Ancient Greece Mafia [CONQUEST]

[MacDougall]

Having looked back on dunya I see she had suspicions earlier in the day of players I came to suspect later. I am curious about it because my assumption is that a scum dunya would cast dispersions on her teammates to scoop up credit later but at the same time it isn't too dissimilar to why I pushed her incorrect lynch in Mortal Kombat. I give her some town points for this observation.

This just is not true and I loathe that you are bringing down my entire scum meta to it when I have done that exactly twice in my entire mafia playing time. Once in Loneliness and Cheese on RYM (a strategic move on my part), and once in FE (because the whole team decided to buss each other). Saying that scum dunya always busses her teammates is incorrect and I refuse to let that stick on me. I have a reputation to maintain, ok?

He did say he ultimately gave you town points.

This is an interesting self-observation. What exactly do you consider bussing? What would you say your own position on bussing is, generally?

Yeah very strange that she took a post in which I was giving her credit and got angry about it. Doubt a scum would do that right? Scum would just be happy to have gotten the town points and let that one go through to the keeper?

That makes sense.

Golden, GTH, is LC bad?

WORST, this is the worst, seriously you are so bad, Golden already suspects me and voted for me so let's ask the crowd what the purpose of your post here REALLY is

What's the purpose of my post?
Why, I'll share if you ask.
Until recently I had a neutral read on you. Maybe slightly bad, but neutral.
Then you repeated your desire to stay out of the sig/Dom interaction. That's the exact same thing you repeated ad nauseum in GOC about Epi and myself when you were bad.

Enh. Not a tell, more like a true reflections of my feelings based on past experience. I still think you're bad.

Vague. Vague. Vague.
Vague-ity vague.
Refrigerator.

WTF are you haikuing about here?

Golden, GTH, is LC bad?

Yep. Give me a harder one.

In all fairness my flag is a small flag, but my eye is firmly on him.

My eye on him seems to be bothering him a lot, don't you agree?

You know that thing where you accuse people of the thing you are guilty of? What's that called again?

Anyone with suspicion of Colin, pile votes onto him now. I have an idea.

[VOTE: ColinisCool] aubergine

Wow you are definitely bad.

LC wants to stay out of my interactions iwth people unless they involve him. That means I'm bad.

Do you actually literally fish your hand in the toilet to get this stuff out, or do you use some sort of tool?

I quite like that you two are at odds. Keep going.

[MacDougall]

MacDougall care to give me a snap judgment first thought on my scumteam idea before I fall asleep?

Not mac but I dont like you proposing an entire team on d2.

I like it in isolation but it contrasts heavily with what Golden was saying on day 1 about how he plays the game. Perhaps he was bullshitting about his preference to identify town and then POE hmmm? Just saying what he needed to to shake a suspicion?

Remove my PoE and I'm left finding a team amongst about 9 or 10 instead of 21.

I have many methods. Who knows what I'll use at any given point.

PS I could be really mistaken but I really don't think Marmot is bad. All of his posts remind me of good Marmot, and he uses his 'I do not kill Epi on day 1' meta a lot and it has always been true to date... again, you will take this as a grain of salt because a meta is made to be used, but I've been on the inside of a team with Marmot when he explained why he has this view and I don't think it's meta-building... I think it's a genuine rule he self-imposes.

I just checked and I couldn't find the post I thought you made on that subject. Did you actually make one?

Which subject?

The POE thing. I thought you did but I can't find it.

[Golden]

I've made like 200 posts. I probably did. It's true that I like town reading people, I find it effective. With a quick search, I can also find at least three games in which I talk about my adherence to 'theory of the game' as well though. The two methods aren't exclusive.

[MacDougall]

@MacDougall care to give me a snap judgment first thought on my scumteam idea before I fall asleep?

It's pretty much my scumteam too. I feel like Marmot could be distancing Sloonei as a result of my lumping them together.

There are quite a few players reading the scum team similarly and that feels good.

Would be happiest with a Sloonei or Colin lynch today.

What do you think of Wolfo?

Pingy for being new. Easy mislynch target. Why?

[MacDougall]

I've made like 200 posts. I probably did. It's true that I like town reading people, I find it effective. With a quick search, I can also find at least three games in which I talk about my adherence to 'theory of the game' as well though. The two methods aren't exclusive.

