[TOWN WIN] Lost in Space Mafia

[Alison]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

[Alison]

What were your D1 reasons to townread Fext, NAA?

[Seanzie]

Nah man the main reason I "dipped" is because this game has an EOD about 30 minutes before I get out of bed so I more or less missed the entire final 10 hours of the day due to sleeping. I left my vote on Fext because Alison showed up and buried Fext in a way that made me feel like leaving my vote there was probably just the correct thing to do.

If you believe that you made the correct play, then you don't need to ask the question that you did coming into the thread:

Sorry about that I got very busy. NAA why are you thinking Alison?

How about answering the question for a change... that'd be quite helpful to me.

I don't know what there is left to say... An obv town player was axed on D1 of a game that has 2 miss-elims. The logic was that he was mafia with a polarized player that had one good game in which people didn't force anything alignment indicative out of him.

[VOTE: NotAnAxehole] aubergine

You've seen NAA put all his eggs in one basket before, right?

[Alison]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

[MacDougall]

you asked one question and you literally disqualified the only logical argument I can make against yours for an arbitrary reason?

i have no other answer for you.

Wait, wtf, what is "arbitrary" about the fact that you had done the same shit? That is not arbitrary at all.

okay now you're just shifting the goalposts... you disqualifying my ability to make the only rational and logical argument, one so obvious that it was immediately apparent to you is completely unnecessary

[Seanzie]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

[MacDougall]

you asked one question and you literally disqualified the only logical argument I can make against yours for an arbitrary reason?

i have no other answer for you.

Wait, wtf, what is "arbitrary" about the fact that you had done the same shit? That is not arbitrary at all.

Yours is honestly worse because I had to beg Creature to vote Fext. You just went along with it even though clearly you were townreading them.

ah yeah i consciously went along with it while i was sound asleep good call

[Seanzie]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

[Seanzie]

you asked one question and you literally disqualified the only logical argument I can make against yours for an arbitrary reason?

i have no other answer for you.

Wait, wtf, what is "arbitrary" about the fact that you had done the same shit? That is not arbitrary at all.

okay now you're just shifting the goalposts... you disqualifying my ability to make the only rational and logical argument, one so obvious that it was immediately apparent to you is completely unnecessary

I can't shift the goalposts until after you've kicked the football.

You made a read on Creature that applies just as well to you from an outside perspective. It is a fair question to ask what from my POV should I use to distinguish you from Creature given that read.

Your answer to this question is not great thus far TBH...

[Alison]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

I am stating my thoughts and casing my top scumread.

Fext wasn't obvious town because everything that came out of his mouth was complete horseshit that I spent much of my iso dismantling. His inexperience made me lean even more towards him being scum because newbie scum struggle to piece together coherent thoughts and as a result they end up having thought processes that don't make sense in perspective. I struggle to see how anyone could call Fext obvious town.

[NotAnAxehole]

Football or futbol?

[Seanzie]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

"some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them"???????? there is exactly one person that fits that description. Use my name please. Do not pretend like this was an effort of the group. I own up to yesterday, and I know I am obvtown because of it, granted for all the wrong reasons, but meh, still.

How about the mafia that were scumreading Fext before the tunneliest/loudest player started strongly strongly pushing for Fext's elim? Do they backtrack or go along with it?

[Alison]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

I didn't realize it was. The only person I saw bring up that point was NAA.

I think Mac as mafia would most likely have either silently sheeped the wagon and redirected all the blame to me the following day or townread Fext, voted some vanity wagon and peaced out if that was his strategy. I thought his townread on Fext was weird, but he wasn't using it to grab cred or anything and he has a track record of sheeping me even on people he townreads especially D1. I don't think it's particularly suspicious. I would policy him in F5/F3 if it comes to that, but I think NAA is basically outed from being in the exact position scum would want to be in and I don't think he's likely wolves with Mac.

[Seanzie]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

I am stating my thoughts and casing my top scumread.

Fext wasn't obvious town because everything that came out of his mouth was complete horseshit that I spent much of my iso dismantling. His inexperience made me lean even more towards him being scum because newbie scum struggle to piece together coherent thoughts and as a result they end up having thought processes that don't make sense in perspective. I struggle to see how anyone could call Fext obvious town.

1. Who was your original post aimed at? This is a fair question, I relly don't know, but you use the word "you" a lot, so I need to know who "you" is to fairly judge the post.

