm Current opinion on Nanook. Summary: Day one light wolf, would chop

Spoiler: show
Nanook being usual happy self, which is pure NAI

The Nutella interactions over soup, with lingering vote is a bad look.

Not much to go on, as day one is just day one, but that does stand out. I mean we have a runaway wagon, and Nanook is content to ride it apparently on a disagreement over soup. It seems either opportunist or bussy depending how Nut flips, but not good in any event that he didn't really explore any further.

dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:11 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:10 pm
dyachei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:04 pmremind me tim

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:00 pm Current opinion on Nanook. Summary: Day one light wolf, would chop

Spoiler: show
Nanook being usual happy self, which is pure NAI

The Nutella interactions over soup, with lingering vote is a bad look.

Not much to go on, as day one is just day one, but that does stand out. I mean we have a runaway wagon, and Nanook is content to ride it apparently on a disagreement over soup. It seems either opportunist or bussy depending how Nut flips, but not good in any event that he didn't really explore any further.
nanook is voting hally

Yeah this is the runaway wagon problem. His read on Nutella didn't change for a long time (might have recently, dunno) and vote movements don't really have to correspond. My bad though on not checking current vote.

Might be interesting to ask [mention]NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME[/mention] what he thinks of Nutella long about now and why.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:13 pm Nutella's claim is effectively a doctor claim. It's also relatively proveable. It is not correct to yeet her after this claim.

Smart.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:14 pm [VOTE: tim] aubergine

Dumb.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:21 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:19 pm nutella's claim requires both the song + the role that people have for her ability to work correctly, and since this is a role madness setup, it means that the roles in this setup are so hyper-specific that i highly doubt her ability could ever work without having people outright claim

i just dont really buy it tbh
no just the song title, also i should have clarified but i have a full list of the song titles that are in the game so im not just shooting in the dark in the whole discog lmao

So by matching their song you get them in the boat, and then once they are in the boat you can choose one to protect, is that it?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:24 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:21 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:19 pm I don't think she's fake. It's too random. Boats? C'mon. Also she'd come up with a fake claim that'd be more believable if she was fake.
the boat part is probably real, but the part about her being a protective could easily be fake
Why would she keep the boat part of the fake claim when it's the stupidest sounding?

If her role is "you put people on your boat for bad reasons" why even mention the boat. You just fake claim a straight doctor or something.

You continue to make a good point, but you presented a really bad counterwagon. Try again.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:26 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:23 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:21 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:19 pm nutella's claim requires both the song + the role that people have for her ability to work correctly, and since this is a role madness setup, it means that the roles in this setup are so hyper-specific that i highly doubt her ability could ever work without having people outright claim

i just dont really buy it tbh
no just the song title, also i should have clarified but i have a full list of the song titles that are in the game so im not just shooting in the dark in the whole discog lmao
So by matching their song you get them in the boat, and then once they are in the boat you can choose one to protect, is that it?
i protect the whole boat

so it's actually p good if i get multiple people

Let Down

I'm in.

Hally wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:27 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:26 pm Let's just yeet one of Sprit or JPIC lol
i don’t really wanna kill sprit but maybe jpic. it feels very shrug though

I'd go Sprit, but only because I really think the Tutuu push was totally pointless theatrics for town and a possible play for town cred for a wolf. Before that I had him more as misguided town.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:30 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:28 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:26 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:23 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:21 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:19 pm nutella's claim requires both the song + the role that people have for her ability to work correctly, and since this is a role madness setup, it means that the roles in this setup are so hyper-specific that i highly doubt her ability could ever work without having people outright claim

i just dont really buy it tbh
no just the song title, also i should have clarified but i have a full list of the song titles that are in the game so im not just shooting in the dark in the whole discog lmao
So by matching their song you get them in the boat, and then once they are in the boat you can choose one to protect, is that it?
i protect the whole boat

so it's actually p good if i get multiple people
Let Down

I'm in.
This is actually a scum claim fmpov. Who would be unafraid to roleclaim if not someone aware of why it is not safe to do so?

Because I think I don't really care about the whole "but what about soup killers" paranoia that infests this site.

