The Syndicate

That was a pretty disappointing talk from Monkey regardless of alignment.

How many of those night actions do you think are real?

Night 1 - Chaos
Night 2 - Bopped Enrique’s nose
Night 3 - Shot Mac
Night 4 - Played too much Persona and missed the deadline.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 6:07 pm N1 - Quin visited chaos, got cursed
N2 - Quin didn't submit
N3 - no one but me visited Jack
N4 - I learned Boethiah can give out roleblocks

3-Night cycle so I can forget to submit again.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:38 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:35 pm

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:35 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:32 pm

lost monkey wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:18 pm Jack...on N2, he targeted Enrique.

Fwiw, this is true.

What did you target with again?

Didn’t say.

Would saying at this time be particularly hazardous, because maybe it prompts...something...so I think maybe you should.

I think it’s more helpful than not to not say.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:35 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:32 pm

lost monkey wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:18 pm Jack...on N2, he targeted Enrique.

Fwiw, this is true.

What did you target with again?

Didn’t say.

Gavial wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:30 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:15 pm [VOTE: Tim] aubergine

Vanity wagon let's goooo

Like he Legit voted LW and tried to make the CW to them Tim.
He clearly doesn’t wanna vote Vulgard because he knows he’s so close to winning as scum here.

Gavial...he’s joking.

Gavial wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:27 pm

lost monkey wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:18 pm I can use the tracker shine from time to time. Another shot can be used the next day. I already tracked jack on N2, he targeted Enrique. I really wanted to hide and track tonight, all that got wasted.

Ok so then Jack might actually be Town then?

It is frustrating that this of all things is making you reconsider your read on me.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 5:18 pm Jack...on N2, he targeted Enrique.

Fwiw, this is true.

If this ends the game, I ain’t even gonna be mad but i am hoping for a wolf flip.

I wish the Cindy Kate had the same vote analysis tech so I could quickly check if there was ever any pressure on Lomo and what votes looked like when Mac and Falcon shaded him.

Seanzie still out posting Lomo smh.

DaisyCloud wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:19 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 4:16 pm My case on Monkey is as follows.

Both Mac and Falcon expressed scumreads on Lomo that they did not follow up on. Lomo interacts a lot with them but doesn’t really do anything to get either yeeted or that looks not w/w. And mostly, if I’m wrong, I can say it wasn’t my fault because he should have replaced out. It’s hard to read players who have full days practically missing from their isos.

Devil’s advocate: Wouod wolves allow their teammate to make no vote at all for several days? Fucking probably tbh.

this is basically my case on monkey. but like he could still just be town.

y u copying me

Like if the test says 2+2= and we both get 4, doesn’t mean I copied you. There’s just like limited conclusions one can draw from a limited iso.

My case on Monkey is as follows.

Both Mac and Falcon expressed scumreads on Lomo that they did not follow up on. Lomo interacts a lot with them but doesn’t really do anything to get either yeeted or that looks not w/w. And mostly, if I’m wrong, I can say it wasn’t my fault because he should have replaced out. It’s hard to read players who have full days practically missing from their isos.

Devil’s advocate: Wouod wolves allow their teammate to make no vote at all for several days? Fucking probably tbh.

I get the idea “Radishes is lazy.”

I get the idea “Radishes said he scumread the wolf but voted a no wolf instead.”

I don’t get the idea “Radishes making a case at all = scum Radishes.”

Is Lost Monkey a wolf?

Whatever [VOTE: LostMonkey] aubergine

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 2:52 pm Like don’t vote for LM as a punt, read the ISO and vote LM as a reasonable decision or else you’ll take an arrow to the knee

I mean, he’s posted twice today and five times yesterday, some of those posts having no content.

There’s plenty in the iso that could be distancing with Mac and Falcon tho

I kinda wanna punt and vote Lost Monkey.

