Banjo-Kazooie Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Dragon D. Luffy]

1. Nanook’s flip is confusing in light of yesterday, and also an unconventional kill choice at face value.

I'd wager mafia just pissed their pants at the idea of nanook being a cop.

[G-Man]

Popping in while I eat some dinner.

I am totally baffled by Nanook’s actions, but RIP.

Ding dong the witch is dead!

Are we thinking it was a SK or did Jimmy add a ?-shot civvie vig to balance his baddie-friendly game?

[G-Man]

PS- I’ll try to answer your questions, totes;
I’m that nice of a nice fella.
Don’t give me your votes
Because I know who killed Nutella.

[speedchuck]

Are we thinking it was a SK or did Jimmy add a ?-shot civvie vig to balance his baddie-friendly game?

I can't imagine it being a SK. Why would an SK go for nutella?

[speedchuck]

Kind of a weird role for nanook to have. I wonder what kind of conclusion he was trying to get based on it.

He knew Sig was vanilla, alright. Did he think vanilla mafia was more likely to be bad?

You could argue it is because the host said he would make up for the setup being scumsided. But so far there have been a lot of vanilla town roles.

That said I'm expecting the mafia to be pretty weak. Maybe nutella was the only non-vanilla role in the mafia since she is the villain of the game. Then again this isn't a very powerful ability for it to be the only one, I guess.

Maybe he thought that, if his role had a purpose for town, that might be it. A pseudo-cop sort of thing. I'm pretty convinced he was wrong, with all the vanilla flips (and the non-vanilla scum flip).

In any case, we can move on from it now. Nanook and Sig both flipped, and their actions aren't going to tell us much. We can look for TMI there, and for nutella interactions.

[speedchuck]

My initial thoughts are that, based on what I remember reading of nutella this morning, Sloonei looks pretty good? And G-man maybe as well?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I'm lowkey just waiting for the ISO people to do their thing before voting.

[G-Man]

Ponder this with me, folks:

I have information that, if shared and corroborated, could reduce our POE pool by two.

If Nutella was killed by a serial killer, then I give Jimmy mad points for it, even if it impairs the winnability of the game for the civs.

An SK can’t be trusted by either side,
And we’d see which side would flinch.
Would the baddies skin the SK’s hide,
Or do we all give in and lynch?

If Nutella was killed by a civvie vig, then it begs the question...

One shot? Two shot?
How many do they got?
If one’s the number, then let’s dance!
If it’s more then I take a firm stance.

Would a one-shot civ vig be enough balance for the rest of what we perceive this game to be? I don’t want to expose someone with another round of ammo and feed the baddies an easy kill choice for Night 3.

Deliberate we must.
We could gain two to trust.
Nine of us remain.
Who must we detain?

My favorite Muppet
Was never Miss Piggy.
But I believe that strange puppet
Just earned me a Jiggy!

[dunya]

There is no serial killer. OP clearly states only 2 factions

Town and Mafia. That's it.

[dunya]

This game features only two factions: civilians and mafia.

Night phases are open. Mafia BTSC is constant.

[dunya]

Gman is a town read for me.

I'm looking at DDL, Tony/speed and Russti now and their interactions with nutella, and reactions to the Mac and sig lynches.

[G-Man]

There is no serial killer. OP clearly states only 2 factions

Town and Mafia. That's it.

Perfect. I don’t know how many times I have read over the OP content and that never sank in.

So forget all the jive turkey SK stuff and riddle me this:

Is sharing my information worth the risk of losing out on a possible additional civ vig kill?

[dunya]

I think you should hold onto it for now, G, and allow the person to role claim when they want.

[Turnip Head]

Hmmm not what I expected but now we don't have to lynch either of them. Good get, whoever vigged nutella!

G-Man looks good imo, as for his info I only request that he doesn't take his info to the grave since he's now a target. Sloonei also looks good.

I'll probably iso Nutella in the morning and see what I can dig up, I'm sure others will do their own isos of her

[dunya]

Also so freaking weird but I had a dream that somehow included this game last night and Jack was playing in it I shit you not. Woke up and heres jack replaced in for Tony. So basically, I see the future now. Jack was bad. Let's see if that holds up too...

[dunya]

I would vote Tony if that was on the table. I have zero reason to town read him; he's made so little impression that I kept forgetting he was even a player.

(23)

alright let's give this a go


Dragon D. Luffy town
dunya town
Epignosis scum
G-Man town
M Plus 7 town
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME scum
Russtifinko town
sig town
Sloonei town
speedchuck scum
TonyStarkPrime scum
Turnip Head scum

Where is her progression on Tony? Nothing.

She's accused almost every civ flip we have plus TH. So why Tony? She forgot he was playing the game with speed?

[VOTE: jack] aubergine

We can lynch u before u have to read everything, pal.

[Tangrowth]

1. Nanook’s flip is confusing in light of yesterday, and also an unconventional kill choice at face value.

Nutella’s flip is encouraging. Interactive ISOs will be the name of the game today.

I don't think it's that confusing. Maybe he was thinking that if sig had lied and claimed a PR, he'd have caught sig in a lie, and if not then he might have backed off.

[dunya]

MP, Sloonei, Gman and Turnip are my lock town reads.

speed I just town read for his efforts, though they haven't been a lot if posts, I see town voice behind his posts.

So my POE
JACK/ Tony
DDL
Russti

I'm not sure if we'd be working with 2 or 3 baddies but 3 is more likely. That's the pool of 3 I'll be looking at this phase.

What are everyone else's 3 person suspect pool look like now?

[Tangrowth]

My initial thoughts are that, based on what I remember reading of nutella this morning, Sloonei looks pretty good? And G-man maybe as well?

Yeah, Sloonei is effectively lock clear for me now after that flip. He's my top town easily.

[Sloonei]

Interactive reads, under the umbrella
of the deceased mafioso nutella.
What will I find, what clues exist?
If this doesn't work, I will be pissed.

Spoiler: show

I feel kinda too lazy to try very hard with the verse
I'll probably give up cause it'll start making my posts worse
I don't follow what Russti said about role claims
I don't think the same role would go to two names.

A Day 0 comment about Russtifinko's view on role claims. Russ hasn't played much recently, so has a different take on claiming than most of our current regulars. This post doesn't offer any judgment, so I can't say too much about nutella's handling of russ here.

Spoiler: show

I'll try not to lynch you this time sig
I feel bad about last time, regret is big
And I get that you signed up to post less,
so adding the rhymes in is unwanted stress.

I aint lynching sig on day (1)
twice in a row, that's no fun
I'd rather choose someone who seems too eager
to do so despite the motive being so meager

Sig is wicked departed now, but nutella's first stance was opposition to early suspicion against him. This may bode well for the people who opposed sig early on.

Spoiler: show

In post number three
I will [VOTE: MP] aubergine
This ain't the dog pee
I think I'd see

People like MP, for instance, who she votes for here. M Plus 7 +1

Spoiler: show

Hey fuckers it's Power Rankings Time

The Power & The Passion - Top 5!


1. Russtifinko - Putting forth some thinking activities in an environment that is probably not super chillax for scum. Liking ya boy.

2. TonyStarkPrime - Really good looks for the boy. Powers to the top of the rankings on the back of some really willing and hectic town pings and good effort.

3. Sig - I like the fire and the penache stirring from within.

4. Sloonei - A bit of an awkward start but I give him points for considering threadstate so early on. I'll give him a mini pass because a post cap game does make sense to be something bothersome to him. Don't like his FPS town reads though. I see no reason to town read Epi or MP, let alone both of them. Would love an explanation.

5. Nutella - I have a sense that she is towntella but she doesn't really deserve the read. I don't like that she went for the sig town read. I enjoyed the pressure we were putting on him. But she's obsessed with disrupting earnest scum hunting in the early game for some reason as a matter of course so it's on town meta for her to do this.

Everyone Else

6. Turnip Head - I have this sort of inverse read on TH right now where I think he's kind of taking the piss a bit too much to be scum.

7. Epignosis - Really enjoyed him slapping M Plus 7 across the face with a wet fish but he doesn't care one iota about the roof. He's burning through posts, taking the piss mostly.

8. NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - He hasn't posted out of rhyme yet at all and his reads in rhyme have been pretty borderline.

9. M Plus 7 - Pretty bad so far. The only town ping I've had was him saying fuck. But MP is the sort of wolf player who fakes getting upset when he's accused (or perhaps doesn't need to fake it).

10. dunya - What is you doing fam? I don't like the fact that you've left zero impression on me.

T11. G-Man + Speedchuck - They have made one off topic post each in a game that I would expect the scum to have action paralysis in.

This is good this is good this is good shit
This is my fourth post and I love it
To respond to Sloonei no I don't care
MP feels different here, I swear

Wholesale support for Mac's day 1 reads. It's probably more accurate to read this as (phony) support of the effort from MacDougall, but if we mine it for more clues, we get support of the following list of suspects: Turnip Head, Epignosis, Nanook, MP, dunya, and G-man. I do not think that all of them need to be town, but nutella might be more resistant (at least, less openly supportive) if the list was threatening to her or her team.

Spoiler: show

Fifth post and now I think MP looks better
His last few posts fit his town meta to the letter
But I have some questions about that rainbow
How did Nanook and Turnip earn spots in a green row?

MP is looking better in nutella's eyes, but he's not without scrutiny. Nanook and Turnip are getting attention from nutella now. Her team just killed nanook last night, it would seem. I think MP continues to look good here. Not enough data on TH.