I need to know if you did now given you accepted it and chose to explain/defend a post that you may not have even made because if you did I need to digest it.

[MacDougall]

FTR, dunya, I'm just trying to get inside your brain here. I presume you're doing the same with me. I'd like to trust you, but the jury's still out for a little bit here.

Not a fan of the bolded.

Explain.

Dunno why you'd like to trust her. Don't know why you feel the need to say it. Feels like trying to pacify Dunya. Wouldn't you rather distrust her and then lynch her?

You and I solve the game in opposite ways. I hate hunting for scum. I'm awful at it. It stresses me out. I've had plenty of games where I ended with egg on my face because my grand theories about who were bad couldn't possibly be more wrong. In contrast, I feel like I'm halfway decent at establishing a network of solid town reads, reassessingn them, and solving the game via POE. I feel much more comfortable in my hunting for town and mafia when I have a network of other townies solving with me who can give me feedback in real time and vice versa. All of this doubly so in early stages of the game; later on I inevitably get heavily pinged by posts and dogpee all over people, but in Day 1 I try to actively fight my urge to that because my early game accuracy is abysmal.

I was mistaken. This was the post I mistook for you.

I find it odd that you didn't remember you never said what I accused you of. How would you rationalise that if the shoe was on the other foot?

[MacDougall]

Votes are changeable btw guys. You can use your vote to pressure people. Why so few voters?

[colonialbob]

MacDougall care to give me a snap judgment first thought on my scumteam idea before I fall asleep?

Not mac but I dont like you proposing an entire team on d2.

Why? You don't think I can catch an entire team on d2? I've done it before. I've also seen entire scum teams caught on day 1 (I miss manu).

We haven't played a tonne together before, but welcome to What I Do. I believe in 'theory of the game'. A scum read is useless if you look around and realise a person has no team compatablities. Look around and find team-indicative behaviour, and you up your chances of having found something useful.

Don't play the idea, play the specific team I'm proposing and underlying assumptions I'm making.

I've also seen people claim a role that has been established as bad before. Doesn't mean we should play like it's a likely possibility.

I agree with checking to see if suspects are team-compatible but I don't think that type of analysis is very useful until you have mafia reveals and/or endgame scenarios. You're layering assumptions on assumptions, and it feels like building a castle on sand.

Add to that stuff like a mafia deciding to hardcore bus/distance like in FE.

[Golden]

I've made like 200 posts. I probably did. It's true that I like town reading people, I find it effective. With a quick search, I can also find at least three games in which I talk about my adherence to 'theory of the game' as well though. The two methods aren't exclusive.

I need to know if you did now given you accepted it and chose to explain/defend a post that you may not have even made because if you did I need to digest it.

I’m pretty sure there is one. It may not have mentioned PoE, just my penchant for townreading people.

[MacDougall]

I've made like 200 posts. I probably did. It's true that I like town reading people, I find it effective. With a quick search, I can also find at least three games in which I talk about my adherence to 'theory of the game' as well though. The two methods aren't exclusive.

I need to know if you did now given you accepted it and chose to explain/defend a post that you may not have even made because if you did I need to digest it.

I’m pretty sure there is one. It may not have mentioned PoE, just my penchant for townreading people.

Please help me get off this train

[Golden]

MacDougall care to give me a snap judgment first thought on my scumteam idea before I fall asleep?

Not mac but I dont like you proposing an entire team on d2.

Why? You don't think I can catch an entire team on d2? I've done it before. I've also seen entire scum teams caught on day 1 (I miss manu).

We haven't played a tonne together before, but welcome to What I Do. I believe in 'theory of the game'. A scum read is useless if you look around and realise a person has no team compatablities. Look around and find team-indicative behaviour, and you up your chances of having found something useful.

Don't play the idea, play the specific team I'm proposing and underlying assumptions I'm making.

I've also seen people claim a role that has been established as bad before. Doesn't mean we should play like it's a likely possibility.

I agree with checking to see if suspects are team-compatible but I don't think that type of analysis is very useful until you have mafia reveals and/or endgame scenarios. You're layering assumptions on assumptions, and it feels like building a castle on sand.

Add to that stuff like a mafia deciding to hardcore bus/distance like in FE.

There’s zero value in criticising the concept. Criticise the underlying logic instead. It’s naturally full of flaws, but it’s a basis for discussion.

