The Syndicate

I'm not sure I can respond to that Dizzy post without breaking rules. Keeping my vote there and want that slot dead on policy now. Feel free and scumread me for it tomorrow if they flip town.

I'm down to kill tsp if illario doesn't show up.

Bereft wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 7:26 pm
Bereft wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 7:24 pm Where did Dizzy defend me now? I must be missing something, because all I remember is them calling me cute that one time.
Yeah I ctrl F'ed, it doesnt exist.

Yeah it was in my notes because I read it on this:

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Nov 15, 2023 2:35 pm Gira, my love, my one and only.

Hands across the Atlantic Ocean

[VOTE: Robyn] aubergine

They had a wordy post and they didn’t say hi to me.

which situationally was pushing robyn over you despite you scumreading him.

Bereft wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 7:24 pm Where did Dizzy defend me now? I must be missing something, because all I remember is them calling me cute that one time.

d1 when you were getting wagoned, unless I'm nuts. Lemme go back and look.

WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 7:19 pm
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 7:16 pm This game.

Rondo is not a wolf.

Gira is not a wolf.

Leetic is not a wolf.

There is at least one wolf in Bereft/Dizzy, quite possibly two but the entire game freaking out (again!) about pushing there indicates at least one active partner elsewhere.

Pyxxy... *can* be a wolf but this wagon rising up and pushing them over dizzy is ???
I don't think it's Bereft
Idk if it's Dizzy, I don't think he's scummy, I just think he's a non-entity which is not great.
Why is there at least one between those two? Wagonomics or their defense of each other?

Everyone else is towny, they're hard defending each other all game on nothing while the rest of the game spins in circles complaining the game feels "hard"

This game.

Rondo is not a wolf.

Gira is not a wolf.

Leetic is not a wolf.

There is at least one wolf in Bereft/Dizzy, quite possibly two but the entire game freaking out (again!) about pushing there indicates at least one active partner elsewhere.

Pyxxy... *can* be a wolf but this wagon rising up and pushing them over dizzy is ???

I arrive. Reading.

Has illario shown up?

well.

bed.

If you are town then ignore me and do your thing. You have the floor.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 6:32 am @Ranmilia @WindwardAway @pyxxy @tedxtr Why do you think you have the best possible vote right now?

It's you or Bereft for me as of right now. You've done nothing to help town, some stuff to hurt it early on, and then hid behind inactivity. Bereft has at least been posting and Mac had them town and you wolf. There's been so much resistance and so many people saying "oh dizzy is just rand I don't want to vote there it's not spicy, it's not the BEST POSSIBLE VOTE" sort of thing that I feel like that has to be a mafia talking point. Mac had you scummy and died.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Nov 15, 2023 11:48 pm
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Wed Nov 15, 2023 7:10 pm @Dyslexicon I have read your posts... I don't have much to say in response that isn't obvious or already said. If you are town, we can really use your head in the game, please keep on keepin on, read as much as you are able and give us your thoughts, and don't feel like "oh no ran is dead set on killing me" because that is not the case, unless you are a wolf in which case it is the case. But regardless very happy to finally get a game with you <3
It is at this point that a feeling that I have had already has now fully crystalised to a point where I feel the need to say it aloud.

Ran is such obvious town that anyone who has scumread them whatsoever is entirely suspicious with perhaps the sole exception of leetic.

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 6:19 am so pyxxy wolf read me cuz of my slank cover

abi wolf read me cuz of the wagon on me

at this point, if bereft wolf reads me on my actual posts he might be outed

I share these thoughts.

WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 6:17 am I see I've missed nothing important

ted claimed pr.

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 6:11 am
leetic wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 5:42 am Anyway, not sure what to make of tedxtr's sudden claim but that is likely an issue for later, don't want to vote them today.
Well mainly that it's fake

it's almost certainly not fake. it was obvious overnight when I reread him and noticed he was all about being interested in mech but not in a way that threw up any fluff for town. this is why I said to not go for him this morning.

ted do you have any relevant info to give? I assume not given what you said but.

...

yeah

that's. what i thought. i told y'all we don't go ted today.