2. Can you point to a single newbie scum being able to post as much as Fext has?

[Alison]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

"some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them"???????? there is exactly one person that fits that description. Use my name please. Do not pretend like this was an effort of the group. I own up to yesterday, and I know I am obvtown because of it, granted for all the wrong reasons, but meh, still.

How about the mafia that were scumreading Fext before the tunneliest/loudest player started strongly strongly pushing for Fext's elim? Do they backtrack or go along with it?

Me. You. Mac.

Three loud, tunnelly players. All pushing Fext, until the point Mac recanted the scumread.

As I pointed out earlier, I think they either backtrack completely and flip to weakly shielding Fext for cred (which is pretty much what I think NAA is doing here), or they go along with it and blame a scapegoat. I don't think they do what Mac did, which is adopt some weird middle ground stance where they townread someone they want dead but don't gain any towncred for it.

[Seanzie]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

I didn't realize it was. The only person I saw bring up that point was NAA.

I think Mac as mafia would most likely have either silently sheeped the wagon and redirected all the blame to me the following day or townread Fext, voted some vanity wagon and peaced out if that was his strategy. I thought his townread on Fext was weird, but he wasn't using it to grab cred or anything and he has a track record of sheeping me even on people he townreads especially D1. I don't think it's particularly suspicious. I would policy him in F5/F3 if it comes to that, but I think NAA is basically outed from being in the exact position scum would want to be in and I don't think he's likely wolves with Mac.

Plz quote my case on Mac and tell me why I'm wrong. Mac's post connecting LC to Fext made it so he couldn't silently sheep as I personally pivoted from LC to Fext due to what I incorrectly saw as Fext's slipping. Why is it so weird to think that Mac didn't expect me to bite so hard, but felt stuck to his read, and was surprised when even after Fext was being kinda towny, Mac just stayed to elim a town?

Also, plz do it in a way that does not assume your own TMI on yourself. Like, I can accept that you might townread Mac because of your own alignment, but honestly, you/Mac is a super real world for me, so if it is false, I need arguments that work that don't rely on your own TMI.

[Seanzie]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

"some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them"???????? there is exactly one person that fits that description. Use my name please. Do not pretend like this was an effort of the group. I own up to yesterday, and I know I am obvtown because of it, granted for all the wrong reasons, but meh, still.

How about the mafia that were scumreading Fext before the tunneliest/loudest player started strongly strongly pushing for Fext's elim? Do they backtrack or go along with it?

Me. You. Mac.

Three loud, tunnelly players. All pushing Fext, until the point Mac recanted the scumread.

As I pointed out earlier, I think they either backtrack completely and flip to weakly shielding Fext for cred (which is pretty much what I think NAA is doing here), or they go along with it and blame a scapegoat. I don't think they do what Mac did, which is adopt some weird middle ground stance where they townread someone they want dead but don't gain any towncred for it.

Oh wolfy wolfy Alison...

1. Mac did not tunnel Fext, Mac tried so soooo soooooo hard to back off.

2. In what world am I supposed to believe the proud Alison describes herself as tunnelly unless she feels caught?

nah nah nah nah nah nah nah

sorry nah

[Seanzie]

Mac/Alison feel like they tag-teamed in and out, and yeah... it ain't working....

[Seanzie]

@Alison

What is your read of me right now?

@MacDougall

Same question?

[NotAnAxehole]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

"some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them"???????? there is exactly one person that fits that description. Use my name please. Do not pretend like this was an effort of the group. I own up to yesterday, and I know I am obvtown because of it, granted for all the wrong reasons, but meh, still.

How about the mafia that were scumreading Fext before the tunneliest/loudest player started strongly strongly pushing for Fext's elim? Do they backtrack or go along with it?

Me. You. Mac.

Three loud, tunnelly players. All pushing Fext, until the point Mac recanted the scumread.

As I pointed out earlier, I think they either backtrack completely and flip to weakly shielding Fext for cred (which is pretty much what I think NAA is doing here), or they go along with it and blame a scapegoat. I don't think they do what Mac did, which is adopt some weird middle ground stance where they townread someone they want dead but don't gain any towncred for it.

Oh wolfy wolfy Alison...