3 player wolfteams without Monkey totally exist tho.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 2:08 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 2:03 pm

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:58 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:57 pm Scotty says Jack says “Vote for falcon...if your top scum read...will?” wrt me wanting Tim to vote Falcon instead of Marmot. “This makes absolutely no sense”

That’s me trying to consolidate votes. I was voting for Tim. Tim was voting for Marmot. I think Falcon and Tim are wolves and Marmot is town.

Town Tim (in theory) will be willing to switch from town Marmot to wolf Falcon. Wolf Tim (in theory) will be willing to do the same so as to look townie, especially if he’s worried Falcon will flip anyway without his vote, making him look super scummy.

So in theory, making this proposition protects a townread (Marmot) and a wolfread (Tim) to ensure the death of a wolfread (Falcon).

It’s not a nonsensical stall. It’s me trying to save a townie and yeet a wolf which, in the end, I did.

What if Marmot was a wolf all along tho?

Well then I’m an even bigger idiot and Marmot did exactly what I was trying to make you do.

But I don’t think so. Mac’s treatment of Marmot is suicide for no good reason if they’re partnered.

how would you describe "Mac's treatment of Marmot"?

I keep coming back to tied Marmot/Mogh wagons and Mac took Mogh voters (himself and at least 1 other player) and moved them to Gavil.

So if Marmot is a wolf, Mac switches it from Town/Wolf to Different Town(or whatever)/Wolf wagons, which doesn’t actually make Marmit less likely to be yeeted. However, it puts him on record as wanting both CWs to go over Marmot. So if Marmot is yeeted, this makes Mac look very bad, again, without actually managing to make Marmot less likely to be yeeted that day, let alone in the long run.

I have a hard time getting around this reasoning.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:57 pm NGL, I want Radish to be the wolf so I can just sheep Vulgard...

Mood.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:38 pm

Vulgard wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 12:43 pm Oh, by the way. There's a mechanical problem.
If I survive today, I don't know what to do. My options are all negative utility in this gamestate like the jailkeep on Gavial.

What are they? Maybe we can brainstorm a creative way to use one beneficially.

I am starting to look for benefits in leaving you and Radish to twist in the wind. I'm getting more and more locked in on one, and only one, of you being a wolf. That leaves two other wolves out in the wild. Rather than take the 50/50/90 between you and Radish, there may be merit in trying to bang out some other wolf that could resolve the issue between the two of you for us.

Now I want to clarify something that I think we as town are largely looking at wrong. The "wolf PR" line of thinking. Falcon should not be treated as a wolf PR. He held the Razor. That was his main thing. He had some other power (I haven't checked back to see what it is) but I am sure the bulk of his power was the Razor and the wolves didn't lose that. So if the wagons came down to Falcon v another wolf (Marmot?) and that wolf was a serious power that would be lost then, yeah, Falcon can just die, bet hellbussed for cred, take his low posting low effort wolf carcass and go.

Hugely agree.

That said, the only possible hellbusser is Kyle. He wasn’t willing to move off Falcon and over to you. If he had, I think it’s fairly reasonable to assume you would have flipped, ESPECIALLY with Marmot also choosing between you and Falcon with me yelling at him to go for you.

So I don’t think there’s a Falcon+Marmot+hellbusser of the Falcon wagon kinda world.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:58 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:57 pm Scotty says Jack says “Vote for falcon...if your top scum read...will?” wrt me wanting Tim to vote Falcon instead of Marmot. “This makes absolutely no sense”

That’s me trying to consolidate votes. I was voting for Tim. Tim was voting for Marmot. I think Falcon and Tim are wolves and Marmot is town.

Town Tim (in theory) will be willing to switch from town Marmot to wolf Falcon. Wolf Tim (in theory) will be willing to do the same so as to look townie, especially if he’s worried Falcon will flip anyway without his vote, making him look super scummy.

So in theory, making this proposition protects a townread (Marmot) and a wolfread (Tim) to ensure the death of a wolfread (Falcon).

