Lost Again Mafia (Season 3) - Day 5

[Epignosis]

linki: Epi- you didn't discuss any other possibilities, nor did you frame as "Golden has used a godfather role before where all the other teammates must die first." You went right into this:

I went and looked back. Both previous installments have a "Mafia Godfather." I couldn't tell what the first one meant, but the second one couldn't be tracked or checked- it wasn't a traditional "Godfather."

So no, that doesn't look good for DF, but he may in fact be a traditional manner of "Godfather." If that's true, then it means you're wasting lynches on him while his cronies keep on keeping on.

You proclaim your idea to be the definition of a "traditional" godfather even though it seems that's not the case for the rest of us. Your post lacks the context of Golden's use of such a role in BSG.

And?

There is a piece of data here that wasn't present in Seasons 1 or 2: DF got the most votes and didn't die.

[G-Man]

Five Reasons Epignosis Might Be Mafia:
1) He hasn't been as engaged in this game as he was in other recent games.

2) He hasn't voted for anyone who got lynched yet.

3) He jumped the gun on trying to warn us away from voting for DFaraday with his whole "traditional" godfather line.

4) He tried to spook us into thinking lynching an impervious DFaraday today would end the game.

5) He was lazy early and is becoming belligerent when challenged.


Five Reasons Epignosis Might Be Civvie:
1) He had his ass handed to him in the last Heist game he played and seems to not think these sorts of games are worth as much effort as larger games.

2) He didn't jump all over DFaraday for playing differently.

3) He came up with his own wrong reasons for going after nutella, rather than just glomming onto mine.

4) His Day 2 and Day 3 votes were well-reasoned.

5) I always want to assume Epi is a baddie and I am wrong more often than not.

[G-Man]

Five Reasons S~V~S Might Be Mafia:
1) She contributed little but roleplay for most of Day 1 and defaulted to her meta of not approving of casting too many votes on one person for silly reasons.

2) She started the Llama train on Day 1, which sucked in a few other players familiar with her meta for not liking silly votes and they followed her lead.

3) Day 2 she came after me pretty hard, as if she was trying to build a case against me before she noticed I wasn't on the poll despite the OP, the game rules, and my absence from the Day 1 poll as well.

4) She glommed on hard to the "notsawyer overreacted to DFaraday and must be bad" theory. Her Day 2 vote is conspicuously late on the notsawyer train, coming before the nutella onslaught.

5) Her Day 3 vote is questionable considering it represents a sharp turn-around from her vote against notsawer's suspicion of DFaraday Day 2. Perhaps she was trying to line up at least one vote on a teammate to keep up appearances.



Five Reasons S~V~S Might Be Civvie:
1) Her coming after me on Day 2 as if she wanted to build a case against me doesn't make sense if she had BTSC with others. I think everyone else understood I was unlynchable so one of her teammates should have stepped in and told her to end that quest (unless her teammates were awol at the time).

2) She defended nutella pretty hard, which would have been a tad conspicuous when going back over her ISO after nutella's death.

3) I would expect S~V~S to come at me and my weirdness. It's part of our rapport with each other.

4) I always suspect her of being bad and the odds aren't typically with me on that.

5) n/a

[G-Man]

Five Reasons Sorsha Might Be Mafia:
1) She hid behind roleplay for just about all of Day 1. She did that when she was a baddie in Season 2.

2) She flaked out on the game for almost all of Day 2, save for one post. Baddies don't like to ask for replacements. It's tempting to try to coast to victory, which is easier to do in some of these Heist games, sadly.

3) She missed two votes in a row, which makes her impossible to evaluate, given how little she's posted.

4) On Day 3, she said she's try to catch up. On Night 3, she said she was still behind and needed to catch up. Was she really trying to catch up or just buying herself more time

5) I get Lazy Rotten Deborah vibes something fierce for her.



Five Reasons Sorsha Might Be Civvie:
1) Most of her absence can probably be explained by her focus on Survivor Mafia. (this is why I try not to play more than one game at a time)

2-5) Yeah, I got nothing.

