The Syndicate

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:14 am . . . really? Who was the other one?

Wasn't me, I can guarantee you that.

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:07 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:39 pmThough I should make a point that 'sucking' and 'looking bad' are different.

I usually employ a mixture of the two.

Some of us can't distinguish either from, "Please just shut the fuck up Epi and, yeah, stop."

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:58 pm If Epi were to host another Vocaroo game (which is his choice, let's not force it on him ), it'd be his second game in the present Heist cue -- could mean anywhere from a couple months to next year depending upon his prerogative. Anyone can host the game though, it's a piece of cake.

You could swap out the active one in the queue for it.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:15 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:13 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:00 pm Though Epignosis in Vocaroo could kind of make it 11 for mafia and 2 for indy (solo).

That game played out so strangely. We blindly fell into an absentee scum lynch on Day 1 and then had to try to catch a lone baddie with no real clues anywhere. Plus epi charmed the pants off us.
My point is when is Vocaroo II happening?

This.

I think I'm supposed to be hosting that.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:13 pm Plus epi charmed the pants off us.

First time I've ever seen someone say that.

Just drop the V. That helps.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:50 pm Oh yeah. Send me MVP votes.

I don't believe in those. But if you're sending them, you know where they belong.

I think where the mafia fucked up with me is that, once I've made up my mind, that's often it. So when I said nutella was good, why did they kill me?

Catching sanmateo felt good. It really did.

This is the best civilian MP performance I have ever witnessed.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:11 pm I'm probably way too excited for this win but god damn it was driving me crazy knowing that I could cause town to lose it in the end. I'm so glad it worked out.

Well played to the scum team as well, all three of nutella, DDL, and sanmateo really played impressively well. It's a wonder we caught you all.

You should be. You were clutch. Straight fucking clutch.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:45 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:14 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:11 pm Of all the people supposedly suspicious of DDL, DDL only took one vote.

I remember nutella suspecting him because i've just been talking about that, and she tried to cast a vote for speedchuck instead. Good catch. who else suspects him?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:01 pm I'm leaving now and keeping my vote on nutella. This most recent bit of digging from Epi has produced another mark against her for me, and I just do not feel like I am seeing the same townie nutella that I'm used to seeing. Lynch good, fellow townies.

What was my "good catch?"

People were suspicious of DDL but didn't vote for him. It's somethig worth digging into. I don't have time to dig into it right now.

Okay, but the central factor in this is DDL (if you're going down this road).

For my own part, what keeps my suspicion of nutella in check is her meltdown at the end of Day 1 followed by that caustic "I-told-you-so" rhetoric directly after the lynch, and then what she posts after that.

While I do not doubt nutella could fake an outburst like this, the eruption was almost certainly genuine, given her recent frustration elsewhere. While I acknowledge that the outrage at missing the vote would likely be genuine even if nutella is bad, the sourness bled over into the lynch reveal itself.

That too, could be faked, but was it?

If it was, it would have to mean that:

1) nutella was genuinely angry about the poll time change (as I believe she would be regardless of alignment), but then
2) after seeing the dead power role and, while being secretly overjoyed,
3) launch a little tirade at the blockheads who lynched LC, and THEN
4) go back to her original complaint about the time change.

For nutella to be bad, all four of these things have to be true.

#4 would indicate to me that nutella believed she had a real opportunity to change the lynch, and that she was robbed of that opportunity. If she were bad, she would have been delighted at the outcome and her complaint at this stage would have been unnecessary and her dissatisfaction feigned.

On top of it all, nutella is a grammar girl. Read those posts. Home girl was genuinely pissed all the way through.

I think I just talked myself into calling nutella a civilian.

nutella's emotional rants will never affect me one iota ever again.

There's a house with no door...

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:55 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:49 pm

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:46 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:43 pm I have a more important question:

What are we going to do with Quin once we find him?

Spike his drink?

Or give him another sausage sandwich.

That was the clue that should have taken us to New South Wales in the first place.

Fine by me. Who's on the top, middle, and bottom between the 3 of us then?

