Lasagna Mafia [END]

[Hyena]

Luck/kza/creture gg go next

Talk to me about Luck. At EOD yesterday, I had thought there was higher chance Luck was mafia than Syn/MissSparkles based on Luckbox seeming uncomfortable chopping Alison and Esooa after seeming eager in the post where they told me I wasn't crazy for wanting to chop one of them.

You've misinterpreted that post fwiw. I was both uncomfortable with it and also thinking you weren't crazy-- definitely not eager at all.

Is there a reason you didn't try to talk me out of going after them?

[Luckbox Inc]

Luck/kza/creture gg go next

Talk to me about Luck. At EOD yesterday, I had thought there was higher chance Luck was mafia than Syn/MissSparkles based on Luckbox seeming uncomfortable chopping Alison and Esooa after seeming eager in the post where they told me I wasn't crazy for wanting to chop one of them.

You've misinterpreted that post fwiw. I was both uncomfortable with it and also thinking you weren't crazy-- definitely not eager at all.

Is there a reason you didn't try to talk me out of going after them?

No. At the point in which we had that discussion it was pretty clear that esooa wasn't being killed and I was worried about Alison myself.

[fingersplints]

Ok the whole check thing has gotten a lot more confusing.

I don’t understand town lying about checks. It’s seems to make things unnecessarily convoluted and waste time we could be actually searching for baddies.
This feels like nanooks town game, so I’m inclined to believe there. I can’t see Luckbox being town if there is only one cop, but I also don’t get the mafia strategy behind this either.

So yea confusing

Read up for mafia strategy.

And this best explains why I despise cop cover with a passion. So thanks for putting it into words for me, have a town lean.

I read all the mafia strategy. Still really doesn’t seem worth it to me, but I guess just because I wouldn’t do it doesn’t mean someone else wouldn’t.
Sometimes mafia do the unlikely because it’s unlikely and they can get by on that.

[ejjinami]

ngl, that’s a bit disappointing :/
sparkles’s tone is fine but I think the game has gone past the point where people could be read solely for it

I don’t think I would have been able to scum-read creature so early on, especially only based on an ISO dive
Not really AI imo
glad we’re on the same page tho, at least we can talk now
Future reads will likely be more telling

One thing worth noting tho, is that if creature is scum, he likely really wasn’t online when sparkle started reading his ISO because he knew the exact number of pings he got (they would have disappeared if he was lurking and talking to spark on the mafia chat)… So in the case of a spark-creature team, there’s a decent chance that spark wouldn’t have known that they’d have to bus

anyway, I’m back to where I was. Just gonna look through syn’s games later
and do whatever I normally do.
We have time so it doesn’t really matter

[fingersplints]

could you just trust me if I say that lunchbox is nearly always town here and that you’re wasting your time?
honestly, I’m less cleared than them so if you’d like to interact with me, go ahead

like, ignoring the entire game thread isn’t really the most optimal choice

Alternatively everybody (including the cop) stays silent and hopes the cop doesn't end up dying before they can share their results.

Pretty much how I’d do it.

I’m reading his ISO R U HAPPY NOW?? Don’t cry :hugs:

TuT thank you

I only trust my own reads on people, and to a lesser degree and as I said to Esooa earlier I don’t find any discussion to be a waste of time at this point. I’m not going to not talk about someone because one person said it’s their town game. Reads can be wrong

[Esooa]

it's not a waste of time but there's more efficient ways to spend it is more of what I was meaning

[Esooa]

I don't have a 3rd I really believe is mafia that isn't Syn. I don't think I've been given a satisfactory one. KZA is just mafia and so is creature

[ejjinami]

I only trust my own reads on people

fun fact, despite this being a game of deceit, I believe that’s still not the right approach
no player is perfect, if you know your strengths and weaknesses and are able to somewhat judge how likely another player is to have correct reads in general, sheeping each other is often the best thing to do

the only requirement here is that you should actually know how accurate your various methods of solving are and know what to be stubborn on
playing FM as a team game is way easier than trying to solo it XD

[Creature]

Alternatively everybody (including the cop) stays silent and hopes the cop doesn't end up dying before they can share their results.

