Persona 5 Mafia [Game End]

[MacDougall]

This is exactly why you should have a problem doing that.

Okay Mac. I told you what I had in mind. If you don't buy it that's the way it is.

So you made that post after thinking "if I make this post, Dragomir will be encouraged more and continue to play" and not just " hey look, a take I agree with, I shall post accordingly.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

This is exactly why you should have a problem doing that.

Okay Mac. I told you what I had in mind. If you don't buy it that's the way it is.

So you made that post after thinking "if I make this post, Dragomir will be encouraged more and continue to play" and not just " hey look, a take I agree with, I shall post accordingly.

A little of both, primarily the former (though "continue to play" needs to be expanded to "continue to play with confidence and have fun in the game). I've done it a few times with Dragomir.

No patronizing or the like intended, Dragomir. It's just that you're new here and newer to the game than most, and it's important to me that people like you have a good experience.

[MacDougall]

Hmmm okay then. Seems reachy to me but you are a bit of a hero archetype so it's probably on brand.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

So how about this Day 2 stuff.

[Dragomir]

[mention]MacDougall[/mention] what do you think of Rej?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

though, just realized my read on TSP was complete bullshit. I didn't realize I had initially townread him and just assumed he seemed meh.

Why does this post exist?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If it wasn't a busser:

Epignosis > Creature > sprityo > Long Con

If it was a busser:

Rej > MacDougall > Jack > nutella > Dragomir

[MacDougall]

@MacDougall what do you think of Rej?

Doesn't feel like mafia to me generally. Doesn't stack up given the result either. My opinion remains what it was before the flip, with the added element of him being a viable counterlynch option ... yeah nah.

[Dragomir]

though, just realized my read on TSP was complete bullshit. I didn't realize I had initially townread him and just assumed he seemed meh.

Why does this post exist?

Why do any of Creature's posts exist?

[MacDougall]

If it wasn't a busser:

Epignosis > Creature > sprityo > Long Con

If it was a busser:

Rej > MacDougall > Jack > nutella > Dragomir

That I can place you in both categories is an interesting observation.

If not one = Long Con > Sprityo > Jay > Creature > Epignosis

If is one = Nutella > Jay > Jack > rej > Dragomir

Seems the only thing we agree on is that Dragomir = town.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If it wasn't a busser:

Epignosis > Creature > sprityo > Long Con

If it was a busser:

Rej > MacDougall > Jack > nutella > Dragomir

That I can place you in both categories is an interesting observation.

If not one = Long Con > Sprityo > Jay > Creature > Epignosis

If is one = Nutella > Jay > Jack > rej > Dragomir

Seems the only thing we agree on is that Dragomir = town.

I'd really like to know what you think of my Epignosis gripes. The only one to engage that to this point is nutella.

Link 1 | [/url=http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 85#p553286]Link 2[/url]

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Link 2

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]MacDougall[/mention] I'd also like to know your current POE pool.

[Rej]

lol [mention]Dragomir[/mention] repeatedly asking same questions to fish for others opinions.
oh boi it's EoC and ya still talk like BoC.
bring the case, then ask people!

a new tinfoil before I go sleep:

tinfoil consists of 2 parts:

part 1:
D1 Town was giving out town reads like fuck and this is what the wolves tried to build on.

part 2:
D1 Mafia PR bussed D1 Mafia goon/vanilla in order to receive town creds.

both parts are x/z combineable and could paint JJJ/Drago or anyone else who received town creds or good townreads as scum


I will go sleep now, I am currently renovating my living and sleep room that's why I was busy and still will be tomorrow, but I read everything.

JJJ made some nice analysis' which I loved to read

I still dont have a clue who could be Tony's partner, possibly it could be everybody. Take care so the wolf doesn't create confusion!

Nightey guys.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Importantly, all those analyses I did invariably directed me to a posture that it wasn't a bus.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Creature Jack Mac are probably my “town core” so there’s some overlap on the lists at least

One of these things is not like the others.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Creature may be surpassing Epignosis for my most severe frowny face.

[MacDougall]

Okay Jimbob.

