DFS Mafia [ENDGAME]

[Tangrowth]

AHHHHHHHH

[Tangrowth]

And that should have been green probably but technically it does relate to why I’m in here so often even though I need to work

I can’t even

*slams head against desk*

[Tangrowth]

Does picking apart Mac’s rainbow list look like scumhunting, or an attempt to discredit? Others should weigh in.

Which do YOU think it is Colin?

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

This is me:



I DON'T KNOW HOW TO STOP
I DON'T KNOW HOW TO STOP

Seriously, someone fucking yell at me if I come back in here... any time within the next few hours. I'll be back this afternoon at the earliest?

This is me:

Damn nice choice.

[Tangrowth]

I look forward to hearing what you find, DH.

As for myself, I clearly need to take a break from this game most of tomorrow, so we'll see how long I can accomplish that.

Such a fucking lie.

What's the lie?

Guarantee you post 15 times in a row at least twice tomorrow in a 2 hour period.

Nostradumbass.

HEY!

You said 15 times in a row! I have not done that yet!

[Tangrowth]

I think my giant catchup posts are proving detrimental to actually catching up so I'm gonna not do that and instead skim the last several pages and hopefully eventually get back to the beginning of the thread and have time to iso colin and mac. I haven't read anything since daystart and I should fix that immediately.

Robot you should either just ISO me or ignore me completely because I'm pretty sure I'm like over 1/3 of the entire thread myself. Not sure which is more conducive to understanding what happens in the thread.

[Tangrowth]

Dammit guys I’m going to need your help to avoid 15 posts in a row. It’s like speed. If my speed drops below so much I EXPLODE. Let’s not let me post too much in a row. That means I need you all in here and kicking ass.

No one wants to pick up pieces of exploded sock everywhere.

I don’t think I could have a better note to exit again than this, so here we are. BBL.

it would help if you just stopped doing speed

i know you're probably doing mine because i'm first alphabetically but i'm going to pretend it's because you just find me that compelling

WC1 just ended and I was already suffering withdrawal from your sense of humor. Glad you could scratch the itch.

[Tangrowth]

Fuck is this close to 15 yet?

*reaching explosion point*

Be back later. I WILL GET THIS FUCKING WIFI WORKING

[Dragon D. Luffy]

socky.exe has stopped working.

[ColinIsCool]

Does picking apart Mac’s rainbow list look like scumhunting, or an attempt to discredit? Others should weigh in.

Which do YOU think it is Colin?

The latter, although a read of sprit’s ISO is in order if I want to be confident.

[sprityo]

Does picking apart Mac’s rainbow list look like scumhunting, or an attempt to discredit? Others should weigh in.

Which do YOU think it is Colin?

The latter, although a read of sprit’s ISO is in order if I want to be confident.

shouldnt take you more than half an hour. I've got little to nothing

[RobotNerd277]

I think my giant catchup posts are proving detrimental to actually catching up so I'm gonna not do that and instead skim the last several pages and hopefully eventually get back to the beginning of the thread and have time to iso colin and mac. I haven't read anything since daystart and I should fix that immediately.

Robot you should either just ISO me or ignore me completely because I'm pretty sure I'm like over 1/3 of the entire thread myself. Not sure which is more conducive to understanding what happens in the thread.

Yeah sorry I'm ignoring you.

[Tangrowth]

I think my giant catchup posts are proving detrimental to actually catching up so I'm gonna not do that and instead skim the last several pages and hopefully eventually get back to the beginning of the thread and have time to iso colin and mac. I haven't read anything since daystart and I should fix that immediately.

Robot you should either just ISO me or ignore me completely because I'm pretty sure I'm like over 1/3 of the entire thread myself. Not sure which is more conducive to understanding what happens in the thread.

Yeah sorry I'm ignoring you.

[Tangrowth]

pay attention to meeeeeeee

[Tangrowth]

Looks like I might have figured out the wifi problem? (too many devices connected tends to fuck it up? maybe?)

So see you all... never. I'm never showing back up. I'll be doing all of the work.

[RobotNerd277]

I think my giant catchup posts are proving detrimental to actually catching up so I'm gonna not do that and instead skim the last several pages and hopefully eventually get back to the beginning of the thread and have time to iso colin and mac. I haven't read anything since daystart and I should fix that immediately.

Robot you should either just ISO me or ignore me completely because I'm pretty sure I'm like over 1/3 of the entire thread myself. Not sure which is more conducive to understanding what happens in the thread.

Yeah sorry I'm ignoring you.

not quiiite true, but I'm mostly reading your posts when someone else quotes them, or you quote someone else. The ones that aren't quoted are less likely to be information-dense anyways probably I think.

Good luck with work!

[sprityo]

At which i finally look into 180 (million) JJJ posts:

I

Spoiler: show

mmediately, provides reads with a reason. minimal fluff. Just by how he starts i can tell he has a willingness to solve and does so with MP and Tsaiah. You could effectively lump them together.

A trend with each individual player entering the thread is Jay is interacting and giving an immediate read.

Jay is pushing for DH to interact and he is getting a steady resistance to it, therefore the rift between them is formed and there's now the current beef. Normally if there were other avenues of approach I would question this, but it's more so by the lack there-of that makes his pursuit look legitimate. I don't think DH not posting is alignment indicative though, same to do with Marmot.

So we get this big defensive post, which can be from a neutral position, but i dont see it like that. I dont think jay would be the person to give points and cred to the highest posting player in the game to give himself credit.

Here we get the smackdown against mac.

Spoiler: show

I do have one comment.

The suggestion that I am to have "scum-slipped" while not understanding the how of it rings false to me. I cannot think of a scenario in which I have ever made a clumsy post as scum and not known immediately afterwards in every way that it could be construed as scum, so to claim I don't understand my own scum slip is a fairly adventurous call. I am meticulous with my posting as scum and will draft and redress all my posts constantly so for me even scum slip would be rare let alone scum slip and not know how.

I would have thought that Jay wouldn't entertain the notion that Mafia Mac is that clumsy, hence why I think it reflects worse on him.

Alien has restated his perceived slip, so you can continue to contend with that notion in that dialogue.

I don't think you slipped. I never claimed otherwise. I am perturbed that you are bringing this poop here now, as it suggests to me that you are reading the thread closely enough to be aware of a general negative atmosphere forming around you, but not closely enough to see the details.

Followed by the DH ISO- which highlights all the non-interaction from DH at that point in time. I dont think there was anything positive to look at in the first place, even so Jay gives him the benefit of the doubt the best he can. Reading it over actually made me think about what mac had said about DH and, it's like he just took the words from jay's mouth. (but this isnt about mac it's about 3Js)

so for this section of the ISO it's a lot of cycling between Mac, Alien, and DH.

I think it's important to frame this notion a very specific way.

It shouldn't be this question: "Does anyone else in this game mind high posting rates as much as DharmaHelper?"

Instead, it should be this question: "Does DharmaHelper believe that anyone else in this game might sympathize with general frustration over the high posting rates?"

In reference to the second question, I do think some names on the player list are applicable as those who DH might appeal to. Marmot, Russtifinko, and Kylemii stand out immediately. Even people like MacDougall, M Plus 7, or myself could be had, theoretically, by an appeal of a player who is struggling to keep up with the game because of us. The newcomers wouldn't apply here. I don't think DH specifically looked at the list and picked out names with some deliberate strategy, but I do think it's a general mindset which is functional enough in this game.

