Battlestar Galactica Mafia - GAME OVER

[Polo]

Separately, I would assert that S~V~S's responses to Polo's pressure have been robotic and emotionless. I can understand a concerted effort to avoid blowing up, but everyone has limits and I am seeing this as less authentic. I also know that in my own baddie game, emotionlessness is probably my most significant tell (I'm working on it. ). Eventually that stuff is going to frustrate a civilian, enough at least that it will be visible in the posts. This doesn't mean S~V~S should be suspecting Polo, but I would expect a more animated demand from her for him to put up or shut up. He won't let it go and she has been very accommodating of that.

I'm not letting it go until she gets lynched.

[ObscureAllure]

RIP bea.

Not going to lie, you were one of my top susses. One reason that I never shared was that Glorfindel at one point used the word "maths". I looked into his entire post history at the Syndicate, and he had never used that word before until this game. And I know you use the word "maths" often, so I thought maybe you were saying it in btsc and he picked up on it.

Alas, that wasn't so.

Now, ObscureAllure, I would like to know...

Bea - I keep seeing you say you're a nub player. have you not been playing for years?

What was your intent with this post? Did you think that bea was trying to trick people into thinking she was actually a nub who just started playing? Tbh, this question just seems like it's there to make bea jump through hoops and I don't like it.

The point of the post is exactly as it sounded. She has said multiple times this game that she's a "nub" (the slang of newbie) player and it is odd to me because she was around years ago before I took a break. You can't really be a newbie at something you've been playing for years. It felt like she was using that as an excuse (oh, I can't figure out who the mafia are because I'm just a lowly nub!" Type of a feel. How on earth does that make me suspicious?

I'm beginning to understand that Matt jokes because you pick the weirdest, not role related shit to harp on.

[Polo]

ObscureAllure, what are your reads?

[ObscureAllure]

Either SVS or Polo is bad. Frankly, the fact that Polo is saying that he's 100% sure without posting evidence as to why and ISNT getting punished makes me think he's full of shit. I said something way less confirmative and got punished for it. If tomorrow is Polo vs SVS, I guess we will find out which one.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me why we aren't lynching confirmed Cylon Wigly?!?? One in three (or more) chance of being bad as opposed to the unknown player who is about 2 in three chance of being civvie!?!


Linki: WIGLY, sig (although I think I may have found an alternative situation in my reread here so I reserve the right to remove), rabbit (I think Zebra was recruited), Matt, and either Polo or SVS

[ObscureAllure]

MATT

DO YOU
THINK
RECRUITMENT
IS VERY LIKELY
IN THIS
GAME?!

[rabbit8]

Well.... I suck.

Sorry Bea.

How does this result influence your perspective of the game?

I thought you were on her team...... I suck.

I still think Rico is bad though. I thought he was on another team. Maybe I was completely off base with two teams and there is only one.

[Polo]

Either SVS or Polo is bad. Frankly, the fact that Polo is saying that he's 100% sure without posting evidence as to why and ISNT getting punished makes me think he's full of shit. I said something way less confirmative and got punished for it. If tomorrow is Polo vs SVS, I guess we will find out which one.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me why we aren't lynching confirmed Cylon Wigly?!?? One in three (or more) chance of being bad as opposed to the unknown player who is about 2 in three chance of being civvie!?!


Linki: WIGLY, sig (although I think I may have found an alternative situation in my reread here so I reserve the right to remove), rabbit (I think Zebra was recruited), Matt, and either Polo or SVS

Can you assure me that if I'm NK'd tonight you will vote for S~V~S tomorrow?

[DrumBeats]

If we delve into that level of paranoia I have two theories.

1. if they were to kill me it would make people more likely to take what I said seriously namely me saying we should lynch Wilgy.
2. I speculated about this early in that I think the mafia attempted to kill me early in the game, but for some reason there kill failed.

I think my first theory is much more likely and think tomorrow we should be lynching Wilgy.

That doesn't answer my question. I was asking as to why you think the mafia killed Dex to frame you, and how exactly mafia killing Dex frames you.

[DrumBeats]

The more I read back into this game, the more I believe Glorfindel could have been civ and that Epignosis could be mafia.

Elaborate. Tell us where/why if you want to convince us. It's going to take a hell of a good reason, and based on your SVS post, I'm not confident you can deliver.

Polo, response please.

[DrumBeats]

Drumbeats...

On May 7th, you said...

Good:

JJJ
ika
G-Man

Toastery:

Rico
Vompatti
LoRab

FoS: Ricochet

Richochet has been arguably the most vocal player this game, but looking back, Ricochet has provided nothing with his/her many posts. The only thing Rico did was attempt to discredit basically every other post. This is a very proscum approach because its sole purpose is to reduce town information. Rico has not provided a single town/toaster read iirc. In all of those posts, there is no reason to have no reads at all imo. I don't know meta, so I can't judge based on that, but nothing about this behavior strikes me as protown.

On May 8th, you said...

Good:
JJJ
Ika
SVS - I don't know meta, but all of his posts have a genuine effort to help the town imo and he brings up a lot of good points.

Toaster:
Rico - Still seen no real reads or anything, just self-defense. This guy isn't even pinging my scumdar anymore, it's going loco everytime he posts.
G-Man - SVS's points on his post are incredibly valid imo. Summarizing is an easy way to feign information and I didn't notice that before.
Obscure/Vompetti - I really don't like how they both locked a vote for seemingly no reason.

