Coronavirus Mafia [ENDGAME]

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Yeah wilgy playing now makes sloonei the obvious secret vote candidate imo

[juliets]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME so my read of nutella this game is leaning scum.

The people she has read as scum include you, Jack, Hyena, 112 and DDL all of whom I disagree with. (I think she is reading everyone but me town right now but these were her past reads).

She has brought up things about me that are just part of my style and has been adamant those things make me scum. Part of me wants to say she's just mistaken but she hasn't wavered at all like she does when she's town. In fact, I haven't seen her wavering on anybody like her normal civ self though it usually happens at EOD in my experience and we've only had one of those.

Her responses to MR's death sounded overwrought, and that isn't normally what I see in town nutella. It's like she was overdoing it so people would believe she was not his partner.

She and I both did agree on Hyena's MP7 case so we haven't disagreed on everything. I only lean scum on her because I would really like to see some more behavior before writing her off completely.

I know it seems like I'm not wavering at this point, which I admit is unusual and feels weird. This has just been a weird game for me in how much I've mentally sorted people as town. But as you said yourself, I have changed my reads quite a lot this game. I have had multiple scumreads that didn't stick and I *have* waffled on them and I *have* changed my mind. Maybe not in the way I usually do, and yeah I'm sticking to my guns on you and not really waffling there but I have my reasons (which are partially POE from my townreads).

My response to MR's flip was really just me typing how I felt in the moment. It was stream of consciousness. I was stunned. Wasn't exaggerated.

I'm in a position right now where I realize why I look bad but all I can do is honestly say how I've felt in this game and I can't really defend more than that, it's just been weird. I would encourage you to look at the sheer volume of my posts and the extent to which I'm stream of consciousness posting and not holding anything back, and as MP has pointed out see how different that is from my recent scum games where I am much more restrained. I know I don't look like my usual town self here because of how my reads have evolved, but I implore you to see that I am also not even remotely within my scum meta. I know how that sounds, believe me I'm conscious of it, and I am starting to accept that it's fairly likely I get mislynched today but I won't go down without a fight and I want others to see through to my true motivations here.

Wow nutella, you may have convinced me. Step away from me for a minute and tell me who else is in your "maybe scum" pile. I have been defending so much I'm not doing well on reading baddies. Everyone seems so town. I'm half considering Hyena's idea of the Wilgy and Sloonei slots. I wish this double lynch had not come so early in the game, I'm having flashbacks as to how we screwed it up in GOC.

Omgosh a ton of linki.

[juliets]

Oh I missed the stuff about Wilgy. Definitely won't vote him.

[DrWilgy]

Someone explain secret vote or link me to it. I didn't see it in the rules or during my review.

[nutella]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME so my read of nutella this game is leaning scum.

The people she has read as scum include you, Jack, Hyena, 112 and DDL all of whom I disagree with. (I think she is reading everyone but me town right now but these were her past reads).

She has brought up things about me that are just part of my style and has been adamant those things make me scum. Part of me wants to say she's just mistaken but she hasn't wavered at all like she does when she's town. In fact, I haven't seen her wavering on anybody like her normal civ self though it usually happens at EOD in my experience and we've only had one of those.

Her responses to MR's death sounded overwrought, and that isn't normally what I see in town nutella. It's like she was overdoing it so people would believe she was not his partner.

She and I both did agree on Hyena's MP7 case so we haven't disagreed on everything. I only lean scum on her because I would really like to see some more behavior before writing her off completely.

I know it seems like I'm not wavering at this point, which I admit is unusual and feels weird. This has just been a weird game for me in how much I've mentally sorted people as town. But as you said yourself, I have changed my reads quite a lot this game. I have had multiple scumreads that didn't stick and I *have* waffled on them and I *have* changed my mind. Maybe not in the way I usually do, and yeah I'm sticking to my guns on you and not really waffling there but I have my reasons (which are partially POE from my townreads).

My response to MR's flip was really just me typing how I felt in the moment. It was stream of consciousness. I was stunned. Wasn't exaggerated.

