Champions 2019 - Crisis on The Syndicate [GAME OVER]

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I still don't trust Epignosis.

I still don't know why others trust Epignosis.

[Turnip Head]

Surprised to not see Ted taken more seriously as a suspect

He's on the shortlist.

Let's not bring his height into this

[JaggedJimmyJay]

There's the dilemma. At least five players for whom I have nearly no trust:

Turnip Head
ColinIsCool
tedxtr
Epignosis
speedchuck

I can think of a reason to give civilian credit to other people. This disregards Tranq, who is a total shrug.

[speedchuck]

I'm probably not, come to think of it. Though I do get invested sometimes.

I recognize that you're looking for that investment, a genuine desire for hunting perhaps. You're not going to find that much from me this game. You can check my other town games in the past six months and see what you see there, on the flipside. When I don't have time, I don't have much at all.

I don't fault you for being short on time and having less overall to offer. That's the way it goes. What I do think is different for This Speedchuck over Those Speedchucks though is your handling of suspicion. In the recent past, I remember you falling into similar POE positions where you were kind of a default suspect merely for not having a lot of content. Then, when someone tried to lynch you, you showed fire in your resistance to that.

You did it to me in the MU Season 6 Scrimmage when I was trying to mislynch you. You didn't shrug and say whatever. You fought back against a JJJ that you viewed as nefarious trying to take advantage of you. You've said that you suspect me in this game too (still not clear on why), and here I am now driving a wagon that threatens to end you. In response, I get no fire. I get shrugs.

Different levels of short on time. I didn't have a kid in April last year, nor a paying audio project due in a week.

That's a bad example, and if I was certain you understood WHY I'm low on time this game, the timeline of my life and such, I'd say your comparison is dishonest.
Not everyone is keeping up with the speedchucks.

[speedchuck]

There's the dilemma. At least five players for whom I have nearly no trust:

Turnip Head
ColinIsCool
tedxtr
Epignosis
speedchuck

I can think of a reason to give civilian credit to other people. This disregards Tranq, who is a total shrug.

That's a pretty good POE TBH, with 14 players left? Or do you assume some deep cuts?

And why isn't Tranq on the list?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Different levels of short on time. I didn't have a kid in April last year, nor a paying audio project due in a week.

That's a bad example, and if I was certain you understood WHY I'm low on time this game, the timeline of my life and such, I'd say your comparison is dishonest.
Not everyone is keeping up with the speedchucks.

I'm not talking about how many posts you make or how long the posts are -- these are dependent upon time.

I'm talking about the words you use.

[speedchuck]

Having read over the last two pages, Dys and Dom are my top townreads. Their votes are on people I would like to see lynched.

I got twenty minutes. Lets go.

I actually wanna hear this

There's not much to hear, yo. You give me vibes. Even with this post you give me vibes.

"Someone suspects me!? I LAUGH! Tell me of this inconsequential suspicion, fellow townie, and we'll work it out over tea." It's, just, it doesn't feel genuine.

It comes more from a PoV of me having a civ role and transparently laying out my thoughts, which would make me believe I'm obvious town (I never filter my thoughts) and me never being mislynched in one year of mafia is also contributing towards this. I'd rarely been suspected as town so I have high expectation when such claims occur.

Ok, I got lynched once but that was when I was on a holiday at the sea and I didn't care enough to stress myself

Too calculated a response. Bad.

I mean, if you're seriously genuine here, then you have an ego the size of a train and self-analysis out the butt. It doesn't read like transparently laying out thoughts.

So hey, if you never get mislynched, and we lynch you today, then you must be scum, right? Otherwise you wouldn't get lynched.

In case you wanted to look for it, this started my early suspicion of Ted. That never went away. I still feel Ted is scum.

I feel nothing about Colin, which is a bad sign.

I would lynch TH before Jay, to clear things up regarding their dichotomy.

Michelle still rubs me the wrong way, but I'm 50/50 on if that's just a different way of looking at the game.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

That's a pretty good POE TBH, with 14 players left? Or do you assume some deep cuts?

And why isn't Tranq on the list?

That's more of a pure suspect list than a POE pool. The latter would be less generous and include the likes of Tranq, Michelle, Tony, and G-Man. I think they generally look fine (Tranq aside who looks like nothing), but I can't paint a brilliant golden case for their civilianhood.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I would lynch TH before Jay, to clear things up regarding their dichotomy.

Why is it a dichotomy?

[speedchuck]

Different levels of short on time. I didn't have a kid in April last year, nor a paying audio project due in a week.

That's a bad example, and if I was certain you understood WHY I'm low on time this game, the timeline of my life and such, I'd say your comparison is dishonest.
Not everyone is keeping up with the speedchucks.

I'm not talking about how many posts you make or how long the posts are -- these are dependent upon time.

I'm talking about the words you use.

Which are affected by the time I have to consider them, dwell on them, and invest in them. Don't be obtuse.

This game is... running at about ninth on my priority list, where this time last year it would be maybe third or fourth. That takes some emotion/feeling/investment out of it.

[speedchuck]

I would lynch TH before Jay, to clear things up regarding their dichotomy.

Why is it a dichotomy?

*googles dichotomy*

Hmm. Maybe not quite that.

I'm curious if there's a chance we're wrong and TH's arguments toward you are in good faith, like if he's not on Mac's team. Knowing his role would influence that a lot. I still think you two aren't teamed, despite what others have said.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I still think you two aren't teamed, despite what others have said.