On May 9th, you said...

I'm honestly feeling better about Rico now than I was yesterday.

And that was it.

Explanation?

That was a long time ago, but I think I remember it being due mostly to his fight with Ika and him beginning to start taking more stances. The fight with ika made me think that mafia wouldn't put themselves at the forefront of that pointless of bickering and draw attention to themselves that way, and he began to take stances, which was absent from much of his day one imo.

[DrumBeats]

By Day Four, 3J had missed three So Say We All's, so if you get the brig for three times, then 3J should've been silenced Day 5.

By Day Two, Vomps had missed three So Say We All's, so if you get the brig for three times, then Vomps should've been silenced Day 3.

These players were not silenced for those days.

Hrm.

So why do you get three times Drum?

As 3J said, Golden mentioned being behind on them. You can find him saying that if you ISO Golden. I received the 2nd and 3rd punishment on the same day phase because of it

[DrumBeats]

If I recall correctly, I got a bit of a scolding from JJJ for having too many civs on that list, but OK. You're on it

It's funny that only 2 of the 7 people you read as bad are still alive. One of them is a confirmed Cylon who we believe is Civ (DrWilgy) and Sig.

The other 5 were either lynched with your assistance and turned out to be anti-Cavil (Bea, Long Con, LoRab) or nightkilled (Dex, Spacedaisy).

I would call Long Con anti-anti-Cavil if that makes sense. He likely wasn't in Cavil's faction, but his martial law in my opinion would have helped Cavil's group in the long run because we would eventually be forced to rid of our civ cylons.

[DrumBeats]

3J - I notice you did not post at all on Day 7. Before Day 7, how many So Say We All's had you missed?

I'd missed four, but Golden also fell behind on the treason stuff for a while so that muddies this line of thinking.

Care to fill in the 4th punishment to complete the list?

Punishments I know of:
1 - Warning
2 - Penalty Vote Next Day
3 - Brig
4 - ?
5 - Brig
6 - Modkill

[DrumBeats]

Polo, what degree of confidence do you have in your read on S~V~S?

High enough for me to say this: if she's lynched and she's not Cylon, then you can lynch me on the next day.

I am 100% sure she's mafia.

Are you claiming to have info? Becasue that would be impossible. And that would be the only 100% you could have, tbh.

And Jay, I kept poking her over & over, and she kept not responding. Since the Nutella lynch. Had she just once poked back, I would have backed off, but she never did, and she posted tons

The only way you could be sure that it'd be impossible for me to have info is if you know you killed the character that can have that information.

Wait, is that how things work here? On this site, do the mafia know what role they killed, or is it unknown to them too?

[DrumBeats]

RIP bea.

Not going to lie, you were one of my top susses. One reason that I never shared was that Glorfindel at one point used the word "maths". I looked into his entire post history at the Syndicate, and he had never used that word before until this game. And I know you use the word "maths" often, so I thought maybe you were saying it in btsc and he picked up on it.

Alas, that wasn't so.

Now, ObscureAllure, I would like to know...

Bea - I keep seeing you say you're a nub player. have you not been playing for years?

What was your intent with this post? Did you think that bea was trying to trick people into thinking she was actually a nub who just started playing? Tbh, this question just seems like it's there to make bea jump through hoops and I don't like it.

The point of the post is exactly as it sounded. She has said multiple times this game that she's a "nub" (the slang of newbie) player and it is odd to me because she was around years ago before I took a break. You can't really be a newbie at something you've been playing for years. It felt like she was using that as an excuse (oh, I can't figure out who the mafia are because I'm just a lowly nub!" Type of a feel. How on earth does that make me suspicious?

I'm beginning to understand that Matt jokes because you pick the weirdest, not role related shit to harp on.

To be fair, as someone who doesn't know how long any of you were here, I thought Bea was actually a "nub" using the newbie defense.

[DrumBeats]

MATT

DO YOU
THINK
RECRUITMENT
IS VERY LIKELY
IN THIS
GAME?!

I'm not Matt, but I think it is a possibility for how the final five mechanic could come into play. I remember people saying/looking into it on the wiki, that of the final five, most of them sided with the humans in the show and one sided with the cylons. I'm wondering if the cylons have a role that lets them recruit the final five over to their side.

[Polo]

Polo, what degree of confidence do you have in your read on S~V~S?

High enough for me to say this: if she's lynched and she's not Cylon, then you can lynch me on the next day.

I am 100% sure she's mafia.

Are you claiming to have info? Becasue that would be impossible. And that would be the only 100% you could have, tbh.

And Jay, I kept poking her over & over, and she kept not responding. Since the Nutella lynch. Had she just once poked back, I would have backed off, but she never did, and she posted tons

The only way you could be sure that it'd be impossible for me to have info is if you know you killed the character that can have that information.

Wait, is that how things work here? On this site, do the mafia know what role they killed, or is it unknown to them too?

If they have a character with a role-discovering power, they can know who they are going to elliminate.

The more I read back into this game, the more I believe Glorfindel could have been civ and that Epignosis could be mafia.

Elaborate. Tell us where/why if you want to convince us. It's going to take a hell of a good reason, and based on your SVS post, I'm not confident you can deliver.