I think this post is kind of a stretch jay. Do you feel obligated to pressure DH to play to your standard?

I should do an ISO of Alien next because it seems like i dont remember much of what he says, yet jay has multiple interactions with him that look neutral on the surface......but i can see jay trying to, idk, see if he'll slip on something.

Something I associate with a civilian sprityo is a willingness to stick his finger of suspicion right in the face of any highly active player, unconcerned about the repercussions. Indeed, I think sig does the same thing, and it's something that contributes to their being wrongly suspected in many games.

I'm not seeing that now, however. sprityo has barely dipped his toes into the water even in the posts that he has made.

(I see it jay), your suspicion (and henceforth vote on me) is coming from me not being a present force. Many apologies. But your vote doesnt seem commital more than it looks to be prodding me for activity, akin to dharmahelper. I'm getting warmed up, just bare......BEAR with me

some fluffy fun stuff at the start of Day 1, but he's soon back on track with harassing DH for the content he was promised. he gets something out of this and drops it before moving on the yours truly.

----------------------------------
So my notes/perception on jay overall is, well very good. He is going around multiple people, tracking multiple engagements across Day 0 and digging deeper into meanings. His reads and more importantly the backing of them are solid and believable. There was only the one thing with DH that looked weird to me, but in comparison to the rest of his content, it's insignificant. I'd like to see anyone paint jay in a negative light, the best youre going to get out of him is a disagreement.

What i want out of jay as of right now is his opinions on colin and kyle since i saw a little bit about them while going through his iso and it looked like he has some small suspicions on them. Take me through your thinking on them if you would do so kindly.

[sprityo]

[mention]M Plus 7[/mention] im gonna ignore you because i would literally more than likely waste my entire day going through your posts. It'd be like re reading jay only with more fluff because yknow.....dog pee.

But i'm sure youre in the same ballfield as JJJ. lots of interactions, constantly trying for input

[DharmaHelper]

I keep getting interrupted trying to read so I'm 60% closer to just saying fuck it and trying to play based on Day 1 forward. *shrug*

[sprityo]

With that i'm gonna try watching this lecture now and try not to tear out my hair

i would say give me some questions/tasks to perform when i get back, but someone is gonna put something vague and i dont have any more ISO's left in me for tonight.]

So ask me to look at a posts or series of posts etc. if you so desire, i aim to please

[Infected_alien8_]

Good morning everyone

Spoiler: show

So since mac wants to be all upset cause of silly jokes ill ISO him first.

I WAS gonna do some school, after yknow being on 24 hours, but fuck that.


----------------------------------------
lets see

Spoiler: show

fluff
fluff
fluff
fluff
fluff
fluff
baseless accusations
fluff'
fluff
fluff
Gets mad a jay because jay claims hes bad
more baseless accusations

Shut up Jay

more complaining about jay

Do you have new gut reads of a more authentic variety now, 500 posts later?

I think you will find that I have been trying to solve the game and making reads despite the unwarranted scrutiny actually.

and by reads you mean gut reads with nothing to back it up besides your fueled volatility

I will reiterate that the only thing I hate is that you have a scum read on me. The logistics of it do not affect my emotions. There are certain players that when their eye turns towards you, your lifespan in the game immediately becomes shorter so forgive me for being immediately in fight or flight mode under duress from you.

and in here we find the basis for mac's first ~40 posts of "content" when its just him having a hissy fit jay wants to call him scum

TL;DR: Mac spends over half his current posts with fluff and complaining about jay. #waste my time 2018

Let's see if everything after this provides a more reasonable and possibly better look for mac:

1. My friend without looking back I cannot even remember who I made reads on and what way that is how much I was bullshitting about them.
youre allowed to bullshit about who good and whos bad while i make one little bullshit poke at you and im threatened at gunpoint train-point?

2. Yes I think your analysis of how Alien dealt with it is astute. The way he accused me and has proceeded to ensure that it came across less provocative than it may has reminds me of the hand in the cookie euphemism. im sure i would like this a lot more if i knew what the "hand in the cookie" euphemism is.

7. I am at work, the fact that I am giving you any of my time should be appreciated rather than taken for granted as not being good enough.
oh hey there president of fuck castle. glad you could grace us with your presence. I for one am enlightened

8. The question I answered was the one that was directed at me specifically in an accusatory tone. The fact that I am at work and peeking in between tasks makes me feel more encouraged to focus on things that relate to me. see above

9. My answer is what it is. An honest appraisal of the situation. What would a non waffly answer have been? dodging the question?

It's day 0 can we please just calm down.

I have made lots of posts that were not jokes and that are commital. Many more than you have for instance.

This is a false narrative. Why are you trying to paint a false narrative against me? Do you tend to do that as town?

ahem: i've made less than 10 posts about stuff that qualifies as content *references 30 posts of jay-complaining*. much more than you, the guy who just now has checked in

youre being mean. why are you making me look bad? do you always do that cause the way im asking these questions paints you as scum without you having to answer


LITERALLY THE ONLY PEOPLE MAC HAS SUSPICIONS ON ARE THE ONES THAT MADE SOME KIND OF POKE, AS A JOKE OR AS A LEGIT REASON, THAT HE CAN EASILY TARGET WITH HIS CRAP BULLYPOSTING
he wont go after jay because jay has already scared him this game with the scum throw-out read.

I'll do a seperate post for his "raindbow list"


so yeah over all that big caps lock statement right there is my exact thoughts on mac

he's not town. and since he is the only person i have a negative read on. he gets my vote [VOTE: Mac] aubergine

You criticise me for having a "hissy fit" because Jay had a scumread on me. How would you describe the tone of your posts about me since I made a scum read of you?
Oh, most certainly the same. I'm not denying you the notion im not upset. that's why i made this whole thing.
What about my posts are "crap bullyposting"?
in your entire list of posts, there is alot of "what?" and snark.
Why did you put rainbow list in quotation marks?
i think it was lazy and you just did it to make SOME kind of alignment indicative post, see below
The five people I was left with suspicions on all made some kind of poke as a joke or legit reason? Really?
see below
This entire post is a strong mix of hyperbole and reducing my game play down to an incorrect series of assumptions to give you a reason to place a vote of me. You forced this entire thing to discredit the player who has voiced the most reasonable doubts about you and your only direct retort to my doubts was to tell me to go to heck.
1. How is a "fuck off" a retort? Second, It cant be "reducing your game play down" if there never was much game play in the first place. "incorrect series of assumptions" would mean i'd have to be wrong. so why am i wrong? youre just saying "youre wrong, youre bad." What's so bad about goign against the biggest contender against myself? If you had perhaps looked actually town-aligned i wouldnt have voted you, but no that's not the case.

in which i look at mac's rainbow post like i said i would earlier

Something didn't make sense about the way Russ and alien interacted with one another after alien accused (but didn't really accuse) me of a scumslip. Sprityo has avoided heat in ways he probably shouldn't have given the level of engagement he has made.i never made any kind of engagement, wtf? There is also an element of POE because I have liked lunalee's content since I gave her a glare. Dharmahelper is also still very much on my radar primarily because he has completely refused to engage me despite me having voiced suspicion on him. Like he is just skirting by the fact that I keep getting my focus placed elsewhere by other players. this is a dumb/selfish reason to suspect a player. like "he hasnt addressed ME about what I think of him"

After giving it some undistracted and focused thought. Here's how I feel currently about each player that will contradict myself so just deal.