Not teamed as in not both on the same mafia team, or as in not aligned the same way at all?

[speedchuck]

I'm going to have company for the rest of the evening.

[speedchuck]

I still think you two aren't teamed, despite what others have said.

Not teamed as in not both on the same mafia team, or as in not aligned the same way at all?

The former.

But also probably the latter, if I understand you correctly.

[speedchuck]

Wait, no, I think I misunderstood you.

Only the former.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: ColinIsCool] aubergine

[Turnip Head]

Don't forget about the take five bomb, town. That's likely a baddie item, and proper use of it could win them the game

[Turnip Head]

I want to be buried with my bow

[JaggedJimmyJay]

It is with great regret that I must bring this news from the Mafia Headquarters in Copenhagen. Due to the continuing COVID-19 crisis, we have decided to suspend the 2020 Mafia season indefinitely until an appropriate course of action can be determined. We all love Mafia and our Mafia leagues, but we also love our players, staffs, and fans. This is a precaution to keep everyone as safe and healthy as possible until the situation improves. We remain committed to resuming Mafia activities for the 2021 season. All season ticket holders will be refunded in full for missed events.

Regards,

Jay Wimsatt
Comissioner, IML
Copenhagen, Denmark

[G-Man]

It is with great regret that I must bring this news from the Mafia Headquarters in Copenhagen. Due to the continuing COVID-19 crisis, we have decided to suspend the 2020 Mafia season indefinitely until an appropriate course of action can be determined. We all love Mafia and our Mafia leagues, but we also love our players, staffs, and fans. This is a precaution to keep everyone as safe and healthy as possible until the situation improves. We remain committed to resuming Mafia activities for the 2021 season. All season ticket holders will be refunded in full for missed events.

Regards,

Jay Wimsatt
Comissioner, IML
Copenhagen, Denmark

Okay, now I’m open to lynching Jay. What a dweeb.

[Turnip Head]

It is with great regret that I must bring this news from the Mafia Headquarters in Copenhagen. Due to the continuing COVID-19 crisis, we have decided to suspend the 2020 Mafia season indefinitely until an appropriate course of action can be determined. We all love Mafia and our Mafia leagues, but we also love our players, staffs, and fans. This is a precaution to keep everyone as safe and healthy as possible until the situation improves. We remain committed to resuming Mafia activities for the 2021 season. All season ticket holders will be refunded in full for missed events.

Regards,

Jay Wimsatt
Comissioner, IML
Copenhagen, Denmark

"Where you were when the covid killed mafia"
"I was eating graham cracker and voting for speedchuck
Tv says game is dead
"no"

[G-Man]

On my way out the door. I’m going to keep things spicy and vote for Speedchuck. Maybe we can squeeze some information out of a closer lynch.

I’ll think about my secret vote some more, but it will most likely be TH.

[Sloonei]

Kickstarting my brain back into mafia action by finally looking at sabie. Better late than never.

Spoiler: show

Hey svs! it's been awhile since we've been in a game together.
I see the votes on jack and I'm not sure. I thought i had a good idea of Jack's gameplay but I've been wrong a couple times. I feel like he tries really hard to blend in and look civ when he's bad and has been a more aggressive and jokey player when civ. He accused nutella in another game and ended up getting mislynched early on and was right about her. Nutella can be difficult to read at times but I have been able to read her correctly before. When I have more time later I'll have to read through their ISOs

Nanook was bad last game I played in and he was good at seeming like a civilian for awhile. I actually only started suspecting him towards the end. I haven't had a chance to look over his civ gameplay style to see if it is similar.
I saw JJJ put me in the bottom part of the reads when I haven't even done anything yet or is it because I haven't done anything yet? I didn't even know the game had started and it's a lot to catch up on. I'm not super talkative in the beginning of games sometimes but I'm trying to get better at it.

Her first on-topic post, and her first remarks constituting a read are directed at Jack. Her stance is non-committal, skeptical about both the votes and jack himself, it would appear. If I have to make a judgment, I'd say she's more favorable to Jack than opposed to him ("I see the votes on jack and I'm not sure.") nutella1.0 is mentioned and gets a similar, but less lengthy, treatment. "Nutella can be difficult to read" is pretty open-ended, but its function here seem to be to leave the door open for future suspicion.
Nanook1.0 gets another negatively-slanted shrug. She caps the post off with a questioning glance at Jay, but no judgment is passed. She is perturbed by her placement in the orange section of the infamous Day 0 reads list, which may be an indicator that she and Jay are not aligned: if they're teammates she has no reason to be bothered by this.
Four players are mentioned in this post. Two are still alive. Jack is the only one treated somewhat favorable, Nutella and nanook (dead in a murder-suicide) get similar negative slants, while Jay gets a sort of timid side-eye.

Spoiler: show

I finally just got through everything I missed.
Sorry ever since my surgery my processing speed is a little slow so it does take me some time to read and process and understand everything. I'm not ATEing or whatever just letting people who aren't super familiar with me know that's why I'm not as quick to respond sometimes. I am trying to keep up as best as I can and respond to things as they come up.
I saw that dizzy was questioning me because of my slow start but I'm just not as talkative in the beginning of games.

I'm not sure what to think about the jack and nutella dynamic. I know Jack always jokes around about being unlynchable. If jack is bad I wonder what would be his motivation to go after nutella so intensely because if she flips town then that just makes him look bad. Nutella does also bring up a good point that jack sometimes will change his mind at the last minute and say he was just trying to see how people respond to it. I'll have to look back at that other game because it does remind me of that and jack had been right. Jack claims he has been right about nutella multiple times does anyone know of another example besides the Australian game?

