Jack Attack Mafia (Day 5)

[Millium]

[mention]JaggedJimmyJay[/mention]
Rule of 3 is love
Rule of 3 is life
I live and die by the Rule of 3!

This answer rubs me the wrong way. It doesn't look like Alison is referring to a player she actually finds "suspicious" (and Epignosis is central in her POE pool).

Ya I see what you mean

[Hally]

[VOTE: epi] aubergine

i hate to do this but

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Epignosis would probably be the most sensible chop when exploring this universe.

[Millium]

if Colin is a wolf, he can effectively never touch any of us with his roleblock or he outs himself
the claim was stupid and unnecessary, the claim itself is wolfy because it comes in a way that exists just to make him look better
It pretty much depends on how "reactive" Colin is, so its relatively NAI in terms of towniness

[JaggedJimmyJay]

im just going to say it: I don't believe all this stuff about girl genius. TSP, I don't buy that you saw sprityo play this game, thought "this is really different from when he was a serial killer in girl genius", and then went off "I don't think sprityo is 3P this game".

first of all, this read is super tenuous. sprityo lurked as SK in one game one time, and he... still lurked here, but slightly less, so he's not the same alignment? huh?

second of all... why was your head even at SKs? at the time the prevailing theory was that vig shot FG, and the mafia shot nanook, remember? there was no hint of an SK at that point in time. we all knew it could be a possibility, but for you to draw the mental connection "this slot isn't SK because it doesn't match sprityo's 1-game SK meta" -> "this slot probably isn't 3P" - does that make sense? why can't that slot be some other third party role?

Also put off by this. I deliberately exaggerated my angst about Tony's "slip" and this is precisely the kind of post I thought a mafioso might come up with if he is innocent.

[sabie12]

i could see the team being like exactly epi/alison/kitsu if kitsu is a wolf

I mean I thought alison and colin could be but hey either way I'm down with an alison vote.

im honestly still not feeling colin as a wolf

I think for me it was in connection with alison and their interaction that made me feel colin could be scum.

I'm debating whether I want to vote alison or epi. I was leaning alison but either seems like a decent choice for today.

[Hally]

alison/epi interactions honestly do read w/w

like they went at each other fairly aggressively but then just... dropped it

has either one of them actually tried to kill the other in this game

it feels like they always have someone they’d rather go after

[JaggedJimmyJay]

alison/epi interactions honestly do read w/w

like they went at each other fairly aggressively but then just... dropped it

has either one of them actually tried to kill the other in this game

it feels like they always have someone they’d rather go after

It's almost like a softer rehearsal of LC/JJJ.

[Millium]

Sabie's posts annoy me...

[Hally]

yea i like the epi/alison world

i think they each have relatively high chance of being a wolf individually and they also make sense as a pair

think this is the pair i wanna yeet in today

if this is the correct world we’ll have plenty of time to find the third, whether it’s kitsu or colin or whoever

[sabie12]

Sabie's posts annoy me...

Cool

[sabie12]

[VOTE: alison] aubergine

Going away now since I'm annoying. Later y'all

[Hally]

wisp what was that for

[Hally]

[VOTE: alison] aubergine

Going away now since I'm annoying. Later y'all

you're not annoying you’re lovely!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: alison] aubergine

Going away now since I'm annoying. Later y'all

You're not annoying sabie. I think that was an unfortunate way to describe "suspicious". We're always glad to get your takes!

[Millium]

cause its like "She is here" but only posts when she feels like it
it triggers me

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine
Guess I dont inherently care, and I want to see how she responds

still think Kitsu looks terrible outside the "Miller Slip"

[Millium]

like how is that a townie reaction to my post...
I don't think I was being mean, it just feels like an over-reaction, jesus man

[JaggedJimmyJay]

like how is that a townie reaction to my post...
I don't think I was being mean, it just feels like an over-reaction, jesus man

Some folks don't like being called "annoying", understandably. Remember the vibes of Glorious Holy Game 6.

[Millium]

like how is that a townie reaction to my post...
I don't think I was being mean, it just feels like an over-reaction, jesus man

Some folks don't like being called "annoying", understandably. Remember the vibes of Glorious Holy Game 6.

Meh I can't help it
I try to choose my words better
"Suspicious" probably would have been better I guess

[nutella]

i could see the team being like exactly epi/alison/kitsu if kitsu is a wolf

This

[Hally]

im sure you didn’t mean any offense wisp but it still came off a bit rude

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Anyway sabie is town.

[Hally]

hm seems like a lot of ppl are settling into the same world now

i feel good about the convergence of me/nut/jay/wisp

[TonyStarkPrime]

What world have we converged on?

[Millium]

I'm not accepting that read yet
I saw ur meta argument and its ok, but all I see is them never taking a front force to any of the games they play in, regardless of alignment

[Hally]

What world have we converged on?

epi/alison with possibly kitsu as third

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm not accepting that read yet
I saw ur meta argument and its ok, but all I see is them never taking a front force to any of the games they play in, regardless of alignment

How do you feel if this is sabie's most active game of her "career"?