I'm in a position right now where I realize why I look bad but all I can do is honestly say how I've felt in this game and I can't really defend more than that, it's just been weird. I would encourage you to look at the sheer volume of my posts and the extent to which I'm stream of consciousness posting and not holding anything back, and as MP has pointed out see how different that is from my recent scum games where I am much more restrained. I know I don't look like my usual town self here because of how my reads have evolved, but I implore you to see that I am also not even remotely within my scum meta. I know how that sounds, believe me I'm conscious of it, and I am starting to accept that it's fairly likely I get mislynched today but I won't go down without a fight and I want others to see through to my true motivations here.

Wow nutella, you may have convinced me. Step away from me for a minute and tell me who else is in your "maybe scum" pile. I have been defending so much I'm not doing well on reading baddies. Everyone seems so town. I'm half considering Hyena's idea of the Wilgy and Sloonei slots. I wish this double lynch had not come so early in the game, I'm having flashbacks as to how we screwed it up in GOC.

Omgosh a ton of linki.

Well other than Sloonei I have reasons to townread everyone else, but some of them are weaker than others. Tony probably the weakest, and MP. And I'm honestly starting to consider the possibility I'm wrong on Speed even though he was one of my strongest. If I were to reorder my list now I think LC, Hyena, Jack, and even Nanook might place higher than him at this point.

I really should look into Tony more though huh.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Someone explain secret vote or link me to it. I didn't see it in the rules or during my review.

Rule that was added by vote N1, adds a second TK that’s decided by secret vote. Secret votes are final once made.

[nutella]

Someone explain secret vote or link me to it. I didn't see it in the rules or during my review.

There was a poll during the night phase for adding a mechanic for D2. So today we have an extra secret vote by PM and it's unchangeable, so we need to reach a consensus in thread and send in our votes toward eod. We are probably going for Sloonei because that slot has not played at all and should be resolved.

[juliets]

I can agree to secret vote Sloonei.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

If sloonei flips mafia I’m going to both laugh at and mock everyone that fought me on killing them D1

And if they flip town I’m going to ignore it and defend the approach anyway.

[juliets]

[mention]nutella[/mention] the only thing about Tony is MR suspected him and even voted him. I guess that could have been distancing though, I need to look back at that.

[DrWilgy]

Fair, do we have a solid list of who all is for the Sloonei shot and have any other names been suggested (other than me of course)?

I'm assuming this is just a PM to Epi?

[Long Con]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME so my read of nutella this game is leaning scum.

The people she has read as scum include you, Jack, Hyena, 112 and DDL all of whom I disagree with. (I think she is reading everyone but me town right now but these were her past reads).

She has brought up things about me that are just part of my style and has been adamant those things make me scum. Part of me wants to say she's just mistaken but she hasn't wavered at all like she does when she's town. In fact, I haven't seen her wavering on anybody like her normal civ self though it usually happens at EOD in my experience and we've only had one of those.

Her responses to MR's death sounded overwrought, and that isn't normally what I see in town nutella. It's like she was overdoing it so people would believe she was not his partner.

She and I both did agree on Hyena's MP7 case so we haven't disagreed on everything. I only lean scum on her because I would really like to see some more behavior before writing her off completely.

I know it seems like I'm not wavering at this point, which I admit is unusual and feels weird. This has just been a weird game for me in how much I've mentally sorted people as town. But as you said yourself, I have changed my reads quite a lot this game. I have had multiple scumreads that didn't stick and I *have* waffled on them and I *have* changed my mind. Maybe not in the way I usually do, and yeah I'm sticking to my guns on you and not really waffling there but I have my reasons (which are partially POE from my townreads).

My response to MR's flip was really just me typing how I felt in the moment. It was stream of consciousness. I was stunned. Wasn't exaggerated.