Spoiler: show

post #3 btw

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

didn't address my sig point, i feel ignored. *pout*

Sorry yeah I kind of missed that
It's just that lynching sig is old hat
And I don't see any reason to jump on him early
I thought people doing so were unreasonable surely

This vote from dunya doesn't have quite enough sticking power to be a slam dunk, but the exchange still has enough that I like: I think if the ladies are teammates then it's less likely that they'd have this sort of in-thread miscommunication for nutella to ignore a point raised against her by teammate-dunya so early on, and the response from nutella appears a bit sheepish, which would be another indication of non-alignment. Good look for dunya.

Spoiler: show

dunya seems her typical self
but she's not firmly on my town shelf
because I know she can be wily scum
but she's not under my voting thumb

Blanket dunya suspicion. I'm more inclined to believe that this post doesn't exist between partners, but that is also not a slam dunk.

Spoiler: show

dunya seems her typical self
but she's not firmly on my town shelf
because I know she can be wily scum
but she's not under my voting thumb

dunya has 11 posts and Day 1 is halfway over.

I do not understand how you can say she seems like she's "dunya as usual."

This is a shit take.

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

what? Why not? She's criticizing things
in her typical dunya way of questionings.
I don't see what you're seeing at all
But your viewpoint is not my call

She gets a bit defensive when epi calls her out on that dunya read. This may be a slightly worse look for dunya if we consider that nutella was nervous for her own sake and for the sake of her phony teammate read at this moment. But I think it's enough to say that nutella was just defending her own read, and perhaps the reason she felt compelled to give dunya a town read so early is because she was afraid of her.
I'll also note that this response reminds me a tiny bit of nutella's initial response to dunya's vote, though that one was a little more subdued. My interpretation of each of those posts has been favorable for dunya, but I see room for alternative theories in all of them. I'd like to hear from others on these posts.

Spoiler: show

anyone who still gives weight to my number of posts as a genuine reason to scum read can kindly kiss my backside. had enough of that meta and spent the last games changing it. dunya posting 200 posts on day 1 is dead. over. deal with it. and especially on a 25 post limit game.

my read on mp is tone-based. he seems genuine. even though he has mostly been on the defence, because people were hitting him from all sides, his defences are all sincere and coming from a place of truth, i feel. and with that, hes still took the time to game solve and keep up. Scum mp will be more focused on defence and getting out of people's dog piles. i am an intuition-based player, and i can see town behind MP posts.

i am however beginning to feel less certain of a town sloonei here.

I dunno how to read russ, and i will at some point quote his massive post when I'm not on my phone and reply.

But that's not what I did fam
I was talking about the mindset ham
Of rationing your posts to get near the quota lamb
And anyways your overzealous defense of MP makes me skeptical too damn

I don't understand this and I need someone to vote for other than MP so [VOTE: th] aubergine I don't buy your reasoning for suspecting dunya

This would be some harsh bussing if TH and nutella are teammates. Also in hindsight this post should have been a red flag ("I need someone to vote for other than MP" is yucky language). A little bit of Day 1 distancing is certainly in nutella's playbook and the vote feels kind of passive and arbitrary, which may be a sign that she didn't mean for it to stick. I'll be interested in examining Turnip Head's reaction on the other side of this exchange when I get there.

Spoiler: show

Wait Speed is in this game?
Wait Tony is in this game?

Hot take: one of these two is bad.

Spoiler: show

I'm not inspired by TH's responses to Mac. I get that TH has been "misunderstood" as a townie before but I don't get nearly the same sense from them this game that I often do. Their reads feel much more.. idk, manufactured somehow. maybe I'm just not following their godlike intuitive thought processes, but I feel so strongly that they're wrong about Mac that I'm not inclined to believe it's a real read.

Still inconclusive on TH. I'll have to dig further into this garden when I'm done with the current exercise (or sometime later, because I'm supposed to be editing my thesis right now).

Spoiler: show

I am concerned that Nanook seems to have disappeared. Hopefully we'll see more from him in the last few hours but I haven't got any particular townie feeling from his posts so far.

(18)

The above TH suspicion is immediately followed up with a jab at nanook, who we now know to be town. Maybe nutella is trying to pivot away from her teammate. Maybe she's reaching out in all directions for civilian mislynches. We're getting towards the end of Day 1 here, where Mac and sig were the primary wagons. There's no real need for nutella to divert momentum away from either of those. It's more likely she's just trying to appear proactive and/or setting up things for later here.

Spoiler: show

I would vote Tony if that was on the table. I have zero reason to town read him; he's made so little impression that I kept forgetting he was even a player.

(23)

This post was a red flag in the moment. The poll was close enough that a vote for Tony here would have made him theoretically viable. nutella spoke as if that wasn't the case and I gave her shit for it, at which point she placed a vote on Tony. Nothing materialized from it, we lynched sig, and tony was hardly a suspect on Day 2. Bad look for Tony/Jack (Don't worry, Jack. If we lynch you in this game it will be a Tony lynch. You're safe).

Spoiler: show

Dragon D. Luffy town
dunya town
Epignosis scum
G-Man town
M Plus 7 town
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME scum
Russtifinko town
sig town
Sloonei town
speedchuck scum
TonyStarkPrime scum
Turnip Head scum

GTH reads, neat. Epi, nanook, speedchuck, and tony are bad. I gave tony some credit for pushing Epi during the night when he was about to die. We see nutella doing the same thing here. That makes me lose a bit of confidence in my tony town read.
I'll restate my hot take from before: one of tony or speedchuck is bad.

Spoiler: show

I think I need to re-skim a bit
with the new knowledge that Epi was legit.
I remember he prodded both dunya and me
and then said he wouldn't lynch either, actually.

I don't know why this observation exists, but dunya's name is in it.

Spoiler: show

I'll roleclaim. I'm Leaky and I have a semi-useful role that requires me to have good instincts, so I'm not all that hopeful about that, but I'm town.

any reason you chose to claim??
Nanook's calling out sig by name
Don't know why you'd just randomly out
when not in direct danger, what's that about

(2)

There's nothing that I can really latch onto here, at least not by just looking at nutella's side of things, but these interactions with TH are distinctly peculiar.

Spoiler: show

wow this game is frustrating because everyone is talking past each other lol. DDL's hypothesis of nanook's thing makes a lot of sense to me, I don't get why TH is pushing back on it so much because I think Nanook is telling the truth but it could be something kind of ambiguous. Sig is just being dumb now about the MP thing, multiple people explained that he was town and then replaced and he just ignored that lol. And his refusal to claim in the face of nanook's request makes me think it's more likely nanook's info is good so [VOTE: sig] aubergine for now.

Russti if you just delete the "@" symbol in the post editor the annoying thing goes away. It's a dumb bug but that at least makes it stop.

I don't see the case on G-Man at all. He feels like normal G-Man to me.

Names galore. DDL is saying something that makes sense, cool. TH is pushing nanook on a faulty premise, cool. Sig is bad and gets a vote, the his push on MP is fundamentally flawed, cool. She "doesn't see the case on G-man at all", very cool. The exchange that convinced me nutella was bad stemmed from that last comment. I'm not quite sure what it means for Da G. As dunya observes, the stance nutella eventually takes is very bold in support of G-man, but that was more a product of the back-and-forth between the two of us than a direct push on G-man. I made her talk about it, and she was committed to casting shade on me. I believe this post here marks her first mention of G-man in the game. I also don't think she'd acknowledged DDL beforehand. She uses his theory in part to prop up her sig vote here, for whatever that's worth.

Spoiler: show

I don't remember which game it was, but I think there was an instance where town Sig lost a game on purpose to make a point about being against claiming. Or maybe it was someone else (this happens a lot in the other forum I play in). Correct me if I'm wrong.

If this is true it makes me paranoid, though. There is a good chance nanook is telling the truth but his info isn't really conclusive, and Sig is gonna self destruct to make a point anyway.

Notably Nanook also faked a red peek in a recent game (the baseball one), though that person happened to be indeed mafia But from what he's said here I believe he's not lying this time and he is admitting that his info might not be 100% reliable. But yeah you make a point that goes against Nanook's plan to policy-lynch sig for refusing to claim.

This doesn't look like a teammate interaction. DDL looks to be authentically contradicting nutella's desired angle and nutella gives a tentative concession without moving her vote. If they're teammates nutella can ignore it or DDL just doesn't make the original post.

Spoiler: show

I can totally see bad nutella.

She's just... not very around.

Like compare to last game where she was extremely around. Saying things. Posting hot takes. Etc.

Sorry I have been very distracted by other things so I haven't really gotten my head in this game. I don't have super hot takes, I have some townreads and a lot of people who haven't made much of an impression. I kinda think Sloonei is scum for being so focused on his garbage Gman case over everything else, but I've gone back and forth on him.

I think it's likely one of you and TH is bad based on this recent exchange.

"One of TH or DDL is bad shrug2" My money's on TH right now.


The G-man thang will be contained in a single spoiler:

Spoiler: show

What is everyone's read on G-man?

town

What is everyone's read on G-man?

town

Why?

Like I said, he just feels like regular ol G-Man to me. I don't understand/agree with the case.

You said this before I posted my case.

Your case did nothing for me, you just pointed out some things in his posts that seemed typical from him imo. I don't see the problems you see, I see Gman's way of processing the game.

I need to look back at that awful G mislynch in GOC and see how much scum!Sloonei contributed to it and how that compares to his push here. I'm just getting a lil deja vu and I think G tends to be misread repeatedly for consistent reasons.

I said I didn't see the case on him as in I didn't get the reasons people suspected him, since I hadn't seen anything that struck me as atypical for town Gman. You posted "reasons" which were just a list of some details from his posts. I found it uninteresting and uncompelling.

I said I didn't see the case on him as in I didn't get the reasons people suspected him, since I hadn't seen anything that struck me as atypical for town Gman. You posted "reasons" which were just a list of some details from his posts. I found it uninteresting and uncompelling.