You can tell me what you don’t ‘think’ is useful but I’m telling you you just haven’t experienced it working. It could fall apart like a house of cards but for now it’s job isn’t to be right, it’s to make an informed lynch choice. If it’s right, bonus!

[Golden]

I've made like 200 posts. I probably did. It's true that I like town reading people, I find it effective. With a quick search, I can also find at least three games in which I talk about my adherence to 'theory of the game' as well though. The two methods aren't exclusive.

I need to know if you did now given you accepted it and chose to explain/defend a post that you may not have even made because if you did I need to digest it.

I’m pretty sure there is one. It may not have mentioned PoE, just my penchant for townreading people.

Please help me get off this train

I cannot. It is well past my bedtime and that could take a while.

[Long Con]

I quite like that you two are at odds. Keep going.

I'm sure it will happen regardless of what you, I, or Dom like.

[Long Con]

I've made like 200 posts. I probably did. It's true that I like town reading people, I find it effective. With a quick search, I can also find at least three games in which I talk about my adherence to 'theory of the game' as well though. The two methods aren't exclusive.

I need to know if you did now given you accepted it and chose to explain/defend a post that you may not have even made because if you did I need to digest it.

I’m pretty sure there is one. It may not have mentioned PoE, just my penchant for townreading people.

I don't recall any POE talk form you yet.

[Golden]

Dunya, the thing you miss is I don't care about 'credit'. If someone is asking me to respond in a way that will give me 'credit', I can manipulate that easily. You shouldn't give me credit ever for anything that gets 'credit'. I knew the impact of giving you the run around, I chose to do it anyway, because I didn't want your read of me to be surface deep. Put it this way, I am playing the long game. I'm more interested in being myself and allowing you the chance to learn who I am and how I plan than I am in the idea of giving you want you want in the moment.

So the fact I don't get any credit for answering your thing two hours later is far preferable to me.

And I don't have 'one way' of playing but I do like PoE. But mostly I just call whatever I see. For you to say I don't have many reads after you've responded to a list in which I gave about ten (and then not engaged in my response to your following point), I don't love that aspect of your so much.

Here it is. I did it for you. Page 3 of my iso.

[MacDougall]

Ok. Ok. I got u.

Naw that post is great because it even has the same point you made just now.

[Long Con]

Ok, so POE me to your Civ column and this game will be healthier.

[Golden]

Ok, so POE me to your Civ column and this game will be healthier.

Let’s say I replaced you with another person. What do you think of my proposed team?

[Long Con]

Not really sold on Colin, I think he will end up being lynched and a Civ. A lot of that is based on my dubiousness around the broad assault on him for things I don't really see as baddie-indicative.

Lunalee, maybe. I have no real issue with her being bad.

Sloonei... Mac seems to be on fire this game, and have a really solid footing from which to judge people, so his case on Sloonei is probably really good. I could follow a Sloonei vote. He also wants people to vote for Colin, but I am not sure what his endgame is there.

[Dom]

I quite like that you two are at odds. Keep going.

I'm sure it will happen regardless of what you, I, or Dom like.

Personal attacks don't look good on you.

[Dom]

LC has flipped out because I have a moderate bad read of him. He has said my interaction with Marmot "looked bad". No details given. He said my vote for Collin, someone at the bottom of my read list looks bad. No details given.

[Tangrowth]

I will finish catching up now, full stop, but after I do and drop a giant rainbow reads post, I'll have to vanish again. I'll make sure to schedule time tonight and tomorrow night close to the deadline to interact with you all.

[Long Con]

I quite like that you two are at odds. Keep going.

I'm sure it will happen regardless of what you, I, or Dom like.

Personal attacks don't look good on you.

??? Have a good trip, let me know when you get back to reality.

[Tangrowth]

And Mac if you’d been here I would have joined you in pushing the thread in another direction. I regret that MP had to leave just when he did. I was trying to catch up and never fully engaged with him in real time, that could have lead to better results.

Ugh, I just have to respond to this. I feel like a giant egghead for the sig mislynch. I officially can't read the guy, and I should have trusted my earlier self that was townreading him, because I got caught up in the moment and really thought he was the best option we had available. It was pretty difficult to develop any counterwagon at the time, but I regret my actions; I should have just stuck with Luna or went somewhere else I guess.

[Tangrowth]

I see Luna as quite town at this point and I’m willing to trust speedchuck on tone. I’ll do a rainbow list when I get a minute.