@abyssum -- I have little opinion on abyssum. A fair amount contribution and no pings makes me feel like they deserve a town read.
empty
@ColinIsCool -- Colin's contributions here have been poor compared to in other games he has played. Not sure if that's a reason to scum read him given his participation in Firefly. I'll give him a pass for now.
@DharmaHelper -- Suspicious, not for his lack of content but for his avoidance of engaging me directly. see above underlined

@Infected_alien8_ -- Suspicious for his discrediting of me and then backtracking away from it.

@JaggedJimmyJay -- Jay has been a bit more critical than usual and there is history of Jay being overly mean = bad in his exhaustive back catalogue but if push came to shove I would give him a town read. this is you trying to distance from jay even farther.

@Kylemii -- Kyle seems okay at this juncture. Hasn't been an overwhelming contributor but not everyone can have been, has been discerning in his commentary and his opinions have made sense.

@Lunalee -- Lunalee's reactions to being prodded looked good. I think she is town.

@Marmot -- Should be lynched for lack of contribution. And this is new for marmot?

@M Plus 7 -- Seems his usual townie self. Constantly pinging me because he says such nice things to and about people and is so friendly that I as an Australian who is used to calling my friends cunt just cannot deal. I just naturally suspect people who are both loud and buddying. In the past I'd probably have got into a shit slinging match with him after accusing him of sounding insincere and genuinely offending him for what is actually just him being a nice person but I've come to realise that is usually not how I catch bad guys so I hold my tongue.
buddying the buddy
@RobotNerd277 -- Seemed to want to come out firing at me but as soon as I questioned why he melted like butter on a hotplate. Weird and suspicious.
"melted like butter in a hot plate?" You mean he called you out on your bullshit. and then he recognized something he considered worthy enough to be okay, (albeit i never saw what he did)
@Russtifinko -- Giving myself some time to dwell I think Russ is town. When you have nothing to hide and genuinely try to get to the heart of why people are posting certain ways you often leave some weird shit in the thread that people grab onto and find weird. I think that is what Russ has done that has myself and some others a little piqued.
your explanation is convoluted. just say you didnt have a reason to counter MP and move on
@sprityo -- I think Sprityo is Mafia. I think he has been overwhelmed by the volume and is struggling to interject himself because he's being ignored. Perhaps with me having an actual go at him we'll get more out of him.
you might have got me on meta reads alone in retrocasualty. but im not gonna be thrown in a corner and kicked mac.
@Tsaiah -- I find it hard to decide how I feel about Tsaiah except to say that I like the way they play and have enjoyed their contributions. MP giving her such a huge tick of approval bodes well.

@Turnip Head -- Turnip Head hasn't really got rolling into the game yet but has frequently tried to voice opinions and comment on things. I think Turnip Head is town.
literally most of these green people are "i think theyre town cause vague reasons"

Please show me where each of these five players did that. Failure to do so will result in your credibility being completely removed.
I'm coming back to this once im back from dinner.
Also to suggest I am afraid of going after Jay flies in the face of what you know about the way I play so that was also a lie.
You haven't shown you would. Perception is reality, especially via text my guy.

sprityo I read your scum chat from retrocausality. I know what you think of my civ play. I know exactly how you feel right now.

What was it? "Of all the players it had to be MacDougall".

Attacking me here is smart I will give you that. But you shouldn't have lied so much in doing so. Better luck next time.

Again, where have i lied. you havent directly rebuked any of my statements. On top of that, I don't trust past games. a new game is a new life, a breath of fresh air. This posts actually serves nothing more than to discredit me, in ANY sense, town or not. Maybe, consider this for a minute, Im not mafia and im sstanding my ground against your blatant, lazy suspicions

Sprit do you think Mac is suspicious here then? You've made an argument against him but your conclusion is that he has blatant, lazy suspicions, so do you think that makes him Mafia and why?

Also Mac can you elaborate on your russ read please?

[Infected_alien8_]

@abyssum -- ISO
@Infected_alien8_
@JaggedJimmyJay
@RobotNerd277
@Russtifinko

plz also tell me ur history?

I changed my mind on Kyle again. I don’t like this post. Even if he receives thorough responses from each of these people about their “history”, I have my doubts that he’d be likely to apply it to his hunting. It’s a question being asked for the sake of asking a question.

not everything is about hunting, jay. this question has never been about hunting, it's about getting new players into the game and making friends and having a good time, which is why we're all here in the first place.

Fuck you, Kyle!

Okay this made me laugh pretty good.

Same lol

[Infected_alien8_]

I think Alien may have been grasping at straws with that slip talk and has now found themselves in the (unenviable) position of defending and debating a suspicion they knew was bunk. On notice.

I'm not defending it, I don't believe in it myself, I said so right from the moment I pointed it out, or right after. I pointed it out to get other opinions on it.

[Infected_alien8_]

Does picking apart Mac’s rainbow list look like scumhunting, or an attempt to discredit? Others should weigh in.

Unsure where he was going with it, it read more like a defence than anything because of that

[Infected_alien8_]

Spoiler: show

Hi Turnip Head, what makes you say that?

Idk k ask me later

I will. I'm trying to decide if you're town, and attempting to scum-hunt, or if you're mafia and trying to stir up interest on an easy townie lynch. The "Idk k ask me later" answer makes me think it's the latter.

linki MP of course

I get a bad vibe from this post. It feels like a bit of a forced read? Like, it's so easy to find what Turnip did as suspicious but gut-wise I just don't see it as suspicious at all because it's so obviously suspicious, yet Luna is sinking her teeth into it a bit here. This combined with her saying I have a commentary vibe to my posts with little opinions, which I disagree with and makes me wonder if her read there is genuine too, makes me suspicious of her.

what, you think what Turnip Head is doing is too suspicious to even be suspicious? what's your thought process here? why can't Lunalee view this as a legitimate suspicion and comment on it? this almost reads like you're not really suspecting this post but are instead trying to disagree with Luna's read on you without actually just quoting it and saying "no you're wrong."

i should hope you disagree with Luna's less-than-favorable read on you (you know if you have opinions, you know if you've been in commentary mode), but why doesn't THAT read genuine to you? you can't just say that nothing seems genuine without giving any reasons as to why. if you disagree, OK, but lay out why you think that instead of just saying that you're suspicious of Luna. disagreeing with a read doesn't mean that that read came from scum, and not thinking a read is right doesn't mean it's insincere

I think what Turnip head is doing, if he's Mafia, would so obviously make him appear suspicious that I doubt he'd do that on purpose as Mafia, and Luna was implying he was. She can view it as legitimate, I just don't think I buy it, because it feels like a really easy read to make that 9 times out of 10 would not actually be suspicious. It's like going after somebody that seems really obviously low-hanging fruit just because what they're doing is sort of 'scummy' but it's clear they're just new or in their Town meta. Not that that's what's happening here but that's sort of the type of thing I mean.