For Epignosis to be TSP's teammate you are relying on him being quite sloppy. Given I have literally never caught wolf Epi myself, that alone gives me pause though I don't want to outsmart myself. I will add that his ... agreeability over the past 30 to 60 minutes has caught me raising an eyebrow or two, so I am not without my own independent concerns.

I think in the context of the argument that TSP might have been tempted to distance Epi, the same applies to his brief dalliance with a vote on you. Though obviously it'd be quite weird for you to bring that up if it was in fact what you yourself was guilty of.

They are things that are worthy of consideration. They aren't dramatically moving me at this point.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Okay Jimbob.

For Epignosis to be TSP's teammate you are relying on him being quite sloppy. Given I have literally never caught wolf Epi myself, that alone gives me pause though I don't want to outsmart myself. I will add that his ... agreeability over the past 30 to 60 minutes has caught me raising an eyebrow or two, so I am not without my own independent concerns.

I think in the context of the argument that TSP might have been tempted to distance Epi, the same applies to his brief dalliance with a vote on you. Though obviously it'd be quite weird for you to bring that up if it was in fact what you yourself was guilty of.

They are things that are worthy of consideration. They aren't dramatically moving me at this point.

I think you're too high on Creature.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think with respect to the potential distancing vote from Tony, there's a clear distinction:

When Tony voted for me, he literally called it a "challenge". He broadcasted that vote to the universe.

When Tony voted for Epignosis, he bailed on it immediately without even mentioning that it had existed.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I will grant that the whole "I thought I said why I read Tony as a civilian" thing would be sloppy though. Epi would have dun goofed in such a scenario. I don't think it's a ridiculous notion, but it is something that gives me pause.

Creature is probably my top suspect now.

[MacDougall]

Okay Jimbob.

For Epignosis to be TSP's teammate you are relying on him being quite sloppy. Given I have literally never caught wolf Epi myself, that alone gives me pause though I don't want to outsmart myself. I will add that his ... agreeability over the past 30 to 60 minutes has caught me raising an eyebrow or two, so I am not without my own independent concerns.

I think in the context of the argument that TSP might have been tempted to distance Epi, the same applies to his brief dalliance with a vote on you. Though obviously it'd be quite weird for you to bring that up if it was in fact what you yourself was guilty of.

They are things that are worthy of consideration. They aren't dramatically moving me at this point.

I think you're too high on Creature.

Yeah I mean the little list I copied from you is giving me a false reading because of the context of it. He is most certainly in my POE.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Out of my POE pool (Creature, Epignosis, Long Con, and sprityo), who looks the most authentic at face value?

sprityo > Epignosis > [Long Con exists] > Creature

[MacDougall]

Out of my POE pool (Creature, Epignosis, Long Con, and sprityo), who looks the most authentic at face value?

sprityo > Epignosis > [Long Con exists] > Creature

I'd say Creature looks the most authentic. That is to say authentic by Creature standards. Epignosis is the only one that I can say I have felt is acting out of character out of this list.

[Jackofhearts2005]

“well he played a crap game defending a wolf on D1. I was justified”

I have played an excellent civilian game to this point, and no I am not joking.

Gonna reread why people think Tony was bussed and see if that’s convincing at all.

My initial instinct with regard to this is contextual. There were exactly zero minutes in all of Day 1 in which Tony was truly safe. Until the very last moment with Epignosis, nobody read him as a civilian -- not me, not Mac, not anyone. There were little points here and there that gave people doubts as is often the case with people checking every angle they can, but he was never safe.

So why does a mafioso protect him? What? That's nonsense. The only reason I can see Epignosis doing it is his disdain for bussing. Otherwise I find it much easier to associate the Tony lynch with either a bus or with teammate(s) who were on sideline wagons.

I mean, you need mislynches as a wolf and a wolf lynch means no mislynch plusbthetown gets clues.

Also if there are only 2 wolves, losing your partner D1 sucks.

You're trying really hard to paint Jay as bad. Sure all of these are true but what's worse is defending a lost cause. Jay is right, it's absolute nonsense to hard defend your buddy in that situation. Tell me I'm wrong. A mafioso either avoids the lynch on their buddy or joins in. There's a chance that a redirect might happen but this situation doesn't call for it(only when your buddy has very few votes on them is it optimal to redirect the lynch from them).

You’re wrong.

All always/never bus statements are wrong.

I’m not saying Jay is 100% definitely mafia because he defended Tony. I’m saying clearing Jay and Epi because they defended Tony is a bad idea.

And Jay is basically leaving open that Epi would defend his partner so really he’s just saying “I am town.”

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Out of my POE pool (Creature, Epignosis, Long Con, and sprityo), who looks the most authentic at face value?

sprityo > Epignosis > [Long Con exists] > Creature

I'd say Creature looks the most authentic. That is to say authentic by Creature standards. Epignosis is the only one that I can say I have felt is acting out of character out of this list.

When Creature talks about Tony are the posts that specifically bug me.

Spoiler: show

Jack is bad for making a post

okay seems reasonable vote:Jack

???

Hold on am I voting twice in the poll?

This is town or I am being overconfident

Let me guess:

Voting phase will take forever to start and when it does I'll have to pull something I know is completely bullshit to justify my vote when there's absolutely no need to.

If this weren’t Creature it’d seem like scum preemptively making excuses, but this is a legitimate form of complaint I think from our resident complainer and scum wouldn’t be quite so quick on the excuse? Lean town?

"If this weren't Creature it'd seem like scum preemptively making excuses"

Uh? You can change my name to any player and it remains the same. It's not AI anyway.

Also I liked the totodile but the new icon is cool too.

Totodile had to go, it made me feel pessimistic for some reason.

TSP, Sprityo and Speedchuck are Mafia.

There’s a problem here

Conductor, we have a problem.

Jack is bad for making a post

okay seems reasonable vote:Jack

???

i a m j o k i n g

P l e a s e e x p a n d

Let me guess:

Voting phase will take forever to start and when it does I'll have to pull something I know is completely bullshit to justify my vote when there's absolutely no need to.

If this weren’t Creature it’d seem like scum preemptively making excuses, but this is a legitimate form of complaint I think from our resident complainer and scum wouldn’t be quite so quick on the excuse? Lean town?

"If this weren't Creature it'd seem like scum preemptively making excuses"

Uh? You can change my name to any player and it remains the same. It's not AI anyway.

I disagree

Maybe some years ago it was indeed AI, but not anymore.

I don't remember anything towny from Tony either.

And the fact that this post exists at all, regardless of interpretation, is a concern to me:

though, just realized my read on TSP was complete bullshit. I didn't realize I had initially townread him and just assumed he seemed meh.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Maybe Epi made sloppy mafia mistakes because alcohol.

[nutella]

I hate that post by Jay if that wasn't clear. It's wolfy as fuck.

This is just as basic and lame as the thing you're whining about.

You don't even know why I think it's wolfy so how can you say that?

To be clear, it's wolfy because it serves wolf purposes.

1. Steels the resolve of another person that their wrong minded doubt towards me is sound. The types of doubts Dragomir has towards me (the tinfoil variety) are tunnel making doubts. Turning Dragomir against me right now is perfect for the mafia. This was made worse by the fact that you simultaneously declared that you doubt that very doubt resolving you of the lashback of being a proponent of said doubt.
2. Makes them feel like you are a friend.

Both of these things are wolf moves. Neither of them are civ moves.

Now tell me again that it's basic and lame.

I know exactly why you think it's "wolfy". And it's fucking basic. I mean no shit. "Now Dragomir is going to think he's right her dee der". It's the night phase, and you're not getting lynched in this Mafia game because of that.

Get a grip, nerd.

what on earth


we're back to scumjay world lads

[nutella]

Night 1 after a day 1 Mafia lynch. Super town Jay is in hot takes mode.

It feels to me like you are currently trying to open up strings of wrong minded case making everywhere. Pushing Dragomir towards me, opening up suspicion lines towards Epignosis, humouring the bussing case. You are not operating with the narrow minded focus towards tried and true scum huntign methodology. It also feels like your interaction analysis was tokenistic because it really proved nothing.

I also do not sense the "I better get my shit in" Jay that is ever present on night 1 after a Mafia death.

So you're either Mafia or you are using this game to experiment with your meta.

dingdingding

I was briefly pacified by the interaction analysis work but obviously that's obligatory for him anyway and you are right that he didn't get much out of it other than the Epi case, which I liked but am feeling better about Epi since his posts tonight. So..... yeah.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I was briefly pacified by the interaction analysis work but obviously that's obligatory for him anyway and you are right that he didn't get much out of it other than the Epi case, which I liked but am feeling better about Epi since his posts tonight. So..... yeah.

I think everyone is a civilian except for four people on the basis of those analyses. I feel pretty damned good about that.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If there's a vig I hope you shoot me. This isn't even a woe is me thing, it's necessary.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

#gutreadsarecoolbutwhentheyreallyouworkwithyoulosegameshashtaghashtag

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I will literally lynch myself on Day 2 if y'all can't get over this shit. It's a rare day when things get this dire, but I genuinely don't see how the civilians can win this game if they cannot get me out of their heads. I absolutely hate to be in this position in a game with what figures to be very few mislynches available, but I am seriously at a loss. If I can't get through to anyone no matter how hard I try, then my presence here is a problem.

[MacDougall]

You are welcome to continue to gamesolve alongside replying to and dealing with fair suspicion. I do believe that is the fundamental essence of the game. Defend yourself from suspicion and make your own? No? Not sure why you needing to do so should stun you into absurd freak outs. Is it because you feel like you are beyond reproach?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

You are welcome to continue to gamesolve alongside replying to and dealing with fair suspicion. I do believe that is the fundamental essence of the game. Defend yourself from suspicion and make your own? No? Not sure why you needing to do so should stun you into absurd freak outs. Is it because you feel like you are beyond reproach?

I keep seeing that I am not doing things and it is driving me nuts.

I have gamesolved my ass off all night and I feel pretty good about where I sit. I have gamesolved so much that I genuinely don't know what more to gamesolve right now.

On the basis of Tony interactions, voting behavior, face value gut reads, and activity in this night phase I have a clear POE pool: Creature, Epignosis, sprityo, and Long Con. I would tend to order them accordingly, though sprityo and Long Con might as well be interchangeable. Everyone else I can provide a strong reason to read as a civilian.

I feel like I have solved the game. My ability to pursue alternatives is wrapped in theories about possible bussers -- it's all highly speculative, and my feeling is that Rej would be the best bet in that universe.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If there is some specific gamesolving-related question or idea someone would like to present to me, then by all means do that.

[MacDougall]

You are welcome to continue to gamesolve alongside replying to and dealing with fair suspicion. I do believe that is the fundamental essence of the game. Defend yourself from suspicion and make your own? No? Not sure why you needing to do so should stun you into absurd freak outs. Is it because you feel like you are beyond reproach?

I keep seeing that I am not doing things and it is driving me nuts.

I have gamesolved my ass off all night and I feel pretty good about where I sit. I have gamesolved so much that I genuinely don't know what more to gamesolve right now.

On the basis of Tony interactions, voting behavior, face value gut reads, and activity in this night phase I have a clear POE pool: Creature, Epignosis, sprityo, and Long Con. I would tend to order them accordingly, though sprityo and Long Con might as well be interchangeable. Everyone else I can provide a strong reason to read as a civilian.

I feel like I have solved the game. My ability to pursue alternatives is wrapped in theories about possible bussers -- it's all highly speculative, and my feeling is that Rej would be the best bet in that universe.

You are obviously doing things and I don't think anyone would say it's as simple as that you are not. I think you are being suspected a little more than usual because there are some idiosyncrasies to your approach this time, and everyone here is very used to heavy amounts of Jay ergo we have preconceived notions of what to expect from you that are not entirely being met. I will add that it's not fair for me to be as blunt in my appraisal as I was before. I do in fact know how you feel, very much so, it is a cross I also constantly bear. And yours is a complex emotional response that is natural for players like us when civilian. "Why are you scum reading me ffs I am so obviously town", when in fact it is very obvious to everyone else that you are not obviously town even though you probably are.

Of major concern, always, is that I'd go as far as to say that you probably replicate that very emotional response on purpose because you know that it gets people off your back, even when you are a civ, perhaps especially when you are a civ. I do it, so I am sure you also do it. Given that fact, it's impossible for me, and probably many others you play with consistently to ever really truly believe it.

All that aside, it is simply the fact that you are always within your Mafia range that has you perennially tinfoiled. It has been this way for years. I sympathise but it is always the case. It's like a midday move we've already seen so many times before. It's a routine process of the simulation. Jay gets tinfoiled. News at 11.

Truly, the only way prolific players like you and I ever convince other civilians to drop tinfoil is by virtue of destroying wolves (I belabour the plural) with what are CLEARLY our own cases. Which you haven't satisfied yet here obviously. This is the heart of why I warded people against lynching you yesterday. You solve yourself, the same way I do. If we are alive in the late game and we haven't wrecked wolves, we are usually wolves.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Strongest indicator that Dragomir is a civilian:

His entire post history

~~~

Strongest indicator that Jack is a civilian:

Apart from his post history, which I think is reasonably close to Dragomir's in authenticity:

Drago/Jack feels right I think that's it someone write it down

Why Jack?

Drago spends a lot of time casually scumreading Jack as a second target and then asks him as a second target to vote with him. It gives me bad vibes. Gut feeling.

Tony's fake hunting on both Dragomir and Jack here just does look like distancing to me. I might even say in Jack's case that it looks like it's supposed to look like distancing, similar to his challenge vote to me. Describing a concrete suspicion on Jack in this "bad vibes/gut feeling" manner looks more to me like dually-contrarian reads (along with Dragomir) on highly-trusted civilians in hopes of garnering credit.

~~~

Strongest indicator that MacDougall is a civilian:

I'm pretty down for this apparent consensus. My only concern is that there is too much of a consensus... but then again, I think the going hypothesis is that he'd only have one teammate and it's likely to be sprityo who's been quiet anyway. So, [VOTE: tonystarkprime] aubergine

Did you just steal random sprityo suspicion from Mac?

I think this kind of reveals a lot about Mac by way of shading nutella -- he tried to appeal to the audience, specifically Mac, by suggesting that nutella was parroting him.

~~~

Best indicator that nutella is a civilian:

The post above also looks great for her. Additionally:

There's only one positive thing about TSP. He's going against the grain with the scum read on me. Though, I'm not sure what to make of it.

Ehh I feel like it could be kind of a hail mary though/trying to make it look like he has real original opinions and trying to set off discussion about literally anyone besides himself (and sprityo)

Sprit has not made me feel any better, his mac vote is nasty. I really think occam's razor here is just tony/sprit team... but is this game really that easy? It may not be, but my inclination is to go ahead and lynch them and if the game isn't over then we can buckle down on finding a deepwolf (or it's just jay or epi who wouldn't be so "deep" to me lol)

why would i have to fake original opinions when it seems like I could just take reads from others and shoot to the top of the townie list

alternatively

"I feel like TSP is scum because he said something different and that's too much work"

alternatively

wait where is Sprityo coming from again have you actually said anything about Sprityo also why do people suspect sprityo, whose game plan apparently in all cases is apparently just "exist"? Discuss.

Tony was indignant that he wasn't getting credit for his [super good!] thing, but nutella was getting it for her [super bad!] thing. That kind of gripe doesn't look like teammate stuff to me.

Mmmmmmm could mac and I both be right could it be Jay/Tony w/w
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

hmmmmmm

I'll take that dare

vote:JJJ

He tried to play into her suspicion of me with this move. It certainly isn't going to make me look better. He's just screaming "hey nutella, Jay IS my teammate! See! Can't you see!" -- he doesn't gain anything by playing to his audience like this if his audience is his team.

~~~

Best indicator that Rej is a civilian:

“I said something stupid and you’re scum for pointing it out”

I don’t think it’s AI that you say it but Drago’s latch onto it seems opportunistic because it’s so obviously a blah argument

He looks like he is literally laying a pillow underneath Rej's head as he disses Dragomir to ensure Rej is so comfortable that he won't view it badly. "I don't think it's AI that YOU say it, baby love. Just that other bad mean boy."

Rej is town btw

do you have better reasons than "drago isn't ripping him to shreds"

Basically copy/pasting something I was saying about Rej reads to Jack when Rej was his counterwagon. This is the kind of thing that makes it look like an actual counter. Without it I'd genuinely have no problem with a mafia-mafia wagons theory.

