Recruitment Mafia IV: Dawn of the Clans (End Game)

[Golden]

Rico, I like your find in nutella's posts.

@JJ - although you did not make the point about me, the italicised last 13 words of your posts I find myself relating to a lot in this game because it expresses very simply why I find it difficult to understand that some people are so convinced I'm behind epi's death.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

DFaraday, I spared your life on Day 1. Don't make me regret it, show me some of that juicy #content.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Hey bea, did all of the positive feedback you received on Day 1 (including from me) inspire someone sinister to recruit you?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@JJ - although you did not make the point about me, the italicised last 13 words of your posts I find myself relating to a lot in this game because it expresses very simply why I find it difficult to understand that some people are so convinced I'm behind epi's death.

At this point I am not sure you stand to gain much by continually addressing this issue -- but you stand to lose everything if those pursuing the matter continue to dislike everything you post about it. I'll make a recommendation, that you can ignore if you see fit, that you put this on the backburner for at least a while and focus your efforts on anything else in this game.

[Tranq]

Let's discuss the following theory:

You could have posted to try to detach from seeming like the person who stopped day. You also might not have nkown that the hosts would announce when day was stopped. I'm not ready to vote for you for this, but it does raise an eyebrow.

So you're inclined to believe that the person who ended the day early was not aligned with Team Good Guys, or still among the neutral pile?

I think you could select a large number of posts from about the same area of the thread and find a "could have been..." description for them that suits your theory in a similar fashion. You're already reaching quite a bit -- not only to peg this role on me, but beyond that to assert it'd even warrant a vote if you were right.

I noticed something and brought it up, partly to see your reaction, partly because I thought it worthy of bringing up. Yours was the only vote within a time frame close to the vote end time that talked about people being sure to vote. It stood out to me. I pointed it out. It's what I do.

I do not the the person who ended day early is civ aligned, for sure. I think they may have been bad alligned--but they may be neutral. But their action does not feel neutral. So I feel it is worth discussing.

And I don't think I said I was going to vote for you, just that I suspected you and had/have an eye on you. Your reaction to that seems a bit over the top, tbh, and didn't make me feel better. But still just keeping an for the time being.

Supreme Judge is a Child of Serenity. Brutal Executioner kills a Child of Serenity tonight. This theory can be tested by asking Brutal Executioner to target JaggedJimmyJay.

Thoughts?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Tranq, do you find me suspicious or are you tagging along for an opportunity to maybe kill a vocal contributor?

[S~V~S]

I'm not gonna read that ever.

I skimmed it for my name

Scotty said: Golden v SVS: SportsCenter highlights of a semantics contest. SVS has nitpicked pieces of Golden's arguments over the course of the game as a telling sign of "non-civ" behavior. Golden has straight up defended her to the nose, and some would say beyond what would be deemed satisfactory.

You are confusing me with someone else. I did not semantically nitpick him. I am talking about his meta and his tone as well as my assessment of the kill itself. And "some" (you?) may think he has defended beyond what is necessary, but I do not say that since I think he is the one who killed Epignosis, as in Azuma or her teammate. Believe me, I have been where Golden is, and I have happily killed Epignosis night one in past games when he was on my back figuring I could WIFOM my way out of it becasue being on the receiving end of his schtick can be hurtful & maddening. When you are somewhat intellectually vain (as many of us who play this game are), Epis tone can be infuriating. He is condescending and pretty much calls people fools and their defenses against his "arguments" ridiculous. It may be fun to watch when it isn't *you* but not so much when it is. Golden is someone who does not suffer being called a fool well.

Plus I do not think the baddies would have accommodated him so easily. Baddies love nothing more than a huge one on one civ fight. It keeps everyones attention off of them and talking about the arguing parties. Why the hell would they kill Epignosis? To frame Golden? I considered that as well, but with Epi alive and focused on Golden, why waste their kill? The end result would be Golden dead and Epi marginalized. The only way it makes sense for me is if Golden was on the team that killed Epi.

Scotty subsequently said: SVS - some posts seem like she'll talk a big game over someone, and then she'll fade into the darkness.

This is how I play; I watch & I listen until something catches my eye, and then I settle in to dig the Holland Tunnel.

When Golden is not bad, he is like a Knight in shining armor. He is good and brave and true; he does what is right even if it is not necessarily what is in his best interests. This is why i have said "pod person" more than once. I don't know who this is right now wearing that Golden suit, tbh. I firmly believe that if Golden were a neutral, he would be playing for the civs. And I don't see that at all.