It’s not a nonsensical stall. It’s me trying to save a townie and yeet a wolf which, in the end, I did.

What if Marmot was a wolf all along tho?

Well then I’m an even bigger idiot and Marmot did exactly what I was trying to make you do.

But I don’t think so. Mac’s treatment of Marmot is suicide for no good reason if they’re partnered.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:20 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 10:21 am At this point, based on what Vulgard posted, he’s got no read on MR and it is purely a self pres. they could still be aligned

If Radishes flips red I will defend Vulgard and probably just follow his reads. I don't think that TWO wolves case Falcon and wind up voting me...that's a wolf and a town that the wolf wants to look like.

Reasonable take.

Scotty says Jack says “Vote for falcon...if your top scum read...will?” wrt me wanting Tim to vote Falcon instead of Marmot. “This makes absolutely no sense”

That’s me trying to consolidate votes. I was voting for Tim. Tim was voting for Marmot. I think Falcon and Tim are wolves and Marmot is town.

Town Tim (in theory) will be willing to switch from town Marmot to wolf Falcon. Wolf Tim (in theory) will be willing to do the same so as to look townie, especially if he’s worried Falcon will flip anyway without his vote, making him look super scummy.

So in theory, making this proposition protects a townread (Marmot) and a wolfread (Tim) to ensure the death of a wolfread (Falcon).

It’s not a nonsensical stall. It’s me trying to save a townie and yeet a wolf which, in the end, I did.

Tony says 4 wolves here Kyle/Falcon/Nacho/Vulgard/Jack.
Jack says no, 2-3 wolves.
Scotty says that is Jack defending Falcon.
But if you look at Jack’s readlist, it’s
Jack
Vulgard
Kyle
Falcon/Nacho.

So I’m not defending Falcon. I’m agreeing Falcon is likely a wolf.

Didn’t mean to submit yet oh well

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 12:57 pm Jack > falcon

Spoiler: show

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Wed May 19, 2021 12:48 am

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed May 19, 2021 12:43 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 18, 2021 11:55 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue May 18, 2021 11:54 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue May 18, 2021 10:16 pm Fwiw I really like nacho’s entrance. I feel like he just started playing- we’re playing twister and it’s back foot green and we’re both jockeying for that spot!

Yeah, he feels town. Which is another minor hole in my Daisy suspicion.

I’m

Pondering the likelihood of a world where Daisy and Tim are town and Marmot and Flanders are not.

Need to work out in my head who another three wolves would be with that.

I’m gonna work out in my head a world in which I’m just tunneling you (with apparently daisy) since I’m apparently wrong about your guilt according to *everyone else*

How do you see falcon fitting in to that arrangement?

Idk.

I’ve felt Falcon has had a good tone all game but idk if I’ve seen their scum game ever. Falcon briefly pursued the “yeet someone I think is town” strategy but he got off it pretty damn quick in a way that felt not like a wolf backpedaling.

Falcon meh

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 12:59 pm

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 8:55 am Nachomamma's ISO I could best describe as inoffensive. There's nothing in it that definitively told me they have no TMI. But it is not a dumpster fire and I do not want to kill this yet.

Falcon's ISO is a step below that. He spent most of the game pushing LHF. The push on Marmot is especially notable because he's tunneled on it hard. If Marmot's mafia, then this looks better for him, but I currently don't think Marmot's a wolf.

Vibbing with these reads.

Falcon meh

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 1:23 pm Idk who I wanna yeet but if I did, it would probably be Tim.

Made
Scotty
Daisy
Marmot
Vul
Tony
Gavil
LC
Kyle
Radishes
Falcon
Nacho
Monkey
Tim

I hate this list.

Falcon somewhere on bottom

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:29 pm Let’s go @Kylemii

Tim yeet. Maybe Falcon tomorrow

Falcon not priority

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:35 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:34 pm vote for falcon or you're a wolf it's as easy as that

Falcon has less votes than Tim and one is Nacho.

