Philosophers' Mafia [ENDGAME]

[iaafr]

so is it just dizzy

or amy

or u

[protocultures]

LC is confirmed from v!hallys pov so

he is impossible to tinfoil without also tinfoiling hally

the converse isnt true (w hally / v lc is possible), but yeah

probably just cant be lc

i still buy that hally just couldnt make that claim up as wolf

I dont understand Hally's clears. They ALL depend on MR being mafia. How does Hally KNOW that MR was mafia.

Why does Hally clear Nutella?

Why does Hally clear LC?

It all relies on MR being mafia. There is nothing to confirm MR was mafia.

I dont want to vote for Hally, I advocated a check on Hally.

if I die in poe, its whatever since I said its not terrible for me to die yesterday.

if Mr isn't mafia he has to be vig

if Mr is vig, Nutella has to be scum

people have entertained this world and mostly still concluded it's less likely than Nutella being what she claims with the nightkill from MR Having been redirected

Agree with the bold and highlights.

Most people concluding MR was mafia should not make Hally CLEAR Nutella or LC.

It does not CLEAR Hally.

It does not CLEAR Nutella.

It doesnt even CLEAR LC from Hallys perspective, because they only said their power doesnt work if they redirect mafia to mafia.

[protocultures]

if proto flips town should i peek in dizzy-amy-iaafr-benson or should i peek hally to clear her + lc? (and nut??? but i forgot again)

Not even sure you should check Hally anymore if I die today, its prob too late.

Just assume Hally is real and check/kill into POE since thats prob only way we win.

[protocultures]

if i’m checked and ppl still concoct a weird ass tinfoil of how i, lc or nut can be still be wolves i’m punting whatever person tinfoils that into the sun

when i come back green that is the end of the tinfoil. full stop

not gonna have tutuu burn a check on me just to have someone tell me why it doesn’t mean what it actually means

mafia cant roleblock or redirect, so tutuu's check will be clean

[nutella]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

[protocultures]

tbh actually mafia killing tim could be like a game losing play

they really had to target within the clears because like, eventually i will be confirmed and so will nut, lc, colin, tutuu, wwh and nanook

and like, i don’t think wolves have enough nights left to kill all the clear ppl if they didn’t start like... last night and even then it’s a stretch

but like i think no matter what kill they make there theyre fucked in some way

Please stop calling people confirmed then when they are not.

Tutuu is almost confirmed for redchecking mafia.
Nanoon is almost confirmed for shooting mafia.
WWH is confirmed because of my logic as to why mafia dont have a redirect, which you said you didnt understand.

Thats it.

Nobody else is really confirmed.

from MY pov, LC is confirmed to have not gone anywhere/done anything in the first night, unless someone with higher priority jacked me in the night.

people are confirmed, you just don’t understand why

Explain it then so Tutuu doesnt burn a check instead of saying "ffs im town stop being dumb"

[nutella]

the only world in which hally is lying is the world in which hally and lc are mafia teammates and made up the whole vest thing, and we don't have an explanation for what would have really happened to their kill in that situation (at least from my pov since i know i killed radishes, but obv mafia would never kill radishes there if he was town lol?)

[nutella]

and I don't enter into that world at all still. I killed a mafia fucking leave me alone

[protocultures]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

[Long Con]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

Could be MR is town, and you are town. That's fine in the Hally-is-scum world.

[Long Con]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

Hally says she can't make Mafia kill Mafia with her redirect, I believe.

[nutella]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

I AM TOWN VIGI I SHOT RADISHES AND HE DIED AND IT WAS JANITORED LIKE MY ROLE SAYS

are you suggesting there was another town vigi who shot LC

???????????

[protocultures]

Hally and Nutella are way more linked than Hally to LC.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

This isn’t technically true yeah? In theory MR could’ve been town vig and LC BP mafia

I’m not saying that’s the case just saying it isn’t, like...impossible mechanically

[Long Con]

Hally and Nutella are way more linked than Hally to LC.

No, I don't agree they are linked.

[protocultures]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

Hally says she can't make Mafia kill Mafia with her redirect, I believe.

Right, so Hally can only clear LC if hally KNOWS MR is mafia.

How does Hally KNOW MR is mafia? They dont.

[nutella]

Hally and Nutella are way more linked than Hally to LC.

