Alison wrote:
falcon45ca wrote:
Ergo, don't say no
I think this post from falcon is kinda townie.
Alison wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
lucy
Boquise
Seanzie
decent squad for Day 0. everybody get in my squad. show me your vip squad passes
I have 0 people I'd consider clear enough to call them part of my squad - I have a light townread on Falcon and that's mostly it. You have three.
What are you seeing that I don't?
These reflected Alison's initial takes after about 13 minutes of involvement with the thread. I'll mark the gentle town credit for falcon, otherwise this is whatever.
Alison wrote:
Boquise wrote:
Regarding the "not say your wolf leans on D0" thing I asked Creature about. I mentioned that there are some reasons and given Creature has now replied, I will say mine.
Scum reads tend to make people defensive/emotional. Since D0 seems to be jokish, I reckon it could from one perspective ruin the "chill phase" and from another perspective, give scum hints on how to act accordingly.
I am not really pro hiding thoughts, but I think it is better to focus on town reads. I did have a dude on my ol' homesite who was great at sniffing out scum in our N1 phases tho (we had N1 starting before D1 and open night chat for everyone) by just looking at how players acted, if they were nervous etc.
Creature's response is lol and creature-esque. I'm not really satisfied, but it is D0 so!
Making people defensive and emotional is a good way of both finding and executing scum.
I believe this philosophy from Alison comes into play later, so it's good to take note of it here. The philosophy itself may not necessarily be "kosher" in everyone's eyes (e.g., inviting additional emotion into the game thread for the sake of making reads), but regardless I do think it's on-brand for Alison. She'll do what she can within the rules to progress her reads.
Alison wrote:
I've played with a lot of players who come from chat mafia - they are almost always chatty and comfortable in that chattiness, regardless of alignment. I think the fact that Lucy is refusing to make reads and is just talking about TV shows means that I'd expect her to be comfortable even if she was a wolf.
I townread her for a post she made afterwards where she asked Seanzie about his age. I think her worrying about adjusting her perspective on his tone based on his age was a sincere thought, and it's not something that many people, especially forum mafia newbies, would think to fake. It reflects a desire to get things right, which I guess is sorta close to what you said about her wanting to make a mark. I'm with you on Lucy right now.
What about Boquise and Seanzie? I'm not familiar with Boquise, but he hasn't done anything that jumps out as me as town, and Seanzie if anything is being slightly less proddy and pokey than he usually is.
Re: falcon, I think if he was mafia and said the line about there being one wolf between you and Seanzie, it would have been intentionally made to throw shade on you - but he backs off it relatively quickly and plays it off as a joke, which suggests he isn't really interested in pushing that narrative. Nothing out of the realm of fakeability, but it's enough for a townlean on page 2.
At my request, Alison expanded on her initial view of falcon. The language remains soft here, emphasizing that it's a very early perspective. By the standards of page 2 play I don't really have a problem with the rationale. It's just something to consider as the progression moves forward.
Separately, I appreciate Alison's take on lucy. As I mentioned earlier
in the game, I like that she took a conclusion I had come to (town read on lucy),
agreed with that conclusion, but still challenged the premises that led me to it. The note about lucy's interaction with Seanzie is one that offers better depth than "new player posting a ton probably town".
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Just so I am clear, with all this talk of Champs and stuff. I havent accidentally entered a champs game have I?
Pretty sure I havent, just need to make sure because its early and you're all doing my head in with this champs talk
Sometimes I wonder how much of your posting is a joke and how much isn't.
Alison wrote:
If I had to pick someone to vote right now it would be Rondo.
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Alison wrote:
If I had to pick someone to vote right now it would be Rondo.
You know, I KNEW going into this game you would focus me. This is going to be fun. HAHAHAH
I put down a phantom vote on you less than 10 pages into the game.
Does that feel like being focused to you?
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Alison wrote:
If I had to pick someone to vote right now it would be Rondo.
You know, I KNEW going into this game you would focus me. This is going to be fun. HAHAHAH
I put down a phantom vote on you less than 10 pages into the game.