Nanook almost had me fooled in all my circuits. He is good at seeming like town when he's not. I feel like he has been kind of aggressive in some points I am never a fan of calling people idiots or anything like that.
I don't know master radishes I'm not familiar with them and I missed where the case began on them. I saw some people saying it had to do with their usage of certain terms?

This is a direct response to a question from SVS about Jack, nanook, and radishes. I've color coded sabie's response according to my interpretation of her positions.
Jack is green, getting an explicit nod of support from sabie. That could be indicative of a partnership, but it feels a little bold for that. The yellow bit about nutella/jack goes nowhere.
Nanook receives implicit shade based on a previous game in which he was mafia and fooled sabie. We know that nanook1.0 and sabie were not partners, so I am noting this just to call attention to her strategy, especially in comparison to the next point. When sabie is made to talk about Radishes (her teammate) she gives a pronounced shrug. At least in the case of her other shrugs, there seems to be a direction ("Nutella brings up a good point..."; "I thought I had a good idea of Jack's gameplay..."). But with Radishes she goes absolutely nowhere: "I don't know radishes I'm not familiar... I missed where the case began." Sabie plays the cluelessness card when asked to talk about her partner.

Spoiler: show

In looking through Jack's ISO his initial posts on nutella seemed pretty iffy but it quickly turned into his main suspicion. I know he was right about her before and I don't see how scum jack benefits from going after nutella because if she flips town that's going to look bad on him. I think nutella may have been a little more confident in the Australian game because she knew she'd show as town if checked. Too bad I figured out she was bad even after checking her.
We do have another 24 hours til end of day. Putting my vote on nutella [VOTE: nutella] aubergine I must go sleep.

A new interpretation of sabie's handling of Jack: she is propping him to justify a vote for nutella. I find this type of interaction to be more indicative of no teammate connection, but it's not impossible to read it the other way. Tentative good look for Jack.

Spoiler: show

In looking through speedchucks ISO there really isn't much there. When he discussed the jack nutella dynamic he just says it was interesting which is a way to kind of seem involved and respond to what's going on without really putting in his own perspective or response to it. He hasn't really seemed like he's trying to figure things out or anything.

I guess I'm not surprised jack is kind of changing what he said before about nutella. It seems as though he is trying to see how people react to his accusations and I know he can be tricky like that. I don't see it as a bad look for jack right now. I don't know if it necessarily changes my feeling on nutella but I'm curious to see what her response is to that.

Hard negative stance against speedchuck. Good look for him.
Her handling of Jack here again has the feel of non-alignment. Her stance is getting convoluted, and it's as if Jack has pulled the rug out from under her. If they're teammates, this is a sloppy moment. Not impossible, but I'll call it unlikely for now.

Spoiler: show

In looking through speedchucks ISO there really isn't much there. When he discussed the jack nutella dynamic he just says it was interesting which is a way to kind of seem involved and respond to what's going on without really putting in his own perspective or response to it. He hasn't really seemed like he's trying to figure things out or anything.

I guess I'm not surprised jack is kind of changing what he said before about nutella. It seems as though he is trying to see how people react to his accusations and I know he can be tricky like that. I don't see it as a bad look for jack right now. I don't know if it necessarily changes my feeling on nutella but I'm curious to see what her response is to that.

Can you elaborate on your feelings on Nutella?

I saw you basically be like "Jack is good at reading Nutella" but I didn't see much in the way of what you independently think about her, given the posts I'm missing.

Sure so I'm not always as good at reading nutella as you claim to be. I thought she seemed similar this game to how she was in the Australian game with her responses to being suspected. I recall she strongly defended herself and threw suspicions in all other directions to see if it would stick. I thought that was kind of how she was reacting here. I think I've mostly seen nutella be mafia or indie in the last few games I've played with her though so that's what I'm used to seeing.

Here she is responding to a direct question from jack about nutella. If they're teammates this question is kind of obligatory from Jack so no points there. sabie's response is also standard. Hm. This post is pretty stiff on both ends and I can read it as a teammate interaction more easily than the above posts. Keeping an eye on it, I guess.

Spoiler: show

sabie12 I see a lot of things about nutella in your posts, but it's not clear why you voted her. Gimme the scoop.

Ive explained that I thought her playstyle was similar to what I've been seeing when she was mafia before. I'm also not the only one who suspected her. I also thought I had time to delve further into it before end of day.

Generic prod from Jay about the nutella vote. This is similar to Jack's question above. The "I've explained" qualifier might signal annoyance, which might be a good look for Jay but that's a very minor point.

Spoiler: show

sabie12 I see a lot of things about nutella in your posts, but it's not clear why you voted her. Gimme the scoop.

Ive explained that I thought her playstyle was similar to what I've been seeing when she was mafia before. I'm also not the only one who suspected her. I also thought I had time to delve further into it before end of day.

Why does this matter?

Was wondering why you asked me about it when others were voting her as well. I mentioned a few times why I was voting her.
Voted a random character since I know nothing about the show.

Sabie again appears to be bothered by Jay's interrogation. Good look, I think. But something about this particular exchange strikes me as having the potential to be staged. I don't need to read it that way, but it's there and I can't ignore the possibility. Maybe it's because I don't remember anything developing out of this exchange. Looking back on it now, I feel like it could have been seen as a bigger deal. But that's hindsight talking. I dunno, I'll store this away in the back of my mind for now.

