King of the Hill Mafia

[Creature]

my most concrete scum read has been porscha - but she has also done a thing that I have mostly seen by town. Alison's case made me reconsider again.

I think that you, alison, mac, and jack have been side-lining a lot (aside from the mac vs Alison stuff earlier) where you exist and (with the exception of jack) make posts that sound generally good and that's that.

what

weirded out by you describing me, alison, and mac as "side-lining" when we have almost singlehandedly been steering the momentum of the game but it's probably not an alignment indicative thing

if youre town then you should vote jack with me

but there is no momentum in this game, thats the problem tbh

why jack over porscha. I will sleep in a few minutes tbh

i agree the gamestate has actually been pretty slow/stagnant in general, but i wouldn't go as far as to say it has "no momentum". in either case, i don't understand why you described the few players in this game who have actually been attempting to create momentum as being the ones who are sitting in the sidelines, but i dont really care enough to pursue it further

i think the posts that jack has made so far are borderline gibberish and represent a thought process that i find it difficult to believe that he would have as town (ie: "i think SPF's description of neon is scummy but i'm not allowed to push on SPF because neon thinks SPF is town, but also, i don't think that neon is town either"), he made several posts that gestured toward solving without actually doing it (ie: asking for opinions on porscha and the never following up with it), and his vote on you was uncharacteristically lazy

i'm not really sold on him being mafia but i do think his posts are probably the worst out of everyone who has posted so far, and if he is town then i know he is capable of doing much better

okay, but i wanna explain myself some more tbh
like, yes, sure, there IS some momentum.

In my experience, when the wagons are stagnant/day feels slow, and a town (me in this case) gets pushed for just being around and trying to play properly, and a lot of lhf names are thrown around, scum is sitting comfy and just steers the game without getting their hands dirty. Thats the impression I got when playing today tbh. That a wolf is most likely located in that sweet spot tbh.

i've seen jack be lazy as both alignments, but alright. I will consider. I am currently following Alison's Porscha take and re-evaluating my own conclusion. We'll see where I land tbh

Do you think gamestate suggests no wolf is in danger of being lynched rn?

If yes who would be a surprise name for wolf?

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: SPF] aubergine

[staypositivefriend]

jack if youre town then you should consider reading my posts and engaging with me instead of lazily OMGUSing me

[staypositivefriend]

if you're town then you can do better than this. pull yourself together. this is not the jack town that i know or that i've seen in the past

[Creature]

The more Creature baselessly calls votes shrug yeets and implies that they are essentially =rand when people have dropped entire cases on them and called them outed etc. the more I think he is partners with Porscha and was caught with his pants down.

I'm challenging people to come up with cases. I pretty much started with wolfreading Porscha but got concerned I was myself just confbiasing her and others were jumping in for easy mislynch.

I have been dropping cases on Porscha ever since I came back. Have you read them?

I read the one with two paragraphs. The second paragraph is fair. Though the first paragraph seemed like a gamestate read yet I feel like I was the main component of your gamestate read (the one calling Porscha an easy vote). Am I missing someone?

You missed the one where I argued that SPF and Boquise being run up for unclear reasons EOD1 is >>rand likely to be the result of evil intentions, and that the most obvious reason for it is relieving pressure off Porscha.

Perhaps. I know from my part I've been paranoid of both Boq/SPF. Though I guess they both received votes from other players who didn't manifest much (Seanzie is one of those low hanging voters I had in mind, Jack prob included).

[Jackofhearts2005]

I mean here is the thing. It is extremely rare for Boq and SPF to get run up D1. You can complain about how this is classist or whatever but I'm pretty sure if you look at their games you'll find it is objectively true. So now here we are, 4 hours to EOD1, and SPF and Boq are being voted. The votes on them are bad - for instance Lilypetal has admitted to voting SPF because it was "the worst possible vote I could cast here" and Jack voted Boq for "I don't have a great reason for this".

So I am sitting here and I am thinking to myself why the fuck we are nearing EOD and two players who usually receive strong townreads D1 are getting run up for zero reason. Occam's Razor is just that there are nefarious motives at play and boxed in scum feel the need to create chaos in the thread and try to get away with wild pushes.

Candidates for boxed in scum who feel the need to do this to save themselves: Jack and Porscha, who were top wagons and consensus suspects before this round of voting happened.

Candidates for boxed in scum's accomplices: Lilypetal and maybe Creature.

I think it is virtually guaranteed there is one in Jack/Porscha, if not both, and if so then Lilypetal and Creature need to be put under a microscope (Lilypetal especially for that huge reversal on her Porscha read). I will probably just be voting on one of those two and currently I think it's slightly more likely to be Porscha because of her reaction to pressure.

Lol

[Creature]

Boq, why are you voting spf?

[Alison]

I'm unsure of Alison's framing of me comes from town or not. I want to read it as a misunderstanding but if she's scum it's an easy set up for a ML on me later on

I'm reading you as Porscha's accomplice and my suspicion against you has been centered on the way you have treated Porscha. In fact if Porscha flips town much of your play will be vindicated.

