MU Season 6 Scrimmage [GAME OVER]

[Dragon D. Luffy]

It's still not clear whether you want to lynch me or not.

You keep voting for me, but every time some player says you wanna lynch me, you reply "lol no I don't".

[Luxurious]

I’m sobbing oh my god my whole iso is gone. Fuck phone posting

[Luxurious]

Wtf is this bad good shit?

Gun-to-head reads. We took stances on each player without allowing anything other than "good" or "bad".

Also, the hell are the logical reasons for me being scum? I don't see any.

Stuff like this rubs me the wrong way:

Spoiler: show

If y'all actually sussing Nova after what he did yesterday, y'all gotta go.

First of all, you protected JJJ over Nova? Second of all, how do you know the heal was successful? Could be more reasons for why nobody died last night aside from you protecting your target.

I still sus Owner and DDL pretty heavily. RDW is someone I'm taking interest in as well. I'm finna go back and read Ultra's interactions.

Damn, seeing Owner's claim, he might be fine then. Off to DDL it is then.

I believe Owner identifies as a woman.

Yeah, I keep forgetting.

Why did Owner’s claim convince you she was town

She claimed tracker and apparently tracked you to JJJ which you confirmed. This is a pretty dumb question.

You seem to be treating the game like there are obvious facts and "logic" to callback your original question here. Your post history is emotionless, and it looks like you're playing Mafia with a calculator.

Also when you had an opportunity to dig in and talk with DDL, the guy you've suspected so much, this was what came of that:

Spoiler: show

This reeks of chainsaw defense.

You know, isn't Ultra technically chainsaw defending DDL here when he attacks JJJ here? Especially even more as Ultra went to make his stance and vote on JJJ. I mean, he's technically defending DDL by attacking JJJ's vote on DDL calling it out as a chainsaw defense. This makes me sus of DDL even more.

novaselinenever I understand your case against JJJ but I press x to doubt that he's buddies with Ultra. The latter made his case and vote against JJJ and it's not like Ultra was in any danger of being lynched at that time for a distance attempt to make sense here, so what Ultra's fake case on JJJ is not coming off as a bus or distance imo. Also, I'm strong scum reading Owner and she also made her wishy washy case against JJJ, who again Ultra used for his fake case, so I definitely see more of a pairing between two buddies going against one townie there.

Dragomir if all you do in the game is place a picture of me on your wall and throw shit at it you are going to be lynched before I am.

Lol, ok. Didn't say anything about trying to get you lynched here, only pointed out something interested. But aight then.

Didn't say anything about trying to get you lynched here

What?

You practically cursed me and all my descendants and threatened to pour salt onto our land.

By saying that what Ultra did made you look worse?

What about yesterday? You did nothing but attack me.

Are you backtracking on that?

I don't care what happened last DP. I'm talking about the now. I'm still sussing you for what I called you out for but I'm not planning on making an almighty push you at this moment.

I mean, what is this reassurance to DDL that you're not trying to lynch him? Eh?

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

Who are the players with 2 agendas? What proof do you have that they have 2 agendas

[Luxurious]

I'm at work right now and won't be able to come through with my thoughts on the recent pages for until a few hours. Just one thing though, this wagon on me is bad and reeks of an attempt to save Soneji. RDW looks even more bad in my eyes.

How do you feel now thar Soneji flipped town

I am confused. My impression was that I was a counter wagon to save Soneji but seeing how both leading wagons are town, it makes me think that there were more town in my wagon than on Soneji's wagon as it doesn't make sense for scum to get another wagon going when they can just hop on the leading wagon which was a mislynch.

How does it affect your RDW read? Why are you scum reading him anyway

He hasn't done anything contributive and productive this entire game and then sheep on my wagon with literal piss poor reasoning. Nothing about that is coming from a Town POV.

Can you go through the GTH reads and assign each person good/ bad?

The only two reads I remember are RDW and DDL. I also havent seen you post any townreads?

Tyia

Not really interested in doing that.

I don't really like posting my townreads.

From my pov this looks like you trying not to tmi any townies

[Luxurious]

Tl;dr iso of speedchuck because this is fucking take 2

Spoiler: show

Do you have any scum reads outside of, like, DDL

Haven't read the whole game, probably not going to. Finger of suspicion right now is on:

Gemma
Owner
Ultra
Dragomir
DDL

Do you remember why you included Owner/ Ultra here?

I would ask about Gemma/ DDL/ Ultra, but previously all three of these people had been talked about in a hedgy sorta way.

Spoiler: show

I could see an Ultra/Owner connection if I squint.

I haven't seen it yet, but I'm not caught up. I suspect both of them separately.

Outside of the post below, Speed hasnt interacted or said anything about Owner. Will wait for a reasoning.

Spoiler: show

quote=speedchuck post_id=532854 time=1556595742 user_id=545]

So for everyone who asks, I was (as assumed by some) trolling for reactions. I'll be moving my vote, but hey, started some discussion.

