basic mafia [END]

[TonyStarkPrime]

Not an axehole

You've seen the argument that me/Seanzie have made about the quality of the "work" that he's doing here vs his posting in Alta?

I know him pretty well

I've seen it and I do not care

I feel bad for you

[TonyStarkPrime]

Seems like it’s going to be Alison vs DOO. I think Alison is definitely more likely to be town out of the two, so [VOTE: DOO] aubergine
I’ll try to be around as late as I can for EOD but I’m already getting tired.

this is wolfy for the same reason my vote was wolfy but arbitrarily if alison is town you'd want the chop there instead of the loose cannon

[TonyStarkPrime]

Seems like it’s going to be Alison vs DOO. I think Alison is definitely more likely to be town out of the two, so [VOTE: DOO] aubergine
I’ll try to be around as late as I can for EOD but I’m already getting tired.

You need to vote in the poll.

but then this is probably not w/w so then what

[TonyStarkPrime]

@Alison Why do you townread me?

Because "I've done nothing townie, why do you townread me" is a towntell for you.

I also like how active you are in generating activity and clashing with players. You're putting in effort to engage with multiple players and try to solve in a situation where you could easily phone it in.

Can you name another game where I did this?

I just had a scum game where I hardslanked the whole time and had less than 50 posts the whole game, so if I was scum, I would actively work to not look like I did in AtLA. How does that factor into your thinking?

1) Nope. I remember you doing it one game, but I can't remember what it was. It's more of a mindset thing where you question people's motivations rather than just accepting the townread. I'd compare it to what Esooa does, where she constantly pesters people about why they townread her. There's a similar thread of pseudo-reaction-testing line of thinking.

2) It doesn't. If you cared about meta, you'd want to not look like your scum game as either town or scum, because you don't want to be scumread as either alignment. If you didn't care about meta, then all that's happened is that you're putting in a lot more effort/solving than the last time you're scum.

Okay, fair.

This is not an accurate assessment of me. I rarely ever think about meta when deciding how to play as town, but almost always consider it when I rand wolf.

I ISO'd Alison and I did see a few things that concern me. I'm not sure if she is the right choice for elim today, but her thunderdome on DoO is somewhat uncharacteristic of Alison, as in my experience, she avoids such interactions as they are bad for the thread. She also seems overly focused on finding one or two wolves, and trying to push the thread towards yeeting, rather than normally I feel she tries to compile reads on everyone so we can sheep her after she gets NK'd. She has mentioned us sheeping her, but she doesn't seem to be concerned with having a game-winning PoE before EoD. That being said, these differences between town!alison are not so stark that I am not willing to go there right now. If DoO flips and flips town though, Alison will definitely be worth a lot of scrutiny.

eh I think she says that she avoids such interactions but this has little correspondence with reality tbh. But actually I think this is a decent read all in all. Alison looks kinda eh to this point.

but like, maybe the overconfidence on doo is actually towny? idk.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I'd like to kill in luckbox/nanook/dizzy/tsp? today?

that's a salad

[TonyStarkPrime]

I'd like to kill in luckbox/nanook/dizzy/tsp? today?

also it's a pretty bad subset of players but I think that might be towny

[TonyStarkPrime]

I'm confident axe is town, I dont particularly want to dig through this game, he generally has decent reads, so I'm sheeping him for the time being.

It isn't particularly difficult to understand.

nanook's pretty clearly town here

[TonyStarkPrime]

I am still 100% fine with a dyslexicon vote btw

I'll NK you!

whoops

[TonyStarkPrime]

My PoE for tomorrow is Alison voters regardless of what doom flips tbh

Odds that Maf killed Esooa to set up Alison for a mislynch?

i think that falcon not having good reading comprehension is more points for my town read on him

[TonyStarkPrime]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

Also if Alison flips town, Dizzy is scum.

ok this is bad

[TonyStarkPrime]

To be honest, to not vote Alison today is basically insulting her as a player.

actually this is reasonable

[Alison]

@Alison what do you do when Occam's razor says you're mafia? Do you make the level 0 play by killing your own slot?

Occam's Razor says I'm town because I have access to my own role PM

I have been known to orchestrate my own exe in exchange for people promising to sheep my legacy though

[Alison]

This game would be a lot easier with a Dizzy flip. BK exe gave us nothing.

[TonyStarkPrime]

y'all wild

finger probably town, alison wagon lazy and nonsensical

hmm

[TonyStarkPrime]

pretty sure esooa was a doc dodge tbh

hmm

[Alison]

TSP have you ever done a catchup like this as town before

Because I feel like every time you fall behind as town you just phone it in

[Alison]

I'd probably exe Ender over Mac

Axe has to be correct about something eventually, right?