[S~V~S]

Also Position 3

[Tranq]

Tranq, do you find me suspicious or are you tagging along for an opportunity to maybe kill a vocal contributor?

Can't say i have a strong opinion on you one way or the other, although i've enjoyed reading your posts. I'm more interested in seeing discussion on the theory. I know there are several pros and cons.

If it didn't involve you, what would your thoughts on the matter be?

[Canucklehead]

Anyone know what position we're in for tonight?? I can't remember the results of last Night's vote. Maybe the Hostiles could include that info as part of their Lynch posts?? It will probably expedite the process of getting night powers in.....

[Canucklehead]

Using my awesome powers of deduction, I've concluded we're in position 5.
I'm a mutherfacking detective.

[Canucklehead]

Anyone know what position we're in for tonight?? I can't remember the results of last Night's vote. Maybe the Hostiles could include that info as part of their Lynch posts?? It will probably expedite the process of getting night powers in.....

Hosties, not Hostiles.

Also, that post sounds bitchy and demanding.......when it was meant to sound cheerful and helpful. If you could all manually insert several imaginary cutesy smileys while reading so that my tone is more clear, that'd be swell.

[Long Con]

First player to post a picture of a Hostile Hoagie will gain esteem.

[bea]

Hey bea, did all of the positive feedback you received on Day 1 (including from me) inspire someone sinister to recruit you?

Nope. And I've been busy so no contests for me.

[bea]

Also RIP bass.

Also also I am not amused to be up this early. *sigh*

[Turnip Head]

TurnipHead- [snip]
You just said you didn't know who to vote for, and actually also said that you couldn't decide between Bass or Golden.

I never said that. And even if I did, what's your point?

You're literally all over the place on your reads, and don't back them up. What's up with that, bro?

No I'm not. And even if I was, what's your point?

[Marmot]

Official Announcement

so no one gets confused...

Night will end at 10 pm EST. All PM's must be in by then. Please get them in as soon as you have made your decision as it is easier for your wonderful, amazing hosts.

I think you mean 1 (one) beautiful host and 1 (one) soulless mindwrecker.

[Marmot]

Turnip Head. How does it feel to be alive?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Tranq, do you find me suspicious or are you tagging along for an opportunity to maybe kill a vocal contributor?

Can't say i have a strong opinion on you one way or the other, although i've enjoyed reading your posts. I'm more interested in seeing discussion on the theory. I know there are several pros and cons.

If it didn't involve you, what would your thoughts on the matter be?

Interesting question. I'd have to shed all biases to answer truly which I of course cannot do. My best assumption is that I'd allow LoRab the space to pursue the theory and the player in question the opportunity to respond before involving myself. Then I'd suggest that the theory is probably too speculative given that it hinges on a single one-line post.

[bea]

I went with option 4 cuz it was sad cuz it had no votes. Also so I didn't forget. big evaluation day at work then hopefully prebirthday dinner with the hubby!

[Marmot]

I went with option 4 cuz it was sad cuz it had no votes. Also so I didn't forget. big evaluation day at work then hopefully prebirthday dinner with the hubby!

Happy birthday Diggs (whom I've never really met but heard all about.

[nutella]

So why the double standard between these two Sorcerers' deaths? And why suddenly find Magnetarch to have been dangerous, when previously it was deemed not so bad?

Honestly, I admit I was a little biased by my having wanted to lynch Bass, and wanted to push back a little against people like SVS who had immediately gone "awww he was an innocent unrecruited so sorry you got lynched bb" without considering his role and its potential effects on the game. When I went back to read the Magnetarch's role after the reveal, it was under a different light than when I skimmed through the Sorcerors for threats, and I re-interpreted it as actually rather dangerous, though of course not as scary as Azura or the Pyromancer. And as I said in the earlier post you quoted, some roles can be a huge threat if they're a baddie but immensely helpful if they're a civvie, so I was scanning for Sorcerors that would be particularly threatening as baddies. When I went back to read the Magnetarch however it seems worrying in its own right -- regardless of his recruitment status, the abilities can cause some destructive fuckery. Especially considering a lot of them have a random factor -- it doesn't look like the Magnetarch has much agency in positions 1, 2, and 5.

