The 7th Saga [END, JJJ IS A DOOFUS]

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Does Hally/Fatmo make sense as a team?

2/3 claims being mafia would be a huge lol

Not impossible but like

I’d have to see more hard claims to believe it tbh

i thought you were 90% sure fatmo is town. what happened to that?

How does this question have anything to do with what you’re quoting

[Hally]

Does Hally/Fatmo make sense as a team?

2/3 claims being mafia would be a huge lol

Not impossible but like

I’d have to see more hard claims to believe it tbh

i thought you were 90% sure fatmo is town. what happened to that?

How does this question have anything to do with what you’re quoting

because you are clearly considering fatmo as mafia in that quote which is a change from when you said he was 90% likely to be town

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Does Hally/Fatmo make sense as a team?

2/3 claims being mafia would be a huge lol

Not impossible but like

I’d have to see more hard claims to believe it tbh

i thought you were 90% sure fatmo is town. what happened to that?

How does this question have anything to do with what you’re quoting

because you are clearly considering fatmo as mafia in that quote which is a change from when you said he was 90% likely to be town

What

I said it’s not impossible

10% is not impossible

What kind of fake-ass gotcha bullshit is this

[Hally]

ok nook whatever sorry i tried interacting with you

i have ten posts left i think so gonna save them bye

[Fatmo]

Does Hally/Fatmo make sense as a team?

2/3 claims being mafia would be a huge lol

Not impossible but like

I’d have to see more hard claims to believe it tbh

i thought you were 90% sure fatmo is town. what happened to that?

I mean, 90 isn't 100. He's saying not impossible but he'd have to see more hard claims or whatever. This doesn't really seem inconsistent with him mostly TRing me yesterday. He's right to leave room for new info to change his mind and all that.

[1612]

Does any of her progression on me make sense


Literally the only thing that made even a little sense was when she scumread me while I wasn’t answering her (bad) questions how she wanted me to...and even then her jump off that (then back to it I guess? I’m unclear why she’s back to scumreading me tbh) did not make sense to me

I mean has any of my progression made any sense? One point I was like chard is town after him giving reads, let's go Long Con. Oop nevermind Long Con started to talk and be defensive, he might be town.
I town read Hally, don't think that's scummy at all.

[Fatmo]

I also lean more town than not on Hally RN FWIW.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Does any of her progression on me make sense


Literally the only thing that made even a little sense was when she scumread me while I wasn’t answering her (bad) questions how she wanted me to...and even then her jump off that (then back to it I guess? I’m unclear why she’s back to scumreading me tbh) did not make sense to me

I mean has any of my progression made any sense? One point I was like chard is town after him giving reads, let's go Long Con. Oop nevermind Long Con started to talk and be defensive, he might be town.
I town read Hally, don't think that's scummy at all.

I don’t think it’s generically scummy

I think her specific progression on me is scummy

[MacDougall]

The progression on Fatmo is pretty bad. She just waxes lyrical about potential Fatmo alignment but never actually pushes on him or asks him any questions. So is she really actually trying to make a read there? Or just wanting it to look like she is?

ok mac town cool

if me/tutuu/ted/mac is all town that’s something. and 1612 too. then poe is like fatmo/lc/nook? but i kinda think nook is town for like no reason. so fatmo/lc? is that a thing?

im honestly not convinced the scum team is like lc/fatmo but like, idk what that’s based on. i cant form a coherent thought rn

1612 town. nook town. ted? yea probably just town

gotta sort mac, tutuu, lc, fatmo

mac/lc/fatmo poe? but should mac not be there? should ted be there? idk. probably fine whatever

Then after Fatmo's claim she does a 180 on having him in the POE. Not only does his claim deserve a day but she never felt he was scummy anyway.

im inclined to just give that claim a day. fatmo doesn’t really seem scummy to me anyway. but idk who is scum now. if i take fatmo as town and rule out mac/lc off that, what’s left? 1612 still no. nook don’t think so. ted? with lc or mac? idk i don’t like that tbh. still feel like ted is town

Hally, what is your read on me right now?

i don’t know. i want to read you town but im having doubts because i can’t think of teams. like i don’t think fatmo os scum. 1612 is not scum or im just literally the worst. so what that leaves is

you
nook
lc
mac

of which lc/mac cannot be a thing. so like? mac/nook? lc/nook? but i feel like its not nook. but i don’t think its you either. so maybe it is nook? with mac or lc?

