Fallout New Vegas: A Post-Nuclear Mafia Game [LEGION CONQUEST]

[MacDougall]

Brad the Chelsea double voter lel

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like “Mac/TSP are heavily wolf siding” is a sorta weird statement which is tautologically true if we’re wolves and I think cannot possibly be true if we aren’t (unless the wolves are like Brad and Lan but in that case hands up idk)

I think saying someone is wolfsiding in a small game is weird anyway. (Not even suspicious just nonsensical.)

Like we have one flipped wolf (who was beyond consensus) and you know of a handful of dead townies and yourself. We have 2, maybe 3 living wolves.

"Wolfsiding" is like what you say in a mash when you have 10 previous w/t wagons resolved by yeet, ita or kp and you can look and say "Tony was on the wrong side of most of these 10 w/t disputes. Ergo, he is on the side of the wolves and is likely aligned with them and needs to go if he doesn't.

I don't feel like you can say that in this game. You're welcome for saying to you what you already said but in like a more longwinded way.

[Jackofhearts2005]

fuck I forgot to close the quote again

[Jackofhearts2005]

that and switching between past tense and present tense interchangeably are the only things stopping me from becoming a successful novelist

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: unvote] aubergine

[VOTE: Unvote] aubergine

[VOTE: unvote] aubergine lel

Got a giggle out of me.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The beginning of Falcon's 38 post iso is focused on talking to dead townies.

It then moves into talking to Dunn in a way that doesn't look particularly teamed. But I already townread Dunn off her posts so this is just fuel for the fire.

Falcon uses the word bivouac, which is neat. I didn't think anyone had used that word outside of Small World. He also talks to Mac a bit but it's throwaway lines.

That covers D1.

Falcon asks Mac if he's powerwolfing. Basically still throwaway but Mac is one of the two living players he's talked to at this point so it's worth noting.

Then we get this line.

I think falcon is way more likely than not villa btw.
I still think Lan is an IC
Mac and Creature can still be town

I kinda wanna kill Chels but im too much of a coward to actually push that today so i'd settle for TSP or Epi ig.

Thoughts on Mac and Chelsea?

Also I see falcon being floated around, falcon completely fell below my radar so far, but then again so did TSP and (for a long time) Sig and... too many others.

You can find me on sonar or lidar, but I am immune to radio waves

Lan is not talking to Falcon or even really saying anything about Falcon but Falcon feels the need to address this. He answers with a joke. Maybe luck. Maybe a good look for Lan. The Lan post also mentions Mac and Chelsea and TSP and Sig so if any/multiple of those spurred Falcon to address this post, it's kinda hard to tell which of them it was.

Falcon says Mac will self resolve by D3 and is a wolf if still alive by then. Good look for Mac?

Okay, but what's your stances on the game? Where is your head at? What do you think about your wagon, and why?

I don't think I've seen you post much content I found meaningful and I'd rather see more.

I don't care if folks vote for me, it's happened before and it'll happen again

I can't see any reason to find Epi town

Dunn feels like they're posting EXACTLY the way they described their town meta, so much so it feels scripted

I'm undecided if LC's anger is towny self-righteousness or snared wolf

More talking with Lan. None of this is heavy enough to not just be distancing from Dunn/Epi and can certainly also be him trying to set them up as misyeets. I get nothing from this.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Mac's slot will self-resolve at this point

Either he's alive past D3 cuz he's a wolf, or he's gonna get shot

If my reads suck as bad as Chelsea and Lan say why would I get shot n3?

Sounds like a wolf claim to me.

Do you think Michelle and Neon were NK'd cuz their reads were spot on?

Sick non argument that doesn't apply to me.

Ah, but that's where we disagree, I think it does

Huh. I'm not sure what they're really talking about, here, but it seems like Falcon is implying Michelle and Abi dying points to Mac as a wolf, which is a good look for Mac.