It doesn't read genuine because it's wrong and I don't understand how they can come to that conclusion if they've been reading my posts because I feel like I've been pretty clear about my opinions and not commenting at all.

point 1: i don't agree. mafia will do plenty of things that look suspicious, because they're mafia. essentially what you're saying here is that you and Lunalee are both viewing an action as suspicious, but you're genuine because you think it wouldn't come from mafia and Lunalee is not genuine because she thinks it could potentially be from mafia. i don't think it's like going after really obvious low-hanging fruit either.

point 2: will wait for Lunalee to comment before i respond to that.

what i'm getting from you rn is that, because you disagree with Lunalee's conclusions (TH could potentially be mafia, alien is in commentary mode), Lunalee is not genuine--her thought process is fake and couldn't come from town.

i can understand more selfish reads. what i don't get the one on the situation with TH. how strong is your townread on Turnip Head, would you say?

Mafia will do plenty of things that look suspicious yeah, but Town will also do some things that are suspicious. If they didn't, this game would be boring and way too easy. It's about deciding which suspicious things are likely to come from Mafia and which aren't. Some things I see as just 'too suspicious to be suspicious'. It's like if someone comes in and says "I'm not reading the thread by the way, just gonna vote M Plus 7 in a bit." You could argue that's suspicious because it makes their life easier as Mafia to do that.

But it's such a bad move if they're actually Mafia because they're just risking getting themself lynched, that it's probably not coming from Mafia. If it is, then it's probably WIFOM, but it's likely it's just a Town being silly. That's sort of what I mean when I say my points on Luna. It feels like they made a really easy read from something that as Town they'd dismiss, because it was low hanging and they could easily grasp onto it in a game where they're struggling for content. It's possible she just genuinely thought it was suspicious but I don't, and I'm struggling to see why she'd genuinely think that.

I don't have a town-read on Turnip, I just don't have a scum-read on him nor do I find those posts suspicious.

[Infected_alien8_]

The "I'm not reading the thread by the way, just gonna vote M Plus 7 in a bit" is probably a bad example actually, but hopefully you get what I mean. Something like "i'm never gonna read the thread, just gonna hop on whatever wagon is popular"

[Infected_alien8_]

Okay I'm caught up now.

How do I vote?

I'm satisfied with russ' answer about what he meant with the revenge lynch, that makes sense to me now

M Plus 7 said to me that his meta is that as Mafia he struggles to make authentic dogpees and I'm convinced that's what I just saw

Aby seems off to me and I'm not sure why, and I don't understand where the town-reads are coming from for her

Luna hasn't posted since so my read on her is the same

Sort of confused as to what to think about GH so I want to wait for him to actually read the thread before making a judgement, the most compelling thing I can remember is the point I think Jay made about him going for the weakest point in his ISO

Everyone else I don't have anything to say about in my memory

How do I vote by the way?

is this off feeling something that came about when i started questioning you about Lunalee/TH?

i know you mean DH but lol

No it was when you were defending M Plus 7 I think.

But overnight I slept on this actually and was going to make a post about it but I may as well do it now - I thought back to your first interaction with him that felt really awkward and weird, and how reluctant you were to form an opinion of him, and how eager you were to defend him, and all of it starting to paint a picture to me where you're his partner.

[Infected_alien8_]

here have my notes sheet that I decided like halfway through that I would post

Spoiler: show

#1065 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 22#p474422
DH keeps commenting on how he hasn't read the thread. This is annoying. I do agree that calling someone a pussy or a coward isn't the same as calling them mafia. That being said, I think JaggedJimmyJay is anything but that.

I'm not liking the JJJ + DH interactions? It reads as both townies, but being really distracting. I'm mostly just annoyed about that, but it doesn't read as scummy from either party.

#1094 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 55#p474455

ooooh spirityo has an iso wall of macdougall. Saves me the trouble for now!

Wait, has macdougall not actually posted a bunch of solid argument stuff? I figured it was somewhere in the 7 pages I hadn't read.

I'm not liking this "only person I have a negative read on" bit from spirityo but I'm still not a fan of mac. There's a lot to pick at in this thread. MP's willingness to throw "town" at people, DH's unwillingness to read the thread etc. Anyways, the end of spirityo's post is a bit yelly but he makes a point against Mac that I agree with. I still want to do my own iso because ~bad vibes~

#1104 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 7b#p474465

Agree with Kylemii. I hope there's an explanatino for how on eart you get a townread on DH.

pseudo-random-neuron-firing -> where's tsaiah?

#1114 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 80#p474480

wonderful, mac responded to spirityo's post. I should also answer those questions when I get around to it, because idk who I believe less tbh, spirityo or mac.

I feel like I should address the "melted like butter on a hot plate" thing but idk what to really say. I intend to take more of a look at Mac later? I probably should have done this last night instead of getting distracted but also whatever the past is in the past.

I... keep skimming over MP's posts. Sorry! I'll probably read what you have to say... eventually!

What about the 'only person I have a negative read on' part don't you like?

[DharmaHelper]

Spoiler: show

Good morning everyone

Spoiler: show

So since mac wants to be all upset cause of silly jokes ill ISO him first.

I WAS gonna do some school, after yknow being on 24 hours, but fuck that.


----------------------------------------
lets see

Spoiler: show

fluff
fluff
fluff
fluff
fluff
fluff
baseless accusations
fluff'
fluff
fluff
Gets mad a jay because jay claims hes bad
more baseless accusations

Shut up Jay

more complaining about jay

Do you have new gut reads of a more authentic variety now, 500 posts later?

I think you will find that I have been trying to solve the game and making reads despite the unwarranted scrutiny actually.

and by reads you mean gut reads with nothing to back it up besides your fueled volatility

I will reiterate that the only thing I hate is that you have a scum read on me. The logistics of it do not affect my emotions. There are certain players that when their eye turns towards you, your lifespan in the game immediately becomes shorter so forgive me for being immediately in fight or flight mode under duress from you.

and in here we find the basis for mac's first ~40 posts of "content" when its just him having a hissy fit jay wants to call him scum

TL;DR: Mac spends over half his current posts with fluff and complaining about jay. #waste my time 2018

Let's see if everything after this provides a more reasonable and possibly better look for mac:

1. My friend without looking back I cannot even remember who I made reads on and what way that is how much I was bullshitting about them.
youre allowed to bullshit about who good and whos bad while i make one little bullshit poke at you and im threatened at gunpoint train-point?

2. Yes I think your analysis of how Alien dealt with it is astute. The way he accused me and has proceeded to ensure that it came across less provocative than it may has reminds me of the hand in the cookie euphemism. im sure i would like this a lot more if i knew what the "hand in the cookie" euphemism is.

7. I am at work, the fact that I am giving you any of my time should be appreciated rather than taken for granted as not being good enough.
oh hey there president of fuck castle. glad you could grace us with your presence. I for one am enlightened

8. The question I answered was the one that was directed at me specifically in an accusatory tone. The fact that I am at work and peeking in between tasks makes me feel more encouraged to focus on things that relate to me. see above

9. My answer is what it is. An honest appraisal of the situation. What would a non waffly answer have been? dodging the question?

It's day 0 can we please just calm down.