I kinda wanna soft clear Mac for doing the fatmo push lmao who’s stoping me

Lol I'm not clearing him for that. Why would you want to?

It’s anti-village but the way he handled it was townie imo, I find myself doing those kinds of pushes in a lot of my games when I have a scum read but scum on like tone and leave room for doubt, often in the form of a PR read

It wasn't anti village at all. If Fatmo did what he should have done it would have been extremely pro village. But Fatmo is scum with Hally and that's that.

i don’t think fatmo is scum and im not either so you’re batting zero rn

Now she's so sure he's town she's actively attacking my credibility. Quite the progression.

Why would someone with such a potentially bad town role not out it? Fatmo is just mafia. Stop being fools.

Fatmo should have outed. He had no reason not to once he was outed as not vt. He could have then found his best town reads and worked out his best actions. Instead he just yoloed his role apparently and specifically stopped me from stopping the kill.

why would fatmo claim at all as scum though? like why would he admit he roleblocked you

Cuz he was gonna get turboed from POE otherwise and claiming a roleblock is safer than claiming a role someone else might have.

She asked me a really asinine question that i easily answered, she didn't address my answer.

I found his soft that he might have been doc.

He also then hard claimed vig after that, so lol.

I don't get why he's still scumreading me for not giving into his pressure three minutes after I joined the game though and doing exactly what he wanted me to and outing everything about my role.

This is why I asked about Mac and how much he tends to soft in my last post. Or if he does so more or less as town or scum.

I might come around to believing he was actually the doc because of that soft, and he did specifically ask tutuu if she was VT. I'm not sure yet.

I really have no idea what Mac's scumrange is or anything like that. I've only ever observed a couple games with him, and he's been town in them.

i do not believe fatmo is mafia

Just quotes a random post of his and townreads him. No effort to explore him at all. I don't even think she asked him a question. She's sure asked the rest of us questions.

fatmo is clearly town and mac pushing him and me as the team is just... no. but idk who is teamed with mac actually

back to thinking nook is town because of how frustrating he is. don’t ask me how this makes sense but it does

if it’s not mac its ted/lc

Now Fatmo is clearly town and I am being pushed by her for pushing them. After I was essentially her top town read (note that later she goes back to clearing me).

But imagine thinking it's rational to clear someone for claiming to be a roleblocker and then voting for someone who claimed to be a doctor that was roleblocked. Just imagine it.

please check how fatmo was as scum in avatar compared to how he is here. im not clearing him off his claim, im clearing him because he’s town

also your claim isn’t verifiable at all. why should i believe you’re a one shot doctor?

Now after all of this she cites some meta comparison that she had failed to mention the entire time.


Tl;dr Hally's progressions on everyone has been odd, but her progression from starting off as Fatmo being POE but never really ever making a read through to thinking he just deserves a day and then eventually just lock clearing him and shielding him is ... I just don't buy it.

[MacDougall]

Does Hally/Fatmo make sense as a team?

2/3 claims being mafia would be a huge lol

Not impossible but like

I’d have to see more hard claims to believe it tbh

I don't see how claiming makes any difference tbh.

Fatmo had to claim because I cornered him into it. A VT claim would get him turboed. Claiming town PR is his only option whether it's true or not.

Hally's claim is tame by comparison.

I really don't understand how this is influencing your read at all tbh. Explain it like I'm 5.

[MacDougall]

Does Hally/Fatmo make sense as a team?

2/3 claims being mafia would be a huge lol

Not impossible but like

I’d have to see more hard claims to believe it tbh

I don't see how claiming makes any difference tbh.

Fatmo had to claim because I cornered him into it. A VT claim would get him turboed. Claiming town PR is his only option whether it's true or not.

Hally's claim is tame by comparison.

I really don't understand how this is influencing your read at all tbh. Explain it like I'm 5.

[Hally]

yes but somewhere in between having him in the poe and starting to shield him i actually went and looked at the game where he was scum and compared it to his iso here and saw it was night and day. have you done that yet mac? because you should

[MacDougall]

Now Hally is just existing stage left because Nanook is defending himself while I am casing her. Please. Stand your ground please.