No, seriously.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:00 pm

Day 1

Australia's most dedicated investigators are on the case. Quin is on the loose, and it will take a coordinated national effort to track him down. The top minds came together at the newly established Headquarters of the Quin Search in Sunshine Coast. The discussion was heated from the start, passions elevated by the terribly indecent nature of their quarry and the necessity to determine his location immediately. Much time was wasted however when presenters promoted numerous leads in Queensland. They'd seemed promising at first, but it quickly became evident that there was nothing there. Eventually the team found their start in New South Wales.

It is Day 1. This phase will last 48 hours.

This says "quarry." It should probably say "quarrel," but it doesn't.

Where in New South Wales has a lot of quarries?

I'm thinking section B now.

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:46 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:43 pm I have a more important question:

What are we going to do with Quin once we find him?

Spike his drink?

Or give him another sausage sandwich.

That was the clue that should have taken us to New South Wales in the first place.

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:42 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:34 pm Isn't it just possible that sanmateo was latching on me because he wanted to have someone he could vote for over and over so péople thought he was scumhunting when he wasn't?

Someone who gets suspected by a lot of people often so that wouldn't draw much attention to him?

Not really. If that was his strategy, it's also just as likely that he could end up being accused of tunneling. And that one usually never ends well if the person is wrong.

I have a more important question:

What are we going to do with Quin once we find him?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:34 pm Isn't it just possible that sanmateo was latching on me because he wanted to have someone he could vote for over and over so péople thought he was scumhunting when he wasn't?

Someone who gets suspected by a lot of people often so that wouldn't draw much attention to him?

Why didn't it occur to you to say this when he started trying to get you lynched?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:06 pm Quin Search

The team caught a break when a new witnessed emerge, or at least they hoped it would be a break. She reported being stuck under Quin's incredibly indecent gaze for some time, as though in a trance. After turning up in a field on her own, wandering aimlessly and tirelessly, her mind was not in a normal place. All she could remember for sure was that the air felt cool around Quin. She was terribly shaken by the ordeal.

Find Quin.

Bearing in mind that any of the above could be fake news, the standout clues to me are "turning up in a field" and "the air felt cool around Quin."

The latter leads me to believe they were in Sydney. I don't know where any fields are in Australia.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:19 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:16 pm I also suspect DDL because he called me good because I'm so logical, but he hasn't agreed with a single thing I've said or done.

I've already explained my point. I don't need to agree with someone's read to think they are being honest.

You didn't call me honest. You called me logical.

I'm going to spend the last moments of this phase searching for Quin, since, you know, this is "The Search for Quin."

I also suspect DDL because he called me good because I'm so logical, but he hasn't agreed with a single thing I've said or done.

Why wait?

sanmateo wrote: ↑Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:30 pmwait what

sanmateo wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:56 pm so is this night 0 voting thing real or just some weird thing yall do

Given sanmateo's role, this is a completely fabricated post. No confusion whatsoever.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:02 pm

sanmateo wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:56 pm so is this night 0 voting thing real or just some weird thing yall do

It's a thing. Might have some effect on the game.

speedchuck answered in earnest rather quickly but not too quickly. I like that.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:05 pm yeah, just read the mp07 post about that

my first impulse was voting for queensland and wait and see whether birdwithteeth's claim was real or not, but from what i can gather there's no real information tha'll be revealed from the result of the vote.

I don't know what post is referenced here. MP?

The latter part of the post, given that sanmateo's role was to give false information, makes this look, at worst, like an uncoordinated mafia interaction, but I don't think that's what this is.

Given the role, check the Night 1 host post for funny business. I'll check that later.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:07 pm eh, i'm voting queensland anyways. statistically they're more likely to be town than not

This reinforces my view that birdwithteeth11 is good. Not focusing on the role material for a moment, I take notice of the pronoun: "they're." sanmateo might have subconsciously used a male pronoun here, but he used a plural one, which indicates unfamiliarity.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:59 pm

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:22 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:44 pm I felt like Epignosis' reactions were way more suspicious than my reaction to them. I don't understand why you ignore my points about his reactions and just vote for me instead.