... what else is a case supposed to be? What would have made it more compelling?

This is not feisty or spicy nutella.

You're Sloonei. You know what a case is. Come on. Why are any of G-Man's posts suspicious? What makes them feel outside his normal town meta? I don't recall anything remotely persuasive about this from your post. I looked at the stuff you quoted and thought "yeah, nah, nothing wrong with that."

Also this is a garbage line of questioning. This is Fake Questioning Sloonei. Like I saw in GOC. I thought I felt it again early this game, then I cooled down on you for a while but the feeling is back in full force. You're full of shit.

Of course G-man could be town. Of course people sometimes express uncertainty in their reads, Day 1 or otherwise. And the paranoia about giving the mafia team guidance in their kill selection has been prevalent on the Syndicate for as long as I’ve been here. But the purpose of making a case and playing this game is to consider the alternatives to that.

Town G-man can be humble. He’ll tell us when he’s behind or not sure what to think of things or just struggling with the game in general. His posts here haven’t had that feel. His posts here strike me as being instilled with inflated confidence, as though he doesn’t want to be called out on exactly those other things. The “built-in concessions” I refer to in his first reads list aren’t the typical “hedging” remarks I’d expect. Rather “MP is doing this, which could mean X or Y” it’s “I have an old bias...”, which signals to me that he is aware the read exists on a flimsy premise, not that he is doubting himself.

That is just one point in my G-man case. I’m typing it all out here not out of investment in the case itself, but to frame my newer and bigger suspicion against nutella. I’ve been on the receiving end of her tinfoil suspicions in just about every game we’ve played together for at least the last year. I know what that’s like. I also have a sense of what it looks like when she is actively trying to figure things out— to figure me out. It comes with an air of believing that I am full of shit, but a willingness to listen anyway. Throughout this exchange she has demonstrated an unwillingness to engage: the entire above spiel about G-man is an elaboration on the case that I already presented earlier. It is absolutely not air tight, but it’s also not far out of bounds for what I usually post, particularly on Days 1 or 2. For nutella to suggest that it’s not even a case at all, but something lesser, and to immediately pivot to calling me fake, without demonstrating any of the usual visible inner turmoil over that read, just reads like one conspicuously counterfeit jar of hazelnut spread.

Nah. I am still trying to figure stuff out, like I've said I've gone back and forth on you. It's just that I've decided G-Man is town and nothing you said convinced me to consider otherwise. Funnily enough, your second paragraph here is the first thing that has actually given me pause. I can potentially see where you are coming from there. That angle was not present at all in your earlier case though. This could easily be a retroactive addition to inflate the depth of your "case", or it could be legitimate insight. Show me that this additional level of depth was present in your read earlier, and maybe I'll believe you.

G-man is bad, I say.

Spoiler: show

Patching together a reads list yields this:

GOOD VIBES
-Russ: His good on the fake-claim cover roles makes me feel good. A baddie would have clarified with the host.
-Dunya: I like her spunk. She's more assertive and direct than I would suspect a baddie to be.
-Epi: He makes good counter-punches, but how many times have I been duped into civ reading him in the past?

TBD (I need to ISO these for a stronger read)
-DDL
-sig
-Sloonei
-Speed
-Tony
-TH

BAD VIBES
-MP: This might be old bias due to his high-volume style of play. It's a soft ping, so don't take it the wrong way.
-Nutella: Equal parts old bias and not feeling much of anything despite the volume of her ISO.
-Mac: He keeps coming back to low-hanging fruit. Lazy for a civvie to do; wise for a baddie. It's never lost its appeal. I am low-hanging fruit, I realize this, so my judgement may be a tad harsh.
-Nanook: Maybe it's a lack of familiarity, but something in his play rubs me the wrong way. Rhyme scheme in moderation and play the game, friendo.

All four of his "BAD" reads come with built-in concessions. I wouldn't quite call it hedging or "wishywashy"; instead G is admitting the flaw in all of his reads ("old bias" x2, "may be a tad harsh", "Maybe it's lack of familiarity"). The effect suggests a player who is tentative because he knows his reads are wrong, as opposed to a player who is keeping an open mind.

Okay, you do have the "knows his reads are wrong" part here. I guess I just glossed over that because I disagreed, I thought his hedges were pretty natural. Looking again I can understand why you saw what you saw. I think I still disagree.

The same thing comes out when he elaborates on his nanook read:

Spoiler: show

G-Man:

He needs more time to post. He doesn't have much, but I will say this:

-Not a fan of his insistence on rhyming. Yes, it’s cheeky and fun but even I won’t encourage everyone to post solely in rhymes. Not a fan of his repetition of it. (-1)

...is strange coming from a guy who insists on practicing strange and quirky gimmicks all the time (his posts all start with a P, this time, by the way).

It's doubtful to me that someone of G-Man's quirky caliber would characterize posting in rhymes as something bad or inscrutable. We understand song lyrics just fine (well, most. We have Yes and Led Zeppelin...)

I would lynch G-Man today.

Peculiar? Yes. Hypocritical? Perhaps. In this game, there is a limit to how beneficial the rhymes are. You can fit them in here and there between prose as well. Once the benefit is over, sticking with the rhymes just impairs communication. I think it’s his apparent stubbornness to abstain from prose more so than the use of rhyme. My play experience with him is quite limited. If he’s quirky like me, then it might make sense. I lack that context. I’m voting for Nanook now so I have a vote on the board as I start ISOing the people I have little to no read on.

This post also feels as though it has a sort of falsely inflated confidence, like he is overcompensating when pushed on a read that is weak.

This point I don't get at all. I don't see anything that can remotely translate to "inflated confidence" in the highlighted portion. I don't understand how this quote is relevant to your case at all. It looks like you pulled something he said at random and decided it demonstrated "falsely inflated confidence" to... well, inflate your case. Now this part makes me think again that you're talking out of your ass.

Like I said before, this became less about G-man and more about me, man. I'm not swayed all that much by the volume of content where nutella appears to be defending G-man, as that was mostly my doing. Me me me, I'm so great. nutella's initial position was "I don't see the case on G-Man at all. He feels like normal G-Man to me." That is a harmless thing to say at that stage even if G-man is her partner. He's not in immediate danger, and this is a very quick and easy way to bat that suspicion away and move onto something else. It's a light touch, specifically designed not to get too deep into the case. But I'm too narcissistic to let that slip by when I put some work into presenting an argument against G-man, so I pestered nutella until she talked about it. Her default stance was "I don't see the case" and thus Sloonei's insistence on the case became oppositional to her, and that turned into me being fake.

I actually might be inclined to say that the exchange is a bad look for G-man, or I can at least make that argument. Whether or not I believe in it is a different matter. But it goes like this: nutella did not want to talk about G-man, thus her initial responses were all non-receptive to the case I was making. She was not disagreeing with me or engaging on a level that would prompt direct discussion of G-man himself: she was outright ignoring any parts of the argument which related to G-man. When that eventually became impossible she sheepishly agreed to one part but turned immediately to a more minor issue and harped on that as a point of contention. Then the exchange ended.

That does not need to be the case and it's entirely possible G-man is an innocent bystander caught in the crossfire.

--------------------------------------------
SUMMARY: "One of tony/jack or speedchuck is bad" has been my hot take throughout and I'm interested in pursuing that.
Turnip Head has the most head-scratchability in here, but this was a one-sided view of that potential pairing and there was absolutely nothing conclusive.
The exchange between nutella and I last night was tethered to G-man, but I'm unsure how relevant he really was to the progression. He remains a viable suspect to begin the day, but I would not take that to the bank. I think I'll plop a vote on him anyway since that's where my heart currently lies and linkitis tells me that jack just received a vote and he'd be my second choice.
Folks like DDL and dunya were incidentally present, but in such a way that I lean in their favor. I'm interested in hearing what others think of those early interactions between nutella and dunya.
I think MP looks alright early on.

[Tangrowth]

MP, Sloonei, Gman and Turnip are my lock town reads.

speed I just town read for his efforts, though they haven't been a lot if posts, I see town voice behind his posts.

So my POE
JACK/ Tony
DDL
Russti

I'm not sure if we'd be working with 2 or 3 baddies but 3 is more likely. That's the pool of 3 I'll be looking at this phase.

What are everyone else's 3 person suspect pool look like now?

I'm not really sure. Jack is pretty much always in my 3-person POE.

I would say you, Russ, and Sloonei are never in there. Beyond that, I need to do more thinking.

Linki with a giant thing I'll read after posting this, thanks Sloonei.

[Sloonei]

Also so freaking weird but I had a dream that somehow included this game last night and Jack was playing in it I shit you not. Woke up and heres jack replaced in for Tony. So basically, I see the future now. Jack was bad. Let's see if that holds up too...

Ignore my vote call at the end of the ISO post. I believe in dunya' dreams. [VOTE: tonyjackprime] aubergine

Also I'm willing to buy G-man's claim to have info right now.

[Sloonei]

Quick update: Turnip Head never acknowledged this post, nor was there any follow up from nutella. But they did have this exchange:

Mac seems more interested in reading townies than finding scum

I've voted for him

You uh. You've played with Mac before right?

Yeah I played against him in Assassin's Creed where I was bad and he was town, so I know exactly what he's capable of. He's just posting reads lists, that won't help him find baddies, it just makes him look like a fun guy.

Which... also resulted in nothing. I will place a vote on [VOTE: Turnip Head] aubergine to highlight him as a suspect at the moment. I still believe in dunya's dream tell and would remain in favor of pursuing jacktony.

