The Syndicate

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 11:12 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:51 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:37 pm Ok, I don’t think Seanzie is bad.

Key thoughts:

Lucy towncleared dennis before she went out. I tend to lean wifom on that post, Dennis is town and Lucy wanted us to tinfoil him on the other side.

Rondo has consistently said neon is in wolfrange and that’s probably my starting point for another look today.
I thought Lucy was bad early, I *knew* she was bad when she got pissy that Kate was dead posting. It was almost like, “Shut up, you, I killed you!”. I think she was telling the truth that she was trying to wedge Kate/Dennis. That’s a big chunk of why I suspected her before I backed off.

I think Neon is town. No baddie would have gone that balls to the walls to protect a teamie, imo. But she made it sound like aggro defense is more the norm now, so outside of my experience.
I have consistently thought neon was town, that’s my gut read. I’m just wondering if someone like rondo has a better read.

Where are you at on Roxy and Rondo? (I’m thinking here of rondo as bea and reevaluating reads on friends.)

I’m going to reread them tomorrow as well as splints and you. Obvs with the role claim my town read on you stands, but I want to see interactions too, so I’ll pull in Mata too.

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:44 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:41 pm I’m really sorry to see Scotty go. He was a good doc, he saved some people I think.

As I said, after lecturing during the last day about friendship blinders, I’m going to doublecheck mine. The last EOD was weird.
I am sorry for briefly upsetting you. My goal with the Falcon vote was to see what it shook out. I think/hope it might be helpful, that was the goal. I only did it once I felt confident the Lucy outcome wasn’t in doubt (especially because I always intended to go back there).

No worries, lol. I got back home and saw you moved your vote and I’m literally yelling at my computer, “WTF Golden!?!” So I basically transcribed what I was actually saying ha ha

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:37 pm Ok, I don’t think Seanzie is bad.

Key thoughts:

Lucy towncleared dennis before she went out. I tend to lean wifom on that post, Dennis is town and Lucy wanted us to tinfoil him on the other side.

Rondo has consistently said neon is in wolfrange and that’s probably my starting point for another look today.

I thought Lucy was bad early, I *knew* she was bad when she got pissy that Kate was dead posting. It was almost like, “Shut up, you, I killed you!”. I think she was telling the truth that she was trying to wedge Kate/Dennis. That’s a big chunk of why I suspected her before I backed off.

I think Neon is town. No baddie would have gone that balls to the walls to protect a teamie, imo. But she made it sound like aggro defense is more the norm now, so outside of my experience.

I’m really sorry to see Scotty go. He was a good doc, he saved some people I think.

As I said, after lecturing during the last day about friendship blinders, I’m going to doublecheck mine. The last EOD was weird.

Golden wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 2:58 pm Chances of a Sean wolf going ‘you know what, i can use this as an opportunity to pocket golden’ and putting down doctor threads for me to see are astronomical. It’s far too risky.

The doctor dying would refute it.

It’s a million percent more likely that Sean just happened to sharply change his read and I misjudged why than that he’s deliberately wolf-pocketing me.

Also this. I’m otherwise staying out of this other than so say that on my current rainbow Sean is near the top.

Imma go read now.

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:18 pm
Kate wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:17 pm
Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:17 pm
Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:15 pm I'd elim Golden here.
Well.

That’s a departure from Golden’s theory
For real?
Why would Seanzie, the doctor that supposedly saved Golden on N2, ever be voting Golden here

Good point.

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:17 pm
Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 1:15 pm I'd elim Golden here.
Well.

That’s a departure from Golden’s theory

First one I’ve found.

Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:21 pm Uhhh, so Golden, about your whole 'Seanzie is doc' thing...

Well Scotty was the only one to push back even minimally.

That said, I personally think Sean was town, but I think we all need to reevaluate our reads.

I’m gonna go back and read, because after Lucy’s elim, I’m not sure who I think The third could be.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:58 pm what’s going on

Lucy outed herself

Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:47 pm
falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:44 pm
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:42 pm I disagree, I am making sure Lucy goes over today and I am not voting her
But you're not the one saying you are committed to doing what SVS wants, which again is super fuckin weird to say.
No, it’s not. Rondo had it exactly right.

I should be allowed to vote my own gut when the result is in no doubt.

Of course you're allowed. I was just disappoint

and surprised to see that you did so and it made the vote 3-6. With one vote cancellation and two people left to vote.

I feel better that it is now 3-6, but two people still have not voted, and one of them is Lucy who isn't going to self vote. My parents are still at the restaurant, lol, I left early to be here in case Lucy showed up, I have like three windows with various ISOs in them ready to refute points.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:26 pm
Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:25 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:22 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:17 pm [VOTE: falcon] aubergine

The result isn’t in doubt and I’d rather be here.
What does this even mean?

I am not sure why you are so resistant to a Lucy vote.

How likely is Golden to be bad in a world where falcon is civ and Lucy is bad?

Jesus. I worked my butt off for this elimination for two days for this? I give the fuck up.
Sus.
Like i really really REALLY hate this level of sus

Let's talk about it again after the lynch ends.

Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:27 pm
Scotty wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:27 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:25 pm I just want my vote to be on my highest suspect. That’s it.
I mean…you’ve been pretty vocal all day that you suspect falcon. This is all so very odd
Yes I have, 100% so SVS should not be upset at me for voting that way.

Two people haven't voted yet, and there is a three vote difference. So anything could happen. This elimination will give us the info to find the third, I kinda think it already has. I think someone already pointed it out.

I felt like we were acting as a town, except for someone who thinks it's the wrong move. You do you, as you always should, but this just surprises me, I thought you saw what I was saying.

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:28 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:28 pm
Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:25 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:22 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:17 pm [VOTE: falcon] aubergine

The result isn’t in doubt and I’d rather be here.
What does this even mean?

I am not sure why you are so resistant to a Lucy vote.

How likely is Golden to be bad in a world where falcon is civ and Lucy is bad?

Jesus. I worked my butt off for this elimination for two days for this? I give the fuck up.
Sus.
Yeah OK. I think you're town, but I also think you're blinkering yourself with confirmation bias.
but not me?