How about this for a plan then? We lynch you today for your backtracking. If you flip civ, then we lynch Epig on Day 2 since he was clearly egging you on and trying to start something!

yeah that seems like a terrible plan. none of what i've seen from the epi/LC thing moves me particularly. it's a bunch of tepid day 1 stuff. but more importantly, if getting into weird arguments in-game is really a recurring thing between them, then obviously we need to look elsewhere because anything coming from either of the two about the other one holds less weight.

I am under the impression that sanmateo was distancing against his team rather than hunting down civilians. This was a prime opportunity to "suspect" bwt, but he didn't do that, even though he called bwt's plan (which was almost surely facetious) "a terrible plan."

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:04 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:02 pm

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:59 pm

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:22 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:44 pm I felt like Epignosis' reactions were way more suspicious than my reaction to them. I don't understand why you ignore my points about his reactions and just vote for me instead.

How about this for a plan then? We lynch you today for your backtracking. If you flip civ, then we lynch Epig on Day 2 since he was clearly egging you on and trying to start something!

yeah that seems like a terrible plan. none of what i've seen from the epi/LC thing moves me particularly. it's a bunch of tepid day 1 stuff. but more importantly, if getting into weird arguments in-game is really a recurring thing between them, then obviously we need to look elsewhere because anything coming from either of the two about the other one holds less weight.

where else shall we look?

well there's already a bandwagon forming against long con so that seems like a great starting point

This question is a small nod in Sloonei's favor. It didn't need to be asked.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:34 pm fuck it i'm just quoting every single post itt

Spoiler: show

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:33 am

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:11 am Epi vs LC, aka "El Clásico"

I know, right? I mean, I was just joking around... but Epi's reaction! I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he totally freaked out. He demanded four times that I substantiate my claims, then he throws out a weak-ass OMGUS, and then demands opinions from everyone on it.

Not to mention he completely ignored Wilgy, who also made a very similar joke. I guess he understood that Wilgy's post was a joke, but not mine. This is unexpectedly juicy Night 0 stuff!

alright, well this post is obviously an overreaction. that's approximately one half of the case against this guy, the other half being the meta stuff epignosis was talking about. i obviously don't know much about that but i think it's more important that this kind of conflict between these two has played out multiple times in previous games. i don't think there's much i can do by learning everyone's meta but i'd like to know more about the specifics of the previous installments of the epi/lc clasico.

Spoiler: show

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:18 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:33 am This is unexpectedly juicy Night 0 stuff!

Isn't it though!?
I'm not even under pressure and I'm still finding it impossible to see your posts in a joking light.

It wasn't a joke. If you were egging on Epi to get a reaction, which I could have bought, you wouldn't be backpedaling so ridiculously hard right now.

this is speedchuck's reaction to the post above, makes sense for a townie. sloonei also picked up on it immediately and questioned long con over several posts, because he's sloonei and he asks questions and shit. the otherfirst responder was mp, and he said epi was a town read, which i want him to elaborate on. i think epi's last post (the one about looking at other players) is very town-like but i'm mostly interested on why mp said that at that point in time.

Spoiler: show

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:55 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:33 am

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:11 am Epi vs LC, aka "El Clásico"

I know, right? I mean, I was just joking around... but Epi's reaction! I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he totally freaked out. He demanded four times that I substantiate my claims, then he throws out a weak-ass OMGUS, and then demands opinions from everyone on it.

Not to mention he completely ignored Wilgy, who also made a very similar joke. I guess he understood that Wilgy's post was a joke, but not mine. This is unexpectedly juicy Night 0 stuff!

I don't like the tone of this post. Sounds like you are trying to make him look back without engaging him yourself.

now this, *kisses fingers like chef boyardee* this is that sus shit. just piling on

Spoiler: show

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:22 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:44 pm I felt like Epignosis' reactions were way more suspicious than my reaction to them. I don't understand why you ignore my points about his reactions and just vote for me instead.

How about this for a plan then? We lynch you today for your backtracking. If you flip civ, then we lynch Epig on Day 2 since he was clearly egging you on and trying to start something!

piling on... slightly more egregious because bwt said they think both are neutral reads. dragon and bird look scummier to me than LC based on this

Regarding the third box, we've already established that sanmateo knew LC was good. I do believe he was trying to distance from a teammate.

