The Syndicate

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:58 pm Hyena

Jackofhearts2005

town

town

Hyena

Jackofhearts2005

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:56 pm Here are the first two:

Dragon D. Luffy

DrWilgy

town

scum

Here are the first two:

Dragon D. Luffy

DrWilgy

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:55 pm GTH might be better provided we can ban neutral

Yes, preferably no neutral.

Seriously, I'm going to start GTH reads if there's enough people around and willing. I'll just state a couple names at a time, and then you tell me either town or scum.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:53 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:51 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:42 pm It just dawned to me that lynching someone in the 3-man group is considerably harder since they get to cockblock 2 other people from voting.

That includes MP, speed and hyena.
All the more reason to give me until at least tomorrow to solve the shit out of this game.

Who wants to participate in that?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:49 pm Can we just take a poll between the towncore of DDL, Hyena, Nanook and Jack of how many townread Juliets, Tony, Speed, Wilgy and MP?

I townread Speed. I’m not confident enough by a long shot to fight for or against the others.

OH SHIT, we should do GTH reads!

Hyena wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:46 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:34 pm Maybe I’m biased into thinking tony is town because I feel like I have a decent understanding of him game/a fairly few of the accusations against him remind me of stuff that gets levied at me sometimes, but like, I just don’t really see “he changed his mind and didn’t document it in excruciating detail in thread” as being particularly AI
It's not that. He's going with the crowd. If people hadn't started throwing my name out again as a suspect, I doubt Tony ever votes for me there. When he townread me, it was when most people were townreading me. When he was scumreading me the first time, it was only when Nutella voted me and started pushing me.

This is a good point, but it depends on how Tony plays as town perhaps too, right?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:42 pm It just dawned to me that lynching someone in the 3-man group is considerably harder since they get to cockblock 2 other people from voting.

That includes MP, speed and hyena.

All the more reason to give me until at least tomorrow to solve the shit out of this game.

Hyena wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:30 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:42 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:23 pm Hey Tony, what are your reads right now?
I’m willing to townclear Jack. I think I’ll have an opportunity to examine Wilgy today — I don’t think he should be cleared long term for his derp, but it’s worth something.
Nanook and Hyena are the typical townreads. I’m less sure on both of them. I thought Hyena was scum early, but they’ve contributed a fair amount. Nanook probably sorts himself pretty quickly— there are obvious places to start for any sort of analysis. Your slot is vague and I haven’t played with you before (unless you count your first day), so I’m basically now trying to get ahold of your day 1 meta. That leaves Speed and Juliets. I cannot read Juliets. Nutella was pretty certain she was scum, but that softened towards the end and there’s always a certain town energy here to not lynch the rival train from the day before. Speed is left— I don’t think he’s playing like he had previous times I’ve seen him as scum, but he seems to me both the most likely to be scum and the most likely to provide information in his defense.
This is my participation for today, but Ive constructed a light schedule for myself tomorrow so I should be around more.

What does typical even mean in that context? Can you clarify, Tony?

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:00 pm I'd like it if everyone publicly stated vote crap as much as possible. If MP comes in, 'misses' the Mac post, and votes Wilgy 5 minutes before deadline, Imma be piiissed

I saw it, no worries, lol. I agree with you here.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:43 pm None of the POE has done anything today to make me not want to lynch them.

As for me there, that's on me, I keep underestimating the time I'll get pulled away with work since I had to... sort of finagle my work schedule due to multigaming with that other game this week. I'll try my best to earn a spot out of there.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:34 pm Maybe I’m biased into thinking tony is town because I feel like I have a decent understanding of him game/a fairly few of the accusations against him remind me of stuff that gets levied at me sometimes, but like, I just don’t really see “he changed his mind and didn’t document it in excruciating detail in thread” as being particularly AI

I've been burned by this myself, as recently as that damn MU champs practice game. I feel like it's really hard to tell whether it's more likely a townie who didn't remember and/or explain their feelings fully versus scum with agenda that wasn't well thought out and/or fabricated.

My bad, I had something come up, I'm here until deadline now.

Be back in a few.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:19 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:17 pm Tony makes the night polls apparently. I have no reason to think that role is town or scum.
These kinds of roles tend to be more like town imo. If you have to balance a team of three scum having one of them be zero utility is a major inbalance point, while for the town side it's a good way to keep the town team from being OP.