1. Mac did not tunnel Fext, Mac tried so soooo soooooo hard to back off.

2. In what world am I supposed to believe the proud Alison describes herself as tunnelly unless she feels caught?

nah nah nah nah nah nah nah

sorry nah

I mean on D1 she said "Alison, mac, Seanzie all scum reading someone can't be wrong"

D2: "Everyone is wrong sometimes, scum had TMI"

My guess is Lime Coke also must have had TMI on Fext.

[MacDougall]

@Alison

What is your read of me right now?

@MacDougall

Same question?

drunk

[Alison]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

I am stating my thoughts and casing my top scumread.

Fext wasn't obvious town because everything that came out of his mouth was complete horseshit that I spent much of my iso dismantling. His inexperience made me lean even more towards him being scum because newbie scum struggle to piece together coherent thoughts and as a result they end up having thought processes that don't make sense in perspective. I struggle to see how anyone could call Fext obvious town.

1. Who was your original post aimed at? This is a fair question, I relly don't know, but you use the word "you" a lot, so I need to know who "you" is to fairly judge the post.

2. Can you point to a single newbie scum being able to post as much as Fext has?

1. The word "you" here refers to NAA, re: the stuff about "you said in basic mafia", etc., because I was responding to his post. The post in general is directed at the rest of the thread, because they are who I wish to convince to vote NAA.

2. Off the top of my head, Alexa was coming out strong and spam posting threads from her very first game of forum mafia. At any rate I wouldn't clear someone for volume posting when the content of their posts are really bad.

[MacDougall]

still not scumreading Alison

where is this mystical outed wolf?

[Seanzie]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

I am stating my thoughts and casing my top scumread.

Fext wasn't obvious town because everything that came out of his mouth was complete horseshit that I spent much of my iso dismantling. His inexperience made me lean even more towards him being scum because newbie scum struggle to piece together coherent thoughts and as a result they end up having thought processes that don't make sense in perspective. I struggle to see how anyone could call Fext obvious town.

1. Who was your original post aimed at? This is a fair question, I relly don't know, but you use the word "you" a lot, so I need to know who "you" is to fairly judge the post.

2. Can you point to a single newbie scum being able to post as much as Fext has?

1. The word "you" here refers to NAA, re: the stuff about "you said in basic mafia", etc., because I was responding to his post. The post in general is directed at the rest of the thread, because they are who I wish to convince to vote NAA.

2. Off the top of my head, Alexa was coming out strong and spam posting threads from her very first game of forum mafia. At any rate I wouldn't clear someone for volume posting when the content of their posts are really bad.

So like... Fext is at Champs finalist level...

funny thing, I remember when you found out in Spank! that Jo was reasonably new. That pretty strongly affected your read. Why didn't it affect your read here?

[Alison]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

I didn't realize it was. The only person I saw bring up that point was NAA.

I think Mac as mafia would most likely have either silently sheeped the wagon and redirected all the blame to me the following day or townread Fext, voted some vanity wagon and peaced out if that was his strategy. I thought his townread on Fext was weird, but he wasn't using it to grab cred or anything and he has a track record of sheeping me even on people he townreads especially D1. I don't think it's particularly suspicious. I would policy him in F5/F3 if it comes to that, but I think NAA is basically outed from being in the exact position scum would want to be in and I don't think he's likely wolves with Mac.

Plz quote my case on Mac and tell me why I'm wrong. Mac's post connecting LC to Fext made it so he couldn't silently sheep as I personally pivoted from LC to Fext due to what I incorrectly saw as Fext's slipping. Why is it so weird to think that Mac didn't expect me to bite so hard, but felt stuck to his read, and was surprised when even after Fext was being kinda towny, Mac just stayed to elim a town?

Also, plz do it in a way that does not assume your own TMI on yourself. Like, I can accept that you might townread Mac because of your own alignment, but honestly, you/Mac is a super real world for me, so if it is false, I need arguments that work that don't rely on your own TMI.

In that world why doesn't Mac just go "yeah, I think Fext is scum too, I agree with Seanzie and Alison", and then when Fext flips town, points fingers at you and says you did it?

Or why doesn't he just go "yeah Fext is my townread", but get off and don't do much to defend him so Alison + Seanzie push the wagon through anyway?

[Seanzie]

still not scumreading Alison

where is this mystical outed wolf?

Really? You really don't see why her saying you tunnelled Fext is suspicious?

[Alison]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

"some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them"???????? there is exactly one person that fits that description. Use my name please. Do not pretend like this was an effort of the group. I own up to yesterday, and I know I am obvtown because of it, granted for all the wrong reasons, but meh, still.