The fourth box is a phony reaction, because sanmateo had already reacted to this post.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:04 pm the thing about bird that i feel is throwing me off is jay's post at the beginning of day 1 and the bwt night 0 claim.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:09 pm

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:04 pm the thing about bird that i feel is throwing me off is jay's post at the beginning of day 1 and the bwt night 0 claim.

You and I have known Jay the longest of anyone in this game. What do you think are the chances that he provided birdwithteeth with information, true or false, about the Day 0 poll?

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:15 pm seems unlikely. but there's clearly a mechanic at play here and mp07 said that there's a precedent for giving info to random players in night 0 polls.

This right here makes all of Sloonei, MP, and BWT look better to me.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:57 am i think given what people have said about bird i wont vote for him today. sloonei threw out both of the posts that i singled out beforehand but he still seemed steadfast on voting for LC until i wrote that post. something doesn't really track there, i was taken aback by him being that easily convinced but it seemed like people were moving away from that bandwagon so it'd make sense that scum sloonei (scoomei?) would switch. if what he said about looking at bwt's claim in the same way as mp07 and epignosis is true, then why wouldnt he vote for dragon from the start?

that's less simple than the reason i suspect dragon, so it feels less likely to be true. thus im probably voting for dragon. but my uni canceled classes today so i have time to spare

Delicious.

Translation: If DDL gets lynched, people will think I'm good and Sloonei is bad.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:23 pm i'm looking at this mp bandwagon and it just looks like bullshit. if he's scum spacedaisy is probably scum as well but it's not exactly a solid vote. wilgy's vote could literally mean anything. and ddl has once again gone on a bandwagon, i understand that he's sequestered meeting family, friends and loved ones and he can't yell at strangers online (aka the best thing in the world) or whatever, but am i going insane? he's done this twice

If sanmateo's definition of "bandwagon" is to even mention suspicion of someone after someone else, then lots of us are guilty of "bandwagoning." Why single out DDL? And how would doing it twice make anybody suspicious?

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:57 pm yeah, i think speedchuck came in and voted for mp and then left. which is extremely weird unless i skipped over his name when i posted above but i remember there were 3 votes on mp.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:00 pm did wilgy even vote for mp at some point?

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:08 pm alright well, i might change it because at least ddl kind of said why they were voting for mp. i suppose i could be overlooking mp's tells but has anyone even made a case against him? voting for lurkers isnt really that sus. the LC bandwagon made more sense and that was pretty weak

These posts are opening a window to abandon his DDL vote if the tally renders it necessary.

All of this leads me to believe DDL should be lynched next.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:14 pm

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:58 pm

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:55 pm I'm looking at a sanmateo/DDL teammate pairing with that last post by DDL.

Oh, I hadn't even thought of that!



That could actually explain sanmateo's suspicion of DDL even more -- because he knows he's bad.

The whole "The MP train is bullshit" charade looked like distancing to me.

What do you mean?

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:23 pm i'm looking at this mp bandwagon and it just looks like bullshit. if he's scum spacedaisy is probably scum as well but it's not exactly a solid vote. wilgy's vote could literally mean anything. and ddl has once again gone on a bandwagon, i understand that he's sequestered meeting family, friends and loved ones and he can't yell at strangers online (aka the best thing in the world) or whatever, but am i going insane? he's done this twice

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:08 pm alright well, i might change it because at least ddl kind of said why they were voting for mp. i suppose i could be overlooking mp's tells but has anyone even made a case against him? voting for lurkers isnt really that sus. the LC bandwagon made more sense and that was pretty weak

sanmateo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:26 pm ah fuck, i completely missed the deadline

sanmateo looks too invested in a DDL lynch for reasons that are too artificial to be any good Day 1 when he called Epi vs LC "tepid."

If I'm right about speedchuck, nobody needed saving or thrown under the bus. His vote for DDL looks like he was going to distance and coast.