This feels a bit too scripted. Not sure, if this was planned for some motive or what, but generally talking or getting the conversation going is a good thing, unless there's some hidden/scum motive involved..hmm

How soon do you think you'll be moving your vote? / Who are your currently suspicious of?

I have moved my vote (and answered this question), so I'll assume you get to that
[/quote]

Spoiler: show

I came into this day planning to go after Owner.

But as it turns out, Jack is scum. So there's that.

I'll try to figure out how to explain why.

linki: You're a lot more bold about this kind of thing than I am, mac

linkilinki both

I’m kinda sad he didnt go after Owner because I wanted to know where his head was at in regards to why he’s scum reading her here. I think the Jack thing has some town equity to it since it’s kinda outta left field.

Spoiler: show

I saved JJJ last night.

Or someone roleblocked the killer.

Or the mafia chose not to kill.

I caught up this morning and found myself having to realign my reads.

Nova looks super solid in light of the ultra lynch.

Epi looks a little fishy for trying to piggyback on my nova case.

Still don't like Owner.

Not getting a good vibe from Soneji. Him having a low post count is normal, but he normally comes at the end with a bunch of attacks against players and is sure of thing. Here he feels more... basic.

Mac is giving me a civ vibe. Compared to the other game where he was very tame, here he's pissed off. I like pissed off Mac.

RDW needs to come down to the playground.

Neutral on the rest.

Why is Nova super solid? I’ve played two days of another game and read most of Nutella’s champs D1 since this thread closed.

It's not like I changed my mind about the questions thing being fishy, but vote analysis > how many questions the guy is asking.

Nova was the name of the Ultra wagon. He pushed it more than everyone else. I bet he's the one mafia tried to kill tonight.

The wagon was the towncore (Speed/Jack/Lux), Jay (who Ultra was after and who was probably the nk), and Nova.

You think there were no wolves on Nova’s wagon?

You're rewriting D1 here.

"Towncore" Jack didn't do anything to push Ultra's wagon. He jumped in after Speed and I.

"Towncore" Lux magically understood the case on Ultra 5mn before EoD.

"Who was probably the nk" Jay was very all right with Ultra going after him. Liked his "assertive tone", had him green and jumped in not long before EoD after being prodded.

What are you trying to do?

You can’t make me take back my reads!

Defense played for overeggageration, laughs

Lux I suspect you are getting bias from your initial sight of Jay exploding a thread.

If you look around you, you'll notice there are people who think Jay is not exploding the thread hard enough.

Laughing at the same old things.

Just feels off to me. Like... Jack is funnier when he's town, instead of having these jokes that defend him and prod at normalcy.
Screw it, call this a toneread. Jack trying to play too casual after two phases of tremendously bad luck

It’s relatively weak so I cant blame Jack for more or less brushing it off. But that’s how tone reads are tbh.

Also speed what do you mean by two phases of tremendously bad luck?

Spoiler: show

Tell me where my interactive reads are wrong.

With Jack specifically?

I don't know. I hadn't seen them until now, nor have I read the entire thread.

You like to repeat that you havent read the entire thread a lot. You’re lucky Soah isnt here

Oh after this there really isnt that much. He says he’s sick so a bit of leniency, but Speed has really dropped off after D1. He’s kinda fallen to the background and that worries me more than anything considering his presence day 1.

[Luxurious]

Re: the hedgy thing

He more or less gave town and scum points for all three of them, but ultimately read them all as some form of scum.

[Luxurious]

[VOTE: JaggedJimmyJay] aubergine

I don't know speedchuck or his meta or whatever but he town read and defended him far too soon. Also switched his vote to a player who isn't active instead of pursuing DDL

Bingo. Ultra voted JJJ but threw shit at speedchuck.

Should JJJ show to be a civilian, it "proves" Ultra wrong.

Textbook bullshit.

I'm voting speedchuck.

Add this to the iso

[Luxurious]

[VOTE: Speed] aubergine

[Luxurious]

Okay well

Some other things I was thinking about while I was cleaning:

Gemma could be following Speed around (re: Jack suspect yesterday) because they’re teammate, she’s sheeping a townread, OR she’s hiding behind a townie’s reads

I like first one the most but that’s because it matches my biases

[Luxurious]

I’m not sure how I feel about JessieKruger.

On one hand, his posts are lacking
On the other hand, he missed most of day 1 and day 2, and is still here trying anyway despite that using the limited information he has.

Big Shrug

[Luxurious]

Kinda lame seeing Epi and Jack online and yet they’re both dead

[Luxurious]

Oh i only came here to let y’all know it’ll be another busy day at work but i do wanna hear thoughts regarding Speed since both JJJ and Nova yesterday seemed real interested in it

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

I wanna say one of those was a vig kill and if I find town shot one of them Im gonna be Big Mad

Also during the night i came to the realization that we dont get role flips when people die

Anyway i think mafia got vigilante

I mentioned that we didn't get role flips. The "i'm gonna be Big Mad" bit pings me. I guess I feel like it's fake. Town can make wrong kills too. I don't know if it was town or mafia. Wouldn't mafia try to get rid of bigger threats, then again, figuring out who is actually truly a threat might be a whole other thing entirely.