Are you TMI-ing that Porscha will flip wolf, in saying that I'm setting you up to be executed?

No, I'm saying in the world that Porscha is your accomplice you are setting me up to be executed.

Then vote Porscha. If I am town, my suspicion and casing of Porscha has been in good faith and are for good reasons. If I am town, as you suggest, I am hellbussing my own teammate (although I have no idea why I'd do that instead of letting SPF/Boq/Jack wagons naturally save her), and so Porscha is still mafia.

Either way, Porscha should be wolf to you, yes?

[Boquise]

what

weirded out by you describing me, alison, and mac as "side-lining" when we have almost singlehandedly been steering the momentum of the game but it's probably not an alignment indicative thing

if youre town then you should vote jack with me

but there is no momentum in this game, thats the problem tbh

why jack over porscha. I will sleep in a few minutes tbh

i agree the gamestate has actually been pretty slow/stagnant in general, but i wouldn't go as far as to say it has "no momentum". in either case, i don't understand why you described the few players in this game who have actually been attempting to create momentum as being the ones who are sitting in the sidelines, but i dont really care enough to pursue it further

i think the posts that jack has made so far are borderline gibberish and represent a thought process that i find it difficult to believe that he would have as town (ie: "i think SPF's description of neon is scummy but i'm not allowed to push on SPF because neon thinks SPF is town, but also, i don't think that neon is town either"), he made several posts that gestured toward solving without actually doing it (ie: asking for opinions on porscha and the never following up with it), and his vote on you was uncharacteristically lazy

i'm not really sold on him being mafia but i do think his posts are probably the worst out of everyone who has posted so far, and if he is town then i know he is capable of doing much better

okay, but i wanna explain myself some more tbh
like, yes, sure, there IS some momentum.

In my experience, when the wagons are stagnant/day feels slow, and a town (me in this case) gets pushed for just being around and trying to play properly, and a lot of lhf names are thrown around, scum is sitting comfy and just steers the game without getting their hands dirty. Thats the impression I got when playing today tbh. That a wolf is most likely located in that sweet spot tbh.

i've seen jack be lazy as both alignments, but alright. I will consider. I am currently following Alison's Porscha take and re-evaluating my own conclusion. We'll see where I land tbh

Do you think gamestate suggests no wolf is in danger of being lynched rn?

If yes who would be a surprise name for wolf?

i think there is a possibility yes, especially during the moment where i was the main wagon (and my name has been dropped a lot during the day so it isnt a surprise that it has now grown to a real wagon).

Like i said, spf, alison, mac in that case.
I guess I will have to reconsder Seanzie since he is hellbent on this being in his wolf range but i have more often than not found his approach come from a town or not.

I guess you could be a wolf too, regardless of Porscha's alignment. If she is town and you are a wolf, your position right now would be fake lamenting about two town wagons.

If I did not have a feel of how you play, I would be voting you about now tbh

[staypositivefriend]

i'm contractually obligated to become a wagon on d1 for horrible reasons every time i roll town

[Creature]

This is the most towny I have seen Lilypetal be this game regardless of Porscha's alignment.

[Boquise]

Boq, why are you voting spf?

i was hungry for a wolf read and thought she was doing a beetlejuice tbh
will change when i have decided who to vote

[Lilypetal]

I'm unsure of Alison's framing of me comes from town or not. I want to read it as a misunderstanding but if she's scum it's an easy set up for a ML on me later on

I'm reading you as Porscha's accomplice and my suspicion against you has been centered on the way you have treated Porscha. In fact if Porscha flips town much of your play will be vindicated.

Are you TMI-ing that Porscha will flip wolf, in saying that I'm setting you up to be executed?

No, I'm saying in the world that Porscha is your accomplice you are setting me up to be executed.

Then vote Porscha. If I am town, my suspicion and casing of Porscha has been in good faith and are for good reasons. If I am town, as you suggest, I am hellbussing my own teammate (although I have no idea why I'd do that instead of letting SPF/Boq/Jack wagons naturally save her), and so Porscha is still mafia.

Either way, Porscha should be wolf to you, yes?

No. I'm not entirely sure on Porscha's alignment. I don't want her to flip town even if it helps prove I'm town. I'd rather we kill a wolf today

[Creature]

i'm contractually obligated to become a wagon on d1 for horrible reasons every time i roll town

Prpb because you're a strong wolf (and lowercase tell).

[Lilypetal]

spf is going to flip 3p here

[Creature]

Jack > Porscha > Boq > spf

My current wagon preferences

Unless someone wants to flip the entire gamestate upside down

[Jackofhearts2005]

jack if youre town then you should consider reading my posts and engaging with me instead of lazily OMGUSing me

I read one of your posts and it was laughably bad. Creature expressed suspicion of you. You expressed suspicion of iirc Neon, which looked bad even if Neon townread you.

I’m not 100% sure you’re a wolf but “Jack, this is just OMGUS. Axetualky, you havnt red muh posts” ain’t gonna do it.