Spoiler: show

Nice to see colin and tranq have come in. I haven't played with them in awhile I don't think.
Sloonei I hope you're feeling better
I guess since nutella and nanook probably wouldn't have info at this point they could sub in if they wanted to.

Empty namedrops on colin, tranq, and myself. Okay. Thank you for the well-wishes several weeks ago, sabie.

Spoiler: show

SVS and Colin are probably the people I want to kill the most tbh

Why's that?

Prods nanook2.0 to expand on his suspicions against SVS (town) and Colin (unknown). Given sabie's tentative handling of Radishes earlier, I'm inclined to say her strategy is to avoid conflict when it comes to her partners. Good look for Colin in that regard. Here is a pretty generic response to Colin about A Thing. It tells me nothing, but it exists.

Spoiler: show

I would gamble on there being at least one mafia in Colin/g-man/drago/tranq

At least a nickel, maybe even a whole 7 cents.

I reread some of the quieter people today, and will add Colin, I already did G and Tranq. I don't see much alarming in Tranq, even though we don't seem to see eye to eye on people. @juliets probably knows Tranq best; Jules any opinion yet on Tranq?

I agree with tranq regarding his thoughts on TH but other than that I don't feel like there's anything substantial in any of his or drogos posts so far to go off of. I remember in world asunder tranq and I had btsc in the map and helped each other out til he got recruited by a mafia team and then he wasn't as involved. I think that is the only time I played with him so I'm not sure if his lack of involvement in this game is alignment indicative. Colin is meh. gman is...cursed? I'm used to seeing his spreadsheets and such but he did say he is super busy. I've misread gman for his lack of caring and participation before.

Color coded analysis again. She starts off by supporting Tranq's suspicion against Turnip Head (good look for TH to not be on this team), but then goes into a pretty overt-but-not-explicit shading of Tranq, which also envelopes drago (who would become nutella2.0). Good look for Drago. "Colin is meh" is snuck in, which I'm inclined to view favorably for Colin again, but the way it's positioned in this post kind of hides the read, so I feel less strongly about Colin than tranq here. She doesn't really go anywhere in her G-man comments again, which recalls her earlier handling of Radishes some. There is implied reason to suspect him, but she quickly backs off of it by acknowledging his schedule conflicts.

Spoiler: show

I feel bad for colin in that I feel like people often don't get me either but his ISO doesn't make me feel good about him. He doesn't seem to be interested in keeping up with what's going on and trying to figure things out. He asked about jack and then didn't give any further thoughts on it.

Does TH always have short responses and ask other people to make reads for him? I know I've played with him before but I don't remember. I feel like he's been kind of providing reads without much explanation and asking others to tell him why someone is scummy.

Nanook has had a big change in his tone since coming back so he must be excited about the role he got. I don't know if that's a good thing or not because he seems like he was hoping to be mafia but could just be a more exciting role. I find it weird he made it a point to point out he didn't get a mafia role.

I don't know if I've seen a bad jay before? I thought he looked like his usual self and getting discussion going and making reads. Is he different when he's bad?

Good to see sloonei seems back to his usual self. Just has to start asking more questions and have more long ISO posts and we got the old sloonei back. (Glad you're feeling better) good post on radishes I'm not familiar with them and they don't seem to be familiar with a lot of people here either so that's a good point.

I like this color coding thing, so I'm gonna stick with it. Three hard negative reads in a row kick off this post: Colin, Turnip Head, Nanook2.0. We know nanook was town. I am heavily inclined to say that Colin and TH are not on sabie's team, but I don't think anyone's been arguing for that anyway. At least not in TH's case.
Then she gives a total shrug at Jay. "I don't know... I thought he looked like his usual self... Is he different when he's bad?" This non-handling is reminiscent of her Day 0 treatment of Radishes. That feeling in the back of my head has been elevated to a mild sensation here. Jay is suddenly somebody to keep an eye on.
Her most positive read in this post is on me (cool), which she then spins into yet another shrug on Radishes.

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Turnip head] aubergine come and explain your reads

I would also like to hear more from TH about reads.

ebwop, proofread fail : Sloonei: civ, of the big three (Jay, Epi, Sloonei) I feel most confident in his civness. In their case I defeulted to civ not so much becasue I have seen their civ game as I haven't seen their bad. With Sloonei, I think I have seen his civ game as well as not seen his bad game.

Uh am i dumb for seeing a slip here? Why is sloonei in red but you have him green?

I was also wondering does this mean you think sloonei is bad?

A couple of generic prods, one directed at Michelle regarding TH. The other directed at Ted regarding me. Okay. This is the first time ted or michelle have come up in this ISO, for the record. I get nothing out of this post other than another point in the "TH is not on sabie's team" ledger.

Spoiler: show

I agree with a lot of svs' reads aside from a few things

People misunderstand me a lot which when I first came back made me frustrated but I realize now it's just difference in playstyle and interpretation of things and that's okay. I am kind of slow to start sometimes and have to talk things out to process them which people think is scummy but it's just how I figure things out.
I'm more iffy on TH and nanook than svs. THs lack of discussion and relying on others to do it for them gives me more of a scum lean. Nanooks major shift in tone and making it a point to mention the scum role thing makes me iffy on him.

I do know what she means about spirit and his "biting" personality that we haven't seen a lot of yet. Sometimes he gets more into it as the game progresses though.