Like if JaggedJimmyJay was scum for instance, then there might be a push to keep the active players alive so that him still being alive doesn't look as suspicious.

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

[VOTE: M Plus 7] aubergine

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

I think I want to look at JaggedJimmyJay and RDW a bit. Or Jay the only one who knows how to read him?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

I told JJJ this before I signed up, but it's finals szn and I've got 10 days to learn Income Tax Law so I might not be my regular old self. But I will post when I can. I am an open book.

If you don't know me, I enjoy long walks on the beach, sunsets, and killing scum.

I'd rather lynch them myself. Feels more satisfactory.

Maybe we don't have the same definition of scum? I guess for a baddie, townies are the scum. You know being the minority, the underdogs and all. I'm sure they believe they're the good guys.

*starts rereading thread* *gets paranoid about nova* hmmm

[Dragomir]

It's still not clear whether you want to lynch me or not.

You keep voting for me, but every time some player says you wanna lynch me, you reply "lol no I don't".

What in the fuck is this? I have wholeheartedly expressed that I want to lynch you, I just wasn't making a big push on it last DP like I did D1 which is what I was trying to tell you in our interaction. How incorrect this post is pisses me off tremendously.

[Dragomir]

Wtf is this bad good shit?

Gun-to-head reads. We took stances on each player without allowing anything other than "good" or "bad".

Also, the hell are the logical reasons for me being scum? I don't see any.

Stuff like this rubs me the wrong way:

Spoiler: show

If y'all actually sussing Nova after what he did yesterday, y'all gotta go.

First of all, you protected JJJ over Nova? Second of all, how do you know the heal was successful? Could be more reasons for why nobody died last night aside from you protecting your target.

I still sus Owner and DDL pretty heavily. RDW is someone I'm taking interest in as well. I'm finna go back and read Ultra's interactions.

I believe Owner identifies as a woman.

Yeah, I keep forgetting.

Why did Owner’s claim convince you she was town

She claimed tracker and apparently tracked you to JJJ which you confirmed. This is a pretty dumb question.

You seem to be treating the game like there are obvious facts and "logic" to callback your original question here. Your post history is emotionless, and it looks like you're playing Mafia with a calculator.

Also when you had an opportunity to dig in and talk with DDL, the guy you've suspected so much, this was what came of that:

Spoiler: show

This reeks of chainsaw defense.

You know, isn't Ultra technically chainsaw defending DDL here when he attacks JJJ here? Especially even more as Ultra went to make his stance and vote on JJJ. I mean, he's technically defending DDL by attacking JJJ's vote on DDL calling it out as a chainsaw defense. This makes me sus of DDL even more.

novaselinenever I understand your case against JJJ but I press x to doubt that he's buddies with Ultra. The latter made his case and vote against JJJ and it's not like Ultra was in any danger of being lynched at that time for a distance attempt to make sense here, so what Ultra's fake case on JJJ is not coming off as a bus or distance imo. Also, I'm strong scum reading Owner and she also made her wishy washy case against JJJ, who again Ultra used for his fake case, so I definitely see more of a pairing between two buddies going against one townie there.

Dragomir if all you do in the game is place a picture of me on your wall and throw shit at it you are going to be lynched before I am.

Lol, ok. Didn't say anything about trying to get you lynched here, only pointed out something interested. But aight then.

What?

You practically cursed me and all my descendants and threatened to pour salt onto our land.

By saying that what Ultra did made you look worse?

What about yesterday? You did nothing but attack me.

Are you backtracking on that?

I don't care what happened last DP. I'm talking about the now. I'm still sussing you for what I called you out for but I'm not planning on making an almighty push you at this moment.

I mean, what is this reassurance to DDL that you're not trying to lynch him? Eh?

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

Who are the players with 2 agendas? What proof do you have that they have 2 agendas

I was talking about myself.

[Dragomir]

How do you feel now thar Soneji flipped town

I am confused. My impression was that I was a counter wagon to save Soneji but seeing how both leading wagons are town, it makes me think that there were more town in my wagon than on Soneji's wagon as it doesn't make sense for scum to get another wagon going when they can just hop on the leading wagon which was a mislynch.

How does it affect your RDW read? Why are you scum reading him anyway

He hasn't done anything contributive and productive this entire game and then sheep on my wagon with literal piss poor reasoning. Nothing about that is coming from a Town POV.

Can you go through the GTH reads and assign each person good/ bad?

The only two reads I remember are RDW and DDL. I also havent seen you post any townreads?

Tyia

Not really interested in doing that.

I don't really like posting my townreads.

From my pov this looks like you trying not to tmi any townies

TMI?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

I'm don't know what you mean in the highlighted question.

