I am playing less Mafia right now because X

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I am putting this poll up just to get a general idea of where folks are at here. There's been some dialogue here and on Discord about how slow some games have been to fill up lately, and I think it's important to try to nail down why that is the case before determining possible solutions. I know that I have personally not signed up for many games in recent memory, and it's mostly because I have very little time to spare and I have also been pretty burned out. That's perfectly okay if you are in a similar position. Too much fun ceases to be fun sometimes. We'll probably get it back eventually. I have blocked names from appearing in the poll on purpose.

If you have reasons not featured in the poll for not playing much Mafia lately, particularly on The Syndicate, feel free to use that "other" option and expand in the thread. Please be mindful, however, that this thread is not intended to be a space to vent general frustrations with the forum or community or its members. There are outlets for that, and if you have specific grievances by all means please bring them to my attention. But let's keep this thread friendly in all regards. Thanks gang.

[dunya]

no time + no desire in general.

games are fine and i wish i could play them all.

[Syn]

I can't commit to playing due to extenuating circumstances.

Specific to TS, the setups have recently been nonstandard, bastard, or role madness, or a mixture of the three, and that just doesn't interest me. However, this hasn't ended up impacting my willingness to play; I haven't played on MU either.

Most of my mafia time goes toward hosting now.

[Guillotine]

The games currently in sign ups don't interest me and I don't feel I should sign up so they would fill and get the wheel rolling. I think it would help if games have a set deadline and if they don't fill in time then skip to the next one in the schedule and see if they'd fill up instead.

Every time I check the board to see if there is a new game up for sign ups, they are the same games that have been up for weeks! So, what are we supposed to do? Play games we don't want or let the syndicate die because the hosts will not step down?

No, maybe your game is not interesting enough to make us feel like we want to play mafia again, there is always that mafia game that makes us want to play again and perhaps yours just is not it! So give the chance to the next host to offer that game maybe? and us players too? This is my point of view obviously, I'm not speaking for anyone but myself.

The second reason is for a specific grievance but I can ignore that for a great game concept.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I'm on a soft break since December 2020, due to a combination of mafia burnout and being busy in real life. I say "soft" because I have already kind of broken it by hosting a small game at One Last Forum. But for now I'm only hosting small games in small forums and not hosting anything big, or playing anything.

The soft break will end in December 2021, when the real life workload will likely go down. Then I will make my return by hosting Team Fortress, and likely signing up to some Rackets. I intend to stick to Rackets for now because the last few non-Racket games I played scared the shit out of me with how high the post count was. I believe the main reason for my burnout was all the mornings I spent reading and replying to over 500 posts for hours a day, and I don't want to return to that, probably ever.

All setups being offered seem interesting and fun, though. And I would play them, if my break was over and they were in the Racket slot instead of the slots they are in. But I'm a role madness guy, I can understand if a non-role madness person feels underwhelmed.

[MartinGG99]

I used to play like 2-3 (or even 4) forum mafia games a month across multiple sites last year, but nowadays I do 1-2, at most 2. This is due to a number of things, top-most being the biggest factor:

--COVID stopped being serious enough to prevent in-person interaction for most of my education, causing travel time for IRL stuff to be a factor again after 1.5ish years
--I also have increased the amount of courses I take per semester up to 5 from 4.
--I have other, non-FM games that have my interest. This isn't to say that I'm not interested in FM; I certainly am, but I can no longer satisfy my entertainment needs if I play solely one thing (especially if I played said thing a lot in the past).
--I currently consider 4 communities to potentially play FM on (This used to be 2-3 back in 2020). I try to play across them with even frequency if I can, but if I'm playing 1-2 FM games per month then it can be several months or even half-a-year before I even sign-up for another game on the same site.

I might one day return to playing as frequently as I did in 2020 but I'm doubtful that will be anytime soon; that may have to wait until late May of 2022.

[Scotty]

My time has been throttled of late with job changes and schedule flux. I’ll still play any game/any theme if you twist my arm for numbers, because I like playing games. But I do think I am the outlier, not the norm.

