DFS Mafia [ENDGAME]

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

[ColinIsCool]

I’m not voting for new players out of courtesy. After D1, though, your ass is grass.

[Tangrowth]

There's something natural in the scent of abyssum's recent post progression. I don't get the feeling that this person is being careful, which I mean in the best sort of way.

"I don't have all of the thoughts, but I have some of them, here take a look, these are the thoughts, oh you have concerns, okay calm down I'm getting to it, wait a damned minute"

I can dig that perspective. I'm still getting there on her, but I'll post a reads list here in a second and I think I'd color her slight town.

[ColinIsCool]

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

He seemed to offer the most uncertainty or least-presciptive-descriptions (?) for those three, so as to maybe not call attention to their scum metas or make their lives harder by boxing them into something.

[Turnip Head]

Is [mention]ColinIsCool[/mention] bad? Discuss.

[Tangrowth]

That’s a good point about MP, Infected alien. I don’t recall him being so eager to lock people in during previous games — in fact, in Easter he talked himself into just about everybody being scum at different points before I murdered him. That’s interesting.

I don't feel like this is an accurate representation at all? I feel like I developed some town reads on Day 1 and had a full-fledged rainbow?

This is still Day 0, so maybe you're conflating the entirety of my play in Easter with the very beginning of my game there.

It’s possible I am being fast and loose here, and I’m having a hard time articulating the poinr exactly, but it feels like a contradiction in playstyle. Very confident to be able to lock people in D1, but also tinfoilly enough to see the merits in just about every case in Easter (as town). Does that make sense?

Hmmm... yeah, I think that makes some more sense now maybe? I can't even remember exactly how I came to reads that game, but off the top of my head maybe I have been more eager to town read folks here.

I JUST REALLY WANT JAY AND TSAIAH TO BE TOWN OKAY

[JaggedJimmyJay]

M Plus 7
Tsaiah

abyssum
Infected_alien8
sprityo
Kylemii

RobotNerd277
Russtifinko
Marmot

Turnip Head
ColinIsCool
MacDougall

DharmaHelper

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Is @ColinIsCool bad? Discuss.

I've already discussed. Whaddya got?

[abyssum]

my not-so-hot early reads: alien, tsaiah, jay likely to be town

alien for that Interesting wall post that i'm not going to respond to until i see MP7 do so. this may have an element of being biased to recent games, since alien was scum in WC1 and he was notably sort of timid. @Infected_alien8_ this is your first game here, right? (can't say i agree about the slip, though)

jay for lines of questioning; i like the stankbutt accusation/thread because it tickles my funny bone and also makes some sort of sense. super liable to change but being a fan of my avatar is a bonus anyway

tsaiah is the one of the weaker reads outta these, because she has no problems faking tone as scum, but i like her read on MP7 even though i don't fully agree with it yet. not only do i think MP7 would be excitable as scum or town in this playerlist, i think that his posting comes off as sort of pressured and a lot of the content so far isn't really dealing with This Game, which makes excitability/thoughts/etc easier to fake. TBD

What do you mean exactly? I'm too fluffy?

you're not 'too' anything, i just don't think that what you've posted so far is automatically town-indicative, and i wanna ENGAGE you before i start slapping a townread on you (which isn't a thing i've been around enough to do yet, so my bad on that front. i'll try to be more once i've completed some housework)

it's just. being excitable + posting about meta + talking about players isn't auto "yes you're town" in my book, if that makes sense

[ColinIsCool]

Is @ColinIsCool bad? Discuss.

He’s certainly bad at Mafia

[Tangrowth]

Now that MP has answered for himself, I wish to expand with my external perspective of why his play to this point bears a civilian appearance:

He has just emerged from both of the two most intense Mafia games he has ever played in (he can protest that claim if he sees fit). He was a civilian in both of them. He reached an immense post count greater than any ever seen on the site he started in both of them. He reached the final three in both of them. Despite losing the first, he still advanced to a wild card game, and then bettered his performance in every arena of play. He just won the most intense game of his life, as the final voter, the game clincher, and his confidence is soaring.

Now he has an opportunity to play in a similarly vanilla-heavy mafia game on his home turf, both with players from those games and others he has known quite a lot longer, and exercise the skills he developed in those champions games here. It is visible in his behavior, and it is something I recognize keenly. I behaved quite similarly when I returned from my Season 2 appearance in that tournament, with my own confidence soaring, ready to show my old Mafia Mates what I had learned in my excursion to the "big leagues" (forgive my cheesiness).

These are things which may still be expressed in a mafioso MP, and I will remain vigilant in my considerations of his play. I haven't felt his conduct has been inauthentic yet though. I believe him.