This is just provably untrue lmfao

I feel like you haven't read half the game to even have this thought

[Hally]

tbh actually mafia killing tim could be like a game losing play

they really had to target within the clears because like, eventually i will be confirmed and so will nut, lc, colin, tutuu, wwh and nanook

and like, i don’t think wolves have enough nights left to kill all the clear ppl if they didn’t start like... last night and even then it’s a stretch

but like i think no matter what kill they make there theyre fucked in some way

Please stop calling people confirmed then when they are not.

Tutuu is almost confirmed for redchecking mafia.
Nanoon is almost confirmed for shooting mafia.
WWH is confirmed because of my logic as to why mafia dont have a redirect, which you said you didnt understand.

Thats it.

Nobody else is really confirmed.

from MY pov, LC is confirmed to have not gone anywhere/done anything in the first night, unless someone with higher priority jacked me in the night.

people are confirmed, you just don’t understand why

Explain it then so Tutuu doesnt burn a check instead of saying "ffs im town stop being dumb"

i refuse to explain it again

[protocultures]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

I AM TOWN VIGI I SHOT RADISHES AND HE DIED AND IT WAS JANITORED LIKE MY ROLE SAYS

are you suggesting there was another town vigi who shot LC

???????????

Your claim is also super unconfirmed to everyone except you.

[Long Con]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

This isn’t technically true yeah? In theory MR could’ve been town vig and LC BP mafia

I’m not saying that’s the case just saying it isn’t, like...impossible mechanically

But Mafia killing MR is truly outlandish.

[nutella]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

This isn’t technically true yeah? In theory MR could’ve been town vig and LC BP mafia

I’m not saying that’s the case just saying it isn’t, like...impossible mechanically

.....ok technically yes but i would be pretty shocked


radish was just a wolf

[protocultures]

Hally and Nutella are way more linked than Hally to LC.

This is just provably untrue lmfao

I feel like you haven't read half the game to even have this thought

I am asking the same questions over and over, nobody is giving me answers that clear the people it says it clears.

Nutella pov is at least consistent.

Hally's is not.

[Long Con]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

Hally says she can't make Mafia kill Mafia with her redirect, I believe.

Right, so Hally can only clear LC if hally KNOWS MR is mafia.

How does Hally KNOW MR is mafia? They dont.

She knows because the Mafia had a kill to make that night, and it didn't go through. She redirected Radish onto me, and I took a kill hit and survived. The logic is pretty clear.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

But yeah I mean....


Look, Proto, if you’re town and the POE fails I promise I’ll think about these worlds

But at this point in the game we can afford to assume we have lock and reassess if it’s proven to be a false lock, I’m not interested in breaking a potential lock just for tinfoil rn lol

[Hally]

if this entire house of cards tinfoil hinges on radishes being exactly town vig then like... why are we discussing it

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

This isn’t technically true yeah? In theory MR could’ve been town vig and LC BP mafia

I’m not saying that’s the case just saying it isn’t, like...impossible mechanically

But Mafia killing MR is truly outlandish.

Yeah it is

Hence why I’m not interested in exploring those worlds right now!

[tutuu]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

This isn’t technically true yeah? In theory MR could’ve been town vig and LC BP mafia

I’m not saying that’s the case just saying it isn’t, like...impossible mechanically

But Mafia killing MR is truly outlandish.

It is, unless they had like a day cop or a n0 cop or some extra mech stuff that let them know MR's role (potential town vig) in advance. or something

[nutella]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

I AM TOWN VIGI I SHOT RADISHES AND HE DIED AND IT WAS JANITORED LIKE MY ROLE SAYS

are you suggesting there was another town vigi who shot LC

???????????

Your claim is also super unconfirmed to everyone except you.

LC believes it because of the percentage thing, other people believe it because it's too specific for me to have made up, idk dude think what you want but look at how i claimed it right away, i can't come up with that as scum lol

[protocultures]

tbh actually mafia killing tim could be like a game losing play

they really had to target within the clears because like, eventually i will be confirmed and so will nut, lc, colin, tutuu, wwh and nanook

and like, i don’t think wolves have enough nights left to kill all the clear ppl if they didn’t start like... last night and even then it’s a stretch

but like i think no matter what kill they make there theyre fucked in some way

Please stop calling people confirmed then when they are not.

