Death and Taxes: An Economics Mafia [DAY 7]

[Russtifinko]

As a side note, Paul Krugman's Imaginary Aliens lucked out by winning the randomization, there. Apparently they are very unpopular.

[G-Man]

[Dragon D. Luffy]

You're next.

[Golden]

That feels good!

[fingersplints]

Excellent

[G-Man]

You're next.

[Epignosis]

So the game hasn't ended yet?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'd just like to say that Day 5 was beautiful town mafia. We came in with a clear objective, thoroughly explored it from all sides, and came to a general decision as a team. And it paid off.

Brings a tear to me eye.

[Golden]

So the game hasn't ended yet?

Yeah, I had quite a bit of nervous excitement about this lynch because I thought there was a legitimate chance the game could be over. Clearly not. Sorry epi on the bright side, I won't ask JJ to look at meaningful interactions between you and bass.

I'd just like to say that Day 5 was beautiful town mafia. We came in with a clear objective, thoroughly explored it from all sides, and came to a general decision as a team. And it paid off.

Brings a tear to me eye.

I know. Now that I feel I've truly caught up with this game (and it's gotten slower) I've gone from feeling like it's quite intense and stressful to feeling like it's glorious. I'm feeling really confident that we've got this.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

So the game hasn't ended yet?

It's your fault for being town.

[Turnip Head]

Bitchin'.

[G-Man]

Spoiler: show

I'd just like to say that Day 5 was beautiful town mafia. We came in with a clear objective, thoroughly explored it from all sides, and came to a general decision as a team. And it paid off.

Brings a tear to me eye.

Spoiler: show

I'd just like to say that Day 5 was beautiful town mafia. We came in with a clear objective, thoroughly explored it from all sides, and came to a general decision as a team. And it paid off.

Brings a tear to me eye.

I have reservations about a Bass lynch too, and i think theories related to Bubbles are a bad case against him. But there are other reasons to suspect him, and once splints placed her vote it was essentially sealed anyway barring significant guns/butter intervention. which is why i voted for him. the worst scenario would be a mafia-altered final tally.

His flip will be very telling either way though.

Maybe i'll do a Bass/G-Man interaction analysis to ensure i'm comfortable labeling them team mates.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

G-Man has a point. Jay seemed really on the fence this phase. He wasn't favoring the bass lynch, he even wrote an analysis to say why he disagreeded with the cop theory, but once the bandwagon became obvious, he jumped on it.

He was also quite late in most lynches in the game, for that matter.

[G-Man]

G-Man has a point. Jay seemed really on the fence this phase. He wasn't favoring the bass lynch, he even wrote an analysis to say why he disagreeded with the cop theory, but once the bandwagon became obvious, he jumped on it.

He was also quite late in most lynches in the game, for that matter.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i'll answer you momentarily, G-Man. DDL made some comments that need to be addressed first.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

G-Man has a point. Jay seemed really on the fence this phase. He wasn't favoring the bass lynch,

i was on the fence. on Day 1, Bass was my top mafia read and i tried to rally the thread against him instead of Golden to no avail. as the game progressed i thought Bass looked better in light of a few different things in my analyses. so on Day 5 when he was being fielded as a lynch candidate over the guy who intentionally played into bogus "curse" theories, i had to think long and hard about it. so i asked questions. i did my own digging. i measured my thoughts against those being provided by Bass's bigger opponents (Turnip, Golden, and yourself). i wasn't going to change my mind without thinking it through. and in mafia games, when i think something through i do it public.

he even wrote an analysis to say why he disagreeded with the cop theory, but once the bandwagon became obvious, he jumped on it.

no i didn't. i wrote an analysis to explore the notion of Bubbles being an investigative role. and why did i do that?

Spoiler: show

If you guys can think up an interesting thing for me to research when i get home, i'll do it. I'm sure there's some potential evidence that could be examined more closely.

If I had one thing I'd be interested in your perspective on, it's 'Are TinyBubbles posts consistent with her having a detective role'.

because it was the only request given to me when i called for research requests. so i answered Golden's call, did the research, and provided my analysis. did you find the points i made in that analysis to be slanted, incorrect, or illogical?