[Russtifinko]

Nutella ISO, as promised:

nutella's posts are basically non-game-related early on, and her posts through D1 are basically all rhymes. Here's the first one of any substance:

Spoiler: show

Fifth post and now I think MP looks better
His last few posts fit his town meta to the letter
But I have some questions about that rainbow
How did Nanook and Turnip earn spots in a green row?

Says MP looks good, and shades NANOOK and TH. Not sure what to make of it yet, will revisit with more context

Spoiler: show

I aint lynching sig on day (1)
twice in a row, that's no fun
I'd rather choose someone who seems too eager
to do so despite the motive being so meager

feels like tmi

i didn't get the scummy vibes that sloonei, mac, and others got from sig, but this excuse from nutella is not really a defense of "why sig is not mafia" it's just some weak narrative about not wanting to lynch him on day 1 twice in a row, but maybe on day 2 eh? i guess i just don't buy it.

Not directly nutella-related, but I came back to this because after dunya voted nutella she eventually responded to it. This is a super good read by dunya, and the first thing that looks town from her to me (beyond "other people say she seems fine"). It doesn't completely change my mind, but it definitely helps. nutella wasn't taking any other heat for this at the time, so it would be some pretty inspired distancing if they were teammates.

Spoiler: show

dunya seems her typical self
but she's not firmly on my town shelf
because I know she can be wily scum
but she's not under my voting thumb

dunya has 11 posts and Day 1 is halfway over.

I do not understand how you can say she seems like she's "dunya as usual."

This is a shit take.

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

what? Why not? She's criticizing things
in her typical dunya way of questionings.
I don't see what you're seeing at all
But your viewpoint is not my call

Then, nutella mega-waffles on dunya, and Epi calls it out. I think this is less alignment-indicative than dunya's original call-out, but if they're both bad, I do think it would've taken some very involved BTSC to plan ahead of time.

Spoiler: show

anyone who still gives weight to my number of posts as a genuine reason to scum read can kindly kiss my backside. had enough of that meta and spent the last games changing it. dunya posting 200 posts on day 1 is dead. over. deal with it. and especially on a 25 post limit game.

my read on mp is tone-based. he seems genuine. even though he has mostly been on the defence, because people were hitting him from all sides, his defences are all sincere and coming from a place of truth, i feel. and with that, hes still took the time to game solve and keep up. Scum mp will be more focused on defence and getting out of people's dog piles. i am an intuition-based player, and i can see town behind MP posts.

i am however beginning to feel less certain of a town sloonei here.

I dunno how to read russ, and i will at some point quote his massive post when I'm not on my phone and reply.

But that's not what I did fam
I was talking about the mindset ham
Of rationing your posts to get near the quota lamb
And anyways your overzealous defense of MP makes me skeptical too damn

I don't understand this and I need someone to vote for other than MP so [VOTE: th] aubergine I don't buy your reasoning for suspecting dunya

Says she "needs someone to vote other than MP (after townreading MP earlier in the day, mind you). In hindsight, this should have been a MASSIVE red flag. Also defends dunya after the mega-waffle, which should've been another red flag.

Wait Speed is in this game?
Wait Tony is in this game?

Which honestly, at this point in D1, fair. Not sure what to make of it.

Spoiler: show

Sloonei does actually have a weird snideness to his game that isn't usually present. Are you okay mate or are you just scum and is the being evil clouding your usual chirpy personality? I like how you've kept your POE super wide. Not very like you at all.

I would expect the methodology being wielded to make it harder for scum who already are not keen to post (ie. G-Man and Speedchuck who profile given G-Man doesn't like playing Mafia and Speedchuck slanks generally but somehow mustered an actual effort for Rona mafia so is probably burnt out). When I rand wolf I am always tailoring my posts, deleting them, walking away from the game etc. The post count cap + rhyming would just make that a lot worse.

I actually disagree with your take on Sloonei -- I think MP put it pretty well and the snideness you're talking about actually comes out a bit stronger when Sloonei is scum imo. I agree that he feels slightly off this game and it bothered me at first, but he settled in a bit so I figured it was probably just nervousness about the format of the game. I think he feels more natural recently.

When did I start looking more natural?

if i'm being grumpy this game we will just blame it on old age. damn kids and their post limits. banjo ka-pooie.

Idk probably around the start of D1, I think it was mainly your D0 posts that made me feel uneasy.

I have kind of a weird feeling about Epi too with the way he's been throwing out extra-confident cases that don't feel quite like his typical D1 bait. His thing about dunya made absolutely no sense to me and when I expressed a townread on me he acted like he had a "gotcha" on me. I really don't understand why he expects me to feel differently about dunya, I think her posts have been suitably aggressive. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what his gripe is.

14

Says she felt bad about Sloonei but is coming around, and shades Epi.

Spoiler: show

(17)

smh @ mac recklessly hitting his post cap. RIP. He's town.

I'm not inspired by TH's responses to Mac. I get that TH has been "misunderstood" as a townie before but I don't get nearly the same sense from them this game that I often do. Their reads feel much more.. idk, manufactured somehow. maybe I'm just not following their godlike intuitive thought processes, but I feel so strongly that they're wrong about Mac that I'm not inclined to believe it's a real read.

Calls Mac as civ, shades TH #2. Calls TH out for going after Mac, based on......I guess I'd call this gut if nutella had been civ. Somewhat good look for TH in my opinion.

Spoiler: show

I am concerned that Nanook seems to have disappeared. Hopefully we'll see more from him in the last few hours but I haven't got any particular townie feeling from his posts so far.

(18)

Shades NANOOK #2, in the same way she shaded TH the second time. Based on...feelings? Certainly possible nutella went after 2 people the same way when one was on her team and one wasn't, so I wouldn't be willing to town confirm TH based off of it, but generally positive.

Spoiler: show

Not breaking a tie is scummy
Stick to your reads, dummy
I actually think you’re smart
But that doesn’t rhyme for a start

It's early enough that I expect someone else will break it anyway, or it could even swing to someone outside those two still. And I townread both Mac and sig (Mac admittedly more strongly) so yeah I'd rather not vote either. If it really comes down to it, idk. Cross that bridge at the deadline.

(21)

D1, calls that both Mac and sig are civ. Seems she didn't want to be caught lynching a civ so parked her vote elsewhere. This post reminded me to go back and look at the D1 results again since we now know both top candidates were civ. Baddies must've been salivating. I want to go back and see if anyone pushed for a sig lynch on N1 (besides NANOOK), and look at any late votes on sig. I think weakly justified singleton votes could be fruitful too - anyone doing what nutella did here.

Spoiler: show

I would vote Tony if that was on the table. I have zero reason to town read him; he's made so little impression that I kept forgetting he was even a player.

(23)

Shades Tony for being quiet on D1. I'd say good look for him. She ended up voting him in a later post, too.

Spoiler: show

Yeah you're scum

Posts this right after the D1 lynch result. Looks good for TH in hindsight. Right before the lynch, Sloonei called that nutella was bad and Mac's teammate, and mentioned nutella's weird read of Tony. This one seems more plausible to do as teammates than what dunya did further up, but I still think it looks mildly good.

Spoiler: show

alright let's give this a go


Dragon D. Luffy town
dunya town
Epignosis scum
G-Man town
M Plus 7 town
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME scum
Russtifinko town
sig town
Sloonei town
speedchuck scum
TonyStarkPrime scum
Turnip Head scum

For the most part, this GTH wasn't as enlightening as I had hoped. All the scum reads are people she had shaded already, and the town reads are everyone else. The MP read stood out to me, since on D1 she initially expressed suspicion of him and then backed off and started defending him from TH. I do think that has the look of possible distancing, so bad look for MP. In a later post, Sloonei thought it was crazy that nutella read him town and dunya read him scum. Sloonei, I don't have the history behind you 3, so mind elaborating on why that was so mind-blowing for you?

Spoiler: show

wow this game is frustrating because everyone is talking past each other lol. DDL's hypothesis of nanook's thing makes a lot of sense to me, I don't get why TH is pushing back on it so much because I think Nanook is telling the truth but it could be something kind of ambiguous. Sig is just being dumb now about the MP thing, multiple people explained that he was town and then replaced and he just ignored that lol. And his refusal to claim in the face of nanook's request makes me think it's more likely nanook's info is good so [VOTE: sig] aubergine for now.

Russti if you just delete the "@" symbol in the post editor the annoying thing goes away. It's a dumb bug but that at least makes it stop.

I don't see the case on G-Man at all. He feels like normal G-Man to me.

Takes the sig vote, which would be the easy call as a baddie. More relevant for this analysis, this is the first time nutella mentions G-Man in the game, outside of her GTH town read on him, which she never elaborated on. Claims not to understand the case on him.

Spoiler: show

I think regardless of sig's flip we have pretty much wasted this day (aside from Sloonei perhaps). I guess there may be some associative reads we can make from the sig situation but otherwise there has been very little analysis. It feels stagnant.

In hindsight, another big red flag I missed. Said Sloonei had been productive, despite saying she didn't understand nor believe his case on G-Man.

Spoiler: show

What is everyone's read on G-man?

town

Why?

Like I said, he just feels like regular ol G-Man to me. I don't understand/agree with the case.

Reiterating without adding anything tangible to G-Man's defense.

Spoiler: show

I can totally see bad nutella.

She's just... not very around.

Like compare to last game where she was extremely around. Saying things. Posting hot takes. Etc.

Sorry I have been very distracted by other things so I haven't really gotten my head in this game. I don't have super hot takes, I have some townreads and a lot of people who haven't made much of an impression. I kinda think Sloonei is scum for being so focused on his garbage Gman case over everything else, but I've gone back and forth on him.

I think it's likely one of you and TH is bad based on this recent exchange.