I make myself (or simply allow myself to be) a target and read players based on that. This is a normal Jack thing to do. Yet every time I read a wolf this way, the wolf says it’s just omgus. It’s not me saying you suck for suspecting me. I’m saying the way you’re going about the expression of your suspicion of me sounds fake and therefore, I think it comes from a wolf.

Like…Alison’s read on me also sucks but it doesn’t stick out as fake in the same way. I’m not saying she’s for sure a townie and you’re for sure a wolf but there’s a reason my vote is on you and it’s absolutely not omgus.

[staypositivefriend]

jack if youre town then you should consider reading my posts and engaging with me instead of lazily OMGUSing me

I read one of your posts and it was laughably bad. Creature expressed suspicion of you. You expressed suspicion of iirc Neon, which looked bad even if Neon townread you.

I’m not 100% sure you’re a wolf but “Jack, this is just OMGUS. Axetualky, you havnt red muh posts” ain’t gonna do it.

I make myself (or simply allow myself to be) a target and read players based on that. This is a normal Jack thing to do. Yet every time I read a wolf this way, the wolf says it’s just omgus. It’s not me saying you suck for suspecting me. I’m saying the way you’re going about the expression of your suspicion of me sounds fake and therefore, I think it comes from a wolf.

Like…Alison’s read on me also sucks but it doesn’t stick out as fake in the same way. I’m not saying she’s for sure a townie and you’re for sure a wolf but there’s a reason my vote is on you and it’s absolutely not omgus.

if you're town then it should be extremely easy to understand why i find it wolfy that you decided to leave your vote parked on boq as the leading wagon when you thought that the day was ending, when you did not mention boq at any point prior to that in your ISO, and when i struggle to believe that you would be OK with boq being the d1 chop on a game like this unless you had any specific reasons to scumread him. it feels out of character for you and distinct from the other towngames i have seen from you, including the mash

and that's the exact thing - you thought that my push on neon looked bad but you were opposed to pushing on me because neon had a townread on me, even though you made it clear from your posts that you did not actually think that neon was town. this is a thought process that does not make any sense and that i struggle to wrap my head around no matter how many times i think it through

to be blunt, if youre town then my recommendation is to stop posting badly and start actually playing the game

[Jackofhearts2005]

anyway i finished catching up with the thread and i actually think that jack looks the worst out of all the people who posted when i was gone.

Neon's iso is pretty much flufftastic. I know that's shite of me to say but it's true.

@Neon You seem convinced that there is a wolf in the people who have pushed you but that I specifically am wrong town. Why?

Because people who push me for my approach to the game day 1 especially when I'm more relaxed and memey than normal are almost always town and almost always think they have some amazing solve on me when in fact I'm just being myself.

They give woofs an easy wagon to jump on and put pressure on because like okay someone else started it the reasons look good enough at a base level and it's easy to jump off if needed or to hand wave when I flip town.

Your not the first you won't be the last and it happens in almost every game with people I've never played with before when I'm at my most natural self. Lately I've been kinda not being me and trying to emulate the games of the really good players I respect but I'm shit at it so now I'm in this weird juxtaposition where people who have specced me lately expect me to be like I was in champs or since than and people who know me from before expect me to be goofy anime meme girl when in truth I don't even know who I am anymore so I kinda decided to try to be old me again... cause that's when I had fun in mafia and was like actually kinda good at it.

Anyways point is. You created a wagon that's easy for woofs to use to get a misexe if I don't change my play or to get off of if I do without much suspicion. I don't think a woof starts the wagon I do think at least one jumps on it as it gains traction though.

Mood. I do wanna see more follow up to this, though.

Mac thinks Neon is totes town. SPF thinks Neon looks like a frozen wolf and I tend to think "frozen wolf" isn't a thing that happens fucking D1. But then Neon is like "SPF is my top townie."

i dislike jack characterizing neon as "fluffastic" only to use neon's read on me as an excuse not to read me or push on me further. it feels like jack is attempting to position himself to vote neon as needed while also using neon's read on me as a crutch to avoid giving a stance on my alignment

in general, this train of thought doesn't make any sense to me - if jack thinks that i am mischaracterizing neon's play or describing her in a wolfy way, then i would expect him to pursue that read further instead of lazily giving up because someone who he doesn't even townread is calling me down. it borders on word salad because of how difficult the logic is to follow

i also dislike him asking a question about porscha (ie: "is porscha playing scummy this game?"") and then choosing not to self-preserve on porscha while still giving himself the space to vote her later if it becomes strategically necessary. i feel the same way about his vote on boq - it came out of nowhere and i find it difficult to believe that jack!town would be comfortable leaving his vote parked on boq on d1 of a game like this, especially without a clear reason

This is all kinda silly.

I choose to not vote Neon. I didn’t position shit.

I choose to vote for Boq thinking the day was about to end and then shrug left. My vote for Boq is real like Republican economic theory.

okay but why would you choose to vote boq and make him the leading wagon if you thought that the day was about to end, especially since you hadn't mentioned boq in your ISO before that point? is boq really a player that you're OK with killing on d1 without having any particular read on him? why not vote for porscha or literally any other person that isn't boq?