I view emotion (or the lack thereof) to be an important indicator which can shed light on otherwise vague notions of "tone" or "vibes" which comprise guts reads et cetera. I believe that, in a vacuum, mafia members are generally less emotional in their posts than are civilians. There are exceptions as with any "tell", but I don't really care about exceptions.

What I mean regarding your exchange with DDL was that instead of voicing your concerns about him directly to him, you alleviated his concern that you wanted to lynch him. This is something that you have since loudly protested. Whatever your intention may be, I am telling you right now that it hasn't always been clear what you want to do with the player Dragon D. Luffy. "Not making a big push" (whatever that means) is meaningless to me. Clearly you are and have been pursuing his lynch -- it is probably the most pronounced aspect of your post history. This manner of technicality and your insistence about it strikes me as at best misplaced. I don't know why that is important to you from a civilian perspective.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]Luxurious[/mention], I am reading your case against speedchuck and am struggling to discern a narrative or theme in what you are saying about him (if you intended for there to be one apart from "he's suspicious"). I don't fully follow your case. If you could reduce it to one or two sentences that expresses why he is bad, that would be super.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think I want to look at JaggedJimmyJay and RDW a bit. Or Jay the only one who knows how to read him?

RDW has only played one other full game here. Mac and I have both played with him a lot in years' past on RYM (MP as well to a lesser extent). I don't take much interest in such dated meta, but if you have questions the lemme have 'em.

[Dragomir]

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

I'm don't know what you mean in the highlighted question.

I view emotion (or the lack thereof) to be an important indicator which can shed light on otherwise vague notions of "tone" or "vibes" which comprise guts reads et cetera. I believe that, in a vacuum, mafia members are generally less emotional in their posts than are civilians. There are exceptions as with any "tell", but I don't really care about exceptions.

What I mean regarding your exchange with DDL was that instead of voicing your concerns about him directly to him, you alleviated his concern that you wanted to lynch him. This is something that you have since loudly protested. Whatever your intention may be, I am telling you right now that it hasn't always been clear what you want to do with the player Dragon D. Luffy. "Not making a big push" (whatever that means) is meaningless to me. Clearly you are and have been pursuing his lynch -- it is probably the most pronounced aspect of your post history. This manner of technicality and your insistence about it strikes me as at best misplaced. I don't know why that is important to you from a civilian perspective.

You were complaining that I didn't dig and talk to DDL when I had the chance. I ask if it's common to have 2 agendas when interacting with players on this site because digging and to voice my opinions directly to him was not my plan and that was obvious. Me correcting DDL was the plan.

I don't really agree. How much emotion a player has isn't dictated by their alignment but their mood and how they just play the game imo.

Why should I voice my concern directly to him? I don't see a point in it when I've been voicing my concern about him all game and he definitely saw those posts.

I don't understand what you're trying to say in the bolded. I obviously want to lynch the guy, but you guys don't share the same mindset so I'll try against somebody else I think is scum.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

One thing that concerns me about JJJ's town read of me: he knows I play exactly the same way regardless of alignment

When RDW said this he was speaking something generally agreeable (if perhaps not exactly right, because nobody is identical between alignments now matter how confident they are to the contrary). On that front, I don't think he is "off-meta" in his posting character. He could be off in his posting rate, which used to be higher. He's busy. None of this means much to me anyway. I'll offer more concrete beefs:

He left his Day 1 vote on a placeholder. Bleh

His Day 2 vote went to Dragomir. He attributed it to beefs stated by DDL and Jack. His personal investment was limited.

These things aren't awful in isolation, but an entire post history of it is underwhelming. He hasn't generated a read of his own since Day 0, and Day 0 accounts for 44% of his posts to this point. That's a considerable fall-off. I get finals week -- I've been dealing with that too. The excuse allows only limited slack though.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

You were complaining that I didn't dig and talk to DDL when I had the chance. I ask if it's common to have 2 agendas when interacting with players on this site because digging and to voice my opinions directly to him was not my plan and that was obvious. Me correcting DDL was the plan.

I don't really agree. How much emotion a player has isn't dictated by their alignment but their mood and how they just play the game imo.

Why should I voice my concern directly to him? I don't see a point in it when I've been voicing my concern about him all game and he definitely saw those posts.

I don't understand what you're trying to say in the bolded. I obviously want to lynch the guy, but you guys don't share the same mindset so I'll try against somebody else I think is scum.

There's some potential for culture and/or personal style clash. It would seem to me that the best way to work out a read is to talk to the player being read. I am not going to press the issue here, because everyone has a different idea of how to play the game. Do your thing and I'll be the judge.

[novaselinenever]

I'm here

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm here

I'm doing a trustfall. You might as well do a trustfall.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Operation: Trustfall

Why is Player X a civilian?

Dragomir

He hasn't been shy about stating strong viewpoints and taking assertive stances, nor with responding to accusations hurled his way.