Weird, because nutella actually gave 5 scum reads in her GTH. Obviously just playing non-commital, which makes me think there's at least one baddie in her scum reads from N1. That would've been a good opportunity to lightly bus without actually building any kind of case that would put a teammate at risk. Also says "one of TH and DDL" is bad without expressing any kind of preference between the two. Given her previous shade of TH and her GTH reads, this actually makes me more confused about him. If I don't see any other posts by her mentioning him, I could see it being a bus. Would greatly appreciate others' input on that. I do think DDL's suspicion is a good look for him, because he was the first person after Sloonei to really be going at her. I have trouble seeing the angle where Sloonei and DDL coordinate to bus a teamie nutella with no other suspicion on her, in a game where D1 and D2 were handed to them.

Then she spends 5-6 posts defending G-Man from Sloonei. I won't quote them all here, but it ends with this:

Spoiler: show

Wait, is this multi quote feature new?
I’m not here to use it, but I disagree with Sloonei on Nutella.
How I interpret this conversation:

Nutella: hmm, I see no case on GMan
Sloonei: here it is
Nutella: still not seeing it
Sloonei: aha you have already said that you are not seeing it and yet you are still not seeing it?

My general impression is scum would love to seize the opportunity to pick a new town lynch, especially with a narrowing list. And if GMan is scum, the defense probably isn’t as brazen.

Nah, it’s more that she’s not engaging with it. Things have been said about g-man but rather than address those things she’s just said “nope.” It's like like that Monty Python argument sketch.

I think I've been clear that I think all the things you pointed out in your case are things I see as consistent with town G-Man. I don't have a problem with him hedging on his reads. I don't have a problem with him avoiding giving reads during night phase. I don't have a problem with his behavior at EOD1. I've seen him mislynched before for similar reasons and I'm not looking for that to happen again. I could be wrong but I think he has an honest approach and a town mindset. How many ways do I need to rephrase "I don't find your case compelling"

I don’t believe that this is your honest response. I’ve made less compelling cases in the past that you’ve been on board with.

I dunno what to tell you then, except that this ain't the past.

This post is what convinces me firmly that Sloon is town. No way they bus this hard as teammates.

Spoiler: show

do you actually think nanook was straight up lying the whole time here, not that he did get a result that was unreliable/not 100% confirmation, as he said? everything he said causes me to believe the latter. which should answer dunya's question as well, no I don't suspect nanook because he could have been telling the truth and just had wrong info.

I guess sig being vanilla confuses that idea a little, since I'm not sure what kind of ability nanook would have in that scenario. hm

Defends NANOOK. This is the only one of her last 10-ish posts spent talking about anything but Sloonei and G-Man. I think this explains the NANOOK NK despite the heat he was taking for the sig mislynch. nutella may have seen it as a way to build civ cred, like when she parked her vote away from the major trains D1 and called both Mac and sig town. Calling her shots, so to speak.

Spoiler: show

G-man is bad, I say.

Spoiler: show

Patching together a reads list yields this:

GOOD VIBES
-Russ: His good on the fake-claim cover roles makes me feel good. A baddie would have clarified with the host.
-Dunya: I like her spunk. She's more assertive and direct than I would suspect a baddie to be.
-Epi: He makes good counter-punches, but how many times have I been duped into civ reading him in the past?

TBD (I need to ISO these for a stronger read)
-DDL
-sig
-Sloonei
-Speed
-Tony
-TH

BAD VIBES
-MP: This might be old bias due to his high-volume style of play. It's a soft ping, so don't take it the wrong way.
-Nutella: Equal parts old bias and not feeling much of anything despite the volume of her ISO.
-Mac: He keeps coming back to low-hanging fruit. Lazy for a civvie to do; wise for a baddie. It's never lost its appeal. I am low-hanging fruit, I realize this, so my judgement may be a tad harsh.
-Nanook: Maybe it's a lack of familiarity, but something in his play rubs me the wrong way. Rhyme scheme in moderation and play the game, friendo.

All four of his "BAD" reads come with built-in concessions. I wouldn't quite call it hedging or "wishywashy"; instead G is admitting the flaw in all of his reads ("old bias" x2, "may be a tad harsh", "Maybe it's lack of familiarity"). The effect suggests a player who is tentative because he knows his reads are wrong, as opposed to a player who is keeping an open mind.

Okay, you do have the "knows his reads are wrong" part here. I guess I just glossed over that because I disagreed, I thought his hedges were pretty natural. Looking again I can understand why you saw what you saw. I think I still disagree.

See that's why I don't believe you right now. You waved away my case as "not a case at all" (paraphrasing), and are now admitting to not having read it closely. That has been the impression I've been getting this entire time. "Tell sloonei he's wrong" rather than "Engage with the points sloonei is making." Bogus. Stupendously bogus!

The same thing comes out when he elaborates on his nanook read:

Spoiler: show

G-Man:

He needs more time to post. He doesn't have much, but I will say this:

-Not a fan of his insistence on rhyming. Yes, it’s cheeky and fun but even I won’t encourage everyone to post solely in rhymes. Not a fan of his repetition of it. (-1)

...is strange coming from a guy who insists on practicing strange and quirky gimmicks all the time (his posts all start with a P, this time, by the way).

It's doubtful to me that someone of G-Man's quirky caliber would characterize posting in rhymes as something bad or inscrutable. We understand song lyrics just fine (well, most. We have Yes and Led Zeppelin...)

I would lynch G-Man today.

Peculiar? Yes. Hypocritical? Perhaps. In this game, there is a limit to how beneficial the rhymes are. You can fit them in here and there between prose as well. Once the benefit is over, sticking with the rhymes just impairs communication. I think it’s his apparent stubbornness to abstain from prose more so than the use of rhyme. My play experience with him is quite limited. If he’s quirky like me, then it might make sense. I lack that context. I’m voting for Nanook now so I have a vote on the board as I start ISOing the people I have little to no read on.

This post also feels as though it has a sort of falsely inflated confidence, like he is overcompensating when pushed on a read that is weak.

This point I don't get at all. I don't see anything that can remotely translate to "inflated confidence" in the highlighted portion. I don't understand how this quote is relevant to your case at all. It looks like you pulled something he said at random and decided it demonstrated "falsely inflated confidence" to... well, inflate your case. Now this part makes me think again that you're talking out of your ass.

The highlighted portion is not where I'm getting the inflated confidence from. That is a confusing bit of marking from me, oops. The highlighted bit coincides with the previous point, framed above the spoiler. The non-highlighted portion is what generated the "inflated confidence" remark. That rhetorical posturing at the beginning, the self-vindication, it all feels kind of rehearsed to me, like he thought it over a few times before hitting submit. Like Mac said:

When I rand wolf I am always tailoring my posts, deleting them, walking away from the game etc.

(God I love this new highlight quote feature)

I admitted I had glossed over a detail and am now engaging with it. Okay??

As for the second part... ...I still don't see the inflated confidence. I am reading the whole post you quoted and I don't get it. It's a reasonable defense of his view on nanook. Whatever "posturing" there is, that's just how G-man is. I find it altogether uninteresting.

Sounds defensive here, like she knew Sloonei wasn't going to let it go and was worried D3 would be bad for her.

tl;dr

In conclusion: nutella was bad.

But seriously, here's what I get out of it.

Sloonei looks super town, and I can't see a series of events that would lead me to vote for him in the next few days. I also think DDL comes out of it looking pretty solid, albeit to a slightly lesser extent. I also think the D1 interactions look good for TH and dunya. I wouldn't vote TH today, and although I'm not willing yet to completely drop my dunya suspicion, but I probably wouldn't vote her today either.

I think MP is a possible bussing candidate here, so not great for him, and it looks absolutely terrible for G-Man. nutella spent nearly 20% of her posts defending him but never added anything substantive to the discussion.

One further thing worth discussing/looking into: since we now know the D1 lynch was civ/civ, where do people think the baddie votes are? nutella parked hers on an-off wagon; do we think the others did the same to lie low?

I am now le tired and probably will not read until tomorrow.

Linki: wow people are reading the same stuff as me and reaching exactly opposite conclusions. G-Man claiming info has dunya and TH reading him lock town, the day after they both thought NANOOK looked bad for infodumping. Sloonei thinks the nutella ISO looks good for MP. And this is just as my opinion on all 3 of you went up by reading this. I am so confused now....

[dunya]

My Dreams Dont Lie ft. SHAKIRA

Last night I had a dream
It involved a flying penguin
And playing a mafia game with the team
Which we would win

In it jack was bad
He was caught red handed
It was so sad
But next phase he was dead

I am now in bed
Going over my pool
Of suspects in my head
Aren't i so cool?

We got 48 hours to get this right
I see sloonei did the hard work
But that's enough from me tonight
So I'll just sit and lurk

I need 4 more rhymes
To get my plus five today
Oh my, look at the times
Good night sweet dreams I say

[dunya]

Yes, gman lock town. Look at nutellas role "you will be told who targeted that player that night if anyone."

GMAN knows who shot nutella. There isnt 2 similar scum roles on the sane team. I give Jay way more credit than that plus it would be weird. It makes sense for town to have a similar counter balance role though.

No doubt in my mind G is town. Big difference between his claim and nanooks.

[Sloonei]

[mention]Russtifinko[/mention] we seem to disagree in one key area: you think MP is the prime bussing candidate in nutella's ISO, whereas I came out feeling like Turnip Head is the more likely candidate. If you had to summarize each your reads on those two in a few sentences, what would you say? What are the most important points to you?

[dunya]

Turnip is genuine town. No way they are scum. I'll bet my goat on it. Town pouring from every side.

