The Elder Scrolls [GAME OVER]

[DaisyCloud]

remember when we thought all the m named players was mafia.

except for mog it's just been Mac so far

[Scotty]

Meta read on MR: he's town y'all

Yes but why

[Scotty]

Why are Long Con and Gavial still voting for me?

Also when did Gavial go full jester? It feels like he ate some bad mushrooms from the witch somewhere between N1 and D2

[Vulgard]

Re: Gavial - Tim, I asked him for evidence because I hoped he'd surprise me. He didn't. Trust me, I know how he plays. I can link the games at any time.

@ LC's compatibility with Mac: I don't recall ever saying he's incompatible with Mac. It's possible I changed my mind and forgot. I took his side in the redcheck business, but since he rescinded, my related conclusions die with it.

@ DaisyCloud: I did write a case on her guns blazing. However, her reaction was so villagery I flipped my entire read right there. It told me beyond the shadow of a doubt that I cased a villager. And it has nothing to do with AtE; it's the way she was rebutting my points. I can't imagine a wolf pulling that post off. I could describe it in detail, but hopefully I won't need to. Villagers should be seeing what I'm seeing there.

[Jackofhearts2005]

That’s good “SK is Gav” equity right there

We need to quit talking about the SK...that apparently takes nights off. Gav calling me the 3P is mostly funny, but people who might be taken seriously, like you, need to consider that the wolves have two artifacts now. That means they have the vote power aspect, plus a bonus for having two. The Mace of Molag Ball is theoretically powerful enough to make a single player into a viable faction. Does this sound like something we really want the wolves to get hold of? Along with whatever added bonus yet another artifact gets them?

Stop talking about artifacts and third parties.

Do NOT press for claims on what shrine people went to. Notice that Mac had a "was there an artifact at shrine X? power. We do not know what night he used that power or what shrine he targeted. Molag Ball dude so NOT say anything about what shrines you have visited. If townies try to press it out of you...well, town will willage. Sorry.

This is the towniest post you’ve made in the past few days

Counterpoint: wolves love to give mechanical advice that is of questionable usefulness because it’s mostly obvious and doesn’t lead to catching wolves

Like, I wouldn’t award cred for that post.

[Vulgard]

I'm wary of reading into Mac's spew because I know he's competent at this game. There's also the fact his ISO is almost all oneliners where he alternates between TRing and shade. It's a coinflip which of his partners he shaded, which he townread, and which he ignored. He definitely wasn't playing like someone with a plan to endgame, at least.

The reason I'm not clearing Tim is that he hasn't written anything that made me think "This man has no TMI." The fact he's discussed mechanics a lot is a part of that, although not wolfy by itself.

I need to go over Scotty's ISO with a fresh mind, one second.

[Master Radishes]

Meta read on MR: he's town y'all

Yes but why

But I want him to explain my meta to me.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Idk who I wanna yeet but if I did, it would probably be Tim.

Made
Scotty
Daisy
Marmot
Vul
Tony
Gavil
LC
Kyle
Radishes
Falcon
Nacho
Monkey
Tim

I hate this list.

[Vulgard]

Does anyone have a reason they scumread Tim? For me it's a straight PoE read, I'm not sure if I could've been any clearer. He's put lots of effort into the game, I'm not going to deny that. But none of his posts made me go "this is definitely an uninformed perspective."

[Jackofhearts2005]

My suspicion of Tim can basically be summed up

“I don’t have a good reason to townread him. He keeps pushing townies. He should townread Marmot. He keeps acting like he doesn’t know if I suspect him or not and why. He keeps putting forth super questionable suggestions like yeeting townreads. Hated the way he treated Seanzie. Hated the way he treated Bo and Flanders. Hate the way he’s now treating Marmot. Hate how he keeps basically threatening to scumread me for scumreading him.”

Why did I turn on this suspicion again? Presumably, I had a reason for that.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Primarily the difference is exactly what I said in the post you just quoted.

Since working with you is like pulling teeth, let me ask more specific questions since you don't want to help.

Is it specifically that pressuring TSP will just get blown off? If this is the case, how do you feel about the effect you've had on Made thus far? If that isn't the case, can you please at least try to play well with others and clarify on the difference?