Does that feel like being focused to you?
No but your opening is exactly how I expected it to be, I called it early and I like being right.
Where did you call it?
Alison wrote:
EnderWiggin wrote:
He said it to me when he saw the player list lol.
I didn't notice him calling it anywhere in the thread so I was wondering if he said it in the mafia chat and slipped that he did lol.
Here's an early snippet of the Day 0 combat between Rondo and Alison, primarily with the latter serving as the provocateur. It portends more active exchanges later, so let this serve as the tablesettings.
Alison wrote:
Creature wrote:
Is it a bad idea to read JJJ based on how eager he seems to be?
Yes. I have never known him to have a mafia game where he was not eager - if I remember correctly, the first time I ever played with him I (incorrectly) wolfread him because his eagerness seemed so over the top I was convinced it was faked.
This is, for whatever it's worth, true.
Alison wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
I always used to say that I have no preference between rolling town or mafia, but these days that's probably a lie I would tell myself to assuage my ego. I play Mafia mostly for the solving.
Thoughts on Rondo?
Alison wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Alison wrote:
What do you mean "micro and macro"?
Aforementioned "little moments" are micro. Macro, I acknowledge that the guy has made more posts than anyone in the game short maybe of lucy. I can't say he's uncomfortable.
He has 77 posts and I can't think of a single game-related opinion he has other than being slightly suspicious of Lucy for talking about TV too much and then saying he liked a post of Lucy's later on. I don't know if the quantity of his posting is a plus there.
Alison brought her suspicion of Rondo to me for further dialogue and development (and perhaps to gauge me by extension), which is preferable to naked shade. Small point.
Alison wrote:
Tossing out this (maybe slightly disrespectful) read:
In a playerlist like this, it would be psychologically easy for Creature as either alignment to do nothing or simply sheep people, especially in the context of an early D0 without any voting. That he's taking stabs at forming his own reads (#401, #404, #422) and trying to discourage a "do nothing and sheep" mentality (#351) reflects well on him, as I think he would be more willing to put in that effort as town.
Alison wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Seanzie wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
[VOTE:
Creature] aubergine
Why creature?
In my limited experience playing with or spectating Creature, he's been a bit on the spam side (I say so with love). He might have intended to spam
here (link) too, but it hasn't materialized. I've a general impression of discomfort.
What did you think about my townread of Creature?
Alison wrote:
FWIW I have seen many Creature town games where he does nothing, lowposts, and sheeps whoever is loud obvious town.
Alison's initial view of Creature was positive, with a reasonably developed (for this stage of the game) rationale. Again in this exchange she adds qualifications to my own read, so that's a decent trend to indicate thoughtfulness.
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
@RondoDimBuckle, Alison has placed a vote on your head. Please talk about that and thanks
It is a thing she has done
. I dont really care too much because I knew it was coming and it makes me happy
Why would someone attacking you make you happy?
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
@RondoDimBuckle, Alison has placed a vote on your head. Please talk about that and thanks
It is a thing she has done
. I dont really care too much because I knew it was coming and it makes me happy
Why would someone attacking you make you happy?
Because I am a giant troll and love when I can elicit an emotional reaction from people. Ala, you entering thread and insta voting me. Its predictability is food for the soul. It just makes me happy
You didn't exactly jump for joy though. I said I suspected you, you were like "ha ha ha, I knew it!" and then proceeded to steadfastly ignore me from then until now. I didn't get the impression you were trying to fish reactions out of me or that you felt particularly gleeful. I'd expect a troll who really wanted me to attack them to at least tease or bait me once or twice, but you've mostly ignored me, even in the face of constant provocation (ie. me talking about you a bunch).
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
Alison wrote:
RondoDimBuckle wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
@RondoDimBuckle, Alison has placed a vote on your head. Please talk about that and thanks
It is a thing she has done
. I dont really care too much because I knew it was coming and it makes me happy
Why would someone attacking you make you happy?