I am taking into consideration what speedchuck had to say about her as well. I think I'm leaving her alone for today in the interest of pursuing other players, but we'll see.

[Tangrowth]

Mac, your Sloonei case is quite excellent. I was starting to get a feeling from him myself similar to the one you described as him "playing a game of whispers". Well said. He's very timid this game and that gives me some serious pause. I'll mull over it some more, but it'd be nice to see more from Sloonei in general, but specifically in response to some of the points you made re: sig and such.

I do have a question for you though, [mention]MacDougall[/mention]: What for you differentiates the way Sloonei flipped on his perspective of sig from someone else like me? You say I can't be a compatible teammate of Sloonei, so can you expand on that perspective?

Despite the strength of the case (in my opinion), in seeing Sloonei has some votes already, I think it's important that we don't fail to pressure as many players as possible this phase nonetheless.

[colonialbob]

And Mac if you’d been here I would have joined you in pushing the thread in another direction. I regret that MP had to leave just when he did. I was trying to catch up and never fully engaged with him in real time, that could have lead to better results.

Ugh, I just have to respond to this. I feel like a giant egghead for the sig mislynch. I officially can't read the guy, and I should have trusted my earlier self that was townreading him, because I got caught up in the moment and really thought he was the best option we had available. It was pretty difficult to develop any counterwagon at the time, but I regret my actions; I should have just stuck with Luna or went somewhere else I guess.

Ew.

[VOTE: M+7] aubergine

[Tangrowth]

Oh, I see Sloonei responded. I'll have to mull over this, but the first thing I noticed is the use of strong language in it, which I think is atypical for Sloonei. I've seen Sloonei curse less than most of the players on this site.

[Tangrowth]

And Mac if you’d been here I would have joined you in pushing the thread in another direction. I regret that MP had to leave just when he did. I was trying to catch up and never fully engaged with him in real time, that could have lead to better results.

Ugh, I just have to respond to this. I feel like a giant egghead for the sig mislynch. I officially can't read the guy, and I should have trusted my earlier self that was townreading him, because I got caught up in the moment and really thought he was the best option we had available. It was pretty difficult to develop any counterwagon at the time, but I regret my actions; I should have just stuck with Luna or went somewhere else I guess.

Ew.

[VOTE: M+7] aubergine

Explain.

[Tangrowth]

And I never read the townie handbook. I saw it on the shelf and it's like 800 pages and mostly incomprehensible.

Just had to say that this explains my playstyle so well; I read it cover to cover. Twice. Doesn't seem to do me much good.

real book, or extended metaphor?

Extended metaphor, sorry. Just a bad joke.

[Tangrowth]

Read Golden's case against me on the last page, and his posts that followed the lynch, and ask yourself, "Does this [the case against Colin] make any sense?"

I'm interested in hearing your answers.

It does make some sense. You voting off-wagon while 3 people are almost tied for the lynch and 1 vote can change everything is suspicious to say the least. It's the bad kind of suspicious.

It doesn't matter how weak the cases against Sig, Epi and me are, I don't believe that after all that happened today you didn't have any read on us three. In the case, you read both 3 of us as Town, you could have voted for your weakest Town read to try to save the two others that you read strongly as Town. You didn't even attempt that and just took the easy way out.

So yeah, you voting off wagon in such a crucial time is bad and Golden's case has merits. This is something a player with inside information (scum) would do since they would know who would flip Town and thus not participate so late in a mislynch to avoid scrutinization.

So I avoided scrutinization by doing something that is more likely to get scrutinized? Not following here. Isn't it scummier to just jump on an easy wagon and parrot some BS reason that somebody else said than to actually try and hold someone different up to a light?

Why are you concerned with what is perceived as scummy?

[colonialbob]

And Mac if you’d been here I would have joined you in pushing the thread in another direction. I regret that MP had to leave just when he did. I was trying to catch up and never fully engaged with him in real time, that could have lead to better results.

Ugh, I just have to respond to this. I feel like a giant egghead for the sig mislynch. I officially can't read the guy, and I should have trusted my earlier self that was townreading him, because I got caught up in the moment and really thought he was the best option we had available. It was pretty difficult to develop any counterwagon at the time, but I regret my actions; I should have just stuck with Luna or went somewhere else I guess.

Ew.

[VOTE: M+7] aubergine

Explain.