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 5:31 am i would, if people were actually helpful and engaged in good faith

i get wagonned all the time and people rarely elaborate on why, and when i ask them to give a clear cut reason, they never do or they say something of this sort

then i check their iso and it’s still non existent

ye i meant the leetic/abigail stuff, apologies.

I too would like to know, I see Bereft scumreading but I don't see or can't understand the reasons, and I don't really buy d1 wagons as reason on its own given the circumstances. I HAVE +scum points on ted I think are better than that already and they're counterbalanced by thinking the wagons if anything look good for him.

Please cut out the fighting and negativity. This is not good for the game, fun value, or town.

So we have been told

@☆Princess Abigail☆
What are your thoughts on the current poll

WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:27 am I mean, lots of people said they think Rondo is scum and then voted Dizzy.
I said I changed my mind overnight, Rondo's ISO was not scummy yesterday, and then I voted Dizzy to put pressure there.
Dunno what everyone else's explanation is. Has Dizzy shown up yet?

He has not. I've moved there because TSP now has an illario in his head.

WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:25 am
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:24 am
pyxxy wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:20 am saving current votecount for later
Spoiler: show
Dyslexicon
3
25%
Voters: Ranmilia, pyxxy, tedxtr
tedxtr
2
17%
Voters: Bereft, ☆Princess Abigail☆
TonyStarkPrime
2
17%
Voters: leetic, Gira
No vote / Unvote
1
8%
Voters: TonyStarkPrime

no Rondo vote yet

Aren't there like four people not voting? Why is Rondo called out specifically?
I assumed he was pointing out that Rondo is not a wagon despite having been talked about

yeah but leetic made a similar comment earlier about rondo specifically not voting

WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:24 am
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:23 am
WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:21 am Good morning
A bit busy again today but I'll be around for a while before eod regardless
Also I have an extra vote on me, lol
Curioser and curiouser
My guess is that it's actually coming from the other thread

Yeah the current going theory is that they indicate pairups with people who were wagoned or killed somehow in the other thread. TSP has one and reports illario is dead and in a mason chat with him, same as with abigail/porscha. No one else has reported one today.

pyxxy wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:20 am saving current votecount for later
Spoiler: show
Dyslexicon
3
25%
Voters: Ranmilia, pyxxy, tedxtr
tedxtr
2
17%
Voters: Bereft, ☆Princess Abigail☆
TonyStarkPrime
2
17%
Voters: leetic, Gira
No vote / Unvote
1
8%
Voters: TonyStarkPrime

no Rondo vote yet

Aren't there like four people not voting? Why is Rondo called out specifically?

WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 4:21 am Good morning
A bit busy again today but I'll be around for a while before eod regardless
Also I have an extra vote on me, lol

Curioser and curiouser

Ain't no need to neg people about past games. We learn and move on, gg go next.

Wilgy... (cupcake trauma dog face)

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/27896

Dizzy wolfgame (and wolf sweep) I specced closely. In this particular game he mostly hid behind Hally claiming a godread on him but still a great game for analysis.

leetic wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 3:18 am A couple of meta questions about Dyslexicon:

- Is it typical for them to completely dip like this?
- Do they typically bus/distance their partners or are they more willing to openly defend them?

1. not really, as either alignment
2. in the dizzy wolf games I remember it was a mix of all three, distancing, some bussing, some open defense. A lot of forcing hard dichotomies like "we simply must resolve [town on town fight]" although that's a common wolf tactic regardless.

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 3:06 am
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 2:53 am
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 2:39 am
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 1:09 pm Okay after catch up report card

Lawful Good: Ranmilia, DubzDimBuckle, WWA

Chaotic Good: Princess Abigail, Gira, Bereft, Leetic

True Neutral: Dizzy, TSP

Lawful Evil: Pyxxy

Chaotic Evil: Ted

Ordered within tiers

Leetic is dropping for me. Schweppes is rising.

Lawful Goods are locked in and I'm willing to bet the game on it.