I have made lots of posts that were not jokes and that are commital. Many more than you have for instance.

This is a false narrative. Why are you trying to paint a false narrative against me? Do you tend to do that as town?

ahem: i've made less than 10 posts about stuff that qualifies as content *references 30 posts of jay-complaining*. much more than you, the guy who just now has checked in

youre being mean. why are you making me look bad? do you always do that cause the way im asking these questions paints you as scum without you having to answer


LITERALLY THE ONLY PEOPLE MAC HAS SUSPICIONS ON ARE THE ONES THAT MADE SOME KIND OF POKE, AS A JOKE OR AS A LEGIT REASON, THAT HE CAN EASILY TARGET WITH HIS CRAP BULLYPOSTING
he wont go after jay because jay has already scared him this game with the scum throw-out read.

I'll do a seperate post for his "raindbow list"


so yeah over all that big caps lock statement right there is my exact thoughts on mac

he's not town. and since he is the only person i have a negative read on. he gets my vote [VOTE: Mac] aubergine

You criticise me for having a "hissy fit" because Jay had a scumread on me. How would you describe the tone of your posts about me since I made a scum read of you?
Oh, most certainly the same. I'm not denying you the notion im not upset. that's why i made this whole thing.
What about my posts are "crap bullyposting"?
in your entire list of posts, there is alot of "what?" and snark.
Why did you put rainbow list in quotation marks?
i think it was lazy and you just did it to make SOME kind of alignment indicative post, see below
The five people I was left with suspicions on all made some kind of poke as a joke or legit reason? Really?
see below
This entire post is a strong mix of hyperbole and reducing my game play down to an incorrect series of assumptions to give you a reason to place a vote of me. You forced this entire thing to discredit the player who has voiced the most reasonable doubts about you and your only direct retort to my doubts was to tell me to go to heck.
1. How is a "fuck off" a retort? Second, It cant be "reducing your game play down" if there never was much game play in the first place. "incorrect series of assumptions" would mean i'd have to be wrong. so why am i wrong? youre just saying "youre wrong, youre bad." What's so bad about goign against the biggest contender against myself? If you had perhaps looked actually town-aligned i wouldnt have voted you, but no that's not the case.

in which i look at mac's rainbow post like i said i would earlier

Something didn't make sense about the way Russ and alien interacted with one another after alien accused (but didn't really accuse) me of a scumslip. Sprityo has avoided heat in ways he probably shouldn't have given the level of engagement he has made.i never made any kind of engagement, wtf? There is also an element of POE because I have liked lunalee's content since I gave her a glare. Dharmahelper is also still very much on my radar primarily because he has completely refused to engage me despite me having voiced suspicion on him. Like he is just skirting by the fact that I keep getting my focus placed elsewhere by other players. this is a dumb/selfish reason to suspect a player. like "he hasnt addressed ME about what I think of him"

After giving it some undistracted and focused thought. Here's how I feel currently about each player that will contradict myself so just deal.

@abyssum -- I have little opinion on abyssum. A fair amount contribution and no pings makes me feel like they deserve a town read.
empty
@ColinIsCool -- Colin's contributions here have been poor compared to in other games he has played. Not sure if that's a reason to scum read him given his participation in Firefly. I'll give him a pass for now.
@DharmaHelper -- Suspicious, not for his lack of content but for his avoidance of engaging me directly. see above underlined

@Infected_alien8_ -- Suspicious for his discrediting of me and then backtracking away from it.

@JaggedJimmyJay -- Jay has been a bit more critical than usual and there is history of Jay being overly mean = bad in his exhaustive back catalogue but if push came to shove I would give him a town read. this is you trying to distance from jay even farther.

@Kylemii -- Kyle seems okay at this juncture. Hasn't been an overwhelming contributor but not everyone can have been, has been discerning in his commentary and his opinions have made sense.

@Lunalee -- Lunalee's reactions to being prodded looked good. I think she is town.

@Marmot -- Should be lynched for lack of contribution. And this is new for marmot?

@M Plus 7 -- Seems his usual townie self. Constantly pinging me because he says such nice things to and about people and is so friendly that I as an Australian who is used to calling my friends cunt just cannot deal. I just naturally suspect people who are both loud and buddying. In the past I'd probably have got into a shit slinging match with him after accusing him of sounding insincere and genuinely offending him for what is actually just him being a nice person but I've come to realise that is usually not how I catch bad guys so I hold my tongue.
buddying the buddy
@RobotNerd277 -- Seemed to want to come out firing at me but as soon as I questioned why he melted like butter on a hotplate. Weird and suspicious.
"melted like butter in a hot plate?" You mean he called you out on your bullshit. and then he recognized something he considered worthy enough to be okay, (albeit i never saw what he did)
@Russtifinko -- Giving myself some time to dwell I think Russ is town. When you have nothing to hide and genuinely try to get to the heart of why people are posting certain ways you often leave some weird shit in the thread that people grab onto and find weird. I think that is what Russ has done that has myself and some others a little piqued.
your explanation is convoluted. just say you didnt have a reason to counter MP and move on
@sprityo -- I think Sprityo is Mafia. I think he has been overwhelmed by the volume and is struggling to interject himself because he's being ignored. Perhaps with me having an actual go at him we'll get more out of him.
you might have got me on meta reads alone in retrocasualty. but im not gonna be thrown in a corner and kicked mac.
@Tsaiah -- I find it hard to decide how I feel about Tsaiah except to say that I like the way they play and have enjoyed their contributions. MP giving her such a huge tick of approval bodes well.

@Turnip Head -- Turnip Head hasn't really got rolling into the game yet but has frequently tried to voice opinions and comment on things. I think Turnip Head is town.
literally most of these green people are "i think theyre town cause vague reasons"

Please show me where each of these five players did that. Failure to do so will result in your credibility being completely removed.
I'm coming back to this once im back from dinner.
Also to suggest I am afraid of going after Jay flies in the face of what you know about the way I play so that was also a lie.
You haven't shown you would. Perception is reality, especially via text my guy.

sprityo I read your scum chat from retrocausality. I know what you think of my civ play. I know exactly how you feel right now.

What was it? "Of all the players it had to be MacDougall".

Attacking me here is smart I will give you that. But you shouldn't have lied so much in doing so. Better luck next time.

Again, where have i lied. you havent directly rebuked any of my statements. On top of that, I don't trust past games. a new game is a new life, a breath of fresh air. This posts actually serves nothing more than to discredit me, in ANY sense, town or not. Maybe, consider this for a minute, Im not mafia and im sstanding my ground against your blatant, lazy suspicions

Sprit do you think Mac is suspicious here then? You've made an argument against him but your conclusion is that he has blatant, lazy suspicions, so do you think that makes him Mafia and why?

Also Mac can you elaborate on your russ read please?

What have I done to deserve this

[Infected_alien8_]

At which i finally look into 180 (million) JJJ posts:

I

Spoiler: show

mmediately, provides reads with a reason. minimal fluff. Just by how he starts i can tell he has a willingness to solve and does so with MP and Tsaiah. You could effectively lump them together.

A trend with each individual player entering the thread is Jay is interacting and giving an immediate read.