Is there a case for why Falcon over Tim?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:37 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:36 pm maybe I'm thinking about this completely wrong

From a strategic standpoint, yeah.

Falcon could still be a wolf but if only 1 or 2 townies are voting there....

Falcon maaaaybe but doubtful

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:39 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:37 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:36 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:35 pm the marmot wagon probably has four towns which I think makes marmot significantly more likely to be town

If everyone on the Marmot wagon AND Marmot are town, who is your poe?

the falcon wagon, falcon, vulgard, maybe you

Lol 4/5 of Kyle/Falcon/Nacho/Vulgard/Jack.

Jesus, Tony. I think you got probably 2-3 wolves on that list.

Casting doubt on falcon wagon

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 6:53 pm I’ll vote Falcon if Tim will.

Vote for falcon...if your top scum read...will? This makes absolutely no sense

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 8:37 pm Like I didn’t see a Tim fighting his ass off to get Falcon chopped. Not even close. I saw a Tim hoping Tim would run out and a Marmot yeet would go through.

Nor you, lol

Something doesn’t add up with Jack’s vote do falcon. This could absolutely be a bus

You’re misinterpreting a couple things here.

First off, the vote count when I asked people to move off Falcon and only Tim were like

Marmot (strong townread) - Scotty (absent), Vulgard (absent), Long Con? (absent, not trusted), Tim (not trusted)

Falcon (scumread, partly by scummy behavior and partly by poe) - Nacho (absent, not trusted), Tony (present townread), Kyle (present townread)

Tim (biggest scumread) - Jack, Radishes? (townlean at the time iirc but not present), someone else

So I came in an hour from eod and saw probably a townie being yeeted over probably two wolves and if there was just one wolf, it was Tim. So I pinged iirc the four townreads I had who were present. Marmot(off wagon), Daisy (off wagon?), Tony (Falcon) and Kyle (Falcon) to consolidate to yeet preferably Tim but at least Falcon over Marmot.

Kyle and Tony refused to move to Tim and stated they basically hasn’t read my case on him because it was too long (it was probably wrong anywho). So I was very frustrated by this and voted Falcon while encouraging Daisy and Marmot to do the same because I genuinely wanted to yeet Falcon over Marmot if those were my two choices.

You’re worried you’re seeing me try to move votes from w!Falcon to t!Tim. What you’re seeing is me try to move present townreads to one wagon on a player I suspected. First, Tim and when that failed, Falcon. This caused Falcon to go over instead of Marmot. Maybe Tony would have consolidated those votes without me. Idk.

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 12:46 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 17, 2021 10:54 pm So I’m somewhere like


Townread
KZA
Bo
Mac
Made
Falcon

Townlean (these reads are all stupid)
Kyle
Scotty
Tony
LC

???
Enrique
Nacho (yeet if Daisy is a wolf)
Marmot
Quin
anyone else if forgotten

Scumread
Tim
Flanders
Daisy

D3. Look at that sexy list. Jack, I know neither of us have had good reads but damn

Yeah, but I turned around on two of the townies at the bottom and one wolf at the top because I am very smart.

I don’t know what to do.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 10:30 am Exactly. If Falcon might get yeeted, why not be there at EoD? It's my team's PR if I'm a wolf. And KP, too. Shouldn't I try harder to save it, even for one more night?

I just think not showing up is NAI and it feels dishonest to say “I would have done X if I was a wolf” when that would require you to have seen things you didn’t see. But yeah, maybe you’d have seen it if you were a wolf.

I wanna see a case on LC.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 3:26 am If I'm a wolf and have TMI on Falcon being a wolf, I'd commit to his wagon instead of bailing. Especially since I already scumread him, so might as well commit for townpoints, right? Either that, or I'd try to pile on Marmot after justifying it. Me leaving a vanity vote on Tim isn't the best play if I'm a wolf, to put it mildly. I am neither saving my teammate nor killing a villager.