[MacDougall]

yes but somewhere in between having him in the poe and starting to shield him i actually went and looked at the game where he was scum and compared it to his iso here and saw it was night and day. have you done that yet mac? because you should

Explain why it's relevant. Nothing immediately jumps out at me. He seems scummy here, scummy there. Post volume doesn't count because this game is just always going to be more active because it had me, Tutuu, Alison and you in it so there is more content to react to.

[Hally]

Now Hally is just existing stage left because Nanook is defending himself while I am casing her. Please. Stand your ground please.

mac i have like 7 posts left. i don’t really care about your case. im not getting eliminated

[MacDougall]

If one of Nook and Hally isn't mafia I will eat a shoe.

And that means LC is town.

[MacDougall]

Now Hally is just existing stage left because Nanook is defending himself while I am casing her. Please. Stand your ground please.

mac i have like 7 posts left. i don’t really care about your case. im not getting eliminated

So you just wasted one on this asinine statement instead. Cool.

[MacDougall]

I think the mafia are probably 2 of Hally, Nanook and Fatmo as it stands right now.

[Fatmo]

Also 1612, you seem to have decided I was scum based on Cass's play and then my awkward entrance to N1 without reading or anything. And also because I shaded Mac.

I mean, how would you feel about Mac if you had just jumped into the game, and like thirty seconds later after dipping your toe in and saying hello, Mac was yelling at you and everyone else that you were lock scum and demanding a full reveal of any power you might have? Lol like really. I get that for you it seems as simple as "I TR Mac and Fatmo shades Mac" but that's just how I felt about our initial interactions.

Like I've said, and even Mac has acknowledged, we may have just had a bad start and pinged each other. But I feel like we've actually communicated decently today and have at least somewhat more of an understanding of where the other is coming from.

You say you don't believe my claim. Can you elaborate on exactly what you don't buy about it? Like obviously I am a RB.

And at some point, I think you said I was trying to set up a possible bus on LC? Lol I don't get how you could think that. First of all, would you EVER imagine such a weird roleblocler role, where I had to block two people in alphabetical order?

Why would I give a potential reason to partially clear who you suspect is my teammate? Again, my RB would have stopped the NK if I successfully targeted who carried it, as long as I wasn't RBd myself or there is a strongman or something.

Why would I even admit to having RBd Mac if I'd legit thought he was a Doc and tried to stop him from saving someone? I wasn't even being pressured anymore like I had been during the night. Heck, even Mac's first post didn't talk about it at all. I just got the feeling either me or LC would likely be the kill, and that that's where all conversation would be spent during the day, so decided to just out what I'd done so people could have the info to help solve.

[MacDougall]

LC with 5 votes on him right now in a game that has felt conflicted, confused and antagonistic means that he is town. The chances of the town coalescing on mafia in this environment are effectively nil. There is no viable team that contains him in it because if there was one he wouldn't have five votes.

[Hally]

yes but somewhere in between having him in the poe and starting to shield him i actually went and looked at the game where he was scum and compared it to his iso here and saw it was night and day. have you done that yet mac? because you should

Explain why it's relevant. Nothing immediately jumps out at me. He seems scummy here, scummy there. Post volume doesn't count because this game is just always going to be more active because it had me, Tutuu, Alison and you in it so there is more content to react to.

his depth of thought here is greater and he seems way more comfortable to me. and yea i do think it’s significant how much hes posting here compared to posting like ten times over an entire game. that big of a post count jump is alignment indicative. its not even close

If one of Nook and Hally isn't mafia I will eat a shoe.

And that means LC is town.

or nook is teamed with lc? why is that not a thing? nook only got on after i started pulling votes onto lc

[Fatmo]

Oh never mind on Mac trying to understand where I come from and possibly TRing me lol. Looks like I misinterpreted a bit.

[MacDougall]

Why would I even admit to having RBd Mac if I'd legit thought he was a Doc and tried to stop him from saving someone? I wasn't even being pressured anymore like I had been during the night. Heck, even Mac's first post didn't talk about it at all. I just got the feeling either me or LC would likely be the kill, and that that's where all conversation would be spent during the day, so decided to just out what I'd done so people could have the info to help solve.

You literally just answered your own wifom.

Claiming a wifomy power (probably the actual one you do have, that you did in fact use), is better than just dying wondering. And not claiming at all makes no sense because you were outed not VT.

