Episode VII - the Force Awakens

#1

I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?

#2

Golden wrote:I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?

No. No one else is going.

#3

No, apparently I hate Star Wars.

#4

Epignosis wrote:
Golden wrote:I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?
No. No one else is going.

Yeah, haven't you checked twitter lately?

#5

Epignosis wrote:
Golden wrote:I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?
No. No one else is going.

I love it when you have a cinema to yourself. I'm glad it isn't overhyped or anything.

#6

Nope. I'll wait until the third or fourth week usually if I go see a movie. I don't like a packed theater because I have a sweet spot that I like to sit in. I don't like getting to the theater any more than 20 minutes before showtime. Does that make me a movie snob?

#7

Just saw the trailer. Looks good.

#8

The movie still looks pretty good to me but I thought the trailer was mostly meh. The poster they released recently has me concerned about one thing.

Spoiler: show

#9

G-Man wrote:The movie still looks pretty good to me but I thought the trailer was mostly meh. The poster they released recently has me concerned about one thing.

Spoiler: show
I really hope we're not dealing with a third Death Star. That would feel way too repetitive.

I don't mind exploring old content in new ways. New ways, being the operative words.

#10

Golden wrote:I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?

Are you going in costume?

You aren't a true fan until you go in costume.

#11

Sorsha wrote:
Golden wrote:I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?
Are you going in costume?

You aren't a true fan until you go in costume.

I don't think I am a true fan. I more enjoy looking at all the other people in costume.

I will, however, be wearing in-joke clothing with the logo of Star Wars Celebration Anaheim 2015, the official fan convention, which I attended. I think that will get me sufficient geek cred.

#12

I'll probably go, because I'm not a monster who wouldn't take the chance to go with his best friend to the movies once in a while, otherwise I really don't care.

#13

Sorsha wrote:
Golden wrote:I have my tickets for the midnight screening. Anyone else going all in on the first day?
Are you going in costume?

You aren't a true fan until you go in costume.

:P

Back in 2003 I went to a Lord of the Rings trilogy presentation on opening night of Return of the King. Still probably the greatest theater-going experience of my life. My best friend and I got there three hours early so we could nab good seats. We sat in the lobby for an hour and a half before they opened the theater. As we sat there I asked him if showing up three hours early for a fantasy trilogy that would keep us there for over 12 hours made us major dorks. Another attendee walked past us dressed up like Samwise Gamgee (complete with replica elvish cloak, backpack, and frying pan). My friend turns to me and says, "Oh, we're major dorks alright but at least we're not that guy."

Anywho, I have an old Boba Fett t-shirt I plan on wearing when the wife and I go to see it. I have a Max Rebo band concert shirt that I'm trying to talk her into wearing as well.

#14

I just realized I have a mission: to rewatch all 6 Star Wars films in the next two months.

Oh, and also Back to the Future 2.

Mission Accepted.

#15

I don't want to go on opening day. Too much annoyingness and talky-people.

My plan is to go on Christmas. Because that's what Jewish people do on Christmas. And then we eat Chinese food. It's a thing.

#16

my GM last year got us Chinese for Christmas (we had to work) I was all like "Celebrating the holidays in the way of your people are you?" He's all "Yea and I'm going to a movie after we close, smart ass." I miss seeing that doofus more than once a week.....

Not sure if we will make the midnight show, but I have plans to see it as soon as I can. Cuz. Yea. I can see Star Wars now and still hold to my pledge to not give Lucas any more of my money.

#17

The hype over here in Nauru is so staggering, I still managed to get a good seat next Saturday evening at the mall. I'm also going alone because the abovementioned best friend actually said meh (also tfw no gf) .

#18

T minus three hours.

#19

How is everyone planning to discuss this in here? Spoiler tabs yay or nay?

#20

Ricochet wrote:How is everyone planning to discuss this in here? Spoiler tabs yay or nay?

I wasn't planning to (for a while) but I guess provided everything about the movie is spoiler tagged, it would be ok?

#21

Golden wrote:
Ricochet wrote:How is everyone planning to discuss this in here? Spoiler tabs yay or nay?
I wasn't planning to (for a while) but I guess provided everything about the movie is spoiler tagged, it would be ok?