Because I am a giant troll and love when I can elicit an emotional reaction from people. Ala, you entering thread and insta voting me. Its predictability is food for the soul. It just makes me happy
You didn't exactly jump for joy though. I said I suspected you, you were like "ha ha ha, I knew it!" and then proceeded to steadfastly ignore me from then until now. I didn't get the impression you were trying to fish reactions out of me or that you felt particularly gleeful. I'd expect a troll who really wanted me to attack them to at least tease or bait me once or twice, but you've mostly ignored me, even in the face of constant provocation (ie. me talking about you a bunch).
1 Because I am at work so I dont have unlimited time.
I hate ATE so I am going to hide that
2 because we have played that game in the past and it just gets me chopped eventually so I am trying something new where I just ignore you.
3 because I dont have any support yet so I have no in thread power
4 its day 1 so meh
5 Other people are more interesting than you
6 I have lunch now so I am finishing my list
7 maybe I should
[VOTE:
Alison ] aubergine
"I am happy that you attacked me because I'm a troll who craves attention, but now that you've actually attacked me and given me what I want, I'm going to hide that emotion because I don't want to use AtE"? How does that make sense as a thought process? Why would expressing happiness be AtE at all?
Alison wrote:
I mean I think Rondo has just been full of shit this game.
This stretch of Alison's dealings with Rondo drew the ire of some in the moment. It is, if nothing else,
uncharitable. There's a distinct air of provocation here, and one that strikes me as deliberate (as it is quite blatant). Perhaps this is a moment then to recall Alison's previously stated philosophy: "making people defensive and emotional" is an effective way of hunting. I do think Rondo's emotional display elevated in this exchange, so in that sense, "mission accomplished". I don't take much from this in isolation, because it looks to me like the execution of a strategy -- one that can be executed regardless of alignment. The progression will mean more to me moving forward.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
Alison deciding to expend energy on day 1 on antagonising a player who is know to be capable of disruptive anti town play as town reeks to me.
Or I just think they're scum and am trying to get them killed.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
Plotting the exact same chaotic path through the game he always seems to when he's town including reacting exactly as I'd expect him to when I made a baseless townread on him to bait the reaction I was looking for to solidify the read?
I have seen no evidence of him plotting any path, either in this game or in previous games.
Can you quote the reaction you were fishing for that was townie? I'm still working through the backlog.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
lucy wrote:
besides rondo I like this lobby
Rondo is cool. He's just an acquired taste. And you have to have a very refined palette.
How confident is your townread on Rondo?
Mac protested the read, and Alison began to engage with him on the matter. Just marking for progression.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
switching my vote to falcon
i was thinking about doing it earlier
i think wilgy is sus but i think falcon is sussier
I haven't felt swayed on falcon in one direction or the other since I gave my initial read on him.
Wilgy is in my POE.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
switching my vote to falcon
i was thinking about doing it earlier
i think wilgy is sus but i think falcon is sussier
I haven't felt swayed on falcon in one direction or the other since I gave my initial read on him.
Wilgy is in my POE.
I'd just like to point out, again, that I have been right on Falcon dating back about 20 games straight, as multiple alignments, including correctly reading him as independent once.
I have a good track record of reading Falcon too.
What's your case on him? Just what Nate said?
She also interacts with Mac about falcon, a read of hers that has not moved much since the initial impressions (so a slight tick in the direction of town).
Alison wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
Nah ur reads are bogus lol.
And you are either of the ten fools or a wolf.
Your read indicates one while behavior hits at the other, I'll place you orange.
This aggression is townie for Wilgy though I think. I remember him playing more passively as mafia.
This is something I like from Alison. In the previous spoiler, there was a separate note about her having Wilgy in her POE. Here, one minute later, as she reviews the game, she notes a Wilgy post and gives a positive remark. Given that Wilgy is about as bait as bait gets when he is town, it's good that Alison was willing to turn from "POE" to something positive on a dime, particularly given that this read isn't a super developed one.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
words... that mean nothing
What really did it was his spree of just asking aimless questions of why people had the reads they had that I can already see he has no intent in following up on lol.
eg., town Falcon doesn't give a shit about why EnderWiggin would vote Fingersplints lol.