I have not much thought of you, tbh, in this context. On short acquaintance, you are not a person I would expect to get confirmation bias. You seem to be thinking out of the box to the point that the confirmation bias is 3-4 boxes behind you. Neon is aggressively in giant font defending Lucy, you are promoting open thought and chaos. Not the same thing, even if your vote landed the same way.

I think you don't have as firm of an opinion as she does, and your opinion is more flexible.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:25 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:22 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:17 pm [VOTE: falcon] aubergine

The result isn’t in doubt and I’d rather be here.
What does this even mean?

I am not sure why you are so resistant to a Lucy vote.

How likely is Golden to be bad in a world where falcon is civ and Lucy is bad?

Jesus. I worked my butt off for this elimination for two days for this? I give the fuck up.
Sus.

Yeah OK. I think you're town, but I also think you're blinkering yourself with confirmation bias.

Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:17 pm [VOTE: falcon] aubergine

The result isn’t in doubt and I’d rather be here.

What does this even mean?

I am not sure why you are so resistant to a Lucy vote.

How likely is Golden to be bad in a world where falcon is civ and Lucy is bad?

Jesus. I worked my butt off for this elimination for two days for this? I give the fuck up.

Ebwop because that means they let two people go relatively easily.

Assuming Lucy flips bad we all have to reevaluate our reads and why we’re townreading the people we are.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 4:17 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 4:12 pm
Scotty wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 4:07 pm Back on topic:

Lucy is in finals week right now, which explains her absence, but has had enough wherewithal to post a few snarky one-liners today like:
‘You’re not allowed to post when dead’
‘I can’t read’
‘Neon is scum’

What can I do with that?

I think Lucy is bad and her partner is probably already voting her.

With bad lucy, I’d be willing to write off Neon, Rondo and falcon.
If Lucy a bad her partner is Falcon honestly I don’t know what is with everyone wanting to clear Falcon for terrible reasons.
I just don’t see falcon’s play with Vivax and Lucy as partners as compatible as I can see someone trying to deepwolf. I know it looks obvious but like…I feel like falcon would have played harder or something if we already suspected his 2 potential partners in Vivax/lucy yesterday.

I am not clearing him, I just find it more likely from an optimal winning mafia strategy for there to be a deepwolf

I’ve reread falcon over and over and I kinda agree. I think it’s prolly someone everyone is townreading on tone or whatever tbh, especially if Lucy flips bad.

@Golden its like “one” , one would think.

Roxy wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:58 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:54 pm And goddamn it THERE ARE FOUR LIGHTS!!!!!
my favorite post in this game, may be a new signature <3[

If it's ok S~V~S?
Reading..... going to miss Kate/ Batman this game. I have so few in my trust circle.

I didn't know if anyone would even get that, being in the thread at the same time as Rondo can feel like an interrogation for sure! Feel free

My plans got pushed back a bit, and moved closer to home, so no Long Island Expressway 2 weeks before Christmas

but I still have to head out in a bit. Looking forward to reading your catch up later.

Golden wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:42 pm
Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:35 pm I say we flashwagon Dennis.
Flashwagons in a world with two living cops who could have up to four different green peeks between them isn’t great.

There’s a reason I keep pushing consensus this game… we should be able to weed out those who have been peeked and avoid elimming them by taking into account a broad range of perspectives.

You would think so, wouldn't you?

What does "turboed" mean?

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 11:12 am There is zero worlds where scum wins if one of them dies today.

In Game 1, Golden deepwolfed all by himself for several days before lylo, and went on to win it. If someone is deepwolfing (and someone must be since for the most part the thread is active since the inactives have been replaced), they're pretty good at it.

So there is a world where this can happen. It's a small world and it's pretty far away from here, lol, but it exists.

Question, real one, no snark; is bussing people still the norm? Because, for instance, in one game years ago, Tangrowth bussed me from literally their first post. We used to be some aggressive bussers.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 10:47 am
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 10:20 am
Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:42 am Alternatively.

But here's the thing which feels more likely? Because to me if I'm wolf I don't risk alienating the loudest voice in the room defending me in this situation. However if I'm town I might note that I think it looks sus. And to me personally I see that reality to be the higher likelihood.
Is this a norm now? Thinking that town can't legit defend town? That defending someone is automatically wolfy? Becasue last time she posted a read on you:

lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 4:35 pm i've iso'ed neon from another game just to make sure and she's very different here, i'm confident in calling her town here
And has posted nothing since to make me think her read on you has changed. So why would she think someone she thought was town defending her maskes them look bad?

I guess the game has changed alot in the last few years
See here's the disingenuous twisting of words again lol

I'm sorry if I'm coming across that way, it isn't my intention. I don't see how I twisted anything at all. She town read you, you said

She thinks I'm being scummy and that after she dies and flips town I should be looked at

.

And I don't understand why she would think that if she thinks you're town. Unless she no longer thinks that, but there is no reason to deduce that from her posts.

It could be a culture thing, and if it is and I am misreading it, I would like to know.

So not sure how I'm twisting words.

I am not trying to argue with you, and I certainly am not trying to twist your words. I can have problems with "subtle"; it's why I I have such long posts alot of the time. I edit and rewrite and rewrite to soften it. You should see me irl where I can't edit and proofread. Not great a lot of the time.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 10:50 am
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 10:07 am
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:45 am 11 people, majority at 4, 2 deaths today assuming doc fails is 9 minus 2 votes is 7 so we have 1 misyeet after today 2 total before we are in faux lylo if we don't hit vote deleter. So we gotta make these count or doc has to carry us even further on their back
Even with one vote deleted, this is what I have been saying. It's why I am trying so hard here to get people on the Lucy wagon. We can't afford miselims anymore as long as that exists in the game. And she is the only person the majority of us are not civ reading.

If she's not bad, you guys eliminate me next.

Also, I have limited time today, and I want to spend it in my very singleminded way lol. Your "what if" exercises looked interesting but I'd probably have to read up more than I have time for today, I'll hit them up tomorrow (although if Lucy IS bad, and IS lynched, I don't expect to see tomorrow ha ha).
Have you thought why I'm the only one defending lily in a game where there's 2 woofs left?