Polo, response please.

Can I answer this when I get back from work?

[Matt]

@ GOLDAMA

I've just done three days worth of treason counting

My, weren't so many of you bad on day six...

Be wary of incoming punishments.

Can you confirm whether you meant "three days" in real time or "three days" as in phases?

In addition, even if Golden meant three day phases as of Night 6, that would mean Day 6, 5, and 4 going backwards.

Vomps missed three by Day 2.

So it still holds true that Vomps was not silenced after missing three SSWA's, but Drumbeats was.

I do NOT think this is a case of Golden being lazy or behind. He has obvi put mucho effort into this game of his, and I think there's a reason some players get three times and some get five times. I have no idea what that reason is, but I find it amusing both 3J and Drum want to sweep it under the rug.

@Obscure - You need to die. Die die die. Please. A fiery horrible death. Thanks. And I have no idea if there is a recruit or not. IF there is such a thing, then I would have to believe Epig would need to go immediately.

[Epignosis]

If I were a recruiter, I wouldn't recruit me for precisely that reason.

[Matt]

If I were a recruiter, I wouldn't recruit me for precisely that reason.

I realize I'm a bit all over the place and at the same exact time, trust you more then anyone and also distrust you more then anyone...haha...

Do you think there's anything to the SSWA misses? Do you think Golden, after setting up this awesomely complicated game, just decided to wing it on punishments for SSWA?

[G-Man]

RIP bea.

Not going to lie, you were one of my top susses. One reason that I never shared was that Glorfindel at one point used the word "maths". I looked into his entire post history at the Syndicate, and he had never used that word before until this game. And I know you use the word "maths" often, so I thought maybe you were saying it in btsc and he picked up on it.

Alas, that wasn't so.

Now, ObscureAllure, I would like to know...

Bea - I keep seeing you say you're a nub player. have you not been playing for years?

What was your intent with this post? Did you think that bea was trying to trick people into thinking she was actually a nub who just started playing? Tbh, this question just seems like it's there to make bea jump through hoops and I don't like it.

The point of the post is exactly as it sounded. She has said multiple times this game that she's a "nub" (the slang of newbie) player and it is odd to me because she was around years ago before I took a break. You can't really be a newbie at something you've been playing for years. It felt like she was using that as an excuse (oh, I can't figure out who the mafia are because I'm just a lowly nub!" Type of a feel. How on earth does that make me suspicious?

I'm beginning to understand that Matt jokes because you pick the weirdest, not role related shit to harp on.

To be fair, as someone who doesn't know how long any of you were here, I thought Bea was actually a "nub" using the newbie defense.

As far as I know, someone calling themselves either the term "nub" or "n00b" doesn't just mean "I am a new player." It's also a self-deprecating remark implying that you are playing like a nub or having a bad game where nothing clicks. I remember that being Piano lingo because certain players would call each other 'nub dutchies.' I don't know that OA ever played at The Piano but several Piano folk migrated to Rev, where OA resurfaced after STV crashed and burned for the second (or third?) time. If she was ever exposed to it, I would assume she has just forgotten. It's a molehill, not a mountain.

RIP bea.

I think I found what I didn't like about S~V~S's Day 6 vote but I'm going to keep reading through her content to see if there's any more to it.

I agree with Jimmy. Since losing the amnesty claim to strategize around, we've been a little sloppy as a group. We need to come up with a PLAN for approaching tomorrow's vote. If we can all share some reads tonight and during the first half of Day 9, maybe we can pick up a sense of direction. Day 8 was like Day 1 revisited but without the favorable result. All the missed votes make my spreadsheet weep.

[Matt]

Also Epi...

Continuing my ISO of Drum and ran across this...

Mafia don't need me dead to win. That's number one.

Number two is let them try.

How do you know that?

Try to kill me. I know you want to.

Yeah so I'll ask for Drum again, how do you know that Epi?

[Epignosis]

If I were a recruiter, I wouldn't recruit me for precisely that reason.

I realize I'm a bit all over the place and at the same exact time, trust you more then anyone and also distrust you more then anyone...haha...

Do you think there's anything to the SSWA misses? Do you think Golden, after setting up this awesomely complicated game, just decided to wing it on punishments for SSWA?

Designing a complex game is easy because you are free to work on it whenever you want.

Executing a complex game is not easy because you are on the clock, as it were, and it can be easy to overlook things. I do believe once Golden said this:

Dammit, I missed getting to participate in the gun to head reads exercise. Who wants to know my reads?

Sorry for being absent over the last couple of days. Life has really socked me in the mouth, but I'm catching up now and will be posting all the sorties etc. Some of you are also owed punishments for treason... I have not forgotten that.

[Epignosis]

Also Epi...

Continuing my ISO of Drum and ran across this...

Mafia don't need me dead to win. That's number one.

Number two is let them try.

How do you know that?

Try to kill me. I know you want to.

Yeah so I'll ask for Drum again, how do you know that Epi?

How indeed. Maybe it's because I'm literate. Maybe it's because I'm lying. Maybe it's because I'm secretly recruited by an independent faction of space vampires.

[Ricochet]

Random thoughts -

I'd like to lynch either Obscure or Rico. They have both been super shady, and I'm not entirely sure why people have civ reads of them. I'm a little more hesitant on OA since my troubles this past day phase, but still.