So, yeah, maybe I would have included the Magnetarch on my earlier list if I had thought a little more about it, but it's not on the same level as the Pyromancer, but rather scary in a different way.


linki: bea, position 4 is the one with poison and I think it's best to delay the infection as long as possible because it will be cumulative. sneaky counter-current vote there.
and MM I believe it is actually bea's birthday that is coming up in a few days (though idk when diggs' is)

[reywaS]

I can definitely see how you (or anyone) would view Golden as a threat at this point. He basically stopped short of calling the Epignosis kill "a demonstration".

I do see the irony in SVS seeing me as a threat and wants to vote me, essentially because I did what I could to get rid of the person I thought was a threat.

Um I am voting for you, but if you do not get lynched, I will not try to get the baddies to kill you.

Well I think I've made it very clear epi was a one off too, but it doesn't stop everyone pretending like I'm going to do it to them next.

This type of attitude is a big reason why I don't trust you, Golden. You admittedly make this big, bold move to Epignosis killed on Day 1, and then you act like everyone is being unfair to you by not trusting your intentions. Do you really see the scrutiny on you as unfair?

Scrutiny? No.

But, rey, I will repeat to you - you find me suspicious for things like saying 'I feel guilty about it'. What is the baddie motive in that statement?

I do not think all of my votes are the outcome of scrutiny. I actually think some of the votes (especially yours) come from a place of a lack of scrutiny.

I will say to you again, you are the one who claimed that motivations are where you should be looking. Why, then, do you continue to ignore me every time I ask you why my statements are indicative of a baddie mindset, and just fall back on telling me off for claiming honesty etc

I apologize for the lack of clarity. When I say "your motivation", I am not saying what is the baddie or civvie motivation for Golden to react that way? I'm saying "What is Golden's motivation for saying the things he does?" Is it coming from a position of honesty or is he being fundamentally dishonest in his ideas. Do you see the difference?

[Dom]

I won't be back before the poll closes, so here goes:

VOTES TURNIP HEAD

He's on my list of players who I don't have a read on and lynching him could be a test of whether or not to ignore future messages from the Speaker of Serenity.

wut???

Dom, thanks for clarifying -- I was indeed the second player to vote for Bass today, after MP, but I still don't get why that is suspicious. Can you elaborate on why my vote warranted an ? And no I wasn't upset about you eyeing me specifically, it's more that your general pattern of opportunistically badgering people about little things is bothersome and imo unproductive. Maybe you have some success rate of catching baddies with stuff like that, I don't know, but to me it really seems like fluffing up your posts with trivial "pings" rather than discussing more substantial thoughts./quote]
It seemed rather bandwagon-y? Although, in retrospect, for this game, that would not make a whole lot of sense, you are right.
I rather disagree with you. Your definition of opportunistic seems rather shallow and I would hardly qualify my posts as such. I thought I saw something in Scotty's posts. I was wrong (in regards to that specific example). I thought I saw something in yours. I don't think it was fruitful. However, I will say-- when other players make similar claims about people to see how they react, gauge reactions, and collect data-- you don't seem to mind that at all.

I agree with others who think Dom is being shady about his thoughts, and I tihnk people should be asking him to explain them more.

Who are "others"? Where did they say these things?
If you want me to explain my thoughts more, why not ask? You have not asked me to expound on anything thus far, I believe. All of a sudden, you're interested? Is that because I think you're playing a rather suspicious game? Are you talking about nutella's posts-- if so, I am not getting the same reading from her posts at all.

S~V~S, to elaborate, I suppose I just feel as though you're putting Golden up to an expectation that is unreasonable, considering he has been quite open about playing a neutral game, and that Epi was a serious threat to Golden's immediate livelihood. I think it's key to note how emotionally-charged Golden's play has been this game, due to being under constant defense for his well being, and from Epi for a while at that.

Sorry, my friend, but that is a load of BS. I can't find the link at the present time, but Golden opened the game by saying he would have a hard time lynching someone he doesn't feel could be bad.
That's entirely different from neutral.

SVS, if later in this game I'm civ and decide I think you are bad, then I am deciding you are incompatible with me, but I'm doing so in a civ/baddie context. What is the difference for epi?

There are two civ teams who don't need each other dead-- that's the difference.

Bye Bass. The Sorcerers don't have it easy, it seems.