I don't really see the agenda in just throwing out naked reads.
I agree with you that the second post seems a little shallow in hindsight. My opinion of falcon has shifted down. Partially because of this and partially because I felt he treated my push on Rondo oddly. He doesn't react to it at first, then when Seanzie and Mac come along criticizing it for stirring up a chaotic player, he argues that it's something I would do as either alignment. Then later on says that he townread me less because of it.
Alison wrote:
MacDougall wrote:
Alison wrote:
Boquise wrote:
Maybe Mac plays differently here, but my expectation of town Mac is that he creates reads by tunnelling a player and looking at what ripples that causes in the thread. Basically going in with a machine gun and "100% sure someone is scum". So your first sentence doesn't really vibe with my experience tbh
I am pretty sure Mac is town here and I have a lot of experience with him. Even if he is scum he is probably townsiding/bussing so I am going to sheep his reads this day phase tbh.
and yet... you are not doing that... how odd lol
I'm not voting Rondo solely because of you.
I could be open to voting Falcon. I kinda want to explore Creature worlds for a bit because after I gave him cred for trying to solve he vanished, and JJJ has sus on him.
Alison wrote:
falcon45ca wrote:
Marmot wrote:
falcon45ca wrote:
Nate, Sean, Marmot
83% chance of at least 1 scum in that lil' group
What, you don't like my math?
I'm a Mathlete yo....tho I've been banned from international competition for taking PED's
Why those three?
Alison wrote:
falcon45ca wrote:
Alison wrote:
falcon, what's your Mac read exactly? You've been picking apart his posts, but you don't seem like you're gearing up for a push. I struggle to see what you're getting at.
67% town, I don't think scum Mac would push my ML so hard. I'd say his gut feel is real, it's just wrong.
What do you hope to gain by treating a town read like this?
Alison wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
I have questions about the authenticity of some of falcon's play. A few examples:
~ I already mentioned his initial reception of Seanzie and I. I don't see a thread of logic that connects our early town leans to a "difference check", and the dichotomy presumed by a difference check is not one I care for.
~ When prompted to talk about his own reads, it's memes and gifs. That's fine in moderation, but I don't think it's being done in moderation. This might relate to the observation Nate made first about the awkward mix of gaming and shitposting.
~ Some gotcha moments that just look fake. I didn't like falcon's motion against Creature, just grabbing four posts Creature made in succession, voting, and doing a gif. On this page his treatment of Mac gives a similar impression. "Why vote out of order in your POE list of four players" -- even if the order was truly misinterpreted, the implication that Mac has to honor some precise order of operations is kinda bunk.
This is a good post.
After talking with Mac, Alison's view of falcon trends downward. One cannot accuse Alison of lacking in progression -- the trajectory follows from her initial dialogue with Mac and eventually lands here with some original suspicion and some acknowledgement of mine.
Alison wrote:
The way I see this game is fairly simple.
Mac and JJJ are both playing to their obvious town power town selves. I think they are very likely just town but even if they are I suspect they are townsiding for now because they are bringing down a lot of unnecessary bad attention if they shove blatantly bad reads down our throat here. So either way their reads are probably going to be good D1.
I am likely going to prioritize hammering on the reads we have in our Venn diagram overlap as those are the most likely to be hits. If we don't get pelts after a bit it will be obvious something is rotten.
As mentioned earlier, I find Boquise, Wilgy and Lucy townie in addition to JJJ and Mac. I am hands off Rondo for now in deference to Mac's read. Nate feels like someone a little out of their depth but trying to do the best he can to be part of the solving which I think is a pretty okay place to be in.
Seanzie has been ~fine. He started off a little weaker than usual but his ISO of me was decent. I wouldn't put him in my town squad but I don't really have interest in a Seanzie exe today.
I interpreted Ender's cryptic approach to Seanzie earlier as a way to fish for reactions with him like he did with JJJ but he hasn't really followed through on that promise which leaves me wondering why he did it. I am also unnerved by how hands-off he is with Rondo, who he knows well and even gave advice on how to read. It's weird that me and Mac have a stronger read on Rondo than the guy who knows him the best.