If lily is woof there should be more thread resistance. There has not been a single period of time where another wagon had more than 3 votes and that wagon was me Golden and Dennis.

That's 3 pretty universally town cored players. There's no resistance from lily there's no resistance from anyone but me. Why? Especially in this thread state.

There's 2 options. Last wolf is deep as fuck or lily is town.

Alternatively the woofs gave up.

I also think it is possible there is no thread resistance because no one in the town thinks she is town. The only person not to have posted to day is Roxy, I think. And I guarantee you that if she was the deep wolf, she would be in here calling for Lucys head, too, if Lucy was bad and taking this much suspish.

No baddie would be doing what you are, though, so I think this townlocks you for me, even if i toitally disagree with your conclusions.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:42 am Alternatively. She thinks I'm being scummy and that after she dies and flips town I should be looked at.

But here's the thing which feels more likely? Because to me if I'm wolf I don't risk alienating the loudest voice in the room defending me in this situation. However if I'm town I might note that I think it looks sus. And to me personally I see that reality to be the higher likelihood.

Is this a norm now? Thinking that town can't legit defend town? That defending someone is automatically wolfy? Becasue last time she posted a read on you:

lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 4:35 pm i've iso'ed neon from another game just to make sure and she's very different here, i'm confident in calling her town here

And has posted nothing since to make me think her read on you has changed. So why would she think someone she thought was town defending her maskes them look bad?

I guess the game has changed alot in the last few years

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 9:45 am 11 people, majority at 4, 2 deaths today assuming doc fails is 9 minus 2 votes is 7 so we have 1 misyeet after today 2 total before we are in faux lylo if we don't hit vote deleter. So we gotta make these count or doc has to carry us even further on their back

Even with one vote deleted, this is what I have been saying. It's why I am trying so hard here to get people on the Lucy wagon. We can't afford miselims anymore as long as that exists in the game. And she is the only person the majority of us are not civ reading.

If she's not bad, you guys eliminate me next.

Also, I have limited time today, and I want to spend it in my very singleminded way lol. Your "what if" exercises looked interesting but I'd probably have to read up more than I have time for today, I'll hit them up tomorrow (although if Lucy IS bad, and IS lynched, I don't expect to see tomorrow ha ha).

Spoiler: show

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 8:28 am I'm becoming increasingly less confident in my Lucy town read and my SVS town read stimulants as I analyze more... so that's fun.

Okay I'm gonna try to word this again. And talk my way through it for myself to.

First point of conflict SVS v Lucy over the FamilyTM. Lucy pushes the FamilyTM for info that largely seems unrelated to the game. SVS finds this opportunistic. During ensuing discussion SVS thinks Lucy is being dismissive but I believe there's just a general misunderstanding based on new v old school play styles.

Townie motivation for Lucy when it comes to the push on the FamilyTM feels like a general attempt to go get information on how three FamilyTM interact with each other, their self meta on how they'd interact with each other in wolf v town worlds. Gaining understanding into personalities can help better sort and understand play. I do think different personalities play mafia differently and this insight has helped me understand things better. I also believe that at face value Lucy saying she feels she can catch a wolf or get 3 TRs from this is true and that she is correct in saying the Family better understands each other so their reads on one another are extremely valuable.

Wolfy motivation for Lucy during this could feel like an attempt to create dissent in the FamilyTM and to set up for potential pushes into the 3 later on using that however as I recall that never really happens and as a wolf this feels like a most dangerous game depending on the FamilyTM's alignments because in a world where all 3 are town and Jack doesn't sub out this could immediately back fire if they don't take the bait and turn into a cohesive town bloc and push back against the attempt to pull apart the family dynamics especially considering how defensive they've been about each other and how I know for fact that at least Jack and Kate rolled town

Lucy v the FamilyTM feels weird at a base level but overall I think I understand the idea behind it and in my analysis I feel that town motivation here feels substantially more likely than scum motivation.

Lucy v SVS generally feels to me like Lucy is trying to help SVS understand her perspective and what she's attempting to accomplish.

However SVS could be right and Lucy could be trying to discredit the narrative. But when I look at Lucy's responses it feels genuine it feels like Lucy is saying "yes you are correct I do not appear towny and solvy now but I will prove to you that you are wrong about me."

SVS here could be deliberately misrepresenting Lucy for a push setting an opportunity to move in on someone doing something that appears wolfy at a base level which is a common reason to push into town as wolf and kill them

However i think it's more likely that SVS just thinks it's wolfy and misunderstood what Lucy was saying.

There's also a post early on from Lucy where she's trying to set up a counter wagon and I believe she lists 3 names (rule of 3 lameow). Golden interject to say Bea should be taken out Benshina the first post they made was townie and Lucy immediately says that she wolf read that post. I don't think a wolf bothers creating conflict here over a non existent wagon that isn't currently being created.

With that said I personally do think it's more beneficial to scum than it is to town to push slankers and low posters early on. But this could be a simple difference in style.

I actually think Lucy's post #814 is blatantly town reading back. She is trying to get SVS to understand her mind and see her perspective and motivation while SVS keeps changing the meaning of her posts (at least in Lucy's mind but considering my recent interactions with SVS I've gotten similar feelings.) The frustration in this post reads blatantly town to me. Further this entire conversation it doesn't feel like Lucy is disregarding SVS' fears but rather trying to build a relationship so they can find each other despite a difference in understanding and perspectives. Okay this is Hella good vibes. Remembering why I had the early TR on Lucy.

Following this there's an exchange with Golden about Bea again Golden says the Bea post isn't AI and Lucy drops that push pretty quickly.

Lucy votes Wilgy says Sean is in town meta. This doesn't feel TMI because I do believe their was some doubt on Sean early by Lucy especially regarding Sean's approach to Sabi but the doubt wasn't a straight wolf or town read.

There's a good bit of solving in regards to Dennis' EoD1 that feels townie and feels like it lacks TMI.

