Day 6 seems like a good place to start. It's been harped on a bunch, but in my mind it was the most chaotic and, hopefully, revealing moment in the game overall. For my purposes, it starts with
this post I made. It was a standard innocent prod for conversation, aimed at two players (Quin and Epi) to kick the day off. Epi responded by immediately throwing shade at me. He was bad. Quin and Dom also had responses, so let's look at them here:
Quin wrote:Sloonei wrote:Epi, who you gonna vote for now that Mr Mac is dead?
Quin, who's your supposed 3 person scum team?
Glorfindel, Dom and Wilgy.
Mac didn't like the first two very much. I'm partial to your argument against Wilgy. They all need ISO's.
What's yours?
A direct response to the question I asked with a brief explanation and a follow-up question. Quin checks off all the Mafia 101 boxes in this post. That looks good. It's also an easy play for a baddie trying to appear town.
Dom's case against Quin started with the false claim that Mac (Night 5's NK victim) had been suspicious of Dom. I see the falsehood there, but I don't see it as a "lie" as Dom spun it. I look at it as a simple mistake. I think this post is mostly harmless and, much like I was not spinning anything against Epi at the time, I don't think Quin was trying to spin something unfair against Dom. He was stating a suspicion which happened to be predicated on a mistaken observation.
On the other hand, Dom's response to my question:
Dom wrote:Sloonei who are you going to vote for?
if they die who are you going to vote for?
if they die who are you going to vote for?
Quinn: Citation needed that Mac didn't like me.
Aggressively comes after me for what he perceives to be unfair interrogation methods against Epi. The obvious piece of glaring suspicion to point out here is that it looks like Dom is defending Epi. I'd like to ask Dom if he has any thoughts on that now.
Dom calls Quin a "liar" in his very next post:
That is strong language which I object to, as I already said above. Making a mistake or failing to acknowledge a falsehood does not constitute lying. A lie is deliberate. I got no such sense from Quin and he acknowledges he was wrong and explains the origin of his mistake promptly
right here.
Dom wrote:Why would I kill both someone who thought I was civ and someone I was trying to get lynched?
Dom launched into the same self-defense he's using again today, all the way back on Day 6. This strikes me as overly-defensive in my re-read. This thought is not really connected to anything either Quin or I was saying at the time and it comes out appearing like an opportunistic and calculated defense that he just wanted to get out for the sake of doubt and argument.
This is where Dom's hyper-defensiveness starts to come out as an aggressive OMGUS against myself and Quin. Perhaps it's because we became naturally separated into two opposing sides here, but this entire interaction inclines me to read Quin as town and Dom as bad. Once again I can't ignore the similarities between his response with Epi's concurrent behavior. They're both turning slight or no suspicion at all into aggressive pursuit of the two players opposite them. I wonder if it's conceivable for two baddies to come out of the gate with the exact same strategy in a situation like this, whether intentional or not, or whether it's just a bit of a coincidence and Dom was simply responding unfavorably to what he thought was an unfair suspicion. Regardless, his reaction seems a bit overblown in retrospect.
I also can't ignore the hypocrisy he engaged in here. Quin is lying and "spouting BS" about him, but he is also accusing me of things that I never said or did ("that's not what you asked" and his later claim about my Glorfindel suspicion (once again he is defending a now-confirmed scum)).
Dom wrote:Sloonei wrote:Dom wrote:Quin wrote:No, I didn't know that the post you quoted even existed.
When did you replace in?
TBH, if you want to make a claim why not research it at all?
Sloonei wrote:Dom wrote:That's not what you asked.
And you didn't answer my question(s).
I have a funny way of saying things.
Yes I did.
Did you?
Why expect Epi to have a next suspect to vote when you didn't name one if Glorf was suddenly dead?
I wanted to hear his thoughts. He gave them. I am satisfied with his response for now.
Who are you
considering voting for?
You,
Glorf, Quin, Lorab, and Scotty.
Casts a wide and vague net. I tend to believe that scum players always list at least one teammate when giving a list of reads like this.
Dom wrote:Quin wrote:Dom wrote:Quin-- no.
I'm sure you wouldn't mind elaborating on your read, in that case.
Why?
I said what I feel is relevant. I didn't suspect you until Day 6. I didn't suspect Sloonei until Day 6. What elaborating is there to do?
Quin wrote:Quin wrote:Dom wrote:Quin-- no.
I'm sure you wouldn't mind elaborating on your read, in that case.