1) Do you have prior experience with Epi and what we should expect from them?
2) Do you think that people are usually honest with regards to self-meta? Also, wouldn't that make it easier for a wolf to just "playbook" their own self-proclaimed meta? Do you have prior experience playing with Dunn that would back up that self-meta claim?
3) LC's anger feels less game-related and more player-related, considering that they want to clobber Sean in real life while almost begging to be yeeted. I don't think that they are related here. What else do you read LC off?

1. Yes, and I find Epi does exactly what he's doing now when he's wolf, passively engages the thread in a way that makes him difficult to read
2. Yes, but w/ varying degrees of accuracy, as it can be difficult for ourselves to actually understand our own meta.
2A. That's exactly my point
2B. No
3. Nothing, I've not skimmed much outside of the aggro stuff

Ya'll should appreciate the efforts I've taken to reformat these Lan/Falcon walls.

This is maybe a good look for Epi. Part of the issue here is that since Falcon doesn't push anybody, it's hard to distinguish shade on townies from distancing on wolves.

Townread:
Michelle
Chelsea
Scotty

Townlean:
Manny
Dunnstral

I added Dunnstral to townleans because I think...whatever he's doing is towny.

What are your actual scum reads? I saw you implore Mac not to vote Chelsea, which is passively giving Mac a TR as well...so who aren't you TRing?

This is a super weird post to make if the team is Falcon/Lime/Chelsea. Less weird if it's Falcon/Chelsea/notLime. Still kinda weird if it's Falcon/Lime/notChelsea.

That looks...reasonable I guess? Would love to see you give a bit deeper of an insight on Lime though; considering that Lime seems to be the main talking point of D2 so far.

Ya know, I might, just cuz' you asked so nice

Sean's early take re: Maf Lime being afraid to engage isn't part of his meta that I'm aware of, so I prodded Lime

His response seems like foreshadowing now re: mods, and looking at his early posting, I'm not seeing any real engagement w/ anyone in a way that suggests he's actually trying to solve

More talking to Lan. More talking about Lime.

I'm good w/ Epi, Dunn, Lime

[VOTE: epi] aubergine

I'm not gonna check the votecount here but by eod, only Manny will be voting Epi and Falcon will be voting Seanzie with Epi and Mac.

And that's basically D2.

D3, Falcon claims his role, claims one day of night results, then nopes the fuck out and gets yeeted.

[Jackofhearts2005]

In summary, Dunn, Lan, Epi and Lime look a little better. Chelsea looks a little worse. Mac basically the same but maybe someone can pull something more useful out of that than me. Not a whole lot to this iso.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I think Creature’s a bad vote today. I’m going to run with the assumption that he’s Mr House until I come up with a good reason to the contrary. Wolf team probably Chelsea / Jack. Very low confidence. Maybe Chelsea / Epi but I don’t think Falcon shuts up yesterday with that team. Manny possible. That’s where I’m at right now

[TonyStarkPrime]

Now are we in a game state where we can play chicken with the wolves and make them 3P hunt? IDK

[LanMisa]

Bad news: My dad has a... some kind of lung infection and since early today I also started coughing.

There's no good news here unfortunately.

[LanMisa]

@LanMisa

who do u think is more likely a wolf between mac and chelsea?

Gun to head right now I like Mac more than Chelsea, but I assume this was in response to the two runaway wagons that dissolved by now so this may not have as much relevancy right now.

[LanMisa]

I don't quite understand this train of thought and please don't lose focus, Manny, we really don't have much wiggle room here.

Yeeting Mac is easier than yeeting Chels in this gamestate therefore if i want to avoid risks in order i just kill chelsea first and Mac tomorrow.
In the world of w!Mac i can just sit and do nothing though which is why this day is annoying and i just wanna kill the obvious 3p epi, and incase they dont flip 3p they prolly flip wolf which is also good.

I think Epi is much more of a coin flip and I presently think he's very unlikely mafia because of his vote positioning at eod1.

When mafia are under no threat they usually don't end the day voting side by side on a town c/w. It's just a probability pattern. Obviously I've seen it happen but it's very >rand likely unpairing for him and Falcon to be voting together on Seanzie with me as two wolves.