PS I didn't role claim. Near as I can make out the associated song title has little to nothing to do with the actual role.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:33 pm If someone already claimed then Nutella already has someone to protect. What if she puts scum on the boat?

Nutella wait. You are saying that if you get it right, they go on the boat and then you protect the whole boat every single night? That role is broken.

That role gets Nutella NKed bloody fast is what it does.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:34 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:32 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:30 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:28 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:26 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:23 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:21 pm

no just the song title, also i should have clarified but i have a full list of the song titles that are in the game so im not just shooting in the dark in the whole discog lmao
So by matching their song you get them in the boat, and then once they are in the boat you can choose one to protect, is that it?
i protect the whole boat

so it's actually p good if i get multiple people
Let Down

I'm in.
This is actually a scum claim fmpov. Who would be unafraid to roleclaim if not someone aware of why it is not safe to do so?
Because I think I don't really care about the whole "but what about soup killers" paranoia that infests this site.

PS I didn't role claim. Near as I can make out the associated song title has little to nothing to do with the actual role.
It's nothing to do with the paranoia. The host specifically said that claiming is dangerous.

I'm not currently finding that in the rules, tbh.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:45 pm Also note, Tim didn't self pres vote as his wagon was gaining momentum. TMI.

LOL...you overstate the momentum.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:46 pm
tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:45 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:45 pm Also note, Tim didn't self pres vote as his wagon was gaining momentum. TMI.
isnt that towny actually. not self pressing
Hell no. Town doesn't know what nutella is, knows what they are. You always vote the counterwagon as town. Especially if you're Tim.

Mafia Tim wouldn't do it if

a) Nutella is also mafia
b) He doesn't want to get his hands dirty

It's quite likely just mafia behaviour tbh.

Actually, this is just incorrect. I am probably among the LEAST likely to just self press as town, for one thing, and I am also among the coolest of EoD calculators. I was in no danger here and I knew it.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:15 pm I believe that it is absolutely blatantly obvious that Tim is mafia.

That counterwagon would have gone over if it was town.

LOL...I'm tempted to just let this ride and find out what you say when you find out you are wrong. I mean, knowing you are wrong makes it already hilarious, but seeing you when you find out would be priceless.

Meanwhile...I bought Nutella's claim just like a lot of people did. My role is good, but not as stupid good as she claimed, so no I wasn't gonna self press. I particularly wasn't gonna self press for no reason...and as shown by the final count there was no reason.

Now, let's play a different game...Mac shrugged of Nutella's claim, so why didn't he go back to Nutella with his vote? He was the one trying to lead the big swing to me. Away from Nutella. Nutella has flipped wolf. At the end of the day I will flip town. Think about what that means in regards to Mac long about day three.

Now, here's an interesting thing...it does seem like if there had been more wolves available to swing onto me I might have been in danger...so where were they? ALREADY ON ME. Tedxtr is a really good candidate.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:32 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:29 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:15 pm I believe that it is absolutely blatantly obvious that Tim is mafia.

That counterwagon would have gone over if it was town.
LOL...I'm tempted to just let this ride and find out what you say when you find out you are wrong. I mean, knowing you are wrong makes it already hilarious, but seeing you when you find out would be priceless.

Meanwhile...I bought Nutella's claim just like a lot of people did. My role is good, but not as stupid good as she claimed, so no I wasn't gonna self press. I particularly wasn't gonna self press for no reason...and as shown by the final count there was no reason.

Now, let's play a different game...Mac shrugged of Nutella's claim, so why didn't he go back to Nutella with his vote? He was the one trying to lead the big swing to me. Away from Nutella. Nutella has flipped wolf. At the end of the day I will flip town. Think about what that means in regards to Mac long about day three.

Now, here's an interesting thing...it does seem like if there had been more wolves available to swing onto me I might have been in danger...so where were they? ALREADY ON ME. Tedxtr is a really good candidate.
full list of townies in the entire world who would come out of day 1 with a mac suspicion:

[VOTE: tim] aubergine

Missed one. If you look at Mac from my townie point of view he will look quite different.

But for now I'm interested in how he has cleared Ted. Wanna help me make him spell that out, or just give him a pass?