[Millium]

I'm not accepting that read yet
I saw ur meta argument and its ok, but all I see is them never taking a front force to any of the games they play in, regardless of alignment

How do you feel if this is sabie's most active game of her "career"?

I don't know man, I'll think about it again at a later time

[JaggedJimmyJay]

What world have we converged on?

epi/alison with possibly kitsu as third

[mention]TonyStarkPrime[/mention] what do you think of this world?

[KitsuShel]

idk what to do tbh

You and Nanook were my #1s right from the start, and I’ve listened to everything you’ve said in this thread. But I can appreciate that this is not an easy game. I’ll vote with you. I’ve openly welcomed any investigation other than straight alignment copping since that wouldn’t help since I’m a miller.

And if I live through the night, I’ll happily name claim during the next day phase.

this post is honestly very weird

first post kitsu made that really struck me this way

I thought you were talking to me in the post before i posted that, so I was responding to that.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I thought you were talking to me in the post before i posted that, so I was responding to that.

How do you feel about Epignosis and Alison?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Sidebar for KitsuShel: I know this is a wack environment and we are very much not HCRealms, but I'm super glad you've joined us and have enjoyed playing with you regardless of your alignment.

[KitsuShel]

I thought you were talking to me in the post before i posted that, so I was responding to that.

How do you feel about Epignosis and Alison?

I’ve stated before, I’m not feeling great about more than half of the players atm. Right now, they’re part of that. Epi moreso than Alison.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I’ve stated before, I’m not feeling great about more than half of the players atm. Right now, they’re part of that. Epi moreso than Alison.

Could you please clarify? Your previous reads list suggested you suspected Alison more than Epignosis:

So you can’t keep throwing out there that I haven’t “offered any insight”, this my list/ranking atm. Likely town, from top to bottom.

Hally
JJJ
Wisp
Spacedaisy
Sabie
Nutella
Epi
ColinIsCool
Alison
Long Con
TonyStarkPrime

[KitsuShel]

Sidebar for KitsuShel: I know this is a wack environment and we are very much not HCRealms, but I'm super glad you've joined us and have enjoyed playing with you regardless of your alignment.

Haha, I appreciate that. It’s a game and I take no offense.

I’m glad to pick up some new styles and maybe take them home, lol. I’m not sure I’ll be any good at behavioral analysis no matter what, though.

I *am* town though.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I’m not sure I’ll be any good at behavioral analysis no matter what, though.

That's what Jack and Tony and colonialbob said, but now look at 'em go.

[KitsuShel]

I’ve stated before, I’m not feeling great about more than half of the players atm. Right now, they’re part of that. Epi moreso than Alison.

Could you please clarify? Your previous reads list suggested you suspected Alison more than Epignosis:

So you can’t keep throwing out there that I haven’t “offered any insight”, this my list/ranking atm. Likely town, from top to bottom.

Hally
JJJ
Wisp
Spacedaisy
Sabie
Nutella
Epi
ColinIsCool
Alison
Long Con
TonyStarkPrime

Atm = At the moment

At the moment, I’m leaning more towards Epi being mafia than Alison, but I wouldn’t be surprised either way.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Atm = At the moment

At the moment, I’m leaning more towards Epi being mafia than Alison, but I wouldn’t be surprised either way.

Cool. Could you describe briefly what has led you to this change of heart about how to prioritize the two of them? I realize I am incessant with my questions, so thank you for humoring me.

[KitsuShel]

I’m not sure I’ll be any good at behavioral analysis no matter what, though.

That's what Jack and Tony and colonialbob said, but now look at 'em go.

JoH is the only one of them that I have any familiarity with. Hell, I didn’t even know Long Con had been on Realms until I just came across an old Hybridity game.

[KitsuShel]

Atm = At the moment

At the moment, I’m leaning more towards Epi being mafia than Alison, but I wouldn’t be surprised either way.

Cool. Could you describe briefly what has led you to this change of heart about how to prioritize the two of them? I realize I am incessant with my questions, so thank you for humoring me.

I’d say probably because Alison has been more active maybe?

NGL, in a situation where I don’t have a good feel for something, I tend to sheep and follow whomever I feel is most town-like. Atm, it’s you and Hally. Followed by Wisp, Spacedaisy, and Sabie.

If I don’t have a good handle of who I think is mafia, I’ll throw my vote on whomever the majority feel like it should be.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Cool beans. I'd like to see what others think of this exchange.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[TonyStarkPrime]

What world have we converged on?

epi/alison with possibly kitsu as third

@TonyStarkPrime what do you think of this world?

I was there first. Kitsu is probably a less likely third than Colin. Colin’s displaying some really townie bonafides today though.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I’m not sure I’ll be any good at behavioral analysis no matter what, though.