Yeah, I really thought I'd be drained AS FUCK after that wild card game, especially considering it was coming not that long after Game 9 where I already reached heights I didn't think were possible for me, and I really was sooo exhausted after WC1... for about 24 hours. Then I realized this game still needed more players and I jumped at the idea of throwing in some folks I really wanted to play with... and here we are.

I can't help myself.

[abyssum]

Now that MP has answered for himself, I wish to expand with my external perspective of why his play to this point bears a civilian appearance:

He has just emerged from both of the two most intense Mafia games he has ever played in (he can protest that claim if he sees fit). He was a civilian in both of them. He reached an immense post count greater than any ever seen on the site he started in both of them. He reached the final three in both of them. Despite losing the first, he still advanced to a wild card game, and then bettered his performance in every arena of play. He just won the most intense game of his life, as the final voter, the game clincher, and his confidence is soaring.

Now he has an opportunity to play in a similarly vanilla-heavy mafia game on his home turf, both with players from those games and others he has known quite a lot longer, and exercise the skills he developed in those champions games here. It is visible in his behavior, and it is something I recognize keenly. I behaved quite similarly when I returned from my Season 2 appearance in that tournament, with my own confidence soaring, ready to show my old Mafia Mates what I had learned in my excursion to the "big leagues" (forgive my cheesiness).

These are things which may still be expressed in a mafioso MP, and I will remain vigilant in my considerations of his play. I haven't felt his conduct has been inauthentic yet though. I believe him.

i'm leaving in a few minutes but i think i can get behind this perspective

i want to look through and actually see if what you're saying matches up to how he's playing, but it follows logically

[Tangrowth]

That’s a good point about MP, Infected alien. I don’t recall him being so eager to lock people in during previous games — in fact, in Easter he talked himself into just about everybody being scum at different points before I murdered him. That’s interesting.

What does this mean to you?

Alright Jay, what kind of fucking question is this?

The kind one asks of a player who just called something "interesting" without getting to the point.

Alright alright, I just think... it was a bit noticeable the conviction with which you've been shitting in Mac's cornflakes and I expected more bite here from you, that's all.

[Turnip Head]

Is @ColinIsCool bad? Discuss.

I've already discussed. Whaddya got?

ummm I have nothing, just trying to write gotchya headlines

[Tangrowth]

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

[abyssum]

I am resisting the instinct to give alien a lot of credit for the wall post. I appreciate the effort and even more the against-the-grain look at MP. I have a bit of an allergy to posts formatted in that manner though -- analysis consisting of numerous quotes from numerous players which aren't related by some consistent theme is something I have seen many mafia use to engage the thread actively without needing to have quite the direction and focus that a civilian needs.

This doesn't mean I find alien suspicious. I don't really. I am just holding up my garlic cloves warily.

FWIW he posted in that manner in both games (town in G9 and scum in WC1), so the method of posting at least is very likely NAI.

i didn't play with him in G9, but: do you think that he's actually posting similarly to the way he did in WC1? or is this just referring to the formatting?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Is @ColinIsCool bad? Discuss.

I've already discussed. Whaddya got?

ummm I have nothing, just trying to write gotchya headlines

Victimized by clickbait.

[ColinIsCool]

That’s a good point about MP, Infected alien. I don’t recall him being so eager to lock people in during previous games — in fact, in Easter he talked himself into just about everybody being scum at different points before I murdered him. That’s interesting.

What does this mean to you?

Alright Jay, what kind of fucking question is this?

The kind one asks of a player who just called something "interesting" without getting to the point.

Alright alright, I just think... it was a bit noticeable the conviction with which you've been shitting in Mac's cornflakes and I expected more bite here from you, that's all.

Jay’s just warming up. It’s been a while. Having seen my place in his rainbow list, I am turning my cornflake vigilance up to 11.

[Infected_alien8_]

In response to stuff in Alien's wall:

Spoiler: show

Hey everyone!

Pleased to meet you all, very excited to play this game with everyone!

I've read through the thread and I'm suspicious of M Plus 7, slight town-read on Tsai, I want to town-read Jagged but M Plus 7 says they're good at acting Townie so I'm a bit reluctant to do that but I've felt like they've been genuinely hunting so far rather than faking it, and I wanted to town-read Mac based on tone but I think they might have possibly slipped?

M Plus 7 suspicion is, in a nut-shell, that I think they're being too eager to town-read people compared to in other games, and I'm not getting the sense they're genuinely trying to solve. The lack of questions is also concerning but I've not really got any questions myself either yet so I can be sympathetic about that.

Some quotes:

Yeah Tsaiah is pure. I’m locking this for now.

Seems a bit too eager to lock in a town-read? Especially since he hasn't played much with her. And looking through their ISO I really don't know where he's getting that from.