[G-Man]

Five Reasons Speedchuck Might Be Mafia:
1) He spent most of Day 1 posting but adding nothing of substance.

2) He mentions he'd almost rather force a tie than lynch either notsawyer or nutella on Day 2. Perhaps he knew and this was him playing 'uncertain civvie' as little too loosely?

3) The top half of his colorless rainbow was pretty spot-on.

4) He's tightened up his game the longer the game has progressed.

5) There's a lot of posts expressing his thoughts on the thoughts and theories of others but I feel like there's not enough expressing his own thoughts.


Five Reasons Speedchuck Might Be Civvie:
1) He's newer here and still trying to get used to all of our varying personalities.

2) I feel inclined to give a new guy the benefit of the doubt. Sometimes to a fault though.

3) He had a good, pointed question to S~V~S regarding her "second silly vote looks worse than the third" bit.

4) He's tightened up his game the longer the game has progressed.

5) n/a

[speedchuck]

Speedchuck
Quin
Epignosis
Dom
Sorsha
S~V~S
DFaraday

Quin argument makes sense to me. Here's a read list, from most town to least.

Also, this is Mylo, not lylo.

I am your most civilian after you and Quin. Why?

Gut. It's served me well so far.

If DF is a traditional Mafia godfather, and he gets the most votes, the game is over, and the civilians don't win.

What's your definition of a traditional mafia godfather?

Perhaps "traditional" is a poor word choice. I simply mean if DF cannot be lynched until his goons are taken out first, trying to lynch him today gets the mafia the win.

It's MYLO, I think. A mislynch gives mafia the win. A no lynch does not.

[speedchuck]

DOes this game have hammered lynches? Or is it just end of day majority?

[speedchuck]

Ah, okay, I think I've answered my own question.

After reading over G-Man's 'five reasons' post, my readlist remains the same. I'll add color for the fun of it:
Speedchuck
G-Man
Quin
Epignosis
Dom
Sorsha
S~V~S
DFaraday

I'm town.
I don't think this is enough of a bastard setup for G-Man or Quin to be scum. Quin I had a strong townread on anyway.

[Golden]

DOes this game have hammered lynches? Or is it just end of day majority?

No hammered lynches, even at lylo.

[Golden]

I do note, though, that I should have had a 'no lynch' option given this is mylo (sorry) - if active players wish to vote for no lynch, vote for the 'nons' category.

[G-Man]

For what little good it does, here's my current rainbow list:

G-Man, Quin

Dom, Epignosis

DFaraday, S~V~S, Sorsha, speedchuck


I- I love the colorful clothes she wears...

[S~V~S]

Spoiler: show

Quin is the only one in this game talking any sense, so I am following his vote on Sorsha.

You put a second vote on someone becasue the first persons reason ("none whatsoever") was talking sense to you?

S~V~S has played with llama enough to know he posts like this and says controversial things that have no bearing on his alignment. She will admit as much later.

I wonder if Sorsha noticed she had three votes when she was in here.

One vote on a person for a silly reason, ha ha lulz. Dropping a second vote on someone for a silly reason, not cool. Dropping a third vote, what baddie would do that?

I hope to see votes moving there or better reasons put forth.

So dropping a temp vote on Llama for lulz. If he takes his vote more seriously, I will too.

This is a case of S~V~S voting llama not because she thought he was bad, but because she wanted to punish him. "Not cool." Why wasn't it cool? He was a civilian, so even if his thoughts were weird, they were genuine. That's how llama is.

S~V~S knows that, as we're about to see.

Lastly, her final line in this post gave the illusion of open-mindedness, but it was conditional. Again, this was not a vote to find mafia- it was a vote to punish: "Take your (Day 1) vote more seriously or else." It was a threat, and it got a civilian lynched.

Who would you prefer I vote for, SVS?