If there are 4 scum I'd expect the town to have much stronger roles, though, which hasn't been the case so far.

I'd hope there aren't 4 scum here because that seems unbalanced just from a numbers perspective regardless of the powers, let alone some town roles being useless or anit-town, like the fact that we know for example sig had a pretty anti-town role.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:17 pm The speed/Tony thunderdome has been interesting in that it gave good arguments both/again both sides.

I do think Tony looks shadier now after speed quoted his posts shading me for going after MR. While speed looks okay due to his second vote on MR. But I still have a good gut feeling about Tony and not much about speed...

And yeah Wolgy is a valid option. Low activity is not a great reason to lynch him but I feel not enough people are considering/voting for it which means scum could be avoiding him.

This is an interesting point, who specifically do you think best fits this description?

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:39 pm Okay actually, after looking at Juliets ISO once more, I'm really not feeling strong about the case on her. I'm not really finding anything to quote. Nutella's case on Juliets said the MR/Juliets interactions weren't 'inspiring', and I agree with that. But that could be the case for several others. [VOTE: Tony] aubergine for now. I need help sorting Juliets, if anyone has something else to add.

@Epignosis How do we even cast group votes?

I'll take a look in a bit and see what I can uncover.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:22 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:30 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:29 am The two things bothering nutella the most:

The fact we killed a mafioso.

And the fact we have a confirmed civ.
This reads... somewhat manipulative to me. Can you talk about this, DDL? I didn't get this interpretation, but then again I also realize I have different eyes right now.
Yes.

The motivation tell works and I've been lynched as mafia/lynched mafiosos based off it.

When someone is bad they are more likely to say things that show contempt for the civilian faction or lack of belief in their ability to win.

That seemed like that to me.

Hmmm... maybe you're right, but I think it probably depends on the player.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:20 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:27 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:36 am So anyone wants to lynch the "lololololol lets tie the day 1 poll" crew?

Starting with MP and nutella.

Especially MP, who hopped his vote about 5 times before settling on Sig.
What was the underlying logic for this?
MR was being lynched and you started hopping your vote everywhere. Then you and nutella started going about tieing the viote poll which is one of the most anti-town things that happen in this site. Seemed likely that one of you was trying to save MR.

That's fair, and I suppose it doesn't matter anymore, but I'm not sure how often this actually happens especially given how often I've seen people make that accusation.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 1:57 pm TONY STARK BUILT THIS ISO IN A CAVE!

Spoiler: show
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 11:55 am
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:30 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:01 am My character is so fun to roleplay as that I don’t know how. LC can die but if the point of the game is complete our personal vendettas against LC maybe we’re going down the wrong path

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:03 am Hmm, let’s spread the love
Vote
DDL
The more I think about it the more I don't like these posts. The attitudes are wrong.

[VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine
Your attitudes are wrong
The exchange with MR that got Tony some town cred. I don't think it's bad, bot not worthy of cred either. This MR vote lacks substance, has no case, and should NEVER have remained till the end of the day. Textbook distancing, because nobody is going to follow up on it.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 12:01 pm
112 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 9:15 am I think it's more tonal impurity that I see in Tony so far than anything concerning his attitudes toward the game.

Although upon a second read I do agree that 'spreading the love' is an odd attitude. It seems like an easy way to get a vote down and spread the votes into something anti-town more than spreading it into something pro-town if you catch my drift.
I don’t catch your drift. Why is it anti-town to have my vote on someone who I think is suspicious? what of that idea is anti-town
He never said he thought DDL was suspicious. I asked, even, and... well we'll get to that later.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:24 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:20 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 5:41 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 5:35 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 5:21 pm
112 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:59 pm What if Tony and MR are both scum?
Funny, I was thinking MR and you
Distancing.
it’s 112 and tony it was right in front of us this whole time
lol I meant between you and MR
'lol' tell get em
Deflection and distancing when 112 guessed on a relationship between Tony and MR.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 4:54 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:21 am Nanook, Tony, nutella, based on your own role card, what alignment do you think Alex Jones would have?
town
Here's the town cred everyone is talking about.
And.
Yeah, this is a ballsy scum play if it is one. I mean, scum might have a towny-looking role as reference, but still I'd grant some good points to this one. Maybe. For reasons that others have discussed.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 6:59 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:58 pm Now it's time for you people to explain why everyone and their dog is townreading Radishes because I don't see it.