I agree that mac's play so far has seemed more on the scum side and then he has disappeared after jack went from agreeing with him to suspecting him. As juliets said I'd like to look at him further.

As far as svs herself it's been awhile since I've played with her I think I accused her because she didn't say RIP when a civ died and she made me feel bad about it and then she ended up being bad. This game she made it a point to say RIP to nanook and point out that she said it. Aside from that she seems to be putting in effort I could go either way on her.

More colors. I want to start by highlighting sabie's handling of SVS, just as another glimpse at her strategy: This post is framed at the outset as pro-SVS ("I agree with a lot of svs' reads"), and is then capped off with paragraph that reads as fairly positive, until you get to the end when she drops an "I could go either way on her" on her. That conclusion seems entirely out of place, not just in this post but in sabie's ISO at large. It looks like an effort to suddenly and jarringly open the door to a potential lynch candidate without any precedent. This take on SVS does not belong in sabie's post history. What this suggests to me is that sabie's strategy is to look for any lynch options that are not members of her own team. Her gloves-off handling of radishes (and complete absence of sig in this ISO so far) suggest that she was trying not to put any attention on her partners.

Spoiler: show

Ok I just read through @sprityo and almost all of it seems like fluff. He voted Jack on Day 1 making a point of saying it was just gut, but then also voted Jack on Day 2. Sprityo, are you still voting on just gut? I know you just got home and there is family to see and such so I don't want to push too hard but what's going on? You are capable of really great play as Jay pointed out but I can't say I see anything towny in your posts, and the vote for Jack on Day 2 is uninspiring or worse without a reason. Hope you are able to talk some more about this today.

Is anyone else having this same reaction or am I missing something?

Yeah I had the same feeling about spirityo so far. He hasn't done his usual amount of posting and accusing. Seems kinda blah.

pro-juliets, anti-sprit. See above.

Spoiler: show

I think the people discouraging us from a Colin vote look suspicious af

Which people? I recall sloonei and spirityo saying they were wary of a mislynch. Do you think his teammates would be obvious in defending him? I'm not a fan of colin this game either so far. Do you suspect them for any other reason or just that?

Shades Colin while questioning TH. I highly doubt either of them are on sabie's team and am willing to ignore any future mentions.

Spoiler: show

Sorry, S~V~S I am jumping in the shower and out the door to the gym. Quickly though, there were debates about Colin and Mac so I would look at them in ISO's if you can.

Thanks, Jules. I tend to have better comprehension reading thread exchanges than ISOs in general, I find I miss less nuance that way, but I will ISO them as well. Colin was a red read for me, but only as a default since I did not remember much of what he had said, and Mac was a red as well since he had not had anything to say after nutella flipped non-baddie, and his whole thing there reminded me of bad Mac (although I tend to baddie read him in general, so my opinion is not always the most valuable there), so they were both on my list.

Also, if there is anything I have to address, let me know.

Also, can anyone give me their take on why sprit voted for Nanook? Out of all the votes I see up there, that is the one that surprises me the most.

I was also busy yesterday but I had a chance to read up on what's been happening. Colin has been getting suspicion for not doing much of anything. A few people namely sloonei and spirit said colin often gets mislynched for this so they were wary of voting him so soon. TH said they're suspicious for defending him. I didn't see that as defending him as much as just being cautious of voting him too early without giving him a chance. I understand this because I get mislynched for my weird playstyle too sometimes but I haven't seen anything from colin that convinces me he's town. I had pointed out that sloonei and spirit haven't been their usual selves in the beginning of the game but I feel like sloonei has been more towny than spirit. Sloonei questioned me on my post and what I meant was if TH was suspecting him because of his difference in playstyle I could have understood that more than sayi g he's bad fir defending colin. I realize I worded that weird.


Sig had a big long post saying he was limited to one post and he thought mac did it. Mac disappeared for awhile and when he came back to find suspicion on him he was in full force mac mode and saying he's going to be mislynched and saying he won all these sockys so he is a good player and how could anyone accuse him and usual mac jokey stuff. He gave some reads and threw some suspicion at jack. I plan to read through his ISO and compare to some other games. He can be pretty tricky to read and as he pointed out he is a good player. I'm wondering if the more emotional mac is a scummy mac that got annoyed he was caught or just a civ mac being annoyed that anyone would suspect him.

I'm trying to enjoy my weekend but I plan to read through the ISOs and I'll be around in and out.

The first paragraph is mostly just a restatement of the previous post. Colin and TH are still not on sabie's team. Someone else can analyze her handling of me if they want.

What's significant about this post is the mention of sig. This is the first time all game sabie has acknowledged him, and it's... nothing. She simply uses sig as a stepping stone to get to Mac. Sabie says nothing about radishes when he's brought up. Sabie only acknowledges sig as somebody who enables her to suspect Mac. Sabie is avoiding her partners.

Spoiler: show

Question to everyone:

What role do you think targeted G Man with this curse? Uncle Fester?

Out of curiosity, why would baddies target a low poster who had very little topical content up to the point he was cursed with a curse of this nature? I would expect them to curse someone with a strong town read and a high post count.

Targeting G Man with this makes little sense to me.

linki, thanks Jules, I was about to go there myself, I am still flitting around the thread. I just like hearing other peoples interpretations of things, it helps me sort them as well as the subject of the opinion, if that makes sense.

Oh ok I won't copy it in here then. It's part of the whole Colin debate.

The only role I saw that had secrets was the Indie that's still in the game, but doesn't that feel odd, that an indie would have a cursing power? I didn't see anything else that looked like a cursing ability. And I have to agree with your logic, it doesn't make much sense that he was targeted.

