Mafia Misplay Mafia

[Jackofhearts2005]

The fact I am one of her principal wolf reads is why I care about it over the others

I don't think wolves just sat around doing nothing for the whole day until they decided to EoD. And it's not like Mac was possibly going to die only at EoD, it was all day. And like I've said the way Risiinq has voted me is particularly bleh to me, saying Mac should be probably voted but she's just gonna vote me anyways, with other posts saying reasons he's town then ending in a wash.

Think the same applies to you if you're town but I don't recall personally the reads on you cause well, it's not me lmao. Though thinking about it, I think Jack was pushing you a lot, so that's another thing against him looking at it like that

What things is this talking to-about?

[Esooa]

The fact I am one of her principal wolf reads is why I care about it over the others

I don't think wolves just sat around doing nothing for the whole day until they decided to EoD. And it's not like Mac was possibly going to die only at EoD, it was all day. And like I've said the way Risiinq has voted me is particularly bleh to me, saying Mac should be probably voted but she's just gonna vote me anyways, with other posts saying reasons he's town then ending in a wash.

Think the same applies to you if you're town but I don't recall personally the reads on you cause well, it's not me lmao. Though thinking about it, I think Jack was pushing you a lot, so that's another thing against him looking at it like that

What things is this talking to-about?

Risiinq

[Jackofhearts2005]

Hi @Jackofhearts2005

What wants cat-thing now?

You duh

It would not-not work out.

How come?

Queek already has boyfriend.

[Porscha]

my problem with snow is her trying to say she and santy were the ones who "took the pelt" when that's frankly incredibly wrong and i dont get why she would ever say that

I think the opposite and that ris is totally absolutely right with that.
Maybe missed some people, but me and them have certainly part of the pelt cuz like, we sussed Mac together and we stayed ln the wagon. Look at my votecounts of D2 ffs

it's not just abt wagon but about posts and reads and day 1

esooa and i were sussing mac since day 1

I am of the opinion that when omgus-based arguments start occurring and it devolves into "well I did x MORE than the other person!" then the people involved are strongly off-mark of most of the parties involved, or it's entirely v/v.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The fact I am one of her principal wolf reads is why I care about it over the others

I don't think wolves just sat around doing nothing for the whole day until they decided to EoD. And it's not like Mac was possibly going to die only at EoD, it was all day. And like I've said the way Risiinq has voted me is particularly bleh to me, saying Mac should be probably voted but she's just gonna vote me anyways, with other posts saying reasons he's town then ending in a wash.

Think the same applies to you if you're town but I don't recall personally the reads on you cause well, it's not me lmao. Though thinking about it, I think Jack was pushing you a lot, so that's another thing against him looking at it like that

What things is this talking to-about?

Risiinq

Risinq is “her” or “you”?

[Esooa]

The fact I am one of her principal wolf reads is why I care about it over the others

I don't think wolves just sat around doing nothing for the whole day until they decided to EoD. And it's not like Mac was possibly going to die only at EoD, it was all day. And like I've said the way Risiinq has voted me is particularly bleh to me, saying Mac should be probably voted but she's just gonna vote me anyways, with other posts saying reasons he's town then ending in a wash.

Think the same applies to you if you're town but I don't recall personally the reads on you cause well, it's not me lmao. Though thinking about it, I think Jack was pushing you a lot, so that's another thing against him looking at it like that

What things is this talking to-about?

Risiinq

Risinq is “her” or “you”?

Risiinq is her, Santy is you

[Sabiplz]

Hi @Jackofhearts2005

What wants cat-thing now?

You duh

It would not-not work out.

How come?

Queek already has boyfriend.

Happy for u and Mac

[Sabiplz]

*waiting for the nyquil to kick in is taking forever*

[Lilypetal]

alright i voted jack see u all in 2 days

[Jackofhearts2005]

This is literally the ris I read in Candyland montainous, I think sabi should know what I am talking about zzzz

I barely read that game because I was just banned and my game was stolen from me.

I was extremely upset.

Oh rip.
I found ris as obtown since early D1, and shielded them all D1 and D2 when they were lynched, they were town.
They had the same thing in D2 with the presence Esooa is referencing as wolfy I think, and had some problems getting the feeling of thread, but the way they went about reading into their pushes and stuff? Totally the same.
And they were one of the people who were On the wolf since D1/Early D2.
Probably better to look at the slots that were voting with Mac to 3 distinct wagons at EoD , am I crazy? Ris only joined in the one who was one of their suspects, while Jack and Hk (and Neon to less extent) just went 'Mac yeahhh Villa' ant voted differents slots with hopes that the flashwagon went good. And its EVIDENT the tonl switch from Mac before they appear to vote with him.

