Fiddler on the Roof Mafia

[Sloonei]

@y'all: what do you think of LoRab right now?

Lukewarm suspicion. What's her biggest offense?

Our exchange began with her stating a gripe against the nutella bandwagon. I asked her to investigate it. She did. The reads she produced were that Epignosis was suspicious regardless of how he looked in the nutella wagon, and that speedchuck was suspicious simply for being there and for dipping his toes in a lot of bandwagons. She made absolutely no comment on you, despite you also throwing your vote all over the place like speedchuck. I don't buy that these are sincere suspicions.

[Long Con]

I don't think it's prudent with limited time remaining to compile a huge, thorough LC ISO -- I'm not even sure I can finish it in time. Cliff notes:

~ Epignosis and I were fiercely antagonistic with each other for nearly all of Day 1. We ate up a lot of thread content with that combat, and left all other observers scratching their heads trying to parse apart the motives. If there's anyone alive who should keenly understand what scenario and be able to provide insight on it, it's the other guy who has so frequently found himself in the same position against Epignosis.

What insight did he provide? Fuck all. He made a few isolated comments about it, but never anything of substance. To check yourself, click here and CTRL+F for Epi or 3J/Jay/JJJ

What do you expect me to do about it? What success do I ever have with it, ever? What makes you think I was remotely interested in diving into that crap? I was absolutely avoiding it as much as possible.

~ FZ. gave him crap for "asking clarification questions". LC's immediate response was to accuse her of inventing that notion. I don't see many avenues for that to be a neutral or better comment from LC to FZ -- it's a suspicion. This turned into a somewhat hostile exchange, and LC continues to assert that FZ is making shit up, or at least "making unfounded claims", and challenges her for proof. At no point does LC voice a clear read on FZ in light of this debate -- his commentary carries discrediting weight but does not probe his accuser to learn more about her (trendy new accusation ). This smells of CFTWR (caught for the wrong reasons).

This sounds like, because I didn't OMGUS, I'm bad.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@y'all: what do you think of LoRab right now?

Lukewarm suspicion. What's her biggest offense?

Our exchange began with her stating a gripe against the nutella bandwagon. I asked her to investigate it. She did. The reads she produced were that Epignosis was suspicious regardless of how he looked in the nutella wagon, and that speedchuck was suspicious simply for being there and for dipping his toes in a lot of bandwagons. She made absolutely no comment on you, despite you also throwing your vote all over the place like speedchuck. I don't buy that these are sincere suspicions.

Tell me about Long Con quickly.

[nutella]

Jay, I like your thoughts on LC. I'll vote for him. If you're wrong I'll lynch you next.

nutella, tell me about this nasty post.

I wrote it. You think it's nasty because you think it's me preemptively blaming you for a mislynch and not taking responsibility for my vote. That was not implied. I am choosing my own votes and changing my mind on them a lot. I meant that if we lynched LC and he flipped civ I would try you next.

[Spacedaisy]

I moved to nutella for the moment, I'm not 100% certain I want to stay there but my gut just got thrown for a loop and her moving to Jay is concerning to me.

[Long Con]

[mention]Kylemii[/mention]

You shouldn't vote me because the case against me is that I didn't give special insight into the JJJ/Epi fight, and that I asked Epi to clarify "hedging", and that I didn't accuse FZ when she accused me.

I'm not bad and these reasons are not enough to kill me over.

[speedchuck]

Jay, I like your thoughts on LC. I'll vote for him. If you're wrong I'll lynch you next.

nutella, tell me about this nasty post.

I wrote it. You think it's nasty because you think it's me preemptively blaming you for a mislynch and not taking responsibility for my vote. That was not implied. I am choosing my own votes and changing my mind on them a lot. I meant that if we lynched LC and he flipped civ I would try you next.

But if you LIKE his thoughts, why does the flip make you want to kill him? "Good points, but they're invalid so you dies." ?>??

[Sloonei]

@y'all: what do you think of LoRab right now?