As for Gavial - I talked about him earlier. I am quite confident his play this game has been out of his wolfrange, BUT. I haven't played for him for a few months. In theory, it is possible he expanded his wolfrange and is no longer scared of pushing insane worlds as a wolf. That was his wolftell beforehand; as a wolf, he'd be more self-conscious and would try to hide it. As town, he wouldn't be self-conscious at all, which is what I see in this game.

About Enrique's actions - yes, I do know.

- N1, he jailkept Tim.
- N2, he submitted no action.
- N3, he visited Sheogorath (chaos), something I decided to keep unchanged. I assume it removed me from the poll throughout D4.

I am slowly reaching the conclusion that Gavial is screaming instead of pushing.

Should I selfvote? I'm getting the impression you're never going to believe me. I've tried to explain my actions for half this day phase and it feels like a waste of time. This isn't AtE, genuine question. Do you think it's +EV for me to do this here as a villager?

But....you weren’t online at eod to know it was a vanity vote that wasn’t doing anything.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:26 pm Last time I played with wolf Enrique, he treaded water by arguing with iirc wolf Long Con about them sorta claiming the same role for the entire game.

Idk if he’s so basic as to spend like half his posts defending packmates.

Counterpoint: Enrique had to replace out so I’m he may have been planning something else

Further counterpoint: Actually, Enrique might do that for wifom. Idk

His night actions are still pretty sus too.

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:15 pm YO. Vulgard/Enrique is a WOLF.

Hi. Hello there, welcome to whiterun. Here’s all of Vulgard’s posts on d4 regarding Falcon and the lead up to it:
(Now I do entreat you to read it all in sequence, because it’s QUITE enlightening)

Spoiler: show

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 8:55 am Nachomamma's ISO I could best describe as inoffensive. There's nothing in it that definitively told me they have no TMI. But it is not a dumpster fire and I do not want to kill this yet.

Falcon's ISO is a step below that. He spent most of the game pushing LHF. The push on Marmot is especially notable because he's tunneled on it hard. If Marmot's mafia, then this looks better for him, but I currently don't think Marmot's a wolf.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 10:16 am I'm looking at falcon/Nacho/LC/Tim right now as my PoE with Gavial 3p.

Marmot is an outside possibility but I still think it's a town slot.

Still going to check Scotty to determine if clearing him's okay.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 11:35 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 11:17 am

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 10:09 am Made
MR
DaisyCloud
Jack
TSP

lost monkey
Marmot
Kyle

FMPOV the above are town.

Gavial is my primary 3p read. He's not a pack wolf. I trust he has no TMI based on his play thus far.

If Tim's a wolf, he's partnered with LC. He gave LC an early townshield. "But wolves don't want to look like partners!" Tim's MO as a wolf includes doing those things, I'm sure.

For the record, I reviewed Tim's ISO and I don't townread him. If there's a deepwolf/powerwolf/whatever other than Mac, might be Tim.

I hate that LC pulled this fake redcheck thing. Now I need to read Scotty again.

I'm not sure I've ever seen someone assemble a town core so quickly with so few interactions

Do you have a problem with it because you're not in it, wolf?

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 2:45 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 2:41 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 2:22 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 1:58 pm Who replaced Quin again?

Hi.

I was told Quin had flipped town :wowee:

Basically the same thing given how hard I townread Radishes.

I agree with his Falcon read, too.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 2:49 pm

Current wagons are all fine.

Emphasis on wagons. Not vanity votes.

I'm not sure whether Falcon voting no yeet is funny or wolfy. Could be both, could be neither.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 8:08 am Current wagon composition:

Falcon (4): Vulgard, Tim, TSP, Nachomamma
Tim (3): MR, Jack, Scotty

Tim's wagon looks far more pure to me. Falcon still isn't self-pressing, either. It matters less pre-EoD, but still.

I won't vote Tim yet, but I'm leaning that way given the wagon formation.