"one thing I do have issue with is the fact all the votes are being placed on active players, while I believe that there are active mafia players, I don't believe it's any greater than one or two"

Considering the only flipped mafia was highly inactive this is... Intresting but also townie I think because this brings an unnecessary level of sus into at least part of her team unless she's trying to set up a bus. But she consistently votes Bea so ???

So early on Lucy had a light town read on Sabi based on Sean but Lucy voted Sabi in red back this vote was a self pres vote. This vote was one that bothered me since I thought Sabi was blatantly town so this feels better to me now.

"with scotty i get bad vibes from his treatment of me and i believe he’s powerwolfing, kate is just gut" as someone who's been on and off but mostly on Sus of Scotty I like this thought lol.

Lucy self vote could go either way but frankly I think it's town because Lucy has been feeling bad about their play in mafia and Akarui feeling burn out as they've said in this thread and I understand the frustration. However this could be AtE though I do not know what the VC looked like at this point.

Lucy's Falcon read mimics mine... good vibes lol

Lucy does repeatedly defend Mata despite wanting to exe low posters... that feels really bad...sigh.

My phone is dying fuck

Okay Lucy reads that I remember have been

Sabi town
Scotty wolf
Sean town
Neon town
Dennis town
Kate wolf
Kill inactives but defended Mata

So like...meh. She's been right a lot but she's been wrong a lot but the things she's been wrong on look bad in a vacuum. Vote History mostly looks bad but on read back it honestly looks less bad frankly.

Sabi vote was self pres
Soneji vote was a lower presence which she's wanted all game
Wilgy vote was wagonomics

Didn't vote yesterday when Mata went over frankly I think wolf Lucy busses that.

Another thing is me and Lucy were talking after the Sabi invitational and Lucy said that she wants to rand wolf again she hasn't in a long time and she's a good wolf and I truly believe all of that. Lucy is a strong player. I don't think she disappears like this as wolf... much the same as how I felt about Sabi.

The opening of this game is the activity I'd expect from Lucy wolf honestly like D1. I don't think Lucy wolf falls off a cliff though irl is often unexpected. And this read comes with a caveat to... if Lucy's team is inactive outside her like Mata was I could see frustration that her first Wolf rand in a while is with an inactive team.

But overall...I still think Lucy is town and SVS is town but both reads have gotten weaker.

OK.

When I read this post, I was like "She sees it!", with the one section excepted (addressed below). This whole post is about how wolfy Lucy actually is.

Then non thread reasons come in. And you completely forget all the stuff you said above it. Your *pros* are much stronger than your *cons* (much of it WIFOM, tbh). You say she's busy, but you also say she would not fall off if she were a wolf.

Also, re this section,

I actually think Lucy's post #814 is blatantly town reading back. She is trying to get SVS to understand her mind and see her perspective and motivation while SVS keeps changing the meaning of her posts (at least in Lucy's mind but considering my recent interactions with SVS I've gotten similar feelings.) The frustration in this post reads blatantly town to me. Further this entire conversation it doesn't feel like Lucy is disregarding SVS' fears but rather trying to build a relationship so they can find each other despite a difference in understanding and perspectives. Okay this is Hella good vibes. Remembering why I had the early TR on Lucy.

You think I'm twisting the meaning of your posts? Which ones, I'd be happy to explain. I read things differently than many, my brain is kind of a mental varnish remover, it's one on *MY* ND superpowers (It's SO against the grain for me to discuss this, but it seems to be what people do now, so meh). I was not twisting anything. That was how I read it. I took her reaction to it to being caught out, that she automatically dismissed it as "twisting". That was not how I saw it, and it still is not how I see it. I 100% stand by what I thought she was doing.

But like I said in the last post, you do you.

Linki @ Neon. Perhaps, but I think maybe you are wearing the same friendship blinders I was wearing until Vivax replaced Mata.

Linki @ Rondo, there is only 1 elim vote now.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 1:19 am
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 12:17 am So Lucy showed up, threw some shade at the one person defending her and left.

Cool.

Good Night, thread!
And this is indicative of what world?

Because I've run it through 9 million realities. I'm doctor strange now.

This world?

You even quoted it:

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 11, 2022 1:13 am
lucy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 8:27 pm feels like neon is TMI'ing me town
That would require me to have TMI which I do not have because I'm as vanilla as ice cream and decidedly very town

How is shading the only person defending her town? I am new to some of the jargon, but isn't saying someone is TMIing you negative?

She literally came in here, made one post, about you and TMI and left. And it wasn't even TMI, you said you really believed it, not that you *knew* it. In a world of total honesty, it looked like she was trying to faux distance and set YOU up for the next elimination if she flips bad. I personally think you are civ and would argue against eliminating you in that scenario. Not unlike what you are doing here. But I hope you will look at facts, not just irl circumstances. It's the mistake I made much of this game, letting feeling bad for people irl cloud my judgment.

I know you don't want a consensus, and you be you. I just really want to take this game back.

So Lucy showed up, threw some shade at the one person defending her and left.

Cool.

Good Night, thread!

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:48 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:36 pm
Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:33 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:29 pm
Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:21 pm I still think Lucy is a bad elim.
Why? Do you think she is town?

Her only real suspicions have been Sean, low posters and waffles.

I am not seeing anything town and very much that is the opposite of town.

Show me what I’m missing. Because I am 100% missing the town part of her iso.
My vibe read says town. She's busy and I don't see wolfy motivation when I run town and scum scenarios.
So this is gut, not based on what she’s posted or or voted or anything like that?

I respect that. Follow your own gut, not someone else’s.
Not entirely it's vibes but also I just don't see wolfy play.

I see a busy player who's admitted to being busy who's clearly been playing follower not leader and it feels like a townie who's been following the consensus because she can't keep up.

Like she was a strong voice before she got busy and has fallen off a cliff and it all feels town.

No, looking at it, it kinda is the whole argument. And that’s ok,
You play your game your way. If we all played the same it would be mega boring.

I don’t think this conversation is getting us anywhere, so we can agree to disagree.

Tell you what, if I’m wrong, I’ll change my profile pic to a jackass.

And if you knew me you’d know how much I love my profile pic. I feel that strongly confident based on her posts and iso.