You're apologizing and distancing from a D1 civ lynch. It was D1, the odds were always that it would be a civ. That's how the game works. Why would you feel guilty about that?

[Long Con]

Read Golden's case against me on the last page, and his posts that followed the lynch, and ask yourself, "Does this [the case against Colin] make any sense?"

I'm interested in hearing your answers.

It does make some sense. You voting off-wagon while 3 people are almost tied for the lynch and 1 vote can change everything is suspicious to say the least. It's the bad kind of suspicious.

It doesn't matter how weak the cases against Sig, Epi and me are, I don't believe that after all that happened today you didn't have any read on us three. In the case, you read both 3 of us as Town, you could have voted for your weakest Town read to try to save the two others that you read strongly as Town. You didn't even attempt that and just took the easy way out.

So yeah, you voting off wagon in such a crucial time is bad and Golden's case has merits. This is something a player with inside information (scum) would do since they would know who would flip Town and thus not participate so late in a mislynch to avoid scrutinization.

So I avoided scrutinization by doing something that is more likely to get scrutinized? Not following here. Isn't it scummier to just jump on an easy wagon and parrot some BS reason that somebody else said than to actually try and hold someone different up to a light?

Why are you concerned with what is perceived as scummy?

Don't like this but ok I'll wait for Colin to respond.

[Tangrowth]

Theories

1) Baddies include one or both of dunya and wolbre
2) Baddies want us to lynch one of dunya and wolbre
3) Baddies saw Epi's performance in GoC and are intimidated by him generally
4) Baddies just want to screw with us
5) Baddies don't know what is up

Anyone want to rank these theories?

4 > 3 > 1 > 5 > 2

[Tangrowth]

And Mac if you’d been here I would have joined you in pushing the thread in another direction. I regret that MP had to leave just when he did. I was trying to catch up and never fully engaged with him in real time, that could have lead to better results.

Ugh, I just have to respond to this. I feel like a giant egghead for the sig mislynch. I officially can't read the guy, and I should have trusted my earlier self that was townreading him, because I got caught up in the moment and really thought he was the best option we had available. It was pretty difficult to develop any counterwagon at the time, but I regret my actions; I should have just stuck with Luna or went somewhere else I guess.

Ew.

[VOTE: M+7] aubergine

Explain.

You're apologizing and distancing from a D1 civ lynch. It was D1, the odds were always that it would be a civ. That's how the game works. Why would you feel guilty about that?

I'm not distancing. At all. That's the opposite of what I'm doing; I take full responsibility for my sig vote. Of course I regret it. Why wouldn't I feel guilty about mislynching a fellow townie?

[Tangrowth]

Read Golden's case against me on the last page, and his posts that followed the lynch, and ask yourself, "Does this [the case against Colin] make any sense?"

I'm interested in hearing your answers.

It does make some sense. You voting off-wagon while 3 people are almost tied for the lynch and 1 vote can change everything is suspicious to say the least. It's the bad kind of suspicious.

It doesn't matter how weak the cases against Sig, Epi and me are, I don't believe that after all that happened today you didn't have any read on us three. In the case, you read both 3 of us as Town, you could have voted for your weakest Town read to try to save the two others that you read strongly as Town. You didn't even attempt that and just took the easy way out.

So yeah, you voting off wagon in such a crucial time is bad and Golden's case has merits. This is something a player with inside information (scum) would do since they would know who would flip Town and thus not participate so late in a mislynch to avoid scrutinization.

So I avoided scrutinization by doing something that is more likely to get scrutinized? Not following here. Isn't it scummier to just jump on an easy wagon and parrot some BS reason that somebody else said than to actually try and hold someone different up to a light?

Why are you concerned with what is perceived as scummy?

Don't like this but ok I'll wait for Colin to respond.

I'm confused; what don't you like: my questioning of Colin's content or Colin's content?

[Tangrowth]

Not gonna repeat myself. Busy, sorry. Check ISO.

Nova, townish. Epi, sig, town. Those were my reads. Again, check ISO.

I don't like the Colin push. I think it looks more like people jabbing a frightened animal with a long stick than real baddie hunting.

What specifically inspires that perspective?

[Tangrowth]

Theories

1) Baddies include one or both of dunya and wolbre
2) Baddies want us to lynch one of dunya and wolbre
3) Baddies saw Epi's performance in GoC and are intimidated by him generally
4) Baddies just want to screw with us
5) Baddies don't know what is up

Anyone want to rank these theories?