Dragon D. Luffy

He appears to be quite comfortable in this game thread despite having been the subject of some strong accusations from the earliest period to now. Doesn't seem to have an agenda to pursue at a glance.

Gemma

She has posted loosely from the get-go, and has been able to maintain that sort of rapid-fire dialogue when she has been around to make posts. She stepped out quickly to claim a protection on me as soon as it was revealed that there was no kill.

JessieKruger

He missed the first game cycle in its entirety. Despite that, he has returned and made an effort to make a meaningful contribution instead of remaining a permanent slanker.

Luxurious

She has been highly active and engaged in a wide breadth of topics in the game thread, and has seemed comfortable in a role of content facilitation throughout. Her tone is good. She claimed to jail me, a target corroborated by Owner and an effect corroborated by myself.

M Plus 7

If he is a mafioso alongside a brand new guy like Ultra, he might feel a greater sense of obligation to make a difference in the game at his own home site.

MacDougall

His play is markedly different from what was just seen in another game where he was offed straightaway. He has been aggressive and fearless, and he doesn't seem concerned with the consequences to himself.

novaselinenever

He's developed a consistent style in recent civilian games, and he has essentially adhered to that in this game. He spearheaded the lynch of Ultra on Day 1 and looked authentic in the effort.

Owner of a Lonely Heart

She revealed her track of Lux to me in such a way that it looks like a genuine hunting effort, particularly in the wake of Gemma's doctor claim. She has been generally true to her civilian persona for investigating the game from a mindset uniquely her own built upon meta and night actions.

rundontwalk2

He doesn't appear to feel any urgency to generate reads (in this context, fake reads) and is happy enough to play the role of a follower while he is behind with the game.

speedchuck

My interpretation of his interactions with Ultra is positive for him, in that I have a feeling Ultra committed TMI regarding speedchuck in his accusations against me. He voted Ultra early, and he based that vote on an original suspicion (that Ultra was leaning on nova as a crutch).

Tsaiah

The dice favor the civilian faction.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I had an easy time with relatively few of those. I need our civilians to be more overt. Indeed I could flip a number of those pro-civilian arguments on their head if I so desired. Particularly, anything relating to [insert night action here] means less to me in this setup. I had to rely too much on reasoning that can be reduced to "sounds good, k".

I struggled most with RDW and Jessie in the effort to compile that.

[MacDougall]

fart

[speedchuck]

I will be active tonorrow

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

His voting didn't change from day 1 to day 2.

[Dragomir]

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

His voting didn't change from day 1 to day 2.

What is this supposed to mean and why does it matter?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

Operation: Trustfall

Why is Player X a civilian?

borrowing from JaggedJimmyJay

Dragomir
sizeable number of voters voting against you? | didn't self-pres. A person being killed from each wagon might mean that the votes were between two townies?

DDL
Epi town read him. Soneji spoke kind of well of him or rather he had seen a lot of DDL mislynches.

Gemma
Saved Jay, should I explain more? *Owner misses the birds.*

JaggedJimmyJay
If memory serves, he doesn't bus as scum. His posts examining interactions between Ultra and other players seems townie. His trustfall seems townie. Ultra's vote clears you.

JessieKruger
He seems okay. He seemed ready to jump in and give thoughts. idk

Luxurious Jailkept Jay, Maybe Jay tried to kill someone night 1, and they blocked against it. They seemed not phased with my claim and didn't awkwardly ping me after the fact.

M Plus 7 brain twin, I can't call you town. too much slank too little slang

Macdougall
Lots of people call him town. He seems alright. (I'm trying to finish this, but I kind of want to not type all this up.) I've almost stopped typing twice. Yes, mac, this is technically unfair to you. *insert an I OWE YOU a real read*

novaselinenever Really pushed on ULtra

Owner of a Lonely Heart *puts music here instead*

Spoiler: show

rundontwalk2 Jay spoke well of you. If he's scum, he could be white knighting you. I don't remember your posts pinging me.

speedchuck You're like mac, but not mac. I kind of have you in a pile. But haven't done much with you. You did vote on Ultra though.

Tsaiah no words

Operation: Who To Trust

Why I'm not with anyone?

Dragomir
His voting didn't change from day 1 to day 2. He voted for DDL both days. Scum sometimes stick to voting for one person.

DDL
But DDL did vote for Soneji later on. Epi could have died to make him look well?!?! Soneji not flipping scum when DDL has played with him a lot makes me question how well DDL can read him.

Gemma
Could just being using the claim to ride the game out?

JaggedJimmyJay
His posts examining interactions between Ultra and other players could be used to project his thoughts and opinions of other players in scummy lights? (you putting me with Ultra seemed shady man) His trustfall seems townie, but it could have an ulterior motive to see where others are truly at. Ultra's vote on you could be distancing. His presence wasn't overwhelming on day 0. Speedy (in a previous game) mentioned day 0s being pretty active or more so active when jjj is around town.