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 7:30 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:17 pm
Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:11 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:54 pm But she’s the fifth highest poster

And I tend to view a high poster falling off the earth to be suspicious. But I am less familiar with the current meta, so I could be misinterpreting.
And 90% of that was when?
Busy people can be bad, too

That’s why i try to base suspicions on what people have done and said rather than what they haven’t.

Nothing in her iso is town, imo, neither before nor after she fell off.
I believe this is extremely disingenuous to what I'm arguing here

No, I know what you’re arguing. I don’t think being busy now negates the entirety of her activity.

I don’t think she has done anything even remotely townie the entire game.

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:11 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:54 pm But she’s the fifth highest poster

And I tend to view a high poster falling off the earth to be suspicious. But I am less familiar with the current meta, so I could be misinterpreting.
And 90% of that was when?

Busy people can be bad, too

That’s why i try to base suspicions on what people have done and said rather than what they haven’t.

Nothing in her iso is town, imo, neither before nor after she fell off.

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:11 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:54 pm But she’s the fifth highest poster

And I tend to view a high poster falling off the earth to be suspicious. But I am less familiar with the current meta, so I could be misinterpreting.
And 90% of that was when?

Before she started taking a lot of suspicion a few days back?

Dennis wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 6:03 pm @S~V~S I think you wanted rainbow lists so there you go

Thanks! Yours looks better than mine.

I think Scotty or Golden asked for them first, but at this stage the more reads we have and the more people who make them the better.

Golden (I think)wrote some good posts on splints,
I feel better about her than I did.

But she’s the fifth highest poster

And I tend to view a high poster falling off the earth to be suspicious. But I am less familiar with the current meta, so I could be misinterpreting.

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:33 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:29 pm
Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:21 pm I still think Lucy is a bad elim.
Why? Do you think she is town?

Her only real suspicions have been Sean, low posters and waffles.

I am not seeing anything town and very much that is the opposite of town.

Show me what I’m missing. Because I am 100% missing the town part of her iso.
My vibe read says town. She's busy and I don't see wolfy motivation when I run town and scum scenarios.

So this is gut, not based on what she’s posted or or voted or anything like that?

I respect that. Follow your own gut, not someone else’s.

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:21 pm I still think Lucy is a bad elim.

Why? Do you think she is town?

Her only real suspicions have been Sean, low posters and waffles.

I am not seeing anything town and very much that is the opposite of town.

Show me what I’m missing. Because I am 100% missing the town part of her iso.

Golden wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 3:46 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 3:33 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 3:12 pm In any event, I don’t think the identity of the deleted vote is something we should plan on figuring out.
Oh yeah, we can’t figure it out. I just want us to remember it exists if we form a voting strategy. And keep it in mind in a “what would” kind of way.
I think a two vote majority on any target to avoid a tie is essential, yeah. Even though I prefer Falcon I’ll vote Lucy today if it means avoiding vote manipulation shenanigans.

I agree, but I would prefer Lucy. Short of falcon coming in here with a list of his victims, I don't see me changing my vote. I don't think anyone seems to be thinking she is town

Dennis wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 12:46 am Darn. I think it's something day but I can't think of anything for the R.

Did you ever get an answer to this? I have no idea myself, I would like to know, too.

You're mighty quiet today. Do you have any thoughts on todays discussion?

Golden wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 3:12 pm In any event, I don’t think the identity of the deleted vote is something we should plan on figuring out.

Oh yeah, we can’t figure it out. I just want us to remember it exists if we form a voting strategy. And keep it in mind in a “what would” kind of way.

@Golden i meant that in a world where Lucy was bad. Not otherwise. You can stop huffing now

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:03 pm Here's that rainbow list that no one asked for. Players are listed alphabetically in tiers.

Town

S~V~S
Dennis

Light Town

falcon45ca
Kate
Sabiplz
Scotty

Null or No Content

bea
DrWilgy
fingersplints
jack shepherd
lucy
Roxy
Seanzie
Soneji

Mafia Lean

Golden
Matahari

And to include a recap on players I haven't talked about yet that I have now sorted into tiers:

falcon45ca: I also don't really trust Golden, albeit might be for different reasons. His vibes don't strike me as hitting the notes of his scum game.

Scotty: Has been active and prodding, and also mostly harmless. I think of the townleans I have, his is the least strongest, but GTH, I do think he's town, and I have seen enough content from him to slot him here for now.

Matahari: Some of her thoughts that she posted in #529 lack direction. That is fine. But I get the feeling that she is pushing herself to talk about players when she doesn't have anything specific to say about them. Soneji in particular.

Like Marmots NK; I could see a baddie team with one member in the bottom tier NKing him as a WIFOM move. But a Golden/Mata team would have to be incredibly arrogant to kill Marmot here. Possible, but not sure I see it.

At the time, I thought it might have been Sabi that NKed him, or after they flipped civ, I thought it might have been Lucy trying to isolate Sabi. But it could have been for totally different reasons, and I could be out of left field.

This thread is hilarious, everyone thinks they were the NK targets.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 1:50 pm

Your tinfoil of golden mirrors mine. I think his game of self-assuredness is far messier and different than the last game. He has insisted multiple times he wins games as a deepwolf more often than not and is on a streak as such. That precedence niggles on my confidence all the time with him in that ‘he seems so town, but I DONT wanna be snowed by him again, so maybe the best move is to eliminate him before he gets there just in case.’ Which is a shitty way to approach it, because town golden is a strong player. That tinfoil hat is less tinfoil and more 3D-printed pseudo carbon fiber and a terrible fashion choice to be wearing around the farm. So I also am not pursuing it, but if we start eliminating what should be most likely candidates for wolves in lucy/falcon…and they’re both town…? I’m all for chopping golden.

I don’t think there are 2 town in falcon/lucy as of now. I can see a case where only 1 is wolf and someone else is propping them up, but I definitely feel like one of them going over today is integral to our solve.

I suppose I could see Lucy/Golden but I don't see Golden/Mata. As you say, how this lynch comes out will help me focus it somewhat. As of right now, I think he's town. But times change and so do minds.