What am I shady for? Can you point out anything besides what I've already said that it simply didn't satisfy your reasoning or it didn't follow with your plan? Can you make any single ISO-based read on me, by which I mean actions, votes and such, not just what you felt like it was a thorn in your side. I don't think you can, because I've done nothing that really counts as anti-town.

So let's talk if that's really intention, instead of "muh Rico disagree with me" and "muh claiming business". If I survive the Night, I'll be in deep shit tomorrow, so banter or discord votes are the last thing I'll need, the way you threw one at me the other Day.

I'd like people to either entertain sig's idea on a possible reverse of Glorfy/Epi or I'd like us to lynch sig. Either he's pushing a "theory" that he knows to be true, or he's effing bad. I don't see it another way.

I don't entertain the former idea. As for the latter, can we talk first about possible ways in which sig might have survived, in addition to the Cylon-of-the-Day's survival, back on Day Six? Input first, votes later.

What do people think of sig's idea that Glorfy was good and Epi is bad? Why hasn't the Mafia(s?) terminated Epi?

No way to know, since we don't know the mafia's win conditions. It could be eliminate every opponent, in which case the question stands. It could be eliminate the humans, in which case the question is less relevant.

Drumbeats...

On May 7th, you said...

Spoiler: show

Good:

JJJ
ika
G-Man

Toastery:

Rico
Vompatti
LoRab

FoS: Ricochet

Richochet has been arguably the most vocal player this game, but looking back, Ricochet has provided nothing with his/her many posts. The only thing Rico did was attempt to discredit basically every other post. This is a very proscum approach because its sole purpose is to reduce town information. Rico has not provided a single town/toaster read iirc. In all of those posts, there is no reason to have no reads at all imo. I don't know meta, so I can't judge based on that, but nothing about this behavior strikes me as protown.

On May 8th, you said...

Good:
JJJ
Ika
SVS - I don't know meta, but all of his posts have a genuine effort to help the town imo and he brings up a lot of good points.

Toaster:
Rico - Still seen no real reads or anything, just self-defense. This guy isn't even pinging my scumdar anymore, it's going loco everytime he posts.
G-Man - SVS's points on his post are incredibly valid imo. Summarizing is an easy way to feign information and I didn't notice that before.
Obscure/Vompetti - I really don't like how they both locked a vote for seemingly no reason.

On May 9th, you said...

I'm honestly feeling better about Rico now than I was yesterday.

And that was it.

Explanation?

Think you missed out the keywords "feeling better".

linki: jesus christ can I post

[Ricochet]

Polo, what degree of confidence do you have in your read on S~V~S?

High enough for me to say this: if she's lynched and she's not Cylon, then you can lynch me on the next day.

I am 100% sure she's mafia.

Are you claiming to have info? Becasue that would be impossible. And that would be the only 100% you could have, tbh.

And Jay, I kept poking her over & over, and she kept not responding. Since the Nutella lynch. Had she just once poked back, I would have backed off, but she never did, and she posted tons

Why impossible?

And I don't degree of confidence =/= having info.

Polo, what degree of confidence do you have in your read on S~V~S?

High enough for me to say this: if she's lynched and she's not Cylon, then you can lynch me on the next day.

I am 100% sure she's mafia.

Are you claiming to have info? Becasue that would be impossible. And that would be the only 100% you could have, tbh.

And Jay, I kept poking her over & over, and she kept not responding. Since the Nutella lynch. Had she just once poked back, I would have backed off, but she never did, and she posted tons

The only way you could be sure that it'd be impossible for me to have info is if you know you killed the character that can have that information.

Mafia doesn't find out the role of the victims, unless they have such a power role. Are you implying the Mafia has this?

This exchange is... intriguing.

[Matt]

If I were a recruiter, I wouldn't recruit me for precisely that reason.

I realize I'm a bit all over the place and at the same exact time, trust you more then anyone and also distrust you more then anyone...haha...

Do you think there's anything to the SSWA misses? Do you think Golden, after setting up this awesomely complicated game, just decided to wing it on punishments for SSWA?

Designing a complex game is easy because you are free to work on it whenever you want.

Executing a complex game is not easy because you are on the clock, as it were, and it can be easy to overlook things. I do believe once Golden said this:

Dammit, I missed getting to participate in the gun to head reads exercise. Who wants to know my reads?

Sorry for being absent over the last couple of days. Life has really socked me in the mouth, but I'm catching up now and will be posting all the sorties etc. Some of you are also owed punishments for treason... I have not forgotten that.

Yes, Golden said that on Day 5. That post was made on May 21, his previous post was made on May 19, so I'm inclined to believe he meant real time when saying "last couple of days".

This does not change the fact that by Day Two, Vomps missed three SSWA's, yet was not silenced on Day 3. Or Day 4. Or Day 5 for that matter.

[Ricochet]

G-Man didn't salute.

Either SVS or Polo is bad. Frankly, the fact that Polo is saying that he's 100% sure without posting evidence as to why and ISNT getting punished makes me think he's full of shit. I said something way less confirmative and got punished for it. If tomorrow is Polo vs SVS, I guess we will find out which one.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me why we aren't lynching confirmed Cylon Wigly?!?? One in three (or more) chance of being bad as opposed to the unknown player who is about 2 in three chance of being civvie!?!