I don't really want to rank them, that seems like pointless busy work to me. 6) Golden killed Epi and wants to control the narrative that ensues

So you think night kill analysis is pointless busy work and want to avoid pursuing a narrative, but then proceed to provide a narrative nonetheless?

[Long Con]

Not gonna repeat myself. Busy, sorry. Check ISO.

Nova, townish. Epi, sig, town. Those were my reads. Again, check ISO.

I don't like the Colin push. I think it looks more like people jabbing a frightened animal with a long stick than real baddie hunting.

What specifically inspires that perspective?

Gimme some time and I'll go back and re-feel what I felt when reading it the first time, then I'll try to explain it. Got a few things on the go right now so my Mafia playing is more of a quick-check-and-maybe-post rather than go-back-and-reread-and-explain.

[Lunalee]

Marmot voted for me? In a poll that ends on my birthday. I'll happily return the favor for him since he so kindly gave me his vopte instead of his customary Day 1 self vote. Wouldn't want him to feel too off missing that vote on Day 1 that is normally behind his name...

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

Careful, retaliation voting makes you look scummy.

This is a weird post. "Weird does not equal bad" has been the mantra of this game, but I have to ask about what motivated this post, @@Lunalee? It reads oddly threatening, like you are trying to setup a suspicion of daisy for later. Do you suspect Daisy or do you not?

I do not suspect Daisy right now.
MP asked the same thing:

Spoiler: show

Marmot voted for me? In a poll that ends on my birthday. I'll happily return the favor for him since he so kindly gave me his vopte instead of his customary Day 1 self vote. Wouldn't want him to feel too off missing that vote on Day 1 that is normally behind his name...

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

Careful, retaliation voting makes you look scummy.

Why would you care how Daisy looks?

Just a friendly warning. I did this in the image mafia game, and it made people suspect me later.

[Long Con]

Theories

1) Baddies include one or both of dunya and wolbre
2) Baddies want us to lynch one of dunya and wolbre
3) Baddies saw Epi's performance in GoC and are intimidated by him generally
4) Baddies just want to screw with us
5) Baddies don't know what is up

Anyone want to rank these theories?

I don't really want to rank them, that seems like pointless busy work to me. 6) Golden killed Epi and wants to control the narrative that ensues

So you think night kill analysis is pointless busy work and want to avoid pursuing a narrative, but then proceed to provide a narrative nonetheless?

No, that doesn't sound right. That sounds like you're trying to put a negative spin on my post.

[Tangrowth]

Not gonna repeat myself. Busy, sorry. Check ISO.

Nova, townish. Epi, sig, town. Those were my reads. Again, check ISO.

I don't like the Colin push. I think it looks more like people jabbing a frightened animal with a long stick than real baddie hunting.

What specifically inspires that perspective?

Gimme some time and I'll go back and re-feel what I felt when reading it the first time, then I'll try to explain it. Got a few things on the go right now so my Mafia playing is more of a quick-check-and-maybe-post rather than go-back-and-reread-and-explain.

Appreciate it, thanks.

[Tangrowth]

Theories

1) Baddies include one or both of dunya and wolbre
2) Baddies want us to lynch one of dunya and wolbre
3) Baddies saw Epi's performance in GoC and are intimidated by him generally
4) Baddies just want to screw with us
5) Baddies don't know what is up

Anyone want to rank these theories?

I don't really want to rank them, that seems like pointless busy work to me. 6) Golden killed Epi and wants to control the narrative that ensues

So you think night kill analysis is pointless busy work and want to avoid pursuing a narrative, but then proceed to provide a narrative nonetheless?

No, that doesn't sound right. That sounds like you're trying to put a negative spin on my post.

There's no spin unless it's unintentional; that's how I interpreted what you were saying. What were you saying?

[Long Con]

Read Golden's case against me on the last page, and his posts that followed the lynch, and ask yourself, "Does this [the case against Colin] make any sense?"

I'm interested in hearing your answers.

It does make some sense. You voting off-wagon while 3 people are almost tied for the lynch and 1 vote can change everything is suspicious to say the least. It's the bad kind of suspicious.