I've been down that road with TSP before, and a whole lot of people told me "yeah not helping you press TSP because it won't work, but good luck." Many of those players are in this game, so I am not going to waste my time trying to mount pressure on TSP here, when TSP is literally doing what TSP always does.

Made has blown me off so far, but there is no predisposition in the player list to just let him get away with it, and he is not in his regular position so I expect a wagon on him as EoD approaches will get his attention.

Okay, fair. Thanks for clarifying.

I want to take this moment to point out that I am a jerk, but not a complete jerk. If you ask a specific question I will almost always answer to the best of my ability. "Questions" of the form "that doesn't make sense" aren't really questions, they are statements that mostly amount to "please repeat yourself" and I just...don't.

But I didn't just say "that doesn't make sense". I put in the effort to explain exactly what didn't make sense and why it doesn't make sense in hopes that you could clarify that. This is not the same as just saying "that doesn't make sense, explain again".

So I just read through your ISO as promised.

Part one was "I am a wolf hahaha." Included in it was someone calling you out and being sniped back with a totally false claim about your "read density." For the record at that point you had nine posts and basically none of them called for being taken seriously. There was one hilariously convoluted thing that ended in Nanook being a wolf that you took no action so your actual "read density" when you made that defensive claim was basically zero.

That part ended with the rainbow list, which you have done nothing with. You were asked one question, by me, and from that point on very close to every post you have made has fit firmly in the "wah wah Tim won't help me solve him, he must be a wolf" mold. You have done apparently nothing to solve any of the other 22 slots available.

And now out of the blue you have ISO'd Falcon and come away with reasons to vote him that you aren't sharing.

Can you give me any reason not to vote you when I am done pressing on Made, assuming he doesn't just out himself as a wolf?

This is the post where I started to scumread Tim.

It feels incredibly like a wolf accusing a townie and waiting to go “Well, he was super scummy and unreasonable. I tried to figure him out. Can’t blame me for his death.”

[Jackofhearts2005]

I townread Mac and LC for the stupid reason they chaosed themselves and that’s what I expect town them to do. Idk what I expect from wolf them. Mac seems in his town meta anyhow. Less sure on LC.

ok this is a bad read

More than just bad, tbh.

Look closer at Jack.

[Vulgard]

Oh ffs I’ve been catching up slowly- just started pg 39 and will have to come back again. Good friend is getting married today so im hella distracted.

Something to mull over because as of pg 39 I haven’t seen it-
It is likely that one of the “leaders” of D1 town that weren’t Alison is a Wolf. I’m looking at first Mac and then Tim. I feel that Tim has been nothing but forthright on lots of things. Some call it TMI, I call it helpful.

Mac however has done nothing so much to garner super town status. In fact, his blunt attitude all of D1 and even now with his ailment (which I believe he isn’t faking btw) I feel like he’s just throwing out names to muddy up the thread.

In a vacuum, I’m looking again at BK as well. I disagree that we need to focus on Made and Gavial today. I think the wolves would like that. We may have to coagulate back there eventually, but right now Mac is my top thread leading scum read.

Because no one would suspect it.

[VOTE: MacDougall] aubergine

I’ll be back much later (hopefully tonight) to continue reading and contribute when I can

I must've missed this post upon my first reading. This looks alright. Especially since nobody else presented this sentiment based on the ISOs I've read. Granted, I haven't read the dead players, which I will get to later.

I'm also noting the fact most of Scotty's scumreads have been flipping town... killed in the night. That's the important part. This is a read I've never made before, but: if Scotty is a wolf, wolves wouldn't kill them all. Scotty would like to leave the people he wants to push alive. At least some of them. The fact they've all been dying and flipping V damages his credibility in the thread.

[falcon45ca]

Meta read on MR: he's town y'all

Yes but why

It's in the way you ask questions and probe the game, your approach is def in your town meta. I mean, I guess you could be faking it, but I don't think that's the case here

[falcon45ca]

So anyway, Tim is scum huh.

Nope, not this time. But you already knew that.

Eh. We'll see. You don't feel right. Your push on me feels inauthentic considering you've recently wolfed with me and saw how I operate.

This is towny MR

[falcon45ca]

I think your reasons on Daisy are valid. Like the questions but no follow up and apathy towards wagons are definite scum behavioural tendencies.