Hally wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:36 pm mac is lock town and scum shouldn’t bother trying to discredit him. this is free advice from me to you

Actually you called that advice to scum. Since I am town it doesn't really apply.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:36 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:35 pm But for now I'm interested in how he has cleared Ted. Wanna help me make him spell that out, or just give him a pass?
I also cleared Ted off the nutella flip, so...

Cool, show me how.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:41 pm Like this was a terrible result for mafia. So many town coalesced onto Nutella and have cleared themselves off the way they did it. Wilgy is among them.

Man, Nutella was a runaway wagon...all of your lock clears are gonna look good, but are you REALLY thinking the whole wolf team failed to read the room and none of them established any distance? Seriously?

I get it man, you are gonna heroically drive me over the line and that's fine...but don't let this awesome wolf spike you think you are doing make you silly.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:42 pm
Spoiler: show
@tutuu here's my reads if you want to sheep
[Super Town]
Alison
Oddmerta
MacDougall
Master Radishes
tutuu
Poison Chan
Hally
juliets
Samusamu
Dizzy
SPF
dyachei
tedxtr

[I think belongs in supertown but am suspending judgement because I trust my towncore's reads]
Herm

TSP/Colin

[Town]
Wilgy
sprityo

[Upper POE]
Long Con
nanook

[Lower POE]
JPIC

[Dayvig this man immediately]
Timsup2nothin

If that's what it takes to get our leadership to reassess, please do.

So one reason I bought into Nutella's claim was "it's complicated." Mine is too. In fact I had to wait for Sloonei to tell me what my night action was because it is dependent on the percentage of players that are civilians. Based on the night action I was given 70-79.9% of current players are civilians.

My role is apparently intended as a snowball stopper against the wolves, because the closer to parity they get the more powerful my night actions get.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:56 pm like you're never getting nightkilled unless you reveal as innocent child so why be cagey

We all gotta do what we gotta do. I had a bad EoD and the town core is tunneled. So my role really doesn't matter because it is nowhere near as good as Nutella's fake claim was and that didn't make anyone but Mac and me reassess. So trying to lay out all the different ranges and all the different powers is just busy work.

What all do is watch how various people push me and look for the wolves among them.

Mac's a big boy and I get where he's coming from. It's wrong, probably in a town way, but he's putting entirely too much confidence into his Nutella spew reads. When I flip green he'll remember I said that.

Unlike Mac, you were already a pretty hard town read. You're seeing the same obvious things as Mac, and I'm confident that you too will reassess when you find out that you are wrong.

I am really interested more in the peripherals that weren't necessarily town yesterday and are now getting lock cleared by the town core off Nutella spew, because that's an error.

tutuu wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:57 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:54 pm So one reason I bought into Nutella's claim was "it's complicated." Mine is too. In fact I had to wait for Sloonei to tell me what my night action was because it is dependent on the percentage of players that are civilians. Based on the night action I was given 70-79.9% of current players are civilians.

My role is apparently intended as a snowball stopper against the wolves, because the closer to parity they get the more powerful my night actions get.
thats 14.7 and 16.8

so 15 or 16 or 17 civs, out of 21, the rest non-civs

It's not 17. The ranges are very specific so don't round.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:06 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:04 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:56 pm like you're never getting nightkilled unless you reveal as innocent child so why be cagey
We all gotta do what we gotta do. I had a bad EoD and the town core is tunneled. So my role really doesn't matter because it is nowhere near as good as Nutella's fake claim was and that didn't make anyone but Mac and me reassess. So trying to lay out all the different ranges and all the different powers is just busy work.

What all do is watch how various people push me and look for the wolves among them.

Mac's a big boy and I get where he's coming from. It's wrong, probably in a town way, but he's putting entirely too much confidence into his Nutella spew reads. When I flip green he'll remember I said that.

Unlike Mac, you were already a pretty hard town read. You're seeing the same obvious things as Mac, and I'm confident that you too will reassess when you find out that you are wrong.

I am really interested more in the peripherals that weren't necessarily town yesterday and are now getting lock cleared by the town core off Nutella spew, because that's an error.
if you are town and the town core is tunnelled on you, then the most obvious thing for scum to do is sit back and eat pretzels while they watch you die. why did you open the day blasting mac instead of trying to see who doesn't want to put their hands on the tim wagon?