The other wolves are likely spread across wagons.

Epi is also just far more in his townrange with this play than someone else would be. He's de facto retired from mafia and just plays for keks more or less.

Do you mean "side by side" in terms of "after each other" or in terms of a more general "two wolves on the same wagon"?

Also, I feel like the poll thing doesn't tell you who voted for whom when, or at least it looked to me earlier as if the order of people displayed was random.

[LanMisa]

I kinda wanna say that it would be easier to get votes on epi if epi was villa but i dont know how much i believe that

Epi's "issue" is that everyone has Epi as a complete null which helps not getting voted over people we perceive as bigger threats.

...Then again, being completely neutral is a position for wolves to thrive in; nobody wonders why they keep surviving, nobody actively tries to gun them down either.

Epi also doesn't seem to have any agenda (or goal) though, so... if Epi's a wolf Epi's quite good at surviving but rather ineffective in spreading the wolf agenda

If we don't have any better idea by EOD I would not be opposed to an Epi yeet but I stand with Mac that Epi's a complete null where them flipping town wouldn't shock me.

[LanMisa]

My n1s if you and Brad were town would have been you and Brad. I absolutely assure you of this. I'd have overruled anyone trying to kill Abi and Michelle and laughed at them. You're both dead n1 if I'm mafia.

Do you think I am just hard snowing Brad because I "know how to pocket him?" I'm not saying I've sat here and had a perfect read record I would've been pushing Scotty if they were alive I'm still shocked they were town tbh.

But I don't get how you can come into today, see everything going on and vote me when the Scotty NK points to like, exactly Jack/Dunn

Okay, I don't get the orange bit. How does a Scotty kill imply either one of them? The way I see it Scotty was widely townread if you ignore your own perspective for a second, and Scotty also had softed PR yesterday via his "there may be more PRs in the game" post.

[Manny]

these wagons are a mess and i have no clue who do i actually wanna kill

[LanMisa]

...Yeah, I am officially not feeling great.

[Manny]

the bad part is that tomorrow will also be a pain in the ass because i wont be able to procrastinate solving mac vs chelsea another day

[Manny]

[VOTE: Chelsea] aubergine

migth change my mind later

[LanMisa]

I can't vote TSP really. He's been siding with me too much and with my placement I can't afford to nuke an ally.

If TSP is a wolf (and I still think that he could be) then you voting him out would massively improve your standing and more or less clear you though? I don't quite understand that take.

[LanMisa]

Yeah, I feel like my mind is starting to become sluggish, I think I may be getting fever-ish.

Manny, I think I will need you to decide at some point and I will follow your vote unless it completely contradicts mine. I don't know if I will be able to make a coherent enough thought in a few hours, I already feel like becoming dumber by the second.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I can't vote TSP really. He's been siding with me too much and with my placement I can't afford to nuke an ally.

If TSP is a wolf (and I still think that he could be) then you voting him out would massively improve your standing and more or less clear you though? I don't quite understand that take.

yeah but tsp’s not a wolf

[Jackofhearts2005]

Bad news: My dad has a... some kind of lung infection and since early today I also started coughing.

There's no good news here unfortunately.

Ugh. Sorry, Lan.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Just realized Scotty knocked me out of the top 15 all time poasters at some point in the last year. I guess I need to play more mafia. Sorry Juliets but TSP needs cred

[TonyStarkPrime]

and no let no one state that the fact that TSP is enjoying playing mafia mean he's a wolf

even if it's usually a good read

[Manny]

Manny, I think I will need you to decide at some point and I will follow your vote unless it completely contradicts mine. I don't know if I will be able to make a coherent enough thought in a few hours, I already feel like becoming dumber by the second.

notlikethis i dont want RESPONSABILITY it makes me wanna play it safe and just kill the perma-null slot that is Epi
instead of doing productive stuff like resolving mac/chelsea.