At this point, I don't particularly know, the votes for Sorsha are the only thing to stand out to me so far. Who do you think I should vote for?

I just really dislike it when people put others in a lynchable position for lulz. Probably an artifact of when we did not have changeable votes.

Again, note the wording: "I just really dislike it when..."

Just because you dislike something doesn't mean you should lynch the person for it. It doesn't make him bad. It means (if you are civilian) that you need to reread the object of the game (find mafia), but I find that a lot of times, mafia resort to lynching civilians for things they dislike. And you, S~V~S, have known llama's wackiness for years. His vote against Sorsha was not worth lynching him over, and you know that, but went for it anyway.

Those who have their vote placed on me:

Is it because you don't like what my actions have been? Or because you think they come from a scummy place. Do explain.

Personally, I think Llama looks scummier than you. He was the first to put a second vote on someone for a silly reason. I can't imagine someone being bad and piling a third silly vote on someone. That is why I voted for him, not you. But I have seen very bold baddies do very bold things to fall back on the wifom.

Are you a bold baddie?

Do you honestly think Sorsha is bad? If not do you plan to move your vote?

If S~V~S is bad, I would likely rule out speedchuck based on this exchange.

S~V~S said she can't imagine someone being bad and piling a third "silly" vote on someone. I think that's the most ridiculous thing said here. S~V~S has twice the Mafia experience I do, if not more, and I've seen some squirrely-ass things in my time. I've seen mafia kill their own teammates. I find it hard to believe you, S~V~S, can't imagine mafia not plopping down a third silly vote on someone. I've seen mafia do way crazier things than that.

Llama~

"What is LOST?"

Google results: https://www.google.com/search?q=what+is ... 8&oe=utf-8

Took me 4 seconds

And I will take you seriously if you give real answers and stop goofing around. If you suspect Faraday, then vote for him! You don't feel even remotely sincere to me, and you put someone you don't actually seem to suspect in danger. That concerns me. Even goofing around, when you are sincere this comes through. I am not seeing it.

I don't google things I can ask my friends about. And if I vote for Faraday now, I put my own life in peril, which I am not in the mood to do.

I don't like to bother my friends with trivia, so I Google things. It takes all types to make the world go around.

So you would rather leave your vote on the person who you don't actually suspect, instead of the person you DO suspect, and who you already named as your suspect? Becasue voting for the person you actually do suspect will get you killed, whereas just naming him won't?

I know you like to be quirky and quixotic and cultivate this image, but you make no sense right now. I am Okey Dokey with my vote.

Iam taking another hit of Nyquil and going to bed.

In light of the fact that there has been a Mafia Godfather in both previous entries, this stands out to me. If my hypothesis is correct that DF is a traditional "Godfather," then S~V~S pushing llama to vote DF would be encouraging him to waste a lynch.

I note that S~V~S herself voted DF today (again, over something she didn't like).

Furthermore, in a Mafia context, I doubt S~V~S ever finds llama remotely sincere. That's his way. He's a snake oil salesman. He's a character from a friggin Flannery O' Connor story. Here he is now.

S~V~S even acknowledged his penchant for being "quirky and quixotic," but he's making "no sense right now." Outside of a blatant slip in which the slipper tries to save face, since when does making no sense on Day 1 indicate that someone is bad? Surely S~V~S has enough experience to know that it is civilians who tend to make the lesser amount of sense early on because there is no pressure on mafia to have to get their stories straight. On top of it all, it's llama.

S~V~S was okay with her vote because it was a convenient way to lynch a civilian. I'm calling her out on it.

So this jist of this is that you think I should know better about Llama. That was what I recalled before and reading it again reinforces that.

You're wrong. I am a tone reader, you know this, and llama has a tone when he's bad that he does not when he's civ, much as he would wish it were not so. In the recent GOC, where I was civ and he was not, I knew it pretty fast, and was sure enough about it that I false role claimed to get him lynched. That was not the first timeI read him successfully. I think I read Llama better than I read almost anyone. His pointless gambling with other peoples games has a more controlled element to it when he's bad. When he's civ, he doesn't care. When he's bad, he does care, about how he looks. I thought I saw that here. I was wrong.