Ran, WWA, Rondo want to mason?
Here for your viewing pleasure
Talk to me about Rondo, Ted, Pyxxy? Well you have already talked about Rondo/Dubz but. Why are those your bottom two?
Wagon movement when Ted was brought close to Robyn looks atrocious

I have no conceivably valid reason to town read pyxxy. They've been providing much info but no analysis and largely doing nothing that isn't as wolfy as it could be towny

The way I read the game is to look at posts from a player and internally analyze "how does this benefit town? How does this benefit wolf? Would town do it and why? Would wolf do it and why? Which is more likely?"

After doing that analysis internally I draw a conclusion.

I am much better at finding town than scum statistically so I look for town and than poe the people I find least likely to be town

Hm. Talk to me about Bereft, actually. That's the lynchpin there, because my view on Ted currently is relative to my view on Bereft and Rondo. I see how from your point of view this worldview makes sense.

It occurs to me that TSP did not get a secret vote yesterday. If the wagon in other thread = vote theory is correct that means illario was not a wagon d1, and went straight from that to getting voted out... hm.

Also why did you put yourself in Chaotic Good?

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 2:39 am
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 1:09 pm Okay after catch up report card

Lawful Good: Ranmilia, DubzDimBuckle, WWA

Chaotic Good: Princess Abigail, Gira, Bereft, Leetic

True Neutral: Dizzy, TSP

Lawful Evil: Pyxxy

Chaotic Evil: Ted

Ordered within tiers

Leetic is dropping for me. Schweppes is rising.

Lawful Goods are locked in and I'm willing to bet the game on it.

Ran, WWA, Rondo want to mason?
Here for your viewing pleasure

Talk to me about Rondo, Ted, Pyxxy? Well you have already talked about Rondo/Dubz but. Why are those your bottom two?

leetic wrote: ↑Sun Nov 19, 2023 12:12 am Although this thread still seems suspiciously quiet. @WindwardAway any reason why you're significantly less vocal this phase than you were in the last?

Not to answer for wind in specific, but it is the weekend and our long day 1 was pretty exhausting. Would be nice if folks were around more though but... I've said my piece and don't have much new, the ball is in Dizzy's and Bereft's and Rondo's respective courts. I've cooled on TSP some but still can't really understand his mindset... but now that he's channeling illario it's probably impractical to kill him today regardless.

[VOTE: Dizzy] aubergine

So.

- With this many people corroborating each other I think there's no reason to doubt the general shape of the reported mech.

- Porscha is only a wolf if illario is too.
-- In the world where both of them are wolves, other-thread town is doing fantastic. So I'm not too concerned about that world.

- What on earth is illario doing dead day 2 though. That.. really is only possible if he was slanking/not playing actively. So. That checks out I guess.

Was he there at eod or no, and if no, what was the last time he checked the thread?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 10:25 pm Will relay questions

Also do you have a phantom vote on you, a double vote, or both?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 10:19 pm Does anyone have any other questions

Was Porscha town? What were the wagons/general state of the other thread? Who got phantom votes over there? Who all is in the other thread?

I do not seem to have a phantom vote.

leetic wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 9:22 pm
Bereft wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 12:35 pm Wait no this is news to me. I did not know you knew Porscha was your innie.

I find it weird though, since this effectively gives us extra clears. Unclear. ~ Schweppes

Bereft wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:20 pm All names guessed are correct.

@Gira , you know what your pfp is, right? ~ Schweppes
You can clearly mention usernames. Plus, you can clearly interact with other people in real time. The fact that you almost never do these does not look good.

This however is still true and is why I have them as a very potential wolf.

Well, Bereft is signing their posts with "Bereft" and "Not Bereft" and "Schweppes" at different times, using different writing styles, and they just pointedly talked about "demon summoning" using a set of objects that are totally different from the set of objects they have been using to refer to posters in this thread.

That sure sounds to me like they are trying to imply they have contact with someone in the other thread. If they do, I would expect heavy restrictions on their ability to communicate about it given the obvious balance concerns and the limits we ~know are on Porscha. Some hosts are axiomatically against post restrictions, but if Abi/Porscha speak truth (and at this point I don't see a reason to disbelieve) then we know they exist in this game.

leetic wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 9:15 pm
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 9:11 pm But that also does not serve your purposes well if you are a wolf, and the Porscha/Abi situation is now indicating that post restrictions are in fact part of this game.
Did Abby say they had a post restriction? If so I missed it

Just a bit ago. She said she can't just relay information from her chat with Porscha for free, since that would circumvent Porscha's post limit. (For both rules/spirit of the rules reasons and protown infosec reasons I do not think we should pry too hard into the specifics.)