But when she and Jack were bickering earlier it was one of the few events of the game I've been somewhat present for, and it felt quite t/t to me. I felt like the frustration and omgusing had a delicate hint of genuineness to them.

So I dunno. Despite the logic, I'm not convinced.

And this is towny MR

[falcon45ca]

if you think that in this game we have drawn a scumteam with 0 slankers you will need to explain what makes that rational?

history speaks to the contrary. If anything the fact that we have chopped two slanky poos and missed makes the slanky poo pool more rich with floaters.

Not 0 slankers. Probably some.

But instead of firing blindly and lazily into the slanky pool let's do some actual work and find the active scum. And even if we miss we force said active scum to Do Stuff.

More towny MR

[Jackofhearts2005]

I have no idea why I stopped pushing Tim besides to give him some air.

I hate a bunch of his D3 posts and the only thing he did to make me think is town is claims shit tier investigative item be could buy.

[Vulgard]

Scotty's ISO reads like a confident villager's when I don't have the check coloring my mind. Sure, his pushes have been very wrong, but so have the rest of the village's. There's only one dead wolf on day 4 with 2+ KP each night. Blaming him for wrong pushes just because they were wrong is... well, wrong.

It's the same mistake I made with DaisyCloud.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

[Jackofhearts2005]

Imagine Tim is town. Wolf team would have to be exactly like....Monkey, Nacho, Falcon, LC.

[Timsup2nothin]

did u know TIM is an anagram for TMI?

This...is an absolutely astonishing revelation never noted before in all the annals of mafiadom!!! This...THIS...is why Scotty is a legend!!!

Okay, that said...I really just wanted to ask...you mentioned being in theater, so, yeah, performative. I get so fucking annoyed when people say "well, that Tim post is....performative..." I'm a writer. If I sit down at this keyboard, yeah, I am about to perform. This is my piano, right here, so performing is what I do. I just wanted to share that with you because I think maybe you'll understand it.

[Timsup2nothin]

Since working with you is like pulling teeth, let me ask more specific questions since you don't want to help.

Is it specifically that pressuring TSP will just get blown off? If this is the case, how do you feel about the effect you've had on Made thus far? If that isn't the case, can you please at least try to play well with others and clarify on the difference?

I've been down that road with TSP before, and a whole lot of people told me "yeah not helping you press TSP because it won't work, but good luck." Many of those players are in this game, so I am not going to waste my time trying to mount pressure on TSP here, when TSP is literally doing what TSP always does.

Made has blown me off so far, but there is no predisposition in the player list to just let him get away with it, and he is not in his regular position so I expect a wagon on him as EoD approaches will get his attention.

Okay, fair. Thanks for clarifying.

I want to take this moment to point out that I am a jerk, but not a complete jerk. If you ask a specific question I will almost always answer to the best of my ability. "Questions" of the form "that doesn't make sense" aren't really questions, they are statements that mostly amount to "please repeat yourself" and I just...don't.

But I didn't just say "that doesn't make sense". I put in the effort to explain exactly what didn't make sense and why it doesn't make sense in hopes that you could clarify that. This is not the same as just saying "that doesn't make sense, explain again".

So I just read through your ISO as promised.

Part one was "I am a wolf hahaha." Included in it was someone calling you out and being sniped back with a totally false claim about your "read density." For the record at that point you had nine posts and basically none of them called for being taken seriously. There was one hilariously convoluted thing that ended in Nanook being a wolf that you took no action so your actual "read density" when you made that defensive claim was basically zero.

That part ended with the rainbow list, which you have done nothing with. You were asked one question, by me, and from that point on very close to every post you have made has fit firmly in the "wah wah Tim won't help me solve him, he must be a wolf" mold. You have done apparently nothing to solve any of the other 22 slots available.

And now out of the blue you have ISO'd Falcon and come away with reasons to vote him that you aren't sharing.

Can you give me any reason not to vote you when I am done pressing on Made, assuming he doesn't just out himself as a wolf?

This is the post where I started to scumread Tim.

It feels incredibly like a wolf accusing a townie and waiting to go “Well, he was super scummy and unreasonable. I tried to figure him out. Can’t blame me for his death.”

Care to read Seanzie's ISO at that point and tell me what I was supposed to see other than what I said that I saw?

