Bread Mafia [Game Over]

[DaughterOfOmega]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

[DaughterOfOmega]

DK/Alison/Nanook/Jay/Grogu has to be the poe right?

I mean, I just don't see Esooa/Nutella/Tutuu being mafia at this point

[Michelle]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME what's your solve?

Three out of alison/dk/doom/grogu/jay

can you find a solid reason to take at least one out?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

There is some potential that Alison's massive post that culminated in "vote nutella" was just opportunism. She could have anticipated voting support from DK, Made, Michelle, and maybe Esooa (I don't recall how hers developed). I don't get why nutella is the answer instead of some other high-volume or perceived "manipulative" player.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

This is not nearly as absurd as you are portraying it to be.

The mafia aren't "about to win". They need two mischops in an environment with three clears ALL out of a consensus or near-consensus POE.

[tutuu]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME what's your solve?

Three out of alison/dk/doom/grogu/jay

can you find a solid reason to take at least one out?

Spoiler: show

he will reply with "Nope!" i bet my left kidney

[tutuu]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

This is not nearly as absurd as you are portraying it to be.

The mafia aren't "about to win". They need two mischops in an environment with three clears ALL out of a consensus or near-consensus POE.

Three

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

This is not nearly as absurd as you are portraying it to be.

The mafia aren't "about to win". They need two mischops in an environment with three clears ALL out of a consensus or near-consensus POE.

Three

werd

[Esooa]

if they have a vig shot only two

[DaughterOfOmega]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

This is not nearly as absurd as you are portraying it to be.

The mafia aren't "about to win". They need two mischops in an environment with three clears ALL out of a consensus or near-consensus POE.

You do realize that mafia should not be pushing each other, a single kill on a mafia at this point gives massive info and will ruin the game even further. They need to stay together and try their best to get two misbakes. That is their best chance, Nanook is saying the only people I am potentially pushing are his other mafia. Why would I not be pushing Esooa/Nutella/Tutuu?

Lmao it means a ton

[tutuu]

if they have a vig shot only two

No

We saved a kill

Extra mafia kp results in lack of sleep at mylo

Amount of yeets remains unchanged

[DaughterOfOmega]

I love how the people in POE always try to tear down legit reasons I should be kept alive lol

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

This is not nearly as absurd as you are portraying it to be.

The mafia aren't "about to win". They need two mischops in an environment with three clears ALL out of a consensus or near-consensus POE.

You do realize that mafia should not be pushing each other, a single kill on a mafia at this point gives massive info and will ruin the game even further. They need to stay together and try their best to get two misbakes. That is their best chance, Nanook is saying the only people I am potentially pushing are his other mafia. Why would I not be pushing Esooa/Nutella/Tutuu?

Lmao it means a ton

"Pushing" means absolutely nothing. Chopping is the only thing that matters. I don't give a crap about pushing if it doesn't lead anywhere.

[DaughterOfOmega]

Nanook thinks I am mafia, but has me in a group with every person I have been pushing. Wow I am really trying to kill my partners right before we win

This is not nearly as absurd as you are portraying it to be.

The mafia aren't "about to win". They need two mischops in an environment with three clears ALL out of a consensus or near-consensus POE.

You do realize that mafia should not be pushing each other, a single kill on a mafia at this point gives massive info and will ruin the game even further. They need to stay together and try their best to get two misbakes. That is their best chance, Nanook is saying the only people I am potentially pushing are his other mafia. Why would I not be pushing Esooa/Nutella/Tutuu?

Lmao it means a ton

"Pushing" means absolutely nothing. Chopping is the only thing that matters. I don't give a crap about pushing if it doesn't lead anywhere.

So then why are you reading previous posts and creating a poe from that? You are lying here, you obviously care about what people push, stop say nonsense.

[DaughterOfOmega]

Pushing means nothing lmao, why am I reading lies that the person doesn't even believe to be true

[tutuu]

Actually

We should consider not sleeping at mylo if mafia vig is alive

They might hold the shot and if we sleep at mylo we lose

Not sure if it was correct of me to say this now or hold it

[JaggedJimmyJay]

So then why are you reading previous posts and creating a poe from that? You are lying here, you obviously care about what people push, stop say nonsense.