Tutuu is almost confirmed for redchecking mafia.
Nanoon is almost confirmed for shooting mafia.
WWH is confirmed because of my logic as to why mafia dont have a redirect, which you said you didnt understand.

Thats it.

Nobody else is really confirmed.

from MY pov, LC is confirmed to have not gone anywhere/done anything in the first night, unless someone with higher priority jacked me in the night.

people are confirmed, you just don’t understand why

Explain it then so Tutuu doesnt burn a check instead of saying "ffs im town stop being dumb"

i refuse to explain it again

cool

dont complain if we lose from a check on you then

[Long Con]

Benson also said he didn't actually protect tutuu that night as well...? Or was that a joke? Alison randed onto... ted was it? Maybe the Mafia tried to kill ted... but then who hit me in the vest? I guess I'm scum in that world, lying about the vest, to support a larger conspiracy.

[Hally]

Hally and Nutella are way more linked than Hally to LC.

This is just provably untrue lmfao

I feel like you haven't read half the game to even have this thought

I am asking the same questions over and over, nobody is giving me answers that clear the people it says it clears.

Nutella pov is at least consistent.

Hally's is not.

my pov is entirely consistent with the info i have and i will not explain it again gl

[nutella]

Hally and Nutella are way more linked than Hally to LC.

This is just provably untrue lmfao

I feel like you haven't read half the game to even have this thought

I am asking the same questions over and over, nobody is giving me answers that clear the people it says it clears.

Nutella pov is at least consistent.

Hally's is not.

how is hally's pov not consistent?? what???

[Long Con]

I am aware of no inconsistency.

[protocultures]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

Hally says she can't make Mafia kill Mafia with her redirect, I believe.

Right, so Hally can only clear LC if hally KNOWS MR is mafia.

How does Hally KNOW MR is mafia? They dont.

She knows because the Mafia had a kill to make that night, and it didn't go through. She redirected Radish onto me, and I took a kill hit and survived. The logic is pretty clear.

Alison saved Tim (confirmed)
Benson is claiming a save on Tutuu

Why does LC vest being pinged prove MR as mafia?

It doesnt.

mafia KP could have been blocked by Alison or Benson.

mafia could also have no killed (potentially)

[iaafr]

*quietly rereads amy iso*

41/60

[Hally]

tbh actually mafia killing tim could be like a game losing play

they really had to target within the clears because like, eventually i will be confirmed and so will nut, lc, colin, tutuu, wwh and nanook

and like, i don’t think wolves have enough nights left to kill all the clear ppl if they didn’t start like... last night and even then it’s a stretch

but like i think no matter what kill they make there theyre fucked in some way

Please stop calling people confirmed then when they are not.

Tutuu is almost confirmed for redchecking mafia.
Nanoon is almost confirmed for shooting mafia.
WWH is confirmed because of my logic as to why mafia dont have a redirect, which you said you didnt understand.

Thats it.

Nobody else is really confirmed.

from MY pov, LC is confirmed to have not gone anywhere/done anything in the first night, unless someone with higher priority jacked me in the night.

people are confirmed, you just don’t understand why

Explain it then so Tutuu doesnt burn a check instead of saying "ffs im town stop being dumb"

i refuse to explain it again

cool

dont complain if we lose from a check on you then

i will complain loudly if we lose because ppl wouldn’t stop tinfoiling me and i will be justified in doing so

we aren’t losing though

[Long Con]

Who hit me then?

[protocultures]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

I AM TOWN VIGI I SHOT RADISHES AND HE DIED AND IT WAS JANITORED LIKE MY ROLE SAYS

are you suggesting there was another town vigi who shot LC

???????????

Your claim is also super unconfirmed to everyone except you.

LC believes it because of the percentage thing, other people believe it because it's too specific for me to have made up, idk dude think what you want but look at how i claimed it right away, i can't come up with that as scum lol

This is exactly how I make the claim if I am scum.

[Long Con]

That world has a third kill involved.

[nutella]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

This isn’t technically true yeah? In theory MR could’ve been town vig and LC BP mafia

I’m not saying that’s the case just saying it isn’t, like...impossible mechanically

But Mafia killing MR is truly outlandish.