How about the mafia that were scumreading Fext before the tunneliest/loudest player started strongly strongly pushing for Fext's elim? Do they backtrack or go along with it?

Me. You. Mac.

Three loud, tunnelly players. All pushing Fext, until the point Mac recanted the scumread.

As I pointed out earlier, I think they either backtrack completely and flip to weakly shielding Fext for cred (which is pretty much what I think NAA is doing here), or they go along with it and blame a scapegoat. I don't think they do what Mac did, which is adopt some weird middle ground stance where they townread someone they want dead but don't gain any towncred for it.

Oh wolfy wolfy Alison...

1. Mac did not tunnel Fext, Mac tried so soooo soooooo hard to back off.

2. In what world am I supposed to believe the proud Alison describes herself as tunnelly unless she feels caught?

nah nah nah nah nah nah nah

sorry nah

1. He tunnelled Fext at the start before he backed off.

2. I have repeatedly described myself as tunnelly. It doesn't offend my sense of pride because I don't think it's a bad trait at all.

Here is a recent example:

[Seanzie]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

I didn't realize it was. The only person I saw bring up that point was NAA.

I think Mac as mafia would most likely have either silently sheeped the wagon and redirected all the blame to me the following day or townread Fext, voted some vanity wagon and peaced out if that was his strategy. I thought his townread on Fext was weird, but he wasn't using it to grab cred or anything and he has a track record of sheeping me even on people he townreads especially D1. I don't think it's particularly suspicious. I would policy him in F5/F3 if it comes to that, but I think NAA is basically outed from being in the exact position scum would want to be in and I don't think he's likely wolves with Mac.

Plz quote my case on Mac and tell me why I'm wrong. Mac's post connecting LC to Fext made it so he couldn't silently sheep as I personally pivoted from LC to Fext due to what I incorrectly saw as Fext's slipping. Why is it so weird to think that Mac didn't expect me to bite so hard, but felt stuck to his read, and was surprised when even after Fext was being kinda towny, Mac just stayed to elim a town?

Also, plz do it in a way that does not assume your own TMI on yourself. Like, I can accept that you might townread Mac because of your own alignment, but honestly, you/Mac is a super real world for me, so if it is false, I need arguments that work that don't rely on your own TMI.

In that world why doesn't Mac just go "yeah, I think Fext is scum too, I agree with Seanzie and Alison", and then when Fext flips town, points fingers at you and says you did it?

Or why doesn't he just go "yeah Fext is my townread", but get off and don't do much to defend him so Alison + Seanzie push the wagon through anyway?

I think he thought I'd be wayyyyy less obvtown than I am. Like sorry, but I was wrong in the way that makes me clear town. Y'all could not have necessarily seen that coming.

How is it not almost always a good idea to let a tunnelly town cause another town to flip? Like... honestly 9/10 times that would have worked, but it is clear I went too hard.

Also Mac legit did try a flacid attempt to push me today. Did you read that, or did you skip it because it was a post by a partner?

[Seanzie]

Fext/LC were T/T with some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them. We know this for a fact.

Mafia doesn't sit there and join in the tunnel. Mafia just drops a townread on Fext that's weak enough it won't change the outcome of the day, sit on the counterwagon, and roll in free towncred then gets town to sleepwalk on the players pushing Fext for being wrong once. If I die the game is almost certainly lost and all mafia has to do is allow town to murder each other.

This is exactly how NAA has been playing, and he's jumped straight to the "kill everyone on Fext's wagon because they're just such good players they can never be wrong on a single player ever" line the moment D2 opens.

"some of the tunneliest/loudest players on the game pushing them"???????? there is exactly one person that fits that description. Use my name please. Do not pretend like this was an effort of the group. I own up to yesterday, and I know I am obvtown because of it, granted for all the wrong reasons, but meh, still.

How about the mafia that were scumreading Fext before the tunneliest/loudest player started strongly strongly pushing for Fext's elim? Do they backtrack or go along with it?

Me. You. Mac.

Three loud, tunnelly players. All pushing Fext, until the point Mac recanted the scumread.

As I pointed out earlier, I think they either backtrack completely and flip to weakly shielding Fext for cred (which is pretty much what I think NAA is doing here), or they go along with it and blame a scapegoat. I don't think they do what Mac did, which is adopt some weird middle ground stance where they townread someone they want dead but don't gain any towncred for it.