What I am saying is that your point only has meaning if the pushing leads to chopping. Otherwise it produces nothing other than posts in the thread, and there's no reason why it cannot be viewed as distancing.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

So then why are you reading previous posts and creating a poe from that? You are lying here, you obviously care about what people push, stop say nonsense.

What I am saying is that your point only has meaning if the pushing leads to chopping. Otherwise it produces nothing other than posts in the thread, and there's no reason why it cannot be viewed as distancing.

[Esooa]

if they have a vig shot only two

No

We saved a kill

Extra mafia kp results in lack of sleep at mylo

Amount of yeets remains unchanged

oh, cool

[tutuu]

This really sucks. Really hope maf vig flips asap

[Michelle]

I am at a moment where I still can't see Nutella as villager and I don't understand the town read on her, please help

I think she has at numerous junctures of the game evidenced that her mindset is coming from an uninformed perspective. It's been small things like recognizing and conveying the attitude and energy of the game during important periods in ways that mafia generally struggle to replicate. It's been the development of her suspicions even as she has contributed to mischops -- I very much got the impression that nutella really did care on Day 2 whether we chopped you or Ellie or Made. They were all town, and for her to be invested as much as I think she was suggests that she really did not know they were all town. It's easy for me to see that in her in this game because I have had a similar experience. It's been her most recent suspicion of me, and responses to my annoyance with that suspicion.

I'm open to the case against nutella, but this may help you understand why I struggle so much with it. If nutella is mafia, the best way for me to get there would be to determine what teams she fits on.

Mac had 2 TRs I remember, you and Nutella. He is not perfect, but is closest to perfect and viila motivated to post a correct and honest read .
Unfortunately I saw games who were lost on flipped villagers reads, and what I reread today about Nutella's posts (I know I quoted few but she didn't answer at them) wasn't so nice and didn't stop my suspicion.
You say she cared about the chops, I would say she didn't care that much. In the same time I am tired and I can't dig more.

There is some potential that Alison's massive post that culminated in "vote nutella" was just opportunism. She could have anticipated voting support from DK, Made, Michelle, and maybe Esooa (I don't recall how hers developed). I don't get why nutella is the answer instead of some other high-volume or perceived "manipulative" player.

at this moment i really need Alison's flip to consider that post.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Actually

We should consider not sleeping at mylo if mafia vig is alive

They might hold the shot and if we sleep at mylo we lose

Not sure if it was correct of me to say this now or hold it

Probably good to say now, because I had not thought of that at all

[DaughterOfOmega]

So then why are you reading previous posts and creating a poe from that? You are lying here, you obviously care about what people push, stop say nonsense.

What I am saying is that your point only has meaning if the pushing leads to chopping. Otherwise it produces nothing other than posts in the thread, and there's no reason why it cannot be viewed as distancing.

So my push on Alison is not leading to a chop? Well we shall see

[JaggedJimmyJay]

So then why are you reading previous posts and creating a poe from that? You are lying here, you obviously care about what people push, stop say nonsense.

What I am saying is that your point only has meaning if the pushing leads to chopping. Otherwise it produces nothing other than posts in the thread, and there's no reason why it cannot be viewed as distancing.

So my push on Alison is not leading to a chop? Well we shall see

You took a big shit on my comments about you and DK. Your push there is not leading to a chop. That's why I viewed it as at least "compatible". If you're town you're seeing the game through Omega-colored glasses and your perspective is extremely narrow.

[tutuu]

Fuck i have mech stuff i wanna say but i should keep my mouth shut

[DaughterOfOmega]

So then why are you reading previous posts and creating a poe from that? You are lying here, you obviously care about what people push, stop say nonsense.

What I am saying is that your point only has meaning if the pushing leads to chopping. Otherwise it produces nothing other than posts in the thread, and there's no reason why it cannot be viewed as distancing.

So my push on Alison is not leading to a chop? Well we shall see

You took a big shit on my comments about you and DK. Your push there is not leading to a chop. That's why I viewed it as at least "compatible". If you're town you're seeing the game through Omega-colored glasses and your perspective is extremely narrow.