[Timsup2nothin]

I townread Mac and LC for the stupid reason they chaosed themselves and that’s what I expect town them to do. Idk what I expect from wolf them. Mac seems in his town meta anyhow. Less sure on LC.

ok this is a bad read

More than just bad, tbh.

Look closer at Jack.

What bothered me about that read is that it is the kind of high level LAMIST play I know you are capable of.

"Mac and LC chaosed themselves, and that's towny of them" leads to the unspoken "and Jack also chaosed so he's town too." Your post there wasn't just bad, it was sneaky, and that was the first time I really had "holy cow Jack might really be woofin' here" concerns. It was just about end of twilight, if I remember right, and I just wanted to make sure in case I somehow died that there was a "look at Jack" on the record in my ISO.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I've been down that road with TSP before, and a whole lot of people told me "yeah not helping you press TSP because it won't work, but good luck." Many of those players are in this game, so I am not going to waste my time trying to mount pressure on TSP here, when TSP is literally doing what TSP always does.

Made has blown me off so far, but there is no predisposition in the player list to just let him get away with it, and he is not in his regular position so I expect a wagon on him as EoD approaches will get his attention.

Okay, fair. Thanks for clarifying.

I want to take this moment to point out that I am a jerk, but not a complete jerk. If you ask a specific question I will almost always answer to the best of my ability. "Questions" of the form "that doesn't make sense" aren't really questions, they are statements that mostly amount to "please repeat yourself" and I just...don't.

But I didn't just say "that doesn't make sense". I put in the effort to explain exactly what didn't make sense and why it doesn't make sense in hopes that you could clarify that. This is not the same as just saying "that doesn't make sense, explain again".

So I just read through your ISO as promised.

Part one was "I am a wolf hahaha." Included in it was someone calling you out and being sniped back with a totally false claim about your "read density." For the record at that point you had nine posts and basically none of them called for being taken seriously. There was one hilariously convoluted thing that ended in Nanook being a wolf that you took no action so your actual "read density" when you made that defensive claim was basically zero.

That part ended with the rainbow list, which you have done nothing with. You were asked one question, by me, and from that point on very close to every post you have made has fit firmly in the "wah wah Tim won't help me solve him, he must be a wolf" mold. You have done apparently nothing to solve any of the other 22 slots available.

And now out of the blue you have ISO'd Falcon and come away with reasons to vote him that you aren't sharing.

Can you give me any reason not to vote you when I am done pressing on Made, assuming he doesn't just out himself as a wolf?

This is the post where I started to scumread Tim.

It feels incredibly like a wolf accusing a townie and waiting to go “Well, he was super scummy and unreasonable. I tried to figure him out. Can’t blame me for his death.”

Care to read Seanzie's ISO at that point and tell me what I was supposed to see other than what I said that I saw?

It’s not about Seanzie giving clues he was town and you not picking up on it.

It’s about you framing things the way a wolf tends to frame them, not the way a townie does.

Wolves have tmi and want to look reasonable after a townie flip. Even now, you’re still blaming Seanzie for not being townie enough after you gave him a chance.

So reasonable. Much town. Except you know, not really.

[Gavial]

remember when we thought all the m named players was mafia.

except for mog it's just been Mac so far

This post comes from wolf!

[Gavial]

@Vulgard
Would you be down on voting Daisy?

@Scotty
What’s your read on Daisy?

[Jackofhearts2005]

I townread Mac and LC for the stupid reason they chaosed themselves and that’s what I expect town them to do. Idk what I expect from wolf them. Mac seems in his town meta anyhow. Less sure on LC.

ok this is a bad read

More than just bad, tbh.

Look closer at Jack.

What bothered me about that read is that it is the kind of high level LAMIST play I know you are capable of.

"Mac and LC chaosed themselves, and that's towny of them" leads to the unspoken "and Jack also chaosed so he's town too." Your post there wasn't just bad, it was sneaky, and that was the first time I really had "holy cow Jack might really be woofin' here" concerns. It was just about end of twilight, if I remember right, and I just wanted to make sure in case I somehow died that there was a "look at Jack" on the record in my ISO.

I literally call the read stupid. How is that LAMIST?

[Vulgard]

Alison wasn't killed for her reads. She scumread a lot of people we now know are town. I'm guessing it was the 3p's kill, possibly an SPK. I severely doubt a town vig pulling this kill on us when Alison wasn't even a wagon d1 (from my understanding of the game).