Call me out all you like, you're wrong, just like you were in Blue/Red. You have no idea how to read me. So you misread me alot becasue you put your ideas about how people think onto me, but I don't think like other people and you know this.

I voted Faraday cause he's bad. I'm not.

[speedchuck]

With it being MYLO, and with the power balance as is, Faraday is the best bet.

[G-Man]

Faraday may be the most obvious choice but I'm trying to figure out if I want to vote for him or not. Low-hanging fruit and all that.

#5- The first time I saw myself on YouTube.

And the way the sunlight plays upon her hair...

[S~V~S]

I never saw either of those, I did not play that game. That's amazing, and I admire your bravery. I am impressed. You should post that in every game.

[G-Man]

Fun indeed. That game was something I'll never forget (or live down).

This choice is exceedingly difficult. I wish more people were around to talk about this vote.

#4- Using a baddie pen-pal role to drive Long Con to the brink (if not past the edge) of sanity.

I hear the sound of a gentle word...

[Golden]

+5 Hillary points to G-Man for bringing up Economics.

Oh, hang on, wrong game.

[Epignosis]

Faraday may be the most obvious choice but I'm trying to figure out if I want to vote for him or not. Low-hanging fruit and all that.

If you vote elsewhere, I will follow you, so you are guaranteed a second vote there.

Unless of course you get cute and vote for me.

[DFaraday]

Faraday may be the most obvious choice but I'm trying to figure out if I want to vote for him or not. Low-hanging fruit and all that.

If you vote elsewhere, I will follow you, so you are guaranteed a second vote there.

Unless of course you get cute and vote for me.

I will also vote there. I'm meant to be on this Island. I have a destiny!

[G-Man]

Following me isn't the goal. Keeping our options open is. Tell me what you guys think about speedchuck.

Five Reasons Speedchuck Might Be Mafia:
1) He spent most of Day 1 posting but adding nothing of substance.

2) He mentions he'd almost rather force a tie than lynch either notsawyer or nutella on Day 2. Perhaps he knew and this was him playing 'uncertain civvie' as little too loosely?

3) The top half of his colorless rainbow was pretty spot-on.

4) He's tightened up his game the longer the game has progressed.

5) There's a lot of posts expressing his thoughts on the thoughts and theories of others but I feel like there's not enough expressing his own thoughts.


Five Reasons Speedchuck Might Be Civvie:
1) He's newer here and still trying to get used to all of our varying personalities.

2) I feel inclined to give a new guy the benefit of the doubt. Sometimes to a fault though.

3) He had a good, pointed question to S~V~S regarding her "second silly vote looks worse than the third" bit.

4) He's tightened up his game the longer the game has progressed.

5) n/a

#3- My initial coward threat and the first time I called Golden a coward.

On the wind that lifts her perfume through the air...

[Sorsha]

Sorry for not being around. Packing and moving this weekend... voting DF though as I said yesterday

[G-Man]

Sorry for not being around. Packing and moving this weekend... voting DF though as I said yesterday

Feel free to offer your thoughts on voting for Sorsha too.

Five Reasons Sorsha Might Be Mafia:
1) She hid behind roleplay for just about all of Day 1. She did that when she was a baddie in Season 2.

2) She flaked out on the game for almost all of Day 2, save for one post. Baddies don't like to ask for replacements. It's tempting to try to coast to victory, which is easier to do in some of these Heist games, sadly.

3) She missed two votes in a row, which makes her impossible to evaluate, given how little she's posted.

4) On Day 3, she said she's try to catch up. On Night 3, she said she was still behind and needed to catch up. Was she really trying to catch up or just buying herself more time

5) I get Lazy Rotten Deborah vibes something fierce for her.