I do agree that I like todays wagons, although I like the Lucy one more

since I have actively sussed her as opposed to second hand suspicion re falcon, also I think it will say more about Golden than a falcon lynch would. But if we are doing the two wagons thing, this works for me. Although we need to keep in mind that *if* Lucy is bad, she, or her team, isn't ever cancelling Goldens vote (or trying to NK him).

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 12:48 pm @lucy could you give us a reads list? I don't seem to recall who you have suspected out side of low posters.

You didn't vote yesterday, when the first woof was lynched, and you were on the primary wagon every day before that.

Re Soneji, a few days before we lynched him,
Friday, 5:28~

lucy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 02, 2022 6:26 pm
falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Dec 02, 2022 6:25 pm
lucy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 02, 2022 6:18 pm falcon, besides me and seanzie who do u suspect
I can see Sabi as wolf fo sho. Soneji, Golden
i’d be extremely happy to vote soneji out

Thurs 4:49 PM, with *zero* mention of Soneji between. Thursday her only suspect is Seanzie, Friday she'd be happy to vote Soneji out.

lucy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 01, 2022 5:49 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Thu Dec 01, 2022 5:39 pm
lucy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 01, 2022 5:22 pm I'll try to make a readslist and poe, which is slightly difficult due to gamestate

one thing I do have issue with is the fact all the votes are being placed on active players, while I believe that there are active mafia players, I don't believe it's any greater than one or two

which means that we'll vote out active participants instead of inactive participants which will greatly harm us in late game, due to voting out all the players that have actually done something. instead of inactive whom have done nothing. to that end I scum read bea, so I'll actually place my vote there

[VOTE: bea] aubergine
So you would prefer to eliminate a low poster rather than a person you suspect?

Why Bea over Soneji? Both have 2 posts, hers have at least some content, his have zero.
I don't suspect anyone besides seanzie, and I actually do believe we should resolve seanzie's alignment given the wigly beheading

I've said in an early post, her content was actually void of any content, but I don't feel too strongly if either goes over, but because of bea's post I'm gonna vote there first

Both of these posts were from Day 2, the day we eliminated Sabi. Her only subsequent mention of Soneji was to ask if he was submissive. She did not even make a vote post when she voted Soneji that I could find.

@lucy could you give us a reads list? I don't seem to recall who you have suspected out side of low posters.

Thank You G Man!

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 12:36 pm Your 2 minute delay looks like an attempt at "mind melding" and your post now doesnt help

I’m used to the linki feature and I’m always in the thread I just missed your post, but you do you.

Rondo tinfoiling great minds think alike again lol.

LOL, I miss linki so bad.

Lets ask!

@G-Man is it OK for players to unvote onto the "NON PLAYER" option, or do you frown on this?

Golden wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 12:01 pm
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:59 am
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:49 am
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:39 am
Spoiler: show
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:35 am
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 10:58 am
Spoiler: show
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 9:56 am Looking for GTH opinions: Lucy Village or Woof? (No PoE, if you had to make a call what is it?)

OK, to start, I have no info. But reading back has made me realize I made a timing error, and I made the mistake of listening to someone else when I should have listened to myself. And I am finding some of the things Golden is saying today alarming.

I am going to guess this is OK with Golden since he did something similar to Sean, and becasue i think I am probably mistaken. I'm just going on what I believed most of this game. And I am not sure how to explain this without "going there".

I thought Golden was an info role, and was trying to steer a bit based on that without actually dumping into the thread (which one of the info roles isn't allowed to do anyhow, iirc). Day 1, if i had an info role, I would have checked Sean. Sean was the opposing wagon to Wilgy, and was taking tons of heat. And Golden came in defending Sean. The Doc case he made a few days later looked made up to me, it looked like an info case, except to prove someone was civ, not that they were bad. He posted it to get people off the Sean fixation, and it worked. I myself thought he was town, and still do. Since no one really pushed back at that case, maybe he actually is that role

Golden also was defending Lucy, who I would have checked Day 2 if I were an info role. She was the 2nd wagon Day 2, although not as close as the Day 1 wagon. So I backed off of her, and moved on. I also felt to some extent that maybe I was picking on her (although I am not sure why I would feel that, but I will say that guilt is the only emotion I process fairly normally, lol).

I thought Sabiplz was bad for very bad reasons, and I learned my lesson about misunderstanding cultural differences. I thought they were steering, I thought they were self meta-ing way too much (that, for me, is a baddie tell, a big baddie tell, but not for Sabi obvs). I thought they may have killed Marmot to garner some civ sympathy for themselves since they were obvs super simpatico w/Marmot.

As an aside, now I am thinking Marmot was NKed to isolate Sabi a bit if Lucy was bad. If you look back at Sabis posts, Lucy was trying to meld with Sabi a bit imo.

Anyhow, I compressed days 1/2 mentally and assumed Golden had checked Lucy, but I read back and see he was vouching for her waaaaay before that. So therefore, I either think he was NOT an info role and I read into him, or he was blocked Night 2 and got no results. Or since he was vouching for her day 1, maybe if he was a cop role, he didn't check her at all

And now, reading today, he seems to be backing off of that town read of Lucy. So I went back and realized this started on Day 1, before an info role could have checked anyone.

This is from day one, and I'm a nub

So I can't sort Golden until I sort Lucy. My gut has been saying "WOLF WOLF WOLF" from the start, and will keep it up until one of us is gawn, baby, gawn.

My heart has been telling me this is Goldens town game, but I really need to sort this, so he goes into the PoE until I do. Also to keep in mind, if Golden is civ (and bad Golden is more tentative, less assured he's right, so I think he likely is a civ) and Lucy is not, I bet his vote (and maybe Dennis' vote since she's glommed onto him so hard) have probably never been blocked and probably aren't now. Mine might be, Scottys might be.

Imma read back some more, and get that rainbow in a bit.