That's what Jack and Tony and colonialbob said, but now look at 'em go.

JoH is the only one of them that I have any familiarity with. Hell, I didn’t even know Long Con had been on Realms until I just came across an old Hybridity game.

Was it H15? Such a brilliant game.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Cool beans. I'd like to see what others think of this exchange.

Kitsu town.

[KitsuShel]

I’m not sure I’ll be any good at behavioral analysis no matter what, though.

That's what Jack and Tony and colonialbob said, but now look at 'em go.

JoH is the only one of them that I have any familiarity with. Hell, I didn’t even know Long Con had been on Realms until I just came across an old Hybridity game.

Was it H15? Such a brilliant game.

Yes! I bookmarked to give a good read through at a later date. It looks like it was a great game.

[Long Con]

I’m not sure I’ll be any good at behavioral analysis no matter what, though.

That's what Jack and Tony and colonialbob said, but now look at 'em go.

JoH is the only one of them that I have any familiarity with. Hell, I didn’t even know Long Con had been on Realms until I just came across an old Hybridity game.

Was it H15? Such a brilliant game.

Yes! I bookmarked to give a good read through at a later date. It looks like it was a great game.

Always a good time in the Realms.

[Alison]

TSP still has not answered my question about his reads

I missed it. Can someone direct me? I’m on my phone, I left my computer elsewhere and due to current deadly viruses haven’t had the opportunity to retrieve it yet.

how is epi "I never bus" gnosis treating me the way he does if I am his scum buddy

If you're both mafia, then Epignosis has not bussed you at all in this game. He has attempted to generate distance perhaps, but there has been no bussing. That'd go both ways.

he's explicitly said I was scum and tried to push me a few times

[Alison]

Estimated number of times Epignosis has voiced suspicion of Alison: 9-11

Estimated number of times Alison has voiced suspicion of Epignosis: 6-8

Numbers vary because I don't want a single discussion of numerous posts to count more than once.

Number of votes either has placed for the other: 0

maybe b/c we're both intelligent players who understand that the other person is not getting exed d1 or d2 and prefer to use voting agency in more productive ways?

(also, if this is meant to imply an epi/alison wolf team, do you really think epi "i do not bus" gnosis treats his teammate the way he has treated me?)

This answer rubs me the wrong way. It doesn't look like Alison is referring to a player she actually finds "suspicious" (and Epignosis is central in her POE pool). Also that question about bussing does not reflect what has occurred in this game. They've never promoted a lynch of one another -- indeed that parenthetical stands in opposition to the question directly above it. Distancing is not bussing.

I don't understand why we would ever want Wisp and Daisy checking the same person. Neither of you need to say anymore than you want to say about this/who you're going for, but @Alison please clarify. That strikes me as a major waste.

because we suspect there is a scum redirector in the game. let's say wisp and daisy target whoever they want. the redirector hits wisp and redirects them, making their result useless. daisy targets [someone of their preference] and gets a result on that.

now consider the alternative idea. daisy and wisp both target the same person. this time, the scum redirector can't target both daisy and wisp. they'll still target wisp to deny max info, but daisy gets the check on the target anyway, and ends up targeting [target of town's preference].

in both cases, wisp gets redirected to someone else, so it's the same there. the difference is daisy's target. if you believe that [target of town's preference] is superior to [target of daisy's preference] - ie. if you believe that town combing through the POE and establishing the towncore over the past few dozen pages can come up with a better value investigation target than whoever daisy chooses to investigate, which I do, simply because town working together is better than one person working alone - then my strategy is superior.

you may be tempted to ask: why not have daisy investigate the target of our choice, and wisp investigates whoever they want to? Because then daisy gets redirected, and wisp investigates [target of their choice], while the investigation status of the person that town chose daisy to investigate is still unknown. so it's still [target of wisp's choice] vs [target of our choice] being better as an investigation target.

This strategy frees up the hypothetical mafia redirector to target someone other than the Wisp/Daisy pairing. If those two target different people, the mafia are forced to target one of them to limit the damage to one check. If they both target the same person, the civilians still only get one check and the mafia are free to tamper with someone else. This dynamic regarding "their choice" vs. "town's choice" is a red herring.

1) Epi and I have definitely tried to get the other executed, wtf? We've made cases against each other and put each other deep into the POE. In the context of this game, that is setting someone up to be killed. Also I have no clue why you think that is how I refer to someone who I don't actually suspect.

2) My strategy is optimal and I don't care if the redirector targets anyone outside of Wisp/Daisy. If civillians get one check either way, I want civillians to have a check decided on by the entire town, not by the whims of Wisp or Spacedaisy.

[Alison]

also I disagree with this kitsu execute strongly. I'd much rather carry out the POE and every single person in the POE has much higher scum equity than kitsu right now.