Bereft wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 8:49 pm I don't think the orange juice carton, tabasco, or the kewpie doll, are wolf at all, like at all, at all, right now, and would still townread the toy sword.
I think the metal plate's behavior today is bizarre. I also think the interactions between the disco ball, the stuffed toy, the ducky, and the metal plate, imply half the group is unpartnered with the other half at a glance with no specific details.
Hence a predicament.

~ not Schweppes

So. What is your deal, exactly? I've been trying to translate for you but you've gotten upset at me for it, twice now. That is bewildering to me. Makes me feel like I'm getting suckered and wasting my time. But that also does not serve your purposes well if you are a wolf, and the Porscha/Abi situation is now indicating that post restrictions are in fact part of this game. Are you in contact with/hydra'd/something like that with another player, is that what the demon summoning and different signatures are all about? The heady smell of cedar smoke fills my nostrils, mm, grilling.

Alternatively, we could discuss the taste of the dew on this ficus, which is completely unrelated and puts out the grill fire?

Do you know if Porscha still has vision of the other thread?

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 8:35 pm
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 7:50 pm
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 12:25 pm Reads*
oh.

I think they're pretty consensus takes, +/- pyxxy town gira scumlean. Not absurd but not hard to come up with, doesn't move the needle much for me.
Thank you wanna mason? Your my strongest town read

Certainly. What is the haps?

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 7:01 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:23 pm
☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 12:15 pm
leetic wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 10:30 pm I don't know why Bereft voted the hedge option, but damn their posting method is just so cryptic. If they don't get serious this phase there will be issues.
What was Robyn's final read on schweppes?

I didn't read EoD and I won't
Robyn dipped for half the phase, so I doubt any read they posted has any sort of finality.
I'm quite sure they posted reads I don't care when I care what the read was

robyn's finalish reads:

robyn wrote: ↑Thu Nov 16, 2023 12:01 am
MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Nov 15, 2023 11:53 pm
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Wed Nov 15, 2023 7:13 pm @MacDougall Can you explain like I'm 5 how you think Robyn has not been towny?
In Robyn I do not see someone who has an agenda to solve the mafia game, but I see someone who has an agenda to appear like they are town and mostly just charm people.

The feeling I get from town Robyn is usually one that is more anxious and concerned with figuring out what everyone is up to. Town Robyn by process ends up getting overtly emotional and irritated.

Mafia Robyn has more emotional control over themselves, and they often end up one step ahead of everyone. They are particularly good at pocketing people by saying specific things that are designed to achieve that goal. For instance Robyn is aware that I have a predisposition for townreading people for lack of TMI and pushing me. Robyn threatened to scumread me earlier for daring to suspect them. But then they didn't, and chose to give me space instead.

I can sense in all of our interactions that Robyn is largely holding their breath and just trying to avoid having me outright bury them. Since I started posting all that Robyn has really done is crack jokes and react.
i am town, mafia is not obvious here. other people are making content and leetic is badgering people. i am trying to figure out where i went wrong because i currently townread everyone... which is also why my reads are worthless as of now

i am not anxious of you figuring out my alignment, if you did that would be good. specifically i am anxious of being pushed by you, i'm anxious of getting pushed by everyone really

if i had to make reads i would list gira at the bottom, but i also don't know how much i believe this

and i really don't qant to chop schweppes here anymore because if it comes down to me/him at eod this day won't end well

everything is a mess and i don't know what to fucking do

Previous to that they "godread" schweppes scum. I do not really know what to make of it.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 3:35 pm Five flips are dizzy rondo bereft ran and Abigail narrowly over Ted before Leetic asks

oh you answered already.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 3:29 pm
Gira wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 3:03 pm
WindwardAway wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 6:07 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 3:27 am Could it be that Mac was killed because he was wrong, not because he was right?
If that were the case, I would expect he'd be killed for having an incorrect townread and not necessarily an incorrect scumread, like if he were hard shielding a wolf.