Top wagons:
Jack, who I know is town
Porscha, who I believe to be town
Boq, who is null

Jack votes for Boq

SPF: Why on earth would Jack vote for Boq in this situation?

What a nonsense, agenday push.

[Creature]

Like i said, spf, alison, mac in that case.
I guess I will have to reconsder Seanzie since he is hellbent on this being in his wolf range but i have more often than not found his approach come from a town or not.

I could see Mac being a wolf, but idk if I would wagon him D1 as he's already close to postcapped and usually resolved soon.

Alison I still see differences between her play here and last game so I'm skeptical at going for her today.

spf is already being wagoned. Again I feel like she self-resolves.

Seanzie I've already seen him drop off as town and get flashwagoned to death D1 so I'm very hesitant at going for him today.

If we plan to flip the gamestate upside down I would prob look at Neon, mostly because she's in that limbo where she has had her town moments but feels overall meh (the same feeling I had in Hells last game).

Otherwise I feel like we should just go for Jack or Porscha today. They haven't been towny and my only hesitation with them is that I could easily see both underplaying as town.

[staypositivefriend]

anyway i finished catching up with the thread and i actually think that jack looks the worst out of all the people who posted when i was gone.

Neon's iso is pretty much flufftastic. I know that's shite of me to say but it's true.

@Neon You seem convinced that there is a wolf in the people who have pushed you but that I specifically am wrong town. Why?

Because people who push me for my approach to the game day 1 especially when I'm more relaxed and memey than normal are almost always town and almost always think they have some amazing solve on me when in fact I'm just being myself.

They give woofs an easy wagon to jump on and put pressure on because like okay someone else started it the reasons look good enough at a base level and it's easy to jump off if needed or to hand wave when I flip town.

Your not the first you won't be the last and it happens in almost every game with people I've never played with before when I'm at my most natural self. Lately I've been kinda not being me and trying to emulate the games of the really good players I respect but I'm shit at it so now I'm in this weird juxtaposition where people who have specced me lately expect me to be like I was in champs or since than and people who know me from before expect me to be goofy anime meme girl when in truth I don't even know who I am anymore so I kinda decided to try to be old me again... cause that's when I had fun in mafia and was like actually kinda good at it.

Anyways point is. You created a wagon that's easy for woofs to use to get a misexe if I don't change my play or to get off of if I do without much suspicion. I don't think a woof starts the wagon I do think at least one jumps on it as it gains traction though.

Mood. I do wanna see more follow up to this, though.

Mac thinks Neon is totes town. SPF thinks Neon looks like a frozen wolf and I tend to think "frozen wolf" isn't a thing that happens fucking D1. But then Neon is like "SPF is my top townie."

i dislike jack characterizing neon as "fluffastic" only to use neon's read on me as an excuse not to read me or push on me further. it feels like jack is attempting to position himself to vote neon as needed while also using neon's read on me as a crutch to avoid giving a stance on my alignment

in general, this train of thought doesn't make any sense to me - if jack thinks that i am mischaracterizing neon's play or describing her in a wolfy way, then i would expect him to pursue that read further instead of lazily giving up because someone who he doesn't even townread is calling me down. it borders on word salad because of how difficult the logic is to follow

i also dislike him asking a question about porscha (ie: "is porscha playing scummy this game?"") and then choosing not to self-preserve on porscha while still giving himself the space to vote her later if it becomes strategically necessary. i feel the same way about his vote on boq - it came out of nowhere and i find it difficult to believe that jack!town would be comfortable leaving his vote parked on boq on d1 of a game like this, especially without a clear reason

This is all kinda silly.

I choose to not vote Neon. I didn’t position shit.

I choose to vote for Boq thinking the day was about to end and then shrug left. My vote for Boq is real like Republican economic theory.

okay but why would you choose to vote boq and make him the leading wagon if you thought that the day was about to end, especially since you hadn't mentioned boq in your ISO before that point? is boq really a player that you're OK with killing on d1 without having any particular read on him? why not vote for porscha or literally any other person that isn't boq?

Top wagons:
Jack, who I know is town
Porscha, who I believe to be town
Boq, who is null

Jack votes for Boq

SPF: Why on earth would Jack vote for Boq in this situation?

What a nonsense, agenday push.

jack, you quite literally said that you planned to vote porscha at the end of the day if you felt like it:

I don't really feel like preserving onto Porscha so I'm just not gonna. Maybe I will at EOD. Maybe the wagons will be better. I have heard bad rumors about almost the entire Porscha wagon and I do not trust it.

you are saying that it's wolfy that i said you were giving yourself wiggle room to vote for porscha if it became strategivcally necessary ,when that is objectivrly what you did

you're also acting like i am somehow supposed to infer from your posts that you had a townread on porscha, when you made no indications of townreading porscha, and when i would not expect you to say "i might vote for porscha at the EOD" if you thought that porscha was town

[Creature]

Oh right I forgot about MissSparkles/RondoDimBuckle but they're arguably more shrug lynch than both Jack and Porscha.