Jay is pushing for DH to interact and he is getting a steady resistance to it, therefore the rift between them is formed and there's now the current beef. Normally if there were other avenues of approach I would question this, but it's more so by the lack there-of that makes his pursuit look legitimate. I don't think DH not posting is alignment indicative though, same to do with Marmot.

So we get this big defensive post, which can be from a neutral position, but i dont see it like that. I dont think jay would be the person to give points and cred to the highest posting player in the game to give himself credit.

Here we get the smackdown against mac.

Spoiler: show

I do have one comment.

The suggestion that I am to have "scum-slipped" while not understanding the how of it rings false to me. I cannot think of a scenario in which I have ever made a clumsy post as scum and not known immediately afterwards in every way that it could be construed as scum, so to claim I don't understand my own scum slip is a fairly adventurous call. I am meticulous with my posting as scum and will draft and redress all my posts constantly so for me even scum slip would be rare let alone scum slip and not know how.

I would have thought that Jay wouldn't entertain the notion that Mafia Mac is that clumsy, hence why I think it reflects worse on him.

Alien has restated his perceived slip, so you can continue to contend with that notion in that dialogue.

I don't think you slipped. I never claimed otherwise. I am perturbed that you are bringing this poop here now, as it suggests to me that you are reading the thread closely enough to be aware of a general negative atmosphere forming around you, but not closely enough to see the details.

Followed by the DH ISO- which highlights all the non-interaction from DH at that point in time. I dont think there was anything positive to look at in the first place, even so Jay gives him the benefit of the doubt the best he can. Reading it over actually made me think about what mac had said about DH and, it's like he just took the words from jay's mouth. (but this isnt about mac it's about 3Js)

so for this section of the ISO it's a lot of cycling between Mac, Alien, and DH.

I think it's important to frame this notion a very specific way.

It shouldn't be this question: "Does anyone else in this game mind high posting rates as much as DharmaHelper?"

Instead, it should be this question: "Does DharmaHelper believe that anyone else in this game might sympathize with general frustration over the high posting rates?"

In reference to the second question, I do think some names on the player list are applicable as those who DH might appeal to. Marmot, Russtifinko, and Kylemii stand out immediately. Even people like MacDougall, M Plus 7, or myself could be had, theoretically, by an appeal of a player who is struggling to keep up with the game because of us. The newcomers wouldn't apply here. I don't think DH specifically looked at the list and picked out names with some deliberate strategy, but I do think it's a general mindset which is functional enough in this game.

I think this post is kind of a stretch jay. Do you feel obligated to pressure DH to play to your standard?

I should do an ISO of Alien next because it seems like i dont remember much of what he says, yet jay has multiple interactions with him that look neutral on the surface......but i can see jay trying to, idk, see if he'll slip on something.

Something I associate with a civilian sprityo is a willingness to stick his finger of suspicion right in the face of any highly active player, unconcerned about the repercussions. Indeed, I think sig does the same thing, and it's something that contributes to their being wrongly suspected in many games.

I'm not seeing that now, however. sprityo has barely dipped his toes into the water even in the posts that he has made.

(I see it jay), your suspicion (and henceforth vote on me) is coming from me not being a present force. Many apologies. But your vote doesnt seem commital more than it looks to be prodding me for activity, akin to dharmahelper. I'm getting warmed up, just bare......BEAR with me

some fluffy fun stuff at the start of Day 1, but he's soon back on track with harassing DH for the content he was promised. he gets something out of this and drops it before moving on the yours truly.

----------------------------------
So my notes/perception on jay overall is, well very good. He is going around multiple people, tracking multiple engagements across Day 0 and digging deeper into meanings. His reads and more importantly the backing of them are solid and believable. There was only the one thing with DH that looked weird to me, but in comparison to the rest of his content, it's insignificant. I'd like to see anyone paint jay in a negative light, the best youre going to get out of him is a disagreement.

What i want out of jay as of right now is his opinions on colin and kyle since i saw a little bit about them while going through his iso and it looked like he has some small suspicions on them. Take me through your thinking on them if you would do so kindly.

"I dont think there was anything positive to look at in the first place, even so Jay gives him the benefit of the doubt the best he can"

When did jay give him the benefit of the doubt the best he can, I don't remember that at all

[abyssum]

The "I'm not reading the thread by the way, just gonna vote M Plus 7 in a bit" is probably a bad example actually, but hopefully you get what I mean. Something like "i'm never gonna read the thread, just gonna hop on whatever wagon is popular"

i understand the example (& think it paints a better picture of what you meant when you were talking about Lunalee)

[abyssum]

Okay I'm caught up now.

How do I vote?

I'm satisfied with russ' answer about what he meant with the revenge lynch, that makes sense to me now

M Plus 7 said to me that his meta is that as Mafia he struggles to make authentic dogpees and I'm convinced that's what I just saw

Aby seems off to me and I'm not sure why, and I don't understand where the town-reads are coming from for her

Luna hasn't posted since so my read on her is the same

Sort of confused as to what to think about GH so I want to wait for him to actually read the thread before making a judgement, the most compelling thing I can remember is the point I think Jay made about him going for the weakest point in his ISO

Everyone else I don't have anything to say about in my memory

How do I vote by the way?

is this off feeling something that came about when i started questioning you about Lunalee/TH?

i know you mean DH but lol

No it was when you were defending M Plus 7 I think.

But overnight I slept on this actually and was going to make a post about it but I may as well do it now - I thought back to your first interaction with him that felt really awkward and weird, and how reluctant you were to form an opinion of him, and how eager you were to defend him, and all of it starting to paint a picture to me where you're his partner.

slow down bob ross, nobody's flipped yet.

i don't think i'd have any reluctance whatsoever when it came to townreading an MP7 who's my partner. he's one of the only players in this game that i know, and we already have an easy reference for how we act together when we're both town. why not just pretend to give each other strong, fast townreads? do you think it's out of my range or something?

[abyssum]

at some point i want somebody, in some game, to realize that trying to tease out people's thought processes on another player isn't automatically a defense

which is probably a thing you should know based on the way you "defended" Turnip Head without it really being a defense

[DharmaHelper]

You know what I'm thinking trying to tease out a player's thoughts on another player might not count as a defense.

[abyssum]

Does picking apart Mac’s rainbow list look like scumhunting, or an attempt to discredit? Others should weigh in.

Unsure where he was going with it, it read more like a defence than anything because of that

defense of who/what?

[abyssum]

You know what I'm thinking trying to tease out a player's thoughts on another player might not count as a defense.

my rainbow list now has "DharmaHelper" at the top in green and "everyone else" at the bottom in yellow

[Infected_alien8_]

Okay I'm caught up now.

How do I vote?

I'm satisfied with russ' answer about what he meant with the revenge lynch, that makes sense to me now

M Plus 7 said to me that his meta is that as Mafia he struggles to make authentic dogpees and I'm convinced that's what I just saw

Aby seems off to me and I'm not sure why, and I don't understand where the town-reads are coming from for her

Luna hasn't posted since so my read on her is the same

Sort of confused as to what to think about GH so I want to wait for him to actually read the thread before making a judgement, the most compelling thing I can remember is the point I think Jay made about him going for the weakest point in his ISO

Everyone else I don't have anything to say about in my memory

How do I vote by the way?

is this off feeling something that came about when i started questioning you about Lunalee/TH?

i know you mean DH but lol

No it was when you were defending M Plus 7 I think.