[Turnip Head]

Quick update: Turnip Head never acknowledged this post, nor was there any follow up from nutella. But they did have this exchange:

Mac seems more interested in reading townies than finding scum

I've voted for him

You uh. You've played with Mac before right?

Yeah I played against him in Assassin's Creed where I was bad and he was town, so I know exactly what he's capable of. He's just posting reads lists, that won't help him find baddies, it just makes him look like a fun guy.

Which... also resulted in nothing. I will place a vote on [VOTE: Turnip Head] aubergine to highlight him as a suspect at the moment. I still believe in dunya's dream tell and would remain in favor of pursuing jacktony.

I don't understand what you think happened here.

[Sloonei]

Lol russ and I both said that nutella’s “I need someone else to vote for” comment should have been a red flag in hindsight. But we drew different conclusions from that.

If it weren’t for my nutella ISO I’d have TH as a firm town read.

[Sloonei]

Quick update: Turnip Head never acknowledged this post, nor was there any follow up from nutella. But they did have this exchange:

Mac seems more interested in reading townies than finding scum

I've voted for him

You uh. You've played with Mac before right?

Yeah I played against him in Assassin's Creed where I was bad and he was town, so I know exactly what he's capable of. He's just posting reads lists, that won't help him find baddies, it just makes him look like a fun guy.

Which... also resulted in nothing. I will place a vote on [VOTE: Turnip Head] aubergine to highlight him as a suspect at the moment. I still believe in dunya's dream tell and would remain in favor of pursuing jacktony.

I don't understand what you think happened here.

The theory is that you two are partners and are doing a fake distancing dance right here. There are some jabs that look serious but go nowhere.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

On the nutella/Gman thing, I can see nutella having been caught having to justify a read she didn't actually have, so she doubled down on it in order to avoid contradicting herself. She hadn't given it any thought before, so now she had to make shit up on the fly. That's how Gman could be town from this exchange.

[Sloonei]

On the nutella/Gman thing, I can see nutella having been caught having to justify a read she didn't actually have, so she doubled down on it in order to avoid contradicting herself. She hadn't given it any thought before, so now she had to make shit up on the fly. That's how Gman could be town from this exchange.

Definitely. Don't mistake my bundle of words
As a proclamation for us all to draw swords
Against the G. He may well be good,
Groovy, gregarious, gracious, but misunderstood.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Yes, gman lock town. Look at nutellas role "you will be told who targeted that player that night if anyone."

GMAN knows who shot nutella. There isnt 2 similar scum roles on the sane team. I give Jay way more credit than that plus it would be weird. It makes sense for town to have a similar counter balance role though.

No doubt in my mind G is town. Big difference between his claim and nanooks.

What if this is just scum Gman making shit up

He hasn't revealed who the vig is has he

Though if claims do you think that would work as a confirmation?

[Turnip Head]

Quick update: Turnip Head never acknowledged this post, nor was there any follow up from nutella. But they did have this exchange:

Mac seems more interested in reading townies than finding scum

I've voted for him

You uh. You've played with Mac before right?

Yeah I played against him in Assassin's Creed where I was bad and he was town, so I know exactly what he's capable of. He's just posting reads lists, that won't help him find baddies, it just makes him look like a fun guy.

Which... also resulted in nothing. I will place a vote on [VOTE: Turnip Head] aubergine to highlight him as a suspect at the moment. I still believe in dunya's dream tell and would remain in favor of pursuing jacktony.

I don't understand what you think happened here.

The theory is that you two are partners and are doing a fake distancing dance right here. There are some jabs that look serious but go nowhere.

Hmmm. Well, that's not what happened.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Night 2 has ended.

Time to go four eyes
Such a pest of a mole
Watch how little Tooty cries
Try again in the next poll!

Wait, what's that I see?
It's an egg headed right for me!
Not again, this cannot be
Aaaaayyyyyyiiiiieeeeeee!

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME has been killed. He was:

Spoiler: show

You are Bottles.



During each night phase, you may select a player. You will be told whether or not that player has a vanilla role.

Each time you receive a “vanilla” result, you will gain one Jiggy.

You are aligned with the civilians and win the game when all mafia members are eliminated.

nutella has been killed. She was:

Spoiler: show

You are Gruntilda Winkybunion.



During each night phase, you may select a player. You will be told who targeted that player that night if anyone.

[REDACTED]

You may safely claim to be Tooty.



You are aligned with the mafia and win the game when your team permanently matches or overtakes the voting power of the civilians.

Day 3 is underway. You have 48 hours to lynch someone. I will update the post count ceilings shortly.

Wrong reads flipping via nk is good.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Also so freaking weird but I had a dream that somehow included this game last night and Jack was playing in it I shit you not. Woke up and heres jack replaced in for Tony. So basically, I see the future now. Jack was bad. Let's see if that holds up too...

Lol I never dream about you. Maybe vote for people you aren't obsessed with and who can you know, actually answer your questions about the actions that they actually did.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I agree with Dunya's reason for townreading GMan. In theory, a scum player could just say those things but he reads like a townie excited to share info and I doubt he'd just make something up. Not his style.

Aaaaand I townread TH early on.

[Sloonei]

I agree with Dunya's reason for townreading GMan. In theory, a scum player could just say those things but he reads like a townie excited to share info and I doubt he'd just make something up. Not his style.

Aaaaand I townread TH early on.

You just crossed off the two most viable alternatives to yourself imo. Who do we lynch today, jackie boy?

[Jackofhearts2005]

I agree with Dunya's reason for townreading GMan. In theory, a scum player could just say those things but he reads like a townie excited to share info and I doubt he'd just make something up. Not his style.

Aaaaand I townread TH early on.

You just crossed off the two most viable alternatives to yourself imo. Who do we lynch today, jackie boy?

Yeah no shit.

Fuckifiknow. I’m not caught up.

Wasn’t Speed’s name being thrown around? Granted, I’ve read like 2 of his posts and shouldn’t advocate lynching someone I’m pretty good at reading until I actually read him, either.

[Sloonei]

I agree with Dunya's reason for townreading GMan. In theory, a scum player could just say those things but he reads like a townie excited to share info and I doubt he'd just make something up. Not his style.

Aaaaand I townread TH early on.

You just crossed off the two most viable alternatives to yourself imo. Who do we lynch today, jackie boy?

Yeah no shit.

Fuckifiknow. I’m not caught up.

Wasn’t Speed’s name being thrown around? Granted, I’ve read like 2 of his posts and shouldn’t advocate lynching someone I’m pretty good at reading until I actually read him, either.

speed’s viable for the same reason your slot is: lack of content. I’m interested in the MP theory, for whatever that’s worth. I could see him being pretty well concealed at this point.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

With 4 lynches left we are looking for a PoE of 4.

I think mine is Jack, Speed, MP and TH, in no specific order.

Dunya and Russ have felt civ all game, Sloonei is feeling civ lately since he started to lead the thread, and I think I like Gman's claim.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

If there is a doctor in this setup they should protect Gman, imo.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Can we do me later in the POE since I'm so fun and have a good avatar and am town?

[Turnip Head]

[VOTE: M Plus 7] aubergine

After looking back at his ISO I think I gave him too much credit before.

MP's ISO is concise and littered with clues. It's not a bad read if anyone wants to ISO him out and see what he's been up to so far, but I want to highlight my findings.

Point #1:

Spoiler: show

Fifth post and now I think MP looks better
His last few posts fit his town meta to the letter
But I have some questions about that rainbow
How did Nanook and Turnip earn spots in a green row?

My gut likes them, that's basically it for slight town people. I basically forced myself to GTH people out of my POE, and the ones that came out north of null fell into the slight town area. In their own methods, I felt like Nanook and Turnip are contributing their own reads and thoughts on matters in a genuine way.

I still may consider any of them for a vote today, but I'd have to see something compelling that caused me to change my read. I'm sure I'll be re-assessing in due time.

Freudian slip much? I added my own emphases in the above post where MP responds to nutella. nut asked him about his Nanook and Turnip reads. The "them" in particular feels like a baddie mindset slip where MP is responding to a teammate about how he plans to deal with the opposing team, as in us the civvies. Them.




Point #2:

Spoiler: show

oh cool, town mp is on my team. that's a relief.

mp, can you tell me why sloonei is "strong town"?

i didn't like gman's second post in the game. for all the effort he went into rhyming, i felt like we got 0 reads or anything of substance from it even if he only has a little time (so do i). that's where he and nanook differ for me, nanook offered some opinions on people (they weren't grand sweeping isos, but i don't care if people want to stick to a schtick and from memory it's common that nanook does this).

i am rereading sloonei now, because i feel i missed something.

It's an extremely strong positive gut response to pretty much everything he's said in this game. Sloonei feels different to me when he's scum, like it's hard to explain... when he's scum, he makes observations, points, etc., but there's no underlying drive, the agenda is easier to squint and see, even if he is good scum.

He felt organic on Day 0, and I gave him mild points for the strategic suggestions post, even if it would be easy enough to fake. There's this sort of anxiety that I perceive scum Sloonei plays with that's different than when he's town. I haven't seen it yet.

I also don't think scum Sloonei would respond the way he has to his reads (like #94 and #100. Scum Sloonei is more methodical in the way he responds to questioning of his reads, town Sloonei just sort of slaps away at stuff like that like he did here. I don't think we'd see a little bit of fire breathing from him either in this event; as scum my interpretation is that he'd give more thoughtful consideration to counter-points.

I feel like his ISO just has elements of his town game in spades so far here, even if many of them are more subtle. Of course, I'm open to re-evaluation.