There's also falcon45ca but Alison townreads him.

arogame123 seemed pretty town for me. Is he this good at wolfing?

lucy I'm feelijg a bit meh. She was townreading me yet voted me sheeping Mac and planted her vote on me despite Mac now townreading me. Idk if lucy has done anything useful since then.

[arogame123]

Ok currently skimmed and noticed there are wagons on Boq and SPF. I don't really understand either wagons tbh.

I thought both were pretty townie early on and Boq's frustration of his town reads on him not defending him felt pretty townie as well. I feel like he has been attempting to push the game in a direction and his getting sr for "fear of potential powerwoflers." Additionally, I think the way Boq handled Porscha was pretty townie and explained his issues that he was having with Porscha but also noted some parts of townieness that he found. It didn't seem like he was just sr Porscha to just hop on her wagon.

Additionally, I saw a Jack wagon and currently don't have a read on him. ANyone want to give me a cliff on a read they have on him?

Also Creature, I saw you went from Porscha to likely not being a hit to now having Porsscha in top 2 in ur wagon. What is the main reason for that?

Also, Lily, did u vote on SPF purely for a reaction or did u find something scummy? It seemed like u threw the vote on there like throwing spaghetti on a wall and see what sticks.

[Jackofhearts2005]

jack if youre town then you should consider reading my posts and engaging with me instead of lazily OMGUSing me

I read one of your posts and it was laughably bad. Creature expressed suspicion of you. You expressed suspicion of iirc Neon, which looked bad even if Neon townread you.

I’m not 100% sure you’re a wolf but “Jack, this is just OMGUS. Axetualky, you havnt red muh posts” ain’t gonna do it.

I make myself (or simply allow myself to be) a target and read players based on that. This is a normal Jack thing to do. Yet every time I read a wolf this way, the wolf says it’s just omgus. It’s not me saying you suck for suspecting me. I’m saying the way you’re going about the expression of your suspicion of me sounds fake and therefore, I think it comes from a wolf.

Like…Alison’s read on me also sucks but it doesn’t stick out as fake in the same way. I’m not saying she’s for sure a townie and you’re for sure a wolf but there’s a reason my vote is on you and it’s absolutely not omgus.

if you're town then it should be extremely easy to understand why i find it wolfy that you decided to leave your vote parked on boq as the leading wagon when you thought that the day was ending, when you did not mention boq at any point prior to that in your ISO, and when i struggle to believe that you would be OK with boq being the d1 chop on a game like this unless you had any specific reasons to scumread him. it feels out of character for you and distinct from the other towngames i have seen from you, including the mash

and that's the exact thing - you thought that my push on neon looked bad but you were opposed to pushing on me because neon had a townread on me, even though you made it clear from your posts that you did not actually think that neon was town. this is a thought process that does not make any sense and that i struggle to wrap my head around no matter how many times i think it through

to be blunt, if youre town then my recommendation is to stop posting badly and start actually playing the game

Well if you’re town maybe you could like.



Stop also playing badly?

And like stop being a wolf?

Spoiler: show

gottem

Spoiler: show

idk

[Lilypetal]

spf is supremely towny

[Lilypetal]

Ok currently skimmed and noticed there are wagons on Boq and SPF. I don't really understand either wagons tbh.

I thought both were pretty townie early on and Boq's frustration of his town reads on him not defending him felt pretty townie as well. I feel like he has been attempting to push the game in a direction and his getting sr for "fear of potential powerwoflers." Additionally, I think the way Boq handled Porscha was pretty townie and explained his issues that he was having with Porscha but also noted some parts of townieness that he found. It didn't seem like he was just sr Porscha to just hop on her wagon.

Additionally, I saw a Jack wagon and currently don't have a read on him. ANyone want to give me a cliff on a read they have on him?

Also Creature, I saw you went from Porscha to likely not being a hit to now having Porsscha in top 2 in ur wagon. What is the main reason for that?

Also, Lily, did u vote on SPF purely for a reaction or did u find something scummy? It seemed like u threw the vote on there like throwing spaghetti on a wall and see what sticks.

no spf is perfectly fine i just parked my vote on her to see what people would say but also just as a place to sit for a bit

[Jackofhearts2005]

anyway i finished catching up with the thread and i actually think that jack looks the worst out of all the people who posted when i was gone.

Neon's iso is pretty much flufftastic. I know that's shite of me to say but it's true.

Because people who push me for my approach to the game day 1 especially when I'm more relaxed and memey than normal are almost always town and almost always think they have some amazing solve on me when in fact I'm just being myself.

They give woofs an easy wagon to jump on and put pressure on because like okay someone else started it the reasons look good enough at a base level and it's easy to jump off if needed or to hand wave when I flip town.

Your not the first you won't be the last and it happens in almost every game with people I've never played with before when I'm at my most natural self. Lately I've been kinda not being me and trying to emulate the games of the really good players I respect but I'm shit at it so now I'm in this weird juxtaposition where people who have specced me lately expect me to be like I was in champs or since than and people who know me from before expect me to be goofy anime meme girl when in truth I don't even know who I am anymore so I kinda decided to try to be old me again... cause that's when I had fun in mafia and was like actually kinda good at it.