My gut tells me games aren’t filling because of many factors, but the one that makes sense to me is the worldwide shift out of the pandemic. Gone are the days of 2020 locked inside with nothing better to do. Now people have jobs and school to attend in person, and getting the rusty gears of life working again, so people have far less time and energy to spend on FM.

That’s purely conjecture, and im sure overgeneralizing.

[G-Man]

Other: In X number of games, I plan on retiring from playing mafia altogether. I have a vague sense of the value of X, but it’s not locked in just yet.

Reasons for retiring:
1) I’m busy.

2a) I can’t keep pace with the game as it is currently played.

2b) I don’t derive as much joy from playing as I used to.

2c) I’m nostalgic for a style, tempo, and tone of play that is never coming back.



Because my number of games are limited to X, I’m even choosier than I used to be. Full-size Jobs are out due to 2a. Those games tend to be the ‘most creative’ in that they typically have the most appealing combination of interesting roles and interesting flavor. I seek both in the games that I play when possible.

That leaves me with Heists and Rackets. Sometimes it’s just bad timing that keeps me from signing up for a Heist or Racket that I would otherwise like to. Sometimes I have availability, but the games in sign-ups aren’t my thing for whatever reason. I also will not play while I am hosting.

[fingersplints]

For me it’s busy with new baby but it’s also a little bit of this:

Specific to TS, the setups have recently been nonstandard, bastard, or role madness, or a mixture of the three, and that just doesn't interest me. However, this hasn't ended up impacting my willingness to play; I haven't played on MU either.

I can’t keep up with the crazy games, so a mafia game that would entice me to play would need to be a small game with no crazy role stuff preferably but not necessarily in a theme I love.

[Master Radishes]

Mainly it's being busy with work.

Somewhat linked to that, I face the conundrum of preferring higher activity games but not having the time for them. I could probably handle smaller/slower games (i.e. Rackets) but find them limiting for my own style and thus for my sense of enjoyment.

And also there's just the fact I prefer vanilla-ish games without super wacky mechanics. I'm not adverse to a role madness game, but I agree with Syn above that lately it feels TS games are...very creative setups that simply aren't drawing my interest.

[Master Radishes]

The games currently in sign ups don't interest me and I don't feel I should sign up so they would fill and get the wheel rolling. I think it would help if games have a set deadline and if they don't fill in time then skip to the next one in the schedule and see if they'd fill up instead.

Every time I check the board to see if there is a new game up for sign ups, they are the same games that have been up for weeks! So, what are we supposed to do? Play games we don't want or let the syndicate die because the hosts will not step down?

No, maybe your game is not interesting enough to make us feel like we want to play mafia again, there is always that mafia game that makes us want to play again and perhaps yours just is not it! So give the chance to the next host to offer that game maybe? and us players too? This is my point of view obviously, I'm not speaking for anyone but myself.

I think I agree with this, at least to some extent. I'd probably prefer keeping the 'slow-to-fill' game in open sign-ups even if another game is opened for sign-ups as well (after a certain time period). That way the first game can still have a chance to keep gradually filling. Obviously there should then be a limit on how many games are open at a time (probably just two max).

[sig]

Well I think there are a few reasons.

1. I think alot of the core TS people that could be depended on to fill games have totally retired (not even on the site anymore) or semi retired.

2. The games are just too much now. I can't keep up with the pace, they become more stressful/annoying than fun when you leave for work and come back to like 20-30+ pages and players expect you to be caught up. It really ends up becoming like another job rather than a fun social thing.

3. At least for me life just massively picked up and don't have the time to commit. And that would be true even if the games were slower paced.

[Quin]

i had to go MIA for a while after my mental health took a dive across the last 2 years or so. nothing to do with the community or the games, and im ready to get back into a couple games now if they interest me or people really want me in.

[Roxy]

for me it is all -

Well I think there are a few reasons.

1. I think alot of the core TS people that could be depended on to fill games have totally retired (not even on the site anymore) or semi retired.

2. The games are just too much now. I can't keep up with the pace, they become more stressful/annoying than fun when you leave for work and come back to like 20-30+ pages and players expect you to be caught up. It really ends up becoming like another job rather than a fun social thing.