Strangely enough, despite definitely not caring much at all about the premiere, reading even the simplest of "it was awsm / it was Lucas disguised as JJ all along" reactions would further detract from the incentive to see it. Hard task, considering social media, but I might just go dark until Saturday, as if I were a total nerd.

Yes, I reckon spoiler-tagged discussions here would be for the best.

#22

Did Golden disappear or strap himself to a chair, as to not give into the dark side and post spoilers?

#23

Simon and I saw it this morning on a church's dime.

#24

Damn.

#25

Ricochet wrote:Did Golden disappear or strap himself to a chair, as to not give into the dark side and post spoilers?

I just didn't feel the need to spoilerise.

Although yeah, I've been pretty flat out so I haven't been around much.

#26

Welp, I've seen it.

#27

I am going on Christmas morning.

#28

Despite all the good reviews and amazing box office returns, I'm still going to wait until January to see this. I just don't like crowded theaters.

#29

Sounds like a long wait.

#30

My review:

Spoiler: show

There is so much good here, and so much bad.

The good: this is the best cast since Episodes 4-5. Seriously. Daisy Ridley nails the pivotal role of Rey. Like, this is insta-stardom in the making. John Boyega has fun with his role. My man Oscar Isaac is DYMANIC in his few scenes as Poe. Harrison Ford seems to be honestly having a great time here, I haven't seen him so invested in a film in... man, since Mosquito Coat? At LEAST since The Fugitive. Even Adam Driver, who I sort of hate, finds a way to make his character alive. Carrie Fisher's a bit of a letdown, and C-3PO is flat, but meh, that's okay. Oh, and little BB-8 is adorable. I want one!

The bad: The entire fucking story. Like, every inch of it. How derivative can you get? Even when you go meta and wink at how closely you are copying the other films, it's still sad! Like... ANOTHER FUCKING DEATH STAR???? I know, I know, this one is a Death PLANET, but still... it's a Death Star for christ's sake, complete with a small target the X-Wings have to blow up. Come ON! AGH!!!

And while Ridley is great as Rey... the character arc... like, what? She just spontaneously figures out what to manipulate minds with the Force out of nowhere? And figures out how to protect her mind while a Sith is attacking it? And force-pulls a light sabre BETTER than a Sith? Admittedly, Kylo Ren is made to be imperfect, and he's definitely got issues but... wtf, guys? Jedis train for years to figure this shit out, she blinks and does it? Unless this is a major plot point in the next film, I'm pissed.

There's even minor parts the pissed me off. So, the ENTIRE movie, no one knows where Luke is. And then we get to the end, the story is done, and someone was like "oh yeah, shit, the Skywalker thing" and so... wait for it... R2-D2 wakes up and BAM shows them a map of where Luke is? lulwat?

There wis so much energy and strong vibe in the film, I'm SO beyond pissed that they spent so little time on an actual storyline...

Overall, 8/10 on vibe, but in reality, probably a 6.

Oh, and extra spoiler tag for this last point:

Spoiler: show

#31

Nice touch making the text unspoiled, aka in can't see shit white. Extra protective spoiler layer.

I can certainly share my few thoughts as well, if anyone would be mostly ok with starting to rip through this. (in spoilers, of course)

#32

timmer wrote:My review:

Spoiler: show
There is so much good here, and so much bad.

The good: this is the best cast since Episodes 4-5. Seriously. Daisy Ridley nails the pivotal role of Rey. Like, this is insta-stardom in the making. John Boyega has fun with his role. My man Oscar Isaac is DYMANIC in his few scenes as Poe. Harrison Ford seems to be honestly having a great time here, I haven't seen him so invested in a film in... man, since Mosquito Coat? At LEAST since The Fugitive. Even Adam Driver, who I sort of hate, finds a way to make his character alive. Carrie Fisher's a bit of a letdown, and C-3PO is flat, but meh, that's okay. Oh, and little BB-8 is adorable. I want one!

The bad: The entire fucking story. Like, every inch of it. How derivative can you get? Even when you go meta and wink at how closely you are copying the other films, it's still sad! Like... ANOTHER FUCKING DEATH STAR???? I know, I know, this one is a Death PLANET, but still... it's a Death Star for christ's sake, complete with a small target the X-Wings have to blow up. Come ON! AGH!!!