It doesn't matter how weak the cases against Sig, Epi and me are, I don't believe that after all that happened today you didn't have any read on us three. In the case, you read both 3 of us as Town, you could have voted for your weakest Town read to try to save the two others that you read strongly as Town. You didn't even attempt that and just took the easy way out.

So yeah, you voting off wagon in such a crucial time is bad and Golden's case has merits. This is something a player with inside information (scum) would do since they would know who would flip Town and thus not participate so late in a mislynch to avoid scrutinization.

So I avoided scrutinization by doing something that is more likely to get scrutinized? Not following here. Isn't it scummier to just jump on an easy wagon and parrot some BS reason that somebody else said than to actually try and hold someone different up to a light?

Why are you concerned with what is perceived as scummy?

Don't like this but ok I'll wait for Colin to respond.

I'm confused; what don't you like: my questioning of Colin's content or Colin's content?

Your questioning. Just like what you just tried to do to me, really. It's a leading question that is designed to get people to look at the post in a negative way.

[Tangrowth]

Lol, LC, I'm a terrible manipulator. I don't ever tell other people what to think unless they ask me or I'm in dogpee mode.

What you're seeing is the mode before dogpee mode, where I've seen something alarming, but I want to make sure I'm not misinterpreting what the person is saying and I want to interact with them directly, so I ask them a question -- specifically with the intent of displaying exactly how I interpreted their post and giving them a chance to clear any miscommunication.

If after that person responds, I believe there is miscommunication, I drop it. If I do not, then I may pursue questioning further, or just enter dogpee mode.

[Tangrowth]

Ironically though, what your post feels like though is not an honest attempt to understand where I'm coming from but rather an attempt to spin me as bad. I don't think that's a good look.

[Tangrowth]

To expound on Sloonei, I think his posts from Day 1 suggest he's treading lightly around Golden, a player who is dangerous when he's on either alignment. Golden voted for Sloonei a few times so far this game, Sloonei responded to those votes. But Sloonei's only other mentions of Golden were talking to other players who suspected Golden.

If Sloonei is civilian, I don't see reason for him to behave this way with Golden, nor would I expect him to. And if he does have concerns, I'd like to hear them, because I don't see evidence of these concerns yet.


Oooh, I almost forgot, Sloonei also disagreed with Long Con's and my unwillingness to play Golden's game.



I dunno, there's a consistent distraction from Golden that Sloonei's putting up.

Are you inferring anything about Golden's alignment from this, or only Sloonei's?

[Tangrowth]

Having looked back on dunya I see she had suspicions earlier in the day of players I came to suspect later. I am curious about it because my assumption is that a scum dunya would cast dispersions on her teammates to scoop up credit later but at the same time it isn't too dissimilar to why I pushed her incorrect lynch in Mortal Kombat. I give her some town points for this observation.

This just is not true and I loathe that you are bringing down my entire scum meta to it when I have done that exactly twice in my entire mafia playing time. Once in Loneliness and Cheese on RYM (a strategic move on my part), and once in FE (because the whole team decided to buss each other). Saying that scum dunya always busses her teammates is incorrect and I refuse to let that stick on me. I have a reputation to maintain, ok?

I've had and still have my concerns re: dunya, but my gut reaction is that this post oozes sincerity.

[Long Con]

MP, you are The Straw Man right now.

You take Colin's post and frame it as "he's concerned with what's perceived as scummy" when that's not accurate. Colin was responding to what someone else said looks scummy, so the subject was brought to him, and he responded to it. Your interpretation ignores that and puts up the straw man to beat on: Colin, the Guy Who Is Concerned With What Looks Scummy.

If you had, for example, asked lunalee the exact same question when she literally told Spacedaisy to be careful about being perceived as scummy, then it would have been so very legit. Here, not so much.

You take my post and frame it as "You think nightkill analysis is pointless", and proceed to loosely imply some sort of hypocrisy. But I never said I think nightkill analysis is pointless, I said Golden's "rank my five possibilities" exercise is pointless busy work. You took what I really said, and stuff it into the straw man of "LC considers NK analysis pointless", and throw it out there for people to take swings at.

That makes you a two-time Straw Man Sinner, and my new top suspect.

Keep it honest.

[VOTE: M plus 7] aubergine

[Long Con]

Ironically though, what your post feels like though is not an honest attempt to understand where I'm coming from but rather an attempt to spin me as bad. I don't think that's a good look.

You are right about the irony, at least.