For out-of-game reasons, I'll be busy for a few hours. I hope I'm able to study EoDs before I have to cast a final vote for the day.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 11:06 am Read EoD1. I concede to Tim that he may be right about Nanook getting vigged in the night. Alison advocated for it and even the yeeted villager found Nanook wolfy. Which means that the kills should be swapped around (Nanook vigged, Alison SPKed). There's also the fact Alison claimed a super pro-town role early d1, so killing her would be +EV for wolves either way.

LC's EoD looks kinda wolfy. He parks a vote on Seanzie and it looks like he's shrugging when he places it.

Seanzie goes down flailing and giving us legacy reads. Nanook scum (wrong). Tim scum (we don't know). "Nook W, Enrique W." Nook is V, and I'm not W. "Tim W, Made V." Made's been greenchecked and Tim is in my PoE.

Tim/Mac EoD 1 interactions look mildly not W/W. I still think it's possible they are partners, though.

Tim disliked the Falcon wagon, and Alison defended Falcon hard for gamestate reasons. Yet now Tim's voting Falcon with me. Tim, what changed?

Vulgard wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 12:25 pm Takeaways from EoD readings:

- DaisyCloud looks unpartnered with several people. I could make a case on her being wolf on an independent level. However, her interactions tell a different story, and she had a villagery response to my case. Not willing to go there as of right now.
- Tim's EoDs, at least the ones he was present for, have not looked great. In hindsight, they look like he is killing townies. And while a villager could indeed be killing townies, he especially sticks out. Why? He's spearheading most pushes. Mac is one person doing that, but he's the other. And those pushes have lead to three misyeets in a row. Tim, you must understand that this is a good reason to tinfoil/suspect you.
- Kyle looks a bit better from his EoD 2.
- Ambivalent on Marmot. Tried pretty hard to save himself at EoD 3, but that's the only time I saw him engaged in the EoD yeet. Meh.
- Falcon and Nacho have never done anything during EoDs. Ever. This fact alone makes me want to vote outside of them today. If they are wolves (especially if both are), then the village has been eating itself alive this entire game. The gamestate doesn't seem to support that. Mac has been supporting pushes on villagers, so they had at least one powerwolf. Would they rely on Mac to do everything for them?

Vulgard wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 12:31 pm Checked Falcon's ISO again and I'm content with leaving my vote there. Even though the wagon composition is... well, it could be better... I'm not coming around to the idea of him being town. He spent most of day 1 pushing LHF, day 2 kicked off with him trying to sell DaisyCloud V, and he's been going UTR.

Vulgard wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 1:27 pm I was curious how Tim would react to me pushing Falcon over him, and I don't like it. He posted from the mindset of "well, I can still get Falcon before I die. If Falcon's my partner, I'm bussing here and maybe this'll give me townpoints. If Falcon's V, at least I get one more villager before I go down." The way he reacted to my thinking looks like he's scrambling to find wolfy things in my posts when there aren't any.

Swapping to Tim, we're killing him today. The mindset of "if Falcon flips town, we're just screwed" isn't villagery. It's the mindset of someone who wants to get another misyeet. Where's the analysis of other slots? If Tim's doubting that Falcon's a wolf (and him debating V!Falcon suggests that), why not look elsewhere? He suggests I'm a wolf, but he doesn't push me. In fact, he's voting with me on Falcon. He seems to believe I'm town and mafia at the same time, since I'm in Enrique's slot. He votes on the same wagon as me and wants to vote out the same player as me, but isn't voting me...

This mindset is inconsistent with what he says. Tim is mafia.

Ok so. Did you see it? Lemme break it down for you.
-he comes out swinging with fresh eyes
-gives everyone a patdown (including a ‘meh’ falcon wedged in there)
-ultimately comes away with a scum team of falcon/nacho/LC/tim. What are the odds...only one of those is bad?
-Tim is baaaad
-the falcon/Tim/LC 2-2-2 tie is a-ok
-(once the falcon wagon picked up steam) well, I’m fine leaving my vote there
-(the falcon wagon is screaming out of the station) that Tim tho. He BAD! Votes Tim

I don’t believe that Vulgard ever really thought falcon would be lynched that day. He was looking for something-{anything}-to slander Tim for, and could justify him switching off and still making it look like he was actually cool with falcon.