I was thinking the same thing and I know I played one game where someone pretended to be cursed to avoid suspicion. I don't know if that's something gman would do.

Unsolicited comments about G-man. This post is ambivalent. Refer to the color-code index to see that sabie's two comments about Da G reflecting differing viewpoints. But considering the way sabie has handled her two confirmed partners, I am interested in this post because she is jumping into the conversation about G-man without being prompted. In running with my theory of minimal contact, I'm gonna call this a good look for G. The same post gets repeated later, but without the favorable inflection at the end. An even better look for G. Again.. G-man does not seem like a compatible teammate.

Spoiler: show

I see sabie12 and Michelle share my suspicion of TH (maybe others too, i did not read everything, and probably won't get around to it), so i'm glad to see i'm not the only one. I'm putting a vote there.

Ew.

I also thought this was ew. Tranq seems to be not at all interested in this game.



What happened to jack? Ever since nutella got lynched he hasn't been around as much. I feel like he is around more and more aggressive with the scum hunting when hes a civ. It was like he mainly cared about accusing nutella and then mac and now he's just whatever about it.

I havent had a chance to read gmans huge post yet.

Sabie responds positively to Jay's shade against Tranq. I believe I made a remark about a very similar response to this same post by Mac when I ISO'd him the other day. The point then was that I couldn't see Mafia Mac responding to Mafia Jay in that light. I still believe in that point, but it resonates less with me in the instance of Sabie & Jay than it did when it was Mac & Jay, for some reason. There is more shared experience between Mac and Jay, perhaps, and a coordinated strike like this would be uncharacteristic for them. I can't say the same with much confidence about sabie. I would not go so far as to call this a bad look for Jay, but I struggle to award it the same good look that I did on a separate occasion.
There is also a somewhat negatively-framed inquiry about Jack. Tentative good look for him.

She votes for Mac Day 2, but there are no new developments so I'll just note this post and move on. Her next post continues to shade TH. They're not partners.

Spoiler: show

I've had a hard time making reads this game it's such a big game and so much going on while also balancing real life things. I have a hard time keeping up sometimes and I respond when I'm able to to things that make sense to me. I think mac is going after me because I am easy to go after. I'm not a strong player early game and I know that's a weakness of mine because it takes me awhile to get into it. Also I'd like to point out that mac was town reading me and didnt have any problem with me whatsoever until I voted for him. Then all of a sudden I'm bad because I accused him.

My mind is far from made up at the moment. It would help if you could identify a few town reads that you have so far in this game.

tony because he is way more involved and trying to appear civ when he's mafia from what I've seen.
Juliets seems like she's been putting in effort and trying to figure things out.
Epi seems like his usual.
You now that you've gotten more into the swing of things.
Ted seems okay so far aside from being a little less talkative than I've seen before.
Dom seems more towny this game to me.

Great work from this guy making sabie give a bunch of town reads. And, whoa, everyone she named is still alive! Ted is the most tentative of these reads, for whatever that's worth. I'm unsure whether or not I feel like sabie would have named a partner in this list. sig was still alive at the time and is not named. That voice in the back of my head is also telling me to point out that Jay is not on this list.

Spoiler: show

I'm like 80% sure sabie flips scum, and it's not only because of the wall I've made but that's pretty fabulous. I've taken into account her surgery and this is why I'm currently not haphazardly pushing her to reply to my post, I'm sure she will, I'll give her the time she needs.

I do have one question, nutella, do you have a history of correctly reading sabie? Any reason why she would fear you if she were scum? stuff like that

Ohhhhh ted I haven't gotten to your tldr post yet I'm at work but I'm checking in here and there. Are we going to go through this whole thing a third time? Where you accuse me of being scummy because you don't understand the way I play and then mansplain how I should be playing and then you find out you were wrong about me and then I help win the game. It's always so fun

A very sarcastic and dismissive response to ted's suspicion. This feels like genuine hostility by sabie's standards, and based on her handling of sig/radishes, I'm inclined to view it as a good look for ted.

Spoiler: show

sabie created a dichotomy between Jack and nutella

sabie said jack wouldn't push nutella because him doing that as scum and being wrong will make him a suspect. she votes nutella.

jack backs out. sabie says "well that doesn't change how I feel about nutella cuz I would've expected jack to do that anyway"

"I", as in, her own read. sabie didn't say anything about nutella before that.

Therefore, Sabie is scum and I am town.

Why does this make me scum? I was trying to say that Im not just following your votes around and I'm making my own reads based on her in other games. I thought she was playing how she has in games where she has been mafia. Also, the day was ended before I would have had a chance to consider voting someone else. Also also nutella ended up being not town also also also I just hate anyone telling me how to do something that I know how to do I just go about it a different way. Going back to work now.

A less hostile response to Jack, but sabie still seems a bit flustered. Good look for Jack, but not as strong as for ted.

And that's it. The most surprising development by far here is that Jay feels like a compatible teammate. I don't want to leap to that conclusion: for Jay to be the anti-monitor, he will have had to bussed one of his partners (Radishes) pretty hard from the beginning, and then also contributed to sig's lynch. I don't recall Jay being big in the anti-sabie crowd, but the suspicion against her was barely getting off the ground when she got taken out.