Loosely, I have a POE pool of Falcon, Creature and Ender. The afks remain null, maybe bump Dizzy a bit higher since he is more shameless about lurking when he is town and feels obligated to try a bit harder as scum.
This larger reads post falls in the middle area of the previous spoiler chronologically. These reads were pretty similar to mine at the time, albeit she was lower on Seanzie and Rondo.
Alison wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
The gang town reading DrWilgy ought to expand on that. I think he's a pretty critical slot to sort. @Alison and @Marmot I believe have given that read, maybe others
Wilgy has not played this game the way I think he would as mafia. Boquise mentioned earlier that he was townreading Rondo in part because Rondo seemed to be attacking people and had no interest in making friends despite his (formerly) precarious thread position, suggesting that he cares more about the truth of people's alignments than in staying alive. I think a similar argument applies to Wilgy; his aggression against a widely-townread, power-town Mac was a bold move, and I think it was a result of an authentic thought process more than a scheme to wriggle out of trouble. As discussed earlier, it's quite plausible to me that his indignation about Mac scumreading him comes from a sense of townie entitlement. He has focused his solving around the people voting him, which I think is a natural thing to do in his position (the person being pushed usually has the best perspective on who is doing it for nefarious reasons).
One concern I have about Wilgy is that his solving feels a tad shallow. But this concern is outweighed by the townieness of his approach (outlined above), so I townread him overall.
Alison expanded on her town read of Wilgy. I think that people's treatment of Wilgy can be a very insightful course for investigation in this game, and this is a promising posture for Alison. Especially with Mac going after Wilgy and wielding Mac clout, a mafia Alison can and probably would throw her support behind that in pursuit of the juicy mischop.
Alison wrote:
I did not realize it was EOD already. Luckily I checked before heading off to breakfast.
It seems like Creature isn't going over today and I think falcon is more suspicious than Ender so I'm moving my vote accordingly.
[VOTE:
falcon] aubergine
I'm ok with a falcon exe - the way he treated Mac was weird and seemed to have no purpose other than randomly discrediting and shading him.
Eventual Day 1 vote for falcon. This put the falcon wagon at 7 votes when the next highest (Ender) was at 3 votes. In that way it doesn't really move the tally needle.
Alison wrote:
I still want to hear from Rondo about his Dizzy park but am otherwise inclined to trend him up because I think wolf teams with Rondo in them are >>rand likely to kill me before Mac.
Initial Day 2 take on Rondo. Not long before this I had called for folks to at least be mindful of the Mac kill and its implications, so this is consistent with that. It's also noted that Mac defended Rondo from Alison, so it's good from a process perspective that Alison took that into account instead of going straight back to an unchallenged tunnel. I'm reminded of my own treatment of Creature to start Day 3.
Alison wrote:
I think one thing that bothers me about Nate is that it doesn't feel like he has any reads he's passionate about. I don't know if this is just a playstyle thing but it's what drove me to quiz him about his reads in more detail. I'm uncomfortable by the fact that his stance seems to be repeating the most uncontroversial/popular reads and then chilling and not making a massive effort to push them. I could see this coming from a townie who feels we've got the game in the bag, and I've been in that position a couple of times myself, but those were when I had big confidence in my reads and the wolves were getting crushed. This gamestate started off with a misexe and then some pretty tense/controversial interactions between players, so it doesn't feel wholly appropriate for Nate to just be sitting back and going "yep, I guess we'll just auto the guys in the middle of falcon's wagon".
This might be the most insightful criticism I have seen of Nate in the game. As an aside,
Nate responded here. We'll see about Nate's alignment, but I think this is a very good application of gamestate to solving by Alison.
Alison wrote:
[VOTE:
Dizzy] aubergine
Alison wrote:
EnderWiggin wrote:
Alison wrote:
EnderWiggin wrote:
Alison wrote:
I'll be a little busy for the next 12 hours or so, my apologies. I have skimmed fingersplint's posts this page and been left with a generally good impression. Would like more elaboration on how Ender read Dizzy's entrance; which part of it was a towntell, etc.