He was also quite late in most lynches in the game, for that matter.

correct. in some cases that has been a product of the lynch deadlines falling at bad times for me. in other cases, i have been careful with my vote. it's an important thing to do in one-vote-per-phase games, particularly when the economics mechanic allows for so many shenanigans to disrupt the tally. i voted for Bass 5th (against a 2-vote total for G-Man) when i did because it had become important to get some separation in the numbers. guns and butter could have made an influence and i sought to prevent that.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Spoiler: show

i would have certainly still been considering it. throughout the phase i was trying to assess the wisdom of a Bass lynch, and the logic of the theories being proposed against him. i was coming around, but still viewed you with more suspicion. i felt my hand was forced when the votes started dropping quickly for Bass though. so i discarded my own trepidation in favor of avoiding guns and butter shenanigans (by increasing the numerical distance between the top vote recipient and second place) -- Bass was suspicious enough and promised to yield enough information either way to warrant his lynch. i wasn't upset with my vote.

Spoiler: show

i probably will do it for every player remaining. i don't know when, but yes there is a better reason now to bother with Bass interactive analyses.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

this is now the most posts i've ever had in a mafia game. good show hosts. good show Syndicate.

[Marmot]

I'd have more posts if I wasn't dead.

[G-Man]

I'd have more posts if I wasn't dead.

[Turnip Head]

I'd have more posts if I wasn't dead.

It must be such a horrible burden to bear.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i get the feeling many players will be content to walk right into Day 6 and drop a vote on G-Man. i don't really oppose that lynch, but i do think we should be voicing our backup plans. how will everyone respond in the event of a G-Man town flip? does anyone think we should lynch someone else?

i'll do my typical analyses and see how i feel.

[sanmateo]

lmao @ me not being right once in this game

[Turnip Head]

The remaining baddie according to TH:

Simply too scummy for it to be true: G-Man
Plan B: aether or sanmateo
Tinfoil hat: Golden 2.0

That's where I'm at right now.

[sanmateo]

i get the feeling many players will be content to walk right into Day 6 and drop a vote on G-Man. i don't really oppose that lynch, but i do think we should be voicing our backup plans. how will everyone respond in the event of a G-Man town flip? does anyone think we should lynch someone else?

i'll do my typical analyses and see how i feel.

i was thinking of dropping a vote on acrosstheaether

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Interactions -- Bass and aether

Ok sorry I didn't get to number 4 but it is the weekend and im still young so I go out a lot on the weekends. Anyways out of the new players I really dont know what to make of there play styles. This is the first time I have seen people do ISO. I feel like JJJ and Sloonei are on the level for the most part for now. The one thing I dont really care for is it seems like those two just keep bringing up the same people and flooding the thread with stuff about them. It makes it easy for people to miss what the people in question had to say in there defence.
I really don't get tinybubbles or acrosstheaether. DDL seems to be falling back a little and I would like to know why that is.

Bass's first mention of aether comes on Day 2. he provides a bunch of vague commentary about a number of people in this post, lumping aether with Bubbles presumably as a lurker. this probably doesn't say anything at all about aether's alignment. mafia can point out lurking players with minor prods like this without any discomfort to either party regardless of alignment.

Spoiler: show

nope. shrinking it.

Bass labeled aether as a town read and Bubbles as a mafia read. this might be mildly interesting when combined with the prior post since we know Bubbles was town now. perhaps Bass swapped their real alignments knowing it's be an easy lie to make about two players who to that point had been so quiet? something to chew on.

Is Aether new to mafia? The way she/he has been playing is reading like a new player thats mafia and doesnt know how to handle the heat.

Bass throws a little shade her way on Day 4. it could be worth noting that was the day of Roxy's lynch, when aether was the only other player to receive multiple votes (despite G-Man's admission of not being cursed coming later in the phase). this post came just after MP had just finished dogpeeing about the Roxy/G-Man mafia team theory, so it might have been an attempt to divert thread attention to anyone else at all -- which would reflect well on aether. or maybe Bass felt aether was unlikely to be lynched over Roxy and felt comfortable flinging some poo at his team mate.