Alternatively, let's lynch him.
In general I'm town reading DDL for going against quo on the page, but the phrasing seems ___stilted___ and repetitive -- forced in a sense (the same "I don't see it" idea). I'm not one of those micro-post analysts but it throws me off.
Shading DDL's vote while distancing himself from directly talking about radishes... or scumreading DDL. Subtle discouragement.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:46 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:12 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:05 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:54 pm Tony saying he thought Alex Jones would be town read as a not-scum thing to say imo, especially since it came after me and nutella said the opposite
I agree.
I agree as well.
I can't speak to this argument cause obvious bias but the uniform agreement bugs me
I don't know whether I like this or not. It's almost try-too-hard, like Tony is showing how he can suspect people for propping him up too well. It also gives more publicity to his best reason for being townread.
Or it's genuine, and a good look. You be the judge.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:04 pm
112 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:16 pm MR sitting on Tony the whole round looks bad on him, like he can't pick anyone else who warrants a vote on them.
is this a serious take
(This post might not be in the right place. I messed up my copy-pasta. It's close, though.)
Needless to say I do NOT like this response. Yes it's serious. Bloody good take, too.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:37 pm I'll vote for Sig over Nanook. Weird to vote for Sig on the case "he hasn't said anything crazy yet" and I know that's the kind of reputation that's really annoying to shake, but there's nothing else to be done.
Completely ignoring MR, which seems to be a theme in the last few posts that sorta concerned MR or voting.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 9:54 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 9:40 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 11:26 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 11:03 pm @TonyStarkPrime talk to me about Speedchuck. You have a vote on them right now.
He's felt disengenuous to me
This is probably my least favorite Tony post just reading the ISO real fast. Can you expand on this, Tony?
I don't remember what the circumstances were. I can go back and check if you want.
Here is the reasons:
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 9:55 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 12:33 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 12:01 pm I don’t catch your drift. Why is it anti-town to have my vote on someone who I think is suspicious? what of that idea is anti-town
why is ddl suspicious to you he ain't done nothin
a post like this when two posts later he says that Juliets is scum for asking about a day 1 vote for instance
Asking why he found DDL suspicious (a question he never answered) is disingenous? Because I had a scumread on someone else that I explained (even if it wasn't strong)? What!?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 10:01 pm almost switched to MR for the fun of it but by golly is that a terrible plan
This is almost too on-the-nose for me to believe it came from scum. It's hilarious if Tony is scum, and gives me an even bigger estimation of the man's cajones.

-
There is no reaction to the flip.
-

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 10:39 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 9:23 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 3:19 am I think your argument can be boiled down to “Option 2 seems useless but at least pro-town” which is probably wrong on at least one side
I mean, suppose Donald Trump is mafia. Hard to say forcing someone to do a Donald Trump impression isn't protown.

It's just the implication that if the mafia was like Trump, VInce McMahon, Kelly Loeffler, etc, that option would be too good so things aren't that easy.

Idk. There should be some sort of theme to the scum team, I'd imagine.
that's not the scum team
I don't know if this was supposed to mean that Tony was one of these roles and is town, but... well yeah, I don't know. I should probably tag each WTF moment I have in this ISO for Tony to answer.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 10:40 am
112 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 9:48 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 9:23 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 3:19 am I think your argument can be boiled down to “Option 2 seems useless but at least pro-town” which is probably wrong on at least one side
I mean, suppose Donald Trump is mafia. Hard to say forcing someone to do a Donald Trump impression isn't protown.

It's just the implication that if the mafia was like Trump, VInce McMahon, Kelly Loeffler, etc, that option would be too good so things aren't that easy.

Idk. There should be some sort of theme to the scum team, I'd imagine.
I don't think we should assume affiliations are tied to roleplaying in any way. That's a bad way to run an open set-up game.
This is probably wrong too
Incorrect. Which is maybe a good look? Either that or Tony's being wrong on purpose after so much right-ness about the setup.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Apr 21, 2020 9:19 pm I’m town. Process of elimination gives you my character and my power follows swiftly. I don’t think I’ll be around much in the following day phase, so please don’t try to lynch me.
POE does what now? I have no idea how we're supposed to guess TSP's character and/or power here. This post needs explained.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:15 pm I always suspect Juliets. I’m right sometimes.
I don’t think it’s MP come at me Hyena.
Since Juliets is another main suspect I thought I'd toss this up here. A couple posts from now he suggests lynching her. Possibly an indicator of 'not W/W'.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 6:40 pm I don't like the Sloonei secret lynch it seems wrong. I agree that we need to resolve the slot and having inactives towards game-end can be problematic, but it's still relatively early. There's no reason to assume long term that the slot will remain empty.