And while Ridley is great as Rey... the character arc... like, what? She just spontaneously figures out what to manipulate minds with the Force out of nowhere? And figures out how to protect her mind while a Sith is attacking it? And force-pulls a light sabre BETTER than a Sith? Admittedly, Kylo Ren is made to be imperfect, and he's definitely got issues but... wtf, guys? Jedis train for years to figure this shit out, she blinks and does it? Unless this is a major plot point in the next film, I'm pissed.

There's even minor parts the pissed me off. So, the ENTIRE movie, no one knows where Luke is. And then we get to the end, the story is done, and someone was like "oh yeah, shit, the Skywalker thing" and so... wait for it... R2-D2 wakes up and BAM shows them a map of where Luke is? lulwat?

There wis so much energy and strong vibe in the film, I'm SO beyond pissed that they spent so little time on an actual storyline...

Overall, 8/10 on vibe, but in reality, probably a 6.
Oh, and extra spoiler tag for this last point:
Spoiler: show
killing Han Solo broke my heart, you bastards.

Spoiler: show

#33

I can't believe you would post our pillow talk Epi that is private.

#34

I'm sorry baby. I didn't mean to!

#35

I'm surprised it's pillow talk and not hatemail.

...tfw nobody PM pillowtalks with me...

#36

I told Epi some of my thoughts in WHAT I BELIEVED WAS A SPECIAL MOMENT BETWEEN US but for everyone else here are my thoughts on the film since we're doing that now. Spoilers ho.

Spoiler: show

This isn't going to be very coherent. Anyway, the cast WAS great, I agree. They 100% found the three actors they needed to hold together these next 3 films. It is a very common criticism that the film drew too closely to Episode IV, which I will echo here. I do get that they'd rather play is safe with the plot and that doing things this way makes easing into the world easier for old and new fans, but it was unnecessary all told, I think. That said, it did not take away from my enjoyment of the film too much.

The villains in this film were underused completely, across the board. Phasma especially, but I would go so far as to include Snoke and Kylo Ren AND the general guy ("general guy" being a clue as to how fucking underutilized he is lol) This is my one gripe that I think it is excusable to say "they'll fix it in the next films", though. Also, Snoke as a big bad? Not buying it. He's a terrible Sith Lord. Palpatine was hands on, controlling EVERY aspect of his Empire, molding his apprentice to be the perfect weapon. Snoke is basically some guy. "Oh come to the Dark Side. Also do whatever, it's cool." Kylo is unfocused as a result, and his lack of training and discipline make HIS character less imposing as a villain, and serve against him in some key story moments.

Now let's talk about Rey. Get your pitchforks ready internet hate mob. How dare anyone criticize a female character in films, because we rarely get any of them and they are role models for young girls and anyone anywhere who has anything bad to say about them at all, these perfect snowflakes, is a sexist pig and we should fuck them up. Right? Wrong. Rey is a good character, but not without her flaws. I don't want to sound arrogant, but I think I've nailed down the whole crux of the "Mary Sue", Rey-is-too-good-at-things discussion. No, I do not believe she is "too good" a pilot or a mechanic. Why do I not believe that? Because the film presents a set of circumstances that explains her aptitude in those fields. She lives on Jakku, a desert planet, in a junkyard where she gets food rations depending on the value of the scrap she collects for her "boss". LITTERALLY IN ORDER TO SURVIVE she would have to know: The value (and therefore the function) of the scrap she collects AND how to defend herself against people beating her up to take her scrap and sell it as their own. The film EXPERTLY tells us without telling us that this is the case, her life depends on being a good mechanic/pilot AND being a competent fighter.

What the film DOES NOT TELL US is that she is knowledgeable in or competent with the Force in any way. We get hints, but that isn't enough. If the film doesn't present circumstances that show us WHY she is so good at the Force, it is not believable. Small things like tapping into the force to pilot the Falcon work, because the force is largely an intuitive power, and heightened intuition is almost a reflex for Force Sensitives. But it would take practice and understanding for her to do much else. TLDR? No, Rey is not "A Mary Sue". Yes, the film does a poor job of framing her as a viably adept force user.

How the FUCK did the REMNANTS of the Empire build a better super weapon than the Empire had WITHOUT ANYONE IN THE REPUBLIC KNOWING ABOUT IT BEFOREHAND

Overall, I really really really enjoyed the movie. One of the best films I've ever seen, and one of the best experiences in a theater I've ever had.

And I think that covers everything I wanted to talk about, so bonus spoilers below? Sure.