[MacDougall]

I am willing to just vote for whoever TSP ends up telling me to vote for at this point

[TonyStarkPrime]

page 20 read is that mac is town for not being crazy so we'll see how that develops

[TonyStarkPrime]

TSP have you ever done a catchup like this as town before

Because I feel like every time you fall behind as town you just phone it in

uh i don't think so

[TonyStarkPrime]

Alison, I'm sure you explained it elsewhere, but can you give me your quick thoughts on the whole DOO chop? What was up with that?

[TonyStarkPrime]

ender doesn't show up really til page 21 but I'm going to vote for him to show my alignment before i get that far

[TonyStarkPrime]

My PoE for tomorrow is Alison voters regardless of what doom flips tbh

Odds that Maf killed Esooa to set up Alison for a mislynch?

High.

second order misreading is interesting and maybe something

[TonyStarkPrime]

basically I'm going to be voting for whoever orchestrated the harebrained scheme which got BK chopped and that's that

[TonyStarkPrime]

I have a gut read on Falcon being town that I can't really justify.

It was in mafia's interests to promote the idea that DOO/Alison has one scum in it; people realizing it's T/T would have ruined both the DOO misexe and dissipated much of the suspicion against me after, both of which is fairly beneficial for the mafia to encourage. The two people who were most loudly pushing for DOO/Alison being T/T were Lu Ren and Lunchbox, which I think makes them look good; I've largely moved on from my scumread against Lunchbox as a result of the DOO flip, their towntell earlier, and this.

Lu Ren is town. Will defend this read to death do us part.

noted

I think at this point in life I'll say that this is the sorta thing that feels like TMI but I usually don't think wolves are so open about this kind of tmi with players who aren't on the chopping block just because of the adverse effects it can have

[EnderWiggin]

basically I'm going to be voting for whoever orchestrated the harebrained scheme which got BK chopped and that's that

Well I tried to stop it so.

[EnderWiggin]

I'd probably exe Ender over Mac

Axe has to be correct about something eventually, right?

Bad take but okay.

This honestly makes me feel more like you're scum.

[TonyStarkPrime]

good stuff you're probably town then unless you're the wolf who tried to stop of it of which there exists one

[EnderWiggin]

good stuff you're probably town then unless you're the wolf who tried to stop of it of which there exists one

Probably.

Unless Alison is a wolf.

In which case Belzy/Bo was the rescue wagon that just succeeded.

[EnderWiggin]

ender doesn't show up really til page 21 but I'm going to vote for him to show my alignment before i get that far

I was out on Saturday lmao. Aussie time things

[MacDougall]

ender doesn't show up really til page 21 but I'm going to vote for him to show my alignment before i get that far

I was out on Saturday lmao. Aussie time things

us Aussies and our outgoing nature

[TonyStarkPrime]

I think the player I am most eagerly anticipating returning to the thread is @Luckbox Inc

Lol I literally just woke up and was like "glad I didn't miss the Alison part of the day".

not w/w

[TonyStarkPrime]

ender doesn't show up really til page 21 but I'm going to vote for him to show my alignment before i get that far

I was out on Saturday lmao. Aussie time things

well i've been out for approximately the last week so no judgment

[TonyStarkPrime]

Why is Alison leading vote?

Why is Alison leading vote?

She mafia

Why is Alison leading vote?

She mafia

Cool
[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

This makes today a lot easier

bo=obv town

[TonyStarkPrime]

ok

can we not

I was hoping you'd end up here.

what, feeling condescended towards and disincentivized to post?

I honestly didn't know that was what you were going for. I still don't see it upon re-read.

sorry, i should add for context that i'm not in the best of headspaces right now so my fuel tank is fairly low in terms of actually sitting down and working through stuff and i've been getting a bit frustrated at things/people in the game but not actually been doing much to help or communicate or do anything about the things that bother me, which is unfair

to be clear, when i say it's a read out of respect i'm saying that i think the specific progression, if you look at where it's coming from and what doo posted right before and what alison seized on, is >>rand v, not that in big strokes it couldn't be mafia but it just. my point is that i respect alison enough as a person that i don't think they would make that particular push at that particular time, not that i think they couldn't or that i think their case was good or that their reads are amazing or whatever

i'm sure she's an excellent wolf, i'm just not going to entertain a world in which she is and does what she did at the start of this game for the sake of my own sanity

i feel frustrated at the moment because when i tried to express this you didn't try to engage at all with what i was saying

and it's possible that's because i didn't express myself clearly and you thought i was saying something different or because we have different presuppositions about alison and the way she plays the game of mafia or because what i focused on when i read that interaction d1 was very different than what you focused on

but either way, i'd appreciate it if we could have this conversation in words, posting reads and trying to communicate what i've been saying this entire game and just getting "kek" in return makes me just not want to post at all

I have a hard time entertaining a world where Lu Ren isn't a wolf. But if they are then they're pretty good.