And before Rondo asks, I have no idea who a wolf Lucys partner would be. I don't think it's Golden, his defense of her would have been too hamfisted if he were bad.

tl;dr

Lucy wolf read is also in my iso

now to read this ungodly post at this ungodly time

If you think the doc case is made up and Golden hard defended sean and sean isnt saying no then he is just on borrowed time till real doc flips and then two wolves go down hard back to back. Also you have to ask why real doc isnt trying to murder seanzie. Now Seanzie trying to flip me so aggressively isnt the best move as well because eventually I Will go over and then he will be in deep shit and then Golden and him will have to double down on defending each other (in the world they are w/w) so its a really bizarre play. Might work but its unlikely

There could be a world where seanzie is town and golden is wolf (for defending lucy if i pre-flip her wolf) but then seanzie should be targeting golden for hard death because then he would be wrong on who the night save is and claiming it so boldy in thread means that seanzie would have a difference check on golden but that isnt the case so until someone counter claims or seanzie tries to kill golden I am just saying its true that seanzie is doc and golden was the night kill

if you dont know Sabi its hard to not just scumbucket her

That said if Lucy is wolf and Seanzie is just sticking to his guns so hard that he is seeing red and wolves holstered the kill and golden claimed doc saved him (This is assuming all the planets aligned and its even legal to holster in this format) then golden could still be wolf. But that is an edge case I cant even think about till I see the lucy flip and then another kill after that. But yeah in that case Seanzie is still town because doc would CC and hard death tunnel seanzie and he would be dead before FX

Basically as long as Golden and Seanzie keep sticking together and no Doc flips I lose this game to them and you go over SVS every time. Because I think you are in a good place to deep wolf (Golden is too, but he has a shield and you dont)

Answer me this. Who is goldens partner if not Seanzie? If you cant put any other name next to it right now just look elsewhere and try to flip them. If you can put a name next to it. great lets kill that name then look at golden when we have more information
Ha ha I don't ever remember being called ungodly before, but I'll take it. And people who know my game will tell you I am an excellent deepwolf (I never heard that before this game, but I love that term), it may be what I do best in mafia. But not here.

I don't know if it's real or not, I just know what *I* thought for a large swathe of the game.

I also know when someone is coming after me and they mean it or not. I have had a big reputation as a deep aggressive tunneller. I have been trying to avoid this in my comeback tour. But *my* read on Sean is based on myself, I 100% thought he meant it when he was tunnelling me. He believed it. Goldens read cemented it for me, and was part of why I was more willing to accept Goldens viewpoint. If Golden is bad, I still think Sean is not.

To be clear, I am blaming myself for my actions, *NOT* Golden, although my thoughts on Golden are what precipitated all of this.

Looking for a woof partner for Golden, I find Goldens ISO is clean, in that he has interacted with everyone alive in this game. He's replied to them, he's typed out their names, he's commented on them. I would have to think on who i think would be bad with Mata and Golden, were he bad. I am not seeing a big space to fit a teammate between Matahari and Golden tbh. He was pushing Mata/Falcon as teammates while she was still alive, before Vivax replaced in.

And Golden and a hypothetical partner are not in a vacuum, Mata/Vivax would have to be in there with them. I think I just talked myself out of suspecting Golden at all. I don't see how he is compatible with bad Matahari, and especially with bad Mata/falcon. So not sure. I can't put a name next to Golden.

I am home all day today, and much of tomorrow. My Dad pulled a last minute thing so I have to go tomorrow from @2 Eastern to @ 8ish, I am so annoyed. And we'll be a restaurant so clutching my phone and hiding around corners to post like I did the other day won't work. That's why I am making a big push now, I won't be around for much if any of EOD.

What about yourself SVS+Golden+Mata/Vivax. Why doesnt that work?
I don't see Mata/Vivax and Golden working together, regardless of the third party. I have to go back and reread them, but he was looking to her as bad fairly early, then she was sick and I think both he and I backed off her a bit becasue *Kate* didn't think she was bad. I suspected mata D1 or 2, but she kinda snapped back at me for it, and I tend to read her the opposite of Roxy. Roxy snaps at you when bad, Mata does it when civ. At least that is what I thought.

But I guess I could be compatible with bad Golden, but I don't see how bad me, bad Golden and bad Mata would work together.

I have never done this type of analysis, it's helpful actually.
ALSO, I know G Man is a straight up guy, and if he said he randomized, he randomized. But if he randomized a Mafia team consisting of me, Golden and Matahari, he would re-randomize lol. It's not thread related, but it's what I think.
As relieved as I was to roll civ, if gman randomised a you/me wolf duo and then rolled again I’d be devastated.

Have we been bad together? If so it was a looong time ago, I don’t recall it.

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:49 am
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:39 am
Spoiler: show
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:35 am
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 10:58 am
Spoiler: show
S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 9:56 am Looking for GTH opinions: Lucy Village or Woof? (No PoE, if you had to make a call what is it?)

OK, to start, I have no info. But reading back has made me realize I made a timing error, and I made the mistake of listening to someone else when I should have listened to myself. And I am finding some of the things Golden is saying today alarming.

I am going to guess this is OK with Golden since he did something similar to Sean, and becasue i think I am probably mistaken. I'm just going on what I believed most of this game. And I am not sure how to explain this without "going there".

I thought Golden was an info role, and was trying to steer a bit based on that without actually dumping into the thread (which one of the info roles isn't allowed to do anyhow, iirc). Day 1, if i had an info role, I would have checked Sean. Sean was the opposing wagon to Wilgy, and was taking tons of heat. And Golden came in defending Sean. The Doc case he made a few days later looked made up to me, it looked like an info case, except to prove someone was civ, not that they were bad. He posted it to get people off the Sean fixation, and it worked. I myself thought he was town, and still do. Since no one really pushed back at that case, maybe he actually is that role

Golden also was defending Lucy, who I would have checked Day 2 if I were an info role. She was the 2nd wagon Day 2, although not as close as the Day 1 wagon. So I backed off of her, and moved on. I also felt to some extent that maybe I was picking on her (although I am not sure why I would feel that, but I will say that guilt is the only emotion I process fairly normally, lol).