I have pages to catch up with, but right off the bat I found something interesting in nutella's posts. I'll post it chronologically

RIP Epi and Typh. I am like many others surprised and saddened to see Typh go so early and hope he gets a rez since he is quite a fun/intense player to have around. I somewhat agree with MP's assessment -- I would certainly not kill Typhoony so early, I would be hoping for the chance to end up on a team with him, but I wouldn't necessarily discount that someone else familiar with his gameplay could want to eliminate him early on.

Also, it's revealed that he was killed by the Brutal Executioner, and looking at that role we now know that Typh was a Sorceror. For what that's worth.

My answer to Rico: Azura and the Pyromancer are both pretty scary, but the other 5 Sorcerors don't look so bad to me, and again the scariness of a role really depends on what team they end up on. I guess even if Azura kills again on Night 3 we can't rule that out because the kill would have passed to the recruit. And even if he wasn't Azura I honestly wouldn't be surprised if he was one of the first recruits to a baddie team. So yeah, you have a point that there would certainly be risk in rezzing Typh.

Well I'm not particularly disappointed to lose the Magnetarch, was a dangerous role anyway. And I'm rather indifferent that he was unrecruited. Honestly I'd call this a relatively successful day 2 given the circumstances. It will be hard to find the actual baddies.

Think I'll go for Position 3.

So why the double standard between these two Sorcerers' deaths? And why suddenly find Magnetarch to have been dangerous, when previously it was deemed not so bad?

This is an interesting contradiction. I look forward to LA's response.

LINKI: I am quite satisfied by her response.

[DharmaHelper]

RIP Bass

I'm not gonna read that ever.

Maybe we should spare you the trouble of reading things by hanging you.

Or..you know, not.

[reywaS]

Well I'm not particularly disappointed to lose the Magnetarch, was a dangerous role anyway. And I'm rather indifferent that he was unrecruited. Honestly I'd call this a relatively successful day 2 given the circumstances. It will be hard to find the actual baddies.

Think I'll go for Position 3.

I disagree with this 100%. Unrecruited is unrecruited IMO. I think a lot of roles are dangerous to the civvie cause IF they are recruited to the baddie teams, but they are equally non dangerous to the civvie cause if they get recruited to the civvie team. This sounds like a cop out for being wrong about someone.

[reywaS]

if there was some aspect of his role that made him more likely to be recruited to the baddie cause, I would agree with you 100%.

[DharmaHelper]

Bye Bass. The Sorcerers don't have it easy, it seems.

I have pages to catch up with, but right off the bat I found something interesting in nutella's posts. I'll post it chronologically

RIP Epi and Typh. I am like many others surprised and saddened to see Typh go so early and hope he gets a rez since he is quite a fun/intense player to have around. I somewhat agree with MP's assessment -- I would certainly not kill Typhoony so early, I would be hoping for the chance to end up on a team with him, but I wouldn't necessarily discount that someone else familiar with his gameplay could want to eliminate him early on.

Also, it's revealed that he was killed by the Brutal Executioner, and looking at that role we now know that Typh was a Sorceror. For what that's worth.

My answer to Rico: Azura and the Pyromancer are both pretty scary, but the other 5 Sorcerors don't look so bad to me, and again the scariness of a role really depends on what team they end up on. I guess even if Azura kills again on Night 3 we can't rule that out because the kill would have passed to the recruit. And even if he wasn't Azura I honestly wouldn't be surprised if he was one of the first recruits to a baddie team. So yeah, you have a point that there would certainly be risk in rezzing Typh.

Well I'm not particularly disappointed to lose the Magnetarch, was a dangerous role anyway. And I'm rather indifferent that he was unrecruited. Honestly I'd call this a relatively successful day 2 given the circumstances. It will be hard to find the actual baddies.

Think I'll go for Position 3.

So why the double standard between these two Sorcerers' deaths? And why suddenly find Magnetarch to have been dangerous, when previously it was deemed not so bad?

This, and what Rey said, make a lot of sense.

[Bullzeye]

Voting option three because I feel like it's the least dangerous of the choices we've got left.

[G-Man]

Does anyone have a screenshot of the votes for Day 2? I was busy and didn't have time to fill them in as they happened and I missed any votes cast in the last hour of the poll.

[Bullzeye]

Does anyone have a screenshot of the votes for Day 2? I was busy and didn't have time to fill them in as they happened and I missed any votes cast in the last hour of the poll.

I second this request. Are we not doing poll threads any more?