Pretty much how I’d do it.

I’m reading his ISO R U HAPPY NOW?? Don’t cry

I feel like that everyone sharing a fake result at the end of the day would ensure that if cop dies, the result is not lost while also preventing the town from accidentally spewing themselves not cop by hypoclaiming green on wolf or dropping their cover too quick. However, I didn't take that town needs actual unity for that to work into consideration.

[Creature]

I think my strategy for this setup would be:

1. Hypoclaims are only done at the end of the day. Until then, everyone, including the cop, tries to sort every player as they usually would.
2. On D1, everybody claims If I am the cop, I peeked X green
3. On D2+, everybody claims If I am the cop, I either peeked X green or peeked Y red
4. If the cop dies, we always lynch Y
4.1. If Y flips town, we assume X was peeked green
4.2. If Y flips mafia, we assume Y was indeed the peek (even if they actually weren't) and ignore the X peek
5. Cop can hold off a red peek for one night, but must out it immediately the day after. So if the cop actually peeked Y red N1, they can do rule 3 and hide for the remainder of day 2. If they survive N2, D3 they must immediately out as cop and reveal they peeked Y red alongside their N2 peek. This is kind of interesting, because cop won't necessarily be forced to out immediately if they get a red peek and they might live to get another result. There would be no chance of wolves killing the cop N2 and their red peek getting away as long as town follows rule 4.
6. As a result, we can assume that if the cop didn't do rule 5 the day after the night after, the hypo red peek is false. As such, if cop didn't out D3 and ends up dying N3 then town doesn't need to follow with rule 4 on the D2 hypo, instead they just assume X was peeked green.

Obviously, rule 3 and forward are complex strategies and maybe I should start a new topic after the game. Perhaps we should at most follow rules 1 and 2 this game.

Seems overly confusing tbh

Yes. I think I should probably use examples on how that could work, but I'll prob hold that discussion for postgame.

[Creature]

Sparkles does seem villagery here.

Yeah, Sparkles looks alright for now disregarding Syn.

[Creature]

This is probably a good moment to start forming bigger wagons in general
otherwise it will be pretty much impossible to use VCA later on

VCAs are useless anyway.

But your overly confusing and just meh Cop plan isn’t? Like to get a town to align on it is next to impossible, the shut up cop plsy is the way, that’s how we won in champs S2 tbh.

Again, my cop plan can at least be productive if it is done right (everybody claims their peek, prevents wolves from figuring who is cop and if cop dies their results won't be lost). VCAs are like close to rand and often distracting.

[Creature]

Probably not on the open seer stuff. That seems like a little much for new people.
RE Creature: He still hasn't given any reads but he has said if he were a wolf he would have-- which I do somehow sort of want to believe.
Syn has been in commentary mode all game.

Well I'm sure he'd never lie to you if he were a wolf here

Well I think it should be pretty much true that it's a lot easier for me to read everybody when I'm wolf than when I'm town, it's pretty much TMI I can't escape, while as town I can still get a lot of initial town feels but then start to doubt.

it's the self-awareness that's pinging me -.-

doesn't make it any less valid I think

No idea why self awareness is only a scum trait tbh

But eh the mech plan discussion was not what you started with in Exile pretty sure and the plan itself feels like a wolf trying to lead town astray so there’s that.

I already was planning to bring that up the next cop game I played.

[Esooa]

I really wish I had 3 day vigi shots

[Creature]

if we're uncomfortable with creature maybe we just kill syn.

What if I'm uncomfortable with both?

Why we’re you uncomfortable with me in my other body?

I can’t expect Syn to have done much if they needed repping out do either TMI/Meta/Gut, can you explain why you weren’t comfortable with a Syn vote?

I meant "What if I'm uncomfortable lynching either of Syn and me?". Syn seemed pretty similar to Fall of Numbers game and felt like the suspicion on them was just playstyle clash.