JessieKruger
Was no kill action put in the first night? Aka afk team (jessie, mplus7 and tsiah?) He did hope on Dragomir's wagon; idk.

Luxurious
I on and off have suspicions of them. I think some scum has the jailkeeper ability for nights 1 and 3, but I'm not sure if it is there ability.

M Plus 7
No kill made n1?

Macdougall I think he mentioned mind melding with DDL. I know I can only trust my own mind melds with other people, and not ones that they do. Some people do or can fake mind melding or saying that they agree when they just know the team. Like myself, you did vote Epi. Maybe you killed him? hmmm

novaselinenever
DDL, myself and epi were suspicious of you early on. Epi is in fact dead now. He was making a town circle with me in it, and I got paranoid cause I do that when people read me correctly early on. If I went looking through more of day 1, I could probably still see why I was suspicious of you.

Owner of a Lonely Heart *puts music here instead*

Spoiler: show

rundontwalk2 You don't have much presence. Or maybe I keep missing when you are here? But you did place a vote yesterday and there were kills in the night (coincidence, I think not) *lols* jk, yeah, I don't have much on you at the moment.

speedchuck We weren't seeing eye to eye...maybe that makes you scum?

Tsaiah no words, or afk scum team ftw?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

His voting didn't change from day 1 to day 2.

What is this supposed to mean and why does it matter?

Why does it matter to you? It is only one vote on you. I vote and you appear?

Sometimes, scum don't change their vote from day to day, but town with strong reads might do that as well.

Anyways, I need a break. I don't feel like typing much at the moment.

[MacDougall]

Operation: Trustfall

Why is Player X a civilian?

You seem to have missed the point lol

[Dragomir]

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

His voting didn't change from day 1 to day 2.

What is this supposed to mean and why does it matter?

Why does it matter to you? It is only one vote on you. I vote and you appear?

Sometimes, scum don't change their vote from day to day, but town with strong reads might do that as well.

Anyways, I need a break. I don't feel like typing much at the moment.

It matters to me because your reasoning is flawed and I want an explanation for why you find that bad.

You acknowledge that this both alignments can do the same thing basically making it NAI, heck you only say it's sometimes that scum do it basically saying that this thing I did is not a particular strong scum tell but with all this you vote for me with that as your reason.

This is bullshit and I seriously wanna scum read you.

[Luxurious]

Luxurious, I am reading your case against speedchuck and am struggling to discern a narrative or theme in what you are saying about him (if you intended for there to be one apart from "he's suspicious"). I don't fully follow your case. If you could reduce it to one or two sentences that expresses why he is bad, that would be super.

There was more to it, but like I said before, I gave a brief one since I deleted my original by accident.

One to two sentences is kinda short but alright. He’s kinda dropped off activity wise, kinda like he’s coasting on the Ultra flip/ trapping activities town read people gave him. He’s also been somewhat hedgy with his reads, and I hope to discern why he was looking at Owner and Dragomir Day 1 since that read more for the sake of convenience

[Luxurious]

The only good look he has day 2 was the jack push but he didnt really do much with it.

It did come outta left field which is +Town Points imo

[Luxurious]

Owner is town and nothing can change that

[Luxurious]

I wanna say one of those was a vig kill and if I find town shot one of them Im gonna be Big Mad

Also during the night i came to the realization that we dont get role flips when people die

Anyway i think mafia got vigilante

I mentioned that we didn't get role flips. The "i'm gonna be Big Mad" bit pings me. I guess I feel like it's fake. Town can make wrong kills too. I don't know if it was town or mafia. Wouldn't mafia try to get rid of bigger threats, then again, figuring out who is actually truly a threat might be a whole other thing entirely.

Like if JaggedJimmyJay was scum for instance, then there might be a push to keep the active players alive so that him still being alive doesn't look as suspicious.

Well okay firstly, Epi kill is stupid from town unless whoever shot him was town reading Dragomir but even then it would have been better to shoot Dragomir because he was a conflicting wagon.

Yes i think it would be better to kill threats which is why i said it was probably a meta kill.

I dont see how killing Epi and Jack, two active talkative players, makes JJJ look less suspicious lol

[Luxurious]

I am confused. My impression was that I was a counter wagon to save Soneji but seeing how both leading wagons are town, it makes me think that there were more town in my wagon than on Soneji's wagon as it doesn't make sense for scum to get another wagon going when they can just hop on the leading wagon which was a mislynch.

How does it affect your RDW read? Why are you scum reading him anyway

He hasn't done anything contributive and productive this entire game and then sheep on my wagon with literal piss poor reasoning. Nothing about that is coming from a Town POV.

Can you go through the GTH reads and assign each person good/ bad?

The only two reads I remember are RDW and DDL. I also havent seen you post any townreads?

Tyia

Not really interested in doing that.

I don't really like posting my townreads.

From my pov this looks like you trying not to tmi any townies

TMI?

Too much information. I’m trying to get into the head of town!dragomir here, and there are obviously people you shouldnt want lynched.