[G-Man]

I'm voting for option 3 because it is the least scary option. I'll catch up over lunch.

[unfurl]

First, I think you people have too much free time to be posting a lot :P I really have no idea how you guys can talk so much, so Im just skimmed around cause today I have lesser time to be reading

---

birdwithteeth11
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 73#p170173
read my post, I did not say RIP I said Bye, good thing you said you read my posts, makes point you did not
Too bad you dont think I have contributed much to the game, thats your opinion, great way to encourage players to keep playing in this site!!!
I was not around when you finally answered your questions to me
Perhaps my reasons for votting for you were not the strongest or the clearest but that was it at the moment, maybe I need to learn to make better cases
can someone teach me?

---

Votting for choice 2 again

[G-Man]

First player to post a picture of a Hostile Hoagie will gain esteem.

[unfurl]

Also Bye Bass
I think this is become an elitist game tbqh, where the people who arenot hard core player will going to be lynched, my prediction, less see in an a fortune teller

[Ricochet]

Just beer with me one more day.

How 'bout

[Black Rock]

Official Announcement

so no one gets confused...

Night will end at 10 pm EST. All PM's must be in by then. Please get them in as soon as you have made your decision as it is easier for your wonderful, amazing hosts.

I think you mean 1 (one) beautiful host and 1 (one) soulless mindwrecker.

I am not soulless OR a mindwrecker thank you very much.

[Turnip Head]

Turnip Head. How does it feel to be alive?

Just peachy thanks for asking

[Black Rock]

Does anyone have a screenshot of the votes for Day 2? I was busy and didn't have time to fill them in as they happened and I missed any votes cast in the last hour of the poll.

I second this request. Are we not doing poll threads any more?

I'm slow at posting them because I was tired.

Also I seem to have misplaced the lynch.... so if anyone could just PM me what they have that would be great. I swear I'll get my shit together. I have links on the front page for what has been posted, I'll get the rest caught up.

[Turnip Head]

Also Bye Bass
I think this is become an elitist game tbqh, where the people who arenot hard core player will going to be lynched, my prediction, less see in an a fortune teller

Who are these elitist hardcore players you speak of, and do you think they should be lynched?

[Tangrowth]

I'm not saying RIP to Bass, and, at the expense of making enemies further, I'll echo nutella's thoughts a bit and say that I'm not that sad about Bass's death either. It would have been ideal to nab a mafia-aligned recruiter or recruited, naturally, but an unrecruited Bass is still at least a somewhat favorable result. That said, I'll dearly miss him on a personal level, as always.

Maybe you all are generally more OK with it because you weren't on the receiving end of his completely baseless attack against me, which, combined with other similar attacks yesterday, actually had me feeling as though I was a solid lynch contender for Day 2. My feelings were confirmed when I was tied for the lead in votes for quite a while, though later it died down. Bass's behavior was unpredictable, he wasn't willing at all to actually engage others in conversation and see things from my point of view. He could have easily been playing a mafia or chaos-aligned neutral game, regardless of whether people think his role seems dangerous on its own, which was sort of the feel I was getting from his posts up until the end there.

I agree that it's bet at this stage for Golden to drop the Epi issue completely, but it doesn't help that others (rey and S~V~S and Boomslang, etc.) have been just as insistent on bringing it up over and over as well as Golden has.

Make fun of me as his cheerleader all you want (actually, please do, since it's hilarious), but I have been only defending Golden with the fervor that I've had because I feel accusations against him have been driven by mere fear mongering ("he did that to Epi? What if he does it to me?!?!?!!?"), which is a silly sentiment in my opinion given that the vast majority of players in this game still don't know what side they're going to end up on.

[Ricochet]

Does anyone have a screenshot of the votes for Day 2? I was busy and didn't have time to fill them in as they happened and I missed any votes cast in the last hour of the poll.

I second this request. Are we not doing poll threads any more?

I'm slow at posting them because I was tired.

Also I seem to have misplaced the lynch.... so if anyone could just PM me what they have that would be great. I swear I'll get my shit together. I have links on the front page for what has been posted, I'll get the rest caught up.

I'm currently catching up with counting the tally (had a busy afternoon again; it'll probably stay that way for a lot of upcoming afternoons), I can send you my list afterwards.

[Bullzeye]

Does anyone have a screenshot of the votes for Day 2? I was busy and didn't have time to fill them in as they happened and I missed any votes cast in the last hour of the poll.