I'm in a position right now where I realize why I look bad but all I can do is honestly say how I've felt in this game and I can't really defend more than that, it's just been weird. I would encourage you to look at the sheer volume of my posts and the extent to which I'm stream of consciousness posting and not holding anything back, and as MP has pointed out see how different that is from my recent scum games where I am much more restrained. I know I don't look like my usual town self here because of how my reads have evolved, but I implore you to see that I am also not even remotely within my scum meta. I know how that sounds, believe me I'm conscious of it, and I am starting to accept that it's fairly likely I get mislynched today but I won't go down without a fight and I want others to see through to my true motivations here.

Wow nutella, you may have convinced me. Step away from me for a minute and tell me who else is in your "maybe scum" pile. I have been defending so much I'm not doing well on reading baddies. Everyone seems so town. I'm half considering Hyena's idea of the Wilgy and Sloonei slots. I wish this double lynch had not come so early in the game, I'm having flashbacks as to how we screwed it up in GOC.

Omgosh a ton of linki.

Well other than Sloonei I have reasons to townread everyone else, but some of them are weaker than others. Tony probably the weakest, and MP. And I'm honestly starting to consider the possibility I'm wrong on Speed even though he was one of my strongest. If I were to reorder my list now I think LC, Hyena, Jack, and even Nanook might place higher than him at this point.

I really should look into Tony more though huh.

But Jack is mechanically cleared.

[nutella]

@nutella the only thing about Tony is MR suspected him and even voted him. I guess that could have been distancing though, I need to look back at that.

You're right, I remember seeing that in MR's iso and thinking that was probably not teammate behavior. But yeah I do really need to consider all angles more openly so I'll look into it again.

[nutella]

LC yes that's why :P

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Fair, do we have a solid list of who all is for the Sloonei shot and have any other names been suggested (other than me of course)?

I'm assuming this is just a PM to Epi?

And Mac

[juliets]

Fair, do we have a solid list of who all is for the Sloonei shot and have any other names been suggested (other than me of course)?

I'm assuming this is just a PM to Epi?

I would send it to Epi and Mac once we're sure.

[Long Con]

LC yes that's why :P

OH I thought you meant higher suspicion for those than MP.

[nutella]

I think my main problem with Tony is it feels like he's largely disappeared. He was fairly active on D1 but it feels like he hasn't had any meaningful content since the MR flip.

[Long Con]

I will shoot Sloonei if that's the consensus. He might be bad. He might have bowed back out due to the extra pressures of being bad. He might be Civ, and the secret votes will be unanimous. We can't let him get to Final 3 either way, right?

[nutella]

I’m town. Process of elimination gives you my character and my power follows swiftly. I don’t think I’ll be around much in the following day phase, so please don’t try to lynch me.

I forgot he said this though so maybe I shouldn't dismiss his lack of activity. Also not sure what he's hinting at about his role. Anyone think it's possible he's the one who shot MR? That may be worth looking into.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Yeah I don’t see any way we can let the sloonei slot get to LYLO

[nutella]

hmm that "shouldn't dismiss" wording sounds kind of like the opposite of what I meant, whatever lol

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Why are we even considering tony today?

[nutella]

Why are we even considering tony today?

I don't know that we are. I'm just looking into him a bit more because he's among the weakest of my townreads and I'm trying to reconsider some stuff. But now that I've looked I think it's possible he's even the one who killed MR and not teammate compatible with him at the least.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Given where his vote is parked I somewhat doubt that tony shot radishes.

[nutella]

Given where his vote is parked I somewhat doubt that tony shot radishes.

Huh? I am missing the connection.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Or maybe he moved without calling it, in which case he could’ve shot radishes. Idk.

I don’t really want a claim tho, if they have another/more shots.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Given where his vote is parked I somewhat doubt that tony shot radishes.

Huh? I am missing the connection.

I was thinking it would be weird to have a vote parked on me but shoot radishes instead.

But then I ISOed Tony and realized he doesn’t call his votes, so it’s a moot point.

At any rate, I don’t really want to force a claim so I’d rather cut this off now.