It is, unless they had like a day cop or a n0 cop or some extra mech stuff that let them know MR's role (potential town vig) in advance. or something

not even then. town had radish fucking dead to rights by n1. he was always going to be the yeet if he had survived the night. this was discussed in thread multiple times. he was essentially being treated as an outed wolf. in the very unlikely world where radish was town, there is zero chance mafia ever kill him. it's a fucking free misyeet in that world.



i killed a wolf just deal with it

[Long Con]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

I AM TOWN VIGI I SHOT RADISHES AND HE DIED AND IT WAS JANITORED LIKE MY ROLE SAYS

are you suggesting there was another town vigi who shot LC

???????????

Your claim is also super unconfirmed to everyone except you.

LC believes it because of the percentage thing, other people believe it because it's too specific for me to have made up, idk dude think what you want but look at how i claimed it right away, i can't come up with that as scum lol

This is exactly how I make the claim if I am scum.

nutella kills Radishes as scum (why??? how??) and then claims town vig on the kill. Radioshes was town vig and hit me (why?). Is that what you're proposing?

[protocultures]

Benson also said he didn't actually protect tutuu that night as well...? Or was that a joke? Alison randed onto... ted was it? Maybe the Mafia tried to kill ted... but then who hit me in the vest? I guess I'm scum in that world, lying about the vest, to support a larger conspiracy.

LC - you can be in both worlds.

I just know you didnt go anywhere Night 1 - unless i got redirected.

Colin knows you didnt go anywhere night 1 - unless they got redirected.

LC is prob one of the people who should be killed last other than people like tuutu/nanook, but LC isnt cleared either.

[iaafr]

[VOTE: amy] aubergine

tunnels back on baby woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo lets gooooo

[protocultures]

Who hit me then?

nobody knows if you were actually hit for a start, other than you.

You could have been hit by mafia direct.

You could have been hit by mafia through a redirect.

You could have been hit by town vigi direct.

You could have been hit by town vigi redirected.

[Hally]

i cannot engage in this discussion anymore

no matter what i say someone will come up with some reason why it’s not 100% lock

i simply don’t care because it doesn’t matter

i’m never getting yeeted in this game

[nutella]

*quietly rereads amy iso*

41/60

[VOTE: amy] aubergine

tunnels back on baby woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo lets gooooo

yknow i could be sold

proto is maybe actually trying to solve here, albeit with poor reasoning but potentially from a genuine place


amy's done fuckall and her role actually could pretty easily be a mafia role

[protocultures]

proto i think you're still fundamentally misunderstanding something

hally literally mechanically knows radish was a wolf from their ability

therefore lc and i are clear from hally's perspective

and i know i'm town and so if mr could only be town if i'm not then mr was not town


not sure what you're missing but this is like, pretty established

So Hally cant redirect town vigi?

they can ONLY redirect mafia?

I AM TOWN VIGI I SHOT RADISHES AND HE DIED AND IT WAS JANITORED LIKE MY ROLE SAYS

are you suggesting there was another town vigi who shot LC

???????????

Your claim is also super unconfirmed to everyone except you.

LC believes it because of the percentage thing, other people believe it because it's too specific for me to have made up, idk dude think what you want but look at how i claimed it right away, i can't come up with that as scum lol

This is exactly how I make the claim if I am scum.

nutella kills Radishes as scum (why??? how??) and then claims town vig on the kill. Radioshes was town vig and hit me (why?). Is that what you're proposing?

mafia killing MR and claiming vigi is great for wifom reasons "why would mafia ever kill MR".

I am not saying its THE world, I am asking why people discount these worlds and treat people as mech cleared when they arent.

This tinfoil is what i always do when people claim, I sense I am irritating people in the thread, its why I said kill me yesterday.

Dizzy please just claim so I can hammer myself and join spec chat.

[Hally]

i mean proto is probably town for actually trying here yea

it’s sill correct to kill him

[iaafr]

*quietly rereads amy iso*

41/60

[VOTE: amy] aubergine

tunnels back on baby woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo lets gooooo

yknow i could be sold

proto is maybe actually trying to solve here, albeit with poor reasoning but potentially from a genuine place


amy's done fuckall and her role actually could pretty easily be a mafia role

i mean full disclosure i didnt read much of the iso i just kinda skimmed and then confbiased myself back into a tunnel ive been in for maybe over half the game so

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Look it’s not 100% lock

But realistically it’s like 95-99% lock and that’s more than good enough for this game state imo