If I elaborate it won't work anymore lol.
Keeping a read cryptic so you can use it in future games is dumb. You have already been extremely cagey this game; I would like you to please elaborate on the tell you used to read Dizzy.
Please wait 3-5 business days for a response.
I am sorely tempted to vote you.
Alison wrote:
I vored Dizzy because he went from just being lower activity to openly luxuriating in it and declaring himself comfortable/townie in his state of doing nothing in a way that feels like a refuge in audacity.
Ender's continued refusal to explain his reads hits the same notes for me. I am struggling to understand why they would approach the game like this if they are town.
Alison wrote:
My POE as of right now is Dizzy/Ender and then Nate. fingersplints read TBD. Creature has trended up this day phase and has an endorsement from Mac so I'm ok with him for now.
Through Day 2 you can see Alison's views of Dizzy and Ender declining alongside Nate, and it ends up at this POE. This was consensus or consensus-adjacent at the time, so it doesn't mean a lot to me. Perhaps crapping on Ender for failing to explain reads is a bit much, given that it's pretty evident that this point that he isn't the kind of player to engage in explanations. Alison ought to speak about her read on Ender as of right now; that'd be of significant interest to me.
Alison wrote:
fingersplints' ISO:
Nate has identified #1325 as a particularly sketchy post, because it shifts responsibility for the falcon exe onto Mac, and also hedges her own stance on falcon. I tend to agree with Nate here, and think it's a bad look for fingersplints.
I didn't like #1363 either. She says that she's contemplating where we should vote if we misexe on D1, but there's no followup, and I don't see her talking about the results of this contemplation later on, even where it is appropriate and natural to do so (eg. in #1458 where she is talking about how she wouldn't mind a falcon flip as it would give lots of interactives to figure out where to vote next). Alarmingly, she also does not bring up the results of this contemplation when we do end up missing D1. This suggests that she was just saying it to look like she was solving without actually putting in real analysis or thought into where we should go if our D1 flips green.
I didn't like #2012 either because it looks like her taking a cheap shot at Boquise's attempts to read into Mac's legacy. I'm generally pretty skeptical of discrediting a strong townie's legacy completely or brushing off nightkills as "who knows?" without at least trying to read into them.
She then proceeds to claim that she thought Boquise was treated as null by the rest of the thread, when in my view he was clearly being treated as consensus town. This might be a good sign for her, because it suggests that she is distinctly uninformed: I think she would likely know how the thread is treating Boquise more accurately if she was in scum chat and had partners to catch her up.
In #2128, she says she's interested in taking a closer look at Creature, but then doesn't mention Creature again. Votes for Dizzy instead in #2133 - which is a reasonable vote, but her interest in Creature seems to have mysteriously vanished.
-
Overall, I'd say that I came out of fingersplints' ISO with a markedly worse impression of her before. I broadly agree with Nate's claim that her vote on falcon was hedgy and accountability-dodging, and I'd add that at two separate points in the game she indicates she'll look into something and then never brings it up or mentions it again, even when it would be very natural to do so.
Based off this, I'd be happy to back a fingersplints wagon, and have her in my bottom POE.
Alison wrote:
[VOTE:
fingersplints] aubergine
Alison wrote:
The only point of hesitation for me is the fact that she looked weirdly uninformed about the Boquise thing. But I don't think it's clearing - maybe scum chat is dead, maybe she checks scum chat as infrequently as she checks the main thread (which would make sense if she's busy IRL), maybe she's just savvy enough to fake a derp clear. She did fool us all in Fargo.
It's not enough to make me pull back from voting her.
Alison reviewed fingersplints' ISO and dropped this case accompanied by a vote. This vote made the poll tally a 4-2-2 lead for fingersplints (over Dizzy and lucy). Indeed, Alison's vote had previously been on Dizzy, so this broke a 3-3 tie. This was still about 18 hours prior to the Day 2 deadline, so we can temper the meaning of poll dynamics -- but it's still to be noted and may be of greater significance pending fingersplints' and Dizzy's alignments. Alison's vote would remain her for the rest of Day 2.