Oh wolfy wolfy Alison...

1. Mac did not tunnel Fext, Mac tried so soooo soooooo hard to back off.

2. In what world am I supposed to believe the proud Alison describes herself as tunnelly unless she feels caught?

nah nah nah nah nah nah nah

sorry nah

1. He tunnelled Fext at the start before he backed off.

2. I have repeatedly described myself as tunnelly. It doesn't offend my sense of pride because I don't think it's a bad trait at all.

Here is a recent example:

1. quote the posts where he tunneled Fext. He didn't push Fext for crap.

[Alison]

@Alison

What is your read of me right now?

@MacDougall

Same question?

I think you're probably town.

[MacDougall]

still not scumreading Alison

where is this mystical outed wolf?

Really? You really don't see why her saying you tunnelled Fext is suspicious?

she didn't say that, she said i am a tunnely player... why do you keep misrepresenting every fact

u wolfin?

[Seanzie]

@Alison

What is your read of me right now?

@MacDougall

Same question?

I think you're probably town.

I'm obviously town.

You aren't.

[Alison]

I mean on D1 she said "Alison, mac, Seanzie all scum reading someone can't be wrong"

D2: "Everyone is wrong sometimes, scum had TMI"

My guess is Lime Coke also must have had TMI on Fext.

LC was specifically being linked to Fext so him townreading Fext makes sense. Internally. His actual reasons for doing so were nonsensical and it's why I rejected them and pushed both of them.

What were your reasons for townreading Fext? What posts jumped out at you as being super townie?

[Seanzie]

@MacDougall give a real read on me. Am I town or scum?

[MacDougall]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

I didn't realize it was. The only person I saw bring up that point was NAA.

I think Mac as mafia would most likely have either silently sheeped the wagon and redirected all the blame to me the following day or townread Fext, voted some vanity wagon and peaced out if that was his strategy. I thought his townread on Fext was weird, but he wasn't using it to grab cred or anything and he has a track record of sheeping me even on people he townreads especially D1. I don't think it's particularly suspicious. I would policy him in F5/F3 if it comes to that, but I think NAA is basically outed from being in the exact position scum would want to be in and I don't think he's likely wolves with Mac.

Plz quote my case on Mac and tell me why I'm wrong. Mac's post connecting LC to Fext made it so he couldn't silently sheep as I personally pivoted from LC to Fext due to what I incorrectly saw as Fext's slipping. Why is it so weird to think that Mac didn't expect me to bite so hard, but felt stuck to his read, and was surprised when even after Fext was being kinda towny, Mac just stayed to elim a town?

Also, plz do it in a way that does not assume your own TMI on yourself. Like, I can accept that you might townread Mac because of your own alignment, but honestly, you/Mac is a super real world for me, so if it is false, I need arguments that work that don't rely on your own TMI.

In that world why doesn't Mac just go "yeah, I think Fext is scum too, I agree with Seanzie and Alison", and then when Fext flips town, points fingers at you and says you did it?

Or why doesn't he just go "yeah Fext is my townread", but get off and don't do much to defend him so Alison + Seanzie push the wagon through anyway?

dont mind me just here to throw

[MacDougall]

@MacDougall give a real read on me. Am I town or scum?

scown

[NotAnAxehole]

Watching Alison and Mac talk about each other while they both have a go at Seanzie....

[MacDougall]

@Alison

What is your read of me right now?

@MacDougall

Same question?

I think you're probably town.

I'm obviously town.

You aren't.

wrong on both counts

[Seanzie]

Seanzie why are you not more suspicious of Fext townreaders having TMI given that you thought Fext was outed D1?

My whole case around Mac is based on Mac's Fext-townready posts being TMI? Plz

I didn't realize it was. The only person I saw bring up that point was NAA.

I think Mac as mafia would most likely have either silently sheeped the wagon and redirected all the blame to me the following day or townread Fext, voted some vanity wagon and peaced out if that was his strategy. I thought his townread on Fext was weird, but he wasn't using it to grab cred or anything and he has a track record of sheeping me even on people he townreads especially D1. I don't think it's particularly suspicious. I would policy him in F5/F3 if it comes to that, but I think NAA is basically outed from being in the exact position scum would want to be in and I don't think he's likely wolves with Mac.