(hes gonna hate that I'm saying this since it risks tearing up the towncore, but I mean from a wolf perspective it's more beneficial to kill a loud townie with thread pull who accidentally townreads a wolf imo)

But I legit just think he was killed for being super towny, and I'm not reading into whether his reads were accurate or not, beyond what I already formed opinions on while he was around.
i like highly disagree with this from a theory POV, but as this is all speculative there's no use to it

but to use a real concrete example from this game, mac was hard townreading me and now that he's dead you have shitters like bereft and tsp and insomnia wanting to kill me for no actual discernable reason. mac has never failed to recognize me as town when i am town, he would be shutting that down immediately, he is probably cringing at the fact that there is an attempted push on me at all

but no one actually cares who dead players were townreading. as far as the wolves are concerned i am now a viable mis-elim and there is almost certainly one who is trying for that

insomnia demonstrably can't actually read me and so him suspecting me feels the most believable of the 3
If I were given the ability to flip any five players in the game immediately you would not be on that list

Who would it be then? Who're your wolves?

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 12:25 pm Reads*

oh.

I think they're pretty consensus takes, +/- pyxxy town gira scumlean. Not absurd but not hard to come up with, doesn't move the needle much for me.

☆Princess Abigail☆ wrote: ↑Sat Nov 18, 2023 12:25 pm
Ranmilia wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 11:15 pm Starting over with the riddles three stuff.

Ranmilia = brick
pyxxy = toy sword
leetic = ducky
TSP = metal plate
Rondo = tabasco bottle
Robyn = she
tedxtr = disco ball
Wind = cigarette? (presumed because avatar and context)
Abigail = carton of orange juice? (again presumed on avatar/context)

So Bereft now townreads Rondo because Robyn flipped town, also townreads pyxxy, me, wind, "compass" (I previously thought compass was mac, idk now).
Doesn't townread but doesn't want to go after orange juice (abigail) right now.
Scumreads leetic, ted, possibly TSP, and the "stuffed animal/comfort object" and "kewpie doll" which I'm not sure who they are.

That's what I get out of that.
I knew I loved you for a reason

If you answer this cool but I'm still catching up

What do you make of these tags?

I lost the battle with sleep last night, apologies. Back and catching up.

The tags I think are mostly based on players avatars, except for me and rondo (I'm an orange catgirl, tabasco is orange, i don't get how rondo is tabasco at all and thought he was clearly the metal plate in my first go at it). It seems like some roleplaying (or possibly a post restriction) where he's avoiding saying player names or quoting posts. The numbers listed are postnums if you go hunt them down.

702 and 714 are tsp talking about leetic talking about the flying spaghetti monster thread in a different subforum or lack thereof
2004 is leetic (ducky) saying to me that pyxxy is a wolflean because of their uninspiring voting/lack of posts difficult for wolf.
1475 is a post from rondo saying a gira/leetic worldview, voting gira

Agenda doesn't only have to be a push to actually get them voted out. Discrediting correct reads is also agenda.

Maybe not his scumreads, but he did make a serious push to protect and get people off of Bereft (and/or dizzy), and it was working, even before any of the robyn stuff happened. Here's the post again for reference:

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:05 pm Here’s the situation: not all is right. We’re about to limp into the stupidest looking bereft chop I’ve ever seen. It’s probably rand and there are somewhat good reasons not to do that. So then, who’s in this game who should know better? I promise I didn’t just immediately jump to the two voters on Bereft for the record, I think that looks slightly towny. Leetic seems to have lost a bit of the edge, can’t tell why. WWA is posting a lot but has no thread control nor have they attempted to wrest it. I won’t vote for Mac or dizzy day 1. Ted seems alright. Mac’s defending Gira. I won’t vote Rondo D1 for opposite reasons. Ran and Robyn are self resolving.

The two people he's pushing are the voters on Bereft, which he even lampshades directly and calls them towny(?!). The other wagon atp is dizzy with me and mac voting there iirc, and he blows that off as well.

The more I look here the more I am seeing tsp/bereft/dizzy. Which is very premature but. There's hella agenda.

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