I'll work on that meta post now, but I will also continue to engage anyone in here in real time. Let's get this game fucking rolling. I want to crush the scum. Let's make them drown under genuine solving content.

The "drown under genuine solving content" pings me, though I'm having a hard time understanding why exactly that is.

Lol, what timing.

What makes you assess his poo flinging so far as fake? As you and I both know, it's in character as either alignment. What should I be looking for re: Mac this early? Give me all of your thoughts, Jay.

Poo flinging is great. We should all do it. It should also bear some kind of capacity for response, or at least be traceable to some tangible inspiration. Mac's poo is randomized. I have no idea why those posts he highlighted suggested the alignments he tacked onto them.

So is mac's poo being random not a part of his usual meta, is it usually more focused? Because if so, M Plus 7 not picking up on that would be strange, but Mac seems to disagree with you here so not sure what to make of that yet.

You're in full King of Fuck Mountain mode right now, and I'm just loving it.

Let's solve this game, Jay. We can win.

I've had a long break, and I am sick of you taking all the glory.

With you and I as town and in full solving mode, we can crush this game. I'm fucking stoked.

Again seems a bit eager to assume Jay as Town.

Kylemii has had the best entrance so far. I know he gave me shit for this sort of read in the hydra game, but I stand by something similar here.

I still think it seems wrong, but the fact that you were at least apparently right back then without any prior knowledge makes it possible it might be a real divergence in my types of bullshit, or at least that you think it's real, if that makes sense.

You're bad, aren't you?

Feels a bit like he felt it was necessary to throw in a non-town read in somewhere, because I don't know why he thinks that, he didn't elaborate on it, and didn't ask a question which I think could actually sort their alignment.

If Jay and Tsaiah are both scum this game, I will cry myself to sleep for weeks.

Again a bit too eager on town-reading them, I'm really not sure where it's coming from because he said Jay can fake Mafia really well and I'm really not sure where his Tsaiah tone read is coming from, mostly because I just don't see it at all, and that combined with the fact he hasn't played with them much makes me think this is fake.

Jay is one of the best players I've ever known, and he can fake being town really fucking well, but he's oozing town right now. Locking this in.

It might be just due to difference of style on this site because he knows people better here, but I don't recall him ever 'locking' someone as Town and he was very much 'we must always reassess constantly', and I don't get that impression at all from him so far, so I'm thinking he's not actually a paranoid townie who doesn't know anyone's alignments.

Some early thoughts

M Plus 7 - i can feel the wind from his tail wagging so hard the way over here, eee. While i think he'd be excitable as scum, too, i think the direction that's gone in this particular game is just oozing with how happy he is to get to be playing for the first time with certain people, and in that, the emphasis is clearly on him being excited that those certain people could actually be town like he clearly wants them to be. Serious read, and unexpected--i thought i was gonna be terrified in a but oh god what if he's scum sorta way coming in, but damn if i don't feel like he's probably just town already, AND i'm comfortable with the feeling

JaggedJimmyJay - came in equally comfortable with joking around and with getting down to brass tacks solving (and doing both concurrently), not a bit of it feels forced, i feel like he's seeking out potential paths to sniff his way down without it feeling like he's reaching for minutiae

Kylemii - i do like the way he engaged me, i would've liked it better if he'd actually told me something about himself in his reply (tho i laughed), i'm most interested right now in seeing what he does or doesn't do with the replies he recieves there

Yay, you are town, aren't you?

Another really quick town-read that he doesn't actually explain, which again I find a bit suspicious. Feels like he's trying to pocket people.

At the same time, I'm not sure he'd try to town-read loads of people if he's Mafia because he's just decreasing the pool of mislynches, so that's making me reconsider. But I still find it really strange.

@ Tsaiah, do you have any suspicions of note yet?

Nope. Just some people that I'm trying to get to know, and some people that I'm watching to see what they do next, with some overlap between the two.

I'm a townhunter, on d1 I'm primarily looking for other town (while simultaneously trying to not put any scum in my townreads). My end-of-first day reads have been historically pretty accurate (like if i have ~6 or 7 decently strong townreads, there may be that one inevitable scum hiding among them. Occasionally none, and then that one game that i'm still pissed about, there were two xD)

TOWN HUNTERS UNITE

HIGH FIVE

I guess if his meta here is as a town hunter his behaviour regarding that makes sense but I'm pretty sure he was much less 'town-huntery' in the champs games.

MP
Tsaiah

You ain't posted yet, shit

Kyle
Colin

Mac
abyssum
DH

I forgot that you actually suck at Mafia now. Sucks to be you.

My reads aren’t terribly different from those you’ve provided. Also you know I’m a civilian.

Don't poke the bear Jay. For me to know you are a civilian would require me to be Mafia which I am not you curmudgeon.