Anyways point is. You created a wagon that's easy for woofs to use to get a misexe if I don't change my play or to get off of if I do without much suspicion. I don't think a woof starts the wagon I do think at least one jumps on it as it gains traction though.

Mood. I do wanna see more follow up to this, though.

Mac thinks Neon is totes town. SPF thinks Neon looks like a frozen wolf and I tend to think "frozen wolf" isn't a thing that happens fucking D1. But then Neon is like "SPF is my top townie."

i dislike jack characterizing neon as "fluffastic" only to use neon's read on me as an excuse not to read me or push on me further. it feels like jack is attempting to position himself to vote neon as needed while also using neon's read on me as a crutch to avoid giving a stance on my alignment

in general, this train of thought doesn't make any sense to me - if jack thinks that i am mischaracterizing neon's play or describing her in a wolfy way, then i would expect him to pursue that read further instead of lazily giving up because someone who he doesn't even townread is calling me down. it borders on word salad because of how difficult the logic is to follow

i also dislike him asking a question about porscha (ie: "is porscha playing scummy this game?"") and then choosing not to self-preserve on porscha while still giving himself the space to vote her later if it becomes strategically necessary. i feel the same way about his vote on boq - it came out of nowhere and i find it difficult to believe that jack!town would be comfortable leaving his vote parked on boq on d1 of a game like this, especially without a clear reason

This is all kinda silly.

I choose to not vote Neon. I didn’t position shit.

I choose to vote for Boq thinking the day was about to end and then shrug left. My vote for Boq is real like Republican economic theory.

okay but why would you choose to vote boq and make him the leading wagon if you thought that the day was about to end, especially since you hadn't mentioned boq in your ISO before that point? is boq really a player that you're OK with killing on d1 without having any particular read on him? why not vote for porscha or literally any other person that isn't boq?

Top wagons:
Jack, who I know is town
Porscha, who I believe to be town
Boq, who is null

Jack votes for Boq

SPF: Why on earth would Jack vote for Boq in this situation?

What a nonsense, agenday push.

jack, you quite literally said that you planned to vote porscha at the end of the day if you felt like it:

I don't really feel like preserving onto Porscha so I'm just not gonna. Maybe I will at EOD. Maybe the wagons will be better. I have heard bad rumors about almost the entire Porscha wagon and I do not trust it.

you are saying that it's wolfy that i said you were giving yourself wiggle room to vote for porscha if it became strategivcally necessary ,when that is objectivrly what you did

you're also acting like i am somehow supposed to infer from your posts that you had a townread on porscha, when you made no indications of townreading porscha, and when i would not expect you to say "i might vote for porscha at the EOD" if you thought that porscha was town

What wiggle room? I’m allowed to vote whoever the hell I want, yeah? It’s a free country.

[Lilypetal]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

[staypositivefriend]

jack i have temporarily unvoted u and changed my vote to sleep as a peace treaty. if ur town then help me figure out who the mafia is and who we should vote instead

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

[arogame123]

jack i have temporarily unvoted u and changed my vote to sleep as a peace treaty. if ur town then help me figure out who the mafia is and who we should vote instead

I am kinda confused and skimmed through, but what were the main reasons u were scum reading Jack and why he had the wagon on him?

Is it cause he voted Boq over Porscha through communicating that early? I am kinda lost.

[Lilypetal]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

do something

i dont want to kill u

[robyn]

Oh right I forgot about MissSparkles/RondoDimBuckle but they're arguably more shrug lynch than both Jack and Porscha.

There's also falcon45ca but Alison townreads him.

arogame123 seemed pretty town for me. Is he this good at wolfing?

lucy I'm feelijg a bit meh. She was townreading me yet voted me sheeping Mac and planted her vote on me despite Mac now townreading me. Idk if lucy has done anything useful since then.

I shouldn't have voted yesterday, dunno what to do with my vote now. I'm gonna iso Mac to see what he said about Porscha since he has good meta. And I thought Jack was a towny that gets MLed a lot, no?

[Jackofhearts2005]

jack i have temporarily unvoted u and changed my vote to sleep as a peace treaty. if ur town then help me figure out who the mafia is and who we should vote instead

Oh how reasonable. And if I don’t look at other players, it’s my fault when you re-vote me.



Not interested. Vote your scumreads.

[Creature]

I thought both were pretty townie early on and Boq's frustration of his town reads on him not defending him felt pretty townie as well. I feel like he has been attempting to push the game in a direction and his getting sr for "fear of potential powerwoflers." Additionally, I think the way Boq handled Porscha was pretty townie and explained his issues that he was having with Porscha but also noted some parts of townieness that he found. It didn't seem like he was just sr Porscha to just hop on her wagon.

Idk if Boq can be really read based on being frustrated at being pushed. I feel like he should be read at his ability of bringing wolves to noose.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

do something

i dont want to kill u

You do something. I’m not in control of your vote.