Lukewarm suspicion. What's her biggest offense?

Our exchange began with her stating a gripe against the nutella bandwagon. I asked her to investigate it. She did. The reads she produced were that Epignosis was suspicious regardless of how he looked in the nutella wagon, and that speedchuck was suspicious simply for being there and for dipping his toes in a lot of bandwagons. She made absolutely no comment on you, despite you also throwing your vote all over the place like speedchuck. I don't buy that these are sincere suspicions.

Tell me about Long Con quickly.

I don't have a firm grasp on his play in this game. I simply haven't spent much time looking at him, and it would be unproductive to try to get into that now. I see your gripes but they do not resonate strongly with me because I lack any foundation with which to approach LC right now. That being the case, it seems unlikely that I'd vote for him today unless it's just a blind hail mary.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

What do you expect me to do about it? What success do I ever have with it, ever? What makes you think I was remotely interested in diving into that crap? I was absolutely avoiding it as much as possible.

At the very least I'd expect to know in clearer terms how you read the two players involved.

This sounds like, because I didn't OMGUS, I'm bad.

In a way you did OMGUS -- you told her she was inventing her accusation, which is itself an accusation. You didn't pursue that at all though, and in that exchange your role was purely responsive. I'm not telling you that you were supposed to suspect her, I'm telling you that you were supposed to give a damn about the motives of your own accuser. I saw no evidence that you did.

[Sloonei]

I moved to nutella for the moment, I'm not 100% certain I want to stay there but my gut just got thrown for a loop and her moving to Jay is concerning to me.

I recommend looking at LoRab quickly if you have time.

[LoRab]

@y'all: what do you think of LoRab right now?

Lukewarm suspicion. What's her biggest offense?

Our exchange began with her stating a gripe against the nutella bandwagon. I asked her to investigate it. She did. The reads she produced were that Epignosis was suspicious regardless of how he looked in the nutella wagon, and that speedchuck was suspicious simply for being there and for dipping his toes in a lot of bandwagons. She made absolutely no comment on you, despite you also throwing your vote all over the place like speedchuck. I don't buy that these are sincere suspicions.

That's an interesting way to read what I said. Epi started the bandwagon. Speedchuk jumped onto it, as he did with Kyle and as he did with Daisy. he did so wholeheartedly in all cases. J's moving his vote was different, and more pointed. In addition, he wasn't clear when he voted for LA, and also make some posts defending her, so his place in that bandwagon was much more ambiguous, hence my not having a conclusion about it. My suspicions are sincere, even if your logic doesn't match with mine.

[nutella]

I'm not at all confident about anything anymore. Moved back to lorab

[Kylemii]

I moved to nutella for the moment, I'm not 100% certain I want to stay there but my gut just got thrown for a loop and her moving to Jay is concerning to me.

I recommend looking at LoRab quickly if you have time.

Tell me about lorab

[JaggedJimmyJay]

6-7 minutes

[Sloonei]

I moved to nutella for the moment, I'm not 100% certain I want to stay there but my gut just got thrown for a loop and her moving to Jay is concerning to me.

I recommend looking at LoRab quickly if you have time.

Tell me about lorab

click

[LoRab]

How do you read me, LoRab?

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

why?
Do you have anything to say at all about Epi's play on Day 2?

Like I said--it's gut. Gut, to me, says there isn't a real reason, just a general feeling.

I don't have much to say on Epi's play Day 2. It has felt fairly neutral to me.

Do you have any other reads to share?

Not particularly. I have other players I feel are probably civ, but no reason to point them out. If I had other reads on players I think are bad, I'd have stated them by now.

Do you care to say why you think I'm bad, other than the fact that you disagree with the reasons I suspect people?

when did I tell you whether or not I agree with your reasons for suspecting people?