MovingPictures07 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:58 pm

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:55 pm I'm looking at a sanmateo/DDL teammate pairing with that last post by DDL.

Oh, I hadn't even thought of that!



That could actually explain sanmateo's suspicion of DDL even more -- because he knows he's bad.

The whole "The MP train is bullshit" charade looked like distancing to me.

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:38 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:11 pm linki: Post didn't sway me. Now I'm just going to feel bad if I lynch you and you are town. But I've made my argument, and if more people don't follow up and agree with it, you'll be fine.
Pls, @everyone, what do you think of my case on spacedaisy?

My case from earlier:
Rereading spacedaisy though has her pretty solidly last, much as I hate to say it. Tone, presence, passive-aggressive way of defending herself, the way she slowly switches from defense to helping push the man lynch trains without calling attention to herself, etc.

Any passive aggressive tones you are getting from me is because sometimes Epi's arrogance level gets on my last nerve. And if I can be honest, it's the reason I have pretty much withdrawn from the activity level I had previously engaged after MP's @mention of me. I don't particularly like being pissed off in a mafia game, least of all at someone I consider a friend. Good guy, but one whose mafia persona I frequently cannot handle with out feeling intense levels of irritation.

Pardon me for actually, you know, playing the game.

I have no idea what I could have possibly said or done this game to have been responsible for "any passive aggressive tones" speedchuck is getting from you.

I had a back and forth with LC that ended poorly.

I came up with a theory about you based on how quickly you responded to MP, and when you explained it, I literally said:

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 3:09 pm Yeah, that makes sense.

Other than that, I am at a total loss for how I can be coming across as arrogant or pissing you off.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:00 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:25 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:01 pm I should add that part of the reason I've been so skeptical of Epi all game long is that he just hosted me as a baddie in Street Fighter. He had a front row seat to everything scum Sloonei does and would do. I feel like he of all people should be able to spot the differences in my play here.

That said, I've taken a step back from my suspicion of him today because no one else seemed to agree with my observation that he was deliberately misconstruing information all day long. I may have been imagining it because I didn't think it was possible for me to be read as bad.

I forgot to say that none of that means anything to me.

Are you seriously suggesting that I should clear you right now because I should be able to see how (apparently?) different you are when bad or good?

I'm not trying to suggest anything about how you should or shouldn't play the game, nor am I trying to be critical of you in any way. I'm just expressing that this has been a factor in how I've been reading you this game, because it is. In theory you should be in the best position to judge me against my recent scum game of anyone here, that is all. I feel like you have seen my hand.

The first question I ask myself when anyone expresses suspicion of me is whether or not I believe that person is genuinely suspicious. I've been struggling to answer that question with regards to you in this game. MP as well, but he's had far less to say.

I don't agree. I've hosted you once as bad if I am correct, and you were never at any time under serious pressure of being lynched (nor were any of your teammates). You got lynched because one guy decided you were bad and he dragged you by himself to the gallows.

I have seen nothing.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:45 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:34 pm I'll admit, I've seen people do that. I guess, FMPOV, nutella's reactions seemed very genuine. The way she went about it, the out-of-game circumstances, the frustration about the vote, etc. I can't read it as scum.
Go read her posts and assume I'm town. Does it really seem like a scum reaction?

I actually feel like this game is going well but that nobody is voting in good places. It's freaking weird.

It could be a half legit half faked thing. As in, she is actually mad at the poll time, but she used that feeling to produce a post that made her look more civ.

I've done that myself. There was a game where I was bad and I was feeling guilty about the way I had treated another player in a previous game. So I wrote a heartfelt apology to him while making sure to use that as a spring to make people like me.

The best lies are half truths.

Not the same thing.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:41 pm @Epignosis

This post.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:56 pm also holy shit the worst role to lose wow great job everybody

I thought you were talking about it?

I was referring to the three posts she made where the one you quoted was second.

That post might qualify as a "cheerleader post" for you (and if so, I don't want to meet any Brazilian cheerleaders ), but the one that comes right after it is the one I believe to be crucial in determining nutella's intentions and therefore alignment.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:29 pm Epi looks at a piece of evidence and draws a different conclusion from the one I do.