[Creature]

I townread Creature for effort but then people who've played with him came in and said it was well within scum range so shrug. Syn seemed like he was genuinely annoyed at my play which is the reason I'd rather go Creature over him. I also think he tends to go for the path of least resistance as mafia and trying to push me is not that. This isn't a full clear of him but it is enough to prefer Creature over him today.

Would ve better we try to lynch wolf today

Duh dafuq even is that paragraph by Alison. Feels like they don't want to risk town voting elsewhere and correctly.

I mean Allidon vouched for the my preferred strategy and flip town so this feels like a weird read

I thought it was pretty wolfy because it felt like Alison forced a false dichotomy that the lynch must be Syn or me when it wasn't even that close to day end and anybody could be pushed for lynch.

[KZA]

Yes these are the actions of an innocent kza, mom, definitely not a mafia trying desperately to avoid spew and end the day early so the cop can die already

Idk what you think you're doing it you're town

Literally wasting half the day phase having people solve for a world that doesn't exist

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Can we hammer now?

[KZA]

Can we hammer now?

Yes

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Yes these are the actions of an innocent kza, mom, definitely not a mafia trying desperately to avoid spew and end the day early so the cop can die already

Idk what you think you're doing it you're town

Literally wasting half the day phase having people solve for a world that doesn't exist

Let's pretend I'm faking for a minute

What have you done that would make me inclined to rescind?

[ejjinami]

I meant "What if I'm uncomfortable lynching either of Syn and me?". Syn seemed pretty similar to Fall of Numbers game and felt like the suspicion on them was just playstyle clash.

instead of defending yourself, it would be way better if you just said who you scum-read :/

still curious about that lol

[Creature]

Esooa is probtown and wolves are hiding behind her fit to push a mislynch on a town that could potentially be dangerous for them later in the game.

I’d say so yea AtE potential aside, but I mean I should probably actually read the whole thread too and not just take your word fir it LOL

Take your time. However, if you, as a wolf, saw one town blinded by rage tunneling another town you would heavily consider joining them, right?

[Creature]

Guess this is probably useless now that Nanook claimed cop so meh.

[VOTE: KZA] aubergine

[KZA]

Yes these are the actions of an innocent kza, mom, definitely not a mafia trying desperately to avoid spew and end the day early so the cop can die already

Idk what you think you're doing it you're town

Literally wasting half the day phase having people solve for a world that doesn't exist

Let's pretend I'm faking for a minute

What have you done that would make me inclined to rescind?

Nothing

You tilted me in to this

Fake red check a known emotional player that just subbed in, awesome strat

[KZA]

2 more hurry up I want this done on my break

[Creature]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

What? After you said she wasn’t the best vote (not sure if u full on townread her).

You missed this post:

I'll probably do Alison over finger or Syn

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Yes these are the actions of an innocent kza, mom, definitely not a mafia trying desperately to avoid spew and end the day early so the cop can die already

Idk what you think you're doing it you're town

Literally wasting half the day phase having people solve for a world that doesn't exist

Let's pretend I'm faking for a minute

What have you done that would make me inclined to rescind?

Nothing

You tilted me in to this

Fake red check a known emotional player that just subbed in, awesome strat

Shrugs if someone does fake check you in the future shutting down and not playing the game just makes you look super guilty, fyi

[Creature]

This heavy resistance to moving off my wagon shows at least one of the wolves are at danger of being lynched if town decides to move elsewhere.

wolfy

ime wagons tend to be more flexible when they are mostly v/v and wolves aren't really in danger because wolves aren't in risk if they decide to shake things up a bit. Wagon rigidity and nearly tied indicates wolves are in danger.

Eum no, sometimes top two wagons are just town with a scum on it and the two others just LOL’ing

It's kind of my experience. When the wagons are both on town, it doesn't matter much which gets lynched so wolves probably can take a stance like "one is town, the another is wolf" and then hop in between the wagons or join a third wagon on town if it comes up. When one of the wagons are on wolf, wolves have to be a bit more decided about their stance ("will I bus or will I try to save my partner?") and they don't risk moving elsewhere and hinting town one of the top wagons are on wolf.