I'm down to read Alison wolf games though.

uh, huh.

[TonyStarkPrime]

sorry I meant to say "is a wolf"-- pretty sure Lu Ren has to be good.....

oh ok tsp confused by typos again

[EnderWiggin]

Hey Alison, what is your take on the Mac/Ender Thunderdome?

[TonyStarkPrime]

atm i'm looking at something like 3 of [tsp/nanook/dizzy/sean/luck/bo]

this is a bad poe in that at least three of these people are town and at least one is nanook who's probably town

kinda leaning that luck wolf makes sense here though

[TonyStarkPrime]

I mean, it goes without saying I would yeet TSP in a heartbeat.

There are things I agree with you on.

This is one of them.

found wolves

[EnderWiggin]

I mean, it goes without saying I would yeet TSP in a heartbeat.

There are things I agree with you on.

This is one of them.

found wolves

If it makes you feel better, that opinion has changed now you're actually contributing.

[EnderWiggin]

Side note, TSP probably town at this point.

[TonyStarkPrime]

seanzie has been openwolfing i think

I was just thinking this.

seanzie has been openwolfing i think

Yes, I don't really want to commit but Luck's been trending up and Sean's not looking great.

Do you think Nanook's response to my vote there-- basically building the reason I want to kill him into something it's not and then saying it's not actually a thing at all anyway is alignment indicative? I could understand "no i'm just being lazy and doing my thing that's a bad push" but I felt like the lengths to which he went to thinly strawman and then demolish my push (rather than engaging with the substance of my actual read i.e. that he's blatantly wolfsiding regardless of alignment and that he can do better as town, even if I don't expect him to, and it seems like he's using excuse to tether vote to a blatantly non-consensus short-temper villager, plus his reads have seemed generally tmi-y) don't give me a lot of hope in that regard.

one of these is a wolf

[TonyStarkPrime]

shhh im openwolfing

I believe you.

Why Axe?

Why Axe?

@MacDougall OkAy, you didn't know.

[VOTE: Seanzie] aubergine

You usually tilt me. If you scumread me here it'd have been translated by more than just concurring to me joking about openwolfing. You'd be tunneling me like you always do.

I grilled you for hours last night. You're a wolf.

I know you think you have a good read on me but if you are town, tunneling me is not going to end well for town this time. I am town and will continue to be town and you are entirely off meta in this game. I suggest you change up your approach to something a bit more than just directly calling people wolves and something more persuasive.

Nah, I'd rather just keep calling you and Ender and Alison wolves.

noting that I'm curious about what happened between here and n2 that led to a flip here and i guess I'll find out

[TonyStarkPrime]

Hmm, I get that, but let's say your meta read is accurate. Doesn't occam's razor say to kill on wagon rather than to take Esooa's death to mean that mafia is off-wagon? Esooa, a townie who claimed to not have read the thread and gave reads anyway based on page 1-5 presumably.

Esooa said she intended to turbo everyone on the Alison wagon. She dies in the night. Occam's Razor explanation: mafia are on the Alison wagon. This is doubly true for someone who knows for a fact that Alison/DOO is T/T and so mafia doesn't care which of us they're voting but wants to not be on the person that flipped green.

i really just think alison is a wolf

[TonyStarkPrime]

In Seanzie's world Me/Mac/Alison are all wolves.

Unless he somehow thinks we all powerwolf it up that makes... no sense?

i mean if you/mac/alison rolled wolf together you definitely would powerwolf it up

[Alison]

Alison, I'm sure you explained it elsewhere, but can you give me your quick thoughts on the whole DOO chop? What was up with that?

I thought she was scum so I voted her.

[TonyStarkPrime]

would you do it again or have you learned your lesson

[Alison]

Hey Alison, what is your take on the Mac/Ender Thunderdome?

I'm questioning why the thunderdome is between you two in the first place, but insofar as everyone else seems to have silently agreed this is what we're doing I'd rather vote you over Mac.

I'd prefer to vote Dizzy over any other slot though.

[Alison]

would you do it again or have you learned your lesson

I don't have any regrets about exeing DOO, no.

[EnderWiggin]

Hey Alison, what is your take on the Mac/Ender Thunderdome?

I'm questioning why the thunderdome is between you two in the first place, but insofar as everyone else seems to have silently agreed this is what we're doing I'd rather vote you over Mac.

I'd prefer to vote Dizzy over any other slot though.

I want to know your reasons behind me > Mac.