My scum reads converging on it as an option suggests that we have the possibility of double scum lynch in our options range here.
But possibly W/W with sloonei. Assuming the worst, I know.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:07 pm To Jack's earlier point, I noted very early that I think the best option is to go for the unpaired wolves, here Nutella and Juliets.

Which requires me to say something to MPs point about the possibility of neither of them being scum: well that would suck, wouldn't it? It's not that I distinctly haven't considered that possibility, but the spaces without one of them being scum are rather limited and we'd immediately be forced to consider more unlikely combinations. If we lynch both we get over the "this'll be an easy game" mentality that can sink so many towns sooner rather than later.
Suggesting the Juliets lynch with nutella, as I said earlier.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:18 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:17 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:14 pm I think we have to reconsider Jack.
We'd have to believe that the baddies would give up a role steal (role check) for a dubious clearance plan. They couldn't predict MR's death.
ops forgot mechanics
curses
MiNdSeT tElL

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:42 pm Calling it now Jules and LC.
I think this is also one of my previous calls so ya know some sort of stability here.
Would Tony kill off a potential mislynch (LC) on N2? A good look, one of about 4 in this ISO.
Would Tony shade Jules? 'Not W/W with Jules' look

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:42 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:23 pm Hey Tony, what are your reads right now?
I’m willing to townclear Jack. I think I’ll have an opportunity to examine Wilgy today — I don’t think he should be cleared long term for his derp, but it’s worth something.
Nanook and Hyena are the typical townreads. I’m less sure on both of them. I thought Hyena was scum early, but they’ve contributed a fair amount. Nanook probably sorts himself pretty quickly— there are obvious places to start for any sort of analysis. Your slot is vague and I haven’t played with you before (unless you count your first day), so I’m basically now trying to get ahold of your day 1 meta. That leaves Speed and Juliets. I cannot read Juliets. Nutella was pretty certain she was scum, but that softened towards the end and there’s always a certain town energy here to not lynch the rival train from the day before. Speed is left— I don’t think he’s playing like he had previous times I’ve seen him as scum, but he seems to me both the most likely to be scum and the most likely to provide information in his defense.
This is my participation for today, but Ive constructed a light schedule for myself tomorrow so I should be around more.
This starts with only Jack towncleared and then ends with a POE of just me and I'm not sure I understand that.
-----------------------------------------------------------

There are other posts in the ISO but few of them stood out to me as negative or definitely positive. They were either filler or prodding questions or the like, which can be town or scum.
Tony is, in my estimation, a good candidate for lynch. There aren't any 'GOTCHA's in here on either side. A couple solid town pings, about 2-3 times as many solid negative pings. I'd love to hear opinions, and I'd love tony to clear up a few things.

I actually agree with your first point, especially since "Your attitudes are wrong" is a pretty easy way to say something seemingly shade-y to a scummate without actually suspecting them.

What did you mean by "This is almost too on-the-nose for me to believe it came from scum."? Anecdotally I feel like I've seen scum play with WIFOM like that even if it turns out to be true, so are you saying that Tony specifically doesn't seem like the type to do that?

Just got to your Tony ISO now, speed, I'll take a detailed look.

Spoiler: show

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 12:42 pm Day 1

Master Radishes
3 Voters: Dragon D. Luffy, speedchuck, Hyena

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
4 Voters: Long Con, sig, 112, nutella

sig
5 Voters: NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME, juliets, M Plus 7, Jackofhearts2005, TonyStarkPrime

TonyStarkPrime
1 Voter: Master Radishes

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DAY 2

juliets
4 Voters: Hyena, speedchuck, M Plus 7, nutella

nutella
7 Voters: TonyStarkPrime, NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME, Jackofhearts2005, DrWilgy, Long Con, juliets, Dragon D. Luffy

TonyStarkPrime
1 Voters: Master Radishes (voted before he died I guess)

This looks a lot uglier than I thought it would, color-wise. But I'm on light theme, so maybe it'll look better for you guys.