I thought Sabiplz was bad for very bad reasons, and I learned my lesson about misunderstanding cultural differences. I thought they were steering, I thought they were self meta-ing way too much (that, for me, is a baddie tell, a big baddie tell, but not for Sabi obvs). I thought they may have killed Marmot to garner some civ sympathy for themselves since they were obvs super simpatico w/Marmot.

As an aside, now I am thinking Marmot was NKed to isolate Sabi a bit if Lucy was bad. If you look back at Sabis posts, Lucy was trying to meld with Sabi a bit imo.

Anyhow, I compressed days 1/2 mentally and assumed Golden had checked Lucy, but I read back and see he was vouching for her waaaaay before that. So therefore, I either think he was NOT an info role and I read into him, or he was blocked Night 2 and got no results. Or since he was vouching for her day 1, maybe if he was a cop role, he didn't check her at all

And now, reading today, he seems to be backing off of that town read of Lucy. So I went back and realized this started on Day 1, before an info role could have checked anyone.

This is from day one, and I'm a nub

Golden wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:41 pm I don’t think a vote for Lucy is the way to go today.
So I can't sort Golden until I sort Lucy. My gut has been saying "WOLF WOLF WOLF" from the start, and will keep it up until one of us is gawn, baby, gawn.

My heart has been telling me this is Goldens town game, but I really need to sort this, so he goes into the PoE until I do. Also to keep in mind, if Golden is civ (and bad Golden is more tentative, less assured he's right, so I think he likely is a civ) and Lucy is not, I bet his vote (and maybe Dennis' vote since she's glommed onto him so hard) have probably never been blocked and probably aren't now. Mine might be, Scottys might be.

Imma read back some more, and get that rainbow in a bit.

And before Rondo asks, I have no idea who a wolf Lucys partner would be. I don't think it's Golden, his defense of her would have been too hamfisted if he were bad.

tl;dr

Lucy wolf read is also in my iso

now to read this ungodly post at this ungodly time

If you think the doc case is made up and Golden hard defended sean and sean isnt saying no then he is just on borrowed time till real doc flips and then two wolves go down hard back to back. Also you have to ask why real doc isnt trying to murder seanzie. Now Seanzie trying to flip me so aggressively isnt the best move as well because eventually I Will go over and then he will be in deep shit and then Golden and him will have to double down on defending each other (in the world they are w/w) so its a really bizarre play. Might work but its unlikely

There could be a world where seanzie is town and golden is wolf (for defending lucy if i pre-flip her wolf) but then seanzie should be targeting golden for hard death because then he would be wrong on who the night save is and claiming it so boldy in thread means that seanzie would have a difference check on golden but that isnt the case so until someone counter claims or seanzie tries to kill golden I am just saying its true that seanzie is doc and golden was the night kill

if you dont know Sabi its hard to not just scumbucket her

That said if Lucy is wolf and Seanzie is just sticking to his guns so hard that he is seeing red and wolves holstered the kill and golden claimed doc saved him (This is assuming all the planets aligned and its even legal to holster in this format) then golden could still be wolf. But that is an edge case I cant even think about till I see the lucy flip and then another kill after that. But yeah in that case Seanzie is still town because doc would CC and hard death tunnel seanzie and he would be dead before FX

Basically as long as Golden and Seanzie keep sticking together and no Doc flips I lose this game to them and you go over SVS every time. Because I think you are in a good place to deep wolf (Golden is too, but he has a shield and you dont)

Answer me this. Who is goldens partner if not Seanzie? If you cant put any other name next to it right now just look elsewhere and try to flip them. If you can put a name next to it. great lets kill that name then look at golden when we have more information
Ha ha I don't ever remember being called ungodly before, but I'll take it. And people who know my game will tell you I am an excellent deepwolf (I never heard that before this game, but I love that term), it may be what I do best in mafia. But not here.

I don't know if it's real or not, I just know what *I* thought for a large swathe of the game.

I also know when someone is coming after me and they mean it or not. I have had a big reputation as a deep aggressive tunneller. I have been trying to avoid this in my comeback tour. But *my* read on Sean is based on myself, I 100% thought he meant it when he was tunnelling me. He believed it. Goldens read cemented it for me, and was part of why I was more willing to accept Goldens viewpoint. If Golden is bad, I still think Sean is not.

To be clear, I am blaming myself for my actions, *NOT* Golden, although my thoughts on Golden are what precipitated all of this.

Looking for a woof partner for Golden, I find Goldens ISO is clean, in that he has interacted with everyone alive in this game. He's replied to them, he's typed out their names, he's commented on them. I would have to think on who i think would be bad with Mata and Golden, were he bad. I am not seeing a big space to fit a teammate between Matahari and Golden tbh. He was pushing Mata/Falcon as teammates while she was still alive, before Vivax replaced in.

And Golden and a hypothetical partner are not in a vacuum, Mata/Vivax would have to be in there with them. I think I just talked myself out of suspecting Golden at all. I don't see how he is compatible with bad Matahari, and especially with bad Mata/falcon. So not sure. I can't put a name next to Golden.

I am home all day today, and much of tomorrow. My Dad pulled a last minute thing so I have to go tomorrow from @2 Eastern to @ 8ish, I am so annoyed. And we'll be a restaurant so clutching my phone and hiding around corners to post like I did the other day won't work. That's why I am making a big push now, I won't be around for much if any of EOD.

What about yourself SVS+Golden+Mata/Vivax. Why doesnt that work?
I don't see Mata/Vivax and Golden working together, regardless of the third party. I have to go back and reread them, but he was looking to her as bad fairly early, then she was sick and I think both he and I backed off her a bit becasue *Kate* didn't think she was bad. I suspected mata D1 or 2, but she kinda snapped back at me for it, and I tend to read her the opposite of Roxy. Roxy snaps at you when bad, Mata does it when civ. At least that is what I thought.

But I guess I could be compatible with bad Golden, but I don't see how bad me, bad Golden and bad Mata would work together.

I have never done this type of analysis, it's helpful actually.

ALSO, I know G Man is a straight up guy, and if he said he randomized, he randomized. But if he randomized a Mafia team consisting of me, Golden and Matahari, he would re-randomize lol. It's not thread related, but it's what I think.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:43 am

This gif brings me great happiness.

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