If that’s NOT the case then there are people you would want to lynch last.

Without being able to follow your thought process I kinda figure you’re remaining on purposely obtuse to protect scum mates and not condemn them, or expose town as being, like town.

Also idk why you dont like posting town reads. Why dont you?

[Luxurious]

Y’all just gonna let me have the thread to myself again huh

[Luxurious]

Wtf is this bad good shit?

Gun-to-head reads. We took stances on each player without allowing anything other than "good" or "bad".

Also, the hell are the logical reasons for me being scum? I don't see any.

Stuff like this rubs me the wrong way:

Spoiler: show

If y'all actually sussing Nova after what he did yesterday, y'all gotta go.

First of all, you protected JJJ over Nova? Second of all, how do you know the heal was successful? Could be more reasons for why nobody died last night aside from you protecting your target.

I still sus Owner and DDL pretty heavily. RDW is someone I'm taking interest in as well. I'm finna go back and read Ultra's interactions.

Yeah, I keep forgetting.

Why did Owner’s claim convince you she was town

She claimed tracker and apparently tracked you to JJJ which you confirmed. This is a pretty dumb question.

You seem to be treating the game like there are obvious facts and "logic" to callback your original question here. Your post history is emotionless, and it looks like you're playing Mafia with a calculator.

Also when you had an opportunity to dig in and talk with DDL, the guy you've suspected so much, this was what came of that:

Spoiler: show

You know, isn't Ultra technically chainsaw defending DDL here when he attacks JJJ here? Especially even more as Ultra went to make his stance and vote on JJJ. I mean, he's technically defending DDL by attacking JJJ's vote on DDL calling it out as a chainsaw defense. This makes me sus of DDL even more.

novaselinenever I understand your case against JJJ but I press x to doubt that he's buddies with Ultra. The latter made his case and vote against JJJ and it's not like Ultra was in any danger of being lynched at that time for a distance attempt to make sense here, so what Ultra's fake case on JJJ is not coming off as a bus or distance imo. Also, I'm strong scum reading Owner and she also made her wishy washy case against JJJ, who again Ultra used for his fake case, so I definitely see more of a pairing between two buddies going against one townie there.

Dragomir if all you do in the game is place a picture of me on your wall and throw shit at it you are going to be lynched before I am.

Lol, ok. Didn't say anything about trying to get you lynched here, only pointed out something interested. But aight then.

By saying that what Ultra did made you look worse?

What about yesterday? You did nothing but attack me.

Are you backtracking on that?

I don't care what happened last DP. I'm talking about the now. I'm still sussing you for what I called you out for but I'm not planning on making an almighty push you at this moment.

I mean, what is this reassurance to DDL that you're not trying to lynch him? Eh?

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

Who are the players with 2 agendas? What proof do you have that they have 2 agendas

I was talking about myself.

Oh bet so you’re trying to see how someone acts as town vs. as scum then?

[Luxurious]

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

I'm don't know what you mean in the highlighted question.

I view emotion (or the lack thereof) to be an important indicator which can shed light on otherwise vague notions of "tone" or "vibes" which comprise guts reads et cetera. I believe that, in a vacuum, mafia members are generally less emotional in their posts than are civilians. There are exceptions as with any "tell", but I don't really care about exceptions.

What I mean regarding your exchange with DDL was that instead of voicing your concerns about him directly to him, you alleviated his concern that you wanted to lynch him. This is something that you have since loudly protested. Whatever your intention may be, I am telling you right now that it hasn't always been clear what you want to do with the player Dragon D. Luffy. "Not making a big push" (whatever that means) is meaningless to me. Clearly you are and have been pursuing his lynch -- it is probably the most pronounced aspect of your post history. This manner of technicality and your insistence about it strikes me as at best misplaced. I don't know why that is important to you from a civilian perspective.

Do me a favor and never look up any of my scum games

Tyia

[Dragomir]

How does it affect your RDW read? Why are you scum reading him anyway

He hasn't done anything contributive and productive this entire game and then sheep on my wagon with literal piss poor reasoning. Nothing about that is coming from a Town POV.

Can you go through the GTH reads and assign each person good/ bad?

The only two reads I remember are RDW and DDL. I also havent seen you post any townreads?

Tyia

Not really interested in doing that.

I don't really like posting my townreads.

From my pov this looks like you trying not to tmi any townies

TMI?

Too much information. I’m trying to get into the head of town!dragomir here, and there are obviously people you shouldnt want lynched.

If that’s NOT the case then there are people you would want to lynch last.

Without being able to follow your thought process I kinda figure you’re remaining on purposely obtuse to protect scum mates and not condemn them, or expose town as being, like town.

Also idk why you dont like posting town reads. Why dont you?

I have no idea what you were saying until the last line. I don't like posting town reads to avoid being pocketed, unless I really find someone to be an obvious town and ppl not realizing that to be asinine.