Five Reasons Sorsha Might Be Civvie:
1) Most of her absence can probably be explained by her focus on Survivor Mafia. (this is why I try not to play more than one game at a time)

2-5) Yeah, I got nothing.

#2- The first time Sloonei called me his hero.

[Quin]

Following me isn't the goal. Keeping our options open is. Tell me what you guys think about speedchuck.

Five Reasons Speedchuck Might Be Mafia:
1) He spent most of Day 1 posting but adding nothing of substance.

2) He mentions he'd almost rather force a tie than lynch either notsawyer or nutella on Day 2. Perhaps he knew and this was him playing 'uncertain civvie' as little too loosely?

3) The top half of his colorless rainbow was pretty spot-on.

4) He's tightened up his game the longer the game has progressed.

5) There's a lot of posts expressing his thoughts on the thoughts and theories of others but I feel like there's not enough expressing his own thoughts.


Five Reasons Speedchuck Might Be Civvie:
1) He's newer here and still trying to get used to all of our varying personalities.

2) I feel inclined to give a new guy the benefit of the doubt. Sometimes to a fault though.

3) He had a good, pointed question to S~V~S regarding her "second silly vote looks worse than the third" bit.

4) He's tightened up his game the longer the game has progressed.

5) n/a

#3- My initial coward threat and the first time I called Golden a coward.

On the wind that lifts her perfume through the air...

I've had pangs of suspicion. He was quick to accept me as town even when it'd been made clear that in a balanced setup either DF or I must be bad. I get that he town read me anyway, but at Lylo I'd have expected it to be debated more. He was also the third to jump on my Sorsha vote.

Fun fact - he claims he was town-reading me, but tried to lynch me when he realised I was still alive. What's up with that... chucky boy?

[Quin]

I'm leaning town on both Epi and Dom. I don't think Dom and DF are teammates (famous last words), and I'm pretty much just letting intuition guide my read on Epi.

[Epignosis]

My initial reaction was to raise the banner and the hammer and the nail for S~V~S' coffin.

She says I can't "read" her. I don't think that's true. I've seen through her evilness plenty of times before. I've seen it plenty of times before.

She is right though that I judge her thought process by a standard that usually isn't appropriate. That's true. It's ultimately why I lynched her last time out.

If she's bad, then can't really say I don't "read her" well.

S~V~S, here is something for you to talk about:

When you are bad, you usually leave me alone. When you are good, you have no qualms going after me. That is my general understanding of how you function. Is it 100% accurate? Of course not. But since you say I don't "read" you well, that's sometimes what I go by, along with other criteria.

Why have you not gone after me? I've done nothing noteworthy here. I've been nothing at all of a force or a maker of discussion.

[S~V~S]

Because I don't think you're bad? One thing we have in common, you never low ball when you're bad. You do at times when you are civ. I know that after I have a gave where my instincts were abysmal, as yours were in Red\Blue I tend to low ball.

But if you want to keep clutching at reasons to suspect me, knock yourself out.

[Epignosis]

Because I don't think you're bad? One thing we have in common, you never low ball when you're bad. You do at times when you are civ. I know that after I have a gave where my instincts were abysmal, as yours were in Red\Blue I tend to low ball.

But if you want to keep clutching at reasons to suspect me, knock yourself out.

"Low ball?" You mean not participate much?

My level of participation has everything to do with the fact that I'm trying to do too much at one time- that's it. I don't like to talk about real life in games, because it has nothing to do with my alignment, so I tend to stay quiet about that and post about it elsewhere. This past week has been grades, grades, grades. Add on to this our yard catching fire a week ago and my sister-in-law moving in the week before, with us trying to get her a job (she has one) and an apartment (she doesn't), and that's why I'm "low balling" it (if that's what you meant).

My participation level will never ever ever depend on what alignment I got. I consider not playing simply because you are bad discourteous.

[Epignosis]

And, to add to that, my participation level will never be based on what happened in another game (like G-Man thought). Dom was right- I don't give a shit about any of that.