So, people reading EoD and picking on Ris switch to one of their principal scumread through the day, that got switched back quickly, instead lf those slots is what tilted me, probably

Queek voted one thing only to save beard-thing.

Queek suspected you-you before had bad read on liar-Mac. Queek saw two friend-allies suggest vote Esooa. Queek said why Esooa. Queek got okay answer. Not best-best answer. Voted to kill-yeet Esooa. Probably wrong-wrong. Not Queek’s fault. Queek not try any other kill-yeets because no smart-wise plan for why other things are wolf-things. Queek asked. None found. Better to resolve beard-thing so back to Santy wagon alone.

[hollowkatt]

Can Nook and hk just have their love-hate sex already.

The sexual tension is a lot

Sorry I draw the line at antagonistic flirting

Then stop all the sexual fireworks.

I need a cig when I'm reading yall.

smoke 'em if you got 'em

[Sabiplz]

Alright I moved back to rising since Jack has enough votes.

Gn and godspeed.

[Sabiplz]

If you want to complain about my vote, mods dms are open.

[hollowkatt]

Like, the reason I came so mad is cuz people just threw ris/Mac interactions from the past day and just twisted it to fit a narrative or just straight uo ignored them? Just to put a lazy vote in Ris. And that is even when I at EoD presented a compelling case ln why the FLIPPED WOLF has and insane equity with other slot who hasnt been towny AT ALL.

And somehow ris is the lead wagon? Like wtf

do you seriously think I go that hard defending Mac, starting the Esooa counterwagon with minutes left in teh game day, and then end there if I'm a wolf with mac?

That's like putting out a big blinking sign that says "I am a wolf you complete and utter jacket"

alternately this is all wifom and you should have killed me D1. you'll never know

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like, I stand by the fact that one if these three is true by that kill almost always

V!Hollowkatt
W!Achro
W!Lily.


Other thing it could point out is to another UTR slot without much impact being Scum (Wilgz,Jack,Neon)

Queek is looking for reasons to clear Santy. Queek has not found them yet. Queek has found this.

What does Santy think of this now?

[Jackofhearts2005]

the fact the biggest thing Santy's managed to harp on for the scum read he's had on me the literal entire game is that I'm more inclined to read Neon as more town than risiinq, neon who has literally no other games on site and is playing like, idk how to say, but would be a complete newbie wolf while not one person in thread has said otherwise, is just so rudimentary and lol

I dont think thats a fair analysis?
Like, for starters I started sussing you for your debunking on the Visor/Ris scumreads, and still weirded by your read on ris.
Then I compare with how you read Neon and it pings me.
The way you read me I feel like a lot of undeciding and mostly you adapting to thread , tbfh.
And like, if HK is town, you are not being protown in the slightlest, with room to doubt if Mac is a wolf imo.

Do you think you have been towny for me to not sus you?

What means this bit?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Also Mac, you understand that Im sussing you because your worldview of the game seems to waver ? Like some of th post you did also doesnt add up with how you put me in your W!hk cat in the same tier as JACK. And Esoos in Lean Wolf for that matter.

Its like, too big of a flaw for me to ignore

This maybe means Santy is town-thing.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Also Mac, you understand that Im sussing you because your worldview of the game seems to waver ? Like some of th post you did also doesnt add up with how you put me in your W!hk cat in the same tier as JACK. And Esoos in Lean Wolf for that matter.

Its like, too big of a flaw for me to ignore

You are in that tier because you have partner equity with Snow who at the time I was speculating had partner equity with HK. I had explained my progressions at the time but to summarise it for you.

Day 1 - Snow has me middling, above null. Votes out Ender with me. Has Santy, HK and others below me.
Day 2 - Achro, Lily, Esooa, Porscha all come out pushing onto me. Suddenly Snow says "Yeah Mac is off" votes me. And drops you AND HK from their POE with no progression at all.

I am considerate of the fact that Snow probably would just keep HK in their POE if they were mafia and have since gotten off that entire read. The fact that you have played into me the way you have has you as town to me.

But you had such a townread in me, why couldnt snow be trying to pocket me? Like, you put me down cuz of good equity with someone who had good equity with your scumread. Like, comoaring that with you 'Santy is never mafia' or something like that you posted at EoD I dont see really how that makes me trend down so much.