Why not? The town core is tunneled on me...fact. The wolves can sit back and eat pretzels if that continues...fact. Blasting at Mac to wake him up is my best bet.

Poison Chan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:59 pm Tim, why did you say your song name to nutella? How could you trust someone who is a top wagon and tell your role name?

Somebody had to. The only way to test her claim was for someone to get in the boat. I was lock POE, so a good candidate for the experiment. Better than someone who is lock town.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:12 pm @Timsup2nothin That didn't sound like a "wake up and reassess me" slap to the face. That sounded like you were trying to get heat off you from the audacity of trying to attack Mac coming into D2. It's what I'd do if I had to wolf in this situation. Do something wild and audacious, get some people to say "...would they really be playing this way as scum", and stay just above the bottom POE, and hold that position day after day until I'm in the endgame. To some extent, that's how I played Space Invaders, which had a really similar start (D1 and D2 mafia kills), so I'm on the lookout for your attack on Mac being an attempt to pull something like that. And you immediately turned around and claimed you were just trying to get us to reasses right after you saw that the response to that play was negative, and I'm not buying it.

Yeah, don't care.

"That's too audacious, he'd never do that as a wolf" is a defense that's not available to me.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:13 pm Hey Tim.

Let's consider you're town.

Realise, that I am very obviously town.

Realise that I am probably one of two people who could have caught a save, so I might even be a confirm to someone.

I am also reading the game well. I nailed Nutella to the wall and only backed off cuz she fake claimed.

I have given you a seven player POE.

You're apparently a town in that POE. So you actually have info I don't have.

Rather than get butthurt that I am townreading you lamist style why not use the information you have to the town's benefit.

Go forth and find the mafia. I've narrowed the game down to an immense degree for you friend.

LOL...I'm not butthurt, I just honestly DGAF that you are reading me wrong. If you are town reading me wrong, great, reassess when I'm dead. Win for me. If you aren't, deal with having me call you out a little bit and get on about your business. I'm not going to "win you over" and at this point I'm pretty sure I could deliver a wolfhead on a spike and you'd conf bias it away, so here we are.

I'll give a legacy before you kill me, and hopefully it will be useful. That's all I can promise.

Poison Chan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:15 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:12 pm
Poison Chan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:59 pm Tim, why did you say your song name to nutella? How could you trust someone who is a top wagon and tell your role name?
Somebody had to. The only way to test her claim was for someone to get in the boat. I was lock POE, so a good candidate for the experiment. Better than someone who is lock town.
What are the chances that you are the scum and baited town to follow you and use their roles?

Well, from here that would be zero. From where you are that is a reasonable concern.

Question though...would you describe the post where I revealed my song title as low key, or as containing a "c'mon guys let's gooooooo!" sort of vibe?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:22 pm Noting that Nutella also claimed her song, then it was actually not her real song. So even she was afraid of claiming her real songname.

Considering that her real song was A Wolf At The Door I think there's pretty obvious reasons she didn't claim it besides fear of a soup killer.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:29 pm Yeah I'm done with the mechanics stuff for now, I'm not losing another game to bad mech clears. We murdered scum D1 by regular scumhunting and that's what I intend to be focusing on for now.

@Timsup2nothin Entertain a thought experiment. Suppose ted and oddmerta both are confirmed town by the host or a flip or something. Who's your next scum suspect?

As of yesterday that was Nanook.

I do have a couple more observation on mechanics...

All the people afraid that giving up a song title will get them killed by a third party soup killer...aren't the kinda wasting a chop if they insist on chopping me?

[mention]Hally[/mention] seems to have claimed some sort of song title dependent power. So has Mac. Is there some reason I am so lock wolf that I need to be chopped today rather than checked tonight? Does that make sense? Come to that, I had my song title outed yesterday. Seems like anyone with a song title dependent ability would have, by default, checked me last night. Why didn't they?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:41 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:39 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:29 pm Yeah I'm done with the mechanics stuff for now, I'm not losing another game to bad mech clears. We murdered scum D1 by regular scumhunting and that's what I intend to be focusing on for now.