I think you're bad because the reads you've shared with me right now have not felt very thorough or convincing. Your read of Epi, the strongest one you possess in the game, is based on something vague that you can't identify in anything he's done this day phase. Your case against speedchuck is that he moves his vote around too much in a game with changeable votes. You only offered a "gut" civ read on me when I pressed you for it. And the read which started off this suspicion, your read of nutella, is similarly week. we started by talking about how that bandwagon was suspicious, and you ended by saying that speedchuck's involvement was suspicious because it was suspicious, and that Epi is suspicious regardless of whether or not he was involved. You didn't offer a comment on Jay, just brushed him off. You gave an (understandable) shrug to wilgy.

It's been a long time since I played a game with you, but I remember the strong town LoRab from Mad Max. I don't see her here.

That is how I make suspicions--I literally explained my thought process. So, yeah, you don't agree with my reasons, which you elaborate here. Yes, they are somewhat vague, because they are based on general reads of people. Also, I've done some major read ups of a dozen or so pages, more than once, which makes it hard to make big linky cases on people. At least for me.

As for your other points, I didn't offer a comment on JJJ because I have a mainly civ feeling about him, and his posts in the LA piece were ambiguous. And, it's not that speedchuck changes his vote a lot--it's that every time he changes it, it's to jump on a bandwagon.

Mad Max was a while ago, but it's likely that I was as ambiguous in my thoughts on day 2 as I am here, because that's how my suspicions usually work, except when there's a post that sticks out as wonky, which hasn't happened here.

So, yeah, I am really seeing it as you don't agree with my reasons.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@Kylemii

You shouldn't vote me because the case against me is that I didn't give special insight into the JJJ/Epi fight, and that I asked Epi to clarify "hedging", and that I didn't accuse FZ when she accused me.

I'm not bad and these reasons are not enough to kill me over.

This is not the case.

[Sloonei]

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

why?
Do you have anything to say at all about Epi's play on Day 2?

Like I said--it's gut. Gut, to me, says there isn't a real reason, just a general feeling.

I don't have much to say on Epi's play Day 2. It has felt fairly neutral to me.

Do you have any other reads to share?

Not particularly. I have other players I feel are probably civ, but no reason to point them out. If I had other reads on players I think are bad, I'd have stated them by now.

Do you care to say why you think I'm bad, other than the fact that you disagree with the reasons I suspect people?

when did I tell you whether or not I agree with your reasons for suspecting people?

I think you're bad because the reads you've shared with me right now have not felt very thorough or convincing. Your read of Epi, the strongest one you possess in the game, is based on something vague that you can't identify in anything he's done this day phase. Your case against speedchuck is that he moves his vote around too much in a game with changeable votes. You only offered a "gut" civ read on me when I pressed you for it. And the read which started off this suspicion, your read of nutella, is similarly week. we started by talking about how that bandwagon was suspicious, and you ended by saying that speedchuck's involvement was suspicious because it was suspicious, and that Epi is suspicious regardless of whether or not he was involved. You didn't offer a comment on Jay, just brushed him off. You gave an (understandable) shrug to wilgy.

It's been a long time since I played a game with you, but I remember the strong town LoRab from Mad Max. I don't see her here.

That is how I make suspicions--I literally explained my thought process. So, yeah, you don't agree with my reasons, which you elaborate here. Yes, they are somewhat vague, because they are based on general reads of people. Also, I've done some major read ups of a dozen or so pages, more than once, which makes it hard to make big linky cases on people. At least for me.

As for your other points, I didn't offer a comment on JJJ because I have a mainly civ feeling about him, and his posts in the LA piece were ambiguous. And, it's not that speedchuck changes his vote a lot--it's that every time he changes it, it's to jump on a bandwagon.

Mad Max was a while ago, but it's likely that I was as ambiguous in my thoughts on day 2 as I am here, because that's how my suspicions usually work, except when there's a post that sticks out as wonky, which hasn't happened here.

So, yeah, I am really seeing it as you don't agree with my reasons.

It's more that I don't see evidence of your reasons. In theory I could get behind them. In this moment, I'm not sure I believe you believe them.

[Long Con]

What do you expect me to do about it? What success do I ever have with it, ever? What makes you think I was remotely interested in diving into that crap? I was absolutely avoiding it as much as possible.