I think ris also had one townread in me in D1, not looking at the ISO cuz I suck at checking those but I remember it (When I sussed Essoa for doubting Visor townread on ris).

Have you read Hk/Esooa interactions?

Santy I had you in a literal townleans category why are you freaking out about it? You keep acting like me putting you in the same tier as Jack is a problem. I am literally townreading Jack.

Santy can be friend-ally for now. Better reasons to believe that than most things.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Good reasons to think town-things
Cat-thing Sabi
Santy

Not so good-good reasons to think town-things
Old-thing HK
Esooa

Queek doesn’t want to deal with
Nanook
Lily

Queek needs to read
Ice-thing
Glow-thing
Wilgy
Porscha

Queek go play Persona now-now. Refresh thread if more talk-speaking to do.

[Lilypetal]

Good reasons to think town-things
Cat-thing Sabi
Santy

Not so good-good reasons to think town-things
Old-thing HK
Esooa

Queek doesn’t want to deal with
Nanook
Lily

Queek needs to read
Ice-thing
Glow-thing
Wilgy
Porscha

Queek go play Persona now-now. Refresh thread if more talk-speaking to do.

which one

[Jackofhearts2005]

Good reasons to think town-things
Cat-thing Sabi
Santy

Not so good-good reasons to think town-things
Old-thing HK
Esooa

Queek doesn’t want to deal with
Nanook
Lily

Queek needs to read
Ice-thing
Glow-thing
Wilgy
Porscha

Queek go play Persona now-now. Refresh thread if more talk-speaking to do.

which one

Three

[Lilypetal]

Good reasons to think town-things
Cat-thing Sabi
Santy

Not so good-good reasons to think town-things
Old-thing HK
Esooa

Queek doesn’t want to deal with
Nanook
Lily

Queek needs to read
Ice-thing
Glow-thing
Wilgy
Porscha

Queek go play Persona now-now. Refresh thread if more talk-speaking to do.

which one

Three

best be using aigis

[risiinq-]

@risiinq- sheep me. Its one in Jack/Hk 100% of the times, if not both

no. i am hypothesizing a nook/hk dichotomy

[Porscha]

@risiinq- sheep me. Its one in Jack/Hk 100% of the times, if not both

no. i am hypothesizing a nook/hk dichotomy

and that's based off of nook and hk interactions when hk was wagon day 1? and then the little bit nook said today?

[risiinq-]

ahem i see santy get angry at my wagon and i feel a bit chill-er now lol

sorry for my horrible start of day posts but really how everyone came in to read me was SO INFURIATING OMG YOU CANNOT IMAGINE

LIKE IDC

my eod was not horrible.

anyways, i dont wanna talk abt this topic more than needed but i think my start of day posts are warranted, and most are still logical

[hollowkatt]

@risiinq- sheep me. Its one in Jack/Hk 100% of the times, if not both

no. i am hypothesizing a nook/hk dichotomy

why? Specifically I want you to lay out why nanook, as wolf, would be pushing HK, as town, when there are other, perhaps vastly better (especially after the hyperposting started) players that they could have been pushing?

I get it if you think it's wolf HK and town Nanook, but if you flip me I'll be green so I want to hear you lay out the reverse of what you think is true.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

ahem i see santy get angry at my wagon and i feel a bit chill-er now lol

sorry for my horrible start of day posts but really how everyone came in to read me was SO INFURIATING OMG YOU CANNOT IMAGINE

LIKE IDC

my eod was not horrible.

anyways, i dont wanna talk abt this topic more than needed but i think my start of day posts are warranted, and most are still logical

Like your world view is a mess and makes no sense

And I'm having a hard time with Santy who went from constantly attacking Macs towniness based on his world view to exclaiming Riisinq is clearly and obviously Villa with an also completely and utterly messy worldview that makes no sense.

[risiinq-]

ahem i see santy get angry at my wagon and i feel a bit chill-er now lol

sorry for my horrible start of day posts but really how everyone came in to read me was SO INFURIATING OMG YOU CANNOT IMAGINE

LIKE IDC

my eod was not horrible.

anyways, i dont wanna talk abt this topic more than needed but i think my start of day posts are warranted, and most are still logical

Like your world view is a mess and makes no sense

And I'm having a hard time with Santy who went from constantly attacking Macs towniness based on his world view to exclaiming Riisinq is clearly and obviously Villa with an also completely and utterly messy worldview that makes no sense.

what about my worldview doesnt make sense btw

[risiinq-]

i read the first half of esooa's iso (from rn to like halfway day2)

why are people clearing them off of pushing mac??

like they never push it strongly, it's "i think mac might be wolf"

stuff like that

how is this clearing?

can someone quote things they think from esooa are clearing, specifically in terms of interaction with mac?