Spoiler: show

#37

Ok here goes. Sorry, the spoilers will be also quoted, because I wouldn't be able to live with myself, writing in an indiscernible format - so, definitely no going back if you pop the spoilers tab.

Spoiler: show

I'll write this from the perspective of someone who is not a fan(boy), by which I mean you will never hear me in my life getting hyped over a lightsaber fight or the many details, characters and wonders of such fictional universes and sagas. I did see the original trilogy on TV when I was a kid and I was guilty to have played the pod-racing PC game, after Episode I had come out, but that's about it for long-lasting enthuasiasm. Science-fiction fanboyism always drifted past me - I was chronologically more hooked on music, then cartoons, then music again, then books a bit, then music again, and nowadays snobby arthouse cinema...and music - although I guess I did watch rather rigurously Star Trek TNG as a kid and then was very fond of the Battlestar Galactica series.

That being said, I have no doubt most of the fans themselves should find TFA completely exciting and worthwhile (...except if they set their hopes to totally unreasonable standards, I suppose) and a redeeming service to the franchise, meant to create further episodes that one can be truly excited about (also, mountains of cash). I enjoyed it as well, but that does not stop me from judging the quality and impact of it, afterwards. TFA will stand the test of credibility, but I don't think it will stand the test of a great movie (on all levels) and of nitpicking.

The first thing it failed to do, unfortunately, was make me think any better of this JJ fella. See, he really grabbed the golden keys to blockbuster franchises, yet he always proves that he misses something vital. Up until now, I thought it was storytelling or such. But TFA sealed it for me: it's originality. The only time he proved that was with Lost and Fringe - but his vices instead in that case, frankly to my view, were the desire to bog down the narrative, to constantly pull mysteries out of a hat or create tension by relying on the unresolved, unexplained. But then he dreamed himself as the new Spielberg and made Super 8, which I honestly doubt can be called exciting anymore on the second or third viewing, nabbed Star Trek (and progressively made a mess out of it) and now Star Wars. This guy is simply riding on the back of great film- and franchisemakers with ease.

What TFA should have proven was a sense of original vision, maybe even an embrace of a new mythology. Instead it is refurbished Star Wars (to, no doubt, incredible results; all credits to him, in this case), it ended up being the "30-years-later / history-tends-to-repeat-itself" type of narrative, with everyone-being-someone's-someone and it was more looking back at ANH and even some bits of ESB, rather than looking forward. Probably the breaking point of ANH references to me was the tavern (? dunno what to call it) scene, down to the farking musicians. I swear my hands almost twitched to go up in the air. All the others followed, of course, to a much deeper level than that.

As for performances:

To start with the old ones, I think Ford did a very fine job and was a good sport to put back some real emotion and acting into his [SPOILERS]last[/SPOILERS] performance of a character he wished to disassociate himself with for the past 30 years (seriously, there are articles written on this). The throwback gags were a bit too much for my taste, but they work just fine for the fans. Carrie was mneh and I don't understand why she ended up simply as an old Resistance figurehead, after being referenced in the original movies (by Yoda and Ghost Obi-Wan, I think) as the "other hope" for the Jedi, in case Luke blows it. I did not like that Hammill's cliffhanger was actually wordless, nor the cheap shotmaking of it (helicopter angles? really?), but I did like that being his only appearence in the movie nevertheless (instead of, like it was maddeningly speculated, him turning evil) and that they kept the focus on his failures and flaws, rather than making him a saviour or something (which, after all, he wasn't in the original trilogy, either).

I liked the new blood, as well. I think Rey works as a new iconic figure, although Ridley's performance didn't knock me down or anything (made me think often of Keira Knighley, with all the accent, for some reason). Now, as far as the Mary Sue thing, some skills are explainable (like DH said), others seem hamfisted indeed - I don't have issues with her talents, but it detracted a bit from relating to her as a potential new bildungsroman-like character, just like with Luke. As for the Force thing, I think the mentality of the training being essential (and long in duration) was a concept forced more by the prequels (remember the kids practicing with the ball? jesus) than the original trilogy, in which Luke himself barely had weeks to train properly with Obi-Wan, then Yoda, plus behaved constantly like the avant Harry Potter of mastering anything, really. Anyway, I'm pretty sure Rey will be revealed either as Luke's daughter or perhaps his most talented youngling, back at the academy of whatevs, for which reason Luke left her on Jakku to protect her "until the time is right", just like Anakin protected his children. There was definitely insinuation that Han knew about Rey's backstory, so there ya go. The Force is strong (or native) in her and she can unlock it bordeline deus ex - no biggie.