I not only think it's not hard for scum to fake an outburst of frustration, but I also believe from experience that scum has a tendency to want to announce their reactions to major events in the game. As in "good job town", or "good job, vig", but also "this lynch was so stupid". This isn't really based on logic but I feel it's human nature, they want to show they care but don't want to actually help, so they make those cheerleader posts. I've had to hold that urge myself many times as bad.

And the timing... eh, jury is out on whether Nutella was mad for that or not. Baddies love an excuse not to vote for people, so they don't get involved in possible civ mislynches or unnecessary busses. And again, she could actually be mad and fake the whole thing. I don't want to start underestimating her.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:59 pm why do hosts keep screwing me over? first G-Man kills me for no reason and now suddenly my tie-causing vote doesn't count even though the poll deadline hadn't passed? this sucks you guys why can't I just play mafia without things going wrong beyond my control

This isn't a "cheerleader post."

It's kind of a dirty post if nutella indeed missed the vote on purpose, as I think you are suggesting.

But I don't think nutella is afraid to cast a vote when she is bad.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:01 pm I should add that part of the reason I've been so skeptical of Epi all game long is that he just hosted me as a baddie in Street Fighter. He had a front row seat to everything scum Sloonei does and would do. I feel like he of all people should be able to spot the differences in my play here.

That said, I've taken a step back from my suspicion of him today because no one else seemed to agree with my observation that he was deliberately misconstruing information all day long. I may have been imagining it because I didn't think it was possible for me to be read as bad.

I forgot to say that none of that means anything to me.

Are you seriously suggesting that I should clear you right now because I should be able to see how (apparently?) different you are when bad or good?

On another plane of thought:

DrWilgy effectively "saved" speedchuck from being lynched.

For a moment, suppose someone else had been killed instead and not DrWilgy.

If speedchuck is bad and got lynched today, that sets up the narrative that Wilgy was a teammate brazenly saving speedchuck.

If speedchuck is good and got lynched today, then no such narrative can exist.

DrWilgy being killed therefore leads me to infer the underlined scenario is probably true.

I had a post about this earlier today, but got rid of it because I wasn't sure where I was going with it. I'm going to rewrite it now that I have thought it over.

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:04 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:02 pm

sanmateo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:59 pm

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:22 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:44 pm I felt like Epignosis' reactions were way more suspicious than my reaction to them. I don't understand why you ignore my points about his reactions and just vote for me instead.

How about this for a plan then? We lynch you today for your backtracking. If you flip civ, then we lynch Epig on Day 2 since he was clearly egging you on and trying to start something!

yeah that seems like a terrible plan. none of what i've seen from the epi/LC thing moves me particularly. it's a bunch of tepid day 1 stuff. but more importantly, if getting into weird arguments in-game is really a recurring thing between them, then obviously we need to look elsewhere because anything coming from either of the two about the other one holds less weight.

where else shall we look?

well there's already a bandwagon forming against long con so that seems like a great starting point

I don't know how sanmateo (or anyone) could call the interactions between LC and me "a bunch of tepid day 1 stuff." Perhaps he was misusing the word "tepid." I don't know.

What I do know is that sanmateo wanted to start investigating people who even expressed an anti-LC opinion: Despite sanmateo's use of the word "bandwagon," I don't recall LC ever having more than two votes until DrWilgy swung the hammer.

This, then, presupposes that, for whatever reason, sanmateo believes that Long Con is good.

How did he come to think that if he dismissed the interactions between LC and me as "a bunch of tepid day 1 stuff?"

Why begin trying to suspect people who are expressing an anti-LC opinion on Day 1 before there was a lynch?

It only makes sense to me if he already knows Long Con is not bad.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:51 pm Strongest civ read right now is probably Epi, Im liking his logical prpcesses.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:57 pm
I do agree Nutella's tiptoeing around me looks forced as hell though so Im gonna bet she is an example of such and vote for her.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:14 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:11 pm Of all the people supposedly suspicious of DDL, DDL only took one vote.