Spoiler: show

IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER OTHER THAN ALPHABETICAL, HERE IS THE LONG AWAITED AETHER RAINBOW

Bass_the_Clever
G-Man
JaggedJimmyJay
MovingPictures07
sanmateo
Vompatti

birdwithteeth11 / Golden
Dragon D. Luffy
Roxy
TinyBubbles

fingersplints
Turnip Head

I have a personal preference for blue over green

the first thing aether says about Bass comes on Night 3, and it's to call Bass her top town read. considering Bass's vote in the BR lynch, it makes sense for aether to have read him as town. in fact, she kind of had to. on Day 5 i'd even tried to catch her in the act of not knowing why that is (she passed that easy test). aether's immediate follow-up post is fun though...

If Bass_the_Clever is mafia, s/he is a clever mafia.

heh. that she felt the need to even say this after recording him as her top town read is a ping. straight up.

Bass - the fact that he broke my tie with a known mafia makes me feel good. As I said, he'd be a clever mafia if he's mafia. Basically, in a scenario where DDL is bad and JJJ is good, then Bass would be 100% confirmed good to me.

aether reiterates the reason why she is mechanically forced to read Bass as town. the second bit confuses me though -- what do DDL and i have to do with this, aether?

Spoiler: show

1) Basically, in a scenario where DDL is bad and JJJ is good, then Bass would be 100% confirmed good to me.
2) I was also thinking that perhaps MP and splints were targeted by John Nash

1) can you elaborate?
2) i had assumed that was the mp vs g-man singing contest.

1) DDL is going in pretty heavy on Bass, and JJJ has been reading Bass well, and I could see JJJ's reasoning behind it (if JJJ is a bad guy, things would go less well for Bass, as JJJ could be read as protecting Bass). I'd say as a baddie, one would be more inclined to target and vote for townies at this point rather than bus.
2) if that's true then John Nash is probably someone from RYM lol

when i was reading Bass positively mid-game, aether was happy to place her trust in my perspective. which is a very easy thing for her to do. i don't like this one either. what she says here about DDL and i may be an elaboration of the prior confusing point though.

What I was saying that JJJ has been leaning town on Bass, and if Jay is town, I trust him.

why do you trust me if i'm town? you know i'm not infallible. and what makes you think i'm town to a necessary degree of confidence to just ride my read of Bass to whatever end?

I have a hard time envisioning Bass as mafia, but it isn't impossible. Between Bass and G-Man I'd have to say G-Man, but my view might change if even more solid points against Bass come up.

this is face-value mafioso. if she's mafia, she is literally articulating her desire to keep her team mate alive and take out the easier target instead -- but qualifying it necessarily with the final caveat in case she has no choice.

aether who are you thinking of voting for?

G-Man probably. I've mulled it over and still couldn't see why a mafia Bass would vote BR over me as I'm town. Much of the case on Bass relies on the notion of Bass and me being teammates.

Honestly if Bass flips mafia, I give up.