It also doesnt help that Brad and Creature are doing -1 and thats prolly rand!w for both but i doubt both of them are wolves and i wouldnt be shocked if for some god forsaken reason both were town.
Also Mac stopped giving a fuck about solving and doing stuff this day the second his wagon disappeared which makes me want him dead too zzzz

I kinda wanna kill Chelsea and if she flips town just yeet Mac/TSP/Jack in that order but that doesnt work if this is mylo.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Manny, I think I will need you to decide at some point and I will follow your vote unless it completely contradicts mine. I don't know if I will be able to make a coherent enough thought in a few hours, I already feel like becoming dumber by the second.

notlikethis i dont want RESPONSABILITY it makes me wanna play it safe and just kill the perma-null slot that is Epi
instead of doing productive stuff like resolving mac/chelsea.

It also doesnt help that Brad and Creature are doing -1 and thats prolly rand!w for both but i doubt both of them are wolves and i wouldnt be shocked if for some god forsaken reason both were town.
Also Mac stopped giving a fuck about solving and doing stuff this day the second his wagon disappeared which makes me want him dead too zzzz

I kinda wanna kill Chelsea and if she flips town just yeet Mac/TSP/Jack in that order but that doesnt work if this is mylo.

seems bad

but yeah concerned about mac for the reasons presented here

[TonyStarkPrime]

I mean I'm always concerned about mac beczuse mac has said a lot of things in the past 3.5 years to indicate that he is supremely confident in his ability to snow particularly me and my pride doesn't like getting snowed

[LanMisa]

Manny, I think I will need you to decide at some point and I will follow your vote unless it completely contradicts mine. I don't know if I will be able to make a coherent enough thought in a few hours, I already feel like becoming dumber by the second.

notlikethis i dont want RESPONSABILITY it makes me wanna play it safe and just kill the perma-null slot that is Epi
instead of doing productive stuff like resolving mac/chelsea.

It also doesnt help that Brad and Creature are doing -1 and thats prolly rand!w for both but i doubt both of them are wolves and i wouldnt be shocked if for some god forsaken reason both were town.
Also Mac stopped giving a fuck about solving and doing stuff this day the second his wagon disappeared which makes me want him dead too zzzz

I kinda wanna kill Chelsea and if she flips town just yeet Mac/TSP/Jack in that order but that doesnt work if this is mylo.

My apologies, but I didn't ask to be sick, and with school starting next week it's about the worst possible timing.

I could see Lime, I still don't see Creature as a potential Falcon partner.

I think I lined it out earlier but the worst possible scenario for tomorrow is a 3/3/1 scenario, best possible one would be 6/1/1 or 6/2/0. This setup is weird.

[Manny]

I think I lined it out earlier but the worst possible scenario for tomorrow is a 3/3/1 scenario, best possible one would be 6/1/1 or 6/2/0. This setup is weird.

isnt best scenario actually 5-2-1
there's two 3p's guaranteed afaik
miss-exe means uh 4-2-1 and then nk makes it 3-2-1 which is not game over but

[LanMisa]

I think I lined it out earlier but the worst possible scenario for tomorrow is a 3/3/1 scenario, best possible one would be 6/1/1 or 6/2/0. This setup is weird.

isnt best scenario actually 5-2-1
there's two 3p's guaranteed afaik
miss-exe means uh 4-2-1 and then nk makes it 3-2-1 which is not game over but

We still don't know if there's three or four Mafia. Not even sure what the correct balance would be here, but assuming that both 3P are by nature anti-town (and not just by choice) then I guess that a 13v3v2 may be more reasonable than a 12v4v2.

Then again I have never played here so what do I know about Syndicate setups?

Regardless, best case would be a 3P/Mafia elim in a three Mafia world, worst case a miselim in a four Mafia world, and we could land anywhere between which makes strategizing around it hard.

I also feel like I talk too much about mechanics rather than the game but I am still feeling pretty poor and don't have the power to backread or ISO much.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The correct balance is 3 wolves and you hope the sk doesn't cross-shoot them. Or 4 wolves and you hope he does. wowee

Would love some somebody to weigh in on my work on Falcon. I know it's not a ton to go on but I bothered to do it so it's important for my self esteem to not let it go to waste.