I'm being as un-generous as possible here, because there are only so many conclusions I can draw from 2 days of wagons. But there are some notes I wanted to put up. These are mostly based on the wagons above, and I'm not putting too much stock in them because they don't reflect when the votes actually happened or why, but hey vote analysis.

-MR voted Tony both days, even above self-preservation. That's an action worth noting. I, for one, do NOT think that's a good look for Tony, though some might disagree. Looks like 'If I'm going to die anyway, let me do some distancing.' Notably, Tony cased MR D1 but then ended up voting for Sig. I'd like to know more about that, but haven't started ISOs yet.

-Of all the MR voters D1, DDL (ONLY LOOKING AT THE VOTE WAGON) is more likely scum out of the three. He was the one who first put the vote up. I made it a wagon, and Hyena campaigned/blackmailed for nanook to join. That said, the argument between DDL and MR was pretty strong, and I townread him by virtue of distancing alone.

-No conclusions can be drawn from nanooks D1 votes. It was all self-preservation. That's not his fault, though again I wish the people who voted him were alive to talk about why, since everyone remaining super-townreads him.

-Juliets wagon on D2 looks pretty freaking pure to me. I know Nanook and Tony would disagree, but it's a point worth making. Granted, Nanook's wagon has been proven pure, and there's only so far that can go, but it's still worth looking at.

I'm not big into drawing conclusions based on voting records, even if I think they're important, so maybe you can help me more with some of these conclusions. Why would you think DDL is the most scum because he was the first one to vote (ignoring other factors)?

Hyena wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 12:36 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:20 am And of course Tony's voting for me, too, lol
Tony placed a vote on me and joined Nutella on my wagon D1, but he never really talked about why. I thought it was very opportunistic at the time, and the only reason I didn't pursue it more was because Radish got shot sometime after and I got tied up with casing MP7 instead. What do you think about that Nanook? What do you think about him townreading me now and there being no progression in between?

That is potentially concerning, I'll have to take a look.

juliets wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:38 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:20 am So, does anyone think their tag team buddy is scum?
I do not but my buddy appears to think I am.

My buddies are Hyena and speed, and I'm not really sure yet. I think I can trust at least one of them, especially because I'm not sure how much a Hyena/speed team makes sense off the top of my head, although I'd have to explore it specifically.

Actually once I get caught up I'll post a GTH reads list, then I'll do some ISOs and re-evaluate.

Spoiler: show

juliets wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:36 am I just read through @DrWilgy and this seems to be the only post with a lot of meat on it and it was Day 1.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 3:32 pm Y'all talk too much lmao. Trying to catch up at the same time y'all threw another 10 pages at me.

DAY 1:
Effectively this is where I began my catch up.
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:41 pm @DrWilgy

I need you, friend. Let's generate some content. As soon as you get back in here, I want you to engage me specifically in your reads.
At a glace, I can't tell if I like Hyena or not. The play of 'watch them squirm and untangle the truth in the chaos' resonates with me, but ultimately comes from a selfish mindset. Not directly town or scum, but a selfish mindset does assist scum more.

Yo. Mr.Master Radishes is scum. The interactions with 112 was a super safe buddy.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 6:23 pm Fuck it let’s kill nutella?
#BLESSED

Leanin baddie rn: Raddish, Hazelnut

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:35 pm I feel like everyone's townreading me. I don't feel like I've received any pressure from anyone today. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm attacked tonight and am dead N2.
You still feel like this?

I very much dislike Jule's d1 list
Spoiler: show
viewtopic.php?f=221&t=1876&start=700#p601775

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 9:48 pm
112 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 9:34 pm There's probably scum in Jack/Wilgy. They're players who have posted but only leave blanks in my mind.
yeah
This is shady as hell Hazelnut

OH NO. OH FUCK. WE KILLED SIG POOR SIG. HE WILL BE MISSED... Now who wants to consume his corpse?

Day 1 read conclusions: MP good, TSP good, Nook good, Jules scares me, DDL's a cutiepatootie, and Mr Master Raddish and Hazelnut are bad.

NIGHT 1:
eh

DAY 2:

Now... Not really relating to day 2, but there's a wild world where if Mr Master Raddish isn't scum, then both Nutella and MP may be scum.

I'd like a general census on the feel of Hyena.