Alison wrote:
Boquise wrote:
Alison wrote:
Boquise wrote:
Alison wrote:
I vored Dizzy because he went from just being lower activity to openly luxuriating in it and declaring himself comfortable/townie in his state of doing nothing in a way that feels like a refuge in audacity.
Ender's continued refusal to explain his reads hits the same notes for me. I am struggling to understand why they would approach the game like this if they are town.
Hmm
Have you not played with town playing suboptimally for their faction before tbh?
I have played with townies who play in anti-town ways. They are, unsurprisingly, much rarer than wolves who play in anti-town ways. I generally have no regret killing them anyway if they're going to be liabilities.
oh you are awake!
hmmmm
i hard disagree on them being much rarer than wolves. Otherwise town's win rate in champs would be upside down tbh
I mean it depends on the quality of the playerlist. Champs finales are going to have much less town trolling than the average anime forum casual game. This playerlist has a high quality, and Dizzy and Ender in specific are town players I respect, and who should know better than this.
Regardless of those considerations, if for whatever reason someone insists on being stubbornly anti-town and refuses to budge, I have no qualms in removing them from the game. They could easily be scum, and even if they're town, we don't lose much. I certainly wouldn't want them around in endgame.
(I see Dizzy has opened up a bit more since I originally made that post; I'm explaining my general philosophy towards people who openly do anti-town things.)
Purely Alisonian philosophy. Boq questioned the reasoning behind Alison's suspicions of Ender and Dizzy given their "suboptimality", and this was Alison's reply. I'm not really thrilled with the idea, as even "strong playerlists" (a distinction I don't care for in the first place) are susceptible to human trends. Her perspective is on-brand in any event.
Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:27 am
JJJ/Ender has blown up with surprising speed and ferocity and I am struggling to understand why in the absence of a clear catalyst. You've both made it clear that you have gripes with the other's posting and it's more than just Seanzie's death, but in actually explaining your reads, you both tend towards generalities like "they're not cohesively town solving" and "their posts continue to be fake". Neither of you seemed particularly interested in attacking the other yesterday and now within 2 pages we have a thunderdome.
Can the both of you briefly describe what your thoughts were on the other person yesterday and how they evolved to such harsh reads today?
Alison wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 9:40 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 9:35 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 9:31 pmI have JJJ in my immediate POE
You'd referenced the notion that we've failed to kill mafia and that "arrogantly" you don't think town is here if you/Mac/myself are all town. Is there more to POEing me than that?
There is the question of why Seanzie died over you. One explanation is that you are mafia. There are other explanations, like that Seanzie was onto someone, but it's a possibility I am considering, especially since one of the people Seanzie was "onto" has flipped town and I think another is also town.
The way you and Ender sprang at each other at SOD3, followed by relatively little interaction or pushing after that initial spat, was weird and I said so at the time. You've since clarified that you were scumreading Ender since the day before, but I still think the way you attacked him, calling his posts "fake" etc., smacks of a generic treatment that I don't associate with town you.
This material comes from this Day 3. I find it a little bizarre on two fronts:
1) This seems to imply that Alison was not reading the game thread on Day 2, or that she missed so much of it that she was unaware that I tried to eliminate EnderWiggin then, before today's combat. To be oblivious to certain things isn't necessarily a crime, but I would expect Alison to have a keener understanding of a game state than that.
2) I'm not sure I've ever treated a mafia teammate like I treated Ender here, so the "theater" assertion is difficult to take seriously.
Alison needs to sort this stuff out in the near future.
[-Mass Effect Mafia banner-]
It was a weak day 1 vote based off of general vibes and tone, so I can see why my vote should be looked at because I think it was a pretty lame and vague vote but just because it’s a bad vote it doesn’t come from a bad/scum place. As I expressed in the post you linked, I didn’t want it to be a tie and no result. While this obviously wasn’t the desired result, at least we have something to work with.
Fiddler on the Roof