[nutella]

K whatever I'll leave it alone

[nutella]

Actually though it's weird he never even mentioned you this phase as far as I can see, let alone called why he was voting for you. That's odd. [mention]TonyStarkPrime[/mention] when and why did you vote for Nanook? I see suspicions of some other people in your D2 iso and no mentions of Nanook or why you decided to vote him.

[speedchuck]

Some questions to consider:

If nutella is scum, would she be as up-front-and-center as she is now? Kinda powerwolfing if so, even if she's suspected.

If MP is town (regardless of nutella's alignment) would he be voting only based on who he can save and who he trusts rather than, IDK, actually having reads of his own?

[speedchuck]

I know it seems like I'm going back and checking myself a lot but I don't know how many times I've tunneled nutella when we were both town

[speedchuck]

I especially want Jack to answer because I've been mindmelding with him but not as stubbornly, and this way I can devil's advocate him with my second-guessing

[speedchuck]

I will shoot Sloonei if that's the consensus. He might be bad. He might have bowed back out due to the extra pressures of being bad. He might be Civ, and the secret votes will be unanimous. We can't let him get to Final 3 either way, right?

Shoot?

[speedchuck]

Vig slip?

Scum slip?

Freudian slip?

Pink slip?

[speedchuck]

Summary post of my reads, with a bunch of retread and some new stuff, incoming.

[Sloonei]

i don't care what you do to me. i asked the hosts for a second replacement, but that's a difficult spot for them to be in if they already had to resort to me in the first place. unless there's reason to assume i'll be replaced quickly, i'd agree that it's best to not leave a player slot like mine around longterm.

sorry.

[speedchuck]

Jackofhearts2005 - almost mechanically confirmed as town (not 100%), mind-melding, I'm happy with resting on this townread

Dragon D. Luffy - went heavy after MR on D1, to the point that it endangered him with some people defending MR. Top town boy.

Hyena - has been playing fast and loose all game, similar to the way 112 was playing. A D1 vote on MR, campaigning for Nanook to join him. Doesn't post like he has anything to hide.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - I don't really have any reason to lynch Nanook anymore. Ironically, he's addressed most of my grievances toward his tone and action by aggressively pursuing me.

Dr. Wilgy - fakeslip? I wouldn't put too much credence in that, but I've got a slight townread there regardless. Posting stream-of-consciousness and still implicating scum with it is pretty townly.

TonyStarkPrime - not lynching today, he's not really here and is not a top suspect, we can solve him later, townread when we left him. Note that MR voted Tony D1, an off-wagon vote.


Long Con - on second look does not look good with Master Radishes in his own interactions. ISO him and look for 'radish' and 'MR'. I townread LC otherwise, but he's recently proved how slippery he can be. I remember MR did some weird stuff on his side of the reaction, townreading LC while keeping options open. But was he keeping options open to push LC or bus LC?

juliets - has been gut pinging me all game, and her MR interactions don't look good. That hasn't really progressed any since nutella first made the case. I don't feel really strong about it, but it's not a bad case.

MPlus7 - As I said in a post a bit ago, he's voting based on who he trusts and on saving nutella. Not on scumreads, and not even based on a POE of townreads. It's not hunting, whatever it is. Plus there was the sig lynch mess... and yeah, I still have a scumread here. Don't care what the post count is.

nutella - I'm not going to say anything here that hasn't been said. Nutella's interactions with nanook look like pocketing, with MP look like performance, and her reaction to the Jack confirm / MR kill are less than inspiring. Her reads don't follow any conventional nutella meta, much as she likes to explain that away, and I didn't like the way she recently backed off nutella and decided that suddenly she could be wrong about everything after she's been right about everything for 20 hours since MR's death. She is posting a lot though, and if she has an agenda it's not a very good one. I tinfoil on this.

Sloonei - Good candidate for secret lynch, not much to say

My POE is too big, but luckily a lynch or two will narrow it down tremendously. No way are Juliets and Nutella scum together.
Note that the MR voters are all three on top of my readlist. That just happened, by accident. And the sig voters are...

...

Another post incoming.

[speedchuck]

Okay so jack voted sig, apparently. I was one of the MR voters, and I'm not on my own readlist. Sorry for the confusion.

Anywho.

Nanook voted Sig for self Prez. I suspect everyone else who voted Sig except Jack.
Why DID you vote Sig, Jack?

[speedchuck]

I won't have a whole lot more time to play today, but I know where I'm leaning. I'd like Long Con addressed soon (though we might not have time today), and I'd prefer some responses to the newer things I've mentioned in my above post.

[nutella]

I looked into LC earlier -- I was also thinking that his MR interactions didn't look great, but then I saw that one post of his during the flavor-alignment discussion that I just could never see coming from non-town. Maybe I shouldn't put as much stock in that as I am though.

[Long Con]

I will shoot Sloonei if that's the consensus. He might be bad. He might have bowed back out due to the extra pressures of being bad. He might be Civ, and the secret votes will be unanimous. We can't let him get to Final 3 either way, right?

Shoot?

Responding to this:

Fair, do we have a solid list of who all is for the Sloonei shot and have any other names been suggested (other than me of course)?

[speedchuck]

I looked into LC earlier -- I was also thinking that his MR interactions didn't look great, but then I saw that one post of his during the flavor-alignment discussion that I just could never see coming from non-town. Maybe I shouldn't put as much stock in that as I am though.

Please requote it. I have the memory of a koala.

[speedchuck]

I will shoot Sloonei if that's the consensus. He might be bad. He might have bowed back out due to the extra pressures of being bad. He might be Civ, and the secret votes will be unanimous. We can't let him get to Final 3 either way, right?

Shoot?

Responding to this:

Fair, do we have a solid list of who all is for the Sloonei shot and have any other names been suggested (other than me of course)?

[DrWilgy]

I'm onboard with the Sloonei kill, though it does hurt to vote on presence over hunting.

How pressured has Jules been this game? Has her life been endangered?

[Hyena]

At a glace, I can't tell if I like Hyena or not. The play of 'watch them squirm and untangle the truth in the chaos' resonates with me, but ultimately comes from a selfish mindset. Not directly town or scum, but a selfish mindset does assist scum more.

I have to giggle at this if only for how accurate it is, lol. I can't help but take joy in making people squirm.

I feel like everyone's townreading me. I don't feel like I've received any pressure from anyone today. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm attacked tonight and am dead N2.

You still feel like this?

Nah. I did receive some pressure from Nutella in between D1 and D2, but after Radish got shot, the pressure disappeared and I shot back upwards in people's reads lists since I was one of the Radish voters at the end of D1.

[Hyena]

I don't believe Speedchuck is mafia, and I'm saying this as the person who corrected him when he suggested the possibility that Nanook might struggle to find reasons to scumread people as scum. I'm the one that gave evidence (i.e. Nanook and I successfully lynching a cop D1 in G8 of MU Champs last year) for why this wasn't the case. If I didn't have that evidence though, and if I hadn't played with Nanook before, I don't think I would have seen Speedchuck's post as scummy. It's the way he delivered the post (if that makes any sense) that felt towny. It didn't feel, like, accusatory in a way where Speedchuck was going to just start pushing him just for that. He kinda just brought up the possibility and left it as just that -- a possibility.

Nanook, if you believe Speedchuck is scum, do you think Nutella is with him? Do you think any of Juliets, MP7, or Juliets is with him? If not, then what kind of team are you looking at right now? Radish, Speedchuck, + 1 of the inactives?

Could be nutella, yeah. Not interested in MP or Jules. Could definitely have a non entity scum. I don’t really have a read on LC, so not really ruling him out tbh.

Honestly I’m not even sure how much I think chuck is scum vs. how much I’m annoyed by him. I do think >rand but I’m not locking it. Probably should reread but I’m lazy.