Actually, I'm voting for you until you do elaborate. This is the only game related post you've written to or about me prior to my post yesterday, and I'm not even sure about this one because I don't know which paragraph you were referring to:
Dom wrote:JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Dom wrote:JaggedJimmyJay wrote:LoRab wrote:@jjj: to answer your query about your first point, I agree. I also think it makes it highly unlikely that Elo had BTSC with glorf. Or Quin for that matter.
Do you feel there's anything to be said from that about indiglo, the other replacement?
Can you spell out what you mean here?
Elohcin said she thought a baddie would be replaced before a townie by priority, which she used against Quin since he replaced in first.
I wonder if Elohcin thought to say this because indiglo was the actual baddie replacement and she came second -- against Eloh's expectations.
Ah.
Lynch Indi/INH.
I'm not buying what you're selling.
This is non-sensical.
This is where Quin's case against Dom starts in earnest. Dom rejects it by calling it non-sensical, but I think it's pretty reasonable looking suspicion. Dom has apparently ignored Quin all game long and Quin calls him out on this sudden strong shift in his perspective. These things happen for townies, but that doesn't make it acceptable for Dom to dismiss the entire thing as "nonsense". I am trying to be objective about these two in this review, but at face value Quin just looks a lot better, a lot more level-headed and honest. I've had the sense all along that he is trying to read Dom here and I still get that sense. Dom is just lashing out and rejecting whatever is said against his agenda (by both Quin and myself). It is true that Quin was interpreting his own question backwards, but Dom's response still looks too strongly dismissive for my taste.
Dom wrote:I'm unlikely to vote for you-- but I've got my
on you.
This is an interesting development that goes against the other things I've said. For a brief moment, it appears cooler heads have prevailed. Quin explains his point of view, they come to a better understanding, and Dom maintains his suspicion but loses the severity.
To be fair I can see an angle where Quin is bad and he realizes his attempts to cast shade on Dom has failed and now he has no choice but to back down. I can't really identify which is the case here, but I should at least acknowledge this possibility.
Not too long after that, however, he makes
this post where he keeps up the Quin suspicion while also acknowledging the possibility that Quin was mistaken, and also presents his erroneous interpretation of my answer to his question from the beginning of the day. I wish I had not been so focused on Wilgy at this time or I would have followed up more strongly on this whole Dom thing. It looks bad that his case against Quin hinges on Quin's misunderstanding/spreading of false information regarding him, but then his case against me hinges on him doing the exact same thing. I get that a town Dom would not necessarily recognize this as hypocrisy, but it seems revealing in some way that this is going on here.
Dom wrote:Sloonei wrote:This was my answer to your question, Dom. Please point out the parts of it which you object to:
Sloonei wrote:Dom wrote:Sloonei who are you going to vote for?
if they die who are you going to vote for?
if they die who are you going to vote for?
Quinn: Citation needed that Mac didn't like me.
I am currently voting for Glorfindel until further notice. I am also considering everyone else.
This doesn't answer the question in any way that is useful. AGain, why is Epi fully responsible for knowing who he's voting for the second his top suspect dies but you are not?
"In a way that is useful." I'd like to know what that means, Dom. If you're still reading this massive wall of text. Maybe I should mention in
BIG COLORFUL LETTERS that
I am asking you a question, Dom! And I'd like an answer, if you're capable. What were you hoping to get out of me here? On the one hand it seems you're just antagonizing me and trying to prove a point about my treatment of Epi ("why is Epi fully responsible..."), but in the previous sentence you suggest you are looking for specific game-relevant information out of me. Which is it? What was your motivation here?
After this, Dom goes on a mini crusade where he starts demanding I
answer his question, but I am still unclear on why this was such a huge deal or what was unsatisfactory about my many responses. When I pointed out to him that "who are you gonna vote for" is just a routine question I ask people in this game, he
swats it away by saying the context is different, and continues to go about demanding something out of me that is equal parts unclear and unfair. At the time I thought Dom was just flustered, but in retrospect he looks to simply be aggressively opposed to and stubbornly refusing anything that can be said against him. And I don't think that's a good look. I'm still not familiar with what past-scum Dom looks like, but I have seen plenty of scum performances that look like this from other players.
For the sake of cutting this post off and getting some thoughts into the thread, I'll leave it at this. If you don't feel like reading everything I just typed (and you certainly don't have to), my conclusion is this: Day 6 Dom looks like an over-defensive baddie who was unwilling to engage honestly with both Quin and myself. I left out his later accusations against Quin, but I think we're all familiar with them by now. My hope with this post was that I could gain a more neutral perspective of Quin and Dom, but I just came out of it feeling more strongly that Dom is bad and, therefore, Quin is good. I'm putting my vote on Dom, but this decision is by no means final.