Bearing in mind sabie's handling of her two confirmed partners, my rainbow based purely on these results would be:

Turnip Head
Colin
Jack
Tranq
G-man
ted
speedchuck
Juliets
Tony
Epi
Dom
Michelle
Jay

Those are not the results I was expecting. Michelle is in the bottom tier with Jay because she's almost entirely absent. The tier above jay and michelle are players who are mostly absent, but were named as town reads by sabie in that one post. Juliets could probably be bumped up to the lower green tier because sabie had several interactions with her that looked natural (ie, not staged teammate interactions), but she had very little to say about juliets. I'd have a hard time being convinced to vote for juliets at this stage.

[Turnip Head]

Michelle and sabie are never teammates in this game

[Sloonei]

TH and Colin are top green reads there, but obviously that's just a read on their compatibility as anti-monitor team members. My analysis of Mac turned up much different results.

[Sloonei]

Michelle and sabie are never teammates in this game

Tell me why

[JaggedJimmyJay]

That rainbow conclusion is nearly an inversion of my general reads. That's fun. If I can devote the time necessary I will try to look at sabie from the other direction. I absolutely must thesis tonight though.

[Turnip Head]

Michelle and sabie are never teammates in this game

Tell me why

I shot Michelle with my bow but it was redirected to sabie. Sig was the architect, he'd never switch two teammates

[Sloonei]

Michelle and sabie are never teammates in this game

Tell me why

I shot Michelle with my bow but it was redirected to sabie. Sig was the architect, he'd never switch two teammates

Good point.

[Sloonei]

Commissioner JimmyJay & Sabie

Spoiler: show

ColinIsCool - nothing
Dom - nothing
Dragomir - nothing
Dyslexicon - plus
Epignosis - plus
G-Man - minus
Jackofhearts2005 - minus
juliets - plus
MacDougall - minus
Master Radishes - minus
Michelle - plus
NANOOK - minus
nutella - plus
S~V~S - plus
sabie12 - nothing
sig - minus
Sloonei - minus
speedchuck - plus
sprityo - plus
tedxtr - plus
TonyStarkPrime - minus
Tranq - minus
Turnip Head - plus

As a bonafide cool kid, I would like to propose that you "ama".

Literally "nothing." I don't object, sabie hadn't said a word yet, I think.

Spoiler: show

Dyslexicon
Epignosis
juliets
Michelle
nutella
S~V~S

Sloonei
tedxtr
TonyStarkPrime
sprityo
Tranq
Turnip Head

ColinIsCool
Dom
Dragomir

G-Man
Jackofhearts2005
MacDougall
Master Radishes
NANOOK
sabie12
sig
speedchuck

Sabie's in a bag of oranges. Okay. So are Radishes and sig, for what it's worth. Does JaggedJimmyJay shade his entire team on Day 1 if he's bad?

Spoiler: show

sabie12 I see a lot of things about nutella in your posts, but it's not clear why you voted her. Gimme the scoop.

Ive explained that I thought her playstyle was similar to what I've been seeing when she was mafia before. I'm also not the only one who suspected her. I also thought I had time to delve further into it before end of day.

Why does this matter?

This exchange was the origin of my bad tinglies. My concern was that it felt stiff and underwhelming. Further analysis indicates that this went Absolutely Nowhere. These posts are at the end of Page 3 of Jay's ISO. Page 4 produces 0 results when I Ctrl+f sabie.

Spoiler: show

I see sabie12 and Michelle share my suspicion of TH (maybe others too, i did not read everything, and probably won't get around to it), so i'm glad to see i'm not the only one. I'm putting a vote there.

Ew.

I also thought this was ew. Tranq seems to be not at all interested in this game.

I wouldn't call it disinterest, at least not in this specific instance. I find it ew that Tranq employed this sort of "now I have friends!" mindset when placing his vote.

This tells me nothing.

"High compatibility" with Radishes based on interactive analysis. He's not wrong. Reinforced in a rainbow.

Spoiler: show

I know I’m town and I don’t want to lynch Dom or Sprityo anyway. I think he maybe gives Juliets too much credit and Speed not enough. Neither should be lynched before Sabie or GMan anyhow.

Tell me more

Incidental. Meh.

Spoiler: show

I cant say mych re sabie except throughout day 2 her posts were alot more defensive and scummy which is why she was down in my list.
But I was focusing on the people who had silenced me and my solid read

Radish my read evolved the main scum read was the fact of his slip and I was pursuing my larger lead with intent to lynch him if nanook was bad. Otherwise I found radish later content to be civvie especially compared to mac.

I looked again, and the only halfway positive thing I see you say about Radish came in your one Day 2 post. And that was a conditional statement: if Radish does X, I will move him down my list. When I look at Day 1 when you were able to speak freely, nearly every time you mentioned Radish you stuck Nanook's name alongside him. It just smells like bullshit.

sabie's name appears in a post in which Jay tells sig he is full of shit. That's something. Jay was on sig's case pretty hard, for what it's worth. But in this exercise, sabie is the relevant name. Sabie is dead by this point in Jay's ISO anyway. She does come up again as a name here and follows that up with an inconclusive read on Jack/sabie. I don't disagree with it. Later on he provides this favorable read on Jack based on sabie's handling of him. I don't disagree again.