[MacDougall]

And if we are not, we lose as civilians. So be it.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don't think I can provide anything that makes me feel any confidence in favor of the other four. A couple of them are actively suspicious too via interactions and/or face-value judgment. Hence, POE.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I dig all that Mac. Genuinely, I do. I think my frustration here is that this doesn't strike me as "tinfoil" as it often would in other games. It's not "I'm worried that Jay might be mafia and hoodwinking us." Instead it's just "Jay is mafia." The former is token, understandable, and manageable. The latter essentially means that no matter what I say, that read will hold -- and it's not something I criticize people for. That's just how the game goes. If it happens that way though, my presence here is a gigantic distraction and it inhibits the solution of the game by other players. Perhaps "I'll lynch myself" is dramatic, but I am left in a rarefied air tonight where something like that actually sounds like something to consider.

In any event, many of us seem to agree on a general pool of suspects. The only major point of contention is whether I am one of them.

I hope dissenters to my POE will speak loudly. [mention]Dragomir[/mention], for example: You are very low on Rej. You should examine and explain that in as much detail as you can.

[MacDougall]

Don't you find it odd that we are in a world where you scum read Epi and he town reads you?

It feels uncharted.

[nutella]

Creature Jack Mac are probably my “town core” so there’s some overlap on the lists at least

One of these things is not like the others.

Tbf I called Creature and Mac my towncore early d0 so he could have been sheeping that. But maybe it was convenient?

[nutella]

I will grant that the whole "I thought I said why I read Tony as a civilian" thing would be sloppy though. Epi would have dun goofed in such a scenario. I don't think it's a ridiculous notion, but it is something that gives me pause.

Creature is probably my top suspect now.

Hmmmmmm

[nutella]

Out of my POE pool (Creature, Epignosis, Long Con, and sprityo), who looks the most authentic at face value?

sprityo > Epignosis > [Long Con exists] > Creature

wait is this most authentic to least authentic, or vice versa? if it's the former I strongly disagree. Creature's early posts were authentic af, and sprit's were meh at best

[nutella]

I was briefly pacified by the interaction analysis work but obviously that's obligatory for him anyway and you are right that he didn't get much out of it other than the Epi case, which I liked but am feeling better about Epi since his posts tonight. So..... yeah.

I think everyone is a civilian except for four people on the basis of those analyses. I feel pretty damned good about that.

ok

[nutella]

I will literally lynch myself on Day 2 if y'all can't get over this shit. It's a rare day when things get this dire, but I genuinely don't see how the civilians can win this game if they cannot get me out of their heads. I absolutely hate to be in this position in a game with what figures to be very few mislynches available, but I am seriously at a loss. If I can't get through to anyone no matter how hard I try, then my presence here is a problem.

dude I feel like you say this all the time (idk if there's a pattern to if you say it as scum more but that's not my point) and it's complete and total garbage. if you're town I think we are more than capable of getting through to lynching the real bad guys without having to lynch you first. it may be with a lot of resistance and arguing, but I mean look at how d1 went, I and Jack were pretty set on lynching you but ended up not doing it. that could happen one more time and we could win the game. if you're scum, the game (presumably) ends if we lynch you anyway. so what's the point of saying shit like this? it's rude tbh, and pretty arrogant too, to assume we can't "get over" a misguided suspicion or that we even have to in order to win the game. I fucking hate when you say this stuff.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Out of my POE pool (Creature, Epignosis, Long Con, and sprityo), who looks the most authentic at face value?

sprityo > Epignosis > [Long Con exists] > Creature

wait is this most authentic to least authentic, or vice versa? if it's the former I strongly disagree. Creature's early posts were authentic af, and sprit's were meh at best

It's the one you strongly disagree with. I stated later that Creatures posts about Tony are particularly ugly to me. I think you should look at those and see how you feel.

[nutella]

Like, if the presence of a popular misguided suspicion in the thread that never comes to fruition as a lynch spells doom for town, then town would never win games. You're just being all self-important about it.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Don't you find it odd that we are in a world where you scum read Epi and he town reads you?

It feels uncharted.

It's not something that has specifically perturbed me. I suppose I can't recall offhand another example. It's uncommon at least.