Plz quote my case on Mac and tell me why I'm wrong. Mac's post connecting LC to Fext made it so he couldn't silently sheep as I personally pivoted from LC to Fext due to what I incorrectly saw as Fext's slipping. Why is it so weird to think that Mac didn't expect me to bite so hard, but felt stuck to his read, and was surprised when even after Fext was being kinda towny, Mac just stayed to elim a town?

Also, plz do it in a way that does not assume your own TMI on yourself. Like, I can accept that you might townread Mac because of your own alignment, but honestly, you/Mac is a super real world for me, so if it is false, I need arguments that work that don't rely on your own TMI.

In that world why doesn't Mac just go "yeah, I think Fext is scum too, I agree with Seanzie and Alison", and then when Fext flips town, points fingers at you and says you did it?

Or why doesn't he just go "yeah Fext is my townread", but get off and don't do much to defend him so Alison + Seanzie push the wagon through anyway?

dont mind me just here to throw

Don't mind me just here to make pretend partner interactions

[NotAnAxehole]

It's an awkward 3 way conversation because 2 people deliberately avoiding each other and pumping different narratives about their play.

[MacDougall]

Watching Alison and Mac talk about each other while they both have a go at Seanzie....

mmm yes alison and macdougall, noted for our inability to wolf together

viewtopic.php?t=1904 < a game we wolfed together and won

[Alison]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

I am stating my thoughts and casing my top scumread.

Fext wasn't obvious town because everything that came out of his mouth was complete horseshit that I spent much of my iso dismantling. His inexperience made me lean even more towards him being scum because newbie scum struggle to piece together coherent thoughts and as a result they end up having thought processes that don't make sense in perspective. I struggle to see how anyone could call Fext obvious town.

1. Who was your original post aimed at? This is a fair question, I relly don't know, but you use the word "you" a lot, so I need to know who "you" is to fairly judge the post.

2. Can you point to a single newbie scum being able to post as much as Fext has?

1. The word "you" here refers to NAA, re: the stuff about "you said in basic mafia", etc., because I was responding to his post. The post in general is directed at the rest of the thread, because they are who I wish to convince to vote NAA.

2. Off the top of my head, Alexa was coming out strong and spam posting threads from her very first game of forum mafia. At any rate I wouldn't clear someone for volume posting when the content of their posts are really bad.

So like... Fext is at Champs finalist level...

funny thing, I remember when you found out in Spank! that Jo was reasonably new. That pretty strongly affected your read. Why didn't it affect your read here?

Do you think posting a lot is what makes you a Champs finalist?

GGhana is not a newbie exactly but they are a notoriously polarized scum player. They top posted in Hydra G3. The point I am making is that it is absurd to assume that anyone who is newbie scum can't go above a certain number of posts. I think it's reasonable to assume they can't make posts above a certain quality, or to consistently provide good content. This is why I townread Jo in Spank! - she was making townie enough posts that I was willing to just clear her for them because I don't think a newbie scum could fake those posts. At no point did I say "Jo must be town because she is posting too many times". I said "Jo must be town because her posts are good". Fext's posts weren't good. Fext's posts were shit.

[MacDougall]

It's an awkward 3 way conversation because 2 people deliberately avoiding each other and pumping different narratives about their play.

its difficult to interact with alison when she is doing nothing but say good things about me to the guy who keeps prodding me and asking me questions... but if it please you m'lord

@Alison why does NAA think you are outed mafia cuz i have nfi.

[NotAnAxehole]

Watching Alison and Mac talk about each other while they both have a go at Seanzie....

mmm yes alison and macdougall, noted for our inability to wolf together

viewtopic.php?t=1904 < a game we wolfed together and won

I'm not going to read another game, I'm not budging on my falcon, wilgy, Seanzie reads. Nothing that happens in this game moving forward really matters to my PoE unless one of them actually wolf claimed.

[Seanzie]

Watching Alison and Mac talk about each other while they both have a go at Seanzie....

mmm yes alison and macdougall, noted for our inability to wolf together

viewtopic.php?t=1904 < a game we wolfed together and won

Lolz mac.

[Alison]

given LC is a leading wagon I do have to ask

in poking around I saw he just won a game as mafia where people were like really shocked by his performance

how much does that factor into all of your guys' perceptions of him in this game

found Lime Coke's partner, game is over

Oh wow Fext has a million votes lol.