3. At least for me life just massively picked up and don't have the time to commit. And that would be true even if the games were slower paced.

thank you for the perfect wording sig <3

[MacDougall]

I will always play games to try to get the site moving (ie I signed up to the most recent two just so they'd get started). But I kind of agree with Guillo. When there are games stuck in signups purgatory for ages and not getting sign-ups, it's probably because the game (or dare I say the host, or some of the other players signed up) are unattractive to me. I can't help that.

I think a simple way to fix it would be to have a limit on how long a game can be in the sign-up (if we are always going to limit the amount of games that are run) stage. I find that once they get to a certain point they end up filling fast so maybe like if they don't get to 50% full within a week then the another game enters sign-ups instead. Or maybe you can put multiple games in sign-up at once and the one that fills up to 50% first stays and the others go back into the queue.

[MacDougall]

Other: In X number of games, I plan on retiring from playing mafia altogether. I have a vague sense of the value of X, but it’s not locked in just yet.

Reasons for retiring:
1) I’m busy.

2a) I can’t keep pace with the game as it is currently played.

2b) I don’t derive as much joy from playing as I used to.

2c) I’m nostalgic for a style, tempo, and tone of play that is never coming back.



Because my number of games are limited to X, I’m even choosier than I used to be. Full-size Jobs are out due to 2a. Those games tend to be the ‘most creative’ in that they typically have the most appealing combination of interesting roles and interesting flavor. I seek both in the games that I play when possible.

That leaves me with Heists and Rackets. Sometimes it’s just bad timing that keeps me from signing up for a Heist or Racket that I would otherwise like to. Sometimes I have availability, but the games in sign-ups aren’t my thing for whatever reason. I also will not play while I am hosting.

@G-Man can you articulate the bolded? I am sure that we can accommodate this.

[MacDougall]

For me it’s busy with new baby but it’s also a little bit of this:

Specific to TS, the setups have recently been nonstandard, bastard, or role madness, or a mixture of the three, and that just doesn't interest me. However, this hasn't ended up impacting my willingness to play; I haven't played on MU either.

I can’t keep up with the crazy games, so a mafia game that would entice me to play would need to be a small game with no crazy role stuff preferably but not necessarily in a theme I love.

You mean like Bluey. That's kinda why I ran that game. I thought that running a game with a pretty simple setup, small with a light flavour would be worthwhile. I totally feel the sentiment of wanting more "normal games".

I think that perhaps we should have a conversation about "standard setups" and have some pre-approved ones that fit that mold. It does seem like every game is either bastard or hyper unusual here. Which I think discourages some people from playing here or playing at all.

[MacDougall]

I'll also add that when I run games I do actively ask people to play them. I don't really feel like putting a sign-up thread up and then just sorta waiting for it to fill works on here really (especially when your game is a setup that requires more than double digits of players).

[MacDougall]

Also lastly, and this might hurt to read but the MU technology makes playing mafia a lot easier. Modbot, voting history, postcounts etc. There's no sugar coating the fact that if you ran a game here vs. MU that the user experience is just flat out better there. The only thing TS has going for it is the people and a very large portion of the people here are now playing all over the place.

Nostalgia is great, and I am sure someone is gonna get mad at me for saying this but I feel like this community is destined to become an MU subforum one day.

[Marmot]

For me it’s busy with new baby but it’s also a little bit of this:

Specific to TS, the setups have recently been nonstandard, bastard, or role madness, or a mixture of the three, and that just doesn't interest me. However, this hasn't ended up impacting my willingness to play; I haven't played on MU either.

I can’t keep up with the crazy games, so a mafia game that would entice me to play would need to be a small game with no crazy role stuff preferably but not necessarily in a theme I love.

You mean like Bluey. That's kinda why I ran that game. I thought that running a game with a pretty simple setup, small with a light flavour would be worthwhile. I totally feel the sentiment of wanting more "normal games".