Linki: WIGLY, sig (although I think I may have found an alternative situation in my reread here so I reserve the right to remove), rabbit (I think Zebra was recruited), Matt, and either Polo or SVS

Could you rephrase this, I'm a bit lost in the odds you put forth.

linki: Actually, Vompatti did not post on Day Five.

[G-Man]

G-Man didn't salute.

Are you talking about the current phase? There wasn't a SSWA in the night post.

[Ricochet]

G-Man didn't salute.

Are you talking about the current phase? There wasn't a SSWA in the night post.

Urgh, I'm not even drunk.

[Matt]

Rico - You feel pretty good about Drum? I remember when I brought this idea up a few days ago about the SSWA, you chimed in immediately saying you didn't think there was anything to it.

Rico - You've been shady. Despite seeing the show, you were very much against the idea of both a human and cylon mafia at the beginning of the game. You, like several Cylons, were also adamant about not saying the magic "I am a Cylon" phrase, and then acting as if you didn't know why we were trying to get folks to say it. "What advantage does that give us DEEEERP".

And tbh your little outburst the other day at me seems fake. "Oh boo hoo you made a joke about getting recruited, I'm never playing with you again neener neener."

AND YET...

Can somebody scumread me? I'm having trouble motivating myself.

I think you are scum
Now shake it till you break it
Do not pass Go

Above we see you having a good time playing around with Marmot asking to be scum read.

I didn't read the rules k

No surprises there.

Are you rooting for the baddies this game?

No outburst at Vomps for this, or anything else Vomps did the entire game, up to and including announcing sorties that didn't even exist.

Frankly, yes, you are shady. Maybe you're not bad, but def shady.

Linki - You're right. Vomps didn't post on Day Five.

@Goldama -

[Matt]

Assuming I live this long, I'm going to purposely miss the next two SSWA's to see what happens.

[ObscureAllure]

Either SVS or Polo is bad. Frankly, the fact that Polo is saying that he's 100% sure without posting evidence as to why and ISNT getting punished makes me think he's full of shit. I said something way less confirmative and got punished for it. If tomorrow is Polo vs SVS, I guess we will find out which one.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me why we aren't lynching confirmed Cylon Wigly?!?? One in three (or more) chance of being bad as opposed to the unknown player who is about 2 in three chance of being civvie!?!


Linki: WIGLY, sig (although I think I may have found an alternative situation in my reread here so I reserve the right to remove), rabbit (I think Zebra was recruited), Matt, and either Polo or SVS

Can you assure me that if I'm NK'd tonight you will vote for S~V~S tomorrow?

No? Because if she isn't Mafia, the Mafia would just NK you to set her up? And if she is Mafia, why would she NK you after you've shouted her name for days with out any evidence (and that's making you look bad?) [wifom]I would just continue letting you dig your own grave[/wifom]

[ObscureAllure]

MATT

DO YOU
THINK
RECRUITMENT
IS VERY LIKELY
IN THIS
GAME?!

I'm not Matt, but I think it is a possibility for how the final five mechanic could come into play. I remember people saying/looking into it on the wiki, that of the final five, most of them sided with the humans in the show and one sided with the cylons. I'm wondering if the cylons have a role that lets them recruit the final five over to their side.

I need Matt *specifically* to answer that.

[Matt]

Linki - You're right. Vomps didn't post on Day Five.

@Goldama -

Question for Rico or anyone else who doesn't think there is anything to the SSWA misses...

By Day Four, 3J had also missed three.

So if Vomps was indeed thrown in the brig on Day Five for his failure to SSWA three times, then why wasn't 3J? By that time, if we believe Golden threw Vomps in the brig that day, then Golden would've been caught up and also would've thrown 3J in the brig by Day Five as well.

Something is fishy. Hrm.

[ObscureAllure]

@ GOLDAMA

I've just done three days worth of treason counting

My, weren't so many of you bad on day six...

Be wary of incoming punishments.

Can you confirm whether you meant "three days" in real time or "three days" as in phases?

In addition, even if Golden meant three day phases as of Night 6, that would mean Day 6, 5, and 4 going backwards.

Vomps missed three by Day 2.

So it still holds true that Vomps was not silenced after missing three SSWA's, but Drumbeats was.

I do NOT think this is a case of Golden being lazy or behind. He has obvi put mucho effort into this game of his, and I think there's a reason some players get three times and some get five times. I have no idea what that reason is, but I find it amusing both 3J and Drum want to sweep it under the rug.

@Obscure - You need to die. Die die die. Please. A fiery horrible death. Thanks. And I have no idea if there is a recruit or not. IF there is such a thing, then I would have to believe Epig would need to go immediately.

That's what I thought. You should be more careful how loudly you whisper in the dark, deary, you might not be the only person lurking in the shadows. And honey, my voting record (and other factors) prove the camp I'm in.

[Matt]

MATT

DO YOU
THINK
RECRUITMENT
IS VERY LIKELY
IN THIS
GAME?!

I'm not Matt, but I think it is a possibility for how the final five mechanic could come into play. I remember people saying/looking into it on the wiki, that of the final five, most of them sided with the humans in the show and one sided with the cylons. I'm wondering if the cylons have a role that lets them recruit the final five over to their side.