But overnight I slept on this actually and was going to make a post about it but I may as well do it now - I thought back to your first interaction with him that felt really awkward and weird, and how reluctant you were to form an opinion of him, and how eager you were to defend him, and all of it starting to paint a picture to me where you're his partner.

slow down bob ross, nobody's flipped yet.

i don't think i'd have any reluctance whatsoever when it came to townreading an MP7 who's my partner. he's one of the only players in this game that i know, and we already have an easy reference for how we act together when we're both town. why not just pretend to give each other strong, fast townreads? do you think it's out of my range or something?

I guess that makes sense, you could coordinate mindmelds and things with him and make you both look genuine. I'm not sure what reason you'd have for not doing that, maybe just not thinking about it, or thinking it was too much of a risk in case people didn't buy it or one of you was caught out and people would suspect you were coordinating those mindmelds or something. The theory isn't perfect for sure but it's something that's lingering on my mind.

[Turnip Head]

at some point i want somebody, in some game, to realize that trying to tease out people's thought processes on another player isn't automatically a defense

which is probably a thing you should know based on the way you "defended" Turnip Head without it really being a defense

Subtlety doesn't translate well

linki: which is why we have satire

[abyssum]

Spoiler: show

Okay I'm caught up now.

How do I vote?

I'm satisfied with russ' answer about what he meant with the revenge lynch, that makes sense to me now

M Plus 7 said to me that his meta is that as Mafia he struggles to make authentic dogpees and I'm convinced that's what I just saw

Aby seems off to me and I'm not sure why, and I don't understand where the town-reads are coming from for her

Luna hasn't posted since so my read on her is the same

Sort of confused as to what to think about GH so I want to wait for him to actually read the thread before making a judgement, the most compelling thing I can remember is the point I think Jay made about him going for the weakest point in his ISO

Everyone else I don't have anything to say about in my memory

How do I vote by the way?

is this off feeling something that came about when i started questioning you about Lunalee/TH?

i know you mean DH but lol

No it was when you were defending M Plus 7 I think.

But overnight I slept on this actually and was going to make a post about it but I may as well do it now - I thought back to your first interaction with him that felt really awkward and weird, and how reluctant you were to form an opinion of him, and how eager you were to defend him, and all of it starting to paint a picture to me where you're his partner.

slow down bob ross, nobody's flipped yet.

i don't think i'd have any reluctance whatsoever when it came to townreading an MP7 who's my partner. he's one of the only players in this game that i know, and we already have an easy reference for how we act together when we're both town. why not just pretend to give each other strong, fast townreads? do you think it's out of my range or something?

I guess that makes sense, you could coordinate mindmelds and things with him and make you both look genuine. I'm not sure what reason you'd have for not doing that, maybe just not thinking about it, or thinking it was too much of a risk in case people didn't buy it or one of you was caught out and people would suspect you were coordinating those mindmelds or something. The theory isn't perfect for sure but it's something that's lingering on my mind.

idc if you believe me on this or not because it doesn't matter in the end, but i guarantee you that i would not shy away from it & would find it one of the most fun aspects of any game ever to try to fake mindmelds/finding MP7 as town when we're both scum

[Infected_alien8_]

at some point i want somebody, in some game, to realize that trying to tease out people's thought processes on another player isn't automatically a defense

which is probably a thing you should know based on the way you "defended" Turnip Head without it really being a defense

Well, it felt to me like it was you defending M Plus 7 instead of trying to tease out my thoughts, but looking back on it through your ISO I can see a world where you're doing it to tease out my thoughts as well and you actually haven't defended him as much as I had in my mind. Still though, do you not find your lack of mindmelds with him at all concerning? Didn't you mindmeld with him right from the start last game?

[Lunalee]

@Lunalee

I wanna hear more from you! Specifically, how do you feel about the spirityo v Mac thing? This is a good generic question for anyone to answer, but I've got N O T H I N G on Lunalee so I wanna specifically hear what you have to say.

Hi RobotNerd, thanks for the prompt. I have trouble finding where I should give input in games like this with a lot of experienced players weighing in.

This looks like the post that started it all: A very innocent comment by sprityo about Mac not being actually green on MP's read list.
Here's why MacDougall dislikes sprityo:
Sprityo has avoided heat in ways he probably shouldn't have I want to see examples of this, because I don't see it in sprit's ISO.
sprityo responds to Mac's suspicions by saying "it was a joke" and "I'm bad at mafia"

Then there's Sprit's blow-up post and Mac's reaction to it. At first glance, it honestly looks like two civvs who don't understand each other.

But I can't help but notice how sprityo is reacting to this whole thing. He swings an attack, then immediately backs down, as if hoping to shut it down before Mac can swing back:
swing 1
back-down 1
swing 2
back-down 2

Mac's response to this is steady and forceful. He does not back down. This seems like a more common townie trait. If I had to pick a scum between Mac and Sprityo, I would choose Sprityo.

[Infected_alien8_]

You know what I'm thinking trying to tease out a player's thoughts on another player might not count as a defense.

lol

[Infected_alien8_]

You know what I'm thinking trying to tease out a player's thoughts on another player might not count as a defense.

my rainbow list now has "DharmaHelper" at the top in green and "everyone else" at the bottom in yellow

lol

[Infected_alien8_]

@Lunalee

I wanna hear more from you! Specifically, how do you feel about the spirityo v Mac thing? This is a good generic question for anyone to answer, but I've got N O T H I N G on Lunalee so I wanna specifically hear what you have to say.

Hi RobotNerd, thanks for the prompt. I have trouble finding where I should give input in games like this with a lot of experienced players weighing in.

This looks like the post that started it all: A very innocent comment by sprityo about Mac not being actually green on MP's read list.
Here's why MacDougall dislikes sprityo:
Sprityo has avoided heat in ways he probably shouldn't have I want to see examples of this, because I don't see it in sprit's ISO.
sprityo responds to Mac's suspicions by saying "it was a joke" and "I'm bad at mafia"

Then there's Sprit's blow-up post and Mac's reaction to it. At first glance, it honestly looks like two civvs who don't understand each other.

But I can't help but notice how sprityo is reacting to this whole thing. He swings an attack, then immediately backs down, as if hoping to shut it down before Mac can swing back:
swing 1
back-down 1
swing 2
back-down 2

Mac's response to this is steady and forceful. He does not back down. This seems like a more common townie trait. If I had to pick a scum between Mac and Sprityo, I would choose Sprityo.

His backdown #2 wasn't him going back on his reads though, it was him wanting to move on from stating his case because it was taxing argueing

This also feels a bit like a forced read to me, it feels like you're struggling for what to say, so you're just trying to find something you could say is suspicious, because I don't think your quotes match into your argument very well so it reads as if you made the case first and then tried to fit things into it as opposed to working bottom-up and seeing it first and then making the case

[RobotNerd277]

here have my notes sheet that I decided like halfway through that I would post

Spoiler: show

#1065 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 22#p474422
DH keeps commenting on how he hasn't read the thread. This is annoying. I do agree that calling someone a pussy or a coward isn't the same as calling them mafia. That being said, I think JaggedJimmyJay is anything but that.