Despite the rest of mac's post making me feel he's Town, this could be a slip here - he's assuming Jay is Town and not Mafia, because if he's Town, imagining being Mafia still leads to the possibility of him them being Mafia partners, but he ignores that scenario.

Some early thoughts

M Plus 7 - i can feel the wind from his tail wagging so hard the way over here, eee. While i think he'd be excitable as scum, too, i think the direction that's gone in this particular game is just oozing with how happy he is to get to be playing for the first time with certain people, and in that, the emphasis is clearly on him being excited that those certain people could actually be town like he clearly wants them to be. Serious read, and unexpected--i thought i was gonna be terrified in a but oh god what if he's scum sorta way coming in, but damn if i don't feel like he's probably just town already, AND i'm comfortable with the feeling

JaggedJimmyJay - came in equally comfortable with joking around and with getting down to brass tacks solving (and doing both concurrently), not a bit of it feels forced, i feel like he's seeking out potential paths to sniff his way down without it feeling like he's reaching for minutiae

Kylemii - i do like the way he engaged me, i would've liked it better if he'd actually told me something about himself in his reply (tho i laughed), i'm most interested right now in seeing what he does or doesn't do with the replies he recieves there

I like this post because it feels genuine to me, the M Plus 7 read feels almost too elaborate and complex to be faked, so I slightly town-read Tsaiah because of this I think.

@abyssum -- ISO
@Infected_alien8_
@JaggedJimmyJay
@RobotNerd277
@Russtifinko

plz also tell me ur history?

Hi! I guess my history would be that I started playing a couple years ago, mostly closed setups with my friends so we all knew each other pretty well so it was quite meta-orientated, then joined the champs this year and met M Plus 7 and now I'm here. Is that okay or did you want something else?

--

Sorry M Plus 7, I do feel sort of like I've just come into the thread focusing on you, I guess because I know you more, but those are my initial thoughts.

Re: eager to lock in town players... I mean, yeah? That's me in a nutshell in the early game and just in general. I always think I'm better at finding someone as town than I am as scum, and this has actually led to some interesting discussions with other players (namely Mac because when we first started playing we had some headbutting since he works the exact oppositely). So yeah, I really am eager to do so. It's how I approach the early game. I do feel like I did that in Champs too but you're probably right that I'm substantially more eager here. I think that's a product of a few reasons; in Champs I often didn't know anyone, whereas here I know all of you in at least some way, a decent amount of you very well. It's also a different environment. I did lead the thread at MU and in Champs, but I take it upon myself to be token thread leader here by default and one of the ways I can start feeling like I'm progressing the game forward in the early stages is by identifying other town. In addition, Jay and Tsaiah specifically are players that not only do that as well (hunt by finding other town in the early stages), but IMO are good at doing so, and I LOVE working with Jay and have been very much looking forward to working with Tsaiah. You better bet I'll keep reassessing them every second. But for now I feel confident enough in them being "locked" town for now, and perhaps you're getting caught on that terminology. By no means does that mean I'm not even reassessing them right now. It just means I feel confident calling them town at this stage in the game. Hope this makes sense.

Re: Mac... lol, Mac and I have an interesting relationship. I have a hard time getting my head wrapped around him. I always want to work with him but historically we have found ourselves at odds with each other especially in the early game. I have a really hard time evaluating his early game because his poo flinging always seems random to me to at least some extent. Jay seems to think differently, and I'm inclined to think that he genuinely believes he can detect a difference, so I'm all for considering his perspective. Otherwise I personally have a hard time sorting Mac until we've been able to interact with each other significantly and he shifts into hardcore mode.

Re: the question at Kyle, it was pretty weak; just an indication that I was doubting my town read on him a bit there. I clarified in my subsequent rainbow list though that he's still in the slight town placement. It's a tone read. He'll likely fall to null if I don't see anything particularly inspiring soon though or can connect with him in some way.

Let me know if this helps address any of your concerns or if you want to engage further. Glad to be playing with you and your walls! Lol. Do note though if you want there is a spoiler tag and it's pretty easy to use so that might be helpful if you want to keep responding this way!

Alright, thank you for your response.

For those of you who play with M Plus 7 here, do you agree with his first paragraph by the way, is he usually like this here with people he knows?

And RE the Mac thing, why are you inclined to believe Jay genuinely believes he can detect a difference? Just a feeling or is there another reason?

Now that MP has answered for himself, I wish to expand with my external perspective of why his play to this point bears a civilian appearance:

He has just emerged from both of the two most intense Mafia games he has ever played in (he can protest that claim if he sees fit). He was a civilian in both of them. He reached an immense post count greater than any ever seen on the site he started in both of them. He reached the final three in both of them. Despite losing the first, he still advanced to a wild card game, and then bettered his performance in every arena of play. He just won the most intense game of his life, as the final voter, the game clincher, and his confidence is soaring.