I remember nutella suspecting him because i've just been talking about that, and she tried to cast a vote for speedchuck instead. Good catch. who else suspects him?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:01 pm I'm leaving now and keeping my vote on nutella. This most recent bit of digging from Epi has produced another mark against her for me, and I just do not feel like I am seeing the same townie nutella that I'm used to seeing. Lynch good, fellow townies.

What was my "good catch?"

People were suspicious of DDL but didn't vote for him. It's somethig worth digging into. I don't have time to dig into it right now.

Okay, but the central factor in this is DDL (if you're going down this road).

For my own part, what keeps my suspicion of nutella in check is her meltdown at the end of Day 1 followed by that caustic "I-told-you-so" rhetoric directly after the lynch, and then what she posts after that.

While I do not doubt nutella could fake an outburst like this, the eruption was almost certainly genuine, given her recent frustration elsewhere. While I acknowledge that the outrage at missing the vote would likely be genuine even if nutella is bad, the sourness bled over into the lynch reveal itself.

That too, could be faked, but was it?

If it was, it would have to mean that:

1) nutella was genuinely angry about the poll time change (as I believe she would be regardless of alignment), but then
2) after seeing the dead power role and, while being secretly overjoyed,
3) launch a little tirade at the blockheads who lynched LC, and THEN
4) go back to her original complaint about the time change.

For nutella to be bad, all four of these things have to be true.

#4 would indicate to me that nutella believed she had a real opportunity to change the lynch, and that she was robbed of that opportunity. If she were bad, she would have been delighted at the outcome and her complaint at this stage would have been unnecessary and her dissatisfaction feigned.

On top of it all, nutella is a grammar girl. Read those posts. Home girl was genuinely pissed all the way through.

I think I just talked myself into calling nutella a civilian.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:11 pm Of all the people supposedly suspicious of DDL, DDL only took one vote.

I remember nutella suspecting him because i've just been talking about that, and she tried to cast a vote for speedchuck instead. Good catch. who else suspects him?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:01 pm I'm leaving now and keeping my vote on nutella. This most recent bit of digging from Epi has produced another mark against her for me, and I just do not feel like I am seeing the same townie nutella that I'm used to seeing. Lynch good, fellow townies.

What was my "good catch?"

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:16 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:11 pm Of all the people supposedly suspicious of DDL, DDL only took one vote.

I remember nutella suspecting him because i've just been talking about that, and she tried to cast a vote for speedchuck instead. Good catch. who else suspects him?

sanmateo, obviously.

I thought you were another, but I see you only voted him temporarily and that your position wasn't a strong one.

speedchuck ("I could see DDL as scum regardless of LC's alignment, I think.")

nutella, as I said. She said, "Speedchuck was a way better candidate but yall blew it" but I don't recall her addressing the points I raised in favor of speedchuck. She said that even though DDL was still a viable lynch.

I thought there was one more. MP perhaps? I see he called DDL "uncharacteristically tame." Yes, DDL was in MP's "would potentially vote" category.

Of all the people supposedly suspicious of DDL, DDL only took one vote.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:55 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:51 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:42 pm

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:12 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:03 am

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:59 am I think what is throwing me off is Wilgy swtiching the lynch at the last second to LC, and then both LC and Wilgy being revealed to be civ. As well as confirming how many times I associate Wilgy as a mafia player who plays fast and loose. So I'm hoping I can get my grounding here again soon.

What are your initial ungrounded thoughts on this?

Well we know now that they're both civs, so I'm not sure if it really tells us anything else that is useful. Do you have any thoughts on it?

As is always the case when a civilian gets lynched, I think it's reasonable to speculate that at least one baddie was on board with their lynch, so it might be wise to take a look at the LC bandwagon and votes again.

This does not strike me as genuine.

LC bandwagon?

My Lord, there were three votes on LC, and the one that came in at the last minute to seal the deal was from DrWilgy (a civilian).

So your "bandwagon" consists of MP and me. That's two voters.

Why is it reasonable to speculate that "at least one baddie" is on board when a civilian gets lynched "as is always the case?" When a mafia member gets lynched, isn't it equally reasonable to speculate that at least one teammate was on board?