are you going to hold true to this statement?

~~~

aether looks like a member of the mafia team.

[Turnip Head]

Damn son. Good work.

[Marmot]

I'd have more posts if I wasn't dead.

I'm actually giving myself a run for my money in Flash Mafia.

Still a ways to go to beat Turnip Head's total in Death Note though.

[Golden]

The remaining baddie according to TH:

Simply too scummy for it to be true: G-Man
Plan B: aether or sanmateo
Tinfoil hat: Golden 2.0

That's where I'm at right now.

I seem to be everybody's favourite tinfoil hat baddie, and I can't help but wonder if it's down to what BWT has done before me? Which is one of those things, I suppose. But TH, if you can put your finger on specific things I might be able to respond to...

My own tinfoil hat baddie is DDL, and I don't think it requires that much tinfoil. But aether is front of my mind for tomorrow.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I really don't understand why so many people are throwing around DDL name. I could understand if people have played a game with him before and know his tells but this is his first game here and I have no read on him.
MM out of syndicate regulas who are you getting bad vibes from?
I also agree with splints MP is acting different to the new players and might be something to keep an eye on.

this was the Bass post that pinged me so hard on Day 1. and it frankly makes DDL look like a confirmed townie all on its own. that's probably an exaggeration. but the intended strategy is essentially spelled out plainly: DDL is under heavy pressure right now, and i know that pressure is misguided. i'm going to stand up for him and then feast on the townie points.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

The remaining baddie according to TH:

Simply too scummy for it to be true: G-Man
Plan B: aether or sanmateo
Tinfoil hat: Golden 2.0

That's where I'm at right now.

I seem to be everybody's favourite tinfoil hat baddie, and I can't help but wonder if it's down to what BWT has done before me? Which is one of those things, I suppose. But TH, if you can put your finger on specific things I might be able to respond to...

My own tinfoil hat baddie is DDL, and I don't think it requires that much tinfoil. But aether is front of my mind for tomorrow.

i'm much less inclined to tinfoil you now than i was before Bass flipped mafia. but when i did have some tinfoil happening in the back of my mind, it was mostly because of the way Roxy treated BWT.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

more points in favor of Turnip, Golden, and DDL:

they all proposed various angles from which Bass could be viewed with suspicion. and i put all of their theories to the test -- giving them multiple opportunities to stand down and lynch someone else. so if any of them bussed Bass, they did so quite unnecessarily. G-Man would have been so easy to lynch.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

splints was also fully on board with eliminating Bass, and indeed it was the timing and placement of her vote for him that i think was most pivotal in securing his eventual lynch. her vote literally caused my vote, and G-Man's final vote apparently provided enough cushion to avoid shenanigans.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

basically, here are the people who don't emerge from the Bass lynch with a sterling townie-appearing record:

Vompatti
G-Man
sanmateo

acrosstheaether

[Turnip Head]

The remaining baddie according to TH:

Simply too scummy for it to be true: G-Man
Plan B: aether or sanmateo
Tinfoil hat: Golden 2.0

That's where I'm at right now.

I seem to be everybody's favourite tinfoil hat baddie, and I can't help but wonder if it's down to what BWT has done before me? Which is one of those things, I suppose. But TH, if you can put your finger on specific things I might be able to respond to...

My own tinfoil hat baddie is DDL, and I don't think it requires that much tinfoil. But aether is front of my mind for tomorrow.

I'm not seriously considering it. For me it's the timing of BWT's replacement, it seems to coincide with the focus on BR and Roxy. Maybe the baddies thought they would need an active player to give them a chance in this game. Your contributions have been stellar, I like to think you're just a civvie that's on point.

DDL is cool in my book. I've liked his approach recently.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

essentially spelled out plainly[/i]

sorry Epi. i re-read this post and winced

[acrosstheaether]

What can I say, Bass sure was a _Clever scum and did a good job of implicating me.

[fingersplints]

The remaining baddie according to TH:

Simply too scummy for it to be true: G-Man
Plan B: aether or sanmateo
Tinfoil hat: Golden 2.0

That's where I'm at right now.

I seem to be everybody's favourite tinfoil hat baddie, and I can't help but wonder if it's down to what BWT has done before me? Which is one of those things, I suppose. But TH, if you can put your finger on specific things I might be able to respond to...

My own tinfoil hat baddie is DDL, and I don't think it requires that much tinfoil. But aether is front of my mind for tomorrow.

My suspicion list is #1 aether. #2 sanmateo # 3 gman #4 golden

I have a new appreciation for gman posts. I do not at all understand how he says this is easier then actually posting because I found it loads harder. As I was trying to say last day I thought aether was defending Bass way too much, but I also found sanmateo' posts quite defensive.