Now he has an opportunity to play in a similarly vanilla-heavy mafia game on his home turf, both with players from those games and others he has known quite a lot longer, and exercise the skills he developed in those champions games here. It is visible in his behavior, and it is something I recognize keenly. I behaved quite similarly when I returned from my Season 2 appearance in that tournament, with my own confidence soaring, ready to show my old Mafia Mates what I had learned in my excursion to the "big leagues" (forgive my cheesiness).

These are things which may still be expressed in a mafioso MP, and I will remain vigilant in my considerations of his play. I haven't felt his conduct has been inauthentic yet though. I believe him.

I get all of your thoughts there - not that I necessarily see that same confidence-soaring thing you're talking about, but I think that, if he did have that, he'd have it regardless of alignment. Is there something about it in particular you think makes it more likely to come from his as Town? I know you said it 'may still be expressed in a mafioso MP', but I'm getting the impression you think it's more likely to come from him as Town - why is that? Or is your whole case just the end part, that you believe him?

Also, I don't suppose you could quote the posts of his which give you the impression of the confidence thing could you please, or is it not specific posts, just a general impression?

[Tangrowth]

I’m not voting for new players out of courtesy. After D1, though, your ass is grass.

I'd prefer to do this as well but we'll see how it shakes out. If I really think one of them is the best use of the lynch I would still endorse it.

[ColinIsCool]

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

I’m afraid of supertown posters.

[Tangrowth]

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

He seemed to offer the most uncertainty or least-presciptive-descriptions (?) for those three, so as to maybe not call attention to their scum metas or make their lives harder by boxing them into something.

That's probably fair, but it's really just that I feel least confident in my ability to read those three.

[abyssum]

I’m not voting for new players out of courtesy. After D1, though, your ass is grass.

i, for one, am excited

[Tangrowth]

Is @ColinIsCool bad? Discuss.

I'm torn currently. I dislike how he could be piggybacking off of Alien's suspicion of me and his early posts/entrance were ehhh.

I am getting a good gut feeling from him right now though, and I think his theory about my teammates thing displays an unconventional hunting perspective that's more likely coming from town!Colin.

[abyssum]

alright, time to housework

bbl

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

my not-so-hot early reads: alien, tsaiah, jay likely to be town

alien for that Interesting wall post that i'm not going to respond to until i see MP7 do so. this may have an element of being biased to recent games, since alien was scum in WC1 and he was notably sort of timid. @Infected_alien8_ this is your first game here, right? (can't say i agree about the slip, though)

jay for lines of questioning; i like the stankbutt accusation/thread because it tickles my funny bone and also makes some sort of sense. super liable to change but being a fan of my avatar is a bonus anyway

tsaiah is the one of the weaker reads outta these, because she has no problems faking tone as scum, but i like her read on MP7 even though i don't fully agree with it yet. not only do i think MP7 would be excitable as scum or town in this playerlist, i think that his posting comes off as sort of pressured and a lot of the content so far isn't really dealing with This Game, which makes excitability/thoughts/etc easier to fake. TBD

What do you mean exactly? I'm too fluffy?

you're not 'too' anything, i just don't think that what you've posted so far is automatically town-indicative, and i wanna ENGAGE you before i start slapping a townread on you (which isn't a thing i've been around enough to do yet, so my bad on that front. i'll try to be more once i've completed some housework)

it's just. being excitable + posting about meta + talking about players isn't auto "yes you're town" in my book, if that makes sense

Yeah, I get that for sure. Thanks for explaining.

[Tangrowth]

I am resisting the instinct to give alien a lot of credit for the wall post. I appreciate the effort and even more the against-the-grain look at MP. I have a bit of an allergy to posts formatted in that manner though -- analysis consisting of numerous quotes from numerous players which aren't related by some consistent theme is something I have seen many mafia use to engage the thread actively without needing to have quite the direction and focus that a civilian needs.

This doesn't mean I find alien suspicious. I don't really. I am just holding up my garlic cloves warily.

FWIW he posted in that manner in both games (town in G9 and scum in WC1), so the method of posting at least is very likely NAI.

i didn't play with him in G9, but: do you think that he's actually posting similarly to the way he did in WC1? or is this just referring to the formatting?

Sorry, just the formatting is what I meant.

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

That’s a good point about MP, Infected alien. I don’t recall him being so eager to lock people in during previous games — in fact, in Easter he talked himself into just about everybody being scum at different points before I murdered him. That’s interesting.

What does this mean to you?

Alright Jay, what kind of fucking question is this?

The kind one asks of a player who just called something "interesting" without getting to the point.