I need Matt *specifically* to answer that.

You've now ignored my request, TWICE, to show me where you think I "slipped" in regards to knowing wth you were refering to about Long Con.

You, like Rico, and several cylons, were against saying the magic "I am a Cylon" phrase.

You have been insulting towards me, again and again, in an attempt to discredit my ideas, I think. Based on the way several treat you around here, I doubt that is your usual MO so I have to believe it's a baddie tactic.

Hrm.

Anyway, right now, I'm interested in three things above all...

1) The discrepancy of SSWA punishments.

2) sig's idea that Glorfy is good and Epi is bad. 'Sides Rico, anyone have any thoughts on that? Either sig is a bullshitter and bad...or he's not.

3) I can no longer ignore Polo despite believing for several phases now that SVS was a certain civvie role. You are 100%, Polo? Really?

[Ricochet]

Rico - You feel pretty good about Drum? I remember when I brought this idea up a few days ago about the SSWA, you chimed in immediately saying you didn't think there was anything to it.

You'll have to refresh my memory, is it the idea that it's contradictory for Beats to have been silenced after three misses and Vompatti after five? Didn't Beats post that brigtime was after both three and five misses?

Rico - You've been shady. Despite seeing the show, you were very much against the idea of both a human and cylon mafia at the beginning of the game. You, like several Cylons, were also adamant about not saying the magic "I am a Cylon" phrase, and then acting as if you didn't know why we were trying to get folks to say it. "What advantage does that give us DEEEERP".

Keyword "at the beginning of the game".

You're building a false implication that, because the Act worked against several Cylons, only Cylons were adamant to not claim ergo I am Cylon. False. My principle for waiting to fakeclaim was very clear and most of you hounding me for it are very tonedeaf to judge that. Like I said, "muh claiming" issues.

And tbh your little outburst the other day at me seems fake. "Oh boo hoo you made a joke about getting recruited, I'm never playing with you again neener neener."

No it was very genuine, enhanced by two major factors: 1. One can't go and throw shit like that in the thread, for us to figure out if it's banter, WIFOM or ballsy baddietalk. 2. One can't go and do that especially if that one happens to be Matt.

Seriously, you throw so many ideas and whack on the table and you expect me not to lose my mind when you casually joke with something like that?

AND YET...

Can somebody scumread me? I'm having trouble motivating myself.

I think you are scum
Now shake it till you break it
Do not pass Go

Above we see you having a good time playing around with Marmot asking to be scum read.

Not the same level of banter. How is it? MetalMarsh89 asked to be suss'd. You threw a comment about being recruited.

I didn't read the rules k

No surprises there.

Are you rooting for the baddies this game?

No outburst at Vomps for this, or anything else Vomps did the entire game, up to and including announcing sorties that didn't even exist.

Outburst at what? Vompatti doing what he always does?

[Ricochet]

I need to review the pattern of missed salutes and they check out with Beats' list of punishments myself, but it won't happen tonight.

[Matt]

Rico, I'm going to throw out all of the "personal" stuff because assuming you are a civvie, I'd really rather not get into it with you. I did want to make mention of it, but now that I have, moving on...

Rico - You feel pretty good about Drum? I remember when I brought this idea up a few days ago about the SSWA, you chimed in immediately saying you didn't think there was anything to it.

You'll have to refresh my memory, is it the idea that it's contradictory for Beats to have been silenced after three misses and Vompatti after five? Didn't Beats post that brigtime was after both three and five misses?

Then why wasn't 3J thrown in the Brig after missing three? Or Vomps?

Unless we believe that Golden arbitrarily threw Vomps in the Brig on Day Five for three misses, but let 3J slide until Day 7.

[ObscureAllure]

G-Man didn't salute.

Either SVS or Polo is bad. Frankly, the fact that Polo is saying that he's 100% sure without posting evidence as to why and ISNT getting punished makes me think he's full of shit. I said something way less confirmative and got punished for it. If tomorrow is Polo vs SVS, I guess we will find out which one.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me why we aren't lynching confirmed Cylon Wigly?!?? One in three (or more) chance of being bad as opposed to the unknown player who is about 2 in three chance of being civvie!?!

Linki: WIGLY, sig (although I think I may have found an alternative situation in my reread here so I reserve the right to remove), rabbit (I think Zebra was recruited), Matt, and either Polo or SVS

Could you rephrase this, I'm a bit lost in the odds you put forth.

linki: Actually, Vompatti did not post on Day Five.

I'm on the phone so I'm doing it in my head but we are assuming there are between 3-5 Mafia left right? Of 20 peoples. So the random player lynched is three times more likely to be townie than Mafia. However, Wigly isn't six and y'all say that leaves 1 good Cylon left. So there's about 3 Mafia colons he could be, but only 1 good one he could be. He's more likely to be a Mafia statistically than an unknown human or Cylon player. Statistically, we have better odds of finding a Mafia if we lunch him than a random other player. I don't understand why everyone is ignoring this?!


Matt for the THIrD time, we aren't allowed to quote PMs, infodump, or even POINT TO SOMEONE ELSE DOING IT. If I quote you talking about night actions, I'll get in trouble. AGAIN. I'm referencing something you said in regards to LC. HE even noticed that you said it because he called out me, silver, and you for all talking about the thing that you mentioned and claimed he had no idea what it is, and said that we were all blaming him for something he didn't do and we were mistaken it wasn't him. Good LORT. How do you not know the thing you called him out on? That he even called you out for calling him out on?! LAWDY.