Yes Golden you are #4 from my bwt bad vibes. I know it sucks when you replace in having to be held accountable for someone else, but I really doubt it will even come to 4

[Dragon D. Luffy]

i was on the fence. on Day 1, Bass was my top mafia read and i tried to rally the thread against him instead of Golden to no avail. as the game progressed i thought Bass looked better in light of a few different things in my analyses. so on Day 5 when he was being fielded as a lynch candidate over the guy who intentionally played into bogus "curse" theories, i had to think long and hard about it. so i asked questions. i did my own digging. i measured my thoughts against those being provided by Bass's bigger opponents (Turnip, Golden, and yourself). i wasn't going to change my mind without thinking it through. and in mafia games, when i think something through i do it public.

Well you have a point here, you did vote earlier for Bass on D1.

he even wrote an analysis to say why he disagreeded with the cop theory, but once the bandwagon became obvious, he jumped on it.

no i didn't. i wrote an analysis to explore the notion of Bubbles being an investigative role. and why did i do that?

If you guys can think up an interesting thing for me to research when i get home, i'll do it. I'm sure there's some potential evidence that could be examined more closely.

If I had one thing I'd be interested in your perspective on, it's 'Are TinyBubbles posts consistent with her having a detective role'.

because it was the only request given to me when i called for research requests. so i answered Golden's call, did the research, and provided my analysis. did you find the points i made in that analysis to be slanted, incorrect, or illogical?

The fact you did it because someone else asked you isn't much relevant, if you were mafia that's what I call seizing an opportunity. You went there, made your analysis and came to the conclusion the reason people were giving to lynch Bass was not a good one. And it could have convinced all of us.

It wasn't illogical, I admit that. But it was subjective. Post analysis can be interpreted either way. Who says mafia didn't decide to play safe and get rid of Bubbles even if they were sure she wasn't a cop? What if Bubbles is actually a lot better at hiding her intentions than we think she is? Your analysis leaves ground for more interpretations than just the one you made.

And the point is, while it doesn't do anything to prove you're mafia, your behavior last phase could easily fit a mafia player. A very careful mafia player who likes to play safe, and look for little opportunities to manipulate others.

I'd call it just a tinfoil theory by now. There are a few players I'd lynch before you. But my gut keeps saying there's something to fear about you.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I'm feeling somewhat better about aether now. I guess I'm just mesmerized for her lack of fucks given, and I'm starting to think a mafioso would care more. Still leaning slighly mafia on her.

[G-Man]

[fingersplints]

tfw you wake up and the lynch is decided already.

calling the scum team as fingersplints and g-man rn. i dont feel like voting for bass after being told to do so and when i think he's town

These posts really bother me. Mainly because it echos a similar frustration bass was saying.

Look I been defending myself all game. I glad everyone decided to vote for me with out giving me a chance to defened myself. So now you guys will be lossing a civ.

The mafia team seemed to be annoyed by the fact that we didn't give him a chance to defend. While we did all vote early, I disagree that he didn't have a chance (a lot of this has been discussed for a while)

I was a little confused by sanmateo's posts at the time (before bass even flipped). "After being told to do so" - who told you you had to vote bass?

[fingersplints]

I'd also like to look back and see who all continued to speculate that Epi was bad after he was NK'd. (See if any of my suspicions did) While a civvie could also have a similar thought, I could see baddies trying to push this more. They would want us to think they had a dead member and were less powerful then they actually were.

[thellama73]

You know I am all about individualism, son.

[fingersplints]

Gmans day 1 vote looks bad - his vote put Golden at 6 votes when Bass was at 4. Either his teammates decided not to save him, or gman is.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Personally I'm all for lynching G-Man on day 6, then Vomps on day 7, and then if that fails I'll see who's left in lylo.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Let's lynch the most suspicious person every time. Everyone should just give a gun-to-head read on Vomps and move on.

I think aether is most suspicious by a decent margin. G-Man and sanmateo as backups.

[G-Man]

Let's lynch the most suspicious person every time. Everyone should just give a gun-to-head read on Vomps and move on.

I think aether is most suspicious by a decent margin. G-Man and sanmateo as backups.

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

[G-Man]

[Vompatti]

Personally I'm all for lynching G-Man on day 6, then Vomps on day 7, and then if that fails I'll see who's left in lylo.

Won't the game end when we lynch G-Man since there's only one (1) baddie left?