See my next post. I thought there were more votes. I was not here for the deadline. And it's still a bandwagon in the sense that it's the chain of votes which resulted in a lynch. Do you disagree that mafia members want to lynch civilians?

I did just see your quoting of the poll. That's fine if you didn't remember the number of voters.

However, that doesn't address why it's "reasonable to speculate..."

Of course it's reasonable to speculate that a mafia member voted for a civilian. It's more reasonable (given that there are more civilians that mafia) to speculate that no mafia voted for the lynched civilian.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:55 pmDo you disagree that mafia members want to lynch civilians?

I do. Mafia want civilians to lynch civilians.

And in context, that's a misleading question: LC wasn't the only civilian. Wouldn't it be better to vote for a civilian who isn't getting lynched so that you have somewhere consistent to vote the next Day?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:42 pm

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:12 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:03 am

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:59 am I think what is throwing me off is Wilgy swtiching the lynch at the last second to LC, and then both LC and Wilgy being revealed to be civ. As well as confirming how many times I associate Wilgy as a mafia player who plays fast and loose. So I'm hoping I can get my grounding here again soon.

What are your initial ungrounded thoughts on this?

Well we know now that they're both civs, so I'm not sure if it really tells us anything else that is useful. Do you have any thoughts on it?

As is always the case when a civilian gets lynched, I think it's reasonable to speculate that at least one baddie was on board with their lynch, so it might be wise to take a look at the LC bandwagon and votes again.

This does not strike me as genuine.

LC bandwagon?

My Lord, there were three votes on LC, and the one that came in at the last minute to seal the deal was from DrWilgy (a civilian).

So your "bandwagon" consists of MP and me. That's two voters.

Why is it reasonable to speculate that "at least one baddie" is on board when a civilian gets lynched "as is always the case?" When a mafia member gets lynched, isn't it equally reasonable to speculate that at least one teammate was on board?

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:21 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 3:27 pm

NewTraditionalist wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:14 pm Howdy, all. Delurking to encourage MP (and anyone on the fence) to vote anyone but me. I don't know all of the jargon yet so I'm not really sure where to vote but a vote for me is a vote to kill an honest man.

This is a lie.

Here's a vote.

This morsel strikes me as genuine. That NewTraditionalist voted Wilgy just for Wilgy (jokingly?) calling him bad, and then Wilgy getting greased (when Wilgy didn't even vote NT in the end) doesn't make me think any of this calculated.

The following only makes me weep.

Dom wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:16 pm sup fam i forgot mafia was happening someone catch me up pls

Dom wrote: ↑Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:31 am ok tbh i did the biggest skim of all time bc i really do't have the time or energy to fully catch up and i'm also *catching up* on another game so lol whoops


i take it mp made waves and sloonei / speedchuck r like lol u bad
nutella is the same with ddl

Dom wrote: ↑Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:33 am ok and lc was supatown

Dom wrote: ↑Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:14 pmwho bad

Serge wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:21 pm Jist checking in. Now resuming on something else.

Serge wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:22 am Oh hey, this already started. I'm free from the game I subbed in now, so I can finally start here. Looks like the heat is already on?

Serge wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:20 am I'm sorry I haven't been around, I'll try to catch up within 24 hours.

All of Serge's posts could fit on a T-shirt and be readable from across the street.

There is nothing here to judge, except that "Looks like the heat is already on?" is a subtle way to fan the flames of a civilian-on-civilian lynch without getting involved himself. If Serge had read enough to ask that "the heat is already on," I would have expected some sort of opinion either way.

Also, a comma splice.

birdwithteeth11 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:47 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:24 pm My advice is to lynch someone who looked too clean Day 1. Several people fit that description.

While that could certainly be a good thing to look at, to play Devil's Advocate, couldn't this be viewed as you trying to move attention away from yourself? It's not like you weren't put under the microscope to a certain degree on D1.

I am always baffled when people say, "You're just trying to move attention away from yourself."

Anything someone says other than, "Hey guys, you should pay attention to me" can be construed to mean "I'm just trying to move attention away from myself."

It's an empty thing to say. People will pay attention to whatever they want to pay attention to.