At the very least I'd expect to know in clearer terms how you read the two players involved.

I was clear. I gave you insight into Epi's use of bizarro logic. I don't read him as bad for it because I have seen it enough when he's Civ. I told you all that.

This sounds like, because I didn't OMGUS, I'm bad.

In a way you did OMGUS -- you told her she was inventing her accusation, which is itself an accusation. You didn't pursue that at all though, and in that exchange your role was purely responsive. I'm not telling you that you were supposed to suspect her, I'm telling you that you were supposed to give a damn about the motives of your own accuser. I saw no evidence that you did.

A lot of people like to act like they know how I play, and they go on about what Civvie LC and baddie LC like to do. Here's an actual nugget of truth: when I'm accused, I ignore it as much as I can. I engaged FZ on it a topic that actually started in the Mortal Kombat game, and is an ongoing issue.

[speedchuck]

I'm tying up LoRab and LC

If it stays tied, the rabbi decides

[Kylemii]

Elplz eevator pitch me on lorab vrs locon go

[Epignosis]

It isn't bizarro logic.

[Sloonei]

Epi is my least favorite option in the three-way tie right now. I'm firmly in the LoRab camp.
which bums me out personally because I was stoked to play this game with her. But, here we are.

[Epignosis]

I'm tying up LoRab and LC

If it stays tied, the rabbi decides

False.

[Sloonei]

Elplz eevator pitch me on lorab vrs locon go

Kyle is too drunk.

[Long Con]

Voting Lorab to save myself.

[speedchuck]

I'm tying up LoRab and LC

If it stays tied, the rabbi decides

False.

Which part?

[Epignosis]

Voting Lorab to save myself.

You voted me first.

[Sloonei]

I don't hate the idea of a tie as much as I usually would given that we have a town role that decides these things. That's a sweet role.

[Kylemii]

voted daisy to preserve the tie, I'm okay with letting the rabbi choose

[Epignosis]

I'm tying up LoRab and LC

If it stays tied, the rabbi decides

False.

Which part?

Well, it's back to being true.

[Epignosis]

And now false again.

[LoRab]

Epi is my least favorite option in the three-way tie right now. I'm firmly in the LoRab camp.
which bums me out personally because I was stoked to play this game with her. But, here we are.

Maybe some day you'll accept that my logic is my logic, and I don't change it for other people. And that that really is the crux of your case.

[Long Con]

Voting Lorab to save myself.

You voted me first.

Yeah, I had an old poll up. Sorry.

[speedchuck]

Elplz eevator pitch me on lorab vrs locon go

Kyle is too drunk.

I agree, and it feels out of character for Kyle to get drunk in the middle of a crucial lynch.
I may not know anything, and I don't like bringing RL stuff into games, but come on man save the drunk posting for the night phases.

Kyle doesn't have culpability for tonight. Or maybe he just wanted to drink. I don't know what that's like.

[nutella]

I'm tying up LoRab and LC

If it stays tied, the rabbi decides

Wouldn't it be funny if--

[Sloonei]

Epi is my least favorite option in the three-way tie right now. I'm firmly in the LoRab camp.
which bums me out personally because I was stoked to play this game with her. But, here we are.

Maybe some day you'll accept that my logic is my logic, and I don't change it for other people. And that that really is the crux of your case.

I do not object to your logic. I just do not see the steps involved in it.
Apologies if I'm wrong about you and the Rabbi sends you packing. I hope to play with you again soon.

[Epignosis]

Voting Lorab to save myself.

You voted me first.

Yeah, I had an old poll up. Sorry.

Well, I voted for you and got stuck there. I didn't really want to.

[speedchuck]

I'm tying up LoRab and LC

If it stays tied, the rabbi decides

Wouldn't it be funny if--

If I was the rabbi... (and I'm clearly not saying one way or another)... but if I was, I would avoid ties at all cost. I do not want that responsibility. Suck it rabbi. Stress is all yours.