Boyega was cool, although with some stereotypical lines and exclamations. I don't understand how he was the only Stormtrooper to discover a conscience and at the exact time the storyline of the movie conveniently unfolds. I also don't get how conditioned breeding/training and discovering a conscience on your own can work together.

I definitely would like more Poe Dameron. Period.

I grimaced a bit at the idea of hippie Driver being behind the new baddie mask, but I ended up liking Kylo Ren probably the most, mask on and off. I really liked the nice touch of the mask wearing being a thing of inner confliction, not just Vader refurbishing fan service. Thing is, Kylo Ren is almost the one character I can relate to, because of said confliction and flaws (unlike good and unwavering Rey). I kid you not, I went home after the movie thinking how will Kylo Ren evolve and improve, not how Rey or anyone else will.

The use of Phasma was deplorable and detrimental to the movie's idea of building a strong female character in Rey, but keeping a bucket on and giving only two lines to the female character on the antagonistic side.

I did not give two shits on General Hickup and Snoke.

BB8 was an excellent loveable character, Chewie comeback was also good, I didn't mind 3CPO and R2D2 cameos, but neither cared a lot.

Cinematography and effects were great, just as Epig referenced, but I think you can already tell I do not judge a movie based on such competencies alone.

Finally, what I didn't get any sense of with TFA is where it can head, with Episodes VIII and IX, other than Rey's and Kylo Ren's trainings. The rest, being so much ANH-redux, felt resolved, in a way, within the movie itself, at least on short term. Long term? The neverending conflict between the good and bad forces? Yawn. Fourth Death Star incoming, I assume... The future directing names don't sound any more promising than JJ, tbh (makers of Looper and Jurassic World, respectively...? yeah not much hype there), and I think the damage is already done by TFA with the "let's stick to the old" paradigm.

Based on current excitement level and very competent refreshening , I'd say 7, but this will definitely go down to a 6 or even a 5 with time, for me personally. Originality, motherf**ker, do you speak it at all?

#38

Spoiler: show

#39

Also, fair points everybody and good thoughts/reviews. I still think my pitch would have made a better film

#40

I almost forgot.

Best new gif.

#41

OK, I just got back from seeing it, and yeah. You guys are all right.

#42

Spoiler: show

#43

Ahem

Spoiler: show

#44

DharmaHelper wrote:
Spoiler: show
If the next one is a retreading of the originals again, or if everybody is related to everybody I'm going to flip my shit so hard

Spoiler: show

#45

Just saw it today and you all make good points about the story, but I don't care

It was awesome to finally have another Star Wars movie with intriguing characters. It was a fun movie which the prequels can't claim to be. I'm confident that future installments, specifically the Rian Johnson one will take greater care with plotting and character arcs, but this is exactly what the franchise needed to be relevant again.

#46

Turnip Head wrote:Just saw it today and you all make good points about the story, but I don't care It was awesome to finally have another Star Wars movie with intriguing characters. It was a fun movie which the prequels can't claim to be. I'm confident that future installments, specifically the Rian Johnson one will take greater care with plotting and character arcs, but this is exactly what the franchise needed to be relevant again.

I don't disagree.

#47

I agree with some of the criticisms I have read (particularly in regards to underdeveloped baddies) but overall I liked it. As usual, I went in with low expectations as to not be disappointed, and I wasn't. (At the movie - Unfortunately I had other disappointments in my movie going experience.

)

I think that there are also a few things that could change how I feel about this movie depending on how the next movies go. I like some of the new people and I hope they don't ruin them.

#48

Yeah, it was definitely a fun action film. I would see it again. But I gotta say...

Spoiler: show

#49

Stormtroopers being lame has been a thing since the original films. It's pretty much a meme at this point.

#50

Imma copypaste the reiew I posted on NF...

Spoiler: show

Full Games	Civilian: Mafia: Independent:
Speed Games	Civilian: Fiddler on the Roof Mafia:
Heists	Civilian: MVP: RED vs BLUE
Burglaries	Independent: The Theme Is Literally a Burglary
Special Games	Civilian: Independent:

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