[arogame123]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

do something

i dont want to kill u

what? lol

[Jackofhearts2005]

Oh right I forgot about MissSparkles/RondoDimBuckle but they're arguably more shrug lynch than both Jack and Porscha.

There's also falcon45ca but Alison townreads him.

arogame123 seemed pretty town for me. Is he this good at wolfing?

lucy I'm feelijg a bit meh. She was townreading me yet voted me sheeping Mac and planted her vote on me despite Mac now townreading me. Idk if lucy has done anything useful since then.

I shouldn't have voted yesterday, dunno what to do with my vote now. I'm gonna iso Mac to see what he said about Porscha since he has good meta. And I thought Jack was a towny that gets MLed a lot, no?

Constantly, since he broke himself back in 2022.

[robyn]

Townasferkkkkk

Lucy
Neon
SPF
Seanzie
Aro

Lil Bit Towny

Lilypetal
Creature
Nanook
Falcon

Wolfy

Boq
Porscha
Alison

Everyone else

Jack
MissSparkles (who is essentially outed by virtue of having been pushed by nobody)

Postgame guess for cred

MissSparkles
Alison
Boquise

I will be posting once every couple of hours copying this template and updating based on how the game is panning out. If you have any questions you wish answered I will answer them in bulk.

I hate you all for making me nearly cap in a game I was trying to slank and shitpost in.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Cowards, tbh

[Lilypetal]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

do something

i dont want to kill u

You do something. I’m not in control of your vote.

true i didnt think about that

[Creature]

Townasferkkkkk

Lucy
Neon
SPF
Seanzie
Aro

Lil Bit Towny

Lilypetal
Creature
Nanook
Falcon

Wolfy

Boq
Porscha
Alison

Everyone else

Jack
MissSparkles (who is essentially outed by virtue of having been pushed by nobody)

Postgame guess for cred

MissSparkles
Alison
Boquise

I will be posting once every couple of hours copying this template and updating based on how the game is panning out. If you have any questions you wish answered I will answer them in bulk.

I hate you all for making me nearly cap in a game I was trying to slank and shitpost in.

Then againnnn...

I am an expert at wagonomics and due to the wagon spread the below holds very likely to be 1 wolf in each grouping (removing myself because duh).

JOH, Alison, Creature - Strong because it's ro4 not 3 so 1 wolf being in this group is very likely. All of Alison/Creature/Mac voting a town is relatively unlikely, but offset by the fact that I think we're just voting Jack because he's rand, but then there are no wolves voting someone who is easy to push? So there is very likely a difference check between Jack and one of his three voters and it's most likely Jack himself because of the lack of wolves voting (and if one of Creature is a wolf voting, it makes him >rand wolf for bussing tbh).

Creature, Neon, Lucy - Not strong (given I drove it and was probs wrong and Neon/Lucy are sheeping). If there is one here I think it's always Creature because of strength of read on Neon/Lucy.

Porscha, SPF, Boq - Strong. Similar to the first grouping, it's relatively unlikely that town SPF and town Boq would not be voting a wolf. That is just a read on their town quality. I think Porscha is approaching the limit of her scumrange in this game though, and SPF is a beacon of town virtue here so Boq is looking like ass in this grouping.

Seanzie, Nanook, Falcon - I feel like Seanzie is very towny. Falcon isn't really out of his scumrange and is just being given a pass by Alison for bad reasons. Nanook voting seanzie here just feels like something town Nanook would be doing so I can give him a pass for it. Town Nanook and town Falcon voting town Seanzie should have attracted a bad wolf vote by now so again I think there is probably 1 here and it's probably Falcon.

I would tend to think the mafia is composed in some formation of the below

JOH/Alison
Porscha/Boq
Seanzie/Nanook/Falcon

And I am thinking right now it's probably Jack, Boquise, Falcon.

What Mac last said about Porscha ftr.

I prob expect him to show up a couple minutes before EOD planting a vote on someone he wants lynched though.

[Lilypetal]

[VOTE: jackofhearts2005] aubergine

meh

do something

i dont want to kill u

what? lol

i would like to see this slot be towny

[arogame123]

I thought both were pretty townie early on and Boq's frustration of his town reads on him not defending him felt pretty townie as well. I feel like he has been attempting to push the game in a direction and his getting sr for "fear of potential powerwoflers." Additionally, I think the way Boq handled Porscha was pretty townie and explained his issues that he was having with Porscha but also noted some parts of townieness that he found. It didn't seem like he was just sr Porscha to just hop on her wagon.

Idk if Boq can be really read based on being frustrated at being pushed. I feel like he should be read at his ability of bringing wolves to noose.

hmm I guess, I just read it and the way he reacted to his sr and who was pushing him felt ok. But more so, getting mad at ur tr and then voting them, like he did with spf, is something that town are more likely to do than mafia. THat is bc mafia want to appeal to their tr and get the votes off them, while town mainly are focused on finding scum as well and who is being "scummy around their pressure" so I thought that was a good look from Boq. However, SPF was defending Boq as well during that, but Boq didn't see it at the time prompting his vote.

But if he should be read at his ability of bringing wolves, is there a reason he got wagoned they way he did?