I second this request. Are we not doing poll threads any more?

I'm slow at posting them because I was tired.

Also I seem to have misplaced the lynch.... so if anyone could just PM me what they have that would be great. I swear I'll get my shit together. I have links on the front page for what has been posted, I'll get the rest caught up.

Oh that's fair enough. Wasn't a dig or anything, I was curious because I can't remember the last time I saw one in general.

Also Bye Bass
I think this is become an elitist game tbqh, where the people who arenot hard core player will going to be lynched, my prediction, less see in an a fortune teller

Elitist? In what way?

Linki MP - I mostly agree with you about Bass, I think he earned his own lynch through the way he behaved. He felt very blendy and shifty to me and that's not generally a feeling I associate with the good guys.

[Dom]

I'm not saying RIP to Bass, and, at the expense of making enemies further, I'll echo nutella's thoughts a bit and say that I'm not that sad about Bass's death either. It would have been ideal to nab a mafia-aligned recruiter or recruited, naturally, but an unrecruited Bass is still at least a somewhat favorable result. That said, I'll dearly miss him on a personal level, as always.

Maybe you all are generally more OK with it because you weren't on the receiving end of his completely baseless attack against me, which, combined with other similar attacks yesterday, actually had me feeling as though I was a solid lynch contender for Day 2. My feelings were confirmed when I was tied for the lead in votes for quite a while, though later it died down. Bass's behavior was unpredictable, he wasn't willing at all to actually engage others in conversation and see things from my point of view. He could have easily been playing a mafia or chaos-aligned neutral game, regardless of whether people think his role seems dangerous on its own, which was sort of the feel I was getting from his posts up until the end there.

I agree that it's bet at this stage for Golden to drop the Epi issue completely, but it doesn't help that others (rey and S~V~S and Boomslang, etc.) have been just as insistent on bringing it up over and over as well as Golden has.

Make fun of me as his cheerleader all you want (actually, please do, since it's hilarious), but I have been only defending Golden with the fervor that I've had because I feel accusations against him have been driven by mere fear mongering ("he did that to Epi? What if he does it to me?!?!?!!?"), which is a silly sentiment in my opinion given that the vast majority of players in this game still don't know what side they're going to end up on.

Bass was playing a bad/chaos-aligned neutral game... interesting...
What is Golden playing?

[Tangrowth]

Also Bye Bass
I think this is become an elitist game tbqh, where the people who arenot hard core player will going to be lynched, my prediction, less see in an a fortune teller

I disagree 100%, have you been reading the same thread as me? Golden and I have been in hot seats for almost the entire game, and Golden barely made it out of the last lynch alive.

Meanwhile, we have TinyBubbles, timmer, and DisgruntledPorcupine, who are recently receiving a bit of heat, but have not come under near as much fire as those who have put their words on the line and posted much more.

I think your post here trying to further the divide, making this a hardcore v. non-hardcore fest, is troubling greatly. I think players with post counts of all sizes should be eyeballed with equal fervor, not lopsided, and it's entirely why I've been defending Golden because his posts have read completely reasonable as a neutral-aligned Golden. The only accusations against him legitimately fall into two categories: (1) fear mongering and (2) belief that neutral Golden would play like a civilian.

[Dom]

Also Bye Bass
I think this is become an elitist game tbqh, where the people who arenot hard core player will going to be lynched, my prediction, less see in an a fortune teller

I disagree 100%, have you been reading the same thread as me? Golden and I have been in hot seats for almost the entire game, and Golden barely made it out of the last lynch alive.

Meanwhile, we have TinyBubbles, timmer, and DisgruntledPorcupine, who are recently receiving a bit of heat, but have not come under near as much fire as those who have put their words on the line and posted much more.

I think your post here trying to further the divide, making this a hardcore v. non-hardcore fest, is troubling greatly. I think players with post counts of all sizes should be eyeballed with equal fervor, not lopsided, and it's entirely why I've been defending Golden because his posts have read completely reasonable as a neutral-aligned Golden. The only accusations against him legitimately fall into two categories: (1) fear mongering and (2) belief that neutral Golden would play like a civilian.

HE SAID HE WOULD

[Ricochet]

]
Bass was playing a bad/chaos-aligned neutral game... interesting...
What is Golden playing?

Why do you treat Bass' play as bad/chaos-aligned? Are therefore all Sorcerers bad for you or are they redeemable by recruitement?