[Ricochet]

Rico, I'm going to throw out all of the "personal" stuff because assuming you are a civvie, I'd really rather not get into it with you. I did want to make mention of it, but now that I have, moving on...

Rico - You feel pretty good about Drum? I remember when I brought this idea up a few days ago about the SSWA, you chimed in immediately saying you didn't think there was anything to it.

You'll have to refresh my memory, is it the idea that it's contradictory for Beats to have been silenced after three misses and Vompatti after five? Didn't Beats post that brigtime was after both three and five misses?

Then why wasn't 3J thrown in the Brig after missing three? Or Vomps?

Unless we believe that Golden arbitrarily threw Vomps in the Brig on Day Five for three misses, but let 3J slide until Day 7.

You bring up a good point, that's all I can say right now.

[Matt]

Damn.

I hate to bring this up and have to redo my thinking, but I have to stay true...

Did Golden say that all of the missed SSWA's on the first day didn't count? Like, it was a practice phase?

If so, fuuuuck. I'll still go back and look over who missed what when, but I don't have time right now. Anyway, I think Golden said that. Right? Or no?

[Ricochet]

G-Man didn't salute.

Either SVS or Polo is bad. Frankly, the fact that Polo is saying that he's 100% sure without posting evidence as to why and ISNT getting punished makes me think he's full of shit. I said something way less confirmative and got punished for it. If tomorrow is Polo vs SVS, I guess we will find out which one.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me why we aren't lynching confirmed Cylon Wigly?!?? One in three (or more) chance of being bad as opposed to the unknown player who is about 2 in three chance of being civvie!?!

Linki: WIGLY, sig (although I think I may have found an alternative situation in my reread here so I reserve the right to remove), rabbit (I think Zebra was recruited), Matt, and either Polo or SVS

Could you rephrase this, I'm a bit lost in the odds you put forth.

linki: Actually, Vompatti did not post on Day Five.

I'm on the phone so I'm doing it in my head but we are assuming there are between 3-5 Mafia left right? Of 20 peoples. So the random player lynched is three times more likely to be townie than Mafia. However, Wigly isn't six and y'all say that leaves 1 good Cylon left. So there's about 3 Mafia colons he could be, but only 1 good one he could be. He's more likely to be a Mafia statistically than an unknown human or Cylon player. Statistically, we have better odds of finding a Mafia if we lunch him than a random other player. I don't understand why everyone is ignoring this?!

Why as many as five? Is that including Final Five potential baddies / converts or potential human baddies.

Also, it wasn't my impression that we're randomly lynching players.

But overall I understand your point better now, thanks.

Don't know yet how to judge this. Should we clean Wilgy just because the odds are against him to be good? The late Dex made a strong case for Wilgy being Conoy. Do you disagree with it? Also his odds improve (at least lore-wise) if he's actually F5.

[sig]

If we delve into that level of paranoia I have two theories.

1. if they were to kill me it would make people more likely to take what I said seriously namely me saying we should lynch Wilgy.
2. I speculated about this early in that I think the mafia attempted to kill me early in the game, but for some reason there kill failed.

I think my first theory is much more likely and think tomorrow we should be lynching Wilgy.

That doesn't answer my question. I was asking as to why you think the mafia killed Dex to frame you, and how exactly mafia killing Dex frames you.

Scotty not Dex.
Dex has nothing to do with me.

Random thoughts -

I'd like to lynch either Obscure or Rico. They have both been super shady, and I'm not entirely sure why people have civ reads of them. I'm a little more hesitant on OA since my troubles this past day phase, but still.

I'd like people to either entertain sig's idea on a possible reverse of Glorfy/Epi or I'd like us to lynch sig. Either he's pushing a "theory" that he knows to be true, or he's effing bad. I don't see it another way.

What do people think of sig's idea that Glorfy was good and Epi is bad? Why hasn't the Mafia(s?) terminated Epi?

I'm not 100% sure it is true, however I can't get over a few things.
1. I know Glorfindels game play he wasn't acting scummy at all and there is no way he could've changed his play style that drastically as a mafia member.
2. I had early suspicion of Epi which persisted for awhile, he seemed to be playing like he was in Turf Wars.
3. Why if Epi is a lock cleared green checked civ is he still alive? This makes no sense for the mafia team to do.
4. Again with Turf War he seems to be playing the same way he was then, and as of right now I think Glorfindel might have been right about him.

I could be wrong about Epi, but after reading over Glorfindel's ISO I still don't think he was anti civ. Here is an idea, we know Glorfindel was a number 8 we know Epi is a number 8, what if only one number 8 can be bad? Or they reversed upon flipping. This would explain Glorfindel thinking Epi was bad. Like I said Glorfindel wasn't in my opinion playing his baddie game, I don't think he'd have been able to fool me this thoroughly if he was mafia.

[sig]

Also Glorfindel saying that players were pushing lore to the wrong conclusion makes me believe he wasn't mafia even if the lore said he should be, furthers my belief he wasn't mafia.

[Epignosis]

If we delve into that level of paranoia I have two theories.