I think that perhaps we should have a conversation about "standard setups" and have some pre-approved ones that fit that mold. It does seem like every game is either bastard or hyper unusual here. Which I think discourages some people from playing here or playing at all.

I agree with this.

We added the "Heist" setup to be a mostly vanilla setup with a slight amount of PR usage, and that was also a way to help prepare us for Champs games. However, Champs style formats no longer fit in the Heist mold because 1) they tend to have more than 3 PRs, and 2) They have 17 players, which is above the 15-player cap. I think that we should add Champs style formats to the Heist mold.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Maybe it's time the mountainous-only game type becomes a reality.

[Marmot]

mountainous

[G-Man]

Other: In X number of games, I plan on retiring from playing mafia altogether. I have a vague sense of the value of X, but it’s not locked in just yet.

Reasons for retiring:
1) I’m busy.

2a) I can’t keep pace with the game as it is currently played.

2b) I don’t derive as much joy from playing as I used to.

2c) I’m nostalgic for a style, tempo, and tone of play that is never coming back.



Because my number of games are limited to X, I’m even choosier than I used to be. Full-size Jobs are out due to 2a. Those games tend to be the ‘most creative’ in that they typically have the most appealing combination of interesting roles and interesting flavor. I seek both in the games that I play when possible.

That leaves me with Heists and Rackets. Sometimes it’s just bad timing that keeps me from signing up for a Heist or Racket that I would otherwise like to. Sometimes I have availability, but the games in sign-ups aren’t my thing for whatever reason. I also will not play while I am hosting.

@G-Man can you articulate the bolded? I am sure that we can accommodate this.

In the days of Lostpedia and SpoilerTV (my first two or three years playing online), mafia was a secondary attraction on broader sites. It was played for funsies in between episodes and seasons of Lost and there was a lot of emphasis on flavor and storytelling because we all wanted to write fan fiction. Eventually the smaller and shorter games stayed entirely for funsies, where we would just shoot the breeze and laugh at ourselves when we failed spectacularly. There was no ‘correct’ way to play or host the game then.

As that mafia group broke away from Lostpedia and merged with other small pockets of the mafiaverse, mafia became the main attraction. As such, the nature of playing and hosting changed from an artful pursuit to more of a discriminating taste kind of thing, and then further onto becoming more of a serious scientific endeavor in which one’s intent is to hone their skills to play or host with exacting precision.

That’s not to say that this gradual shift is a bad thing. For a lot of folks, it’s exciting and what they need and want out of the game. It just happens to nudge someone like me more to the sidelines as a player as the game evolves away from me. I’m at a point in my life where I just want to have those kinds of breezy, laugh-it-off kind of games like I cut my teeth on over a decade ago. Given the state of progression, I really don’t think that can be accommodated.

The recent desire for more basic game structure also nudges me to the sidelines as a host. I never let go of those weird experimental roots, and that seems to be more of a liability right now than an asset. I had to cancel one game this year out of apparent lack of interest (and looming work responsibilities). When aifaM sign-ups stalled out, I was worried that I would have to cancel it too, and perhaps that cancelling two games in one year meant that my games were no longer desired, which by extension might mean I was no longer needed as a host. It’s silly to draw validation from how quickly your games fill up, but I think a lot of us would admit that it happens.

In the ‘old days’ (and even here), we would run a hosting poll and those games that landed in the top five would be scheduled to run, and those games would all get run because that was one of the community values we shared- everyone gets their chance. It’s much more of a free market now. I worry that putting a hard deadline on sign-ups will result in potential hosts from feeling like they don’t have a place to shine because they couldn’t fill up a game fast enough. Once is embarrassing enough, but twice (especially consecutively) can be interpreted a lot of different ways inside your mind.

Sorry, I meant to write two paragraphs, which turned into three, which then became five. End ramble.

[MacDougall]

I find your games are among the best games so I would encourage you to keep hosting if you enjoy it. Maybe you should try hosting on MU where there are more people?

Maybe we should make an effort to make more games that are themed to topical things? I often feel like doing that. For instance while Squid Game was on I was sorta hoping to see a Squid Game mafia here. It's a challenge though cuz the queue is so long.