Also just asking this question this way makes me suspect of you. It's terribad defence and the same defence Hally used FOR you earlier that I quoted in my wall showing how easy it was to deflect. Don't use it again.

My first post DID talk about it. I immediately claimed Shenanigans. You knew what that meant and that's why you claimed. You literally perspective slipped by saying this.

[Hally]

LC with 5 votes on him right now in a game that has felt conflicted, confused and antagonistic means that he is town. The chances of the town coalescing on mafia in this environment are effectively nil. There is no viable team that contains him in it because if there was one he wouldn't have five votes.

this is silly. he only has one teammate and if its nook he jumped on late so i don’t see how that’s relevant. like nook ks hardly doing anything. he doesn’t have the thread pull to get votes away from lc. he tried to push me and couldn’t get anyone to vote there with him and he sees that i can get votes on lc so hes bussing. why is that not possible?

[Fatmo]

Lol how is that a perspective slip?

[MacDougall]

This game has more posts than Avatar did already. It stands to reason anyone that posted there is going to have more content here because the game is more active. Stop making bad defenses of someone you're supposed to not know the alignment of. Last time you did that you embarrassed the shit out of yourself Hally.

[MacDougall]

The only thing that is holding me back from insisting everyone vote for you is that I am getting anni flashbacks. That's literally the only thing.

[Fatmo]

I mean she's right about me here. I don't know if it's a legit read or TMI, but either way it's correct.

[MacDougall]

Lol how is that a perspective slip?

Lol how? Yeah you're mafia but I'll humour you anyway.

Because you are saying that my first post didn't mention pressuring you and you observed that specifically because you were concerned that it would. That is guilty mind. Mafia mind.

[Fatmo]

Literally all you said is "I call shenanigans"

[Fatmo]

Mac is back to null for me now. IDK what the heck your deal with me is.

[Hally]

This game has more posts than Avatar did already. It stands to reason anyone that posted there is going to have more content here because the game is more active. Stop making bad defenses of someone you're supposed to not know the alignment of. Last time you did that you embarrassed the shit out of yourself Hally.

The only thing that is holding me back from insisting everyone vote for you is that I am getting anni flashbacks. That's literally the only thing.

ok so vote fatmo. i don’t give a fuck. im voting lc because i think hes mafia and i don’t think fatmo is. if im wrong im wrong. like idk what you want from me

[MacDougall]

I mean she's right about me here. I don't know if it's a legit read or TMI, but either way it's correct.

Maybe she is but it doesn't help me to actually solve the game if she makes defences of you that are actually bad logic. All it does is help me help the town lose.

[MacDougall]

This game has more posts than Avatar did already. It stands to reason anyone that posted there is going to have more content here because the game is more active. Stop making bad defenses of someone you're supposed to not know the alignment of. Last time you did that you embarrassed the shit out of yourself Hally.

The only thing that is holding me back from insisting everyone vote for you is that I am getting anni flashbacks. That's literally the only thing.

ok so vote fatmo. i don’t give a fuck. im voting lc because i think hes mafia and i don’t think fatmo is. if im wrong im wrong. like idk what you want from me

[mention]NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME[/mention] she said the thing

[MacDougall]

I just made both Fatmo and Hally "what do you want from me" at the same time. If they're the team I'm retiring.

[Fatmo]

I mean she's right about me here. I don't know if it's a legit read or TMI, but either way it's correct.

Maybe she is but it doesn't help me to actually solve the game if she makes defences of you that are actually bad logic. All it does is help me help the town lose.

What? I mean, wolves can defend town with bad logic all the time. It's called TMI.

I'm not even saying she's doing that, as I lean slightly town on her, but it's weird to me that the thought isn't really occurring to you that she might be.

[MacDougall]

You can have your LC chop. If he's town I'm coming after you with a gigantic sword so you better kill me in the night.

[Fatmo]

You can have your LC chop. If he's town I'm coming after you with a gigantic sword so you better kill me in the night.

I wish I could lol. If I was scum I'd probably have killed you last night because you were clearly going to be the person to annoy/push me the most lol

[MacDougall]

I mean she's right about me here. I don't know if it's a legit read or TMI, but either way it's correct.

Maybe she is but it doesn't help me to actually solve the game if she makes defences of you that are actually bad logic. All it does is help me help the town lose.

What? I mean, wolves can defend town with bad logic all the time. It's called TMI.