[Turnip Head]

]
Bass was playing a bad/chaos-aligned neutral game... interesting...
What is Golden playing?

Why do you treat Bass' play as bad/chaos-aligned? Are therefore all Sorcerers bad for you or are they redeemable by recruitement?

He's paraphrasing MP.

[Tangrowth]

I'm not saying RIP to Bass, and, at the expense of making enemies further, I'll echo nutella's thoughts a bit and say that I'm not that sad about Bass's death either. It would have been ideal to nab a mafia-aligned recruiter or recruited, naturally, but an unrecruited Bass is still at least a somewhat favorable result. That said, I'll dearly miss him on a personal level, as always.

Maybe you all are generally more OK with it because you weren't on the receiving end of his completely baseless attack against me, which, combined with other similar attacks yesterday, actually had me feeling as though I was a solid lynch contender for Day 2. My feelings were confirmed when I was tied for the lead in votes for quite a while, though later it died down. Bass's behavior was unpredictable, he wasn't willing at all to actually engage others in conversation and see things from my point of view. He could have easily been playing a mafia or chaos-aligned neutral game, regardless of whether people think his role seems dangerous on its own, which was sort of the feel I was getting from his posts up until the end there.

I agree that it's bet at this stage for Golden to drop the Epi issue completely, but it doesn't help that others (rey and S~V~S and Boomslang, etc.) have been just as insistent on bringing it up over and over as well as Golden has.

Make fun of me as his cheerleader all you want (actually, please do, since it's hilarious), but I have been only defending Golden with the fervor that I've had because I feel accusations against him have been driven by mere fear mongering ("he did that to Epi? What if he does it to me?!?!?!!?"), which is a silly sentiment in my opinion given that the vast majority of players in this game still don't know what side they're going to end up on.

Bass was playing a bad/chaos-aligned neutral game... interesting...
What is Golden playing?

I'm not alleging that I can read into Bass's brain and see what he was thinking as he played the game, so I really don't know if he was playing a bad or chaos-aligned game. That was the impression I received from his behavior, and the fact that he really didn't seem to care who received attention as long as it wasn't him.

As to what Golden has playing, I'd say he's been playing a 100% survival-aligned neutral game. He's been under such heat for most of his tenure in this game that honestly I think he's been doing whatever he can to ensure that he doesn't die immediately. I don't think that's necessarily unreasonable at this stage, mainly because I've been reading all of his thoughts as genuine, because he's been able to articulate himself in a manner that I personally find believable. Therefore, I also believe that Golden is not actively seeking recruitment, and that he'd prefer to be a civilian. Of course, if this game will proceed how the prior games did, I could very well be advocating for his lynch, since it's entirely possible Golden and I will end up with opposing interests. I do not currently think we have opposing interests. I honestly wouldn't care about Golden as much as any other neutral if I felt players weren't exposing him to a ridiculously unbalanced amount of heat when compared to other players who should be examined as well.

[reywaS]

"Out of reywaS' 124 posts, I'd reckon 60% of them are about Golden (I'm guesstimating). I would expect it very easy and safe to tunnel into one person for a time"

A response to this particular snippet from Scotty's earlier post. You are right. I have been focusing on Golden a lot. I tend to get tunnel vision in mafia games when someone's posts get stuck in my head. In the past it can be a flaw of my game play style. But, I'm not always wrong when I get fixated on someone. A particular RM game comes to mind...Reality TV Mafia. I remember having a particularly over the top case of tunnel vision in that game, but I did sniff out DharmaHelper and Golden as 2 of the 4 mafiosos in the game...but for every time that I am correct in that case, there are a few instances where I was just flat out wrong. I realize this. This is why I tempered my suspicion of Golden in between Days 1 and 2, but he reignited my suspicion with the things he said in the 2nd half of Day 2. Right or wrong that is the only way I know how to play when I am not on a baddie team. I tend to have a lot more trouble when I am because in my head everything I think to write just sounds forced. A handful of people in this game know this about me. Golden is one of those people, which is why the 2 "no u's" he's flung at me in this game don't ring true to me. In Zany Dex's Superman game on RM, this dynamic was on display where I was Clark Kent and Golden was independent and eventually merged with the mafia team (and won). I got tunnel vision in that game too. I think I was wrong in that case, but regardless I got a lot of flack in that game for it.