I'm not liking the JJJ + DH interactions? It reads as both townies, but being really distracting. I'm mostly just annoyed about that, but it doesn't read as scummy from either party.

#1094 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 55#p474455

ooooh spirityo has an iso wall of macdougall. Saves me the trouble for now!

Wait, has macdougall not actually posted a bunch of solid argument stuff? I figured it was somewhere in the 7 pages I hadn't read.

I'm not liking this "only person I have a negative read on" bit from spirityo but I'm still not a fan of mac. There's a lot to pick at in this thread. MP's willingness to throw "town" at people, DH's unwillingness to read the thread etc. Anyways, the end of spirityo's post is a bit yelly but he makes a point against Mac that I agree with. I still want to do my own iso because ~bad vibes~

#1104 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 7b#p474465

Agree with Kylemii. I hope there's an explanatino for how on eart you get a townread on DH.

pseudo-random-neuron-firing -> where's tsaiah?

#1114 - http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 80#p474480

wonderful, mac responded to spirityo's post. I should also answer those questions when I get around to it, because idk who I believe less tbh, spirityo or mac.

I feel like I should address the "melted like butter on a hot plate" thing but idk what to really say. I intend to take more of a look at Mac later? I probably should have done this last night instead of getting distracted but also whatever the past is in the past.

I... keep skimming over MP's posts. Sorry! I'll probably read what you have to say... eventually!

What about the 'only person I have a negative read on' part don't you like?

maintaining as neutral a stance as possible is pretty scummy. only disliking one person is just barely a step above that. I consider townreads not super relevant to that because it's much easier to say you like someone than you dislike them, you know?

that being said, spirityo hasn't like, demonstrated serious tunnel vision. just not-evaluated-the-rest-of-game vision, which is a pretty reasonable state of being. If they don't start reevaluating townreads, then we'll talk more.

[Lunalee]

Spoiler: show

@Lunalee

I wanna hear more from you! Specifically, how do you feel about the spirityo v Mac thing? This is a good generic question for anyone to answer, but I've got N O T H I N G on Lunalee so I wanna specifically hear what you have to say.

Hi RobotNerd, thanks for the prompt. I have trouble finding where I should give input in games like this with a lot of experienced players weighing in.

This looks like the post that started it all: A very innocent comment by sprityo about Mac not being actually green on MP's read list.
Here's why MacDougall dislikes sprityo:
Sprityo has avoided heat in ways he probably shouldn't have I want to see examples of this, because I don't see it in sprit's ISO.
sprityo responds to Mac's suspicions by saying "it was a joke" and "I'm bad at mafia"

Then there's Sprit's blow-up post and Mac's reaction to it. At first glance, it honestly looks like two civvs who don't understand each other.

But I can't help but notice how sprityo is reacting to this whole thing. He swings an attack, then immediately backs down, as if hoping to shut it down before Mac can swing back:
swing 1
back-down 1
swing 2
back-down 2

Mac's response to this is steady and forceful. He does not back down. This seems like a more common townie trait. If I had to pick a scum between Mac and Sprityo, I would choose Sprityo.

His backdown #2 wasn't him going back on his reads though, it was him wanting to move on from stating his case because it was taxing argueing

This also feels a bit like a forced read to me, it feels like you're struggling for what to say, so you're just trying to find something you could say is suspicious, because I don't think your quotes match into your argument very well so it reads as if you made the case first and then tried to fit things into it as opposed to working bottom-up and seeing it first and then making the case

I felt like back down 2 was Sprityo attempting to shut the door on the whole issue, because he didn't want to continue engaging with Mac.
I did force myself to make a read of Mac and sprit (if that's what you mean), but I didn't have a conclusion going into it. It sort of evolved. Where else do my quotes not make since to you? I may have messed them up, or if not I can try to clarify.

[Infected_alien8_]

Also aby I had a follow-up explanation of what I meant about the easy read thing, but it seems like you understand it now anyway, but basically a as a quick summary for anyone else, since it's so glaringly suspicious, Mafia making that post as a genuine attempt to achieve their objective is a stretch for me, and I think at best it would be a mafia trying to WIFOM to get people like me to say 'why would they do that as Mafia though' and how that's possible but there's nothing to say it was that vs him just doing it as a Townie who didn't care about how they came across, which is why I think it's a null post overall, and I think it's pretty likely that Luna is trying to force reads on things like this and suggesting it was the Mafia genuinely trying to achieve their objective with posts like that because she's struggling to make actual reads as a Mafia member

[Infected_alien8_]

Spoiler: show

@Lunalee

I wanna hear more from you! Specifically, how do you feel about the spirityo v Mac thing? This is a good generic question for anyone to answer, but I've got N O T H I N G on Lunalee so I wanna specifically hear what you have to say.

Hi RobotNerd, thanks for the prompt. I have trouble finding where I should give input in games like this with a lot of experienced players weighing in.

This looks like the post that started it all: A very innocent comment by sprityo about Mac not being actually green on MP's read list.
Here's why MacDougall dislikes sprityo:
Sprityo has avoided heat in ways he probably shouldn't have I want to see examples of this, because I don't see it in sprit's ISO.
sprityo responds to Mac's suspicions by saying "it was a joke" and "I'm bad at mafia"

Then there's Sprit's blow-up post and Mac's reaction to it. At first glance, it honestly looks like two civvs who don't understand each other.

But I can't help but notice how sprityo is reacting to this whole thing. He swings an attack, then immediately backs down, as if hoping to shut it down before Mac can swing back:
swing 1
back-down 1
swing 2
back-down 2

Mac's response to this is steady and forceful. He does not back down. This seems like a more common townie trait. If I had to pick a scum between Mac and Sprityo, I would choose Sprityo.

His backdown #2 wasn't him going back on his reads though, it was him wanting to move on from stating his case because it was taxing argueing

This also feels a bit like a forced read to me, it feels like you're struggling for what to say, so you're just trying to find something you could say is suspicious, because I don't think your quotes match into your argument very well so it reads as if you made the case first and then tried to fit things into it as opposed to working bottom-up and seeing it first and then making the case

I felt like back down 2 was Sprityo attempting to shut the door on the whole issue, because he didn't want to continue engaging with Mac.
I did force myself to make a read of Mac and sprit (if that's what you mean), but I didn't have a conclusion going into it. It sort of evolved. Where else do my quotes not make since to you? I may have messed them up, or if not I can try to clarify.

I agree it's sprit trying to move on, I don't agree it was 'backing down' though, he was shutting himself off from argueing anymore about it but maintaining his stance

And no it was just that part, it feels like you were trying to twist what he did into some sort of case where you say he keeps backing down even though I don't think it fits properly

Also @M Plus 7 what do you think of robot this game right now? Hopefully that tag works but it didn't come up with the option menu thing so I'm not sure

[Infected_alien8_]

[mention]M Plus 7[/mention] okay, I guess tagging doesn't work in the full editor?

[RobotNerd277]

I mean, I was the one asking Luna to force reads

fite me irl alien

fwiw, I have a similar take on the exchange to Luna. The swing and back-off paradigm is a bit aggro, and mac's reaction feels pretty solid and genuine.

linki: I am also curious as to what mp thinks of me