[G-Man]

I find your games are among the best games so I would encourage you to keep hosting if you enjoy it. Maybe you should try hosting on MU where there are more people?

Maybe we should make an effort to make more games that are themed to topical things? I often feel like doing that. For instance while Squid Game was on I was sorta hoping to see a Squid Game mafia here. It's a challenge though cuz the queue is so long.

I’ll keep hosting until it’s it’s no fun to host anymore or until my games start failing to fill up with regularity. From what I can gather, the MU crowd doesn’t seem too keen on my oddball game setups. I also think that The Syndicate is the end of the line for my mafia travels. I barely found TS after a few years away from the game, and I don’t see myself jumping headlong into another community after I retire from playing. I’m content with all the friends and connections I’ve made up to now. If TS eventually fizzles out, I’ll at least be able to connect with you folks on the TS Discord servers, assuming they don’t fizzle out too.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Personally I love hosting games with big, experimental mechanics (I wrote a guide on making them, ffs) and the day I have to drop those to only host simple setups will be the day I drop hosting permanently. I get the attraction of playing such a game, but hosting... not that much. I can write a role list with cop+doctor+vanilla in a couple minutes, so the entire creative side of hosting would be gone with that.

Even smaller setups I'll only host if there's a twist (like Space Invaders, which I didnt make myself but wanted to see happening). If you want to play montainous have fun (I might join too), but we might as well design a bot that hosts montainous games since the actual hosting work for that is nearly zero.

[Mongoose]

2/3 of my employees are moving on to other agencies so I'm doing a lot of jobs.

Also I just don't have the mental real estate for this. I do however have time for socializing so if you miss me, holler on the social media or on the Discord.


(I do REALLY want to host Felt Mafia 3 but am a little overwhelmed at trying to find the most appropriate place to put the lineup or whatever. If you feel like you (you as the universal you) could help me with this, DM me and link me to the correct place maybe?).

[protocultures]

games listed are not typically what I would prefer but then again, same could be said on several other forum sites.

Im a simple player and prefer fully open setups or at least only semi closed. Even if fully open, I prefer limited PR or mountainous without flips. I imagine hosting these are not as fun/rewarding as watching a custom scenario which you have lovingly crafted but cant be sure how people think about these things.

I sense the majority here prefer closed games or role madness style games so I just try to expand my mafia experience by playing in them. I enjoyed space invaders for example.

Hopefully this is not viewed as "venting frustration" but as an honest response to the question.

I havent been here for a long time so cant comment on what is going on or understand the context but I have seen mafia communities fizzle out or game volume drop. In my view, the typical reason is player X does not want to play with Player Y, however does not want to cause any issues so just remains silent as to reasoning and they dont sign up. If there are enough players that dont want to play with player Y, the game may struggle to start at all. Typically these preferences or reasons are not even communicated as nobody wants to start any discussions which may lead to hurt feelings. TS seems one of the overly nice and inclusive communities I have seen so this seems less likely but my cynical nature tells me this is always a possibility.

Alternatively you get a bunch of brand new/unknown players and maybe people dont want to sign up for a game because of the elevated risks associated with new players. Random abandonment, weak solving, low post count which gives nothing for people to work with etc. Again, I suspect this is less likely to be the case at TS due to the heavy emphasis on closed/complex setups which likely makes joining a game as a new player significantly less likely due to being more intimidating.

In the end mafia is a social game and its way more fun to play with friends so in the short term, if you were to create an entirely private lobby through invitation only, I suspect you would get some games starting very quickly. However in the long term, this is terrible for growing the community to replace people who stop playing mafia. Some middle ground where you run private lobbies in conjunction with public lobbies with a limited number of new people is my ideal world but typically I find about half the people find the idea of a private lobby inherently abhorent as a concept.

For the avoidance of doubt, there are no players I avoid (very limited number of games for me on TS and most are unknown to me anyway) but I have some I would enjoy playing with more and I would be more likely to sign up for if I saw they were potentially playing in it. I just raise this as a potential reason since "other" is listed and I havent seen anyone bring it up yet.