If there's anyone who was potentially killed for reads, it's Nanook. I'm guessing it was the wolves' kill.

Townreads:
Quin (flipped town)
Scotty (I read him town now too)
Enrique (my slot, I know I'm town)

Then townreads:
DaisyCloud (super V rebuttal to my case)
Made (peeked green by KZA, a flipped villager)

Seanzie (flipped town)
Falcon
Kylemii
Syn (flipped town)

Scumreads:
Tim (voteparked on him at EoD apparently, suggesting to me it's a wolfread)
Long Con (called his posting wolfy twice, although not super blatant)

Notably does not townread Mac at any point.

Comparing my reads to Nanook's, we agree on pretty much everything. The one exception is that he townreads Falcon and I don't. Our PoEs would end up pretty similar if I were to compare.

And he was the n1 kill; likely to have come from pack wolves, since Alison was wrong on several occasions.

This renews my confidence.

[Gavial]

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

Imagine Tim is town. Wolf team would have to be exactly like....Monkey, Nacho, Falcon, LC.

I think your a wolf because your vote is retarded.
Mac never does what they did to Tim if they are both wolf.
Read the previous posts from last day phase regarding Tim and Mac.
Tim can only be 3P or Town.
Mac may have gotten a 3P check on Tim.
Meaning his buddies maybe trying to still push and vote Tim and your current vote is on Tim which is very questionable.

[Timsup2nothin]

Re: Gavial - Tim, I asked him for evidence because I hoped he'd surprise me. He didn't. Trust me, I know how he plays. I can link the games at any time.

I was pretty much joking there. It was a (hopefully) more clever way of saying "you are asking Gavial for reasons???"

[Jackofhearts2005]

Who replaced Quin again?

[Vulgard]

Gavial, I am absolutely not voting Daisy. Daisy's rebuttal never comes from a wolf. It just doesn't. There are too many aspects of it that make it a frustrated villager's lashing-out, not wolf AtE.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

Imagine Tim is town. Wolf team would have to be exactly like....Monkey, Nacho, Falcon, LC.

I think your a wolf because your vote is retarded.
Mac never does what they did to Tim if they are both wolf.
Read the previous posts from last day phase regarding Tim and Mac.
Tim can only be 3P or Town.
Mac may have gotten a 3P check on Tim.
Meaning his buddies maybe trying to still push and vote Tim and your current vote is on Tim which is very questionable.

Summarize for me what Mac did to Tim.

[Gavial]

Like if scum can’t kill Tim they legit have to try and convince others to vote them despite Tim being overly Townie Minded.
Mac showed that he wanted to discredit Tim HARD.
So hard it cannot be partner aligned.
Mac clearly desperately wanted to get rid of Tim.
You would think why didn’t he just NK them instead of push them as hard as he did, well that’s because he couldn’t because Tim is SK.

[Timsup2nothin]

I'm wary of reading into Mac's spew because I know he's competent at this game. There's also the fact his ISO is almost all oneliners where he alternates between TRing and shade. It's a coinflip which of his partners he shaded, which he townread, and which he ignored. He definitely wasn't playing like someone with a plan to endgame, at least.

The reason I'm not clearing Tim is that he hasn't written anything that made me think "This man has no TMI." The fact he's discussed mechanics a lot is a part of that, although not wolfy by itself.

I need to go over Scotty's ISO with a fresh mind, one second.

I get accused of having TMI every game. Usually it is because I arrive at an obvious conclusion and say so, and an hour later when someone else arrives at the same obvious conclusion they are bothered that I got there faster.

[Gavial]

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

Imagine Tim is town. Wolf team would have to be exactly like....Monkey, Nacho, Falcon, LC.

I think your a wolf because your vote is retarded.
Mac never does what they did to Tim if they are both wolf.
Read the previous posts from last day phase regarding Tim and Mac.
Tim can only be 3P or Town.
Mac may have gotten a 3P check on Tim.
Meaning his buddies maybe trying to still push and vote Tim and your current vote is on Tim which is very questionable.

Summarize for me what Mac did to Tim.

Gladly.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I don't think your griping has had any effect on today. What will have an effect on today is finding a suspect and engaging them. Or talking about the big wagons for today - what do you think of my Marmot defense? Is Mog the wolf that we've been trying to find?