1. if they were to kill me it would make people more likely to take what I said seriously namely me saying we should lynch Wilgy.
2. I speculated about this early in that I think the mafia attempted to kill me early in the game, but for some reason there kill failed.

I think my first theory is much more likely and think tomorrow we should be lynching Wilgy.

That doesn't answer my question. I was asking as to why you think the mafia killed Dex to frame you, and how exactly mafia killing Dex frames you.

Scotty not Dex.
Dex has nothing to do with me.

Random thoughts -

I'd like to lynch either Obscure or Rico. They have both been super shady, and I'm not entirely sure why people have civ reads of them. I'm a little more hesitant on OA since my troubles this past day phase, but still.

I'd like people to either entertain sig's idea on a possible reverse of Glorfy/Epi or I'd like us to lynch sig. Either he's pushing a "theory" that he knows to be true, or he's effing bad. I don't see it another way.

What do people think of sig's idea that Glorfy was good and Epi is bad? Why hasn't the Mafia(s?) terminated Epi?

I'm not 100% sure it is true, however I can't get over a few things.
1. I know Glorfindels game play he wasn't acting scummy at all and there is no way he could've changed his play style that drastically as a mafia member.
2. I had early suspicion of Epi which persisted for awhile, he seemed to be playing like he was in Turf Wars.
3. Why if Epi is a lock cleared green checked civ is he still alive? This makes no sense for the mafia team to do.
4. Again with Turf War he seems to be playing the same way he was then, and as of right now I think Glorfindel might have been right about him.

I could be wrong about Epi, but after reading over Glorfindel's ISO I still don't think he was anti civ. Here is an idea, we know Glorfindel was a number 8 we know Epi is a number 8, what if only one number 8 can be bad? Or they reversed upon flipping. This would explain Glorfindel thinking Epi was bad. Like I said Glorfindel wasn't in my opinion playing his baddie game, I don't think he'd have been able to fool me this thoroughly if he was mafia.

1. I don't agree with you.
2. What are the similarities and why do they matter?
3. I wish I had a nickel every time I heard this.
4. This is a repeat of 2.

"Reversed upon flipping?" Glorfindel thought I was bad?

Let's see.

Glorfindel, I would like gun to head reads on every living player. I'll supply you with the list, all you need to do is copy/paste it and give me "good" or "bad" for everyone. No nulls allowed.

a2thezebra/rabbit8: Good
bea: Good
Black Rock: Bad
Dex: Good
DrumBeats: Bad
DrWilgy: Good
Epignosis: Good
G-Man: Good
JaggedJimmyJay: Good
Metalmarsh89: Good
Matt: Good
ObscureAllure: Bad (but on this one especially, I reserve the right to change my mind based on an ISO of her posts)
Polo: Bad
Ricochet: Good
S~V~S: Good
sig: Good
Silverwolf: Good
SokothQultug: Good
Vompatti: God knows?

The way I see it, I'm one or two 'Bads' short. I've given you an off the cuff opinion and I make no secret of the fact that I'm not a great judge of people's malicious intentions.

This is from Day 6, when Glorfindel filled out 3J's list.

You are reaching, sig. Is it out of a sense of desperation?

[Ricochet]

Also Glorfindel saying that players were pushing lore to the wrong conclusion makes me believe he wasn't mafia even if the lore said he should be, furthers my belief he wasn't mafia.

Do you believe this game is a bastard / inversed format compared to the lore? Do you believe the original Cylon numbers were randomised in mafia / town, the same way the F5 might be randomised among most seemingly human roles?

I don't see why I should believe Athena is bad and Boomer is good, compared to lore, unless the game is inherently tainted from the beginning. The Host hinted that lore should be helpful. This is basically taking lore in account, but flipping everything on its head.

[G-Man]

All this talk about Epi being the opposite #8 than he flipped just seems silly to me.

1) Can we really trust anything coming from the dead? There are baddies in there! Of course they are going to try to sow seeds of doubt. One of those messages was generic as hell and the other one I'm almost certain came from Glorfindel.

2) If Epi were some super-devious role-flipping seemer-bot, why wouldn't Glorfindel have fought Epi's status all game long?

3) Are we actually considering some kind of role-flipping seemer-bot ability for the baddies on top of everything we already know/suspect? Isn't that just a little much to cram into one game? Doesn't it make things a more complicated and difficult than it needs to be?

This feels like a distraction that needs to be shelved and ignored.

[Ricochet]

All this talk about Epi being the opposite #8 than he flipped just seems silly to me.

1) Can we really trust anything coming from the dead? There are baddies in there! Of course they are going to try to sow seeds of doubt. One of those messages was generic as hell and the other one I'm almost certain came from Glorfindel.

2) If Epi were some super-devious role-flipping seemer-bot, why wouldn't Glorfindel have fought Epi's status all game long?

3) Are we actually considering some kind of role-flipping seemer-bot ability for the baddies on top of everything we already know/suspect? Isn't that just a little much to cram into one game? Doesn't it make things a more complicated and difficult than it needs to be?

This feels like a distraction that needs to be shelved and ignored.

#2 sounds very reasonable. I could extend to same train of thought to ask why hasn't Dex's read on Wilgy-as-likely-Conoy been strongly, specifically contested so far, just like the Wilgy-is-Six line has received major no's?