Here we have MP giving a dissertation on a townread of Sloonei. It reads like that time nutella defended a townread of G-Man, I see a lot of similarities in the way they handled explaining their town reads with what feels like TMI. I think this scum team had a hard time driving discussion on townies they could try to lynch. Especially since we did such a good job of attacking each other for them. When townies fight each other hard, so hard so hard like to the death, sometimes when that happens, the baddies don't know where to even utilize their skills, so sometimes they default to explaining their "town reads" lol. Or asking townies to explain their scum reads, since as baddies they might not really understand those incorrect reads. I think that's what MP has been doing all game.


Point #3:

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

Hey fuckers it's Power Rankings Time

D5 The Mighty Ducks - Top 5!


1. M Plus 7 - Okay it's town MP let's not lynch him.

2. dunya - Okay it's town Dunya let's not lynch her.

3. Nutella - This is definitely towntella.

4. Russtifinko - Drops a bit but mostly because MP and Dunya went and showed me their role cards basically.

5. Sloonei - A bit of an awkward start but I give him points for considering threadstate so early on. I'll give him a mini pass because a post cap game does make sense to be something bothersome to him. Don't like his FPS town reads though. I see no reason to town read Epi or MP, let alone both of them. Would love an explanation.

6. Epignosis - I've moved him up a bit after sleeping because he's probably just town Epi.

7. TonyStarkPrime - Drops a bit from the last ranking mostly because of the movement of those below him. Still town reading him for the same reasons as before.

8. Sig - Got a bit of a wobbly boot on but still think he's town. Whiny sig is usually town sig.

Everyone Else

6. Turnip Head - My inverse read where he's town because he's taking the piss too much has reverted to a wtf read because literally all he's been doing is sheeping people.

8. NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - He seems to give very little fucks about getting his points across. This read could change if he would just stop posting in rhyme.

T11. G-Man + Speedchuck - They have made two posts each in a game that I would expect the scum to have action paralysis in.

Hey Mac, thanks for the updated reads. I suggest taking an ISO look at Nanook, and get back to me with what you think. Also can you elaborate on the Tony read?

Spoiler: show

12.

T11. G-Man + Speedchuck - They have made one off topic post each in a game that I would expect the scum to have action paralysis in.

Hey, why this?

--------------------------------------
Rainbow list to help me sort my thoughts and whatnot. Mostly GTH style reads here.


Russtifinko
Epignosis
Mac
MP
DDL
Nanook
dunya
nutella
Turnip Head
sig
Tony
G-man
speedchuck


Those results are boring. nutella and dunya are a pair of players that could very well be within their town games right now, but there's not enough for me to pronounce a judgment. DDL, like russ, feels good in his skepticism of me.
sig's been a little too self-focused. I don't care when he has or hasn't been lynched in past games. I want his opinions on this game, the one that's happening right now in this thread.
Nanook is green because he made me laugh.

Hey Sloonei, talk to me why you don't think there's enough for a judgement on dunya and nutella, but there's enough for Epi, Mac, and me.

Spoiler: show

Sloonei does actually have a weird snideness to his game that isn't usually present. Are you okay mate or are you just scum and is the being evil clouding your usual chirpy personality? I like how you've kept your POE super wide. Not very like you at all.

I would expect the methodology being wielded to make it harder for scum who already are not keen to post (ie. G-Man and Speedchuck who profile given G-Man doesn't like playing Mafia and Speedchuck slanks generally but somehow mustered an actual effort for Rona mafia so is probably burnt out). When I rand wolf I am always tailoring my posts, deleting them, walking away from the game etc. The post count cap + rhyming would just make that a lot worse.

I guess Sloonei's tone does seem a bit off now that you all have been mentioning it. I don't necessarily make too much of that alone though.

Spoiler: show

14. Epi feels distinctly different in this game, but I'm not currently inclined to view that as a negative point. Reads have been pouring out of him more openly than I'm used to. It's a change that doesn't necessarily strike me as agenda-driven. Or maybe that's the point.

But also I don't even know what he was talking about during the whole post count discussion. It seemed like he had it right at first and then fell down a rabbit hole with a misinterpretation of the rules. We had 25 posts on Day 0. We have 25 (+5) posts on Day 1.

Doesn't matter. You're mafia. [VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

Hey Epi, can you talk to me about this?

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

Post count ceilings for Day 1:

26 - Dragon D. Luffy
28 - dunya
34 - Epignosis
26 - G-Man
29 - M Plus 7
28 - MacDougall
30 - NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
30 - nutella
29 - Russtifinko
28 - sig
31 - Sloonei
26 - speedchuck
29 - TonyStarkPrime
28 - Turnip Head

Jiggy pursuits are now underway, and your 4-liners actually count.

I believe it is that I have greatly misunderstood the nature of Day 0. I was under the impression that Day 0 gave us 25 posts and that Day 1 gave us 25 new posts. Doing the math here implies that wasn't the case. Mac's accusation against me (that I'm burning through posts when I only made two Day 1 posts) implies that he was under (what I assume to be) the correct interpretation.

I would think that someone would be kind enough to use one of his or her posts to inform me of my faulty thinking vis-à-vis my accusation of M Plus 7. This correction never came from anybody (TH and nutella even joined me). However. maybe it also is that others were making the same incorrect assumption.

1.

Let us begin with a vote for sig
Whose entrance was just too big
He huffed and he puffed and made a scene
But he just looks the opposite of green

“Let’s not lynch sig day 1” looks like anxiety being masked as banter.

Lynch Sloonei after MP. This sucks.

1.
I agree about this being a bad look for Sloonei. Yeah, sig expressed conflicting views about rhyming. But to me that post, taken as a whole, reads as something a civ throws out because they aren't overly concerned with looking good. Mafia are the ones who try super hard to avoid contradictions in their posts, and that seems like it would've been super easy to avoid here.

Also, "let's not lynch sig day 1" is almost definitely anxiety masked as banter - no one likes dying D1. I don't see how it's alignment-indicative. Sloonei maybe you can explain that one?

Actually, as I reread Sloonei it looks worse and worse to me. As Tony pointed out, he started the lynch train on sig, then switch his vote to Tony because he didn't like all the votes on sig.....what???


-Other Thoughts-
Gonna disagree with Mac - I think Epi is genuinely scumhunting in his big D1 post about MP and Sloonei, and I don't really care about someone "burning through" their D0 posts.

On the other hand, although NANOOK's rhymes are probably the dopest so far, he's burning through D1 posts, which IMO is a different matter than the D0 ones. I also hate the vote on sig - I think it was bandwagony and poorly justified.

MP did the same thing as sig with the ambivalent response to post count limits, and I also don't think that is a big deal - knowing MP, he is probably really excited to be playing this but massively busy, so I bet he vascillates between wanting infinite posts and not having time to read infinite posts. I think the Omerta thing is really the only decent point in Epi's case against MP, but Epi says: "But that isn't important."

The enlarged either means that Russ is believing the same thing I was regarding Day 0, or he's being willfully ignorant here. I lean the former.

You’re talking wack, son
I’ve got like 20+ posts left
I’m barely a quarter done
I won’t leave you missing me and bereft

My vote is the best one
And I don’t wanna hear no beef
Pretending my reads are good is fun
So stop fighting it and hop on my scum killing leaf


(8)

The same thing applies here. At this point, Nanook had eight posts, which would mean "20+ posts left" isn't true. If counting started at Day 0, Nanook has 12 left (he currently has 13 posts).

dunya commented, but her response was independent of my accusing MP about the post count restriction.

i feel like epi's case on mp was a bit more like an english teacher nitpicking someone's grammar vs. scumminess in posts so i would vote epi out before mp.

You might know this already, but Epi is literally an English teacher irl. So I would kind of expect him to sounds like that as a default. I get that you think it weaken's his case on MP, but it doesn't necessarily make me read Epi as bad. Especially with schools being out, he's gotta find an outlet.

"I would vote Epi out before MP" is a strange conclusion to "i feel like epi's case on mp was a bit more like an english teacher nitpicking someone's grammar vs. scumminess in posts."

I do not agree that my treatment of MP was pedantic in the least (which is what the description implies). The meat of my accusation against MP was him complaining about posts and not doing anything about acquiring more posts. Then I realized I read everything about Day 0 the wrong way and it would appear I wasn't alone.

The problem I have here is the implication that "Epi vs MP" is something that needs to be "solved" as it were. Phrasing like this paves the road for "Well, Epi is dead. He was a civilian. We need to assess MP more strongly now."

That post reeks to me. [VOTE: dunya] aubergine

Anyway, this revelation on my end makes MP's reaction (one of bafflement) sensible. It doesn't tell me anything about his alignment on its own, but it at least makes sense.

Ohh, that makes a lot more sense now, Epi, so thank you. See, I assumed from the get-go that we had 25 on Day 0, then it reset to a separate 25 (or, in this case Jay's updated things) on Day 1, and so I was posting considering that fact.

Also, Russtifinko, I won't quote your long post, but Omerta was years ago, I couldn't even remember so I just checked -- May-June 2015.

As for my thoughts on dunya, the jury's out I think, and I'm going to have to wait and see more. It's within her modus operandi to make strong reads on Day 1. I'd still put her at slight town for whatever my opinion of her is worth.

As for whether people post in giant posts or multiple times in a row, I'm not sure anyone would think that doing the latter is a scum strategy? But perhaps I'm wrong there

Ok. Since Omerta was that long ago, I think Epi's case on you is bunk. As far as posting multiple times in a row , my theory is this: a scum player could conceivably use up their posts early in the Day, then say, "Aww shucks guys, I'm out of posts. Too bad I can't give reads or help y'all ctach baddies as the final votes come in." Civs will absolutely want to be able to be in the discussion throughout the day and save posts accordingly.

MP, is your slight town read on duyna purely gut-based? She's my strongest suspect right now, so if there's a good reason to change that I'd like to hear it.