Who are you talking to in this post?

Me. Nacho is taking my mild doomsaying as confirmation I am mafia.

I don't think you are mafia. I think that your approach to today has been lazy. And continues to be lazy. Why would I, I slanker scum, care about pushing Mac, the god of town?

anyway I just woke up at 2am to take a mid morning poo im going back to sleep. I expect Nacho will have strung up a wolf with his incisive cutting game theory based skill upon my return.

I'll do my best!

[Jackofhearts2005]

And I am splendidly tilted when my top townread decides to follow Mac down a useless garden path because that usually means more will follow.

If Tim is town this is TMI.

If Tim is wolf this is shield.

This is always wolf.

Guess your vote's in the wrong place then!

[Timsup2nothin]

I townread Mac and LC for the stupid reason they chaosed themselves and that’s what I expect town them to do. Idk what I expect from wolf them. Mac seems in his town meta anyhow. Less sure on LC.

ok this is a bad read

More than just bad, tbh.

Look closer at Jack.

What bothered me about that read is that it is the kind of high level LAMIST play I know you are capable of.

"Mac and LC chaosed themselves, and that's towny of them" leads to the unspoken "and Jack also chaosed so he's town too." Your post there wasn't just bad, it was sneaky, and that was the first time I really had "holy cow Jack might really be woofin' here" concerns. It was just about end of twilight, if I remember right, and I just wanted to make sure in case I somehow died that there was a "look at Jack" on the record in my ISO.

I literally call the read stupid. How is that LAMIST?

Because it "being stupid" wasn't enough to have you keep it out of the thread. That's the point. You put into people's heads "gosh maybe going chaos is towny...hmmm." In heads where that takes root you create a town read for yourself.

[Vulgard]

I'm wary of reading into Mac's spew because I know he's competent at this game. There's also the fact his ISO is almost all oneliners where he alternates between TRing and shade. It's a coinflip which of his partners he shaded, which he townread, and which he ignored. He definitely wasn't playing like someone with a plan to endgame, at least.

The reason I'm not clearing Tim is that he hasn't written anything that made me think "This man has no TMI." The fact he's discussed mechanics a lot is a part of that, although not wolfy by itself.

I need to go over Scotty's ISO with a fresh mind, one second.

I get accused of having TMI every game. Usually it is because I arrive at an obvious conclusion and say so, and an hour later when someone else arrives at the same obvious conclusion they are bothered that I got there faster.

I'm not accusing you of TMI. I'm saying you haven't proven you *don't* have it. You may still be able to do that if you are a villager.

[Timsup2nothin]

Alison wasn't killed for her reads. She scumread a lot of people we now know are town. I'm guessing it was the 3p's kill, possibly an SPK. I severely doubt a town vig pulling this kill on us when Alison wasn't even a wagon d1 (from my understanding of the game).

If there's anyone who was potentially killed for reads, it's Nanook. I'm guessing it was the wolves' kill.

Townreads:
Quin (flipped town)
Scotty (I read him town now too)
Enrique (my slot, I know I'm town)

Then townreads:
DaisyCloud (super V rebuttal to my case)
Made (peeked green by KZA, a flipped villager)

Seanzie (flipped town)
Falcon
Kylemii
Syn (flipped town)

Scumreads:
Tim (voteparked on him at EoD apparently, suggesting to me it's a wolfread)
Long Con (called his posting wolfy twice, although not super blatant)

Notably does not townread Mac at any point.

Comparing my reads to Nanook's, we agree on pretty much everything. The one exception is that he townreads Falcon and I don't. Our PoEs would end up pretty similar if I were to compare.

And he was the n1 kill; likely to have come from pack wolves, since Alison was wrong on several occasions.

This renews my confidence.

This makes me want to murder you.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Idk.

Nacho kinda pulls a townread on Mac out of thin air and then acts like it’s a sure thing. Mac expresses that Nacho is a wolf no matter what but then doesn’t really do anything with that read and Nacho laughs it off.

It’s not like a smoking gun but it’s kinda bad.

I do like Nacho coming in with a Marmot townread today. I’ve generally felt good about his posts. Poe box is shrinking and those Mac/Nacho interactions.

Thoughts?