This ain’t a bad case though.

Last time I played with wolf Enrique, he treaded water by arguing with iirc wolf Long Con about them sorta claiming the same role for the entire game.

Idk if he’s so basic as to spend like half his posts defending packmates.

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 6:02 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 6:00 pm

KZA is voting Gavil.

Wait, did I miss an announcement where KZA was allowed to vote?

I thought the person letting that happened died.

KZA is voting Gavil.

I used to like it when I townread everyone. Now it just annoys me. What have I become?

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:49 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:48 pm Just say things like “git gud” or “I’m unchoppable.”

That’s what gud players do.

Gut gud

I mean the answer to Tim’s question is “because the case on Tim he made was stronger.”

Which doesn’t necessarily say anything about Radish’s alignment.

Just say things like “git gud” or “I’m unchoppable.”

That’s what gud players do.

That’s a big oversimplification of things but being super accurate in a recap of an unrelated game isn’t important.

I’m gonna throw out some tinfoil.

In me and Radishes’ semi in champs last year, Shepherd purposely was somewhat out there as a townie. Then, in the finals, Shep lasted longer than he otherwise would have by just being out there and having nonconsensus reads and process, which caused everyone in his semi to gut read him town since “that’s just how Shep is as a townie.” This allowed Shep to get away with not hunting and not pushing his teammates for awhile.

Gavil is essentially being given a free pass for being fucking out there in his own little world. Now, I don’t have faked meta to fool me into thinking he’s town. I don’t have any meta at all.

For the people who do, is this just town Gavil? How sure are you?

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:34 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:32 pm Like if Tim, Daisy, Marmot, Tony, Vulgard, Radishes, Scotty, Kyle, Gavil all not fuzzy?

It means there’s been an uncorrected host error.

I don’t know what this means

I have too many townreads. I’ve been pocketed. Also, there’s a good chance anyone who has done nothing to make me townread them is just a wolf atp.

Timsup2nothin wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:33 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:18 pm I mean kinda, yeah.

Vulgard’s iso is pretty freaking negative on Falcon.

Never votes there that I can tell. Ended up on Tim.

He did vote there. When I voted for Falcon I specifically said something like "fresh eyes and we've mostly sucked, so sure" and piled on as the second vote. I was extremely disgruntled when later the wagon got going and he said "oh I'm off to Tim then."

That's the thing...the two actual cases on Falcon I thought were both pretty good, and the people that made those cases both voted me instead with basically no reasons. Radishes never did vote Falcon. Vulgard was happy enough voting behind his but bailed when the wagon got real.

Frustrating lol

Scotty wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:30 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:28 pm Fucking probably.

I mostly like what Radishes was doing yesterday upon reread.

His main poe was Falcon/Tim/Nacho/Marmot but he mostly spends time on the first two and wasn’t around for eod.

Yep, that much is true. It’s just that phrasing at the end there where he said he likes the falcon/Tim wagons, BUT if he had a choice he would go with Tim first. That out is what I’m hung up on.

Not being around at EOD is pretty NAI, but it doesn’t help me not view this as a cop out

That’s the line Vulgard, Radishes and myself all had.

But I was around at EOD to switch to a wolf wagon so here I am all lock clear while everyone has to look at Vulgard and Radishes again.

Like if Tim, Daisy, Marmot, Tony, Vulgard, Radishes, Scotty, Kyle, Gavil all not fuzzy?

It means there’s been an uncorrected host error.

I hate it.

Suggests someone somewhere has pocketed me because there’s 0-1 wolves in Radishes/Vulgard.

Kyle and Scotty most undeserving townreads fmpov.

I hate this game. :angrydog: