[ENDGAME] Bullets Over Broadway Mafia

[Marmot]

I will, but I'm heading out the door right now, so stay tuned.

[Bubbles]

Also TinyBubbles was lynched... she's on the death list but she's also still on the alive list and on the poll...

im unlynchable
sloonei's also on the alive list btw

[Bubbles]

Apologies for my lengthy absence. I am back.

welcome back!

[Bubbles]

Apologies for my lengthy absence. I am back.

welcome back!

sorry that should've been in red. i'm still dead folks

[JaggedJimmyJay]

another question to anyone who can answer:

has any living player here played with Cobalt prior to this game? i have some surface observations about his approach to mafia relevant to reading his alignment, but i would prefer the benefit of this insight before sharing.

I have played with him once before on jtm.

do you recall him playing abrasively in that game too? to a comparable degree with his conduct in this game?

[fingersplints]

another question to anyone who can answer:

has any living player here played with Cobalt prior to this game? i have some surface observations about his approach to mafia relevant to reading his alignment, but i would prefer the benefit of this insight before sharing.

I have played with him once before on jtm.

do you recall him playing abrasively in that game too? to a comparable degree with his conduct in this game?

It's about the same. SVS kind of already address the culture of another site he plays on being more abbrassive (to be fair to jtm that game she played was extreme even for them and resulted in a banning for it)
I was never very surprised by his going after LC early. He played one game with him and was his biggest defender all game. It seems more common to bring past game things into the current games early on there. For example, there seems to be a player there that always leads the lynch on another player every day 1. I felt like LC was one of the players Cobalt knows better (since they were so buddy buddy) and I know that whenever I am playing somewhere I am less comfortable I tend to look at the players I know better first. I guess whats fishiest for me is while he could be comfortable with LC and might have focused on him for that reason, he knows TGG better and I can't remember him discussing him much.
Scotty might be able to answer about Cobalts usual behavior too. the site I played with him once isn't even his home site, so I'm far from an expert on usual Cobalt.

[Black Rock]

I haven't done a big response to the "case" against me because I've been busy and frankly, this whole thing is giving me a headache. Lynch me, and I will turn up as a Civ. All your little theories and connections don't mean jack. If you think that I'm connected to Golden, to Nijuu, or whoever, then why don't you lynch them first and see - you'll have a better chance of getting a baddie, that's for damn sure.

What is the case against me? I'm on sig's team because I voted for him after he outed himself as a baddie? Why is no one calling bullshit on that? If you're so interested in the sig vote, why don't you have a look at people who didn't vote for him after he outed himself? Maybe that makes too much sense.

I haven't read back beyond the quick catchups I have been doing for the past week, but I think the other "case" against me is that I didn't go after LC or comment on him too much either way. At least half the people in this game are WELL aware that LC and I ALWAYS refrain from giving too much of a read in the thread on each other for about the first half of any game we're in together. This has been discussed publicly many times. We are married, and it's not fair to the game, the other players, the host, and to each other for us to focus too much on one another, because we would have an advantage in that area, as we often can see one another's reactions, posting mood, and more. Again, this fact is well known to those that play with us regularly, and I'm disappointed that no one has even bothered to bring that up.

Several people are trying to set me up as the easy bandwagon, and if that's what you're looking for, then by all means, vote me. I don't have a role that will let me survive a lynch like Cobalt, or survive kills like Golden or Sloonei. I can't tell you who the baddies are, I have a knee-jerk reaction to people like Timmer who act like they're on to something and try talk around weak points until they look like a case, it makes them look bad to me.

I'm a Civ, lynch me and I will turn up Civ. Maybe you'll look at the people who jumped on the BR bandwagon without caring whether the case was quality or bullshit, and maybe you won't.

[timmer]

@Golden, while I concede that my thoughts on you are less certain than my thoughts on Black Rock (who essentially just NO U'd me again), a number of your defences are a bit problematic. Yes you survived a kill but you seem content to just state that it was known who tried to kill you and build your defense around that while in fact we have aciv ninja role exposed in the front page and we have seen mafia kills show up on what seem like the wrong nights. So I do not see how you can brush off any chance of you being bad because you survived a kill. Also I have not started that I think you are on one team or another, but both you and Black Rock defend from the stance of Mafia 2. I dont try to s lot people into specific roles I just find what seems scummy.

I won't be cutting for you any time soon, but when Black Rock flips bad I will be studying you quite a bit add a potential teammate. I'm at work now so my posting will be sporadic.

[timmer]

And BR, YOU are the easy lynch? ?? Bubbles was easy. Covalt is easy. Not you.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i am sure this has been addressed already but: in a two-mafia-team game, how is it a relevant defense to survive a night kill?

[DFaraday]

i am sure this has been addressed already but: in a two-mafia-team game, how is it a relevant defense to survive a night kill?

It makes it unlikely that you are on the team that tried to kill you. Although, I once hosted a game where a baddie team NKed their teammate Night 2, so I wouldn't put it past any Mafia team to fake a kill.

I think Golden is probably not part of the plot, but I agree with Timmer that this sudden push for Cobalt, who's been on the backburner for days, is suspicious and comes across as a BR save. My thoughts on BR have not changed, aside from becoming even more suspicious of her, so I'll put my vote on BR for now.

*Votes BR*

[Epignosis]

I also voted for Black Rock.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

scotty too, seemingly.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

nutella, why were you so resistant to taking concrete stances of any kind on the players you had listed as neutral reads in your rainbow? i think Sloonei was right to press you on that and i don't believe you ever responded appropriately.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i see timmer being fielded as a big town read by a few different people. could anyone explain to me why that is the case? i'm sorry to ask so many questions that might force people to rehash old crap, but i have to get involved somehow.

and this game honestly seems to be moving at a snail's pace so it can't hurt.

[timmer]

I haven't done a big response to the "case" against me because I've been busy and frankly, this whole thing is giving me a headache. Lynch me, and I will turn up as a Civ.

One of the baddie roles, not perhaps coincidentally from the team that BR suggests I am trying to pin her on, has been revealed:

"Jekyll & Hyde - If I could reach you, if I could guide and teach youIt’s the classic tale—musicalized! Targets one player a night who must attempt to lynch another player. If that player is not lynched in three days, the targeted player will receive one extra vote in every lynch against them. Will show up as civilian upon lynching."

I find BR's lack of a true defense coupled with this new "I'll be a civ" statement very interesting based on this role reveal.

[G-Man]

Greetings again to you, my fellow Syndicateers!

My campaign has been pounding the pavement and I have to say that I like what I see. Sure, I may not be at the top of resurrection popularity polls and I see Golden has resorted to slinging mud at me even though he's not even eligible for this race. You might normally think these kinds of things might get a candidate down in the dumps but I've got news for you: popularity polls are for insecure losers and Golden is a coward.

Facing early resistance in a campaign means you're doing something right, so I am very proud to announce that I am pressing on and look forward to earning your vote for resurrection.

My campaign has worked feverishly at developing a lengthy list of issues that should be important to you because they are important to me. Let's not forget, I'm successful and should be rich any day now because I emulate the immaculate Donald Trump. Anything I say should leave you in a state of awe because people who emulate rich people are impressive go-getters. Anyone suggesting otherwise is probably a whiny loser who wants to turn this forum into a commie share-fest.

Let's talk about the internet, shall we? I think I shall. While I respect the integrity and independence of the internet, it is high time that we force video-streaming services like YouTube to reveal all available data on its users who post videos of cats accidentally or being tricked into injuring themselves. This is a violation of feline rights in the first degree and those peddling and profiting from these videos should be prosecuted to the fullest extent for the abuse and embarrassment they endorse. These poor cats have been hurt enough. It is cruel and unusual punishment for them to endure the perpetuation of their injuries every time someone links to a "hilarious" cat video on Facebook or Twitter.

While we're talking about rights, I'd like to exercise my freedom of speech to discuss freedom of speech. The freedom of speech is fundamental to a free society and must be protected for all except dogs. Not only are my staffers working on a prototype registration database but we are researching state-of-the-art muzzle technology. When I am elected your resurrectee, all dogs will be muzzled! Our patent-pending technology combines a traditional muzzle with that of shock collars and house-arrest ankle monitors. More on that in a future campaign rally.

In closing, vote for me. I will be- I tell you this- the best dog-repressing resurrectee ever. The Syndicate will be a better place, I'm sure of it. Before I go, I want to introduce my official campaign song. It truly is a classic and comes from a criminally underrated film. The message of this song is exactly in sync with my campaign. Remember- anyone who says otherwise is just a loser.

[Canucklehead]

Imma vote for BR.

[Cobalt]

I don't think I will be voting for you, Golden. I think people talk about baddies faux NKing themselves more than it ever really happens. Plus I have been BTS with LC quite a bit over the years, and I don't ever recall him setting up fake scenes in the thread. It could be that that has changed, last game I played with him he totally pulled the wool on me, but staged fights does not seem like his thing, or yours either for that matter, but I don't have the experience there as much as I do with LC. Although I must say I am rather curious about why you keep back burnering Ninjabloop.

I reread Cobalt last night. He is abrasive, and (I want to keep saying "she" becasue of the avatar) I will discuss content later if need be, but gotta go to work soonish. Cobalt would be an easy lynch in his first game here (or one of the first, not sure if he played here in a game I did not play?) due to tone. We tend to like a more moderate, tone and I know quite a few people (and I am at the head of that line, or am jostling for position as first with Juliets) who read abrasive as baddie. I once heard Juliets say something like, "Civvies don't need to be rude" and I kind of feel that way too. I tried playing a recent game at another forum, and the tone (which was the norm for them) chased me right the fuck out of there, lol. Permanently. I am fairly sure Cobalt played that game. But that is how they play, it may not be the thing for me, but it IS the thing for them.

I am trying to rely a bit less on tone, especially with all the people from different cultures; it is a big part of what went wrong for SVS1.0.

My point is that I am worried we are going to lynch someone based on tone more than anything. That tone is normal for Cobalt, so I will try to ignore it and his shock schtick. So removing the hyperbole type comments (which is also something *this* crowd tends to read as baddie) I find him fairly middle of the road opinion wise; nothing that really raised my brow much. I am not seeing what is so alarming about him, tbh.

Linki @MM~ can you explain your thought process to me re Cobalt? Not links, words.

And off to work

Yeah, my tone was nothing compared to the JTM peeps when I first got there, even I was out of my depth, lmao. Gotta have a tough skin and a bitch ass attitude if you wanna survive there. BUT, that game you played was egregiously out of line. It got really bad and Icege DQ'd cuz he wouldn't stop. So I don't blame you for tucking tail and running home, lmao.

G-Man you're dead go away.

I haven't done a big response to the "case" against me because I've been busy and frankly, this whole thing is giving me a headache. Lynch me, and I will turn up as a Civ.

One of the baddie roles, not perhaps coincidentally from the team that BR suggests I am trying to pin her on, has been revealed:

"Jekyll & Hyde - If I could reach you, if I could guide and teach youIt’s the classic tale—musicalized! Targets one player a night who must attempt to lynch another player. If that player is not lynched in three days, the targeted player will receive one extra vote in every lynch against them. Will show up as civilian upon lynching."

I find BR's lack of a true defense coupled with this new "I'll be a civ" statement very interesting based on this role reveal.

This is REALLY good evidence. I had noticed the Jekyll and Hyde role and noted that it would be complicated if that person flipped civ, or even wondering if they flipped already, but if Black Rock were scum, she would be able to make that "I'll be a civ" statement with confidence to make some of us look bad later.

another question to anyone who can answer:

has any living player here played with Cobalt prior to this game? i have some surface observations about his approach to mafia relevant to reading his alignment, but i would prefer the benefit of this insight before sharing.

I have played with him once before on jtm.

do you recall him playing abrasively in that game too? to a comparable degree with his conduct in this game?

It's about the same. SVS kind of already address the culture of another site he plays on being more abbrassive (to be fair to jtm that game she played was extreme even for them and resulted in a banning for it)
I was never very surprised by his going after LC early. He played one game with him and was his biggest defender all game. It seems more common to bring past game things into the current games early on there. For example, there seems to be a player there that always leads the lynch on another player every day 1. I felt like LC was one of the players Cobalt knows better (since they were so buddy buddy) and I know that whenever I am playing somewhere I am less comfortable I tend to look at the players I know better first. I guess whats fishiest for me is while he could be comfortable with LC and might have focused on him for that reason, he knows TGG better and I can't remember him discussing him much.
Scotty might be able to answer about Cobalts usual behavior too. the site I played with him once isn't even his home site, so I'm far from an expert on usual Cobalt.

Yeah, in places where I'm from it's common to bring old shit into new games. For example, on JTM, Alpha will always vote RadicalFuzz on day one (and even pulled that lynch off once) just because he thinks he's shit. I don't even know how it started.

With LC, it began as a joke, because he tricked me as mafia when we buddied up in the JTM game, and I felt stupid when he flipped scum, cuz one of the vigis saw through him. The way he responded to it and then further developments caused me to really commit to it. As far as TGG goes I knew he was having legit internet issues, and in retrospect I did realize he was salty about Epi subbing back in but I didn't make the connection at the time that TGG was on the scum team that killed Epi, and caught flack for it from Golden amongst others once G-Man (his replacement) flipped.

Is anyone gonna talk TO me or is everyone just gonna talk ABOUT me?

[Golden]

@Golden, while I concede that my thoughts on you are less certain than my thoughts on Black Rock (who essentially just NO U'd me again), a number of your defences are a bit problematic. Yes you survived a kill but you seem content to just state that it was known who tried to kill you and build your defense around that while in fact we have aciv ninja role exposed in the front page and we have seen mafia kills show up on what seem like the wrong nights. So I do not see how you can brush off any chance of you being bad because you survived a kill. Also I have not started that I think you are on one team or another, but both you and Black Rock defend from the stance of Mafia 2. I dont try to s lot people into specific roles I just find what seems scummy.

I won't be cutting for you any time soon, but when Black Rock flips bad I will be studying you quite a bit add a potential teammate. I'm at work now so my posting will be sporadic.

Actually, your case of my voting pattern WAS based on being mafia 2. Unless you think that when I called out TGG before G-Man even subbed in and continued to push that angle, I was doing a complete bus job there as well.

And we know wildhorn kills on even nights, so your theory that someone else killed me would require that wildhorn's kill was blocked AND someone else killed me AND I was saved by the doctor AND wildhorn's kill was not referenced.

And hey, I hadn't looked at the front page for a while, but suddenly a whole lot of roles are revealed :o

Timmer, I honestly cannot believe you actually can still believe it. I'm very surprised you didn't immediately go 'oh, yeah, I see your point'. Because your case on me is literally the most flawed case I have ever seen on me. There is no real feasibility to it whatsoever. Why did you ignore the points I raised about the fact that I was pretty much the first person calling BR out, four days before you were? She was calling me full of shit back then when I was trying to get her lynched.

It's even more flawed than Pilate trying to claim I was teammates with Isaac after I tried to get him lynched for 7 days. But it's pretty much on that level.

[Golden]

Hey, looks like the hooded figures may have been 'company' not any wildhorn corruption.

[Golden]

I don't think I will be voting for you, Golden. I think people talk about baddies faux NKing themselves more than it ever really happens. Plus I have been BTS with LC quite a bit over the years, and I don't ever recall him setting up fake scenes in the thread. It could be that that has changed, last game I played with him he totally pulled the wool on me, but staged fights does not seem like his thing, or yours either for that matter, but I don't have the experience there as much as I do with LC. Although I must say I am rather curious about why you keep back burnering Ninjabloop.

For the same reason I keep backburning BR. I can only lynch one person per day, and I have to do them in some order or another. There has not been a point in this game since about day 2 where I haven't had a long list of people I already believe are bad and given all of them but one have been correct so far, I haven't felt the need to re-evaluate.

If Cobalt and BR die in the next two days, then it's time for me to start evaluating the other cases like ninja and nutella.

[Golden]

And BR, YOU are the easy lynch? ?? Bubbles was easy. Covalt is easy. Not you.

This is absolutely true, and it's why BR has continued to take a back seat for me. The first time she was lynchable was yesterday, and I went for bubbles because there was a reasonable theory for why she could be on either team (so it was useful information to see which way she would have flipped, if bad) whereas I only see BR being on team 2.

[fingersplints]

Voting BR

I know she doesn't usually like to volunteer opinions on LC, but the bit about expecting others to point out why she wouldn't mention LC really seems off to me. Bit of a guilt trip.

[Golden]

Here is the thing I see on BR, splints.

She did offer opinions on LC... opinions about why he was not on mafia team one.

[Golden]

eg 'he wouldn't kill epi' and 'he wouldn't stage a fight with cobalt'...

When LC flipped mafia team two is when that clicked into place for me.

I'm changing my vote to BR too - I expect Timmer to say it's a late change to go with the flow. But I feel better staying as far away from ties as possible in this game.

[Golden]

And also, the random attempt on Bass from Bonnie and Clyde has me thinking of BR too, since she was the one who seemed most convinced he was bad.

[Canucklehead]

BR's responses to Timmer's case have been overtly dismissive ("all your little theories don't mean jack", etc.) and disproportionately angry ("The whole thing is giving me a headache", etch). The level of indignation and the attempts not the address the case but rather to belittle it do not seem like the responses of someone who has nothing to hide, but rather like the responses of someone who is backed into a corner and attempting to bluster their way out of it and scare people off from taking the case seriously. I don't think a div BR responds so dramatically. That's why she's getting my vote.

[Canucklehead]

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting BR's tone and reading into her posts a manufactured and hyperbolic frustration that isn't actually intended (and I'm sure she will correct me if that's the case), but that's how they come off to me.

[timmer]

In fairness to Golden, I wrote my bit about him late yesterday and it may not make as much sense as I thought at the time. I will revisit that later.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

when does this phase end? i see the time at the top of the poll, but i dunno what time zone that refers to.

[Golden]

when does this phase end? i see the time at the top of the poll, but i dunno what time zone that refers to.

You can set the entire forum to reflect your time setting in the User Control Panel, and the poll time will move with it.

[Golden]

It is now day 7. You have until 10:30PM EST on JULY 7th to lynch someone.

Having said that, Dom said this - so this, and not the poll, is when the poll closes, you might need to check what that is in your time zone. I think Dom said it because he has to make the poll go for 48 hours but he wants to get the timing back on track to a reasonable hour.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i am finding it even more difficult than i expected getting situated in this game. there's just so much context i've missed. so i have a request.

i may not vote for a top candidate today. i don't feel qualified, because even when presented with a case i can't really grasp the validity of it without having been present for the rest. i have begun to read the full thread, but that'll take a while -- and reading through it won't be as meaningful as playing through it was. i may still vote along with you folks if i can find a good enough reason to.

but here's my request: can i please have two different players each name one other player they'd like for me to look into? i ask for two because i don't want a mafia player to be the only one assigning me homework. i'll focus on them specifically, and that workload might help me to get better acquainted with the general flow of the game. try to name people who are difficult reads or swing players if there are any to be named.

[Canucklehead]

Fingersplints and Nutella would be my picks.


Mostly because they're two people who I currently think are civ, but if pressed couldn't actually give a reason WHY I think they're div.

[Golden]

I'll give you Cobalt, but if you would prefer someone who isn't already a top candidate, how about Scotty.

[S~V~S]

JJJ, i nominate Ninja and Hedgeowl. Sloonei was hot and heavy for Ninja and TH was suspicious of Hedgie.

I just got home and am only moderately caught up. For now I am voting Ninja as that is the best case I have seen of what I have read. BR is my after dinner read, so that may change.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i'll try to do all three (splints, nutella, scotty). if time permits i'll do the others S~V~S just suggested.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

looking into nutella

any points i make may well be rehashes of old discussions or miss important context. i don't know, but i think it's best if i don't worry about that. if it happens, yell at me.

Spoiler: show

I don't get the Hedgeowl suspicion at all. She posted while catching up and gave her input on a couple main discussions. None of her posts look particularly bad to me, just kind of average minimal-but-sufficient participation. I guess I understood LC's point (though it was regarding SVS) about commenting on issues rather than players, but Hedgie gave her views on LC/Epi/SVS so that doesn't really apply. I don't know, she could be hiding behind that type of participation (I haven't played many games with her but isn't it kind of her norm?) but I just don't really see the reasons for suspecting her, they seem contrived.

I could see SVS as bad. I mean, SVS is always bad

this post is somewhat troubling for covering so much ground within a single read of one player, especially on Day 1. nutella feels strongly enough about her defense of Hedgeowl that she is willing to use such strong language as "I don't get the suspicion at all", but is also willing to semi-explore the theories proposed against her. it's a stronger defense than one might expect to encounter so early, and it contains at least one caveat (highlighted in yellow) to shake the post on its own foundation.

Spoiler: show

...I just stated some.
For the most part though it is too early for me to form reads unless something crazy happens. As for LC and Epi, idk I think they're their usual zany selves, could be any alignment.

Sloonei prompted nutella for reads on Day 1 and this was one immediate response. i am not a big fan of it because the names she mentions are accompanied by non-reads. i don't know why she even bothered to mention LC or Epi 1.0 in this post, because her reads on them seem to mesh with her reads on everyone else as she put it herself (bolded, highlighted). this is additionally problematic given the Mafia-2 flip by LC.

Spoiler: show

I am kind of lost as to where to go this day 1. I haven't really caught on to any of the popular suspicions. I'm at work and won't really have time to re-read stuff so I hope something comes up as I catch up that will give me some direction, but I usually feel hopelessly uncertain about everyone on day 1 :\

those of you who've played with her before: is it typical for nutella to be so timid about providing reads on players on Day 1? she was really struggling at various points to take any stances.\

Spoiler: show

I'm getting a weird vibe from LC and I can't really put my finger on it. It's like he doesn't seem LCish to me. But maybe that's because I haven't really played with him in a while (not counting Pilate which was decidedly not his usual style) and I may be projecting misremembered conceptions of his style, or maybe it's because he's been busy IRL, idk there's just been something nagging at the back of my head about all his posts so far that just feels not quite right. Obviously he's particularly on the defensive right now so maybe I am reading too much into how he's acting under pressure.

Nice sandwich truck! Needs some avocado though.


@Scotty what evidence do you see that there could be two kills? We don't seem to know anything about the roles or the baddie teams really, unless I'm missing something... Typically when there are two teams they kill on alternate nights (I guess you're new to the site and might not have realized that). Though it certainly could be the case that two or more roles/teams kill on the same night. There could be a civ ninja or an indie SK.


Btw I am voting to read the book.

it's important to note here that nutella started voicing some uneasiness about LC on Night 1, after having asserted he seemed like his usual self earlier on Day 1. this is a strange change of tune, and it's not ideal having followed the Day 1 lynch in which LC narrowly avoided being lynched (thanks in part to nutella's late vote going to Cobalt). so nutella waited until LC was safe from lynching to express this concern about him, and it's the first such comment she made about him in the game that i can see. that's a pretty bad look.

Spoiler: show

My thoughts on Epi getting NKed: Usually when a nightkill target during the first couple nights of the game is someone who has been strongly pushing suspicion against someone else, I tend to think it is the baddies' attempt to frame the suspected party. (Can get complicated and WIFOMy though, like if the suspected party really is on the offending team and thinks "nobody will think I actually targeted the person who pushed for my lynch, they'll think it was a frameup" -- that's possible, and maybe this frameup would be too easy) but I'm inclined to think it could be an attempt to frame LC. Which just makes me all the more suspicious of Cobalt for today.

uh oh. this post is pretty suspicious too, especially since it's come to light that LC was indeed mafia and took part in killing Epi 1.0. this was proven not to be a frame job, and so that nutella provided this theory that it was a framejob, unprompted as far as i can tell, just appears inorganic. it's okay to be wrong about some things as a townie, but usually that wrongness occurs in a perspective espoused during a relevant thread discussion. this wrong thing came from the void, protected LC, and placed the crosshairs on the ever-suspected Cobalt instead. soon after nutella had expressed uneasiness about LC too on Night 1.

Spoiler: show

Lol just saw Cobalt laughing off the attempt to frame *him*. Funny joke, you must have enjoyed planning it!

Sorry for posting so many times in a row, and for being so rambly, but my thoughts are going a mile a minute. But I guess I could see it either way. Epi was really gunning hard for Cobalt too by the end of the day, so maybe it was more of a Cobalt frame. Maybe LC and Cobalt are trying to frame each other. Or even better, they're both bad, maybe they're teammates after all and Cobalt's trying to pull a daredevil distancing strategy.

nutella's takes on Cobalt and LC are pretty contradictory during this period of her post history. she seemed to notice that and ended up with these "maybe they're both bad" comments accompanied by vague assertions of simultaneous framing -- or even cooperative framing.

Spoiler: show

I think the Tiny pattern thing you mentioned above was brought up because people thought that it was odd she would keep mentioning it over and over and that it could eb the case she's just trying too hard to be careful and mimic every other game she has played. I thnik there could be something to this theory, and I have my eye on her but I would like to observe her for a little longer. She is also a very low poster so I haven't read much from her.

I had considered Cobalt for my vote last time round, and I think he's my top suspect for todays lynch. I get really scummy vibes off him. I am a little worried about the things he has insiunated about his role, but I also think those could indicate that he is mafia.

Golden is someone I want to keep a closer eye on. I couldn't give you specifics at this moment in time (hence wanting to scrutinise further) but I've always played with civvie Golden and feel like there's something slightly different this game.

i never like theories about mafia team mates before even one of them has been confirmed as mafia. these ideas have higher manipulative potential than the mean, and now we can look back on this one with narrowed eyes because of Bubbles' town flip. nutella saw fit to link the two of them together (albeit on the strength of theories brought forth by others -- she gave them credit and hopped aboard). this supposed link may have been a big part of what led to Bubbles' eventual lynch. is that correct? if so, it was clearly an erroneous strategic course and i think it's valid to view nutella with suspicion for it now.

Spoiler: show

I'm thinking of voting for Hedgeowl, or maybe for nutella because she completely ignored my thoughts on her 0_0

What thoughts did you want me to address? I saw you bring my name up but I didn't think you were addressing anything to me.


Curious developments regarding Bass and Epi2. Wonder what made BR so certain about Bass.

minor point perhaps, but i don't know why Turnip would say nutella's name without meaning to address her in some capacity. so this is a strange comment.

Spoiler: show

I hope G-man is actually going to stop posting all those images. It's annoying as hell. I don't care if you lost a bet or whatever. You're not being a helpful participant.

Is the case on Tiny Bubbles contingent on LC also being bad? Or is there a case for bad TB with a civ LC?

This tbh. I suspect LC a little bit more than Bubbles, and if LC ends up bad I'd look at her as a possible teammate, but I don't see any independent reason to suspect her.

And yeah I don't understand the thing with BR's post. I don't get how it happened but I don't get how it makes her suspicious either.

continued promotion of the erroneous Bubbles/LC link.

Spoiler: show

If only anyone actually read my posts I did in fact discuss my PM when they were being discussed at first, and that it involved protection and a role check and yes it does seem to be the same as Niju's.


I do suspect sig, am going to more carefully re-read sloonei's case to confirm that I agree and then I might switch my vote (doesn't look like Bass is that likely of a candidate at this point)

i think the stronger case to be made against nutella so far is to link her to LC and Mafia-2. this post can be seen through that lens i think. sig was lynched in a landslide vote and flipped Mafia-1. if nutella is a member of Mafia-2 then she had no way of knowing for sure (unless i am missing a significant detail) that sig was not a civilian. so she placed a very late vote and kind of shoved the responsibility for the case to Sloonei instead of shouldering it herself. it's a less meaningful point because it's more speculative, but it's something to think about.

Spoiler: show

Oh nutella! I forgot to ask. Since you feel like talking about Long Con, what is your read on him? Would you consider a lynch of him today?

Yes, I kind of thought I said this in my post...? There's been a consistent trend of people not reading what I post
I said I'd be happy to lynch either LC or Gman, I think they are both likely to be bad. Particularly regarding LC, to answer your question in a bit more detail: I've found his posts as a whole rather odd the entire game, and I think he is playing a very baddie style. I've gone back and forth with uncertainty a couple times, for instance after night 1 when I thought he might have been framed. But at this point I really think he is more likely bad than not.

i give nutella credit for holding true to her story with admirable precision on Day 4 regarding her reads on LC. she's kind of been all over the place with him throughout her post history with the most recurring theme being calling him suspicious but always placing someone else a notch above him on the priority list. that's not a great trend, but it's possible for it to be genuine and i think it's a decent reflection that she was consistent in this case.

Spoiler: show

Who are your suspects today Bass?

My top suspect is still cobalt. When I was doing my six page catch up I got a bad vibe from LC when he switched his vote after saying he wasnt going to be around. Today LC is starting to read more normal to me, so I have him in a gray area. The problem i'm having is trying to remember what mafia LC looks like. I know he was Indy in RR but I think the only game I have seen him be bad in was my first mafia game ever Supernatural Mafia on Rev. I got a slight ping from DF when he made the comment about me not saying anything because I think this is the most I have ever posted in a game this early. I felt like he is skipping over stuff and I tend to think baddies skim and skip stuff because they arent really worried about catching any mafia.

There are a lot of people who I would like to hear more from when they get caught up.

This is the post I found most suspicious. It really sounded like you were waffling on LC and trying to justify not suspecting him while looking like you were also trying to reconsider your position on him to go along with the thread. If LC is bad this totally looks teammate-y. Even if he isn't, this really looks like a baddie style of trying to blend in and giving some thoughts that look original. And (I think BR pointed this out too) those last couple sentences are really really vague and sound like you're trying too hard to look civvie.


I know it's really not the strongest case, and that's because it's largely a gut feeling, which I know you can't really defend against but I do hope to see you participate more and give actual input. Because so far you've given me the impression of a baddie trying to blend in.


linki: It certainly doesn't seem like you've been posting much. I just looked and you have more posts in thread than I thought, but that is not necessarily a good sign. Quality over quantity. Maybe you're making little posts here and there but you've barely contributed anything.