I'm not even saying she's doing that, as I lean slightly town on her, but it's weird to me that the thought isn't really occurring to you that she might be.

What the fuck. I am constantly reevaluating all things all the time. What kind of bs is that it's weird to you that it isn't occurring to me she might be town? That makes absolutely no sense as an expectation, nor is it even true and it's giving me a migraine just trying to deal with how ridiculous of a comment it is.

[Fatmo]

What kind of bs is that it's weird to you that it isn't occurring to me she might be town?

Dude what? Read my words maybe. I said It's weird to me that the thought isn't really occurring to you that she might be scum TMIing that I'm town and using what you think is bad logic to defend that read.

[Fatmo]

Oh shit no wait I can see how my sentence there could be misinterpreted. That's my bad. That was a badly written sentence

[Fatmo]

But you should still have been able to tell the context from the sentence before it.

[MacDougall]

Perhaps I thought you meant the other thing because it's even more ridiculous that you think I'm not trying to evaluate whether she's scum TMIing you? I was literally in the middle of typing up a post warning you against being pocketed when I deleted it to reply to you lol.

[Fatmo]

Perhaps I thought you meant the other thing because it's even more ridiculous that you think I'm not trying to evaluate whether she's scum TMIing you? I was literally in the middle of typing up a post warning you against being pocketed when I deleted it to reply to you lol.

LOL.

I mean, yes, the thought has occurred to me I might be being pocketed. Because she just kinda hard flipped her read after my claim. When before, I might have seemed like an easy miskill. But even if she is, she's not who I want to vote today. I think she could be town. I'd rather go someone else like LC I think there's a higher chance and that I haven't really felt many gut town feelings about.

Tomorrow problems are tomorrow problems. I only have one vote, so I'll go where I think one scum is more likely.

[MacDougall]

LC was also in Avatar and lasted til n4 and died as town with half as many posts as he has here too. Considering you're voting for him and bothered to check that game for meta I'd have expected that you'd have done a cursory analysis of the person you're trying to push and not just looked for evidence to shield Fatmo [mention]Hally[/mention]

What's the meta comparison you're making between LC there and here?

Fmpov that game suffered because it was just slanker city and this game has active players in it.

[Fatmo]

Let's say for academic sake you think LC is town and I'm town. I see you're trying to think of worlds where LC is town. What are your thoughts on the two scum then?

You still thinking like Hally/Nook?

[MacDougall]

All that aside I still want to follow Hally's plan.

Chop LC.

Fatmo roleblocks Ted/Nook.

It's a fine plan unless the team is specifically Hally and Fatmo.

[Fatmo]

All that aside I still want to follow Hally's plan.

Chop LC.

Fatmo roleblocks Ted/Nook.

It's a fine plan unless the team is specifically Hally and Fatmo.

Where did me blocking Ted/Nook come from? Did I miss a post with that or is this something you are bringing up now for consideration?

[MacDougall]

Let's say for academic sake you think LC is town and I'm town. I see you're trying to think of worlds where LC is town. What are your thoughts on the two scum then?

You still thinking like Hally/Nook?

There is nobody in this game who I think is out of their scumrange including 1612.

I think Nook is town but I think mechanically he and Hally are unlikely to be town/town because they're both insightful and one is likely to be right and causing the other to omgus. I'd say the chances of one being there is >rand. It's not as guaranteed as I said when I had heightened emotions. If there is one I'd say it's marginally more likely to be Hally.

I think that in worlds where you are town that the most likely team is Hally + Tedxtr.

I think that my non worldbuilding reads as of literally this second would be;

1612
Nanook

Tedxtr

Fatmo
Hally
LC

The problem is trying to figure out the world inside there. The most compatible team is Fatmo/Hally based on what I've observed and I'd very much struggle to find an LC teammate if he does flip mafia.

Hally TMIing everyone but hard pushing LC when she was voting for Tedxtr at first. yeah that team also makes sense.

I'd say they are the two most likely teams. So FMPOV Hally is in both the most likely teams.

[MacDougall]

All that aside I still want to follow Hally's plan.

Chop LC.

Fatmo roleblocks Ted/Nook.

It's a fine plan unless the team is specifically Hally and Fatmo.

Where did me blocking Ted/Nook come from? Did I miss a post with that or is this something you are bringing up now for consideration?

Hally suggested it. Go catch up.