[risiinq-]

at the same time, like my problem with esooa specifically is that they are not really trying to read me

see cats vs dogs, where i was ACTUALLY wolfing and esooa even got there at the end

it is not passive aggressive attacks

they will work with the people they suspect

rn they are blocking everything and just attacking everything i post

[risiinq-]

now, i'll attempt to explain my worldview a bit, in terms of my townclears and why my poe is what it is

[risiinq-]

sabi and porscha are my locktowns off of "out of wolfrange". feel free to surprise me with an outstanding wolfgame, it's just what i think/how ive read you both. don't think yall can fake what you have done

santy imo is clear to me with how he came into today defending me - it is /really/ authentic - and his interactions with mac and how mac approached him
as well as when i took a trip onto voting esooa he immediately pleaded with me, in a way one would approach a townread, to stop messing around and vote mac lol

neon is also towny bcuz i dont think they have the guts to look that blatantly partnered with mac

lily and drwigly are both kinda towny to me altho note that it isn't as strong as my above reads - especially drwigly
lily i have specific micromoments i like and i think they are way into their towngame meta than wolfgame, a lot of elaborate reads and stuff i dont think they can fake, as well as the hard townread on esooa that while i disagreed with, liked how they approached
drwigly i need to look into more but shrug

that leaves
{nook, hk, esooa, jack}

if anyone has a specific problem with my poe let me know what it is pls, just saying it's bad or that i have a bad worldview makes me rly confused on like, why
notably what would be great would be to tell me who i am misclearing and why

[risiinq-]

@risiinq- sheep me. Its one in Jack/Hk 100% of the times, if not both

no. i am hypothesizing a nook/hk dichotomy

why? Specifically I want you to lay out why nanook, as wolf, would be pushing HK, as town, when there are other, perhaps vastly better (especially after the hyperposting started) players that they could have been pushing?

I get it if you think it's wolf HK and town Nanook, but if you flip me I'll be green so I want to hear you lay out the reverse of what you think is true.

do you think nook is pushing you in good faith? i find it hard to wrap around how stuck he is on ur slot

[risiinq-]

santy i just think the ris ur talking about is not the ris in this game tbh

what problem do u have specifically with my slot? do you agree with what the scumreaders on me have been saying about me?

fwiw santy is correct lol and we kinda are good at reading each other

[hollowkatt]

@risiinq- sheep me. Its one in Jack/Hk 100% of the times, if not both

no. i am hypothesizing a nook/hk dichotomy

why? Specifically I want you to lay out why nanook, as wolf, would be pushing HK, as town, when there are other, perhaps vastly better (especially after the hyperposting started) players that they could have been pushing?

I get it if you think it's wolf HK and town Nanook, but if you flip me I'll be green so I want to hear you lay out the reverse of what you think is true.

do you think nook is pushing you in good faith? i find it hard to wrap around how stuck he is on ur slot

I'll hold my answer till you answer the question

[risiinq-]

I don't have a real answer

[risiinq-]

can i know what u think about my poe

[Esooa]

at the same time, like my problem with esooa specifically is that they are not really trying to read me

see cats vs dogs, where i was ACTUALLY wolfing and esooa even got there at the end

it is not passive aggressive attacks

they will work with the people they suspect

rn they are blocking everything and just attacking everything i post

You're right that I wasn't that much in day 1/2. I read some of your posts and when I read posts from you in your wolf game with Creature I felt similar as when I read them from your town games so I wasn't sure what to think of you and put it off a bit.

I just read all of my day 1 in cats vs dogs and I don't think it's true that I've not been working as much as I do with people usually, I don't think I do very much and I more often than not try to avoid telling my reasons for why I think a person is a wolf to that person. I haven't asked you much though, which is correct. But I think that's more to do with I can't even remember when we really posted together in thread last day and me putting you off. I still did intend to read your ISO until day 2 I remembered I really can't be assed to read one right now

As for Mac, maybe it's not that clearing for me, I don't know. The way I see it, I've been wolf reading Mac from middling to strongly all game. It probably did come across as less than that in thread because with how Mac plays and how Mac plays with me our tendencies are to provoke each other and I didn't want that. I also just don't want to kill him unless I'm more sure that he's a wolf. Relating to knowing how much you push someone though, that was one thing that was ? from you fmpov earlier, that you were so quick and sure to say you are cleared for pushing Mac. But maybe I am just dumber than you or have posted much too much.