I sometimes take a hit in morale right after a poor lynch I directed, but I always remind myself: "You're a civilian. The best thing you can do is keep fighting to get the win for the person you just lynched."

[Epignosis]

I would like everyone to pretend DF is gone. It's Day 4. Who gets your vote and why?

[Quin]

I would like everyone to pretend DF is gone. It's Day 4. Who gets your vote and why?

speedchuck.

[Quin]

For reasons I said in a post on this page.

[S~V~S]

I think you misread what I said, but the point remains I don't think you're bad. I don't always think you're bad as you seem to think I do.

Like I said, you seem to be trying to make the facts fit your narrative. You are looking for things that make me bad. You have decided I am bad and are trying to find points to prove it.

Linki, hrs not gone, though.

[S~V~S]

And, to add to that, my participation level will never be based on what happened in another game (like G-Man thought). Dom was right- I don't give a shit about any of that.

I sometimes take a hit in morale right after a poor lynch I directed, but I always remind myself: "You're a civilian. The best thing you can do is keep fighting to get the win for the person you just lynched."

I know you don't give a shit.

Some people don't play for the win. They play for the fun. I always take a morale hit because I ruined their game.

[Epignosis]

I think you misread what I said, but the point remains I don't think you're bad. I don't always think you're bad as you seem to think I do.

I didn't misread what you said- I don't think you think I'm bad.

Like I said, you seem to be trying to make the facts fit your narrative. You are looking for things that make me bad. You have decided I am bad and are trying to find points to prove it.

Where did you say this before?

[S~V~S]

Because I don't think you're bad? One thing we have in common, you never low ball when you're bad. You do at times when you are civ. I know that after I have a gave where my instincts were abysmal, as yours were in Red\Blue I tend to low ball.

But if you want to keep clutching at reasons to suspect me, knock yourself out.

Here^^

Not the words but the same intent.

[S~V~S]

*waits for semantics argument*

[Epignosis]

No semantic argument necessary: You didn't say it. You said "Like I said before." I can't read your intent.

[S~V~S]

Not my problem. If you want to keep clutching at reasons to suspect me, well, that fits your narrative, doesn't it?

[Epignosis]

I would like to lynch someone other than DF. That's where everyone is voting, and mafia want it so in order to get through the Day phase without scrutiny. I'm not having any of that.

[Epignosis]

Not my problem. If you want to keep clutching at reasons to suspect me, well, that fits your narrative, doesn't it?

It is YOUR problem.

Don't say "Like I said before," and follow it up with "Not the words but the same intent."

[S~V~S]

And good mafia players should be able to read intent.

Don't sell yourself short.

[S~V~S]

No it really isn't my problem. I talk like I talk and you are the one who has problems with it, like how I say I don't like things somehow means something it foesnt, or how i am able to use different words to say the same thing ISN'T the same thing.

It is the same thing. Like I said.

[Epignosis]

No it really isn't my problem. I talk like I talk and you are the one who has problems with it, like how I say I don't like things somehow means something it foesnt, or how i am able to use different words to say the same thing ISN'T the same thing.

It is the same thing. Like I said.

You're not talking. You're posting on an Internet forum. I have to read what you post and make a judgment for or against you. If you want to be understood better, post better.

Not my problem.

[S~V~S]

I post fine.

Just vote for me.

[S~V~S]

You have decided, and you are twisting everything to fit that idea. Why are we even talking? (And for me it's the same as talking which is why I say talking). You made up your mind.

[Epignosis]

I post fine finely, or, if you prefer, well.

Just vote for me.

[Epignosis]

You have decided, and you are twisting everything to fit that idea. Why are we even talking? (And for me it's the same as talking which is why I say talking). You made up your mind.

I have not decided.

[S~V~S]

And with that I àm the hell out of here.

[S~V~S]

I post fine finely, or, if you prefer, well.

Just vote for me.

That^^

[Quin]

i post good