@Timsup2nothin Entertain a thought experiment. Suppose ted and oddmerta both are confirmed town by the host or a flip or something. Who's your next scum suspect?
As of yesterday that was Nanook.

I do have a couple more observation on mechanics...

All the people afraid that giving up a song title will get them killed by a third party soup killer...aren't the kinda wasting a chop if they insist on chopping me?

@Hally seems to have claimed some sort of song title dependent power. So has Mac. Is there some reason I am so lock wolf that I need to be chopped today rather than checked tonight? Does that make sense? Come to that, I had my song title outed yesterday. Seems like anyone with a song title dependent ability would have, by default, checked me last night. Why didn't they?
I can't trust that the song title you gave was legitimate. nutella lied about hers, after all.

Why is nook the scummiest in the [JPIC/sprit/nanook] trio?

Well, truth is that I was using your list as a guide for the order I was doing ISOs in and I never got to JPIC or Sprit so Nanook is what I've got. Sprit I have a sense as being wolfy with his wildly pointless pushes near EoD. JPIC I think is wolfy in the way he is always wolfy and could just as easily be town.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:41 pm
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:39 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:29 pm Yeah I'm done with the mechanics stuff for now, I'm not losing another game to bad mech clears. We murdered scum D1 by regular scumhunting and that's what I intend to be focusing on for now.

@Timsup2nothin Entertain a thought experiment. Suppose ted and oddmerta both are confirmed town by the host or a flip or something. Who's your next scum suspect?
As of yesterday that was Nanook.

I do have a couple more observation on mechanics...

All the people afraid that giving up a song title will get them killed by a third party soup killer...aren't the kinda wasting a chop if they insist on chopping me?

@Hally seems to have claimed some sort of song title dependent power. So has Mac. Is there some reason I am so lock wolf that I need to be chopped today rather than checked tonight? Does that make sense? Come to that, I had my song title outed yesterday. Seems like anyone with a song title dependent ability would have, by default, checked me last night. Why didn't they?
I can't trust that the song title you gave was legitimate. nutella lied about hers, after all.

Why is nook the scummiest in the [JPIC/sprit/nanook] trio?

It's still the only available song title. If I lied what are you thinking...that it will trigger false reads? That makes a kind of sense, but Hally doesn't seem concerned about the people she is demanding claims from being able to lie. I really am curious as to why I had the only outed song title and seemingly nothing came of it. Though maybe as more people check in we will find someone that at least thought to experiment with their powers.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:57 pm
Herm wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:53 pm MacDougall was my biggest town read from Day 1, and he set things in motion on Nutella. So I believe him to be town.

I think Nanook was also on Nutella at one point and switched, but if he was, it got lost in the shuffle lol.
Nook voted her because she liked French Onion soup. Then held the meme vote for ages. Then ended up voting on her counterwagon.

I'd execute him today if he didn't also just play a game where he is essentially exactly the same here and was town.

But I will say that the whole French Onion soup dialogue felt like wolves talking in the thread. That is to say that specifically it felt like Nook and Nut were wolfy and SPF was town.

I know I'm just an obvious wolf, but I felt the same way about the soup business at the time.

However, it could be that Nutella kept that conversation going singlehandedly to throw shade on as many townies as possible in the event of her death.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:00 am I especially want people who aren't the town core that have clearly shared their reads to do this exercise too lol

If you wanted me to participate you made the wrong first group.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:04 am
Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:03 am
MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:00 am I especially want people who aren't the town core that have clearly shared their reads to do this exercise too lol
If you wanted me to participate you made the wrong first group.
I just want your towniest and scummiest from each group. It really shouldn't be an issue.

The only scummy one in the first group, IMO, is me and I know that's just circumstances. At a stretch if I ignore some stuff and look at the not moving vote then I suppose Juliets. Alison obviously towniest.

Second group is full of wolves. I'd kill Sprit, Odd, or Herm out of hand. I guess Odd first. Town there I like Samu.

Third group despite it all I'm gonna stick with Tutuu as town, and since I'm not buying the "let's clear half a dozen people off Nutella spew wholesale" yet I'll stay with Ted as my favorite chop there.

If anything changes I'll let you know.

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