[MacDougall]

I don't quite understand this train of thought and please don't lose focus, Manny, we really don't have much wiggle room here.

Yeeting Mac is easier than yeeting Chels in this gamestate therefore if i want to avoid risks in order i just kill chelsea first and Mac tomorrow.
In the world of w!Mac i can just sit and do nothing though which is why this day is annoying and i just wanna kill the obvious 3p epi, and incase they dont flip 3p they prolly flip wolf which is also good.

I think Epi is much more of a coin flip and I presently think he's very unlikely mafia because of his vote positioning at eod1.

When mafia are under no threat they usually don't end the day voting side by side on a town c/w. It's just a probability pattern. Obviously I've seen it happen but it's very >rand likely unpairing for him and Falcon to be voting together on Seanzie with me as two wolves.

The other wolves are likely spread across wagons.

Epi is also just far more in his townrange with this play than someone else would be. He's de facto retired from mafia and just plays for keks more or less.

Do you mean "side by side" in terms of "after each other" or in terms of a more general "two wolves on the same wagon"?

Also, I feel like the poll thing doesn't tell you who voted for whom when, or at least it looked to me earlier as if the order of people displayed was random.

The latter. By end of day, especially when its a day that's resolved to be demonstrated as wolves being under no pressure, the default pattern is mafia spreading their votes out and not stacking. Especially for Falcon and Epi who really did not have any pressure to put their vote anywhere logical, so they could have just realistically voted wherever they pleased.

[MacDougall]

I can't vote TSP really. He's been siding with me too much and with my placement I can't afford to nuke an ally.

If TSP is a wolf (and I still think that he could be) then you voting him out would massively improve your standing and more or less clear you though? I don't quite understand that take.

There's no voting him out and improving my standing if voting him gets me killed lan.

[MacDougall]

Manny, I think I will need you to decide at some point and I will follow your vote unless it completely contradicts mine. I don't know if I will be able to make a coherent enough thought in a few hours, I already feel like becoming dumber by the second.

notlikethis i dont want RESPONSABILITY it makes me wanna play it safe and just kill the perma-null slot that is Epi
instead of doing productive stuff like resolving mac/chelsea.

It also doesnt help that Brad and Creature are doing -1 and thats prolly rand!w for both but i doubt both of them are wolves and i wouldnt be shocked if for some god forsaken reason both were town.
Also Mac stopped giving a fuck about solving and doing stuff this day the second his wagon disappeared which makes me want him dead too zzzz

I kinda wanna kill Chelsea and if she flips town just yeet Mac/TSP/Jack in that order but that doesnt work if this is mylo.

That's not really a fair take. I had said my piece and my piece got the votes off me. I was going to slow down my posting regardless of whether the votes came off because I'm nearly out of posts and also I only just woke up so what are you actually expecting me to do, post all night long just for the sake of it? Unreasonable as fuck take you fuck.

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Creature] aubergine

@Creature from my vantage you can't really be town simply on meta. You have curved and fallen away as is your mafia meta and never really have sounded like town Creature. If you are town I would suspect Chelsea's read on you has to come from TMI because it doesn't make any sense to me that someone actually familiar with you could have you town unwaveringly like she has.

[Manny]

That's not really a fair take. I had said my piece and my piece got the votes off me. I was going to slow down my posting regardless of whether the votes came off because I'm nearly out of posts and also I only just woke up so what are you actually expecting me to do, post all night long just for the sake of it? Unreasonable as fuck take you fuck.

I know its unfair to you but i also dont care much cuz my brain is too busy HEDGING to actually try to kill u today.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: Creature] aubergine

@Creature from my vantage you can't really be town simply on meta. You have curved and fallen away as is your mafia meta and never really have sounded like town Creature. If you are town I would suspect Chelsea's read on you has to come from TMI because it doesn't make any sense to me that someone actually familiar with you could have you town unwaveringly like she has.