I have pushed the entire day that Alison and DK are teammates, I spent more time on calling out DK and analyzing them because a lot of others have already pointed out Alison's scum game.

So just because I choose to vote with my towncore on Alison first means I am not chopping my mafia?

Hmm

[Michelle]

Actually

We should consider not sleeping at mylo if mafia vig is alive

They might hold the shot and if we sleep at mylo we lose

Not sure if it was correct of me to say this now or hold it

Probably good to say now, because I had not thought of that at all

We have 2 possibilities:
1. the vig shot wasn't used
2. the vig shot was used and blocked
How is the math in the 2 scenarios?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I have pushed the entire day that Alison and DK are teammates, I spent more time on calling out DK and analyzing them because a lot of others have already pointed out Alison's scum game.

So just because I choose to vote with my towncore on Alison first means I am not chopping my mafia?

Hmm

It means that you could be DK's teammate. That you're compatible with them. Not that you must be or that you are. I don't freaking know. But it's possible, especially if Alison is town. I can't speak for Nanook, but there's nothing absurd or even unusual about that perspective. This is ordinary Mafia stuff. I have seen mafia behave that way many times.

[tutuu]

We need to have a big mech conversation TOMORROW

Not today, TOMORROW

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Actually

We should consider not sleeping at mylo if mafia vig is alive

They might hold the shot and if we sleep at mylo we lose

Not sure if it was correct of me to say this now or hold it

Probably good to say now, because I had not thought of that at all

We have 2 possibilities:
1. the vig shot wasn't used
2. the vig shot was used and blocked
How is the math in the 2 scenarios?

If it was already wasted, then we have two mischops available before MyLo, when it would be optimal to sleep.

If it was not used already, then it either will be soon to change that MyLo to LyLo, or it could be saved for MyLo and used when we sleep for an automatic mafia win.

The fact that we don't know is troubling here, and it means we'll be forced into a risky decision eventually unless we sweep mafia immediately.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

The only name on the Alison wagon I have major questions about is Omega, so that's encouraging. I have vague tutuu tinfoil for the jailkeep but don't feel it really.

[DaughterOfOmega]

I have pushed the entire day that Alison and DK are teammates, I spent more time on calling out DK and analyzing them because a lot of others have already pointed out Alison's scum game.

So just because I choose to vote with my towncore on Alison first means I am not chopping my mafia?

Hmm

It means that you could be DK's teammate. That you're compatible with them. Not that you must be or that you are. I don't freaking know. But it's possible, especially if Alison is town. I can't speak for Nanook, but there's nothing absurd or even unusual about that perspective. This is ordinary Mafia stuff. I have seen mafia behave that way many times.

Okay just take a second to think then, why have DK and I spent time yelling at one another being mafia, and DK spending time calling Alison town and voting me, when our goal should be getting Alison killed? If Alison dies, we could easily play the world where Nutella would be mafia for a town Alison flip, and get the misbakes we need to win the game, but here we are playing against our own wincon. I spent hours trying to convince people DK was mafia, and if my towncore went with me we would be killing Koba today, who has been more scummy than Alison. Which would be really bad if DK and I were partners right? The only reason I agreed to kill Alison rn is because I trust in the people who want to kill her first.

It's just really funny that you think I could be playing like this with DK, when the play would always be against the wincon of mafia. It's like you can't read into it at all.

[Made]

Why cant two wolves fake rudeness between themselves in a game where so many townies expressed rudeness and got townread for it?

1) I wouldn't do that because it's terrible behavior.

2) They said I was gaslighting them and treating them like they're town. That's just not what teammates say. It's very easy.

Confirmation bias may stand in the way, as well as people who are sick of the game and just want to force themselves into a solve so they can feel finished, but it's wrong.

JJJ does not have to be mafia here, but gaslighting is another one of those words

Only people to use it (beside one time as a direct quote) were me, Dk and JJJ. The play I said it to was Alison.