[Vulgard]

Like if scum can’t kill Tim they legit have to try and convince others to vote them despite Tim being overly Townie Minded.
Mac showed that he wanted to discredit Tim HARD.
So hard it cannot be partner aligned.
Mac clearly desperately wanted to get rid of Tim.
You would think why didn’t he just NK them instead of push them as hard as he did, well that’s because he couldn’t because Tim is SK.

Question to rouse your mind, although I fear it's a fool's endeavor.

Tim's alive. The other traditionally strong town on this playerlist aren't. This is unfair of me to say, but bear with me.

Why is Tim alive? If Mac wants Tim dead, just kill him in the night. I've seen enough paranoia surrounding him, he wouldn't be protected.

[Long Con]

I never went for chaos, Jack and Tim were talking like I did, but I didn't.

[Vulgard]

Alison wasn't killed for her reads. She scumread a lot of people we now know are town. I'm guessing it was the 3p's kill, possibly an SPK. I severely doubt a town vig pulling this kill on us when Alison wasn't even a wagon d1 (from my understanding of the game).

If there's anyone who was potentially killed for reads, it's Nanook. I'm guessing it was the wolves' kill.

Townreads:
Quin (flipped town)
Scotty (I read him town now too)
Enrique (my slot, I know I'm town)

Then townreads:
DaisyCloud (super V rebuttal to my case)
Made (peeked green by KZA, a flipped villager)

Seanzie (flipped town)
Falcon
Kylemii
Syn (flipped town)

Scumreads:
Tim (voteparked on him at EoD apparently, suggesting to me it's a wolfread)
Long Con (called his posting wolfy twice, although not super blatant)

Notably does not townread Mac at any point.

Comparing my reads to Nanook's, we agree on pretty much everything. The one exception is that he townreads Falcon and I don't. Our PoEs would end up pretty similar if I were to compare.

And he was the n1 kill; likely to have come from pack wolves, since Alison was wrong on several occasions.

This renews my confidence.

This makes me want to murder you.

Because I decided to backread the n1 kill, like any good villager should? I don't see where this reaction is coming from.

[Timsup2nothin]

I'm wary of reading into Mac's spew because I know he's competent at this game. There's also the fact his ISO is almost all oneliners where he alternates between TRing and shade. It's a coinflip which of his partners he shaded, which he townread, and which he ignored. He definitely wasn't playing like someone with a plan to endgame, at least.

The reason I'm not clearing Tim is that he hasn't written anything that made me think "This man has no TMI." The fact he's discussed mechanics a lot is a part of that, although not wolfy by itself.

I need to go over Scotty's ISO with a fresh mind, one second.

I get accused of having TMI every game. Usually it is because I arrive at an obvious conclusion and say so, and an hour later when someone else arrives at the same obvious conclusion they are bothered that I got there faster.

I'm not accusing you of TMI. I'm saying you haven't proven you *don't* have it. You may still be able to do that if you are a villager.

I'll add it into my busy schedule.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I townread Mac and LC for the stupid reason they chaosed themselves and that’s what I expect town them to do. Idk what I expect from wolf them. Mac seems in his town meta anyhow. Less sure on LC.

ok this is a bad read

More than just bad, tbh.

Look closer at Jack.

What bothered me about that read is that it is the kind of high level LAMIST play I know you are capable of.

"Mac and LC chaosed themselves, and that's towny of them" leads to the unspoken "and Jack also chaosed so he's town too." Your post there wasn't just bad, it was sneaky, and that was the first time I really had "holy cow Jack might really be woofin' here" concerns. It was just about end of twilight, if I remember right, and I just wanted to make sure in case I somehow died that there was a "look at Jack" on the record in my ISO.

I literally call the read stupid. How is that LAMIST?

Because it "being stupid" wasn't enough to have you keep it out of the thread. That's the point. You put into people's heads "gosh maybe going chaos is towny...hmmm." In heads where that takes root you create a town read for yourself.

Well thought out psychobabble is not and has never been a thing I do as a wolf.

I asked you what you thought wolf Jack was trying to do, there, pocket Mac? And I don’t remember you ever answering.

Youer suspicion of me feels all over the place and never fully pursued. It doesn’t feel like “I suspect Jack and should look closer at him and grill him to determine his alignment.” It feels like “Jack suspects me and maybe if I treat him with hostility, he’ll see that as townie and lay off.”