Well I guess that's good.

and LC isn't one of them lol

Lime Coke if you're town omgussing me because I am calling you and fext outed based on nothing is a pretty bad way to convince me of such

@Seanzie Here are Mac's posts where he strongly pushes LC/Fext as a team before moving to a townread of Fext.

[Alison]

It's an awkward 3 way conversation because 2 people deliberately avoiding each other and pumping different narratives about their play.

It's funny because I'm not really talking to you either and even said the post that responded to you was actually addressed at the rest of the thread in general.

It's almost like I'm not particularly interested in convincing you that you are scum and I'm not interested in convincing Mac that Mac is town and I am talking to the person I am trying to convince.

[Seanzie]

Fext was not obvious town. He was an incredibly scummy player with a very plausible scumslip theory hanging around his neck. It's been clear, both in this game and in past games, that you don't have a ton of respect for my town play, to the point that you said in basic mafia you'd be willing to completely contravene my entire legacy if I flipped town just out of spite. I could believe you would policy Mac for pushing a D1 misexe, I don't believe that you would adopt the same policy on me.

1. Who is this post aimed at?

2. Why wasn't Fext obvious town, outside of the scumslip? Did his inexperience factor into anything for you?

I am stating my thoughts and casing my top scumread.

Fext wasn't obvious town because everything that came out of his mouth was complete horseshit that I spent much of my iso dismantling. His inexperience made me lean even more towards him being scum because newbie scum struggle to piece together coherent thoughts and as a result they end up having thought processes that don't make sense in perspective. I struggle to see how anyone could call Fext obvious town.

1. Who was your original post aimed at? This is a fair question, I relly don't know, but you use the word "you" a lot, so I need to know who "you" is to fairly judge the post.

2. Can you point to a single newbie scum being able to post as much as Fext has?

1. The word "you" here refers to NAA, re: the stuff about "you said in basic mafia", etc., because I was responding to his post. The post in general is directed at the rest of the thread, because they are who I wish to convince to vote NAA.

2. Off the top of my head, Alexa was coming out strong and spam posting threads from her very first game of forum mafia. At any rate I wouldn't clear someone for volume posting when the content of their posts are really bad.

So like... Fext is at Champs finalist level...

funny thing, I remember when you found out in Spank! that Jo was reasonably new. That pretty strongly affected your read. Why didn't it affect your read here?

Do you think posting a lot is what makes you a Champs finalist?

GGhana is not a newbie exactly but they are a notoriously polarized scum player. They top posted in Hydra G3. The point I am making is that it is absurd to assume that anyone who is newbie scum can't go above a certain number of posts. I think it's reasonable to assume they can't make posts above a certain quality, or to consistently provide good content. This is why I townread Jo in Spank! - she was making townie enough posts that I was willing to just clear her for them because I don't think a newbie scum could fake those posts. At no point did I say "Jo must be town because she is posting too many times". I said "Jo must be town because her posts are good". Fext's posts weren't good. Fext's posts were shit.

Weird thing is though... you didn't change your stance on Fext when you learned they were new like you did Jo. You have a clear uncertain period about you when you leanred Jo was new... none of that appears here.

The postcount thing is all just a distraction to see how your Fext progression went... and guess what? you didn't have one.

[MacDougall]

Watching Alison and Mac talk about each other while they both have a go at Seanzie....

mmm yes alison and macdougall, noted for our inability to wolf together

viewtopic.php?t=1904 < a game we wolfed together and won

I'm not going to read another game, I'm not budging on my falcon, wilgy, Seanzie reads. Nothing that happens in this game moving forward really matters to my PoE unless one of them actually wolf claimed.

sure let's just not bother reading or listening to each other's points and just arbitrarily throw the game to RNG NAA style

why do you have falcon and wilgy town? i've stated reasons, where are yours? they just appear to exist.

[Seanzie]

given LC is a leading wagon I do have to ask

in poking around I saw he just won a game as mafia where people were like really shocked by his performance

how much does that factor into all of your guys' perceptions of him in this game

found Lime Coke's partner, game is over

Oh wow Fext has a million votes lol.

Well I guess that's good.

and LC isn't one of them lol

Lime Coke if you're town omgussing me because I am calling you and fext outed based on nothing is a pretty bad way to convince me of such

@Seanzie Here are Mac's posts where he strongly pushes LC/Fext as a team before moving to a townread of Fext.

Yes... four posts... and then?