Sabie comes up some more as an incidental name, but we're well past her involvement in this game at that point. This was underwhelming, but sabie's presence in this game was light and her exit was abrupt. There is nothing here that would scream at me one way or another. The two most significant points go in opposite directions though: Jay's lack of interrogation of sabie over her nutella vote looked soft, but his stepping in to defend Jack from accusations of being aligned with sabie is something that would seem unnecessary for anti-monitor Jay. Idk, this is weird.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don't recall paying a great deal of attention to sabie early in the game when my attention was elsewhere. She was, bless her heart, well in the blend. Our exchanges were likely limited to rare instances when we'd both happen to be active in the thread at the same time. After she looked crappy in my Radish interaction reviews I would have gone somewhere with it -- but she died. So hooray.

[Sloonei]

I don't recall paying a great deal of attention to sabie early in the game when my attention was elsewhere. She was, bless her heart, well in the blend. Our exchanges were likely limited to rare instances when we'd both happen to be active in the thread at the same time. After she looked crappy in my Radish interaction reviews I would have gone somewhere with it -- but she died. So hooray.

Yes. You'll note that even my bottom tier on the rainbow got this color as opposed to this one or this one. It is difficult to discern a whole lot from sabie's posts. Her handling of the two dead teammates was minimal, so my strategy for identifying the third relies on looking out for who's not present in her posts. Your name came up more than others, but she continually had nothing to say about you and you have been a bigger presence than most of those others.

[Sloonei]

daylight saving's got me all messed up. I feel like it should only be 5 right now but my clock says 7. We seem locked in on Colin vs. speedchuck at the moment. Has anyone come up with any new points on either of them that I might have missed? If we had to pivot to a third name (assuming TH is our secret lynch), who would it be?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don't recall paying a great deal of attention to sabie early in the game when my attention was elsewhere. She was, bless her heart, well in the blend. Our exchanges were likely limited to rare instances when we'd both happen to be active in the thread at the same time. After she looked crappy in my Radish interaction reviews I would have gone somewhere with it -- but she died. So hooray.

Yes. You'll note that even my bottom tier on the rainbow got this color as opposed to this one or this one. It is difficult to discern a whole lot from sabie's posts. Her handling of the two dead teammates was minimal, so my strategy for identifying the third relies on looking out for who's not present in her posts. Your name came up more than others, but she continually had nothing to say about you and you have been a bigger presence than most of those others.

More conclusive takes may emerge overall from the other direction. Given that sabie didn't say a whole lot in general, there were more opportunities for her to be the subject of posts than the writer of posts.

As for me: I think it ought to be evident with at least the other two corpses on that team that I'm not among them. Hell, the crap I was getting the last couple phases via connections to Mac could be related directly to my slaughter of the Anti-Monitor team.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

daylight saving's got me all messed up. I feel like it should only be 5 right now but my clock says 7. We seem locked in on Colin vs. speedchuck at the moment. Has anyone come up with any new points on either of them that I might have missed? If we had to pivot to a third name (assuming TH is our secret lynch), who would it be?

ted

[Sloonei]

Dom, Tony, and Epi are the names I'm least confident in after you (if we're accepting TH's claim about targeting Michelle). She only mentioned those three in a list of town reads when I specifically asked her for them.

[Sloonei]

daylight saving's got me all messed up. I feel like it should only be 5 right now but my clock says 7. We seem locked in on Colin vs. speedchuck at the moment. Has anyone come up with any new points on either of them that I might have missed? If we had to pivot to a third name (assuming TH is our secret lynch), who would it be?

ted

I can dig it. He had some Mac compatibility and was independently suspicion at least once.

I see that he is not currently voting. [mention]tedxtr[/mention] who you gonna vote for?

[Dom]

I still don't trust Epignosis.

bored.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I still don't trust Epignosis.

bored.

Epignosis is bored, or you're bored of suspicion of Epignosis?

[Dom]

Dom, Tony, and Epi are the names I'm least confident in after you (if we're accepting TH's claim about targeting Michelle). She only mentioned those three in a list of town reads when I specifically asked her for them.

Which baddie team am I on then?

[Dom]

I still don't trust Epignosis.

bored.

Epignosis is bored, or you're bored of suspicion of Epignosis?

Yes

[JaggedJimmyJay]

k

[Sloonei]

Dom, Tony, and Epi are the names I'm least confident in after you (if we're accepting TH's claim about targeting Michelle). She only mentioned those three in a list of town reads when I specifically asked her for them.

Which baddie team am I on then?

You would be on sabie's team here. I'm not saying I believe that to be the case, just that there was nothing conclusive to clear you in her ISO.

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: tedxtr] aubergine

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] please scan the most recent few posts from Colin and speed and report your impressions.

[Sloonei]

I do not have a read on Epi outside of the interactive analysis that I've done. That's unusual.

[Sloonei]

Radishes interactive rainbow:
Jay
Turnip Head
juliets
Jack
Michelle
Epi
Dom
G-man
speedchuck
Tranq
Colin
tedxtr
Tony

sabie interactive rainbow:
Turnip Head
Colin
Jack
Tranq
G-man
ted
speedchuck
Juliets
Tony
Epi
Dom
Michelle
Jay

Tony, Epi, and Dom are the three that are not positive on either list. Neat.

[Sloonei]

@Sloonei please scan the most recent few posts from Colin and speed and report your impressions.

If I was going to pick one over the other based on the previous page alone, I'd choose speedchuck. Colin's posts don't say much, but his tone is reminiscent of all those times I've driven the train over him. speedchuck was a bit more aggressive in his self-defense and I didn't find any of it particularly inspiring. He bends and shrugs at a lot of points against him and his reads weren't tremendous.

[Turnip Head]

He bends and shrugs at a lot of points against him

I do this a lot too when I'm town

[Turnip Head]

Maybe I should stop