Alright alright, I just think... it was a bit noticeable the conviction with which you've been shitting in Mac's cornflakes and I expected more bite here from you, that's all.

Jay’s just warming up. It’s been a while. Having seen my place in his rainbow list, I am turning my cornflake vigilance up to 11.

I'm confused. Are you defending him here or saying you don't like him?

[Infected_alien8_]

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

He seemed to offer the most uncertainty or least-presciptive-descriptions (?) for those three, so as to maybe not call attention to their scum metas or make their lives harder by boxing them into something.

I like this post, feels like genuine solving, to take it a step further and analyze his meta post in that way, and I can see where'd he'd reach those conclusions. Fakeable as Mafia but I want to give him a couple townie points for this.

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

Another post that pings me - where's your questioning? I feel like as Town you'd ask for reasons for the teammate thing to get inside his head more, but you didn't. I feel like I'm tunnelling you hard but I just don't see you sorting people like I've seen you do in the past, where you questioned everyone about lots of things.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I get all of your thoughts there - not that I necessarily see that same confidence-soaring thing you're talking about, but I think that, if he did have that, he'd have it regardless of alignment. Is there something about it in particular you think makes it more likely to come from his as Town? I know you said it 'may still be expressed in a mafioso MP', but I'm getting the impression you think it's more likely to come from him as Town - why is that? Or is your whole case just the end part, that you believe him?

Also, I don't suppose you could quote the posts of his which give you the impression of the confidence thing could you please, or is it not specific posts, just a general impression?

I think some of the posts you highlighted in which he expressed confident town reads are expressions of MP's soaring confidence:

Yeah Tsaiah is pure. I’m locking this for now.

Jay is one of the best players I've ever known, and he can fake being town really fucking well, but he's oozing town right now. Locking this in.

There is plenty of room for someone to see these posts and say "M Plus 7 is attempting to buddy Tsaiah and JJJ". That is technically valid. If MP is a mafioso though, he is well aware of that potential existing in any instance wherein he awards civilian credit to whoever. If things are truly so blatant, then I give him credit for playing with such gumption. I think that's a less likely reality than this one though:

MP's confidence is soaring after his last two games in the tournament, and he is more able to overcome his often turbulent nature and assert confidence in reads that may not generate such confidence in a different reality (where MP did not just experience what he did on MU). He's on top of his game, and at least for the moment -- he isn't afraid to state his perspective with a tone of command and presence. He isn't afraid of being wrong on Day 0. He isn't afraid of building an early civilian core comprised of players he knows will work hard alongside him. To his credit, I think that's a positive motion for him as a player.

[Tangrowth]

And RE the Mac thing, why are you inclined to believe Jay genuinely believes he can detect a difference? Just a feeling or is there another reason?

Jay and Mac have a very particular and long history. They both played on RYM long before ever coming here. I think they probably have more history with each other than... maybe any other two pairing of players specifically in this game? *thinks* Yeah, possibly so, even if that's hard to confidently assess. I think Jay could speak to that in much greater detail than I could. I'd like to think I know Mac rather well, but Jay knows him much better.

Based on games that the three of us have played together as well, I think Jay has displayed an ability to confident burrow inside Mac's head than I ever could dream of, and vice versa for that matter to some extent anyway.

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

I’m afraid of supertown posters.

But you always seem to focus more on me than all the others. Lol. I DON'T GET IT

[Infected_alien8_]

I get all of your thoughts there - not that I necessarily see that same confidence-soaring thing you're talking about, but I think that, if he did have that, he'd have it regardless of alignment. Is there something about it in particular you think makes it more likely to come from his as Town? I know you said it 'may still be expressed in a mafioso MP', but I'm getting the impression you think it's more likely to come from him as Town - why is that? Or is your whole case just the end part, that you believe him?

Also, I don't suppose you could quote the posts of his which give you the impression of the confidence thing could you please, or is it not specific posts, just a general impression?

I think some of the posts you highlighted in which he expressed confident town reads are expressions of MP's soaring confidence:

Yeah Tsaiah is pure. I’m locking this for now.

Jay is one of the best players I've ever known, and he can fake being town really fucking well, but he's oozing town right now. Locking this in.

There is plenty of room for someone to see these posts and say "M Plus 7 is attempting to buddy Tsaiah and JJJ". That is technically valid. If MP is a mafioso though, he is well aware of that potential existing in any instance wherein he awards civilian credit to whoever. If things are truly so blatant, then I give him credit for playing with such gumption. I think that's a less likely reality than this one though:

MP's confidence is soaring after his last two games in the tournament, and he is more able to overcome his often turbulent nature and assert confidence in reads that may not generate such confidence in a different reality (where MP did not just experience what he did on MU). He's on top of his game, and at least for the moment -- he isn't afraid to state his perspective with a tone of command and presence. He isn't afraid of being wrong on Day 0. He isn't afraid of building an early civilian core comprised of players he knows will work hard alongside him. To his credit, I think that's a positive motion for him as a player.