Also, at this point, I'm tired of catching up and have to get back to work. Someone directly engage with me as that'd likely put me in the game more effectively... Or make me into an easy mislynch to those dashing scummies who are both charming and brave enough to pull it off.

edit: Mother of Linki
He correctly nails MR as bad and incorrectly labels me and nutella as bad. He sees MP as good (true), TSP good and Nanook good. I am reading them good as well this morning. He is unsure about Hyena.

DrWilgy, in your post you print my list of sorting who I won't vote for and who I would lynch and say you very much don't like my list. Then you later say I scare you. I didn't notice these things when your post went up but can you tell me why you didn't like it and why I scared you? Also, who are you scum reading/likely to vote for today and why? There isn't a lot in your ISO to read you by.

Thanks for this, juliets.

I feel like it would help if I knew more about why Wilgy was making those reads he did there, especially as it pertains to MR.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:20 am
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 1:56 am Spent some much needed time with family today, which is why I never came back. I’ll be around quite a bit tomorrow though.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:49 pm Plus 7

Analysis of Juliets, Tony and Wilgy is most helpful.

I’d be loathe to lynch outside that POE plus you today.
Perfect, thanks for the mention. I’ll get right on it.
I’d like to see analysis on Speed as well. If you get around to it.

Sure thing!

juliets wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:16 am For those of you who say I'm in your POE, can you give me some bullet points on what you're seeing that you think is scummy? I haven't seen a case on me since all that stuff nutella was saying which was flat wrong.

And I'll ask a Sloonei/JJJ question: Why am I town?

POE doesn't necessarily mean you're scummy, it may mean that someone has no compelling reason to remove you from the POE (i.e., call you town).

juliets wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 9:07 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 8:52 pm Juliets I was hoping you’d bring up the disingenuous thing in the moment because I had a post prepped. I’ll answer quickly to that idea: a lot of us have developed a meta, purposely or accidentally, by which we look scummy in all of our games. If LC or me or Jack or whoever start giving off insane townie vibes after day 1 it’s either a fluke or a bad sign. And for players like Sloonei or Jay or dizzy or maybe MP, you can generally sort them by activity — they prove themselves as town. You operate differently — to me it seems you always act as a sort of stereotypical town. To someone like me, who acts less town as town, someone playing a stereotypically town role always seems disingenuous.
You know what is so ironic? That my behavior can be called "stereotypically town" and that it gets me suspected early in every single game. I have tried playing a little differently but then people say things like "Juliets is not asking enough questions, she must be scum". I guess what it's going to take is a style change that gets me lynched in a few games. Also maybe I will be less burned out after a game. I like Nanook's style, I think I'll try it my next game!

I think it's because people have trouble sorting you as a result. Like I personally feel like your tone, actions, etc. are pretty similar in my mind, so I can't just take your behavior being stereotypically town for granted.

juliets wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:58 pm I wanted to repost Long Con's rainbow list right before he died. I don't know if the mafia would have waited this late to send in a kill (he posted at 5:18 pm) but I think we should keep it in mind just in case.

Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 5:18 pm My rainbow looks something like this, but I don't see why it couldn't be anyone below the top three.... Me as Civ, Jack as mech cleared, Wilgy as derp cleared. Who else has done some convincing towny stuff that should be moved up to the greens?

Long Con
Jackofhearts2005
Dr. Wilgy
speedchuck
Dragon D. Luffy
M Plus 7
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Hyena
TonyStarkPrime
juliets

What do you make of it, juliets?

Thanks for the answers, speed.

juliets wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:02 pm Ok, I'm not quite finished with @speedchuck but I'm stopping. I'm up to the Day 2 EOD. I made this long list of things he's said and some of my thoughts but basically it boils down to the only things I see that I really don't like are his early case on me which listed things that are part of my civ game (and anything he's said in follow-up that he thinks shows me to be bad) and I'm just not seeing the Nanook case. Other things that he's done are things I agreed with or at least thought were true at the time they were said. There are some exceptions but I don't think they are worthy of mentioning at this time. So anyway, I see no reason to post the list here.

I need to exercise and eat lunch and then I'll be back.

Fwiw, I wouldn't say that, but I would say they're NAI.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 8:34 am My POE is currently chuck/new MP/wilgy*

If there’s only one mafia in there and not both then I need to reconsider juliets and tony. I’m pretty much just accepting hyena as town, same with DDL (I honestly can’t remember why but I think I had a good reason, if I didn’t I’ll realize it later and correct accordingly, too tired to figure it out now). And jack, obviously. But we’ll cross the juliets/Tony bridge if/when we get there, basically not interested in them before the three I listed.