Or...Creature 3P and Chelsea has "tmi" that Creature is not wolf so has been "townreading" him.

Creature flipping 3P would be a worse look for Chelsea than Creature flipping town cause mafia can't have real tmi on townies atp.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Creature is town -> Chelsea has tmi, Chelsea wolf
Creature is wolf -> Chelsea is defending her teammate, Chelsea wolf
Creature is 3P -> Chelsea acted as if she had tmi but forgot there were 3Ps, Chelsea wolf

I am very good at mafia.

Spoiler: show

But seriously, I don't believe in the first one and I do believe in the last one and idk about the middle one.

[Creature]

[VOTE: Creature] aubergine

@Creature from my vantage you can't really be town simply on meta. You have curved and fallen away as is your mafia meta and never really have sounded like town Creature. If you are town I would suspect Chelsea's read on you has to come from TMI because it doesn't make any sense to me that someone actually familiar with you could have you town unwaveringly like she has.

Me being LHF isn't necessarily wolf indicative because I had a lot of LHF town games

Usually me being LHF just means I am busy (though I might intentionally refuse to post if I am wagoned, especially as wolf)

There should be a clear difference between my LHF town and LHF wolf games

I think what Chelsea is pointing is that it's kinda ballsy for wolf!me to place a vote on you (regardless of your alignment)

Other than that it seems Chelsea is townreading me for pushing someone she wolfreads (you)

[Creature]

I am not really townreading Chelsea here

I guess I was mostly sheeping BK's read on Chelsea but it's fairly weak and I could see their townread on me as pocketing

I just think Mac is wolfier for mostly pushing players I townread (Lime Coke, Manny, me)

[MacDougall]

I am not really townreading Chelsea here

I guess I was mostly sheeping BK's read on Chelsea but it's fairly weak and I could see their townread on me as pocketing

I just think Mac is wolfier for mostly pushing players I townread (Lime Coke, Manny, me)

More blood for the Chelsea/Mac difference check God then I suppose.

Creature I think this is a very lazy assessment of me and you are usually far more anxious about suspecting me than this. If I am simply wolfy for pushing people you townread, I can point at a million games in which I pushed townies and probably 10 you were in. This isn't a good enough argument to offset the Falcon anti-alignment, fact that none of the kills make sense for me and just generally how attractive I am.

[Creature]

I am not really townreading Chelsea here

I guess I was mostly sheeping BK's read on Chelsea but it's fairly weak and I could see their townread on me as pocketing

I just think Mac is wolfier for mostly pushing players I townread (Lime Coke, Manny, me)

More blood for the Chelsea/Mac difference check God then I suppose.

Creature I think this is a very lazy assessment of me and you are usually far more anxious about suspecting me than this. If I am simply wolfy for pushing people you townread, I can point at a million games in which I pushed townies and probably 10 you were in. This isn't a good enough argument to offset the Falcon anti-alignment, fact that none of the kills make sense for me and just generally how attractive I am.

I am alright with the difference check on you/Chelsea

[Creature]

Who would be a wolf with Chelsea? Because I am not seeing Lime Cole and Manny being wolves unless I am missing something about them

[Manny]

Who would be a wolf with Chelsea? Because I am not seeing Lime Cole and Manny being wolves unless I am missing something about them

Brad and Epi work as partners for Chelsea

granted i think if chelsea's a wolf u are more likely her partner but

[Manny]

I am very good at mafia.

It sounds like u should be voting Chelsea.

it'd be funny if i lose the game yeeting the person i invited to play with me ngl

[TonyStarkPrime]

the game of mafia ladies and gentlemen

[MacDougall]

Who would be a wolf with Chelsea? Because I am not seeing Lime Cole and Manny being wolves unless I am missing something about them

How are you townreading Brad here?

[TonyStarkPrime]

I gotta do sports bets here and then take a nap and then go to a movie theatre so I will not really be around but I will place a bet at some point

[TonyStarkPrime]

Wait vote