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

[Infected_alien8_]

And RE the Mac thing, why are you inclined to believe Jay genuinely believes he can detect a difference? Just a feeling or is there another reason?

Jay and Mac have a very particular and long history. They both played on RYM long before ever coming here. I think they probably have more history with each other than... maybe any other two pairing of players specifically in this game? *thinks* Yeah, possibly so, even if that's hard to confidently assess. I think Jay could speak to that in much greater detail than I could. I'd like to think I know Mac rather well, but Jay knows him much better.

Based on games that the three of us have played together as well, I think Jay has displayed an ability to confident burrow inside Mac's head than I ever could dream of, and vice versa for that matter to some extent anyway.

Ah okay, thank you

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Mac can be a tough nut to crack. Making that happen requires persistence and the proper tooling.

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

He seemed to offer the most uncertainty or least-presciptive-descriptions (?) for those three, so as to maybe not call attention to their scum metas or make their lives harder by boxing them into something.

I like this post, feels like genuine solving, to take it a step further and analyze his meta post in that way, and I can see where'd he'd reach those conclusions. Fakeable as Mafia but I want to give him a couple townie points for this.

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

Another post that pings me - where's your questioning? I feel like as Town you'd ask for reasons for the teammate thing to get inside his head more, but you didn't. I feel like I'm tunnelling you hard but I just don't see you sorting people like I've seen you do in the past, where you questioned everyone about lots of things.

Holy shit man, I'm getting there, lol.

I'm trying to get Colin to open up. I have a different way of trying to get in his head after Easter in particular I'm trying to work out. Just because I throw out a soft or fluffy question doesn't mean I'm not trying to get there with someone necessarily. I like to think every bit of word vomit I post serves some purpose... even if occasionally only to just entertain. Lol.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

[Tangrowth]

Mac can be a tough nut to crack. Making that happen requires persistence and the proper tooling.

You're telling me.

[Infected_alien8_]

Spoiler: show

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

He seemed to offer the most uncertainty or least-presciptive-descriptions (?) for those three, so as to maybe not call attention to their scum metas or make their lives harder by boxing them into something.

I like this post, feels like genuine solving, to take it a step further and analyze his meta post in that way, and I can see where'd he'd reach those conclusions. Fakeable as Mafia but I want to give him a couple townie points for this.

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

Another post that pings me - where's your questioning? I feel like as Town you'd ask for reasons for the teammate thing to get inside his head more, but you didn't. I feel like I'm tunnelling you hard but I just don't see you sorting people like I've seen you do in the past, where you questioned everyone about lots of things.

Holy shit man, I'm getting there, lol.

I'm trying to get Colin to open up. I have a different way of trying to get in his head after Easter in particular I'm trying to work out. Just because I throw out a soft or fluffy question doesn't mean I'm not trying to get there with someone necessarily. I like to think every bit of word vomit I post serves some purpose... even if occasionally only to just entertain. Lol.

Okay. What happened in Easter that made you want to change your method of getting inside his head if you don't mind explaining that?

[Tangrowth]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

I really do have a serious problem. I should have gone back to work already.

I saw your rainbow by the way. I'll throw one of my own down here in a few minutes... then I should go for a while.

[Infected_alien8_]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

Alright, thanks. That perspective does make sense to me, but I can also see worlds where he does this as Mafia, either because he's aware he might need to come off as more confident, or because he's confident enough to pocket people, so I don't want to give too much credit to that theory personally

[Infected_alien8_]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

I really do have a serious problem. I should have gone back to work already.

I saw your rainbow by the way. I'll throw one of my own down here in a few minutes... then I should go for a while.

Hahaha, well without your many posts games wouldn't be as interesting so I wouldn't see it as a 'problem'

[DharmaHelper]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

I really do have a serious problem. I should have gone back to work already.

I saw your rainbow by the way. I'll throw one of my own down here in a few minutes... then I should go for a while.

Search found 137 matches

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Tell me more.

He seemed to offer the most uncertainty or least-presciptive-descriptions (?) for those three, so as to maybe not call attention to their scum metas or make their lives harder by boxing them into something.

I like this post, feels like genuine solving, to take it a step further and analyze his meta post in that way, and I can see where'd he'd reach those conclusions. Fakeable as Mafia but I want to give him a couple townie points for this.

Feel mostly good about:

Infected alien
Mac
Jay, but less so

Idk about:

Everybody except for MP, who is on notice.

If MP is bad, skimming his massive post suggests to me that his teammate(s) are either Kyle, Luna or RobotNerd.