[Esooa]

everything about every post on this page is screaming distancing

[KZA]

Yes these are the actions of an innocent kza, mom, definitely not a mafia trying desperately to avoid spew and end the day early so the cop can die already

Idk what you think you're doing it you're town

Literally wasting half the day phase having people solve for a world that doesn't exist

Let's pretend I'm faking for a minute

What have you done that would make me inclined to rescind?

Nothing

You tilted me in to this

Fake red check a known emotional player that just subbed in, awesome strat

Shrugs if someone does fake check you in the future shutting down and not playing the game just makes you look super guilty, fyi

Well I'm not playing anymore so whatever enjoy your wasted day and dead VT

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Ok buddy

[Creature]

Should be pretty clear wolves are in danger here hence the wagon movements all look timid.

So wouldn’t that point to you now?? By your own admission? I mean I don’t actually think a wolf eouod say this if it were actually the case but talk to me.

You can refer to my post prior to this one.

I don't think wolves need to be necessarily wagoned, but if at least one of them are getting plenty of finger of suspicions (even if no vote has been placed on them yet) wolves won't want a liberal gamestate.

[ejjinami]

if ksa or nanook vote, I could hammer

The only question is if I should

I think I could personally just move on

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Vote and I'll hammer

[Esooa]

if you think the last mafia can be literally anyone but creature/syn then sure might as well say but it's not

[Creature]

what do you think about syn?

and esooa actually :P

I believe they're both town

you didn’t even think about the answer before posting, did you? :/

Do you even have any scum-reads atm?
If you consider yourself town and town-read both esooa and son, I’m pretty sure you will either have to end up scum-reading people who are obviously town, or no one lol

So you believe Syn and Esooa are wolves?

don’t change the subject lol
If I’m telling you that your reads don’t make sense, either change them or prove me wrong
If you actually have them, that is

But you're saying that if I townread Syn and Esooa then I will end up scumreading obvtown. That suggests you think everybody else is obvtown while Syn and Esooa are wolves.

Feels like you’re twisting their words here fam, which is either scum or bad town so which is it?

Read this more carefully:

"If you consider yourself town and town-read both esooa and son, I’m pretty sure you will either have to end up scum-reading people who are obviously town, or no one lol"

What is the point of the sequence after the first comma? For me it pretty much implies if I don't wolfread Esooa and Syn I must wolfread obvtown (aka everyone else) or have no wolfreads at all.

[ejjinami]

and lol creature responding so nicely to spark while completely ignoring my push

[VOTE: ksa] aubergine

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I'll leave my legacy with my hammer lol

[Esooa]

it is syn look how fuicking obvious this entire page is

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I faked the check syn and fingers are both green

Luck good chance to be mafia with tmi his play didn't make sense, but only if kza flips green. If he flips red luck probably town

[Creature]

Quite a different approach your taking from the exile game KZA

Yeah, KZA looks pretty much caught wolf here.

[ejjinami]

[VOTE: unvote] aubergine

[Esooa]

this is so fucking boring

[Esooa]

I'm not playing another cop game on the syndicate lol

[JaggedJimmyJay]

The poll vote hit six. Hammer dropped. Stand by.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Day 2 has ended.

@KZA (orangecrush) has been eaten. He was that beautifully constructed and presented piece of food porn seen above.

Spoiler: show

Vanilla town

Night 2 will last until 6:00 PM EDT tomorrow (Friday).

[JaggedJimmyJay]

A corrected poll is now included in the thread's first post.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Night 2 has ended.

Kami was killed. She was a confectionary delight known as chocolate lasagna seen only in the kitchen of the world's premier chef.

Spoiler: show

Vanilla town

Day 3 will last 48 hours. The hammer is five votes.

Spoiler: show

@Creature
@Deli
@ejjinami
@Esooa
@fingersplints
@Hyena
@Luckbox Inc
@Nanook
@MissSparkles

[Luckbox Inc]

ok yikes and lol

[Luckbox Inc]

this time I peeked a wolf for real and yes Nanook is a villager
real seer don't claim