i'm not a fan of this one. she was critical of Bass for "waffling" about LC, but i don't think he was really waffling very much -- at least not in that post. nutella has waffled quite a lot about LC herself throughout her post history. and if LC is finally going to be lynched (as he was on Day 4), it's of course important for his team mates to set up non Mafia-2-aligned players to look bad. i think nutella could be accused of smearing Bass pre-emptively and unfairly here, anticipating the lynch and mafia flip of LC.

~~~

that's probably enough. based on what i can see here in my still limited experience with this game thread, i think there are valid reasons to suspect nutella. if i am off-base on anything, i ask anyone to tell me why. this exercise alone was very helpful in getting me acclimated with the progression of the game though.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

and y'all thought Sloonei was dead.

[Black Rock]

And BR, YOU are the easy lynch? ?? Bubbles was easy. Covalt is easy. Not you.

If you say so, Timmer. Today's gigantic bandwagon was so hard. You made a couple of points on me that point to me being on two different baddie teams, and people ate it up. Things must be pretty quiet for you guys behind the scenes today, huh Timmer?

I know she doesn't usually like to volunteer opinions on LC, but the bit about expecting others to point out why she wouldn't mention LC really seems off to me. Bit of a guilt trip.

You're right, it's only been discussed in half the games I've played recently, so it's really far-fetched to think that anyone would even think to bring it up. Silly me.

BR's responses to Timmer's case have been overtly dismissive ("all your little theories don't mean jack", etc.) and disproportionately angry ("The whole thing is giving me a headache", etch). The level of indignation and the attempts not the address the case but rather to belittle it do not seem like the responses of someone who has nothing to hide, but rather like the responses of someone who is backed into a corner and attempting to bluster their way out of it and scare people off from taking the case seriously. I don't think a div BR responds so dramatically. That's why she's getting my vote.

It is giving me a headache, frankly. It's been the cool thing to do for a few games now to start a BR lynch train and ride it all the way to the station. This is going to be the last game I play for a little while, until you decide on a new target.

I don't know what you expect me to do to defend myself. I don't need 16 posts to say "I voted for sig because he outed himself" and "I didn't have much to say about LC because I never do early on in games". I've said it a few times, and all I get is new people coming in with "Hey guys, I'm more convinced than ever that BR is bad!" I'm not going to waste my time posting if no one is going to care, a lot of people here like to talk just to hear themselves speak, but I'm not one of them.

[Black Rock]

And BR, YOU are the easy lynch? ?? Bubbles was easy. Covalt is easy. Not you.

If you say so, Timmer. Today's gigantic bandwagon was so hard. You made a couple of points on me that point to me being on two different baddie teams, and people ate it up. Things must be pretty quiet for you guys behind the scenes today, huh Timmer?

I know she doesn't usually like to volunteer opinions on LC, but the bit about expecting others to point out why she wouldn't mention LC really seems off to me. Bit of a guilt trip.

You're right, it's only been discussed in half the games I've played recently, so it's really far-fetched to think that anyone would even think to bring it up. Silly me.

BR's responses to Timmer's case have been overtly dismissive ("all your little theories don't mean jack", etc.) and disproportionately angry ("The whole thing is giving me a headache", etch). The level of indignation and the attempts not the address the case but rather to belittle it do not seem like the responses of someone who has nothing to hide, but rather like the responses of someone who is backed into a corner and attempting to bluster their way out of it and scare people off from taking the case seriously. I don't think a div BR responds so dramatically. That's why she's getting my vote.

It is giving me a headache, frankly. It's been the cool thing to do for a few games now to start a BR lynch train and ride it all the way to the station. This is going to be the last game I play for a little while, until you decide on a new target.

I don't know what you expect me to do to defend myself. I don't need 16 posts to say "I voted for sig because he outed himself" and "I didn't have much to say about LC because I never do early on in games". I've said it a few times, and all I get is new people coming in with "Hey guys, I'm more convinced than ever that BR is bad!" I'm not going to waste my time posting if no one is going to care, a lot of people here like to talk just to hear themselves speak, but I'm not one of them.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i don't think you're suspicious BR (because i am clueless about you and most other players right now ). who do you think is most suspicious? sometimes being forced into constant self-defense limits one's ability to do anything else -- like play offense.

[Bass_the_Clever]

Ok so I'm going to vote cobalt. His game play has read bad to me all game.

[Cobalt]

Ok so I'm going to vote cobalt. His game play has read bad to me all game.

Lol, you're so unbelievably bad.

[Cobalt]

Pay attention to the tally, scum trying to push my lynch towards the end of the day.

[timmer]

Have to head out the door, gotta vote quick, should be obvious.

[Black Rock]

*wonders if Timmer plans to call Cobalt out on his No U*

*knows why he won't*

[Golden]

Have to head out the door, gotta vote quick, should be obvious.

Hey, timmer, you point out my day four vote and then you go doing that????

Now I'm incredibly suspicious of you. At least before I could understand why you were calling out on my day four vote. Now I find out that you probably know exactly what was going on.

[Hedgeowl]

Welcome JJJ and SVS! Glad to have you, even though I have been super absent this game. So far in catch-up I have only read this page, so my plan is to vote now since they are changeable and then continue to catch up this evening while also during other things.

I obviously need to catch-up more on the BR case because I just havent been present enough to understand it beyond that she defended LC early on. Of all the people to get caught in a defense of LC, I would think someone's spouse would be the one. If they had been on a team, I think it less likely she would have defended him honestly. Now, I also felt that he wouldn't be the kind of player to go after Epi on Day 1, but didn't mean I didn't vote for him with two mafia teams.