It could be a coincidence, but that’s a whole lot

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Okay just take a second to think then, why have DK and I spent time yelling at one another being mafia, and DK spending time calling Alison town and voting me, when our goal should be getting Alison killed? If Alison dies, we could easily play the world where Nutella would be mafia for a town Alison flip, and get the misbakes we need to win the game, but here we are playing against our own wincon. I spent hours trying to convince people DK was mafia, and if my towncore went with me we would be killing Koba today, who has been more scummy than Alison. Which would be really bad if DK and I were partners right? The only reason I agreed to kill Alison rn is because I trust in the people who want to kill her first.

It's just really funny that you think I could be playing like this with DK, when the play would always be against the wincon of mafia. It's like you can't read into it at all.

The orange portion is the operative point. If that is true, then I agree that it would be meaningful. At the moment though, I am forced to either just take your word for it or not.

I wouldn't be surprised if someone suspected you and I are mafia teammates distancing from one another right now. It may not be their first guess, but it's something they'd view as possible. And frankly, the discussion of "optimality" only matters for human beings who behave according to normative expectations (basically nobody). The mafia may be making choices you view as optimal, or they may be suboptimal. Or they may make ordinary choices and then portray them as suboptimal even when they aren't necessarily. Humans gonna human.

Anyway, I don't think this conversation is productive so I will leave it here. Respond if you want.

[Made]

I ask because the Alison wagon feels like the Ellie chop did. It feels like the kind of thing Dels would rightly criticize as a "we have to chop X"

Also J, If it is anything like the Ellie/Michelle/Made PoE, ur the Made, so you’ll be fine—or a the very least you’ll get baked last.

Just claim power role or something

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Why cant two wolves fake rudeness between themselves in a game where so many townies expressed rudeness and got townread for it?

1) I wouldn't do that because it's terrible behavior.

2) They said I was gaslighting them and treating them like they're town. That's just not what teammates say. It's very easy.

Confirmation bias may stand in the way, as well as people who are sick of the game and just want to force themselves into a solve so they can feel finished, but it's wrong.

JJJ does not have to be mafia here, but gaslighting is another one of those words

Only people to use it (beside one time as a direct quote) were me, Dk and JJJ. The play I said it to was Alison.

It could be a coincidence, but that’s a whole lot

Oh Made, you beautiful silly man. I used the word "gaslighting" because I was literally quoting DK saying it to me. I didn't include quote marks, but it was a quote. My whole point was based around DK saying that to me lol

[Michelle]

<snip>

Alison 1 Made
Esooa 1 DkKoba
JaggedJimmyJay 1 tutuu
Long Con 1 Esooa
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME 1 Long Con
staypositivefriend 1 Michelle

Alison 1 Made
DaughterOfOmega
EllieDelight 1 Long Con
JaggedJimmyJay 1 tutuu
Long Con 5 EllieDelight, nutella, Alison, staypositivefriend, Esooa
Michelle 1 DkKoba
staypositivefriend 1 Michelle

Oh my,

<snip>
didn't want to use spoilers again, these are the first 2 VCs I saved

[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

<snip>
[VOTE: long con] aubergine

<snip>
[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

I found the order of the votes on LC in the first wagon, usually mafia don't start a wagon and waits for a townie to start it, and legends say that the 3rd vote is the worst and usually from mafia.

@Nutella, I found evidence, defend yourself

[Made]

Why cant two wolves fake rudeness between themselves in a game where so many townies expressed rudeness and got townread for it?

1) I wouldn't do that because it's terrible behavior.

2) They said I was gaslighting them and treating them like they're town. That's just not what teammates say. It's very easy.

Confirmation bias may stand in the way, as well as people who are sick of the game and just want to force themselves into a solve so they can feel finished, but it's wrong.

JJJ does not have to be mafia here, but gaslighting is another one of those words

Only people to use it (beside one time as a direct quote) were me, Dk and JJJ. The play I said it to was Alison.

It could be a coincidence, but that’s a whole lot

Oh Made, you beautiful silly man. I used the word "gaslighting" because I was literally quoting DK saying it to me. I didn't include quote marks, but it was a quote. My whole point was based around DK saying that to me lol

Yes. If ur town keep doing that.