If you want to ask about any players I'm here rn

[Porscha]

can i know what u think about my poe

can you rank probabilities of each being wolf and if there are any associations (ie. if nook is wolf, does it clear hk, vice versa, etc)

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

My head hurts

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Can't wrap my head around half of what I'm reading right now

[hollowkatt]

I don't have a real answer

can i know what u think about my poe

So when you say this:

@risiinq- sheep me. Its one in Jack/Hk 100% of the times, if not both

no. i am hypothesizing a nook/hk dichotomy

What you really mean is this:

HK is a wolf
Nanook is town

Otherwise you'd have already thought of how your world view would look the other way around.
That's not a dichotomy that can be explored, that's a world you're presenting as "factual as far as you know" which isn't actually doing any solving.

As far as your POE goes I think at absolute best you've got 2 wolves in there, likely 1 at most, entirely possible that it's zero tbh.

I don't think Esooa/Mac can be paired in any world. If they are that was some fantastic theater and wolf chat has to be either salty as fuck or full of laughs.
Likewise if Nanook is a wolf I don't think he hitches his wagon to me and then cajoles Mac to join in. The main part of why I suspected nanook during D1 and into D2 until I stopped paying attention to his posts is that he's trying to use meta that isn't applicable here, and if it was Santy would have jumped on that and hammered it, so would have Jack. which also tells me that Jack and nanook aren't paired (knowingly).

If the team consists of multiples of jack, nanook, mac, esooa I would have been dead and buried D1, Ender would not have gone over. They have too much meta about my wolf game that they could have used.

In the world where you're a wolf you're calling your partner town.
In the world where you're town I think your weakest clears are lily and wigly and neon. All three of them are highly skilled wolves and the reasons you're clearing them are rather flimsy. They could have counted on me going over D1, shifted into a weird state where it was clear I wasn't going to be the D2 AND I was defending Mac, which could save me for the D3, which would explain why I ended with only nanook on my wagon.

I think nanook is a true believer in the HK is wolfing case, this does not feel manufactured any more. If it was I think he would have abandoned it by now, but here he is with his continuation vote and at that point he's just shitting the bed if he's wolfing. He's got next to no thread presence and/or credit, he can't really be useful to create cases and make pushes without relating them to me in some way. I'm his albatross if he's a wolf.

In conclusion I think you're either a wolf or you've got really bad clears up there, which tells me you're a wolf.
Soz

Even after nanook drops his big case, with discord screenshots, it wasn't enough to get me over. And those 4 know my town game is no slouch even after going on a bender of cussing.

I think your POE is bad, basically.

I see how you argued yourself into it, I just can't agree with it for the reasons I laid out above.

[Esooa]

In the world where you're town I think your weakest clears are lily and wigly and neon. All three of them are highly skilled wolves and the reasons you're clearing them are rather flimsy

Can you talk about Neon more and their wolf game

I don't think they play EoD like they did as w/w with Mac. Do you?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Did HK call me a skilled woof

Aww ilu <3

Kinda needed to hear that xD

[Esooa]

Did HK call me a skilled woof

Aww ilu <3

Kinda needed to hear that xD

I don't think anything in particular of your wolf game other than you've said if you were a wolf your play would be bussing your teammates and such things, lol. And I believe you, it seemed true enough, and I've read other posts that have sounded genuine like about being pocketed by people and such things

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

I'm in an awful state in mafia where everything from Champs onward with a few exceptions has made me feel really bad about myself within the context of the game... like I feel like everything I built my mafia self image around has been torn to shreds

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

And I'm trying to get it back

[Esooa]

I'm in an awful state in mafia where everything from Champs onward with a few exceptions has made me feel really bad about myself within the context of the game... like I feel like everything I built my mafia self image around has been torn to shreds

Ah, sorry to hear :c

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

It's okay it's on me. I've just always believed in my ability to find town and make the game fun for everyone but lately I've been being a bitch and protecting woofs a lot.

Like Mac here. Or Cobalt in champs. And that was like the one part of my game I believed in. Ig I also believe I'm good at talking my way out of SRs when I'm motivated too.

[Esooa]

It's okay it's on me. I've just always believed in my ability to find town and make the game fun for everyone but lately I've been being a bitch and protecting woofs a lot.

Like Mac here. Or Cobalt in champs. And that was like the one part of my game I believed in. Ig I also believe I'm good at talking my way out of SRs when I'm motivated too.

I don't think you've made this game worse at any point

And town reading wolf Mac just happens lmao