Colin why do you do this to me

Another post that pings me - where's your questioning? I feel like as Town you'd ask for reasons for the teammate thing to get inside his head more, but you didn't. I feel like I'm tunnelling you hard but I just don't see you sorting people like I've seen you do in the past, where you questioned everyone about lots of things.

Holy shit man, I'm getting there, lol.

I'm trying to get Colin to open up. I have a different way of trying to get in his head after Easter in particular I'm trying to work out. Just because I throw out a soft or fluffy question doesn't mean I'm not trying to get there with someone necessarily. I like to think every bit of word vomit I post serves some purpose... even if occasionally only to just entertain. Lol.

Okay. What happened in Easter that made you want to change your method of getting inside his head if you don't mind explaining that?

It's... hard to explain probably to anyone who didn't play it, but I'll try my best.

In that game, I was town, and Colin was scum. He played very well and was consistently in the top 5 (probably top 3) posters every phase; even if he wasn't leading town, he had solid reads and was contributing heavily in a game that outposted expectations by quite a bit. In my assessment, he played a very calculated game where he managed to always shift his opinions subtly with the tide of the thread and yet do so in a very organic seeming manner and with solid tone. I feel like he really blossomed into a scary player in that game. Nonetheless for much of the game I felt something was "off" with him but I kept wavering and just didn't get around to confidently leading a lynch on him specifically before I got NKed. In a way you could almost say it was similar to the dynamic town!me had with scum! you in WC1, if that makes sense.

He's a tough player to read. If anything he might have a little bit of that 'seems more naturally scummy when town and townie when scum' thing going on but I haven't played enough with him directly to confirm that.

Every time I tried to get inside his head in Easter, I felt like he always had a reasonable explanation. So my gut would be pinged, I'd inquire, and then I'd let it go despite any misgivings. I'm trying to get around that this time in any way I can.

[Infected_alien8_]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

Alright, thanks. That perspective does make sense to me, but I can also see worlds where he does this as Mafia, either because he's aware he might need to come off as more confident, or because he's confident enough to pocket people, so I don't want to give too much credit to that theory personally

Also, although I get your perspective of 'confidence in reads could be coming from confidence after winning those games', personally that isn't my impression, it feels more like he's just town-reading people because he's trying to post content but struggling to genuinely find things suspicious/worthy of questioning as Mafia or wanting to pocket them, the 'confidence from champs' thing isn't something I sense personally either

[Tangrowth]

Alright, rainbow time, then I really should bounce for a while. I'll likely be back tonight inevitably though because I can't help myself.

[Tangrowth]

Okay, thanks. So basically, you think it seems reasonable that he's confident due to his past games, and therefore, as a Townie, that confidence would translate into confident reads, whereas as Mafia he'd be more cautious?

That's my best guess, yes.

The nice thing about MP is that he is never going to stop posting, even when he shouldn't be posting, and we'll have every opportunity to critically assess whatever he is doing.

Alright, thanks. That perspective does make sense to me, but I can also see worlds where he does this as Mafia, either because he's aware he might need to come off as more confident, or because he's confident enough to pocket people, so I don't want to give too much credit to that theory personally

Also, although I get your perspective of 'confidence in reads could be coming from confidence after winning those games', personally that isn't my impression, it feels more like he's just town-reading people because he's trying to post content but struggling to genuinely find things suspicious/worthy of questioning as Mafia or wanting to pocket them, the 'confidence from champs' thing isn't something I sense personally either

UGH, STOP. Lol. That is not true. Where are you getting this impression? How can clarify anything I've said so far?

[ColinIsCool]

Spoiler: show

That’s a good point about MP, Infected alien. I don’t recall him being so eager to lock people in during previous games — in fact, in Easter he talked himself into just about everybody being scum at different points before I murdered him. That’s interesting.

What does this mean to you?

Alright Jay, what kind of fucking question is this?

The kind one asks of a player who just called something "interesting" without getting to the point.

Alright alright, I just think... it was a bit noticeable the conviction with which you've been shitting in Mac's cornflakes and I expected more bite here from you, that's all.

Jay’s just warming up. It’s been a while. Having seen my place in his rainbow list, I am turning my cornflake vigilance up to 11.

I'm confused. Are you defending him here or saying you don't like him?

I’m saying I’m girding my loins for a future assault from Mr. Jay

[Tangrowth]

We'll have to try to chat more in real time another time Alien because I really have overstayed my time here. But I am destined to hammer this out with you because the impressions you are getting from me are mistaken, and I really don't want us to play another game where we're doing this, LOL.

[DharmaHelper]

[mention]Spacedaisy[/mention] come get your man he's having a nervous breakdown he's rambled about something called a rainbow list for at least 3 hours and theres no such thing anywhere in sight.