Like I had a similar frustration to u Creature where people were just seemingly getting passes for pelts which is fine, but if people believe someone is scummy, just vote on them and move on. Don't give them wriggle room lol

[robyn]

Creature/Mac/Lily

Nook/Aro/Alison

Yeah I don't think one wagon is more towny than the other

[Creature]

Also Creature, I saw you went from Porscha to likely not being a hit to now having Porsscha in top 2 in ur wagon. What is the main reason for that?

Idk how to read Porscha tbh. I feel like I am biased to wolfread her every game and I got bothered when she got six votes at someone. She's in my top 2 because apparently reputable players (like Alison) seem to be wolfreading her so that improves her chance to be a hit.

[arogame123]

Oh right I forgot about MissSparkles/RondoDimBuckle but they're arguably more shrug lynch than both Jack and Porscha.

There's also falcon45ca but Alison townreads him.

arogame123 seemed pretty town for me. Is he this good at wolfing?

lucy I'm feelijg a bit meh. She was townreading me yet voted me sheeping Mac and planted her vote on me despite Mac now townreading me. Idk if lucy has done anything useful since then.

I shouldn't have voted yesterday, dunno what to do with my vote now. I'm gonna iso Mac to see what he said about Porscha since he has good meta. And I thought Jack was a towny that gets MLed a lot, no?

Can you expand on that thought? Do you think Jack is towny here?

[staypositivefriend]

jack i have temporarily unvoted u and changed my vote to sleep as a peace treaty. if ur town then help me figure out who the mafia is and who we should vote instead

I am kinda confused and skimmed through, but what were the main reasons u were scum reading Jack and why he had the wagon on him?

Is it cause he voted Boq over Porscha through communicating that early? I am kinda lost.

-i think the wagon on boq has (or had) a high likeliehood of being scum driven, because boq had a consistent amount of high momentum against him in spite of the reasons to scumread him not extending beyond; "Boq Doesn't Feel Towny". through that lens, i thought it was suspicious that jack chose to park his vote on boq while dipping from the thread, particularly because i don't think town!jack would generally be comfortable with a strong player like boq getting killed on d1 unless he had a good reason to townread him

(i also generally think his testimony of: "i voted for boq because i thought the day was ending" is self-contradictory since about an hour and a half before voting boq, he made a vote saying that he might vote for porscha at the EOD, implying that his vote on boq was not driven by him thinking the day was ending soon, but this is somewhat nitpicky/semantic-y. maybe he just thought the EOD was several hours earlier than it was for some reason?)

-i disliked him saying that it was wolfy for me to have called neon a frozen wolf but that he didn't want to push on me since neon was townreading me, since he made it clear from his posts that he did not actually townread neon, and since i do not perceive jack as the type of player who would be afraid to pursue suspicions against strong players just because someone is townreading them

-he made several posts that felt like someone going through the motions of scumhunting without actually being invested in Solving The Mystery of the game (ie: asking a question about porscha then not following up, or even now him claiming that he townread porscha all along in spite of him saying he might vote for porscha at the EOD, etc etc)

i unvoted him to give him some space because his sassiness when i was arguing with him made me worry that he was town that i was getting confirmation biased on, but those are generally the concerns that i have with his posts so far. i will give the caveat that i don't really know how to read jack and am not sure if i've seen him wolf before

jack i have temporarily unvoted u and changed my vote to sleep as a peace treaty. if ur town then help me figure out who the mafia is and who we should vote instead

Oh how reasonable. And if I don’t look at other players, it’s my fault when you re-vote me.

yeah that is pretty much what i'm saying. gl gl!

[arogame123]

Also Creature, I saw you went from Porscha to likely not being a hit to now having Porsscha in top 2 in ur wagon. What is the main reason for that?

Idk how to read Porscha tbh. I feel like I am biased to wolfread her every game and I got bothered when she got six votes at someone. She's in my top 2 because apparently reputable players (like Alison) seem to be wolfreading her so that improves her chance to be a hit.

Hmm I see, but what's ur read on Alison? I didn't see u tr her, unless ur just putting faith in her for today and giving her the benefit of the doubt.

For what it's worth, I found it interesting that Alison reversed her read on Neon but then I saw her also push on Porscha and I'm like hmm interesting.

[robyn]

Oh right I forgot about MissSparkles/RondoDimBuckle but they're arguably more shrug lynch than both Jack and Porscha.

There's also falcon45ca but Alison townreads him.

arogame123 seemed pretty town for me. Is he this good at wolfing?

lucy I'm feelijg a bit meh. She was townreading me yet voted me sheeping Mac and planted her vote on me despite Mac now townreading me. Idk if lucy has done anything useful since then.

I shouldn't have voted yesterday, dunno what to do with my vote now. I'm gonna iso Mac to see what he said about Porscha since he has good meta. And I thought Jack was a towny that gets MLed a lot, no?

Can you expand on that thought? Do you think Jack is towny here?

no, I just think town Jack gets wagoned a bunch, reading spec chat gives meta such as this
it's more an observation than a read