Yall are overthinking the post count thing holy shit

Everyone has 25 posts for Day 1

The Day 0 posts don't matter

Jay was posting our post counts as reference so he could see when someone's total would show that they had posted 25 times on Day 1

Jesus.

I think this is wrong....what use would it be to use to show our eventual hypothetical post counts?? I'm 99% sure JJJ told us the D1 post limit each player has, which was influenced by post count on D0. Maybe our host can weigh in to clarify his previous post so we're all on the same page?

Yeah, I think she seems townie. Can you better explain to me your beefs with her exactly?

Spoiler: show

Mac seems more interested in reading townies than finding scum

I've voted for him

This is how town wins. In the last game I played I had the entire scum in the POE early. You should remember you were scum in that game. I used to scum read first but I realise I am far better at town reading people.

I can relate.

Spoiler: show

Ok so dunya and MP are acting like classic supatown duya and MP, not enough for me to be able to locktown them but enough for me to want to leave them alone for the time being.

Epi's case on dunya is weird af but it could be the normal epi thing.

I feel cool about Mac, too.

Russ feels very honest too.

Everyone else is whatever.

No idea who to vote for. I'm tempted to park my vote on this juicy TH wagon that seems to be starting to form. I miss super happy and casual TH (though he did make some posts like that in D0). Mac could be onto something that triggered TH is bad.

But I see nutella and TSP on it? Neither of them have yet to earn places my civ pile. DO NOT WANT.

Hey DDL, why do you not feel like you can town read nutella or Tony?

Also, can anyone else talk to me about this Russ v. dunya thing specifically? Do people think they're v/v or something else? I feel like it's an important development that no one's really addressed.

Spoiler: show

Nah I'm cool I'm cool. If I seem triggered it's because townie TH often feels misunderstood, or like, I don't give myself the benefit of the doubt from others, if that makes any sense. I also feel pressure to make the right reads, which I'd like to change about my playstyle so I can play calmer

I feel this as genuine.

Spoiler: show

Speaking of wasting posts, dunya just posted 5 times in a row - maybe combine those all into one?

so? they were all relevant as they came up. and combining posts on my phone is not possible, i can only do it on my laptop. and i'm not worried about post count, there's lots of townies here and no one wants to be washed out by someone who makes newspaper posts every time they post. even 1 good to-the-point post is worth a lot more than ramblings and echos that everyone has already discussed or said. this game gives a chance for everyone to do their part and chip in and be heard so don't expect newspapers more than once a day.

To state this even more strongly - dunya's 5th post of the game started with "oh cool, town mp is on my team. that's a relief." I have a slight town read on MP right now, but it's D1 and you're willing to 100% clear him? I remember MP's meta being that he's slightly more likely to read people as town if they read him as town, and given that he was already gettign some cred from Sloonei eariler, it seems like dunya may be trying to get in his good graces here. Dunya, maybe explain a little better why you think MP is bona fide 100% civvie?

who said i 100% towncleared him? who said i can't pass out town reads and take them away when they prove to be wrong? who said this? who makes those rules? this is how i play. my strategy is forming as many town reads as i can. it's the most effective way to hunt for scum, because paranoia makes everyone look scummy, even genuine townies. when i can't find town in someone, then you worry.

dunya, can you clarify more why you "hate" Epi's interpretation of the D0-D1 post count rules? It sounds like a vast proportion of the players misunderstood them, and when he realized he had, he immediately backed off and said it blew up his case.

because his case used things like "MP complaining about counting votes, but he's an accounting professor, so fake!" -- that's so incredibly silly and i felt like it was a built-up strawman case with points added just to amplify the number of words on the case.

I could see this being more of "attack anyone who attacks MP to get in his good graces" like what I mentioned above.

why do i care in the least to be in MP's good graces? is that what you're doing with your very wishy washy "why is dunya giving MP towncred" but adding a quick disclaimer that "he's town for me too!" lol. hypocricy much? who cares if i say slight, much, a little before i say town?

if anything your posts about MP and me reeks of tmi as though you know for certain MP is town and trying to spin the narrative that i'm trying to pocket him. very bad look for you.

I feel like you all are in a different thread than I am, and I can't tell if you two are speaking past each other or not. dunya, can you talk to me more about this?

Spoiler: show

Mac's bad fam we should probably lynch him. Saying interesting things doesn't make someone town, he's reverse engineering town reads

What do you mean exactly by reverse engineering town reads? I'm intrigued.

Spoiler: show

How does him balancing to overcome it prevent the human experience of it?

i don't understand? you said: "expect the scum to have action paralysis" to me, that implies role restrictions. what did you mean?

after rereading sloonei im undecided. i sense there's some reservation in his posts that i know scum sloonei is known for, but with the post restrictions, i can't tell if that's because of the limitations or because he actually is scum sloonei. but avoiding some stuff and choosing what to comment on without weighing in on things happening makes me hesitant. putting me and nutella in the same undecided could be town could not be category didn't sit right with me either. i don't see anywhere where he's questioned or called out anything i've said. indeed, he's gone this far without addressing me or commenting about me at all before his rainbow!

Why didn't it sit right with you?

Spoiler: show

@MacDougall

you wrote all TH has done is sheep people. where is that? i looked for it and didn't see it.

his first opinion was to say sig wasn't bad. everyone else was piling on sig. he went against the flow.

he voted MP with others, but then was the first to provide a counterargument and unvote.

he poked and voted for me on his own.

he voted for you and is pushing for your lynch for reasons he created entirely.


spicy hot take: mac and nutella and sloonei are bad.

I love the idea that you threw out this spicy hot take, but I have no idea what to make of that at this time. I will enter it into the database for evaluation. Beep boop.

Despite not necessarily agreeing with the hot take, I do feel like this game is in a hard mode... and I'm not quite sure why I feel that way. My reads are probably way wrong.
[/quote]

In this post, MP asks some softball questions and tries to hang out with a bunch of now-confirmed civs (a list that includes Mac and Epi for starters). This post is straight buddying, trying to get on a bunch of player's good sides without throwing out any accusations.

Note the bottom of the post where he cares to point out dunya's spicy hot take but does not give an opinion on the hot take, so why did he mention it? MP also says he feels like this game is in hard mode, which makes sense if he's a baddie whose inclination is to buddy up with the civs instead of fake some reads against them.

Throughout all of this I find a distinct lack of baddie hunting from M Plus 7; he doesn't give a lot of negative opinions or cast doubt or anything like that, I feel like he has been playing it very safe from a baddie perspective, while as town we have all been quite loud in sharing our negative opinions of each other and hopefully the bad guys.

The lone exception is his tiff with sig to start the game, which either way you look at it feels kinda squicky, especially one time in MP's iso where MP says he will lynch sig every game Day 1 if sig doesn't stop attacking him. 0_0 And that fight with sig, wanting to lynch him Day 1, was not based on a scumread of sig, but rather the simple fact that sig was playing in a way MP didn't like. Note the difference there, MP didn't want to lynch sig because he thought sig was bad, he just didn't like how sig was playing. But I'm not really super concerned about that. Despite his sig argument, MP hasn't really done anything that looks very townie to me.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

[mention]G-Man[/mention] I think you should probably claim your result. The benefits of confirming both you and the person who vigged nutella at this stage of the game (with mafia only having 3 kills left) probably enclipse the possible benefits of trying to make a later claim. I'm thinking you probably won't have that chance yourself anyway, since this mafia seems to have cop paranoia.

[dunya]

Wholesale support for Mac's day 1 reads. It's probably more accurate to read this as (phony) support of the effort from MacDougall, but if we mine it for more clues, we get support of the following list of suspects: Turnip Head, Epignosis, Nanook, MP, dunya, and G-man. I do not think that all of them need to be town, but nutella might be more resistant (at least, less openly supportive) if the list was threatening to her or her team.

you forgot to add speedchuck. he was coupled in with G-Man in mac's suspect pool. i would laugh we were all town, but i guess that one i trust least out those names is speedchuck.

This would be some harsh bussing if TH and nutella are teammates. Also in hindsight this post should have been a red flag ("I need someone to vote for other than MP" is yucky language).

to me this is more of a case of "buddying dunya" than it is "suspecting turnip", so i don't see it as a bus or distancing tactic.

There's nothing that I can really latch onto here, at least not by just looking at nutella's side of things, but these interactions with TH are distinctly peculiar.

eh, i take role claims with a grain of salt since mafia may have fake roles they can claim. indeed nutella's role didn't even need a fake role claim, her role could be a civ one.

G-Man looks good imo, as for his info I only request that he doesn't take his info to the grave since he's now a target. Sloonei also looks good.

no he doesn't. there's a vig who have proven themselves and they can claim whenever they want to, without gman outing them. gman can absolutely take it to his grave.

i still think tony/speed look worst out of nutella's iso. i get the TH suspicion more now though and i'll keep an open mind about that when isoing them.

[dunya]

@G-Man I think you should probably claim your result. The benefits of confirming both you and the person who vigged nutella at this stage of the game (with mafia only having 3 kills left) probably enclipse the possible benefits of trying to make a later claim. I'm thinking you probably won't have that chance yourself anyway, since this mafia seems to have cop paranoia.

nanook was clearly not a cop. there are no benefits for gman to out the other person. this is an open role claim game, they can role claim when THEY want. why would you put another vig shot at risk?

[mention]G-Man[/mention] no one suspects your claim, so please don't out the person in a game where they can role claim when THEY want.

[Turnip Head]

Dunya I'm town, no fighting!

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I'm not saying nanook was a cop, I'm saying this particular mafia mostly likely killed him to get rid of what seemed to be a cop.