Okay, okay, that's fair. But yeah, I don't think I'm ever going for Chuck today, and I don't think I want to vote for LC either right now. LC is middle-of-the-pack for me, though leaning more town than scum. I'm still mulling over the Nutella and Jules stuff.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I’m town. Process of elimination gives you my character and my power follows swiftly. I don’t think I’ll be around much in the following day phase, so please don’t try to lynch me.

I forgot he said this though so maybe I shouldn't dismiss his lack of activity. Also not sure what he's hinting at about his role. Anyone think it's possible he's the one who shot MR? That may be worth looking into.

I'm sick and super busy. I'm keeping up.

[Hyena]

Jackofhearts2005 - almost mechanically confirmed as town (not 100%), mind-melding, I'm happy with resting on this townread

Dragon D. Luffy - went heavy after MR on D1, to the point that it endangered him with some people defending MR. Top town boy.

Hyena - has been playing fast and loose all game, similar to the way 112 was playing. A D1 vote on MR, campaigning for Nanook to join him. Doesn't post like he has anything to hide.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - I don't really have any reason to lynch Nanook anymore. Ironically, he's addressed most of my grievances toward his tone and action by aggressively pursuing me.

Yeah, I'd be happy calling the five of us my town core right now. I feel comfortable with everyone here.

Dr. Wilgy - fakeslip? I wouldn't put too much credence in that, but I've got a slight townread there regardless. Posting stream-of-consciousness and still implicating scum with it is pretty townly.

He made me laugh, so I want to keep him around a little longer now.

TonyStarkPrime - not lynching today, he's not really here and is not a top suspect, we can solve him later, townread when we left him. Note that MR voted Tony D1, an off-wagon vote.


Long Con - on second look does not look good with Master Radishes in his own interactions. ISO him and look for 'radish' and 'MR'. I townread LC otherwise, but he's recently proved how slippery he can be. I remember MR did some weird stuff on his side of the reaction, townreading LC while keeping options open. But was he keeping options open to push LC or bus LC?

I haven't gone back and reevaluated either Tony or LC in a while, but I do recall having LC above Tony. Though yeah, these are middle-of-the-pack people for me, too. Radish voting Tony is what's making me hesitant to continue going after him right now. I'll probably do more work to sort these two tomorrow if I'm alive.

juliets - has been gut pinging me all game, and her MR interactions don't look good. That hasn't really progressed any since nutella first made the case. I don't feel really strong about it, but it's not a bad case.

MPlus7 - As I said in a post a bit ago, he's voting based on who he trusts and on saving nutella. Not on scumreads, and not even based on a POE of townreads. It's not hunting, whatever it is. Plus there was the sig lynch mess... and yeah, I still have a scumread here. Don't care what the post count is.

nutella - I'm not going to say anything here that hasn't been said. Nutella's interactions with nanook look like pocketing, with MP look like performance, and her reaction to the Jack confirm / MR kill are less than inspiring. Her reads don't follow any conventional nutella meta, much as she likes to explain that away, and I didn't like the way she recently backed off nutella and decided that suddenly she could be wrong about everything after she's been right about everything for 20 hours since MR's death. She is posting a lot though, and if she has an agenda it's not a very good one. I tinfoil on this.

I'm still going back and forth on Jules and Nute, though now, I'm leaning towards wanting Nute dead over Jules. Someone mentioned something about how she has had a lot of scumreads and pushes that ended up not panning out for her, and it made me remember Nute saying that she wasn't that great at scum. I dunno why that thought kinda stuck so suddenly in my head, but it's there now. I'll probably think this over some more though.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Actually though it's weird he never even mentioned you this phase as far as I can see, let alone called why he was voting for you. That's odd. @TonyStarkPrime when and why did you vote for Nanook? I see suspicions of some other people in your D2 iso and no mentions of Nanook or why you decided to vote him.

tbh I have no clue. I realized earlier when Juliets asked why Nanook was voting for me that I was parked on Nanook. I think I opened by wanting to express discontent with MP votes and so I was looking for a good counter-target. I can't read Nanook but I suppose if I TR MP I should be giving him the benefit of the doubt on at least one of his lock town reads.