[Dragomir]

I wanna say one of those was a vig kill and if I find town shot one of them Im gonna be Big Mad

Also during the night i came to the realization that we dont get role flips when people die

Anyway i think mafia got vigilante

I mentioned that we didn't get role flips. The "i'm gonna be Big Mad" bit pings me. I guess I feel like it's fake. Town can make wrong kills too. I don't know if it was town or mafia. Wouldn't mafia try to get rid of bigger threats, then again, figuring out who is actually truly a threat might be a whole other thing entirely.

Like if JaggedJimmyJay was scum for instance, then there might be a push to keep the active players alive so that him still being alive doesn't look as suspicious.

Well okay firstly, Epi kill is stupid from town unless whoever shot him was town reading Dragomir but even then it would have been better to shoot Dragomir because he was a conflicting wagon.

Yes i think it would be better to kill threats which is why i said it was probably a meta kill.

I dont see how killing Epi and Jack, two active talkative players, makes JJJ look less suspicious lol

Can you explain to me why me being a conflicting wagon to Soneji being scummy now that Soneji flipped town? Cause I don't see it.

[Dragomir]

Wtf is this bad good shit?

Gun-to-head reads. We took stances on each player without allowing anything other than "good" or "bad".

Also, the hell are the logical reasons for me being scum? I don't see any.

Stuff like this rubs me the wrong way:

Spoiler: show

If y'all actually sussing Nova after what he did yesterday, y'all gotta go.

First of all, you protected JJJ over Nova? Second of all, how do you know the heal was successful? Could be more reasons for why nobody died last night aside from you protecting your target.

I still sus Owner and DDL pretty heavily. RDW is someone I'm taking interest in as well. I'm finna go back and read Ultra's interactions.

Why did Owner’s claim convince you she was town

She claimed tracker and apparently tracked you to JJJ which you confirmed. This is a pretty dumb question.

You seem to be treating the game like there are obvious facts and "logic" to callback your original question here. Your post history is emotionless, and it looks like you're playing Mafia with a calculator.

Also when you had an opportunity to dig in and talk with DDL, the guy you've suspected so much, this was what came of that:

Spoiler: show

Dragomir if all you do in the game is place a picture of me on your wall and throw shit at it you are going to be lynched before I am.

Lol, ok. Didn't say anything about trying to get you lynched here, only pointed out something interested. But aight then.

What about yesterday? You did nothing but attack me.

Are you backtracking on that?

I don't care what happened last DP. I'm talking about the now. I'm still sussing you for what I called you out for but I'm not planning on making an almighty push you at this moment.

I mean, what is this reassurance to DDL that you're not trying to lynch him? Eh?

Yes I do treat somethings as facts because that's how it is in my POV. What does emotionless posts have to do with anything? Explain to me what I was supposed to talk to DDL about in those interactions? Cause I wanted to correct his post on me trying to lynch him the entire game. I'm not sure what else there was to talk about cause there wasn't. Is it a common theme on this site to interact against players with 2 agendas in mind?

Who are the players with 2 agendas? What proof do you have that they have 2 agendas

I was talking about myself.

Oh bet so you’re trying to see how someone acts as town vs. as scum then?

What? No.

[Luxurious]

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

His voting didn't change from day 1 to day 2.

What is this supposed to mean and why does it matter?

Why does it matter to you? It is only one vote on you. I vote and you appear?

Sometimes, scum don't change their vote from day to day, but town with strong reads might do that as well.

Anyways, I need a break. I don't feel like typing much at the moment.

It matters to me because your reasoning is flawed and I want an explanation for why you find that bad.

You acknowledge that this both alignments can do the same thing basically making it NAI, heck you only say it's sometimes that scum do it basically saying that this thing I did is not a particular strong scum tell but with all this you vote for me with that as your reason.

This is bullshit and I seriously wanna scum read you.

You dont have strong reads

[Luxurious]

He hasn't done anything contributive and productive this entire game and then sheep on my wagon with literal piss poor reasoning. Nothing about that is coming from a Town POV.

Can you go through the GTH reads and assign each person good/ bad?

The only two reads I remember are RDW and DDL. I also havent seen you post any townreads?

Tyia

Not really interested in doing that.

I don't really like posting my townreads.

From my pov this looks like you trying not to tmi any townies

TMI?

Too much information. I’m trying to get into the head of town!dragomir here, and there are obviously people you shouldnt want lynched.

If that’s NOT the case then there are people you would want to lynch last.

Without being able to follow your thought process I kinda figure you’re remaining on purposely obtuse to protect scum mates and not condemn them, or expose town as being, like town.

Also idk why you dont like posting town reads. Why dont you?

I have no idea what you were saying until the last line. I don't like posting town reads to avoid being pocketed, unless I really find someone to be an obvious town and ppl not realizing that to be asinine.

THERE SHOULD BE SOMEONE YOU DONT WANT LYNCHED RIGHT NOW. WHO IS IT.

how is town reading someone gonna pocket you if you’re constantly aware of them pocketing you? Checkmate.