[DaughterOfOmega]

At this point, I am just working under the assumption that DK is mafia, and the people not wanting to kill them are mafia.

Which is another point to Alison being mafia imo

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I think it says something when Alison has not garnered any more votes in over 12 hours, and that I townread all of the current voters.

Yeah it says that syndicate doesn’t like to hammer

If she was town, what problem do the mafia have with hammering?

Is this a real question

It also ignores that even if her wagon is pure mafia still can’t hammer it

[nutella]

<snip>

Alison 1 Made
Esooa 1 DkKoba
JaggedJimmyJay 1 tutuu
Long Con 1 Esooa
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME 1 Long Con
staypositivefriend 1 Michelle

Alison 1 Made
DaughterOfOmega
EllieDelight 1 Long Con
JaggedJimmyJay 1 tutuu
Long Con 5 EllieDelight, nutella, Alison, staypositivefriend, Esooa
Michelle 1 DkKoba
staypositivefriend 1 Michelle

Oh my,

<snip>
didn't want to use spoilers again, these are the first 2 VCs I saved

[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

<snip>
[VOTE: long con] aubergine

<snip>
[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

I found the order of the votes on LC in the first wagon, usually mafia don't start a wagon and waits for a townie to start it, and legends say that the 3rd vote is the worst and usually from mafia.

@Nutella, I found evidence, defend yourself

I- what? You're accusing me of being mafia for my LC vote? Ok


I think if you are seeing the case for Alison mafia you should realize I'm town lol.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME what's your solve?

Three out of alison/dk/doom/grogu/jay

can you find a solid reason to take at least one out?

I don’t need to

[nutella]

I think doom is still town

Wish more ppl were considering esooa though. Her play today is the opposite of inspiring

[nutella]

There is some potential that Alison's massive post that culminated in "vote nutella" was just opportunism. She could have anticipated voting support from DK, Made, Michelle, and maybe Esooa (I don't recall how hers developed). I don't get why nutella is the answer instead of some other high-volume or perceived "manipulative" player.

why won't you vote for alison

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

if they have a vig shot only two

Successful mafia vig takes us to KILO instead of MILO. They still need to TK three town to win.

[DaughterOfOmega]

I think it says something when Alison has not garnered any more votes in over 12 hours, and that I townread all of the current voters.

Yeah it says that syndicate doesn’t like to hammer

If she was town, what problem do the mafia have with hammering?

Is this a real question

It also ignores that even if her wagon is pure mafia still can’t hammer it

?

the op says there is 12 living players, and if the wagon is pure, then the mafia could hammer?

[Michelle]

<snip>

Alison 1 Made
Esooa 1 DkKoba
JaggedJimmyJay 1 tutuu
Long Con 1 Esooa
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME 1 Long Con
staypositivefriend 1 Michelle

Alison 1 Made
DaughterOfOmega
EllieDelight 1 Long Con
JaggedJimmyJay 1 tutuu
Long Con 5 EllieDelight, nutella, Alison, staypositivefriend, Esooa
Michelle 1 DkKoba
staypositivefriend 1 Michelle

Oh my,

<snip>
didn't want to use spoilers again, these are the first 2 VCs I saved

[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

<snip>
[VOTE: long con] aubergine

<snip>
[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

I found the order of the votes on LC in the first wagon, usually mafia don't start a wagon and waits for a townie to start it, and legends say that the 3rd vote is the worst and usually from mafia.

@Nutella, I found evidence, defend yourself

I- what? You're accusing me of being mafia for my LC vote? Ok


I think if you are seeing the case for Alison mafia you should realize I'm town lol.

Can you, like, convince me I am wrong? Or even try to?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don’t need to

Do you have any particular order or priority for the names in your pile

[Michelle]

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME what's your solve?

Three out of alison/dk/doom/grogu/jay

can you find a solid reason to take at least one out?

I don’t need to

why?

[nutella]

Can you, like, convince me I am wrong? Or even try to?

I don't know what you need convincing of. I've explained all of my perspectives today and why Alison is likely mafia.