[Long Con]

Voting Lorab to save myself.

You voted me first.

Yeah, I had an old poll up. Sorry.

Well, I voted for you and got stuck there. I didn't really want to.

That's the nicest thing you've ever said to me.

[Epignosis]

Wait a minute wait a minute.



When people in here kept saying "the rabbi chooses," I thought they meant Lorab, meaning she would move her vote.

[nutella]

I thought Kyle said he was going to a concert? Like, you had to go to a wedding during the day phase, and he also had plans. That's a bullshit thing to get upset about

[Kylemii]

Elplz eevator pitch me on lorab vrs locon go

Kyle is too drunk.

maybe so

Elplz eevator pitch me on lorab vrs locon go

Kyle is too drunk.

I agree, and it feels out of character for Kyle to get drunk in the middle of a crucial lynch.
I may not know anything, and I don't like bringing RL stuff into games, but come on man save the drunk posting for the night phases.

Kyle doesn't have culpability for tonight. Or maybe he just wanted to drink. I don't know what that's like.

i didn't schedule the concert sir

[Sloonei]

Kyle's inebriation is mild point in his favor for me. He had to fight and claw his way to coherently express his desire to choose a side. drunk mafia kyle could have just thrown a vote and laughed like a rotten child on an anthill.

[Long Con]

Kyle's inebriation is mild point in his favor for me. He had to fight and claw his way to coherently express his desire to choose a side. drunk mafia kyle could have just thrown a vote and laughed like a rotten child on an anthill.

But he one-offed on Daisy.

[LoRab]

Epi is my least favorite option in the three-way tie right now. I'm firmly in the LoRab camp.
which bums me out personally because I was stoked to play this game with her. But, here we are.

Maybe some day you'll accept that my logic is my logic, and I don't change it for other people. And that that really is the crux of your case.

I do not object to your logic. I just do not see the steps involved in it.
Apologies if I'm wrong about you and the Rabbi sends you packing. I hope to play with you again soon.

It amounts to the same thing. You don't see how the logic makes sense to me. Nothing personal towards you--it's every single game on this site for me. I think through things in my own way, the steps don't make sense to othe people, and people think I'm being disingenuous/suspicious. I'm used to it by now.

[Sloonei]

Kyle's inebriation is mild point in his favor for me. He had to fight and claw his way to coherently express his desire to choose a side. drunk mafia kyle could have just thrown a vote and laughed like a rotten child on an anthill.

But he one-offed on Daisy.

He did it for the Rabbi.

[LoRab]

Wait a minute wait a minute.



When people in here kept saying "the rabbi chooses," I thought they meant Lorab, meaning she would move her vote.

ROTFL

And you used Hebrew correctly earlier!!! So go you!

[Epignosis]

Epi is my least favorite option in the three-way tie right now. I'm firmly in the LoRab camp.
which bums me out personally because I was stoked to play this game with her. But, here we are.

Maybe some day you'll accept that my logic is my logic, and I don't change it for other people. And that that really is the crux of your case.

I do not object to your logic. I just do not see the steps involved in it.
Apologies if I'm wrong about you and the Rabbi sends you packing. I hope to play with you again soon.

It amounts to the same thing. You don't see how the logic makes sense to me. Nothing personal towards you--it's every single game on this site for me. I think through things in my own way, the steps don't make sense to othe people, and people think I'm being disingenuous/suspicious. I'm used to it by now.

I'm pretty sure you and I have something in common now.

[speedchuck]

Kyle's inebriation is mild point in his favor for me. He had to fight and claw his way to coherently express his desire to choose a side. drunk mafia kyle could have just thrown a vote and laughed like a rotten child on an anthill.

No yeah, forgot about the concert. That makes sense.

What are you doing in the mafia game Kyle? You're at a concert.

(Disclaimer: I'm not familiar with drunk posting or drinking. I have never drunk. All I knew is that this is the first time I've seen Kyle doing it, and we were at a critical juncture)