*a derp is enough to buy you a day, but it’s fairly easily faked if we’re being totally honest so it’s not enough to keep him out of POE after nutella flipped the wrong alignment.

Wait, why are you accepting Hyena as town?

Spoiler: show

juliets wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 8:21 am Here are the posts I see that are MR about Tony:

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:22 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:01 am LC can die but if the point of the game is complete our personal vendettas against LC maybe we’re going down the wrong path
You seem oddly concerned about an LC lynch.
Then one minute later:

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:30 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:01 am My character is so fun to roleplay as that I don’t know how. LC can die but if the point of the game is complete our personal vendettas against LC maybe we’re going down the wrong path

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:03 am Hmm, let’s spread the love
Vote
DDL
The more I think about it the more I don't like these posts. The attitudes are wrong.

[VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 10:16 am This was from page 2. Only 112 gave it some actual thought, that I saw.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:30 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:01 am My character is so fun to roleplay as that I don’t know how. LC can die but if the point of the game is complete our personal vendettas against LC maybe we’re going down the wrong path

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:03 am Hmm, let’s spread the love
Vote
DDL
The more I think about it the more I don't like these posts. The attitudes are wrong.

[VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine
The first post seems way too serious about the early LC wagon, which was clearly a nothing wagon. It looks like he's trying to gain cred for stopping it. And he's hesitant about it too, using passive language like 'maybe we're going down the wrong path'. His second post is a forced excuse for voting someone random.

I know Tedxtr hates my #page2reads, but it was an awkward opening for Tony and nothing I've seen since has shown me the Tony I saw last game (where I correctly TRed him when no one else did). He may not post as much or make posts as long as others, but in my limited experience when he's town I can still see the townie thought process. His game so far feels like he's mimicking his style.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:05 pm
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:59 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:54 pm Tony saying he thought Alex Jones would be town read as a not-scum thing to say imo, especially since it came after me and nutella said the opposite
I actually kind of like this read. Hmm.
Except the fact he did after you two also means he maybe did it to be funny/contrarian, which would negate this read.

Too WIFOMy to change my mind.

Hyena wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:05 pm
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:59 pm
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:54 pm Tony saying he thought Alex Jones would be town read as a not-scum thing to say imo, especially since it came after me and nutella said the opposite
I actually kind of like this read. Hmm.
Nanook's the one making it though, and I still suspect Tony could be with Nanook.
This is late in the day phase when he saw no one else is interested in Tony:

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:32 pm I've only got a few moments before I fall asleep and not enough time to properly read or respond to everything.

Clearly no appetite for Tony today, so someone summarise the cases on MP7, 112, and/or Nanook. (And/or any other potential wagons.) I have a sense of each but to varying extents.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:05 pm I actually drifted off with my laptop still open. Too many games going on.

I'm just going to go back to [VOTE: TSP] aubergine and fall asleep now. Good night.
He made a few posts N1 talking about the wagons and then posted this (I think he's talking to Hyena):

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:29 am Just for that I'm going to vote with you.

[VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:43 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:32 pm
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:28 pm @nutella can you tell me why you're so convinced about Tony? Or point me to where you explained it, if I've just missed it?
When he countered the idea that alex jones would necessarily be anti-town. Suggested to me that he has a town role that isn't obviously flavorfully "good" and definitely seemed like something scum would never say there in any situation.
Okay, just that then?

I get the thought process, but I don't agree it's something scum would never do. If he had been the first person to respond, yeah, but two others had just posted 'scum' and '3P'. There was an opening to say 'town', and it's an amusing and/or contrarian response that's well within Tony's wheelhouse IMO.

I need to ISO him too though, since - DDL may not believe this - I've been wrong on my D1 reads before.
This seems to me to be a lot of posts for such a short time. The questions is was he distancing, or trying to bus, or just thought Tony would be an easy civ to take out. Nobody joined him in his push day 1 and he went right back to pushing him day 2. I don't know how MR plays very well because he's new to me so I'm not sure which it is, I'll have to chew on it. Does anyone else have any thoughts?

This is a tough call. Does anyone have meta on scum vs. town Tony? I can't recall if it's been discussed.