[Gavial]

All of his Tim Mentions I could find.

What is the deal with this SK idea. There was only one kill N2. Are we thinking there was a doc save?

Maybe they double stacked?

Why would a serial killer want to kill Syn?

*shrugs* gotta serial kill somethin

@Timsup2nothin Gavial reckons he has a cop check on you that shows you as the SK tho.

There's an SK?

Wait.

Gavail "red checked" me as a serial killer, and Scotty fucking bought it???

WTF has been going on here?

No I decided to try to wagon you and bullied Scotty into sheeping and then pretended it was a reaction test when I decided to stop being a dumb dumb.

But the part about Gavial claiming to have a check on you as SK is true yes.

I am...trying to decide which of these sounds crazier...but...sure.

Has anything vaguely normal happened that I should know about before EoD?

Yeah I solved the game. I was just waiting for you to get here so we could lead the successful kill together as the soulmates we are.

@Timsup2nothin Gavial reckons he has a cop check on you that shows you as the SK tho.

There's an SK?

Wait.

Gavail "red checked" me as a serial killer, and Scotty fucking bought it???

WTF has been going on here?

No I decided to try to wagon you and bullied Scotty into sheeping and then pretended it was a reaction test when I decided to stop being a dumb dumb.

And I am splendidly tilted when my top townread decides to follow Mac down a useless garden path because that usually means more will follow.

If Tim is town this is TMI.

If Tim is wolf this is shield.

This is always wolf.

Time to hard shield the SK.

I hard claim super fantastic role that has a Consig check from Mac that says Tim is SK and proof Mac is Consig.

wtf is consig?

Town of Salem version of Rolecop.

Oh right yeah ok.

Shut up.

Also Mac, when we followed your lead to sheep onto Flanders yesterday, it also seemingly came out of the blue.

Why are you not pursuant of that lead again?

I dunno. I feel like pushing Tim right now.

the only person who seems to have conviction in this game is Tim

we're fucked

I think you need to calm down, review your worldview and layer it with rationality Gavial. As usual you are finding yourself in a situation where your reads make no sense to anyone but you and therefore even if there is accuracy to them they will just get ignored.

Let’s not also forgot he knows I’m right and he Consig checked Tim SK!

maybe Jack is mafia

@Jackofhearts2005
Also wanna point out this post right here isn’t a good look for you!

@Timsup2nothin Gavial reckons he has a cop check on you that shows you as the SK tho.

Also, this is BS as he had the check!

[Timsup2nothin]

Alison wasn't killed for her reads. She scumread a lot of people we now know are town. I'm guessing it was the 3p's kill, possibly an SPK. I severely doubt a town vig pulling this kill on us when Alison wasn't even a wagon d1 (from my understanding of the game).

If there's anyone who was potentially killed for reads, it's Nanook. I'm guessing it was the wolves' kill.

Townreads:
Quin (flipped town)
Scotty (I read him town now too)
Enrique (my slot, I know I'm town)

Then townreads:
DaisyCloud (super V rebuttal to my case)
Made (peeked green by KZA, a flipped villager)

Seanzie (flipped town)
Falcon
Kylemii
Syn (flipped town)

Scumreads:
Tim (voteparked on him at EoD apparently, suggesting to me it's a wolfread)
Long Con (called his posting wolfy twice, although not super blatant)

Notably does not townread Mac at any point.

Comparing my reads to Nanook's, we agree on pretty much everything. The one exception is that he townreads Falcon and I don't. Our PoEs would end up pretty similar if I were to compare.

And he was the n1 kill; likely to have come from pack wolves, since Alison was wrong on several occasions.

This renews my confidence.

This makes me want to murder you.

Because I decided to backread the n1 kill, like any good villager should? I don't see where this reaction is coming from.

No. It's because we came to entirely opposite conclusions in some places and I cannot let go of thinking I am obviously right so you must be faking.

But I was here, and you were not, so maybe you are just wrong.

Nanook was DEEP in the POE at the end of day one. I wanted to flash wagon him at EoD and when I was restrained and a town flipped I was ready to come into day two on a kill Nanook warpath. There is not a doubt in my mind, anywhere, that Alison was the NK and Nanook got vigged. Alison was flat out town read. Alison called the shots at EoD and there was no other way to get rid of her, ever. She got NKed, take it to the bank.