My instinct at the time was to give Tony a good look, but looking at it again, I could see it as distancing.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:26 pm I feel like we've cleared someone we shouldn't have. Even if Juliets is in fact scum, there are probably one or two other than her.

MP could have become scum but 1. that seems to easy and 2. no way am I lynching the same guy two days in a row.

While I appreciate the sentiment, what's the reason for this, speed?

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:35 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:33 pm MP7: My towngame and my scumgame are lightyears different
Also MP7: Puts forth most of his effort into ketchup and then disappears

Like I know you ain't at no dinner parties. We're quarantined and shit.

(If MP7 is like a doctor or something, sorry.)
He a professor or treacher or somethin' I think.

'Rona is why he's back, but he said something about being in like 3 games RN.

Yes, this thing you said here, just so you all know.

I'm considered essential, so while my workload has lightened some due to the pandemic, I still am teaching virtually and even when my teaching load is zero I always have research, so there's that.

juliets wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 8:22 pm Guys, honestly, read Nutella's response to my suspicion of her. Does she sound like scum there? I don't think so.

Does anyone think juliets had TMI here? Is she even the type to do that as scum?

Resuming my catch-up.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 4:41 pm Some questions to consider:

If nutella is scum, would she be as up-front-and-center as she is now? Kinda powerwolfing if so, even if she's suspected.

If MP is town (regardless of nutella's alignment) would he be voting only based on who he can save and who he trusts rather than, IDK, actually having reads of his own?

Hey speed, can you talk to me about this? I know it's old news, but I need to try to get inside your head with this.

Okay, I should pretty much be able to be here until deadline, with the occasional break.

Spent some much needed time with family today, which is why I never came back. I’ll be around quite a bit tomorrow though.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:49 pm @M Plus 7

Analysis of Juliets, Tony and Wilgy is most helpful.

I’d be loathe to lynch outside that POE plus you today.

Perfect, thanks for the mention. I’ll get right on it.

Sorry all, I have to go for a bit here. I'll have to resume my catch-up shortly, but I'll have more time tonight. I have some grading work to do tomorrow but otherwise I should be able to threadsit for a while.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:41 pm
M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:28 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:55 am I'm beginning to think Nanook is town just because he keeps blindly self-implicating over the wagonomics.
speed, can you talk to me about this?

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 1:30 am I mean I get what you’re saying but I think normal logic may not entirely apply given that radishes wasn’t even around to self prez and we had/have two non entities. Seems entirely possible that in a 3 scum world a more active partner would feel compelled to vote radishes, especially if one of the non entities is mafia, yeah?

Like I’m not pushing that world but I think it’s entirely plausible.
Nanook says it would be possible that an active partner would vote radishes. Which is something he did.

I think I misinterpreted this post a little bit into something stronger than it was, now that I look at it. Harumph.

Oh okay, this makes sense. Thanks.

I think I'm just going to have to full on ISO as many players as I can. If anyone wants me to prioritize anyone first, let me know.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 11:43 am Ok caught up finally.

As much as I agree Jack's idea of lynching both MP and nutella is sexy af, I still prefer one of Sloonei or WIlgy. Because using that shot on a lurker is optimal, because it's way easier to get a consensus and because there's still a chance we are full of shit right now.

Right now I wanna vote Sloonei. I'm picking him over Wilgy cuz I'm tired of policy lynching Wilgy in this site.

MP looks kind of bad but his homungous effort looks okay. There's a good chance nutella is just playing him. Or vice-versa. There's no way they are both civ though, that interaction doesn't feel natural in 1000 years.

This feels like walking back a suspicion a bit here.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 10:29 am The two things bothering nutella the most:

The fact we killed a mafioso.

And the fact we have a confirmed civ.

This reads... somewhat manipulative to me. Can you talk about this, DDL? I didn't get this interpretation, but then again I also realize I have different eyes right now.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:55 am I'm beginning to think Nanook is town just because he keeps blindly self-implicating over the wagonomics.

speed, can you talk to me about this?

Thanks for bearing with me, all, I hope my questions aren't too cumbersome or outdated.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:36 am So anyone wants to lynch the "lololololol lets tie the day 1 poll" crew?

Starting with MP and nutella.

Especially MP, who hopped his vote about 5 times before settling on Sig.

What was the underlying logic for this?

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